YHWH = Yeshuah/Jesus

[ransomme]

There are many references to Jesus in the scriptures by titles and deeds that show that Jesus is YHWH. I think this helped lead to the invention of the Trinity doctrine, so they could reconcile the obvious fact that Jesus is YHWH and that it is also clearly stated that there is only One God.

Here are a few easy passages showing that inspired writers of the Bible knew that Jesus was YHWH. In the Old Testament all the foreshadowing of YHWH coming in the flesh, all the word links (especially between Isaiah and the NT), etc. make it obvious to those seeing and hearing. And in the New Testament, they knew that Jesus was Emmanuel (God is with us).

Jesus knew it,
“Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad…Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” (John 8:56,58)

Then Moses said to God, “Behold, I am about to come to the sons of Israel, and I will say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you.’ And they will say to me, ‘What is His name?’ What shall I say to them?” And God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM”; and He said, “Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’” And God furthermore said to Moses, “Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, ‘YHWH, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.’ This is My name forever, and this is My memorial-name from generation to generation. (Exodus 3:13-15)

It's right there in the meaning of the name:

YHVH.JPG (18.43 KiB) Viewed 187 times

It was known by all the disciples who led Israel out of Egypt, “Now I want to remind you, though you know all things, that Jesus, having once saved a people out of the land of Egypt, subsequently destroyed those who did not believe.” (Jude 5)

The presence of YHWH led Israel out of Egypt and was the one Whom Moses went with Aaron, Nadab and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel up on Mt. Sinai (Exodus 24) and in the Tent of Meeting “Thus Moses finished the work. Then the cloud covered the tent of meeting, and the glory of YHWH filled the tabernacle. And Moses was not able to enter the tent of meeting because the cloud had dwelt on it, and the glory of YHWH filled the tabernacle.” (Exodus 40:33-35)

John knew and wrote His Gospel to show this connection between YHWH the Creator and Jesus, “1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being. 4 In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. 5 And the Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not overtake it. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God. 14 And the Word became flesh, and tabernacled among us, and we beheld His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth.”

Versus Genesis 1, “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. And the earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters.” (John 1:1-5,12-14)

As is also linked here in Proverbs 8 - The witness of Wisdom
22 “YHWH created me at the beginning of His way, Before His deeds of old.
23 From everlasting I was installed, From the beginning, from the earliest times of the earth.
24 When there were no depths I was brought forth, When there were no springs heavy with water.
25 Before the mountains were settled, Before the hills I was brought forth;
26 While He had not yet made the earth and the fields outside, Nor the first dust of the world.
27 When He (YHWH) established the heavens, I was there, When He (YHWH) marked out a circle on the face of the deep, (this is the same language in Hebrew as Genesis 1:1-2, and that means that the Spirit over the waters in Genesis 1 is YHWH)

Jesus being YHWH became obvious to Peter, James and John, when they saw the Lord Jesus in glory on Mt. Transfiguration. Who else was there? Moses and Elijah. When and where did Moses most famously commune with YHWH? Mt Sinai. How about Elijah, when and where did he famously commune with YHWH? Mt Sinai/Horeb. If not sooner, at that moment Peter, James, and John knew that Jesus was YHWH. They understood which is why then, "...Jesus commanded them, saying, “Tell the vision to no one until the Son of Man has risen from the dead.” (Matthew 17:19)" This is also why Peter said, “Lord, it is good for us to be here. If you want, I will make three shelters (tabernacles/tents/coverings)—one for you, one for Moses, and one for Elijah.”


Even ancient Jews recognized this anciently and didn’t know it:

Deut 31 YHWH 01.JPG (54.85 KiB) Viewed 187 times

Paul knew it. In Romans 10:9,12-13 he writes, “...if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved…the same Lord is Lord of all, who richly blesses all who call on him. For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” Here Paul quoted Joel 2:32 about YHWH and says plainly that He is Jesus, “And it will be that everyone who calls on the name of YHWH will be delivered;”

Isaiah 43:11
11 I, even I, am YHWH, And there is no savior besides Me. (And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved. - Acts 4:12)

Paul does this in other places like Philippians 2:10-11 where he quotes Isaiah 45:23 saying, “so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow —in heaven and on earth and under the earth— and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord (YHWH) to the glory of God the Father.”

The Gospel of Mark starts off quoting Isaiah who was talking about YHWH, “The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God. As it is written in the prophet Isaiah, “Look, I am sending my messenger ahead of you, who will prepare your way, the voice of one shouting in the wilderness, ‘Prepare the way for the Lord (YHWH), make his paths straight.’”

I'm tired that's enough for now. These are typical examples. Do you have any favorites?

[TheChristian]

The disciple Thomas apon seeing the risen Lord Jesus called Him "My Lord and my God."

I see our Lord Jesus in both old and New testaments in great simplicity, its best put by our Lord Himself,

"You pour over the scriptures thinking in them you have Eternal Life,
But all the time they are testifieing to Me"

[Lynn]

According to the ancient Jewish/Hebrew texts, it was Michael at the Burning Bush who spoke to Moses. It was Michael, Gabriel, and Raphael sent to Abraham & Sarah, then Lot. Michael of which was referred to as Lord. One phrase associated with Michael, is Deus Angelorum (which means "God of the angels"). In Jewish understanding, it is Michael who is the intercessor of prayers (meaning he presents them to God). Even though he is referred to as I AM That I AM, the meaning is Existence is Existence. Later in the OT after the Burning Bush encounter, we find that the NAME that Moses sought, was IHVH, of which Abraham, Isaac & Jacob had known in earlier days as it had been revealed to them. Michael is also tagged or associated with the Word, as well as Son.

But Jesus is the flesh made messenger (incarnation of) Michael, so we are speaking of the same (but not directly, but a different portion. As Adam, he brought death into the picture. In his last physical incarnation, he showed how to overcome it. He or She who starts a thing, can only be the one to undo a thing (in other words, end it).

[TheDuke]

I don't find this in any way conclusive. I'm not saying it isn't true. I'm saying that with ancient translations meanings sometimes seem added later. Also, in modern times truths seemed to have morphed as JS learned line-upon-line. Of course RMN must agree, he changed the endowment to say this.

