LDS Freedom Forum

I'm doing a bit of research on LDS temples and ran across this section on the church website. Notice anything missing? No mention at all of the sealing power of the Holy Ghost.

Also, how did we ever come to believe that if we aren't sealed in the temple we lose our connection to our family?

What is a Temple Sealing?
Heavenly Father’s plan of happiness is ultimately to have you and your family live with Him forever. The scriptures call the authority to unite families forever the “sealing” power. This is the same authority Jesus gave the Apostle Peter to provide blessings on earth that will continue in heaven (Matthew 16:19).

In sealing rooms within the temple, marriages between a man and a woman are performed. There, a man and a woman kneel and join hands across an altar to be married for this life and for eternity. During the ceremony, the officiator (called a temple sealer) asks the couple to confirm their commitment to each other and to God. They are promised an eternal union and other blessings that enrich the divine potential of the relationship.

This eternal marriage is called a temple sealing. Children born into such marriages are sealed to their families forever. Adopted children can also be sealed to their adoptive parents. Those who are married civilly before they join the Church or before they are able to go to the temple can also be sealed together as husband and wife. After a couple is sealed, any children they already have can also be sealed to them.

Being sealed as a family is the crowning ordinance of the temple and the greatest of God’s blessings for His children.

Spouses who are married in the temple promise to maintain complete fidelity to one another. They treasure their relationship, which represents the beginning of their eternal family.

Knowing that families can be together forever brings peace and hope as you face the challenges of life, including the suffering and death of loved ones. If you are sealed to your family and remain faithful to your covenants, your family relationships will continue after death.

You can also participate in the sealing ordinance on behalf of your ancestors. By doing so, you can unite entire generations of your family for eternity. Striving to have an eternal family will bring marvelous blessings in this life and in the life to come.

As Church members continue to attend the temple, they are reminded of the eternal commitments they have made (Which commitments do they keep, are we talking about the blood oaths, or something else? Asking for a friend.) to one another and to God, and their relationships are strengthened as they recommit to live Christlike lives and remember the importance of Jesus Christ’s help in maintaining healthy family relationships.

That last part has me shaking my head. The temple has been used as leverage to coerce the saints. It has not become a place where "their relationships are strengthened as they recommit to live Christlike lives and remember the importance of Jesus Christ’s help in maintaining healthy family relationships." Have stepped away from the church, and I am told by family and church members that I have thrown away my salvation and the entire concept of God.

Another gem. Notice how instead of quoting scripture, they quote themselves:

The Covenant Path Leads to the Temple
President Boyd K. Packer explained that the temple is the ultimate earthly destination in our gospel journey: “All roads lead to the temple, for it is there that we are prepared in all things to qualify us to enter the presence of the Lord” (Remember Me: Relief Society Personal Study Guide 1, p. 84).

The ordinances and covenants of the temple are not merely important to our exaltation—they are essential. President Packer further explained, “Ordinances and covenants become our credentials for admission into [God’s] presence. To worthily receive them is the quest of a lifetime; to keep them thereafter is the challenge of mortality” (Boyd K. Packer, “Covenants,” Ensign, May 1987). Faithfully obeying covenants made with God is the most important goal we can pursue in this life. In the words of President Russell M. Nelson, “The greatest compliment that can be earned here in this life is to be known as a covenant keeper. The rewards for a covenant keeper will be realized both here and hereafter” (Russell M. Nelson, “Covenants,” Ensign, Nov. 2011).

The greatest marketing campaign for the church is their flavor of the Covenant Path™

I think this fear right here is one of the last things keeping me connected to the church. I want to be with my family forever. If I'm wrong about all of the problem I am seeing, I don't want to lose them.

But, at the same time, the fact that it is fear and not faith that is holding me here, makes me think it's not necessary, but a means of control.

If I am faithful and committed to my spouse and children, putting only God and Christ before them, why would God separate us in the next life?

.

JuneBug12000 wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:45 pm I think this fear right here is one of the last things keeping me connected to the church. I want to be with my family forever. If I'm wrong about all of the problem I am seeing, I don't want to lose them.

But, at the same time, the fact that it is fear and not faith that is holding me here, makes me think it's not necessary, but a means of control.

If I am faithful and committed to my spouse and children, putting only God and Christ before them, why would God separate us in the next life?
.

