Just read the Glenn Pace Memo... wow

[Refraction75]

More “BS” I guess:

I know this family better than probably most of you on the forum. This hits really close to home.

So you know this guy personally?

[Reluctant Watchman]

We mentioned the pace memo to some friends who are fringe members at best. They had never heard of it. I think probably less than 1% of members know about it.

I don't know about this yet...I am trying to decide if I can stomach the read....

If you have a hard time with the pace memo… I suggest you really pray about reading JR Sweets journal entries. (Whether you should or not). They are seriously the grossest subject matter I’ve ever read.

[HereWeGo]

We mentioned the pace memo to some friends who are fringe members at best. They had never heard of it. I think probably less than 1% of members know about it.

I don't know about this yet...I am trying to decide if I can stomach the read....

Elder Pace's memo is pretty mild. No gruesome details of the abuse.

[HereWeGo]

We mentioned the pace memo to some friends who are fringe members at best. They had never heard of it. I think probably less than 1% of members know about it.

I don't know about this yet...I am trying to decide if I can stomach the read....

If you have a hard time with the pace memo… I suggest you really pray about reading JR Sweets journal entries. (Whether you should or not). They are seriously the grossest subject matter I’ve ever read.

I'm up to #6 in the 151 page document. I know of much more gruesome details in SRA than have come out so far. Perhaps she will get into it.

But I agree with your advice.

[Robin Hood]

I just watched the first vid of Kristy's, where she appears to be addressing some sort of tribunal. There's a guy who looks like he's wearing something close to judge robes who gives a few brief comments towards the end, asserting he was with the CIA and that he believes her (at least in a general sense). Comments are disabled for the video on youtube which is a shame, I'd like to know more about who these people are or what sort of power they might have, all I can tell is it is a tribunal of some kind held in the UK about 4 or 5 years ago.

Frankly, she says a lot of crazy-sounding stuff, doesn't give nearly as many details on specific instances, admits she doesn't have memories of some of the stuff, some of it is memories from her sisters that she is relating. Some parts are highly specific and that she has personal memories of, and there's a lot in there I believe. Untangling how much is truth is difficult though.

I don't believe that some 14 year olds were programmed to fly F-14 fighter jets on secret missions to Vietnam, for example. No matter how well funded and organized these satanic cabals are, I don't think it's possible they are such utter morons they would enact something like that.

Bullets whizzing by her in an underground temple ceremony sacrificing an infant as she runs off with her sisters... well, why would those guys open fire on these girls, who are already deeply under their control? I can sort of see some 'new guy' enforcer panicking and letting off a shot, I guess, but it's a stretch. She also frustrated me by saying the guy who cut out the infant's heart was someone who would later become president of the church, but doesn't name him. On the other hand, I guess Spencer Kimball was playing 'good cop' that day, as he tells the enforcers to leave the girls alone, that they've had enough for today. Still he's part of what's going on and in authority enough to give commands that are heeded, so that would tell us something quite evil about him too.

I have questions, it's frustrating not to be able to ask, but many times I wished the people in the room she was addressing would have asked some specific questions to drill down on the exact 'how' this would work in real life for specific instances she mentions quickly and moves on from. I suspect she might even have good answers, but to verify her stories there has to be some practical good question/answers for how specific circumstances actually unfolded.

I have watched the whole thing in the past, and others like it.
It's BS.

Dismissing the large amounts of testimony from more and more sources as all bs is as naive as the notion that just because no court ever heard the case on the 2020 election fraud that somehow Biden actually won eleventy-billion votes and election fraud is impossible and a fairy tale.

I've seen enough correlating evidence to be convinced that something real is going on. The problem is untangling what parts are true and what parts are not.

As FoxMamma mentioned, there is NO DOUBT that the court systems are corrupted. My little brother was caught with weed when he was in high school and I watched in stunned disbelief the lawlessness that played out against his petty crime for years, and the judges who ruled as petty kings, utterly afraid of any legal consequence for breaking the very laws they were supposed to enact.

More recently I have a neighbor who is attempting to fight a tax battle against the local and state government, and because he's a close friend I have been able to verify the officials have broken law after law after law, all with no consequence. Repeatedly appealing to higher and higher courts, each higher judge has knowingly broken the law to coordinate with the rest of the club below them (even though there are specific laws on the books that forbid their judgements, or ignoring broken laws, nothing seems to matter). He's convinced that once he gets to the Supreme Court, someone somewhere will actually stand up for the law. I'm convinced of the opposite, but I try to be a supportive friend regardless.