I would write a book on the different perceived definitions in Hebrew over time of "elohim" or even "el", let alone Jehovah.

Add some divine investiture and walla. clear as mud.

One example. Jacob wrestled with an angel. Hurt his hip. Apparently an angel like those that kept visiting him throughout his life. Likely men from Melchizedek. but he named the place "Peniel". Now a circular story. He wrestled with an angel. The place is named Peniel. Peniel later means seeing god or something. So Jacob saw god and actually wrestled with god and hurt his hip. I have a problem with this type of evidence. It is circular. It took 2000 years to develop. Who knows who/when it was named, no one wrote it down. Did he make up "Peniel" on the spot. It is only known as there is a small stack of rocks he used as a pillow? Who uses rocks as a pillow? There are stacks of rocks everywhere. How is making the name of the place overcoming his statement is was only an angel? When did it become "god" not an angel? How many translations got it to this point or should I say word by word over time?

In the end the story only makes sense to me as an angel. God isn't known as a wrestler. Moses only got to see his backside, how would Jacob sojourning with goats and stuff wrestle with him physically?

[FrankOne]

According to the ancient Jewish/Hebrew texts, it was Michael at the Burning Bush who spoke to Moses. It was Michael, Gabriel, and Raphael sent to Abraham & Sarah, then Lot. Michael of which was referred to as Lord. One phrase associated with Michael, is Deus Angelorum (which means "God of the angels"). In Jewish understanding, it is Michael who is the intercessor of prayers (meaning he presents them to God). Even though he is referred to as I AM That I AM, the meaning is Existence is Existence. Later in the OT after the Burning Bush encounter, we find that the NAME that Moses sought, was IHVH, of which Abraham, Isaac & Jacob had known in earlier days as it had been revealed to them. Michael is also tagged or associated with the Word, as well as Son.

But Jesus is the flesh made messenger (incarnation of) Michael, so we are speaking of the same (but not directly, but a different portion. As Adam, he brought death into the picture. In his last physical incarnation, he showed how to overcome it. He or She who starts a thing, can only be the one to undo a thing (in other words, end it).

I have entertained that Jesus was also Melchizedek and perhaps even David, but it's difficult for my mind to stretch enough to consider that Michael = Jesus Christ. Could be...but I would have to stretch to go there because it does bring some contradictions. The idea that the Jesus that suffered on the Cross was not the Christ was proposed by the Gnostics. The idea behind that is that it would be a complete impossibility for the Christ to be put in that position. 'HVH becoming Jesus is very plausible in the context that 'HVH atoned for his own self as Jehovah in the OT and to offer a sacrificial hope for those entrenched in the concept of sin, guilt and eternal punishment. Perhaps my response is not appropriate except in the heretic forum?

edit to add:

the above needs to have my definition of terms:

-Jehovah='HVH= The creator of the physical body of Adam/Eve
-Jesus as the son of Jehovah, is Jehovah reincarnated. The Savior of fallen man in order to perpetuate Men, Bodies, and this fictitious world by granting higher levels of kingdoms to those that merit them. (within time/space illusions)
-The Creator of men's souls is not mentioned in my post. He is the creator of all matter as well, before it was organized by Jehovah.
-"The" Christ is the son of the Creator, sent to liberate perfect souls from their fictitious world of vanity.

[TheDuke]

I don't believe that any prophet or leader has been reincarnated in this creation. I believe in MMP, but not reincarnation. I'm ok with discussions on a spirit being (embodied, resurrected, spirit only, etc...) being someone also born on this earth. but, I see no evidence, ever or anywhere that an earthly person was ever another earthly person. Those are just two different topics.

So, Michael, Jehovah, Elohim were never earthly people's names and Adam, Moses, Jesus were never spirit persons names.

[Lynn]

Of the term IHVH, also noted or known as the Tetragrammaton (4 Letters of God) which is referred to as the NAME (GOSPEL, derived from the compound of GOD SPELL, which meant Divine Name), or WORD (LOGOS meant the Divine Word), here is a little info. I is for the Hebrew letter Iod/Yod/Jod (10th letter). H is for He/Hai/Hay (5th letter). V is for Vau,Vaw/Vaw (6th letter). And the 2nd He is also for He/Hai/Hay.

HVH is actually the ancient word for Eve, or Hawah or Havah, "the mother of all living".

Jesus is a weak transliteration of Yeheshuah or Jeheshueh, and is also referred to as the Pentagrammaton (meaning 5 Letters of Jesus), in that it encompasses the Tetragrammaton (IHVH) with a 5th letter Schin or Shin in the center to make emphasis on the heart, rose, or center of the cross (4). Schin or Shin is noted as being representative of "Ruach or Ruah Elohim" or what Christians refer to as the "Holy Spirit".

Hebrew letters & equals in English which can be used in place of:
Iod- I/J/Y
He- H
Vau- U/V/W
He- H

As you can see, this is where the variants of Jehovah, Yahweh, Yahveh & others are derived from.

Combinations Key:
A&I or A&Y = E (such as in Hai or Hay = He)
A&U = O (such as in Aum = Om, or AUM Tat Sat AUM or Om Tat Sat Om, which means I AM That I Am)
K&E = G (such as in Kenosis = Gnosis)
This word kenosis is found in the New Testament- "Let this "Kenosis" (Gnosis) be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus."
IV of RLDS-CoC (JS Transl.)/ KJV/ RSV uses "mind"
LT (Lamsa Translation from the Peshitta aka Aramaic) uses "reason"
but the actual word used in the Greek NT is "Kenosis) which is Gnosis
Refer to 'The Interpreter's Bible', vol.11 of 12 (1955), p.46-48 notes Paul uses a lot of deep words in this passage. This notation of Kenosis used by Paul & related to Gnostic writings is brought up in 'The Encyclopedia of Religion & Ethics' (1961), vol.7 (of either 13 or 16 total), p.680 [my book notes 4-5-1988]. Elaine Pagels may have picked up on it in her book 'The Gnostic Paul'.


Iod/Yod, as well as Jod has given us the English word God, as we tend to interchange G & J.

