What is the Iron Rod?

[Telavian]

In the LDS church the phrase “iron rod” is immediately recognized by almost everyone. This is because it is a core part of the vision of the Tree of Life and because it by itself is quite distinct. If anyone was asked what it symbolizes, they would almost certainly respond with something similar to, “to word of God”. While this is correct, the actual realized meaning has been changed over time from God’s words to his children through the scriptures, to current leader’s words to the members.

https://uncorrelatedmormonism.com/what-is-the-iron-rod/

[FrankOne]

In the LDS church the phrase “iron rod” is immediately recognized by almost everyone. This is because it is a core part of the vision of the Tree of Life and because it by itself is quite distinct. If anyone was asked what it symbolizes, they would almost certainly respond with something similar to, “to word of God”. While this is correct, the actual realized meaning has been changed over time from God’s words to his children through the scriptures, to current leader’s words to the members.

https://uncorrelatedmormonism.com/what-is-the-iron-rod/

one take on the subject.

The word of God is the Logos. Christ. The emanation of Christ. The love of Christ.
In the beginning was the word and the word was God.

[Original_Intent]

In the LDS church the phrase “iron rod” is immediately recognized by almost everyone. This is because it is a core part of the vision of the Tree of Life and because it by itself is quite distinct. If anyone was asked what it symbolizes, they would almost certainly respond with something similar to, “to word of God”. While this is correct, the actual realized meaning has been changed over time from God’s words to his children through the scriptures, to current leader’s words to the members.

https://uncorrelatedmormonism.com/what-is-the-iron-rod/

Another take is that the scriptures themselves have been thru multiple translations and interpretations.
Even if you received "God's word", when you wrote it or transmitted it in any form, it has immediately passed thru the filter of your brain, and been interpreted and even if you feel "very good" that you conveyed what was conveyed to you, if you wrote it those squiggly symbols need to be "read" and each person is going to have their own idea of what those squiggles meant, and the underlying symbolism, etc etc etc.

So best to just keep with "the word of God". If God speaks TO YOU thru your scripture study, wonderful! Working as intended.

[honestseeker12]

I think the iron rod is the word of God which includes the scriptures and also what the Holy Ghost tells you by revelation. Actually, I would say the Holy Ghost is vital to have. You can read the scriptures without the Holy Ghost and not necessarily gain anything, so having the Holy Ghost guide you and teach you is crucial. I think that you need the Holy Ghost to make it back to God's presence, and the Holy Ghost can guide you back just like hanging onto the iron rod.

[onefour1]

[Telavian]

So best to just keep with "the word of God". If God speaks TO YOU thru your scripture study, wonderful! Working as intended.

This is how God works actually. Suppose an author wrote a deeply meaningful story which you read. That author is "speaking" to you personally.
This is the same as with God.

[Telavian]

I think the iron rod is the word of God which includes the scriptures and also what the Holy Ghost tells you by revelation. Actually, I would say the Holy Ghost is vital to have. You can read the scriptures without the Holy Ghost and not necessarily gain anything, so having the Holy Ghost guide you and teach you is crucial. I think that you need the Holy Ghost to make it back to God's presence, and the Holy Ghost can guide you back just like hanging onto the iron rod.

Certainly agree. The scriptures are a description of what God wants to teach you. The Holy Ghost speaks to you through the words.

[Telavian]

There was an electric guitar version of this song that was very nice. Will have to find it.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Found it

[BeNotDeceived]

Found it

Actually, it’s the axle seen here =~ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP_LSJCdlgc

123236b93480d4f5dc15599fcc236a57

Spy sees your 57, and raises you a 384.

Size adjustments as per =~ said 384

[MikeMaillet]

I believe that the Iron Rod might be the OMAS/DS. Revelation 2: 26-28

26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.
28 And I will give him the morning star.

Also, the Iron Rod will be what leads us to the Tree of Life (Christ) during the latter-day exodus to Zion.

Mike

[Telavian]

I believe that the Iron Rod might be the OMAS/DS. Revelation 2: 26-28

Very interesting. I know the DS will bring forth new scriptures. However the servant may be an embodiment of scripture.

