Why is it that there are no blue collar GAs

[Cruiserdude]

Whom the Lord calls, the Lord qualifies.

Right now, the Lord qualifies those who are in the Q12 and FP. What many people forget is that the Church is in such a position now that is simply unprecedented based on the Scriptures. The Scriptures talked about a very localized Church in one small region of the world (two if you include the Book of Mormon), plus the very early modern-day Church (in Doctrine and Covenants).

You didn't have things like visas or passports then, not to mention international flights. The closest example that you can see to the current situation is the Apostle Paul, who a few on this board decry as well, who used his Roman citizenship and previous knowledge to the advantage of the Church spreading missionary work abroad from Jerusalem all the way to Greece and Rome. President Nelson oftentimes was able to make connections not so much because of his calling as an Apostle, but through the medical profession. He is well respected in China, NOT because of his religious ties, but because of his ties in medicine and him having taught many students there and learning their language.

The Church is so big now that you need 15 Pauls to keep up with every development that is going on.

That's how you get out of touch with the common man. That's how elitism starts. See Hollywood. I'm tired of the sentiment that you must have a degree or a "higher" degree in order to be smart enough or driven enough to do good for your family or for the gospel. Blue collar workers would offer additional insights and ways of doing things that would be beneficial.

Joe the Plumber questioned Barack. IRS got on him fast.

This is what happens when you put plumbers in charge. They start asking questions and then the iRS...

Blue collars folks, in general, most times we just don't make good yes men. Blue collar small business owners might be the group most in touch with the common man but our opinion is the least valued among the white shirts and red chairs.
The Amish got it right and we got it wrong.

[Ymarsakar]

Hey, all of you didn't get it wrong. Just like most human programs, sooner or later it gets hijacked. THat is natural or perhaps just satanic.

That's how you get out of touch with the common man. That's how elitism starts. See Hollywood. I'm tired of the sentiment that you must have a degree or a "higher" degree in order to be smart enough or driven enough to do good for your family or for the gospel. Blue collar workers would offer additional insights and ways of doing things that would be beneficial.

Joe the Plumber questioned Barack. IRS got on him fast.

This is what happens when you put plumbers in charge. They start asking questions and then the iRS...

Blue collars folks, in general, most times we just don't make good yes men. Blue collar small business owners might be the group most in touch with the common man but our opinion is the least valued among the white shirts and red chairs.
The Amish got it right and we got it wrong.

[WikiUp]

I think Bednar is evil. I am sorry. I have been around the guy in numerous settings. It is something that really gave me doubts that I had to doubt.

This goes beyond him being a corporate yes man.

Bednar is a tool.

There are no homosexuals in the church:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BQ4_wTGv8Ao

Earrings:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fqhK8fB9m-Q

Agency: you’re not free to do what you want:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mmErOV9oQZ8

Churches can help with misinformation:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qfk7NTOdbKI

Gets too touchy with a boy:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ftp4-kT9VSg

Watch Bednar's wife as he speaks on these topics. She is serious agony about what he is saying. She looks like she does not want to be sitting beside him as he speaks.

Poor lady, but she has made her choice.

[RosyPosy]

But cause unfortunately blue collar are still looked down and under paid!

The Q15 love being hyped up pampered princes.

[silverado]

Just wondering why all of the GAs are executives, MBAs Drs. Lawyers etc? If men and women are truly called by revelation and led by God then one would think that simply through the law of averages that eventually a plumber, roofer, welder etc. would be called to the plush maroon seats. So why is this not the case anymore?

One was a pilot.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Whom the Lord calls, the Lord qualifies.

Uh... I'd suggest you read JST Mark 9 again, and again, and again...

The lord does call prophets. Sometimes they are w/in a church. Sometimes they are outside of any organized religion. And sometimes, maybe, even prophets screw up really, really bad.

[Fred]

Just wondering why all of the GAs are executives, MBAs Drs. Lawyers etc? If men and women are truly called by revelation and led by God then one would think that simply through the law of averages that eventually a plumber, roofer, welder etc. would be called to the plush maroon seats. So why is this not the case anymore?

Whom the Lord calls, the Lord qualifies.

Right now, the Lord qualifies those who are in the Q12 and FP. What many people forget is that the Church is in such a position now that is simply unprecedented based on the Scriptures. The Scriptures talked about a very localized Church in one small region of the world (two if you include the Book of Mormon), plus the very early modern-day Church (in Doctrine and Covenants).