When it is spoken that we are made in the image of God, it is seen clearly when you stack the 4 letters (IHVH) of the Hebrew glyphs. The I (Iod) looks like a head & neck. The first H (He) looks like the chest with shoulders & arms. The V (Vau) is like an extended I (Iod) & is tucked into the first H (He) to look like a Heart and torso. The second H (He) looks to be hips & legs. Looks like a body being outlined here. I will have to see if I have a pic of it somewhere. If not, I will have to take one of it & post it in the next few days. The best shot of it was found in'Kabbalah' by Charles Ponce (1973 PB/ 1991 reprint) translated from French, if not mistaken- p.179. My 1973 copy is somewhere around here, but the pages should be the same. The 4 letters have their significance as Father, Mother, Son, and Bride. There is a comparison of it to a Far Eastern symbol of "hum".

I might also add that if you have a Hebrew word converted to English & it ends in "ah" or "ach", it is feminine gender. Such as Ruah, Ruach, and even Messiah.

As to Michael, look at it this way, we understand that we were spiritial first, physical second. Micheal is the portion we might call the Angelic Self, the HGA (Holy Guardian Angel), the OverSoul, or the Higher Self of his earthly incarnations (projections)- Adam, Melkizedek, Joseph (of Egypt), Joshua (the High Priest at the time of Moses & Aaron), Jeremiah, and finally as Jesus.

I will have to pause here for now.

[Lynn]

I forgot to add, a few other items that can be realized as 2 letters, but then using a single one in English.

Take for instance- Ain Soph Aur (The Unlimited Light or the Infinite Light) a term for God, can also be written in English as En Sof Or.

A&I you already know becomes an E
P&H becomes an F
A&U becomes a O

In the AG Aquarian Gospel (1903) version of the NT, Jesus speaks of the 10th letter as the Holy Iod (Jod) in verse 6, as well as how the Seventies were conceived (underlying principle):

1) The harvest feast drew near; the twelve went to Jerusalem, but Jesus did not go with them; he tarried in Capernaum.
2) Among the multitudes that followed him were many who went not up to the feast; they were not Jews.
3) And Jesus called three-score-and -ten of these disciples unto him and said,
The kingdom of the Christ is not for Jews alone; it is for every man.
4) Lo, I have chosen twelve to preach the gospel, first unto the Jews; and they are Jews.
5) Twelve is the number of the Jew and seven the number of the all, including every man.
6) God is the ten, the holy Jod.
7) When God and man are multiplied we have three-score-and-ten [70], the number of the brotherhood of man.
8) And now I send you forth by twos and twos; not to the Jews alone, but unto every nation under heaven; to Greek and to Assyrian; to the Samaritan; to those beyond the seas; to every man.
9) You need not go afar, for men of every land are here and in Samaria.
10) Arise and go your way; but go in faith; and take no gold nor silver in your purse; no extra coat or shoes.
11) Go in the sacred name; trust God and you will never come to want.
12) And let this be your salutation everywhere, Peace be to all; good will to all.
13) And if the son of peace be in the house, the door will open wide and you will enter in; and then the holy peace will rest upon that house.
14) The seventy in twos went forth; they went into Samaria, and as they went they said,
Peace be to all; good will to all!

In AG chapter 122, he tells the 12 in what manner they shall go out. Note an additional item in verse 12.

1) The Christines prayed in silence seven days; then Jesus called the twelve aside and said,
2) Behold, the multitudes have thronged about us everywhere; the people are bewildered; they wander here and there like sheep without a fold.
3) They need a shepherd's care; they want a loving hand to lead them to the light.
4) The grain is ripe; the harvest is abundant, but the harvesters are few.
5) The time is also ripe, and you must go alone through all the villages and towns of Galilee and teach and heal.
6) And then he breathed upon the twelve and said,
Receive the Holy Breath.
7) And then he gave them each the Word of power, and said,
By this Omnific Word you shall cast spirits out, shall heal the sick and bring the dead to life again.
8) And you shall go not in the way of the Assyrians, nor Greek; you shall not go into Samaria; go only to your brethren of the scattered tribes.
9) And as you go proclaim, The kingdom of Christ has come.
10) You have abundantly received, and freely you shall give.
11) But you must go in faith; provide yourselves no crutch to lean upon.
12) Give all your gold and silver to the poor; take not two coats, nor extra shoes; just take your wands.
13) You are God's husbandmen and he will never suffer you to want.
14) In every place you go search out the men of faith; with them abide until you go from hence.
15) You go for me; you act for me. They who receive and welcome you, receive and welcome me;
16) And they who shut their doors against your face, refuse to welcome me.
17) If you are not received in kindness in a town, bear not away an evil thought; do not resist.
18) An evil thought of any kind will do you harm; will dissipate your power.

In Moses & Aaron's day, they were referred to as "rods". In the standard versions of the NT, they are referred to as a staff instead so as not to stir up trouble. The word is "staff" in IV of RLDS-CoC (aka JST) Mark 6:9 & Mark 6:8 in KJV/ LT (from Aramaic Peshitta NT)/ RSV. In the Living Bible (Billy Graham Crusade Edition) in Mark 6:8 they are called "walking sticks". In The New American Bible (New Catholic Translation)- "walking stick". In 'The Interpreter's Bible' vol.7, pp.730-731 they do not look into the depth of "staff" or the word used here, but they note it seems to be forbidden in Luke & Matthew seem to be permitted here in Mark.

I don't recall if either set- 'The Encyclopedia of Religion & Ethics' (1961) or 'The Encyclopedia of Religion' (1987) picked up on this query (investigation) when I went thru them both, among many other encyclopedias & a vast amount of books back in 1987-1989.

Anyway, in Louis Ginzberg's sifting of ancient Hebrew & Jewish texts, he shares in his 'The Legend of the Jews' (1909/reprint) vol. 4, pp.233-235 concerning Elijah & the time of the Messiah in the last days, that Elijah will remove the two halves of Aaron's rod from the Ark of the Covenant. I believe it is also written in his edited version of just one volume as well which would be Ginzberg's 'The Legends of the Bible' (1956/1975) on pp.600-601 of that single volume.

Aaron's rod is also mentioned in the NT- Hebrews 9:4 as being in the ark of the covenant.