[Telavian]

I believe that the Iron Rod might be the OMAS/DS. Revelation 2: 26-28

26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.
28 And I will give him the morning star.

Also, the Iron Rod will be what leads us to the Tree of Life (Christ) during the latter-day exodus to Zion.

Mike

I just looked in the Simply Scriptures tool which incorporates all the JST and noticed that Joseph changed that verse:
"And he shall rule them with the word of God; and they shall be in his hands as the vessels of clay in the hands of a potter, and he shall govern them by faith, with equity and justice, even as I received of my Father."

The iron rod is the word of God.

[Hiker]

This is a great this is a great way to mold the members of the church as “global citizens”

The rod is no longer the word of God, but the word of the prophet.

[Seeker144k]

In the LDS church the phrase “iron rod” is immediately recognized by almost everyone. This is because it is a core part of the vision of the Tree of Life and because it by itself is quite distinct. If anyone was asked what it symbolizes, they would almost certainly respond with something similar to, “to word of God”. While this is correct, the actual realized meaning has been changed over time from God’s words to his children through the scriptures, to current leader’s words to the members.

https://uncorrelatedmormonism.com/what-is-the-iron-rod/

D&C 68
4 And whatsoever they shall speak when moved upon by the Holy Ghost shall be scripture, shall be the will of the Lord, shall be the mind of the Lord, shall be the word of the Lord, shall be the voice of the Lord, and the power of God unto salvation.

Why is it considered "iron" and not wood or something else? For the same reason we say something is "ironclad". An ironclad guarantee can't be broken or taken back.

D&C 132 (Elliaison version)
7 And verily I say unto you, that the conditions of this law are these: All covenants, contracts, bonds, obligations, oaths, vows, performances, connections, associations, or expectations, that are not made and entered into and sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, both as well for time and for all eternity, are of no efficacy, virtue, or force in and after the resurrection from the dead; for all contracts that are not made unto this end have an end when men are dead.
8 Behold, mine house is a house of order, saith the Lord God, and not a house of confusion.
9 Will I accept of an offering, saith the Lord, that is not made in my name?
10 Or will I receive at your hands that (ordinance, sealing, covenant), which I have not appointed?
11 And will I appoint unto you, saith the Lord, except it be by law, even as I and my Father ordained unto you, before the world was?
12 I am the Lord thy God; and I give unto you this commandment—that no man shall come unto the Father but by me or by my word, which is my law, saith the Lord.
13 And everything that is in the world, whether it be ordained of men, by thrones, or principalities, or powers, or things of name, whatsoever they may be, that are not by me or by my word, saith the Lord, shall be thrown down, and shall not remain after men are dead, neither in nor after the resurrection, saith the Lord your God.

When it is given by the Holy Ghost, which speaks the words of Christ, which is the word of God, it become "iron" and reliable both in this world and the world to come. You cannot come to God or the tree of life except by following and holding onto the words given to you directly by the Holy Ghost. No one can hold the rod for you, you must grab hold of it yourself and not rely on any man or set of men expecting them to lead you along.

~Seeker

[Lynn]

The Iron Rod is the Sacred Name/Word/Sound which holds everything in check.

[Seeker144k]

The Iron Rod is the Sacred Name/Word/Sound which holds everything in check.

Please elaborate.

~Seeker

[Telavian]

When it is given by the Holy Ghost, which speaks the words of Christ, which is the word of God, it become "iron" and reliable both in this world and the world to come. You cannot come to God or the tree of life except by following and holding onto the words given to you directly by the Holy Ghost. No one can hold the rod for you, you must grab hold of it yourself and not rely on any man or set of men expecting them to lead you along.

I agree that the Holy Ghost is part of it. The main issue with 100% reliance on the spirit is that it is so easy to misinterpret the spirit. "Good" feelings have gotten a lot of people into trouble.

[solonan]

This is a great this is a great way to mold the members of the church as “global citizens”

The rod is no longer the word of God, but the word of the prophet.

President of the corporation of......