You didn't have things like visas or passports then, not to mention international flights. The closest example that you can see to the current situation is the Apostle Paul, who a few on this board decry as well, who used his Roman citizenship and previous knowledge to the advantage of the Church spreading missionary work abroad from Jerusalem all the way to Greece and Rome. President Nelson oftentimes was able to make connections not so much because of his calling as an Apostle, but through the medical profession. He is well respected in China, NOT because of his religious ties, but because of his ties in medicine and him having taught many students there and learning their language.

The Church is so big now that you need 15 Pauls to keep up with every development that is going on.

How did the Q15 convince you that Isaiah was a liar?

[Erastothenes]

Apologies but I didnt want this post to turn into a leader bashing session. It was meant as a real question. Recently we got a new bishopric. There were all sorts of guesses as to who it would be. I said that it would be "Brother X." When he was called my wifes friend wanted to know how i knew. I simoly said that he is a young, professional who has a lot of connections in the community and fits the mold of the other GAs. Never mind that there are plenty of very spiritual blue-collar men in the ward. To me, the continued calling of bankers, businessmen and those who "shower before work rather than after," causes the church to lose credibility.

[Cruiserdude]

Apologies but I didnt want this post to turn into a leader bashing session. It was meant as a real question. Recently we got a new bishopric. There were all sorts of guesses as to who it would be. I said that it would be "Brother X." When he was called my wifes friend wanted to know how i knew. I simoly said that he is a young, professional who has a lot of connections in the community and fits the mold of the other GAs. Never mind that there are plenty of very spiritual blue-collar men in the ward. To me, the continued calling of bankers, businessmen and those who "shower before work rather than after," causes the church to lose credibility.

Never heard the difference described in those terms... "shower before work rather than after", I like it

[Ymarsakar]

Apologies but I didnt want this post to turn into a leader bashing session. It was meant as a real question. Recently we got a new bishopric. There were all sorts of guesses as to who it would be. I said that it would be "Brother X." When he was called my wifes friend wanted to know how i knew. I simoly said that he is a young, professional who has a lot of connections in the community and fits the mold of the other GAs. Never mind that there are plenty of very spiritual blue-collar men in the ward. To me, the continued calling of bankers, businessmen and those who "shower before work rather than after," causes the church to lose credibility.

Never heard the difference described in those terms... "shower before work rather than after", I like it

Working 4-7 physical hours a day, I understand that very well. So much sweat and gunk and other problems, easier to wash it off at the end of the day and go to bed. Along with hot and cold towels to reduce inflamation.

[Cruiserdude]

Apologies but I didnt want this post to turn into a leader bashing session. It was meant as a real question. Recently we got a new bishopric. There were all sorts of guesses as to who it would be. I said that it would be "Brother X." When he was called my wifes friend wanted to know how i knew. I simoly said that he is a young, professional who has a lot of connections in the community and fits the mold of the other GAs. Never mind that there are plenty of very spiritual blue-collar men in the ward. To me, the continued calling of bankers, businessmen and those who "shower before work rather than after," causes the church to lose credibility.

Never heard the difference described in those terms... "shower before work rather than after", I like it

Working 4-7 physical hours a day, I understand that very well. So much sweat and gunk and other problems, easier to wash it off at the end of the day and go to bed. Along with hot and cold towels to reduce inflamation.

I'm weird, I actually enjoy and look forward to physical work.... Maybe not 8 straight hours of ditch digging lol but I like eating and sleeping 'by the sweat of my brow'

[Ymarsakar]

That's not weird, it just means your body has little inflamation/injuries, and you are rooted in your base chakras.

Never heard the difference described in those terms... "shower before work rather than after", I like it

Working 4-7 physical hours a day, I understand that very well. So much sweat and gunk and other problems, easier to wash it off at the end of the day and go to bed. Along with hot and cold towels to reduce inflamation.

I'm weird, I actually enjoy and look forward to physical work.... Maybe not 8 straight hours of ditch digging lol but I like eating and sleeping 'by the sweat of my brow'

[IcedKoffee]

Just wondering why all of the GAs are executives, MBAs Drs. Lawyers etc? If men and women are truly called by revelation and led by God then one would think that simply through the law of averages that eventually a plumber, roofer, welder etc. would be called to the plush maroon seats. So why is this not the case anymore?

Because they have proven themselves to be loyal company men. They are willing to dot the I’s () and cross the T’s () no questions asked (). In other words they are “CHURCH BROKE”!!!

[Lykos]

Most people are involved locally. Only a small number will be called be general authorities.

Unfortunately a majority of folks in the usa have moved away from the trades, accepted the 'everyone must go to college' brain drain, and thus fewer and fewer people are "blue collar" workers.

