LDS Freedom Forum

This is… interesting. The B.H. Roberts foundation is doing a survey. The first 12 questions are demographics. But the 13 question, which is the first real question on the survey is this:

“ 13. How likely do you think it is that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints will eventually marry (seal) gay couples in the temple?”

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/BCNJ5T3? ... Cp5R9kzsro

Overton window

I don’t think it’s right, but I do think it will happen eventually. If the church survives that long.

My membership in the church isn't too meaningful anymore, but the day this all-but-inevitable change for gay sealings happens will be the very day I send the letter to have my name removed. Notary friends standby.

Libertas Est Salus wrote: ↑September 22nd, 2023, 9:10 pm My membership in the church isn't too meaningful anymore, but the day this all-but-inevitable change for gay sealings happens will be the very day I send the letter to have my name removed. Notary friends standby.

I don’t think I could have had a better gal notarize my letter.

• Female
• Bright pink hair
• Multiple ear rings and piercings
• Tattoos all over

BTW, in my area it cost $5 and change to notarize a letter. You have to pay to join the church, and to leave it.

Why does leaving the church require a notarized letter?

BigT wrote: ↑September 22nd, 2023, 9:17 pm Why does leaving the church require a motorized letter?

There are two ways to have your records removed, at least that I’m aware of:

1. Talk w/ your bishop and stake president and they can send a letter to HQ to have your records removed.

2. Write your own letter and notarize it. (You can use quit mormon, or do it yourself)

The reason for the notary is because quitmormon.org was having people use their online submission/form, but they weren’t the actual person making the request. Kirton McConkie (I believe it was them) contacted quit mormon and told them they wouldn’t accept any more record removal requests unless the letter was notarized.

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 22nd, 2023, 8:54 pm This is… interesting. The B.H. Roberts foundation is doing a survey. The first 12 questions are demographics. But the 13 question, which is the first real question on the survey is this:

“ 13. How likely do you think it is that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints will eventually marry (seal) gay couples in the temple?”

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/BCNJ5T3? ... Cp5R9kzsro

This is very similar to the survey done in 1990 that gauged attitudes towards the endowment. That caused all the penalties to be removed.
I am not sure what the results of the survey are, however if the change is going to happen it will likely be in the next year or 2.

How would even the most diehard members explain the church getting guidance from surveys? Shouldn't God be dictating whether gay marriage is allowed and not public opinions?

How do they lean?

How does one find out that it was a survey that cause d the removal of penalties in the endowment?

madvin wrote: ↑September 23rd, 2023, 7:19 am How does one find out that it was a survey that cause d the removal of penalties in the endowment?

I wrote about the ordinances changes here:
https://uncorrelatedmormonism.com/a-lis ... e-changes/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1cRSFwmofc

This link has a lot of good information about why things changed.
https://www.lds-mormon.com/whytemplechanges-shtml/

Basically in 1990 the Endowment totally changed and everything "offensive" was removed. It has continued to soften over time and now is fundamentally different than when it started. Most members will claim "further light and knowledge", however I think that is too simplistic of an answer.

Here is the webpage of the group that is doing the survey: https://bhroberts.org/about

BigT wrote: ↑September 22nd, 2023, 9:17 pm Why does leaving the church require a motorized letter?

Because it's hard to get anywhere without a motor.

Reluctant Watchman wrote: ↑September 22nd, 2023, 8:54 pm This is… interesting. The B.H. Roberts foundation is doing a survey. The first 12 questions are demographics. But the 13 question, which is the first real question on the survey is this:

“ 13. How likely do you think it is that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints will eventually marry (seal) gay couples in the temple?”

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/BCNJ5T3? ... Cp5R9kzsro

Seeing that the number 13 has always been associated with evil or being unlucky it is an appropriate number for the question that was asked.

BringerOfJoy wrote: ↑September 23rd, 2023, 9:05 am

BigT wrote: ↑September 22nd, 2023, 9:17 pm Why does leaving the church require a motorized letter?

Because it's hard to get anywhere without a motor.

Bahaha

Perhaps the survey is motivated by a 'behind closed doors' request from the Q15. If so, it would follow the trend of the FED in using private corporations as extensions for their agenda.

Hey! I’m a lurker and will go back to that. Don’t have the same brain width as y’all but I do have a question(maybe two):


Is this foundation associated at all with the LDS church?
Does the LDS church have access to these surveys.

I can speculate that the answer to both is yes but would like some hard evidence.
Thanks !