[Seeker144k]

When it is given by the Holy Ghost, which speaks the words of Christ, which is the word of God, it become "iron" and reliable both in this world and the world to come. You cannot come to God or the tree of life except by following and holding onto the words given to you directly by the Holy Ghost. No one can hold the rod for you, you must grab hold of it yourself and not rely on any man or set of men expecting them to lead you along.

I agree that the Holy Ghost is part of it. The main issue with 100% reliance on the spirit is that it is so easy to misinterpret the spirit. "Good" feelings have gotten a lot of people into trouble.

That's a really good point. People follow good feelings to do all sorts of terrible things. I'm not talking about "good feelings". I'm talking about words. Preferably conversations or discussions, Q&A sessions, etc.

But, I see what you are saying. If a person doesn't know how to hear words, then they are groping around in the dark or mist like Lehi was before he prayed and the mist departed so he could take hold of the iron rod. I think too many people are following their "good feelings" and stuck in the mist not making any progress. They don't know how to pray and get answers, real answers. So they are guessing. Guessing is not an iron rod that leads to the tree. It's a coin toss. And none of the options in a coin toss will lead to the tree. The iron rod is the word of God, and it must be reliable and certain so we can take hold of it. If you aren't sure what the message is, then you can't take hold of it. Or what you take hold of will not lead to the tree and will lead you off a cliff or into strange paths.

The Elliaison group has a really good way to teach this. Takes an hour or two to treach/learn. But Amonhi has taught it a few times in summary on this forum. Here is a link to one of the times he taught this.

How to talk to God or Angels

~Seeker

[Lynn]

Please elaborate.

~Seeker
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It has been a bear of a week, so I will have to do it this weekend.

[MikeMaillet]

I believe that the Iron Rod might be the OMAS/DS. Revelation 2: 26-28

26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.
28 And I will give him the morning star.

Also, the Iron Rod will be what leads us to the Tree of Life (Christ) during the latter-day exodus to Zion.

Mike

I just looked in the Simply Scriptures tool which incorporates all the JST and noticed that Joseph changed that verse:
"And he shall rule them with the word of God; and they shall be in his hands as the vessels of clay in the hands of a potter, and he shall govern them by faith, with equity and justice, even as I received of my Father."

The iron rod is the word of God.

Christ, an individual, is also referred to as the Word of God. Maybe there are more than one Word.

Mike

[Lynn]

The Rod of Iron, Pt.1

I noted:
The Iron Rod is the Sacred Name/Word/Sound which holds everything in check.
++++++++++++++++++++++++

Please elaborate.
~Seeker
++++++++++++++++++++++++

Sorry for the delay, I had to move family from here to their new home last weekend, then we got slammed at work, and getting on at the keyboard, I was good for a few minutes each night, then dozed off in search for Vitamin Zzzz..

In the BoM we have the story related by Nephi, from Lehi, of the "rod" (sometimes the short term only is used) or the "rod of iron". When the "Lord" notes it, sometimes it is referred to as the "rod out of my mouth".

We'll touch on a few of those other references 1st. One is in Revelation 12:3 --- "And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron and her child was caught up unto God and his throne." Another is D&C (CoC-RLDS 18: 2g & k/ LDS 19:14-15 & 20), which shares that "it is by my almighty power ... by the rod of my mouth ..." then further down " ...lest I humble you by my almighty power ..."

Nephi shares further in 1st Nephi (CoC-RLDS 3:68-69/ LDS 11:25) that this "rod of iron" was the WORD of God which led to the fountain of living waters or the tree of life. These two metaphors indicate there is some sort of fruit or fruition, which is representative of the Love of God. It seems many jumped "on the bandwagon" (our slang term nowadays) expecting it to be a smooth ride, however Nephi shares that many fell by the wayside, some drowned, and there were those who fell short & mocked those who chose to stay the course & not give up. So if you stay the course, chances are you will finally gain that single pearl of great price.

This parable or vision parable, is about the same as the one Jesus shared in the NT, or as the one Alma shared in the BoM. All 3 are speaking of this very same thing. Nephi shares further about it in 1st Nephi ((CoC-RLDS 5:148-149/ LDS 17:45) that the Lord works "by the power of his almighty WORD" and "by his WORD" many things can be done.