The real shock isn't that the legal system is corrupted; the real shock is realizing that it's pretty much 100% corrupted.

But this is just the same Gadianton stuff we are warned has existed since the beginning of time, it's just shocking when we encounter it personally. It is very real.

The problem with the victims of this type of torture and mind control is that they have literally 'broken' minds, as far as I can tell many times unable to tell between what was hallucinated and what was real. Remember this kind of mind control works in tandem with hallucinogenic drugs and implanted memories as well. All of this is on purpose, to protect the cabal from any victim who tries to blow the whistle. They'll be disbelieved by default, because some of their 'memories' are simply fabrications or inventions, and they can't always tell the difference, which makes the public dismiss it all as bs.

What's needed is a skilled interlocuter to parse out the true stuff from the false, as well as a detailed investigation.

But at this point, with the mountains of testimonies, I would be a liar if I just through it all out as 'bs'.

There is something seriously wrong, and I believe it's true that it goes to the very highest levels of the church (and the government too of course).

I don't dismiss all of it. But I don't get my head turned by every one-sided claim made in the media. I'm too level-headed for that.
There have been many claims of significant abuse over the years. There was one on the Orkney Isles off the north coast of Scotland, where social workers removed dozens of children from their families because of claims of SRA etc. It was all over the media, with the assumption that these awful wicked parents were guilty right from the start.
In the end, despite detailed testimony from the children, it was proved that the whole thing was made up. No children had been abused, no paedophile ring existed amongst the families, no satanic rituals had taken place... it was all a pack of lies.
And this isn't an isolated case either.

In my own family, my brother-in-laws brothers daughter told a school teacher her father had been sexually abusing her for many years. She went into great detail with her descriptions and was taken into care by social services and placed in Foster care for many years. As far as the authorities were concerned he was guilty as hell.
Now as an adult the daughter has admitted she made the whole thing up so that she could be taken into care and have more freedom.
Same thing happened to a friend of mine in the last couple of years.
So I approach all of these claims with a certain degree of suspicion.

[logonbump]

I just watched the first vid of Kristy's, where she appears to be addressing some sort of tribunal. There's a guy who looks like he's wearing something close to judge robes who gives a few brief comments towards the end, asserting he was with the CIA and that he believes her (at least in a general sense). Comments are disabled for the video on youtube which is a shame, I'd like to know more about who these people are or what sort of power they might have, all I can tell is it is a tribunal of some kind held in the UK about 4 or 5 years ago.

Frankly, she says a lot of crazy-sounding stuff, doesn't give nearly as many details on specific instances, admits she doesn't have memories of some of the stuff, some of it is memories from her sisters that she is relating. Some parts are highly specific and that she has personal memories of, and there's a lot in there I believe. Untangling how much is truth is difficult though.

I don't believe that some 14 year olds were programmed to fly F-14 fighter jets on secret missions to Vietnam, for example. No matter how well funded and organized these satanic cabals are, I don't think it's possible they are such utter morons they would enact something like that.

Bullets whizzing by her in an underground temple ceremony sacrificing an infant as she runs off with her sisters... well, why would those guys open fire on these girls, who are already deeply under their control? I can sort of see some 'new guy' enforcer panicking and letting off a shot, I guess, but it's a stretch. She also frustrated me by saying the guy who cut out the infant's heart was someone who would later become president of the church, but doesn't name him. On the other hand, I guess Spencer Kimball was playing 'good cop' that day, as he tells the enforcers to leave the girls alone, that they've had enough for today. Still he's part of what's going on and in authority enough to give commands that are heeded, so that would tell us something quite evil about him too.

I have questions, it's frustrating not to be able to ask, but many times I wished the people in the room she was addressing would have asked some specific questions to drill down on the exact 'how' this would work in real life for specific instances she mentions quickly and moves on from. I suspect she might even have good answers, but to verify her stories there has to be some practical good question/answers for how specific circumstances actually unfolded.

The robed man is a former CIA agent, Robert David Steele. He was found dead not long ago after pursuing these matters and other corruptions in the CIA.
The bullets whizzing by part is a combination of fear, a youthful imagination, cartoons and the sound of your own footsteps in a concrete corridor. They sound very much like cartoon bullet "whizzings."

[FoxMammaWisdom]

I just watched the first vid of Kristy's, where she appears to be addressing some sort of tribunal. There's a guy who looks like he's wearing something close to judge robes who gives a few brief comments towards the end, asserting he was with the CIA and that he believes her (at least in a general sense). Comments are disabled for the video on youtube which is a shame, I'd like to know more about who these people are or what sort of power they might have, all I can tell is it is a tribunal of some kind held in the UK about 4 or 5 years ago.