BringerOfJoy wrote: ↑September 23rd, 2023, 9:05 am

BigT wrote: ↑September 22nd, 2023, 9:17 pm Why does leaving the church require a motorized letter?

Because it's hard to get anywhere without a motor.

lol
It was the ‘o’ after the ‘t’ that triggered the autocorrect.

While poking around the BH Roberts website I came across this which is actually kind of a nice tool.
https://ldsbot.com/

Michako wrote: ↑September 23rd, 2023, 1:44 pm Hey! I’m a lurker and will go back to that. Don’t have the same brain width as y’all but I do have a question(maybe two):


Is this foundation associated at all with the LDS church?
Does the LDS church have access to these surveys.

I can speculate that the answer to both is yes but would like some hard evidence.
Thanks !

1) yes
2) yes

A secondary email for this survey is from Brigham Young University.

BTW, welcome to the forum. Quite the thread to make your appearance.

Thank you
Is there a place that I can see the BYU survey?
I ask because I have friends who want proof.
One feels like this survey was very anti Mormon and can’t believe that this has anything to do with the church.
Thanks for the welcome and thank you for the help.

Michako wrote: ↑September 23rd, 2023, 6:08 pm Thank you
Is there a place that I can see the BYU survey?
I ask because I have friends who want proof.
One feels like this survey was very anti Mormon and can’t believe that this has anything to do with the church.
Thanks for the welcome and thank you for the help.

I included a link in the first post of this thread. I also believe another comment further on added the link as well. Here it is again:

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/BCNJ5T3? ... Cp5R9kzsro

Oh, your friend is in for a real treat. This question (#13) wasn’t the only gem in the survey. And yes, there is not only a link to the B.H. Roberts foundation, but a legit BYU email address to go along with it.

Here’s the intro copy to the survey:

National Survey of Current and Former Latter-day Saints
Introduction
Thank you for agreeing to participate in this survey about members and former members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints conducted by the BH Roberts Foundation. Your answers will help add to the body of knowledge about Latter-day Saint and former Latter-day Saint beliefs and practices.

Your participation in this study is voluntary and you can withdraw at any time without penalty. If you agree to participate, you will be asked to complete an online survey that will take about 15 minutes. The survey will ask you questions about your demographic characteristics, worldviews, and your religious beliefs and practices. Only one person in your household should complete the survey.

There are no foreseeable risks or benefits associated with this study. Your responses will be confidential. The data will be stored on a secure server and only accessible by the researcher and his authorized assistants. At the end you will be given the chance to enter your email if you wish to be enrolled in future studies. If you do send in your email, we will not link it to your responses to this survey.

If you have any questions about this study, you can contact [email protected]. If you have any concerns about your rights as a research participant, you can contact the BYU Institutional Review Board (IRB) at [email protected].

By clicking on the "Next" button below, you indicate that you have read and understood this information, that you are 18 years or older, and that you consent to participate in this study.

Michako wrote: ↑September 23rd, 2023, 1:44 pm Hey! I’m a lurker and will go back to that. Don’t have the same brain width as y’all but I do have a question(maybe two):


Is this foundation associated at all with the LDS church?
Does the LDS church have access to these surveys.

I can speculate that the answer to both is yes but would like some hard evidence.
Thanks !

I listened to a podcast a while back where a survey maker for the church was interviewed. He said the majority of them are highly educated from very prestigious universities and were very well compensated compared to the run of the mill church employees. They worked closely with the q15 and administered surveys to groups of people within the church they were trying to learn more about. Virtually all church programs or changes to programs resulted from survey results. So there goes the “revelation” process! I wish I remembered the podcast, I’ll see if I can find it and post it on here. Super interesting.

Telavian wrote: ↑September 23rd, 2023, 7:51 am

madvin wrote: ↑September 23rd, 2023, 7:19 am How does one find out that it was a survey that cause d the removal of penalties in the endowment?

I wrote about the ordinances changes here:
https://uncorrelatedmormonism.com/a-lis ... e-changes/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1cRSFwmofc

This link has a lot of good information about why things changed.
https://www.lds-mormon.com/whytemplechanges-shtml/

Basically in 1990 the Endowment totally changed and everything "offensive" was removed. It has continued to soften over time and now is fundamentally different than when it started. Most members will claim "further light and knowledge", however I think that is too simplistic of an answer.

After pondering and praying about the subject (I mention that because I feel it isn’t coming from me) I don’t agree that these changes were significant. That is, I feel they don’t change the power of the endowment, etc. although if they came as a result of a survey (recent changes) that seems a bit gamma.