Excellent observation. FOMO is a huge part of church culture and doctrine. (That's "Fear Of Missing Out" for you old fogeys)

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:38 pm Another gem. Notice how instead of quoting scripture, they quote themselves:

The Covenant Path Leads to the Temple
President Boyd K. Packer explained that the temple is the ultimate earthly destination in our gospel journey: “All roads lead to the temple, for it is there that we are prepared in all things to qualify us to enter the presence of the Lord” (Remember Me: Relief Society Personal Study Guide 1, p. 84).

The ordinances and covenants of the temple are not merely important to our exaltation—they are essential. President Packer further explained, “Ordinances and covenants become our credentials for admission into [God’s] presence. To worthily receive them is the quest of a lifetime; to keep them thereafter is the challenge of mortality” (Boyd K. Packer, “Covenants,” Ensign, May 1987). Faithfully obeying covenants made with God is the most important goal we can pursue in this life. In the words of President Russell M. Nelson, “The greatest compliment that can be earned here in this life is to be known as a covenant keeper. The rewards for a covenant keeper will be realized both here and hereafter” (Russell M. Nelson, “Covenants,” Ensign, Nov. 2011).

The greatest marketing campaign for the church is their flavor of the Covenant Path™

That’s clearly written for an audience that believes Packer and Nelson are prophets, seers, and revelators. If you don’t consider their statements authoritative, fine, but it’s very silly to get upset that the Church doesn’t always cater to your particular premises.

Blue Marble wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:57 pm
That’s clearly written for an audience that believes Packer and Nelson are prophets, seers, and revelators. If you don’t consider their statements authoritative, fine, but it’s very silly to get upset that the Church doesn’t always cater to your particular premises.

Actually, no, this is not written for the LDS audience. This entire section on the church website is basically for non-members and is selling the Covenant Path™.

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:21 pm That last part has me shaking my head. The temple has been used as leverage to coerce the saints. It has not become a place where "their relationships are strengthened as they recommit to live Christlike lives and remember the importance of Jesus Christ’s help in maintaining healthy family relationships." Have stepped away from the church, and I am told by family and church members that I have thrown away my salvation and the entire concept of God.

I think the LDS leadership realizes that if you can be sealed to God without the church then you obviously don't need the church.

They of course downplay experiences in the scriptures where this exact thing happened.

Telavian wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 3:42 pm

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:21 pm That last part has me shaking my head. The temple has been used as leverage to coerce the saints. It has not become a place where "their relationships are strengthened as they recommit to live Christlike lives and remember the importance of Jesus Christ’s help in maintaining healthy family relationships." Have stepped away from the church, and I am told by family and church members that I have thrown away my salvation and the entire concept of God.

I think the LDS leadership realizes that if you can be sealed to God without the church then you obviously don't need the church.

They of course downplay experiences in the scriptures where this exact thing happened.

When God is the mechanic, you no longer need the extended warranty from the salesman.

JuneBug12000 wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:45 pm I think this fear right here is one of the last things keeping me connected to the church. I want to be with my family forever. If I'm wrong about all of the problem I am seeing, I don't want to lose them.

But, at the same time, the fact that it is fear and not faith that is holding me here, makes me think it's not necessary, but a means of control.

If I am faithful and committed to my spouse and children, putting only God and Christ before them, why would God separate us in the next life?

.

...He won't...

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 3:00 pm

Blue Marble wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:57 pm
That’s clearly written for an audience that believes Packer and Nelson are prophets, seers, and revelators. If you don’t consider their statements authoritative, fine, but it’s very silly to get upset that the Church doesn’t always cater to your particular premises.

Actually, no, this is not written for the LDS audience. This entire section on the church website is basically for non-members and is selling the Covenant Path™.

I didn’t say it was written for members, I said it’s written for people who believe that Packer and Nelson are PSRs. Investigators would be in that camp, or at least they would be open to the premise.

It should not surprise even the most hardened anti that the LDS Church’s website quotes LDS authorities to explain LDS doctrine. It’s very bizarre that this upsets you. Are you equally dismayed when catholic.com quotes the pope?

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:38 pm Another gem. Notice how instead of quoting scripture, they quote themselves:

The Covenant Path Leads to the Temple
President Boyd K. Packer explained that the temple is the ultimate earthly destination in our gospel journey: “All roads lead to the temple, for it is there that we are prepared in all things to qualify us to enter the presence of the Lord” (Remember Me: Relief Society Personal Study Guide 1, p. 84).