Frankly, she says a lot of crazy-sounding stuff, doesn't give nearly as many details on specific instances, admits she doesn't have memories of some of the stuff, some of it is memories from her sisters that she is relating. Some parts are highly specific and that she has personal memories of, and there's a lot in there I believe. Untangling how much is truth is difficult though.

I don't believe that some 14 year olds were programmed to fly F-14 fighter jets on secret missions to Vietnam, for example. No matter how well funded and organized these satanic cabals are, I don't think it's possible they are such utter morons they would enact something like that.

Bullets whizzing by her in an underground temple ceremony sacrificing an infant as she runs off with her sisters... well, why would those guys open fire on these girls, who are already deeply under their control? I can sort of see some 'new guy' enforcer panicking and letting off a shot, I guess, but it's a stretch. She also frustrated me by saying the guy who cut out the infant's heart was someone who would later become president of the church, but doesn't name him. On the other hand, I guess Spencer Kimball was playing 'good cop' that day, as he tells the enforcers to leave the girls alone, that they've had enough for today. Still he's part of what's going on and in authority enough to give commands that are heeded, so that would tell us something quite evil about him too.

I have questions, it's frustrating not to be able to ask, but many times I wished the people in the room she was addressing would have asked some specific questions to drill down on the exact 'how' this would work in real life for specific instances she mentions quickly and moves on from. I suspect she might even have good answers, but to verify her stories there has to be some practical good question/answers for how specific circumstances actually unfolded.

I have watched the whole thing in the past, and others like it.
It's BS.

Dismissing the large amounts of testimony from more and more sources as all bs is as naive as the notion that just because no court ever heard the case on the 2020 election fraud that somehow Biden actually won eleventy-billion votes and election fraud is impossible and a fairy tale.

I've seen enough correlating evidence to be convinced that something real is going on. The problem is untangling what parts are true and what parts are not.

As FoxMamma mentioned, there is NO DOUBT that the court systems are corrupted. My little brother was caught with weed when he was in high school and I watched in stunned disbelief the lawlessness that played out against his petty crime for years, and the judges who ruled as petty kings, utterly afraid of any legal consequence for breaking the very laws they were supposed to enact.

More recently I have a neighbor who is attempting to fight a tax battle against the local and state government, and because he's a close friend I have been able to verify the officials have broken law after law after law, all with no consequence. Repeatedly appealing to higher and higher courts, each higher judge has knowingly broken the law to coordinate with the rest of the club below them (even though there are specific laws on the books that forbid their judgements, or ignoring broken laws, nothing seems to matter). He's convinced that once he gets to the Supreme Court, someone somewhere will actually stand up for the law. I'm convinced of the opposite, but I try to be a supportive friend regardless.

The real shock isn't that the legal system is corrupted; the real shock is realizing that it's pretty much 100% corrupted.

But this is just the same Gadianton stuff we are warned has existed since the beginning of time, it's just shocking when we encounter it personally. It is very real.

The problem with the victims of this type of torture and mind control is that they have literally 'broken' minds, as far as I can tell many times unable to tell between what was hallucinated and what was real. Remember this kind of mind control works in tandem with hallucinogenic drugs and implanted memories as well. All of this is on purpose, to protect the cabal from any victim who tries to blow the whistle. They'll be disbelieved by default, because some of their 'memories' are simply fabrications or inventions, and they can't always tell the difference, which makes the public dismiss it all as bs.

What's needed is a skilled interlocuter to parse out the true stuff from the false, as well as a detailed investigation.

But at this point, with the mountains of testimonies, I would be a liar if I just through it all out as 'bs'.

There is something seriously wrong, and I believe it's true that it goes to the very highest levels of the church (and the government too of course).

I don't dismiss all of it. But I don't get my head turned by every one-sided claim made in the media. I'm too level-headed for that.
There have been many claims of significant abuse over the years. There was one on the Orkney Isles off the north coast of Scotland, where social workers removed dozens of children from their families because of claims of SRA etc. It was all over the media, with the assumption that these awful wicked parents were guilty right from the start.
In the end, despite detailed testimony from the children, it was proved that the whole thing was made up. No children had been abused, no paedophile ring existed amongst the families, no satanic rituals had taken place... it was all a pack of lies.
And this isn't an isolated case either.