However, it is not a "given". In other words, you must work for it. You must earn it. In the sense that you "tuff" it out. By earning it, you prove your worthiness to be able to be One with the FIRST MOVER. You can never ever use this power for your personal means or objectives or your prejudices.

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Here are a few snips from the booklet that Earl Curry (of RLDS-CoC) received while fasting & praying in the Kirtland Temple in 1957 called "The Endowment" (43pp.), just so you know what you are getting into seeking "the rod of iron" (NAME/WORD/SOUND/VIBRATION):

How are we to prepare? Q-2 pp.4-5 "... must earnestly seek thru inspired study and thru spiritual experiences of revelation both the near and far possibilities ...".

Q-4 Must people & ministry pass thru trial, etc.? "... It cannot come to those whose hearts are impure and whose lives are stained, sometimes very deeply with the sins of negligence, or extreme preoccupation with the affairs of the world or failure to make the great concerns of the Lord their great concerns, or are light-minded, or are ignorant of the word of God, or know not the word of the prophets, nor see the starkly clear signs of approaching catastrophic crises.  It is impossible for it to come to men, who in this day when the long foretold judgments of the Almighty are about to sweep over the earth, are concerned with little more than the churches of the world. ... Blessed are all such as shall draw close to the Lord in lowliness of heart, in great love, sacrificially, and in great faith.  Such will be pillars of strength to God's people and they shall be instruments of power in His hands. ...".

Q-5 Characteristics of the Endowment:
Characteristic #1- "There shall be an endowment of spiritually won knowledge. In order that you may understand consider the, to you, amazing results that have come to your so-called scientific world from the many institutions of research. In them keen minded men, inspired by the scientific advancement of this your day, seek to discover some of the secrets of the great Creator, hidden in the works of His creation. They have discovered many of these secrets because they have thus sought. Do you suppose your great Father is not aware of the value of this method of extending the horizon of understanding?  Behold, He understands far beyond your willingness to receive or take part, or rise up to, or use. These institutions of research labor very largely under the light of their own intellects and minds, and your civilization could not carry on without them.  But, behold, the wisdom of the Lord -- He would gather you together in His School of His Prophets. He would have you develop and use your keen minds, too, but He offers you spiritual and mental illumination, an illumination that shines out and radiates out from His very presence in Highest Heaven. He offers to guide you and open up boundless resources of intelligence and wisdom, such as scientific researchers can never have. He offers you a spirit-graced institution of inspired research.  Who among you can delineate all that can thus arise out of this His great institution for the discovery of truth, even His long delayed School of the Prophets. Only out of this great school and the endowment to which it ministers and leads can there come power to fully envision and to establish Zion. Only out of it can come the great works to be done that shall usher in the world's Golden Age, the Millennium. The age of scientific research and advancement shall be climaxed by that which the Lord shall set up and in which His servants shall take part.
... Is there not a saying among you that "knowledge is power?"  If this be true in ordinary fields of human understanding, how much more will it be true when the powers of heaven work with you in marvelous ways? 
... This aspect of the endowment - power thru spiritually - won knowledge - must go on and on and on.  Not only must whatever is good among theories, or discoveries, or knowledge of men, or books, or libraries, or sciences - not only ought these to be sought out, but all ye who are sons of the Father of light must as the years shall roll on, merging after a time of great tribulation and judgment into the blessed years of the millennium - you must go on and on and on, even far beyond the limits of the present.
... You need to know so much more than you do about the high communion you could have with angels, or those who tarry, or resurrected beings who are special messengers of the Great Father, bringing very special and Holy gifts from the Eternal one."

Charcteristic #2- " ... To very few has He ever opened His mind in its entirety. "

PAY CLOSE ATTENTION TO THESE TWO---
Characteristic # 8- "... The working out, the achieving of the high purposes for life which are dear to the heart of Him who is the Eternal Father, in the finest and deepest meanings of that NAME, require extraordinary men and women in the body of the church are also required. Ordinary men could not be trusted with the great powers that shall arise out of the endowment because of their narrow self-centeredness that is so much a part of ordinary life. These great powers can only be delegated or placed upon His servants and His people as they are extraordinarily purified in body, mind, spirit, and purpose. ..."