Also Elijah will get the pot of Manna out of the Ark, as well. I could tell you about the "Manna Machine" pot, in more detail, but its description & illustration is in the Kabbalistic book "The Zohar". It is not just a pot, but an atomic powered food processor that takes "dew" (blue-green algae) & irradiates into a protein enriched sort of porridge which is referred to as "manna". Two English scientists used the descriptions & illustrations and constructed one. It actually works. They put all this information in their 1978 book 'The Manna Machine", of which Erich von Daniken reported on it in one of his books. This volume is very rare & expensive. You might be able to get by an interlibrary loan.

Pausing here for the night. Two excerpts on the NAME (IHVH) next round.

[ransomme]

So basically the scriptures are wrong and can't be trusted.

Why would the "mana machine" spew out mama all over the ground around and about the camp? And if it's porridge how could they pick it up if the ground?

Why didn't they just pump mana out into baskets/bowls?

Was the ark of the covenant also some electromagnetic device?

And mana was something that could be broken into pieces like bread or a wafer or something.

[FrankOne]

So basically the scriptures are wrong and can't be trusted.

Why would the "mana machine" spew out mama all over the ground around and about the camp? And if it's porridge how could they pick it up if the ground?

Why didn't they just pump mana out into baskets/bowls?

Was the ark of the covenant also some electromagnetic device?

And mana was something that could be broken into pieces like bread or a wafer or something.

If my memory serves, the Hebrew books were passed on orally for a few thousand years? before being committed to papyrus. I would think there are errors. Not to mention that it was men that wrote what they saw and heard which means that the 'data' went through the filter of their own minds before being remembered.......and then written at least a millenia later.

If I understand it correctly, the NT in GK is a translation of the original in Aramaic.; No doubt the original translators had some bias as to what the original words meant as well as the original witnesses to the events.

The manna subject is very interesting. I believe that 'HVH created the atmospheric and likely supernatural conditions for Quail dung to be converted into manna. (just a guess from memory of studying that)

The ark of the covenant, no doubt, operated on a science that we currently do not understand although from what I've read of the nazi research, (not the current internet crap, but actual documentation) I am guessing that some have gotten close to grasping the principles. Hitler had over a 100 scientists killed when he thought they had it figured out. He was a paranoid maniac.

[ransomme]

So basically the scriptures are wrong and can't be trusted.

Why would the "mana machine" spew out mama all over the ground around and about the camp? And if it's porridge how could they pick it up if the ground?

Why didn't they just pump mana out into baskets/bowls?

Was the ark of the covenant also some electromagnetic device?

And mana was something that could be broken into pieces like bread or a wafer or something.

If my memory serves, the Hebrew books were passed on orally for a few thousand years? before being committed to papyrus. I would think there are errors. Not to mention that it was men that wrote what they saw and heard which means that the 'data' went through the filter of their own minds before being remembered.......and then written at least a millenia later.

If I understand it correctly, the NT in GK is a translation of the original in Aramaic.; No doubt the original translators had some bias as to what the original words meant as well as the original witnesses to the events.

The manna subject is very interesting. I believe that 'HVH created the atmospheric and likely supernatural conditions for Quail dung to be converted into manna. (just a guess from memory of studying that)

The ark of the covenant, no doubt, operated on a science that we currently do not understand although from what I've read of the nazi research, (not the current internet crap, but actual documentation) I am guessing that some have gotten close to grasping the principles. Hitler had over a 100 scientists killed when he thought they had it figured out. He was a paranoid maniac.

Some errors are one thing, fundamentally different and wrong is another.

God's ways are usually more elegant and wonderous.

Besides we know what manna is...

[FrankOne]

So basically the scriptures are wrong and can't be trusted.

Why would the "mana machine" spew out mama all over the ground around and about the camp? And if it's porridge how could they pick it up if the ground?

Why didn't they just pump mana out into baskets/bowls?

Was the ark of the covenant also some electromagnetic device?

And mana was something that could be broken into pieces like bread or a wafer or something.

If my memory serves, the Hebrew books were passed on orally for a few thousand years? before being committed to papyrus. I would think there are errors. Not to mention that it was men that wrote what they saw and heard which means that the 'data' went through the filter of their own minds before being remembered.......and then written at least a millenia later.

If I understand it correctly, the NT in GK is a translation of the original in Aramaic.; No doubt the original translators had some bias as to what the original words meant as well as the original witnesses to the events.

The manna subject is very interesting. I believe that 'HVH created the atmospheric and likely supernatural conditions for Quail dung to be converted into manna. (just a guess from memory of studying that)

The ark of the covenant, no doubt, operated on a science that we currently do not understand although from what I've read of the nazi research, (not the current internet crap, but actual documentation) I am guessing that some have gotten close to grasping the principles. Hitler had over a 100 scientists killed when he thought they had it figured out. He was a paranoid maniac.

Some errors are one thing, fundamentally different and wrong is another.

God's ways are usually more elegant and wonderous.

Besides we know what manna is...

interesting videos, thanks.

my off the cuff deduction was that quail were associated with the manna due to their appearance before the manna was formed. The properties of the dew were not "normal" and the wetness aggregated the dung of the quail into small lumps that when evaporated, made the manna. There is a direct correlation of this process with the priesthood or alchemy, for those interested. The priests of ancient egypt knew things.

I'm not sure who the 'we' are that 'know' what manna is, but my position is that there are many possibilities and many theories.

[Lynn]

I will have to go upstairs to the study Thursday night to see if I can find my xerox copy of the cover of 'The Manna Machine' to see where the Interlibrary Loan pulled it in from, but I recall it was a technical university or organization. You might be able to pull up a copy of the cover from ABEbooks.com or Alibris.com

I will try to go into the secondary library also Thursday night to see if I can find the copy of von Daniken's book that the picture or illustrations are in.

Right off hand, I am thinking it was 'Signs of the Gods' or Gold of the Gods'. It is possible I have copies of the "pot" on U-6. I am on U-9 right now. Firing up U-6 to look.

Anyway, here are the two quotes I mentioned last night. Let me see if I have them already typed up in my massive Eudora email files. Yep, saves me some typing.

