LDS Freedom Forum

Niemand wrote: ↑November 13th, 2023, 3:22 pm

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 13th, 2023, 2:43 pm So since you say he could be "more prophetic" you believe he is prophetic to *some* degree but could be more so by shifting his perspective?

Yes. If you look in the Bible people much worse than him who become prophets. Adam helped invite Satan into this world. Noah got drunk. Moses killed someone. David sent Uriah off to his death to nail Bathsheba. Peter lied about Jesus and so on.

Whether he knows it or not, he has said several true things. He told us to follow the Holy Ghost, he told us to work on home study, and he told us to lessen social media. (Although the last one may have been for the wrong reasons.) I don't think he has delivered all the goods though.

Just one point. Peter didn't lie about Jesus. He lied about knowing Jesus.

My most recent post showing how Nelson is not who he claims to be. https://seekingyhwh.org/2020/04/10/bewa ... od-friday/

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 8:05 am

IsaiahVision wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 7:46 am

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 13th, 2023, 7:04 pm At 50 votes

• 70% of those polled believe RMN is not or is probably not a prophet called by god

• 12% believe he is

• 8% are undecided and 8% are ‘other’.

D&C 64:38-40 For it shall come to pass that the inhabitants of Zion shall judge all things pertaining to Zion. And liars and hypocrites shall be proved by them, and they who are not apostles and prophets shall be known. And even the bishop, who is a judge, and his counselors, if they are not faithful in their stewardships shall be condemned, and others shall be planted in their stead.

Do you believe this scripture will be fulfilled in the near future or what is your understanding of it exactly? Or is happening as we speak?

I believe it is reasonable to assume that it has been going on since the revelation was given, but more recently. Brigham Young too?

SJR3t2 wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 10:55 am My most recent post showing how Nelson is not who he claims to be. https://seekingyhwh.org/2020/04/10/bewa ... od-friday/

This post and the "King Brigham" write-up I thought you made some great points about the topics. The similarities between Young and Noah are pretty uncanny.

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 11:55 am

SJR3t2 wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 10:55 am My most recent post showing how Nelson is not who he claims to be. https://seekingyhwh.org/2020/04/10/bewa ... od-friday/

This post and the "King Brigham" write-up I thought you made some great points about the topics. The similarities between Young and Noah are pretty uncanny.

I hope what I write will help people let go of false traditions of men and turn to YHWH's ancient and eternal way known as Torah https://seekingyhwh.org/torah/.

For those who want here is the link to my King Brigham post, I've learned more since I posted it, but I still stand by it. https://seekingyhwh.org/2017/07/04/king-brigham/

On this point another problem I see is that RMN claims high priesthood through BY, which contradicts JST, D&C, BoM and JS in that the high priesthood is given by YHWH's own voice not man laying on of hands. https://seekingyhwh.org/resources/priesthood/

SJR3t2 wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 12:25 pm

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 11:55 am

SJR3t2 wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 10:55 am My most recent post showing how Nelson is not who he claims to be. https://seekingyhwh.org/2020/04/10/bewa ... od-friday/

This post and the "King Brigham" write-up I thought you made some great points about the topics. The similarities between Young and Noah are pretty uncanny.

I hope what I write will help people let go of false traditions of men and turn to YHWH's ancient and eternal way known as Torah https://seekingyhwh.org/torah/.

For those who want here is the link to my King Brigham post, I've learned more since I posted it, but I still stand by it. https://seekingyhwh.org/2017/07/04/king-brigham/

On this point another problem I see is that RMN claims high priesthood through BY, which contradicts JST, D&C, BoM and JS in that the high priesthood is given by YHWH's own voice not man laying on of hands. https://seekingyhwh.org/resources/priesthood/

Is that you in the Scripture Study 2022-11-02 video? Or don't want to say?

At 13 votes short of 100 total votes the percentages have not changed by more than 1-2 percent

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 12:32 pm

SJR3t2 wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 12:25 pm

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 11:55 am

This post and the "King Brigham" write-up I thought you made some great points about the topics. The similarities between Young and Noah are pretty uncanny.

I hope what I write will help people let go of false traditions of men and turn to YHWH's ancient and eternal way known as Torah https://seekingyhwh.org/torah/.

For those who want here is the link to my King Brigham post, I've learned more since I posted it, but I still stand by it. https://seekingyhwh.org/2017/07/04/king-brigham/

On this point another problem I see is that RMN claims high priesthood through BY, which contradicts JST, D&C, BoM and JS in that the high priesthood is given by YHWH's own voice not man laying on of hands. https://seekingyhwh.org/resources/priesthood/

Is that you in the Scripture Study 2022-11-02 video? Or don't want to say?

I am the bald one in the recording. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgUl1lc ... n&index=35

SJR3t2 wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 2:13 pm

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 12:32 pm

SJR3t2 wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 12:25 pm

I hope what I write will help people let go of false traditions of men and turn to YHWH's ancient and eternal way known as Torah https://seekingyhwh.org/torah/.

For those who want here is the link to my King Brigham post, I've learned more since I posted it, but I still stand by it. https://seekingyhwh.org/2017/07/04/king-brigham/

On this point another problem I see is that RMN claims high priesthood through BY, which contradicts JST, D&C, BoM and JS in that the high priesthood is given by YHWH's own voice not man laying on of hands. https://seekingyhwh.org/resources/priesthood/

Is that you in the Scripture Study 2022-11-02 video? Or don't want to say?

I am the bald one in the recording. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgUl1lc ... n&index=35

So you see Torah as still valid but different than the law of Moses somewhat?