In my own family, my brother-in-laws brothers daughter told a school teacher her father had been sexually abusing her for many years. She went into great detail with her descriptions and was taken into care by social services and placed in Foster care for many years. As far as the authorities were concerned he was guilty as hell.
Now as an adult the daughter has admitted she made the whole thing up so that she could be taken into care and have more freedom.
Same thing happened to a friend of mine in the last couple of years.
So I approach all of these claims with a certain degree of suspicion.

It's too bad we live in a world where more people are worried about being accused, AND VILIFY ALL VICTIMS UPFRONT BECAUSE OF THOSE FEW FALSE REPORTS THAT WILL MOST LIKELY NEVER BE PROSECUTED, INSTEAD OF HELPING THE 95-98% WHO ARE ACTUAL VICTIMS TRYING TO GET HELP.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_accusation_of_rape

https://www.brown.edu/campus-life/healt ... lt-reports

https://www.nsvrc.org/sites/default/fil ... orting.pdf

When my special needs son was being anally raped and I tried to get him help, EVERY MAN HE KNOWS (including his own stupid paranoid selfish father) scattered like cockroaches because every one of them were afraid of being accused of hurting him (turns out a woman did it to him anyway) - INSTEAD OF STANDING UP FOR A LITTLE BOY WHO NEVER GOT HELP, WHOSE BODY WAS DESTROYED FOR AWHILE BEFORE IT HEALED - NOT TO MENTION WHAT IT DID TO HIS SOUL, AND DESPITE THREE DOCTORS AND THE FORENSIC EXAMINER SHOWING EVERYONE WHAT HAPPENED TO HIM, ALL THE PEOPLE WHO SUPPOSEDLY LOVED HIM WERE TOO SCARED FOR THEMSELVES.

Too bad for ALLLLLLL the victims more people are worried about being accused (OR EXPOSED), than getting people help and standing up for victims.

[Light Seeker]

I read the memo around 2014/2015. I remember he mentions the temple in there and how some of the endowment ceremony was triggering to victims of SRA. I assumed that’s why the endowment was changed in 1990.
Edited to add: I see the memo was dated July 1990. I’m not sure when the changes were made to the endowment, other than it was sometime in 1990. Still, I think it’s a good possibility that Pace’s report had something to do with the changes. The memo says he discussed these things in a committee meeting prior to the memo.

I will bet money Beverly Campbell sat in that committee….

[Robin Hood]

I have watched the whole thing in the past, and others like it.
It's BS.

Dismissing the large amounts of testimony from more and more sources as all bs is as naive as the notion that just because no court ever heard the case on the 2020 election fraud that somehow Biden actually won eleventy-billion votes and election fraud is impossible and a fairy tale.

I've seen enough correlating evidence to be convinced that something real is going on. The problem is untangling what parts are true and what parts are not.

As FoxMamma mentioned, there is NO DOUBT that the court systems are corrupted. My little brother was caught with weed when he was in high school and I watched in stunned disbelief the lawlessness that played out against his petty crime for years, and the judges who ruled as petty kings, utterly afraid of any legal consequence for breaking the very laws they were supposed to enact.

More recently I have a neighbor who is attempting to fight a tax battle against the local and state government, and because he's a close friend I have been able to verify the officials have broken law after law after law, all with no consequence. Repeatedly appealing to higher and higher courts, each higher judge has knowingly broken the law to coordinate with the rest of the club below them (even though there are specific laws on the books that forbid their judgements, or ignoring broken laws, nothing seems to matter). He's convinced that once he gets to the Supreme Court, someone somewhere will actually stand up for the law. I'm convinced of the opposite, but I try to be a supportive friend regardless.

The real shock isn't that the legal system is corrupted; the real shock is realizing that it's pretty much 100% corrupted.

But this is just the same Gadianton stuff we are warned has existed since the beginning of time, it's just shocking when we encounter it personally. It is very real.

The problem with the victims of this type of torture and mind control is that they have literally 'broken' minds, as far as I can tell many times unable to tell between what was hallucinated and what was real. Remember this kind of mind control works in tandem with hallucinogenic drugs and implanted memories as well. All of this is on purpose, to protect the cabal from any victim who tries to blow the whistle. They'll be disbelieved by default, because some of their 'memories' are simply fabrications or inventions, and they can't always tell the difference, which makes the public dismiss it all as bs.

What's needed is a skilled interlocuter to parse out the true stuff from the false, as well as a detailed investigation.

But at this point, with the mountains of testimonies, I would be a liar if I just through it all out as 'bs'.