SNIP from "Naming the NAME", Pt.3:
++++++++++++++

... The Concept of the Christian Trinity needs to be compared beside the Egyptian Triad (Qabalah) & the Hindu Trimurti (Hinduism). The Trinity (Christianity) involves a concept of 3 aspects of God for some. They are God the Creator, the Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit (a sort of Transformer facet), and Jesus the Saviour. The Hindu Trimurti involves the 3 faces of Brahman which are: Brahma the Creator, Shiva the Destroyer, and Vishnu the Preserver. The Egyptian Triad represented in Magickal circles are as the Gnostic IAO, in which I is Isis (or Nature) which Creates, A for Apophis or Apepi the Destroyer, and O for Osiris the Redeemer. Now of course, some may not see the link with the middle one in the Christian Trinity. Let me explain it another way. The 3 Phases of Power are: 1) that which Creates; 2) that which Destroys-Transforms-Revivifies-Converts; and 3) that which Saves-Redeems-Preserves-Heals. Simply put, amother way you might be more familiar with, which is very similar, is E = MC2 (E being that which creates, "=" being the transformer or converter; and MC2 as that which preserves. Also, you have the flux from Spiritual (Spirit) to physical (Element) as Joseph shared in one of the D&C revelations.

"Father, Son, and Spirit, THREE in ONE ... as it was the earliest expression of what the Sacred NAME of GOD means in the Christian Religion." [RCB#1A/2A]
--->>> referring to the IHVH or Tetragrammaton revealed to Moses by Michael at the Burning Bush
under- God (Biblical & Christian)
'Encyclopedia of Religion & Ethics', vol.6,p.269a

"GOD Himself is, in Rabbinic and later Jewish literature, often referred to as 'The NAME'." [RCB#1B/2A]
--->>>Description of God without image
under Name of God (Jewish)
'Encyclopedia of Religion & Ethics', vol.9,p.177b

Now perhaps the understanding of how the Trinity was somehow "created" (for remembrance) to embody certain aspects of the NAME-WORD-LOGOS-GOSPEL can be seen. For more on the preliminaries, see Parts 1 & 2 {LRB#04 & LRB#05}.
++++++++++++++

I might add this one from 'The Law of ONE', Bk. 3 (L/L Research Booklet 8.5 x 11 Format pp.128 & 132 snips) or PB format, pp.183-184,188-190 snips).

And that Dirk (a High Priest in the RLDS-CoC, who became a mentor from 6-86 thru 12-88) had me to investigate Teaching & Learning, only to run across this here (Book 3 info in November 1989, about a year after he & Shirley moved up north.

It (the LOGOS) is referred to as a Sound-Vibration-Complex.

+++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++
L/L Research quotes on Logos from Academy #19 (5-7-1997):

snipped from Academy post #19 (5-7-97) On LAW of ONE Logos excerpts from L/L Research:

Now, the heart of the heart of Academy #19 [I compiled & shared on 5-7-1997], is an excerpt from "The Law of One, Bk.3" and is copyrighted in 1982 by L/L Research (in my L/L 8 1/2 x 11 research edition in booklet format- 5th print 4-88). The quotes I will share are from p.128 (session #74 dated 10-28-81) and p.132 (session #75 dated 10-31-81). It concerns the concepts of space & time, and how the Logos/WORD/Name has power BEFORE space and time and built all that IS. So, here it is for your review:

---------------------------
Bk.3, p.128 (#74)---Excerpt QUOTE---

RA: I am Ra. This query borders upon over-specifity. It is most important for the adept to feel its own growth as teach/learner.
We may only say that you correctly surmise the paramount import of the magical personality. This is a study in itself. With the appropriate emotional will, polarity, and purity, work may be done with or without proper sound vibration complexes. However, there is no need for the blunt instrument when the scalpel is available.

QUESTIONER: I assume that the reason that the rituals that have been used previously are of effect is that these words have built a bias in consciousness of those who have worked in these areas so that those who are of a distortion of mind that we seek will respond to imprint in consciousness of this series of words. Is this correct?

RA: I am Ra. This is, to a great extent, correct. The exception is the sounding of some of what you call your Hebrew and some of what you call your Sanskrit vowels. These sound vibration complexes have power before time and space and represent configurations of light which built all that there is.

QUESTIONER: Why do these sounds have this property?

RA: I am RA. The correspondence in vibratory complex is mathematical. At this time we have enough transferred energy for one full query.

QUESTIONER: How did the users of these sounds, Sanskrit and Hebrew, determine what these sounds were?

RA: I am Ra. In the case of the Hebrew that entity known as Yahweh aided this knowledge through impression upon the material of genetic coding which became language, as you call it.
In the case of Sanskrit the sound vibrations are are pure due to the lack of previous, what you call, alphabet or letter-naming. Thus the sound vibration complexes seemed to fall into place as from the Logos. This was a more, shall we say, natural or unaided situation or process. ... ---UNQUOTE Excerpt---

---------------------------
Bk.3, p.132 (#75)---Excerpt QUOTE---

QUESTIONER: You spoke in a previous session about certain Hebrew and Sanskrit sound vibratory complexes being powerful because they were mathematically related to that which was the creation. Could you expand on this understanding as to how these are linked?

RA: I am Ra. As we previously stated the linkage is mathematical or that of the ratio you may consider musical. There are those whose mind complex activities would attempt to resolve this mathematical ratio but at present the coloration of the intoned vowel is a part of the vibration which cannot be accurately measured. However, it is equivalent to types of rotation of your primary material particles.

QUESTIONER: If these sounds are precisely vibrated then what effect or use, with respect to the purposes of the adept, would they have?

RA: I am Ra. You may consider the concept of sympathetic resonance. When certain sounds are correctly vibrated , the creation sings.

QUESTIONER: Would these sounds, then, be of a musical nature in that there would be a musical arrangement of many different sound vibrations, or would this apply to just one single note? Which would it apply more to?

RA: I am Ra. This query is not easily answered. In some cases only the intoned vowel has effect. In other cases, most notably Sanskrit combinations, the selection of harmonic intervals is also of resonant nature.

QUESTIONER: Then would the adept use this resonant quality to become more one with the creation and, therefore, attain his objective in that way?