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 2:14 pm

SJR3t2 wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 2:13 pm

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 12:32 pm

Is that you in the Scripture Study 2022-11-02 video? Or don't want to say?

I am the bald one in the recording. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgUl1lc ... n&index=35

So you see Torah as still valid but different than the law of Moses somewhat?

Correct, and hopefully you can see in Scripture Study 2022-11-02 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgUl1lc ... n&index=35 that Torah is still valid, but in the following recording I show that Law of Moses is different than Torah, including a quote from JS https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zu7_0J2 ... n&index=26.

You may find this recording interesting.

Performances and Ordiances are key words for what was done away with.
https://seekingyhwh.org/scripture-study/2023-07-02/

At 90 votes

• 73% of votes (65 people) indicate a belief that RMN is not or is probably not a prophet of god.

The suggestions to make the poll simpler did produce many more votes. Possibly the nature of the topic too. This is the highest voted poll I’ve done so far. Will try to keep polls simpler in the future. But man I’d live to know *why* people believe this and be able to quantify it.

Answer to the poll: No.

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 5:45 pm Will try to keep polls simpler in the future. But man I’d live to know *why* people believe this and be able to quantify it.

In the op request that people explain their answers. Probably many won't, but some probably will. You might get a good discussion out of it.

P.S. I love to participate in most polls I see on here - and I like to resurrect old polls on occasion, just for the halibut.

Just because one is the longest member of the board of directors doesn’t mean he’s a profit.

Robin Hood wrote: ↑November 13th, 2023, 1:17 pm President Nelson is the presiding High Priest, and as such is the legitimate president of the church.
That is very different from being a prophet.
The Saints have these two things hopelessly conflated.

Of course. They ask you if you sustain Nelson as a "prophet, seer, and revelator" specifically. You aren't allowed to answer "Sure I support him as president, seems like a nice enough guy, but I know he's not a real prophet". You won't pass your bishopric or stake presidency interview doing that.

Silver Pie wrote: ↑December 3rd, 2023, 5:33 pm

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 5:45 pm Will try to keep polls simpler in the future. But man I’d live to know *why* people believe this and be able to quantify it.

In the op request that people explain their answers. Probably many won't, but some probably will. You might get a good discussion out of it.

P.S. I love to participate in most polls I see on here - and I like to resurrect old polls on occasion, just for the halibut.

I’ll make the polls longer if I do more.

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑December 3rd, 2023, 8:58 pm I’ll make the polls longer if I do more.

Thanks. Polls are my favorite part of the forum.

Niemand wrote: ↑November 13th, 2023, 3:22 pm

fractal_light_harvest wrote: ↑November 13th, 2023, 2:43 pm So since you say he could be "more prophetic" you believe he is prophetic to *some* degree but could be more so by shifting his perspective?

Yes. If you look in the Bible people much worse than him who become prophets. Adam helped invite Satan into this world. Noah got drunk. Moses killed someone. David sent Uriah off to his death to nail Bathsheba. Peter lied about Jesus and so on.

Whether he knows it or not, he has said several true things. He told us to follow the Holy Ghost, he told us to work on home study, and he told us to lessen social media. (Although the last one may have been for the wrong reasons.) I don't think he has delivered all the goods though.

Some of the differences are: first, Adam's transgression was known and confessed and he and Eve paid the hefty price. Second, Some scholars have found a problem with it being Noah and they really think that it was Ham that got plastered but insist that this particular event got interpreted wrong in the the bible? Yeah Moses did kill someone but I don't think he intentionally did it but again we all know about it. Yes and David's still paying for what he did only making a Telestial kingdom and again we all know about his sins. Also yes Pete lied and again was very ashamed, remorseful and we all know about it. JS made several stuff ups but also was so remorseful and again we all know about them. They either confessed of their sins / transgressions or they were brought to light.

Yes of course no ones perfect except for Jesus! When we stuff up we confess and are remorseful and hope and pray for forgiveness. We also need to make recompense for our stuff ups if we can. However secret societies and the people that belong to them do not come clean and repent they operate in secrecy. Brigham Young brought in the 'Adam God Theory' to the temple and taught it for twenty five years. This is clearly Satanic and he never admitted it was wrong because he was possessed by a deceitful spirit. He also diverted the recue wagons from helping the Willy hand cart company (Were many then died) to a consignment left on the plains of alcohol, tobacco , coffee and tea. Apparently Brig liked to drink and chew tobacco. This was obviously more profitable than human life as well. Nelson told all the church that the Jab was a 'God send'. This led many LDS astray and they got the Jab to their own detriment. They are still all in denial bout the jab deaths and injuries. They care nothing for human life only for those humans who pay their tithing. The great big push to go to the temple and do family history is because those that attend the temple more and do their family history are more likely to pay a full tithe. None of the leaders have been called of God and they have high jacked the JS restored church and the BOM. With out any of these things they would be nothing!

Mindfields wrote: ↑November 14th, 2023, 6:01 am Come on give poor Russell a break. He was called to be an apostle by men he believed to be "real" apostles. I wonder at what point he realized he isn't a real bonafide prophet of God? Or is he just enough of a narcissist to believe that he is...

Even Gordon Hinckley deferred to the members when interviewed and asked if he was a prophet by Don Lattin of the San Francisco Chronicle: April 13, 1997
"You're the prophet, seer and revelator of the Mormon church?"
"I am so sustained."

It doesn't matter whether they believe it is God's call or they receive revelation, as long as we believe they do and vote "unanimously" towards them.