There is something seriously wrong, and I believe it's true that it goes to the very highest levels of the church (and the government too of course).

I don't dismiss all of it. But I don't get my head turned by every one-sided claim made in the media. I'm too level-headed for that.
There have been many claims of significant abuse over the years. There was oène on the Orkney Isles off the north coast of Scotland, where social workers removed dozens of children from their families because of claims of SRA etc. It was all over the media, with the assumption that these awful wicked parents were guilty right from the start.
In the end, despite detailed testimony from the children, it was proved that the whole thing was made up. No children had been abused, no paedophile ring existed amongst the families, no satanic rituals had taken place... it was all a pack of lies.
And this isn't an isolated case either.

In my own family, my brother-in-laws brothers daughter told a school teacher her father had been sexually abusing her for many years. She went into great detail with her descriptions and was taken into care by social services and placed in Foster care for many years. As far as the authorities were concerned he was guilty as hell.
Now as an adult the daughter has admitted she made the whole thing up so that she could be taken into care and have more freedom.
Same thing happened to a friend of mine in the last couple of years.
So I approach all of these claims with a certain degree of suspicion.

It's too bad we live in a world where more people are worried about being accused, AND VILIFY ALL VICTIMS UPFRONT BECAUSE OF THOSE FEW FALSE REPORTS THAT WILL MOST LIKELY NEVER BE PROSECUTED, INSTEAD OF HELPING THE 95-98% WHO ARE ACTUAL VICTIMS TRYING TO GET HELP.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_accusation_of_rape

https://www.brown.edu/campus-life/healt ... lt-reports

https://www.nsvrc.org/sites/default/fil ... orting.pdf

When my special needs son was being anally raped and I tried to get him help, EVERY MAN HE KNOWS (including his own stupid paranoid selfish father) scattered like cockroaches because every one of them were afraid of being accused of hurting him (turns out a woman did it to him anyway) - INSTEAD OF STANDING UP FOR A LITTLE BOY WHO NEVER GOT HELP, WHOSE BODY WAS DESTROYED FOR AWHILE BEFORE IT HEALED - NOT TO MENTION WHAT IT DID TO HIS SOUL, AND DESPITE THREE DOCTORS AND THE FORENSIC EXAMINER SHOWING EVERYONE WHAT HAPPENED TO HIM, ALL THE PEOPLE WHO SUPPOSEDLY LOVED HIM WERE TOO SCARED FOR THEMSELVES.

Too bad for ALLLLLLL the victims more people are worried about being accused (OR EXPOSED), than getting people help and standing up for victims.

Thankfully he had you to stand up for him.

[Robin Hood]

We mentioned the pace memo to some friends who are fringe members at best. They had never heard of it. I think probably less than 1% of members know about it.

I don't know about this yet...I am trying to decide if I can stomach the read....

If you have a hard time with the pace memo… I suggest you really pray about reading JR Sweets journal entries. (Whether you should or not). They are seriously the grossest subject matter I’ve ever read.

I think you mentioned this character a while back. I checked it out. Maybe the claims and descriptions are true, maybe they aren't. I don't know and I'm prepared to admit I don't know.
However, I do know that in my country and yours a person is considered innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
It has it's flaws, but it's the best system we have.

[Niemand]

There have been many claims of significant abuse over the years. There was one on the Orkney Isles off the north coast of Scotland, where social workers removed dozens of children from their families because of claims of SRA etc. It was all over the media, with the assumption that these awful wicked parents were guilty right from the start.
In the end, despite detailed testimony from the children, it was proved that the whole thing was made up. No children had been abused, no paedophile ring existed amongst the families, no satanic rituals had taken place... it was all a pack of lies.

Do you want to know the worst part? Some of those children were abused when they were taken into state care.

However, there is good evidence of a high level paedophile ring involving lawyers, politicians, police and judges. Nicholas Fairbairn appears to have been one, and there are connections to Thomas Hamilton and the Dunblane Massacre. Since the files on that incident are conveniently sealed, no one can check out any of this (if it is even in the file).

[Reluctant Watchman]

We mentioned the pace memo to some friends who are fringe members at best. They had never heard of it. I think probably less than 1% of members know about it.

I don't know about this yet...I am trying to decide if I can stomach the read....

If you have a hard time with the pace memo… I suggest you really pray about reading JR Sweets journal entries. (Whether you should or not). They are seriously the grossest subject matter I’ve ever read.