RA: I am Ra. It would be perhaps more accurate to state that in this circumstance the creation becomes more and more contained within the practitioner. The balance of your query is correct.

QUESTIONER: Could you tell me the musical name of the notes to be intoned that are of this quality?

RA: I am Ra. We may not.

QUESTIONER: I didn't think that you could, but I thought it wouldn't hurt to ask.
Then I assume that these must be sought out and determined by empirical observation of their effect by the seeker. Is this correct?

RA: I am Ra. This is partially correct. As your seeking continues there will be added to empirical data that acuity of sensibility which continued working in the ways of the adept offers. ---UNQUOTE Excerpt---

---------------------------
+++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++

Oh, I found 3 pics of the "Pot" [Manna Machine] on U-6. One is the cover of the book. I think the second is a pic of their unit. And 3rd is, I think, an illustration from the Zohar.

[FrankOne]

I will have to go upstairs to the study Thursday night to see if I can find my xerox copy of the cover of 'The Manna Machine' to see where the Interlibrary Loan pulled it in from, but I recall it was a technical university or organization. You might be able to pull up a copy of the cover from ABEbooks.com or Alibris.com

I will try to go into the secondary library also Thursday night to see if I can find the copy of von Daniken's book that the picture or illustrations are in.

Right off hand, I am thinking it was 'Signs of the Gods' or Gold of the Gods'. It is possible I have copies of the "pot" on U-6. I am on U-9 right now. Firing up U-6 to look.

Anyway, here are the two quotes I mentioned last night. Let me see if I have them already typed up in my massive Eudora email files. Yep, saves me some typing.

SNIP from "Naming the NAME", Pt.3:
++++++++++++++

... The Concept of the Christian Trinity needs to be compared beside the Egyptian Triad (Qabalah) & the Hindu Trimurti (Hinduism). The Trinity (Christianity) involves a concept of 3 aspects of God for some. They are God the Creator, the Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit (a sort of Transformer facet), and Jesus the Saviour. The Hindu Trimurti involves the 3 faces of Brahman which are: Brahma the Creator, Shiva the Destroyer, and Vishnu the Preserver. The Egyptian Triad represented in Magickal circles are as the Gnostic IAO, in which I is Isis (or Nature) which Creates, A for Apophis or Apepi the Destroyer, and O for Osiris the Redeemer. Now of course, some may not see the link with the middle one in the Christian Trinity. Let me explain it another way. The 3 Phases of Power are: 1) that which Creates; 2) that which Destroys-Transforms-Revivifies-Converts; and 3) that which Saves-Redeems-Preserves-Heals. Simply put, amother way you might be more familiar with, which is very similar, is E = MC2 (E being that which creates, "=" being the transformer or converter; and MC2 as that which preserves. Also, you have the flux from Spiritual (Spirit) to physical (Element) as Joseph shared in one of the D&C revelations.

"Father, Son, and Spirit, THREE in ONE ... as it was the earliest expression of what the Sacred NAME of GOD means in the Christian Religion." [RCB#1A/2A]
--->>> referring to the IHVH or Tetragrammaton revealed to Moses by Michael at the Burning Bush
under- God (Biblical & Christian)
'Encyclopedia of Religion & Ethics', vol.6,p.269a

"GOD Himself is, in Rabbinic and later Jewish literature, often referred to as 'The NAME'." [RCB#1B/2A]
--->>>Description of God without image
under Name of God (Jewish)
'Encyclopedia of Religion & Ethics', vol.9,p.177b

Now perhaps the understanding of how the Trinity was somehow "created" (for remembrance) to embody certain aspects of the NAME-WORD-LOGOS-GOSPEL can be seen. For more on the preliminaries, see Parts 1 & 2 {LRB#04 & LRB#05}.
++++++++++++++

I might add this one from 'The Law of ONE', Bk. 3 (L/L Research Booklet 8.5 x 11 Format pp.128 & 132 snips) or PB format, pp.183-184,188-190 snips).

And that Dirk (a High Priest in the RLDS-CoC, who became a mentor from 6-86 thru 12-88) had me to investigate Teaching & Learning, only to run across this here (Book 3 info in November 1989, about a year after he & Shirley moved up north.

It (the LOGOS) is referred to as a Sound-Vibration-Complex.

+++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++
L/L Research quotes on Logos from Academy #19 (5-7-1997):

snipped from Academy post #19 (5-7-97) On LAW of ONE Logos excerpts from L/L Research:

Now, the heart of the heart of Academy #19 [I compiled & shared on 5-7-1997], is an excerpt from "The Law of One, Bk.3" and is copyrighted in 1982 by L/L Research (in my L/L 8 1/2 x 11 research edition in booklet format- 5th print 4-88). The quotes I will share are from p.128 (session #74 dated 10-28-81) and p.132 (session #75 dated 10-31-81). It concerns the concepts of space & time, and how the Logos/WORD/Name has power BEFORE space and time and built all that IS. So, here it is for your review:

---------------------------
Bk.3, p.128 (#74)---Excerpt QUOTE---

RA: I am Ra. This query borders upon over-specifity. It is most important for the adept to feel its own growth as teach/learner.
We may only say that you correctly surmise the paramount import of the magical personality. This is a study in itself. With the appropriate emotional will, polarity, and purity, work may be done with or without proper sound vibration complexes. However, there is no need for the blunt instrument when the scalpel is available.

QUESTIONER: I assume that the reason that the rituals that have been used previously are of effect is that these words have built a bias in consciousness of those who have worked in these areas so that those who are of a distortion of mind that we seek will respond to imprint in consciousness of this series of words. Is this correct?

RA: I am Ra. This is, to a great extent, correct. The exception is the sounding of some of what you call your Hebrew and some of what you call your Sanskrit vowels. These sound vibration complexes have power before time and space and represent configurations of light which built all that there is.

QUESTIONER: Why do these sounds have this property?

RA: I am RA. The correspondence in vibratory complex is mathematical. At this time we have enough transferred energy for one full query.

QUESTIONER: How did the users of these sounds, Sanskrit and Hebrew, determine what these sounds were?