Additionally, trades people quickly get smart and realize that its better to be the owner of the business and realize the profits vs being the guy doing the work and getting paid, thus at the end of their career they're the white collar business owner and retired.

Additionally, Bishop and Stake President callings take a ton of time. People know this. Most people dont realistically have the time do fulfil these calls during their working decades of their lives. So even when it is extended, they dont accept the invitation.

All these factors to say
Yes, thats the way the world works right now. It didn't always, but this is where we are.

Who knows what the future will look like. One major solar event and all the people working on computers will be SOL

[Ymarsakar]

Most people are involved locally. Only a small number will be called be general authorities.

Unfortunately a majority of folks in the usa have moved away from the trades, accepted the 'everyone must go to college' brain drain, and thus fewer and fewer people are "blue collar" workers.

Additionally, trades people quickly get smart and realize that its better to be the owner of the business and realize the profits vs being the guy doing the work and getting paid, thus at the end of their career they're the white collar business owner and retired.

Additionally, Bishop and Stake President callings take a ton of time. People know this. Most people dont realistically have the time do fulfil these calls during their working decades of their lives. So even when it is extended, they dont accept the invitation.

All these factors to say
Yes, thats the way the world works right now. It didn't always, but this is where we are.

Who knows what the future will look like. One major solar event and all the people working on computers will be SOL

Look up some articles about march 13, 2023. they think we missed a carrington event ; )

[mudflap]

Apologies but I didnt want this post to turn into a leader bashing session. It was meant as a real question. Recently we got a new bishopric. There were all sorts of guesses as to who it would be. I said that it would be "Brother X." When he was called my wifes friend wanted to know how i knew. I simoly said that he is a young, professional who has a lot of connections in the community and fits the mold of the other GAs. Never mind that there are plenty of very spiritual blue-collar men in the ward. To me, the continued calling of bankers, businessmen and those who "shower before work rather than after," causes the church to lose credibility.

lol. I KNEW I wasn't in the club.

[Mamabear]

I think Bednar is evil. I am sorry. I have been around the guy in numerous settings. It is something that really gave me doubts that I had to doubt.

This goes beyond him being a corporate yes man.

Bednar is a tool.

There are no homosexuals in the church:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BQ4_wTGv8Ao

Earrings:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fqhK8fB9m-Q

Agency: you’re not free to do what you want:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mmErOV9oQZ8

Churches can help with misinformation:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qfk7NTOdbKI

Gets too touchy with a boy:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ftp4-kT9VSg

Watch Bednar's wife as he speaks on these topics. She is serious agony about what he is saying. She looks like she does not want to be sitting beside him as he speaks.

Poor lady, but she has made her choice.

I noticed this as well. Very sad.

This video explains a lot…. She can’t even stand up before he does at a conference. Stepford wife.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CPBsWbopjXU

[InfoWarrior82]

While serving my mission, about 6 months in, I asked this very question to my companion. He did not know and it was very apparent that this was the first time this had even crossed his mind.

We didn't come up with a good answer. I think I remember that we concluded that "The Lord needs these kind of men because we live in modern times."

I now know better.

[Nevervaxxed]

My wife and I have friends who are still very active in the church. 3 or more years ago, we were on Vaca with them. We were still active at the time and my friends wife, who works fairly high up in the church, was talking about her interactions with the "brethren", which were not always positive. This was pre- RMN. I stated something along the lines that I believed all of these mean were fairly wealthy so the could serve as lay clergy in their later years, that the Lord must of blessed them so they could serve without pay. My friends wife burst my bubble and told me the brethren were all paid a salary of $125,000 a year, as well as having their virtually all of their expenses, such as travel and residence, covered. At first, I found this alarming; what happened to lay clergy? But then I thought that this salary would allow for more blue collar types. But after researching more, I found that there were none such. So why are wealthy businessmen being paid by the supposed "no paid clergy" church? Shortly thereafter we were informed by the brethren that the killer jab was "safe & effective", which it is obviously NOT, so I really started digging - after all, if they would lie about that, what else that we've been told are lies? Then I found this site, and many on here helped me see so much more clearly. I feel enlightened by people on here such as reluctant Watchman, Lizzy, crusaderdude, and others who share here; I even enjoy those who still defend the church, like Luke and subcommante, although no I find the apologists come across as defensive and even having cognitive dissonance. But, perhaps they are in the same positions as my friend and his wife, where acknowledging the church has gone astray - maybe better said as no longer representing Christ's character and ideals - would dramatically change their lives, so they really do not want to acknowledge it. Cognitive dissonance is rampant, both in and out of the Church. But the Gospel of Jesus is still true. I feel that in my bones

[Hiker]

Some years ago, my former ward had a Bishop that was a truck driver.