The ordinances and covenants of the temple are not merely important to our exaltation—they are essential. President Packer further explained, “Ordinances and covenants become our credentials for admission into [God’s] presence. To worthily receive them is the quest of a lifetime; to keep them thereafter is the challenge of mortality” (Boyd K. Packer, “Covenants,” Ensign, May 1987). Faithfully obeying covenants made with God is the most important goal we can pursue in this life. In the words of President Russell M. Nelson, “The greatest compliment that can be earned here in this life is to be known as a covenant keeper. The rewards for a covenant keeper will be realized both here and hereafter” (Russell M. Nelson, “Covenants,” Ensign, Nov. 2011).

The greatest marketing campaign for the church is their flavor of the Covenant Path™

...the philosophies of men mingled with not much truth...sealing comes by the confirmation of the Holy Spirit...men and women are chosen by God to be sealed...ordinances are for men approaching salvation...but if the ordinances are corrupted, how can salvation be achieved?...if our path has deviated...so has our vision/goal...

No man controls Gods will...God Himself will come to your temple and claim you His...including your spouse...this is the first covenant Jehovah made with man (Adam and Eve). Families are promised eternal life when this covenant is honoured where husband and wife coexist in harmony with God (Jehovah). God places His seal upon your heart so you know of a surety that you and the spouse you love have been sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise.

This is also how you know the promised blessings of eternal life have been extended to your family to the 3rd and 4th generation. Does this mean you will not sin?...of course not. We are born into sin...who in this life does not need the atoning blood of the Savior?...but when the Holy Spirit of promise has claimed you, your promise stands....Can the Holy Spirit lie?

1 Corinthians 3:16-17
King James Version
16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Peace

Blue Marble wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 5:05 pm

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 3:00 pm

Blue Marble wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:57 pm
That’s clearly written for an audience that believes Packer and Nelson are prophets, seers, and revelators. If you don’t consider their statements authoritative, fine, but it’s very silly to get upset that the Church doesn’t always cater to your particular premises.

Actually, no, this is not written for the LDS audience. This entire section on the church website is basically for non-members and is selling the Covenant Path™.

I didn’t say it was written for members, I said it’s written for people who believe that Packer and Nelson are PSRs. Investigators would be in that camp, or at least they would be open to the premise.

It should not surprise even the most hardened anti that the LDS Church’s website quotes LDS authorities to explain LDS doctrine. It’s very bizarre that this upsets you. Are you equally dismayed when catholic.com quotes the pope?

It doesn’t bother me. I find it ironic. And I don’t think the intended audience has any clue who these men are. Sure, members read the website, but the core audience for this section is people completely unfamiliar w church dogmas.

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 5:26 pm

Blue Marble wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 5:05 pm

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 3:00 pm

Actually, no, this is not written for the LDS audience. This entire section on the church website is basically for non-members and is selling the Covenant Path™.

I didn’t say it was written for members, I said it’s written for people who believe that Packer and Nelson are PSRs. Investigators would be in that camp, or at least they would be open to the premise.

It should not surprise even the most hardened anti that the LDS Church’s website quotes LDS authorities to explain LDS doctrine. It’s very bizarre that this upsets you. Are you equally dismayed when catholic.com quotes the pope?

It doesn’t bother me. I find it ironic. And I don’t think the intended audience has any clue who these men are. Sure, members read the website, but the core audience for this section is people completely unfamiliar w church dogmas.

Not sure where the irony is, but I’m glad you’re not bothered.

Blue Marble wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 5:28 pm

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 5:26 pm

Blue Marble wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 5:05 pm

I didn’t say it was written for members, I said it’s written for people who believe that Packer and Nelson are PSRs. Investigators would be in that camp, or at least they would be open to the premise.

It should not surprise even the most hardened anti that the LDS Church’s website quotes LDS authorities to explain LDS doctrine. It’s very bizarre that this upsets you. Are you equally dismayed when catholic.com quotes the pope?

It doesn’t bother me. I find it ironic. And I don’t think the intended audience has any clue who these men are. Sure, members read the website, but the core audience for this section is people completely unfamiliar w church dogmas.

