Nemo: The wealth of Mormon temple builders

[Mamabear]

The reason there are so many temples? Hmmm, Nemo seems to be cracking open this story.

From Reddit:
“Nemo is onto to a major story, imo, with his video about the contractors and suppliers who are pocketing huge dollars through temple construction projects.
It explains one of the key motivations for announcing so many temples. As temples continue to be built, the contractors and suppliers (e.g. chandelier suppliers, custom furnishings, custom carpets, commissioned artwork, gold leafing services, moulding specialists, etc) all continue to become wealthy.”

Give this short video a watch where he explains his research:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u0LdjTZW93U

[TwochurchesOnly]

The reason there are so many temples? Hmmm, Nemo seems to be cracking open this story.

From Reddit:
“Nemo is onto to a major story, imo, with his video about the contractors and suppliers who are pocketing huge dollars through temple construction projects.
It explains one of the key motivations for announcing so many temples. As temples continue to be built, the contractors and suppliers (e.g. chandelier suppliers, custom furnishings, custom carpets, commissioned artwork, gold leafing services, moulding specialists, etc) all continue to become wealthy.”

Give this short video a watch where he explains his research:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u0LdjTZW93U

yep, more fine sanctuaries
church of what's been happening for many years -- nelson shifted it into high gear

[Lizzy60]

I haven’t watched his video yet, but I have suspected this for YEARS. Around 2008, the smallish temple I worked in replaced a perfectly good Celestial room chandelier with one that was far too large for the relatively small room. It looked garish and out of place. Unbidden, the thought came to my mind that some LDS contractor received a nice profit/commission on the item. Someone else probably got to resell the old chandelier for a nice sum. Multiply that by all the building supplies, labor and furnishings, and you’ve got a steady income stream.

Meanwhile, we mere members clean our old rundown buildings that are not even in our stake boundaries (my personal case). Yes, my stake has 10 units and two buildings. Do the math. But we are getting two new temples within an hour’s drive, while the other temple, also an hour’s drive, is underused.

[Chip]

Lots of interesting comments on the video.

[tribrac]

I keep going back to a 2016-2018ish survey of lds members which indicates the members felt more connected to their ward and bishop than they did to church HQ. The members also reported they had more trust for the Bishops than for HQ.

Look at every action they have taken since, they could all be reasonably explained by an argument that HQ desired to erase the members Ward experiences. And instill a deep dependence on HQ.

Programs like YW and scouts that were ward centered were eliminated or stripped down. Meanwhile functions the church HQ controls were expanded ....so you get church run FSY, and promoting youth battalions doing work in the HQ operated temples.

And cut church to 2 hours and stick 6 wards in a building, so there is no continuity and very little chance for association. And add more temples and temple workers who answer to HQ not a bishop.

And they are getting what they want. Wards are dying, and members are more reliant on HQ. Maybe it's the way the lord wants it.

[Niemand]

I keep going back to a 2016-2018ish survey of lds members which indicates the members felt more connected to their ward and bishop than they did to church HQ. The members also reported they had more trust for the Bishops than for HQ.

Look at every action they have taken since, they could all be reasonably explained by an argument that HQ desired to erase the members Ward experiences. And instill a deep dependence on HQ.

Programs like YW and scouts that were ward centered were eliminated or stripped down. Meanwhile functions the church HQ controls were expanded ....so you get church run FSY, and promoting youth battalions doing work in the HQ operated temples.

And cut church to 2 hours and stick 6 wards in a building, so there is no continuity and very little chance for association. And add more temples and temple workers who answer to HQ not a bishop.

And they are getting what they want. Wards are dying, and members are more reliant on HQ. Maybe it's the way the lord wants it.

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. It's those local connections that keep those head honchos in business.

[Libertas Est Salus]

I keep going back to a 2016-2018ish survey of lds members which indicates the members felt more connected to their ward and bishop than they did to church HQ. The members also reported they had more trust for the Bishops than for HQ.

Look at every action they have taken since, they could all be reasonably explained by an argument that HQ desired to erase the members Ward experiences. And instill a deep dependence on HQ.

Programs like YW and scouts that were ward centered were eliminated or stripped down. Meanwhile functions the church HQ controls were expanded ....so you get church run FSY, and promoting youth battalions doing work in the HQ operated temples.

And cut church to 2 hours and stick 6 wards in a building, so there is no continuity and very little chance for association. And add more temples and temple workers who answer to HQ not a bishop.

And they are getting what they want. Wards are dying, and members are more reliant on HQ. Maybe it's the way the lord wants it.