He was the best Bishop I ever had!

[Atrasado]

I think Bednar is evil. I am sorry. I have been around the guy in numerous settings. It is something that really gave me doubts that I had to doubt.

This goes beyond him being a corporate yes man.

I agree 100%. I got very bad vibes from him starting when he was president of BYU-I. I was total TBM at the time, and it was very unlike myself to have any strong feelings, especially negative ones, about church leaders.

I once walked by Bednar on a sidewalk in Rexburg, or so I think. He was wearing a mask, but there aren't very many thin, healthy 75-80 year olds with eyes and hair exactly (I would know that hair anywhere) like his on campus and he comes for meetings every three months or so.

Anyway, his glare (if it was him) at me was a nuclear powered beam of malevolence. I assume it was because I wasn't wearing a mask and wasn't being a good global citizen like we had been 'advised'. It was so extreme it was nearly comical.

I've never interacted with him, otherwise. However, a friend of mine home taught him. When they came in he would visibly start a timer and when it hit 30 minutes he would walk them to the door. He is a different sorta duck.

[Atrasado]

When the original apostles were called they were almost all bluecollar, with the exception of perhaps Matthew the tax collector. The original twelve in this dispensation were also almost all blue collar. It makes sense, since the Lord was a carpenter.

I think back ten years and realize I was a bit of an idolater. I was so proud about the GA's worldly accomplishments and would read all the GA biographies. It seems we would be better served as a church if we had simple men serving as GAs, smaller congregations, and a simpler life instead of living as clean-shaven Babylonians. Maybe then we would still have the fruits of the Spirit and miracles.

[Mamabear]

I think Bednar is evil. I am sorry. I have been around the guy in numerous settings. It is something that really gave me doubts that I had to doubt.

This goes beyond him being a corporate yes man.

I agree 100%. I got very bad vibes from him starting when he was president of BYU-I. I was total TBM at the time, and it was very unlike myself to have any strong feelings, especially negative ones, about church leaders.

I once walked by Bednar on a sidewalk in Rexburg, or so I think. He was wearing a mask, but there aren't very many thin, healthy 75-80 year olds with eyes and hair exactly (I would know that hair anywhere) like his on campus and he comes for meetings every three months or so.

Anyway, his glare (if it was him) at me was a nuclear powered beam of malevolence. I assume it was because I wasn't wearing a mask and wasn't being a good global citizen like we had been 'advised'. It was so extreme it was nearly comical.

I've never interacted with him, otherwise. However, a friend of mine home taught him. When they came in he would visibly start a timer and when it hit 30 minutes he would walk them to the door. He is a different sorta duck.

The glare sounds like a match.
These stories sound like him too

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comme ... ung_girls/

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comme ... r/e593hyt/

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comme ... e_opening/

[Niemand]

Just wondering why all of the GAs are executives, MBAs Drs. Lawyers etc? If men and women are truly called by revelation and led by God then one would think that simply through the law of averages that eventually a plumber, roofer, welder etc. would be called to the plush maroon seats. So why is this not the case anymore?

One was a pilot.

Kind of. Uchtdorf became an executive within Lufthansa. So he comes out of boardroom culture.

He is by far their most engaging speaker. (Despite any political issues!) I believe that's partly why Nelson kicked him downstairs.

[Atrasado]

I agree 100%. I got very bad vibes from him starting when he was president of BYU-I. I was total TBM at the time, and it was very unlike myself to have any strong feelings, especially negative ones, about church leaders.

I once walked by Bednar on a sidewalk in Rexburg, or so I think. He was wearing a mask, but there aren't very many thin, healthy 75-80 year olds with eyes and hair exactly (I would know that hair anywhere) like his on campus and he comes for meetings every three months or so.

Anyway, his glare (if it was him) at me was a nuclear powered beam of malevolence. I assume it was because I wasn't wearing a mask and wasn't being a good global citizen like we had been 'advised'. It was so extreme it was nearly comical.

I've never interacted with him, otherwise. However, a friend of mine home taught him. When they came in he would visibly start a timer and when it hit 30 minutes he would walk them to the door. He is a different sorta duck.

The glare sounds like a match.
These stories sound like him too

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comme ... ung_girls/

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comme ... r/e593hyt/

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comme ... e_opening/

Good grief. Those are quite the stories. Revoked!!!