Characteristic #10- "... He will warn His servants they must never use this great power selfishly, to any short-sighted, humanly conceived ends, but always to the glory of the One Most High and always for the ultimate good of the sons and daughters of men. ... ".
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[Lynn]

The Rod of Iron, Pt.2

Nephi further speaks again on the matter of the tree of life & once again, the rod of iron is the WORD of God in 1st Nephi (CoC-RLDS 4:35-40/ LDS 15:21-24).

Alma shares his version, which is on Faith & comparing the WORD to the likeness of a seed, see (CoC-RLDS 16:139-173/ LDS 32:17,18,21-23,26-43). The Rod of Iron is not about the scriptures, be it the Bible, Book of Mormon, D&C, or any set of scriptures, IT is about One WORD-NAME-SOUND-VIBRATION that carries with it the responsibility to create, destroy (transform), and heal (save), thus IT is the Trinity. It is also referred to as the LOGOS (Divine Word) or GOSPEL (from "God Spell" meaning Divine Name). Alma suggests an experiment, which means once you have some sort of guideline or teaching of IT, then you must work to resolve or solve IT. There is a certain Gnostic quote which assists in understanding this angle.

Jesus shares this analogy of the rod of iron in a similar manner as Alma. This is found in the NT Mark 4:12-21 version of the parable of the Sower & the Seed. Further, the seed is the WORD of God in Luke 8:5-18.

Now, I want you to stop, take a breath & reflect on something. In the NT, Jesus is constantly going around healing people. In fact, some are miraculous, beyond normal possibilities. And yet, even though all these people were healed, there were those lawyers, priests, scribes, and such who never said or claimed these people were not healed, but what they had a problem with the method of how Jesus was doing it. You see, in extreme case, the WORD/NAME/Rod of Iron/SOUND was used. IT was what they had a problem with, as well as sometimes their 613 laws were like the game of Twister & you could only heal on certain days & then some other means of litigation. But if you took note of many times they said he was doing it "in the name of the devil, Satan, or Beelzebub", etc.

For those who wish to understand this attitude, I have a story. Let us say, a new guy walks into a village. He explains he will be back at the town square to exhibit the art of Kung-Fu (or Karate, etc.) nor perhaps some special healing for those that require it. So the people gather. He returns on time, breaks bricks stones, lumber & heals, just as he stated he would do. Now, in many of these feats, he utters a strange cry or shriek or sound. There is no question whatsoever that he performed the tasks. But it was the way he did it, by this strange noise, therefore he must be crazy or have some devil within him. Or he is using the name of an evil spirit. Therefore he is condemned as being in league with dark spirits or such.

I am sure some will scoff at this, but nowadays, many know that usually when one uses Karate or Kung Fu, they "SOUND" out. It is currently acceptable, because we know these people are not calling in evil spirits or using negative powers. Do you see my point? Now, I only need to find one example of this, that Jesus used a WORD/NAME at least once in his many healings. That clue is found in Luke 4:36. After Jesus cast out an evil spirit from one man. The feat or miracle was done. However, there is commentary by the people who witnessed the situation & had known the man beforehand. It states, "And they were all amazed, and spake among themselves, saying What a WORD is this! for with authority and power he commandeth the unclean spirits, and they come out." In other words, Jesus uttered a WORD/NAME/SOUND/VIBRATION. In verse 37, it notes the fame of Jesus & this specific act went out to places all around. He did not just use a command, he used a specific "utterance", whether you wish to call it the NAME/WORD/SOUND/VIBRATION/Rod/Rod of Iron/Sound-Vibration-Complex/Sonics/Hekau/Triple Shouts (The Welsh version of John 1 uses this term).

It also might be noted that Jesus actual name in Hebrew consists of the Tetragrammaton (4 lettered name of God)- IHVH/YHVH/YHWH/JHVH also known as Yahveh, Yahweh/ Jehovah, plus a 5th letter inserted inj the middle- Shin or Schin, which represents the Ruach/Ruah Elohim or Spirit of God (which Christianity refers to as the Holy Spirit). Therefore Jesus is noted as the Pentagrammaton (5 lettered name).