RA: I am Ra. In the case of the Hebrew that entity known as Yahweh aided this knowledge through impression upon the material of genetic coding which became language, as you call it.
In the case of Sanskrit the sound vibrations are are pure due to the lack of previous, what you call, alphabet or letter-naming. Thus the sound vibration complexes seemed to fall into place as from the Logos. This was a more, shall we say, natural or unaided situation or process. ... ---UNQUOTE Excerpt---

---------------------------
Bk.3, p.132 (#75)---Excerpt QUOTE---

QUESTIONER: You spoke in a previous session about certain Hebrew and Sanskrit sound vibratory complexes being powerful because they were mathematically related to that which was the creation. Could you expand on this understanding as to how these are linked?

RA: I am Ra. As we previously stated the linkage is mathematical or that of the ratio you may consider musical. There are those whose mind complex activities would attempt to resolve this mathematical ratio but at present the coloration of the intoned vowel is a part of the vibration which cannot be accurately measured. However, it is equivalent to types of rotation of your primary material particles.

QUESTIONER: If these sounds are precisely vibrated then what effect or use, with respect to the purposes of the adept, would they have?

RA: I am Ra. You may consider the concept of sympathetic resonance. When certain sounds are correctly vibrated , the creation sings.

QUESTIONER: Would these sounds, then, be of a musical nature in that there would be a musical arrangement of many different sound vibrations, or would this apply to just one single note? Which would it apply more to?

RA: I am Ra. This query is not easily answered. In some cases only the intoned vowel has effect. In other cases, most notably Sanskrit combinations, the selection of harmonic intervals is also of resonant nature.

QUESTIONER: Then would the adept use this resonant quality to become more one with the creation and, therefore, attain his objective in that way?

RA: I am Ra. It would be perhaps more accurate to state that in this circumstance the creation becomes more and more contained within the practitioner. The balance of your query is correct.

QUESTIONER: Could you tell me the musical name of the notes to be intoned that are of this quality?

RA: I am Ra. We may not.

QUESTIONER: I didn't think that you could, but I thought it wouldn't hurt to ask.
Then I assume that these must be sought out and determined by empirical observation of their effect by the seeker. Is this correct?

RA: I am Ra. This is partially correct. As your seeking continues there will be added to empirical data that acuity of sensibility which continued working in the ways of the adept offers. ---UNQUOTE Excerpt---

---------------------------
+++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++

Oh, I found 3 pics of the "Pot" [Manna Machine] on U-6. One is the cover of the book. I think the second is a pic of their unit. And 3rd is, I think, an illustration from the Zohar.

i read through your post and found it of interest. When I read such things, which I often do, I always end up with the question "of what USE is it?" . Mysteries as they are, are typically discussed to entertain the Ego. To gratify our vanity of being a 'searcher' but not a FINDER. A finder can use the information in a practical and transformative manner.

I would be very appreciative get all the information that you have on the manna machine. I've worked with a few scientists on this in years past and there is truth to the fact that it can be produced. The properties of manna appear to be the same as Amrit, Agnihotra, and Soma of ancient times.

[Lynn]

Apologies as I've been sick the past few days, it seems due to food poisoning, but obviously not chicken, thank goodness.

6 used copies of 'The Manna Machine' 1978 book are listed for sale ranging from $525.00 to $1139.61 are listed at <ABEbooks.com> Click on this link to see what it looks like from the photo of the cover of the book- <https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Search ... %20Sassoon> or go to their website looking for 'The Manna Machine' (title) by George Sassoon & Rodney Dale (2 British authors).

I found 3 different pics of the device on U-6 & will post them on Sunday, as I have to work on my sister's 12 foot vinyl (fold-up) Porta-Bote Saturday as it is not supposed to rain.

As to this device which is atomic powered, it is reported to make a gluttenous protein enriched sort of porridge from what I recall, of blue green alga by irradiating it. The interesting thing the authors (scientists) found, was that after about a week of processing this stuff, you had to stop & spend a day cleaning it up. which if you recall, they made the manna for 6 days & on the 6th day, they made a second batch later that day, but did not on the 7th day. Perhaps spending that day cleaning it up.

As to the book that mentioned this book, I did not find a copy of 'The Signs of the Gods' by Erich von Daniken in my brief search. If I recall correctly I may have the hardback copy, as well as a Pkt. PB (small Mass Market Ed.) too.

Also after looking thru several piles, I did not find my xerox copy of the cover of the book to see who the technical organization or university that my interlibrary loan had found for me. I recall running across it recently & will continue to keep an eye out for it.

[ransomme]

Apologies as I've been sick the past few days, it seems due to food poisoning, but obviously not chicken, thank goodness.

6 used copies of 'The Manna Machine' 1978 book are listed for sale ranging from $525.00 to $1139.61 are listed at <ABEbooks.com> Click on this link to see what it looks like from the photo of the cover of the book- <https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Search ... %20Sassoon> or go to their website looking for 'The Manna Machine' (title) by George Sassoon & Rodney Dale (2 British authors).

I found 3 different pics of the device on U-6 & will post them on Sunday, as I have to work on my sister's 12 foot vinyl (fold-up) Porta-Bote Saturday as it is not supposed to rain.

As to this device which is atomic powered, it is reported to make a gluttenous protein enriched sort of porridge from what I recall, of blue green alga by irradiating it. The interesting thing the authors (scientists) found, was that after about a week of processing this stuff, you had to stop & spend a day cleaning it up. which if you recall, they made the manna for 6 days & on the 6th day, they made a second batch later that day, but did not on the 7th day. Perhaps spending that day cleaning it up.

As to the book that mentioned this book, I did not find a copy of 'The Signs of the Gods' by Erich von Daniken in my brief search. If I recall correctly I may have the hardback copy, as well as a Pkt. PB (small Mass Market Ed.) too.

Also after looking thru several piles, I did not find my xerox copy of the cover of the book to see who the technical organization or university that my interlibrary loan had found for me. I recall running across it recently & will continue to keep an eye out for it.

I've seen videos on this. But somehow we diverted from YHVH to manna machines...

Personally, the God who parted the waters of the Red Sea and turned water into wine did not use an atomic machine to make manna.