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. It's those local connections that keep those head honchos in business.

My friend, who is very like-minded and who happens to be the ward clerk, told me that the ward brought in $18,000 in tithing last month (a small fraction of what wards bring in, in the Mormon Corridor, I'm sure), but our ward budget for the ENTIRE YEAR is about $4,000. In other words, SLC lets our ward use LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of our tithing revenue. Things that make you go hmmm . . . amiright?

[Niemand]

My friend, who is very like-minded and who happens to be the ward clerk, told me that the ward brought in $18,000 in tithing last month (a small fraction of what wards bring in, in the Mormon Corridor, I'm sure), but our ward budget for the ENTIRE YEAR is about $4,000. In other words, SLC lets our ward use LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of our tithing revenue. Things that make you go hmmm . . . amiright?

Not a surprise to me at all, but it reminds me a bit of what European soccer clubs do. They are more interested in TV deals than the fans who turn up every weekend. The trouble is that even though they make more money off the TV deals, bums/butts on seats are loyal fans and long term customers.

[tribrac]

$4,000 budget. How do you run a ward on that? The answer is you don't. Everyone knows that it doesn't work, including HQ. The ward only works if members make substantial personal donations. Hq knows the members are donating more time and money, but it is never mentioned.

But it so unequal. So wards in Highland have Priests Camp at a condo in St George, go rapeling and offroading. While the ward in Kerns spends 3 days drycamping on BLM open range, eating canned soup and ramen.

I am not telling you to do this, but for me I feel comfortable deducting from my tithing the tanks of gas, ward fundraisers Contributions, entrance fees, "Summer youth activities Contributions" craft supplies, etc

[JuneBug12000]

I keep going back to a 2016-2018ish survey of lds members which indicates the members felt more connected to their ward and bishop than they did to church HQ. The members also reported they had more trust for the Bishops than for HQ.

Look at every action they have taken since, they could all be reasonably explained by an argument that HQ desired to erase the members Ward experiences. And instill a deep dependence on HQ.

Programs like YW and scouts that were ward centered were eliminated or stripped down. Meanwhile functions the church HQ controls were expanded ....so you get church run FSY, and promoting youth battalions doing work in the HQ operated temples.

And cut church to 2 hours and stick 6 wards in a building, so there is no continuity and very little chance for association. And add more temples and temple workers who answer to HQ not a bishop.

And they are getting what they want. Wards are dying, and members are more reliant on HQ. Maybe it's the way the lord wants it.

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. It's those local connections that keep those head honchos in business.

My friend, who is very like-minded and who happens to be the ward clerk, told me that the ward brought in $18,000 in tithing last month (a small fraction of what wards bring in, in the Mormon Corridor, I'm sure), but our ward budget for the ENTIRE YEAR is about $4,000. In other words, SLC lets our ward use LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of our tithing revenue. Things that make you go hmmm . . . amiright?

So $216,000 yearly donations turns into a $4000 budget. You were being generous by rounding up to 2%.

[Rubicon]

My friend, who is very like-minded and who happens to be the ward clerk, told me that the ward brought in $18,000 in tithing last month (a small fraction of what wards bring in, in the Mormon Corridor, I'm sure), but our ward budget for the ENTIRE YEAR is about $4,000. In other words, SLC lets our ward use LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of our tithing revenue. Things that make you go hmmm . . . amiright?

This sounds way off. I've been a bishop twice, and our tithing collected ranged from $250,000 to $400,000 in the two wards. The ward budgets were generally around $13,000 a year. It's based on sacrament attendance during the "counting months" (March, June, September, December). The stakes withhold varying amounts before dispersing the budget money to the wards (even though President Hinckley said in 1990 that stakes shouldn't keep any, and should give it all to the wards), so that can affect how much wards get, but I can't believe that a ward anywhere only had $4,000 for the entire year.

[tribrac]

Mid 2000s I wad a finance clerk in a poor area, the budget was 4,000 something. Which really helped us attract and keep people. We had average sacrament meeting attendance of about 68.

EQ had a budget of $30 to host an annual party. I never could figure out why more men weren't involved.

[Serragon]

My friend, who is very like-minded and who happens to be the ward clerk, told me that the ward brought in $18,000 in tithing last month (a small fraction of what wards bring in, in the Mormon Corridor, I'm sure), but our ward budget for the ENTIRE YEAR is about $4,000. In other words, SLC lets our ward use LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of our tithing revenue. Things that make you go hmmm . . . amiright?