Not sure where the irony is, but I’m glad you’re not bothered.

The irony is the lack of sound scriptural basis for how the “covenant path” leads to the temple. Now, I do know scriptures that teach this path, but there’s no way they’d ever acknowledge those writings as such.

Telavian wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 3:42 pm

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 2:21 pm That last part has me shaking my head. The temple has been used as leverage to coerce the saints. It has not become a place where "their relationships are strengthened as they recommit to live Christlike lives and remember the importance of Jesus Christ’s help in maintaining healthy family relationships." Have stepped away from the church, and I am told by family and church members that I have thrown away my salvation and the entire concept of God.

I think the LDS leadership realizes that if you can be sealed to God without the church then you obviously don't need the church.

They of course downplay experiences in the scriptures where this exact thing happened.

No man comes to the Father except through Christ.
If you have to be sealed to Christ before you can be sealed to the Father why is it so inconceivable you may need to be sealed to someone else before being sealed to Christ?

I find the skip to the end of the line mentality childish. We climb up a ladder rung by rung.

^^^ Have you ever read what Christ taught? He literally invited us to skip the line. You are calling Christ’s very own teachings childish.

In clearer language

I would explain this to an outsider like this:

When you go back to the temple to officiate in the ordinances on behalf of your ancestors
You are reminded of the time you yourself made those covenants of your own choice for yourself.

When I was married in the temple, I was a virgin and as beautiful and holy of a moment in the temple it was, I admit I dont remember much of what was said because I was looking forward to consummating the marriage later that evening. But when I go back to the temple for my ancestors, and when I hear the words of the ordinance, I am filled with hope in Christ. I am able to hear in perfect clarity the words of what I have agreed and what my wife has agreed in covenant with Christ, and what promised blessings await us in the eternity, if we live worth to have that ordinance affirmed by the Holy Spirit

It reminds us of our covenant to God and that softens our hearts to be more unified in Christ and thus more united together in our marriage.

Lykos wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 7:05 pm In clearer language

I would explain this to an outsider like this:

When you go back to the temple to officiate in the ordinances on behalf of your ancestors
You are reminded of the time you yourself made those covenants of your own choice for yourself.

When I was married in the temple, I was a virgin and as beautiful and holy of a moment in the temple it was, I admit I dont remember much of what was said because I was looking forward to consummating the marriage later that evening. But when I go back to the temple for my ancestors, and when I hear the words of the ordinance, I am filled with hope in Christ. I am able to hear in perfect clarity the words of what I have agreed and what my wife has agreed in covenant with Christ, and what promised blessings await us in the eternity, if we live worth to have that ordinance affirmed by the Holy Spirit

It reminds us of our covenant to God and that softens our hearts to be more unified in Christ and thus more united together in our marriage.

Sounds like your first time was memorable……….

JLHPROF wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 6:26 pm No man comes to the Father except through Christ.
If you have to be sealed to Christ before you can be sealed to the Father why is it so inconceivable you may need to be sealed to someone else before being sealed to Christ?

I find the skip to the end of the line mentality childish. We climb up a ladder rung by rung.

Many errors in your thought process.

Why start with sealing to a spouse? Maybe sealed to a dog first as a preparation sealing? Probably should start with something lower like a tree? Maybe we should start with sealing to my breakfast cereal. That seems like a good first step.

Lykos wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 7:05 pm When you go back to the temple to officiate in the ordinances on behalf of your ancestors
You are reminded of the time you yourself made those covenants of your own choice for yourself.

The fundamental question is, why do they need them in the first place? Could no one be saved unless they received all the ordinances personally or vicariously in modern times?
If this is true then why do we see no evidence of this in the Bible or the Book of Mormon which both contain the fulness of the gospel?

Interesting take by many on here. So, it is true many Christians feel they will be with their families and friends in the next life. Seemingly they believe in simply two worlds, one is "heaven" and one is "hell". If you're family members all go to one or the other, they'll be all in one group. Not one major religion, outside of LDS, say anything about a familia relationship. Not one. Most haven't a clue about what we'll be doing there. all that comes up is worshipping the Lord or singing to him! Nothing else. Not a thing. I was overcome twice in one day in London, perhaps 8-9 years back by the holy spirit in the cathedrals. the two points the Lord made bright and clear were 1) all religions that teach of Christ Jesus have some level of spirit and truth (important to me, as the CoE was founded by a wicked king and later by a not-so-nice queen and I didn't see much value their as a UK missionary in the 1970s); and 2) they have no "end game". Nothing! you die, you resurrect, and you continue to worship god (unitarian god that is, all-in-one). Overwhelmed me that day in St Pauls and Westminster.