[Lynn]

There is a reason I somehow brought the Manna Machine into the realm of the post/query of the NAME (IHVH). Sometimes when I do this, is because the Spirit has led me into such a path. Sometimes I can backtrack & possibly find the reasoning behind the link. There is more to come concerning the NAME aka GOSPEL (from the compound GOD SPELL which actually meant "Divine Name"). Some dispute this and say it simply is the story of Jesus. This is like a box (finite) being viewed from the inside (finite view). The bigger picture requires looking in from outside the box (infinite). One source of this GOSPEL = GOD SPELL = "DIVINE NAME" is found in my notes (7-8-1993 Thursday) from 'Encyclopedia of Religion & Ethics' edited by James Hastings Vol.6, p.333 --- Gospel comes from GodSpell meaning "Divine Word (NAME) or "God Story". If not mistaken, "Divine NAME" was from my Compact OED (Oxford English Dictionary) which is the 20+ volume set photo-reduced to 9 pages per page along with a powerful magnifying (viewing) glass.

And back to the Manna Machine, sometimes stories or such, are given as the readers may perhaps comprehend (meaning in a simple manner). It says the manna came from the dew, which means it was derived from a liquid. To not complicate understanding, they simply played it down some. Regardless of if you believe, do not believe, or even want to investigate, this device's drawing as well as a little information, was recorded (written) in the Kabbalistic Zohar, at least in the 1700s) which is about 15 to 20+ volume set (translated into English). And the fact that these two authors (scientists) were able to replicate this device & study its operation brings the conclusion of how the "manna" was miraculously created.

For instance, many of you watch TV, or use computers or smartphones & realize these devices work. They are not miracles, as they are simply in use by bulk (the mass of people). Yet, so many cannot fathom how they actually function or come about. You simply arrive at a simple story to explain these miracle devices. And never give it a second thought.

One example is you think it was the Jewish population that condemned Jesus to death, when it was actually the Romans (including Pilate) and those Jews who sought to keep their control by conforming to Roman authority. But the general Jewish population was against the persecution & killing of Jesus. And because of the Roman controlled Jews in the higher ruling jobs, it has been passed down as Jesus was perhaps a prophet, a fallen prophet, or whatnot, but not the proclaimed Messiah (in only one stage of a much bigger picture of time). John the Baptist while being in prison over a year, had the grand vision (being in the spirit) on the Isle of Patmos (not physically) that we know of as "The Revelation". After this because of what he saw collectively, he sent disciples to inquire to Jesus if he was to fulfill all things right now, or were we to wait for another (incarnation or time). To see everything in a collective state sometimes gives the illusion of everything occurring in the same time slot. Not over periods of time. Jesus answered in part, but never truly qualified the answer that John had asked. But then, many think it was John the Beloved was the author of the Revelation. Even that is now in doubt at least by the Catholic church, as to whether he was ever in Patmos. The simple or story in error is that he was exiled to Patmos. had the vision, wrote it & died there. That was assumed, never any proof, which now brings it into question. John the Beloved (disciple) was not a Seer, but John the Baptist in the NT, AG version of the NT, as well as Gnostic sources speak of John the Baptist, as per Jesus was the greatest of the seers & was the head of prophecy. John the Beloved was an organizer, as he would set up the places that Jesus would speak or travel to. John the Beloved would test the waters to make sure it was safe or if there were spies there from the Romans or Jews placed in command by the Romans. Oh, by the way, Joseph of Arimathea was Jesus' uncle & was on the Sanhedrin, but did not comply with them on many things, including his nephew Jesus. But he was a very powerful & rich man, as he was what was referred to as a "tin magnate" and had business and friends reaching into the Far East to Great Britain. But finally his life was in jeopardy by the Romans & Jews under their control, but they had to be discreet in how to do away with him. For the well documented story of this & Joseph helping others (including the disciples escape, see 'The Drama of the Lost Disciples' compiled by George F. Jowett (1961/16th US edition 2009 PB reprint). Mother Mary died & is buried in Great Britain (UK).

You think that everything was correct in the Bible or Book of Mormon, yet Joseph Smith claimed there were errors in the Bible. And certain items were revealed which he recorded. However, there were many that he could not. Why? Because you can only do "X" amount at a time.

OK, I have to get going on that Porta-Bote repair.

Oh, "FrankOne"- if you did not get my PM reply, it seems my PMs may not be going out, yet the last one said it was successful (yet it sits in the OutBox). If not, email me at <[email protected]> & I will send the copy via email.

[Lynn]

George Lamsa was raised in the Middle East, and was fluent in Aramaic which was in use in Jesus' day. Lamsa translated the Bible (OT & NT) from the "Peshitta" which was the Aramaic version, which actually preceded the Greek version, even though many do not realize or know of this. His translation is noted as the "LT" (Lamsa Translation). Lamsa was also aware of the customs, traditions, parables, understandings, and the culture, as well as the "mysticism of the Middle East", symbolism, psychology, and amplifications in storytelling.

Rocco Errico was an understudy for 10 years of Lamsa & took up the torch to educate others, including that 40 percent of the Bible is based on mysticism, which encompasses dreams, visions, voices, healings, clairaudience (inner hearing), clairvoyance (inner sight), and bi-location (Out-of-Body Experiences or OBEs).

In Rocco Errico's book- 'Let There Be Light: The Seven Keys' (1985 PB) refer to xviii, and pp.141-143, he also discusses and shares about Heaven & the Aramaic word- SHMAYA, which is a compound noun, derived from SHEM (meaning NAME) & YAH (truncated term for God, the 4 letters or Tetragrammaton) which you know by the letters YHVH/YHWH or names Yahweh, Yahveh, or Jehovah). Thus the root meaning of Heaven is actually "the Name of God". And of course, God lived in high places, therefore the relation & use brought us its further uses such as meaning "sky", "cosmos", or "universe".

Therefore Heaven (SHMAYA) truly means "The NAME of God".

If you wiah to pursue the notation that the Peshitta (Aramaic version of the NT) came before the Greek version of the NT, then refer to pp.xvi-xvii.

Errico's 1987 PB 'Treasures From the Language of Jesus' goes further into many of the words & sayings of Jesus as to the understanding, customs, traditions, and idioms of those who were raised in the Middle East.