This sounds way off. I've been a bishop twice, and our tithing collected ranged from $250,000 to $400,000 in the two wards. The ward budgets were generally around $13,000 a year. It's based on sacrament attendance during the "counting months" (March, June, September, December). The stakes withhold varying amounts before dispersing the budget money to the wards (even though President Hinckley said in 1990 that stakes shouldn't keep any, and should give it all to the wards), so that can affect how much wards get, but I can't believe that a ward anywhere only had $4,000 for the entire year.

I was last in ward leadership a few years ago. The total ward budget the last year I served was < 7000.

The Stakes get an allotment and they decide how much to give to each ward and how much to keep for the Stake.

The system the church uses really hurts the small rural wards who are far from Stake Centers and temples. They get less money, but have to spend more money transporting kids to stake and temple events. Generally, these ward leaders eat much of the cost as there is no money available for reimbursement. And since the youth are supposed to have weekly activities, the bulk of the money gets reserved for them while the EQ and RS get 50 bucks each.

The worst thing, however, is that the church charges the wards for all of the materials they use. Need emblems of belonging? Coming out of your ward budget. hymnals and manuals? Pay up. Not only do you get a pittance, but you have to give a portion of that pittance back to implement the programs those giving you the pittance desire.

[Mamabear]

Nemo, if you’re reading this, you’re awesome! Great job!
When you visit America give me a shout, you can come hang out with me and the fam! Ohio! Let’s gooooo!

[Rumpelstiltskin]

Absolutely nothing about this video surprises me - absolutely nothing!

[Libertas Est Salus]

My friend, who is very like-minded and who happens to be the ward clerk, told me that the ward brought in $18,000 in tithing last month (a small fraction of what wards bring in, in the Mormon Corridor, I'm sure), but our ward budget for the ENTIRE YEAR is about $4,000. In other words, SLC lets our ward use LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of our tithing revenue. Things that make you go hmmm . . . amiright?

This sounds way off. I've been a bishop twice, and our tithing collected ranged from $250,000 to $400,000 in the two wards. The ward budgets were generally around $13,000 a year. It's based on sacrament attendance during the "counting months" (March, June, September, December). The stakes withhold varying amounts before dispersing the budget money to the wards (even though President Hinckley said in 1990 that stakes shouldn't keep any, and should give it all to the wards), so that can affect how much wards get, but I can't believe that a ward anywhere only had $4,000 for the entire year.

I don't have any personal knowledge to attest one way or the other. I will say we are a pretty small ward here in the beautiful Midwest. Attendance is probably around 120 to 130. My friend is passionate but not the type to exaggerate. But again, I'm just relying on what he told me just this last Sunday.

[Bookworm101]

My friend, who is very like-minded and who happens to be the ward clerk, told me that the ward brought in $18,000 in tithing last month (a small fraction of what wards bring in, in the Mormon Corridor, I'm sure), but our ward budget for the ENTIRE YEAR is about $4,000. In other words, SLC lets our ward use LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of our tithing revenue. Things that make you go hmmm . . . amiright?

This sounds way off. I've been a bishop twice, and our tithing collected ranged from $250,000 to $400,000 in the two wards. The ward budgets were generally around $13,000 a year. It's based on sacrament attendance during the "counting months" (March, June, September, December). The stakes withhold varying amounts before dispersing the budget money to the wards (even though President Hinckley said in 1990 that stakes shouldn't keep any, and should give it all to the wards), so that can affect how much wards get, but I can't believe that a ward anywhere only had $4,000 for the entire year.

I was last in ward leadership a few years ago. The total ward budget the last year I served was < 7000.

The Stakes get an allotment and they decide how much to give to each ward and how much to keep for the Stake.

The system the church uses really hurts the small rural wards who are far from Stake Centers and temples. They get less money, but have to spend more money transporting kids to stake and temple events. Generally, these ward leaders eat much of the cost as there is no money available for reimbursement. And since the youth are supposed to have weekly activities, the bulk of the money gets reserved for them while the EQ and RS get 50 bucks each.

The worst thing, however, is that the church charges the wards for all of the materials they use. Need emblems of belonging? Coming out of your ward budget. hymnals and manuals? Pay up. Not only do you get a pittance, but you have to give a portion of that pittance back to implement the programs those giving you the pittance desire.
[/quote
This is exactly what we go through...we live in the furthest west in our stake and anything for the stake requires 2 hours one way to get there. Most are already stretched financially...yet they have to transport youth to stake events....crazy....glad Oaks gets to eat his thanksgiving dessert with that gold spoon.