I only truly understand sealing between and man and a wife. I don't claim to comprehend the part of the rest of the family, I feel LDS (McConkie for example) are off-the-beat. And it is surely true that you don't need any LDS temple ordinances to "see god" or "be with him", just be baptized with water and obtain the baptism of fire from the Holy Ghost.......... that's it, according to Jesus, anyway.

BUT, that is salvation, living with god (in CK), heir of the father, joint heir with Christ, church of the Firstborn, etc... not becoming like or a god yourself, that is exaltation. that separates LDS doctrine from the rest of Christianity. Temple sealing is the ordinance that, like baptism, brings a couple together for eternity, IF and only IF, they are worthy, ready and sealed by the HSoP (HG). I'm guessing very few are. NO ONE else will obtain exaltation. Sorry, just a fact, BTW a fact the the Lord (Father) told me personally, and at a time, I was a bit out of sorts with the LDS temples due to Oaks discussion of tithing a few years back. After standing corrected I knew the temple sealings are real, for a few anyway.

If you don't accept it either you will later in life, or you just will not obtain exaltation in this eternal round. Just a fact. Don't shoot the messenger. Working on following god myself on this.

I have my own revelations on our future relationship with our children, but a familia relationship can only be had by celestial parents, else it is at best friends. And given the "many mansions", it is highly unlikely dissimilar level of evolved beings (family or not here) will be too close, at least not in telestial or terrestrial, there are after all , "un-numbered" telestial worlds, all different.

Just answering the OP question.

BTW I will post more details for those "before" 1990, in another post where we can answer the question more specifically.

TheDuke wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 11:18 pm BUT, that is salvation, living with god (in CK), heir of the father, joint heir with Christ, church of the Firstborn, etc... not becoming like or a god yourself, that is exaltation. that separates LDS doctrine from the rest of Christianity. Temple sealing is the ordinance that, like baptism, brings a couple together for eternity, IF and only IF, they are worthy, ready and sealed by the HSoP (HG). I'm guessing very few are. NO ONE else will obtain exaltation. Sorry, just a fact, BTW a fact the the Lord (Father) told me personally, and at a time, I was a bit out of sorts with the LDS temples due to Oaks discussion of tithing a few years back. After standing corrected I knew the temple sealings are real, for a few anyway.

This seems so unfair if you think about it. Suppose you were born an incredibly ugly person and no one wanted to be sealed to you. Are you damned then?
Suppose you were born in obscurity in isolation and no one wanted to be sealed to you? Are you also damned?
Of course, everyone will say "God will make it right". However what does that even mean?

If more men than women are saved then the extra men are damned.
If more women than men are saved and polygamy is not of God then the extra women are damned.
If more women than men are saved and polygamy is of God then why should some men get more women? That is unfair and some men are damned.

You are essentially tying someone's eternal advancement to another person. This is also in direct contradiction to Paul's statements that we should only get married if we can't control our passions. Do we have more light and truth than Paul? I find this incredibly hard to believe because of his actions compared to our own.

So, let's see what the temple sealing claims to be. The OP has two questions really. First, what is a temple sealing according to LDS. and Second, do you accept that or think something else. I'm documenting the first.

What is below was linked to a while back on the forum as pre-1990 sealing ceremony. It has really three parts. The first is the husband promising to be a faithful husband. The second is the wife promising to be a faithful wife. These are here to ensure the marriage is legitimate and legal. See the words. Things like own free will, take each other as spouses, promise to be "honorable" according to norms in society (none spelled out, but assumed). Etc....

Part three is about eternity and celestial promises and sealing power.

Part 1: Brother X, do you take Sister Y by the right hand and receive her unto yourself to be your lawful and wedded wife for time and all eternity, with a covenant and promise that you will observe and keep all the laws, rites, and ordinances pertaining to this Holy Order of Matrimony in the New and Everlasting Covenant, and this you do in the presence of God, angels, and these witnesses of your own free will and choice?