In the AG version of the NT, rod or rod of iron is not used, but "Word of Power" is. And though Jesus did not use it in every case, he used it a lot & endowed the disciples & others with it.

Interestingly, in Eckankar (brought forth in this era by Paul Twitchell), the term is similar- "Rod of ECK Power" or "Rod of Power, ECK". The definition in the Eckankar Dictionary shares this portion on "the Rod of Power"- "The Power of the WORD of God which is given to that Being, who has been chosen, by the ECK (The Audible Life Current aka Holy Spirit) as it descends & enters.

In the "Law of ONE" series, there is no mention of the rod of power or rod of iron. But there is a unique perspective on the NAME/WORD/LOGOS. It is found in 'The Law of ONE', Book 3.

It is copyrighted in 1982 by L/L Research (in my L/L 8 1/2 x 11 research ed.-5th print 4-88). The quotes I will share are from p.128 (session #74 dated 10-28-81) and p.132 (#75 dated 10-31-81). It concerns the concepts of space & time, and how the Logos/WORD/Name has power BEFORE space and time and built all that IS. In the PB edition (1982/Reprint pp.183-184 & 188-190

---Excerpt QUOTE---
The exception is the sounding of some of what you call your Hebrew and some of what you call your Sanskrit vowels. These sound-vibration-complexes have power before time and space and represent configurations of light, which built all that there is.
...
Thus the sound vibration complexes seemed to fall into place as from the Logos. This was a more, shall we say, natural or unaided situation or process.
...
As we previously stated the linkage is mathematical or that of the ratio you may consider musical. There are those whose mind complex activities would attempt to resolve this mathematical ratio but at present the coloration of the intoned vowel is a part of the vibration which cannot be accurately measured. However, it is equivalent to types of rotation of your primary material particles.
...
You may consider the concept of sympathetic resonance. When certain sounds are correctly vibrated , the creation sings.
...
This query is not easily answered. In some cases only the intoned vowel has effect. In other cases, most notably Sanskrit combinations, the selection of harmonic intervals is also of resonant nature.

QUESTIONER: Then would the adept use this resonant quality to become more one with the creation and, therefore, attain his objective in that way?
...It would be perhaps more accurate to state that in this circumstance the creation becomes more and more contained within the practitioner. The balance of your query is correct.

QUESTIONER: Could you tell me the musical name of the notes to be intoned that are of this quality?
...
We may not.

QUESTIONER: I didn't think that you could, but I thought it wouldn't hurt to ask.
Then I assume that these must be sought out and determined by empirical observation of their effect by the seeker. Is this correct?
...
This is partially correct. As your seeking continues there will be added to empirical data that acuity of sensibility which continued working in the ways of the adept offers.
---UNQUOTE Excerpt---

In other words, it is as Alma explains- "experimenting with IT"
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Joseph Smith referred to IT as "The Grand KEY WORD of the Endowment".

[Lynn]

The Rod of Iron, Pt.3

Please note, if lines appear in this brief quote for research, then Oxford University Press has a block on it, as lines appeared over it & the balance of a previous post that had this excerpt in it.


I might add one other quote from a Gnostic work. It is thought to have been written by Simon of Gitta. It is called "Megale Apophasis", which involves a system of three principles (Hmm, those 3 again Creates/Destroys (Transforms)/Saves (Heals). Here is a unique snip.
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All men/women possess the *7th Power* within themselves, but only as a potentiality. It must be 'fully formed' and made actual (activated), in which case it becomes an infinite power, in no respect inferior to the infinite power itself. The whole world and the world-process is staged with the sole intention that this 'fruit' be fully formed and escape the process of becoming, while the visible component of the fire will finally be destroyed by this fire ... It (the 7th Power) is the 'unoriginate' element residing in men, that element in man which is divine; however, it needs the instruction, the teaching of the (Sacred) Word (Egyptian- Sebayt or Teaching/ Hebrew- Chokmah/Hokmah or Wisdom) which (must) come to it, or else it perishes ... the nature of fire is some way double ... apparent & unapparent (hidden in those things apparent)." {Ref.1}