Part 2: Sister Y do you take Brother X by the right hand and give yourself to him to be his lawful and wedded wife, and for him to be your lawful and wedded husband, for time and all eternity, with a covenant and promise that you will observe and keep all the laws, rites and ordinances pertaining to this Holy Order of Matrimony in the New and Everlasting Covenant, and this you do in the presence of God, angels, and these witnesses of your own free will and choice?

Part 3: By virtue of the Holy Priesthood and the authority vested in me, I pronounce you Brother X, and Sister Y, legally and lawfully husband and wife for time and all eternity, and I seal upon you the blessings of the holy resurrection with power to come forth in the morning of the first resurrection clothed in glory, immortality and eternal lives, and I seal upon you the blessings of kingdoms, thrones, principalities, powers, dominions and exaltations, with all the blessings of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and say unto you: be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth that you may have joy and rejoicing in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. All these blessings, together with all the blessings appertaining unto the New and Everlasting Covenant, I seal upon you by virtue of the Holy Priesthood, through your faithfulness, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, Amen.

We see the simple promise of an eternal partnership. and Eternal increase. But only if you are faithful. Only if it is sealed up by Holy Spirit of Promise.

It means that if you achieve this and get sealed up by HSoP, you will become gods. I mean, gods are celestial beings/couples that have eternal increase. that is the "spirits" or "intelligences" flow unto them to become celestial offspring and "do so without compulsory means for ever more".

Show me that in any other religion than LDS ( or a JS off shoot)!

Telavian wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 11:29 pm

TheDuke wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 11:18 pm BUT, that is salvation, living with god (in CK), heir of the father, joint heir with Christ, church of the Firstborn, etc... not becoming like or a god yourself, that is exaltation. that separates LDS doctrine from the rest of Christianity. Temple sealing is the ordinance that, like baptism, brings a couple together for eternity, IF and only IF, they are worthy, ready and sealed by the HSoP (HG). I'm guessing very few are. NO ONE else will obtain exaltation. Sorry, just a fact, BTW a fact the the Lord (Father) told me personally, and at a time, I was a bit out of sorts with the LDS temples due to Oaks discussion of tithing a few years back. After standing corrected I knew the temple sealings are real, for a few anyway.

This seems so unfair if you think about it. Suppose you were born an incredibly ugly person and no one wanted to be sealed to you. Are you damned then?
Suppose you were born in obscurity in isolation and no one wanted to be sealed to you?

You are essentially tying someone's eternal advancement to another person. This is also in direct contradiction to Paul's statements that we should only get married if we can't control our passions. Do we have more light and truth than Paul? I find this incredibly hard to believe because on his actions compared to our own.

Sorry, while salvation is an individual achievement award presented by Jesus to you via the HSoP, exaltation is a team sport. You cannot finish without your team. You cannot have children w/o a spouse. You cannot be god w/o having increase (that is the definition of god by JS).

If you're ready for exaltation in this eternal round, you will be beautiful to someone! and if it was promised you in the pre-mortal council, you will obtain it. If not now, in the millennium, after all that is what the millennium is for, that silly Mormon "welding link" story, is really about dotting the i. and crossing the t's to ensure every single person in the pre-mortal council, gets what they were promised (if they did what they promised that is).

Telavian wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 10:56 pm

Lykos wrote: ↑September 27th, 2023, 7:05 pm When you go back to the temple to officiate in the ordinances on behalf of your ancestors
You are reminded of the time you yourself made those covenants of your own choice for yourself.

The fundamental question is, why do they need them in the first place? Could no one be saved unless they received all the ordinances personally or vicariously in modern times?
If this is true then why do we see no evidence of this in the Bible or the Book of Mormon which both contain the fulness of the gospel?

The Fullness of the Gospel of the Son of God, yes. The Fullness of the Gospel of the Father? (See 3 Nephi 16). No. That was only given to us in Nauvoo by the Prophet Joseph Smith.

“The Calling of The Church of Christ is to Preach the First Principles of the Gospel, the Gospel of Christ, and those Principles having to do with the Doctrine of Salvation — while the Church of the Firstborn is to Preach ‘THE GOSPEL OF THE FATHER’ which is the Celestial Doctrine which pertains to EXALTATION.” — Fred C. Collier (Doctrinal Teachings of Patriarch Fred C. Collier page cxxxi)