I think you mentioned this character a while back. I checked it out. Maybe the claims and descriptions are true, maybe they aren't. I don't know and I'm prepared to admit I don't know.
However, I do know that in my country and yours a person is considered innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
It has it's flaws, but it's the best system we have.

What I find interesting is your choice of words in how you describe these people. They are almost universally derogatory in nature. Do I believe all of the SRA stories? No. But the “coincidences” are no longer coincidences for me. People who abuse like to hide, to cover up the truth, or to say “you’re crazy.”

I really wish none of this was going on. I honestly hope that a person who says they are “the Lord’s anointed” doesn’t play with fire and brimstone. But the simple fact that the church doesn’t want to talk about it, and actively campaigns to demean or silence those who do speak up, is a major red flag. I mean, just look at the whole child sex abuse cases. The church was far more interested in protecting their image (sorry, “the good name of the church”) over the precious young spirits that were being abused.

[FoxMammaWisdom]

Dismissing the large amounts of testimony from more and more sources as all bs is as naive as the notion that just because no court ever heard the case on the 2020 election fraud that somehow Biden actually won eleventy-billion votes and election fraud is impossible and a fairy tale.

I've seen enough correlating evidence to be convinced that something real is going on. The problem is untangling what parts are true and what parts are not.

As FoxMamma mentioned, there is NO DOUBT that the court systems are corrupted. My little brother was caught with weed when he was in high school and I watched in stunned disbelief the lawlessness that played out against his petty crime for years, and the judges who ruled as petty kings, utterly afraid of any legal consequence for breaking the very laws they were supposed to enact.

More recently I have a neighbor who is attempting to fight a tax battle against the local and state government, and because he's a close friend I have been able to verify the officials have broken law after law after law, all with no consequence. Repeatedly appealing to higher and higher courts, each higher judge has knowingly broken the law to coordinate with the rest of the club below them (even though there are specific laws on the books that forbid their judgements, or ignoring broken laws, nothing seems to matter). He's convinced that once he gets to the Supreme Court, someone somewhere will actually stand up for the law. I'm convinced of the opposite, but I try to be a supportive friend regardless.

The real shock isn't that the legal system is corrupted; the real shock is realizing that it's pretty much 100% corrupted.

But this is just the same Gadianton stuff we are warned has existed since the beginning of time, it's just shocking when we encounter it personally. It is very real.

The problem with the victims of this type of torture and mind control is that they have literally 'broken' minds, as far as I can tell many times unable to tell between what was hallucinated and what was real. Remember this kind of mind control works in tandem with hallucinogenic drugs and implanted memories as well. All of this is on purpose, to protect the cabal from any victim who tries to blow the whistle. They'll be disbelieved by default, because some of their 'memories' are simply fabrications or inventions, and they can't always tell the difference, which makes the public dismiss it all as bs.

What's needed is a skilled interlocuter to parse out the true stuff from the false, as well as a detailed investigation.

But at this point, with the mountains of testimonies, I would be a liar if I just through it all out as 'bs'.

There is something seriously wrong, and I believe it's true that it goes to the very highest levels of the church (and the government too of course).

I don't dismiss all of it. But I don't get my head turned by every one-sided claim made in the media. I'm too level-headed for that.
There have been many claims of significant abuse over the years. There was oène on the Orkney Isles off the north coast of Scotland, where social workers removed dozens of children from their families because of claims of SRA etc. It was all over the media, with the assumption that these awful wicked parents were guilty right from the start.
In the end, despite detailed testimony from the children, it was proved that the whole thing was made up. No children had been abused, no paedophile ring existed amongst the families, no satanic rituals had taken place... it was all a pack of lies.
And this isn't an isolated case either.

In my own family, my brother-in-laws brothers daughter told a school teacher her father had been sexually abusing her for many years. She went into great detail with her descriptions and was taken into care by social services and placed in Foster care for many years. As far as the authorities were concerned he was guilty as hell.
Now as an adult the daughter has admitted she made the whole thing up so that she could be taken into care and have more freedom.
Same thing happened to a friend of mine in the last couple of years.
So I approach all of these claims with a certain degree of suspicion.

It's too bad we live in a world where more people are worried about being accused, AND VILIFY ALL VICTIMS UPFRONT BECAUSE OF THOSE FEW FALSE REPORTS THAT WILL MOST LIKELY NEVER BE PROSECUTED, INSTEAD OF HELPING THE 95-98% WHO ARE ACTUAL VICTIMS TRYING TO GET HELP.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_accusation_of_rape

https://www.brown.edu/campus-life/healt ... lt-reports

https://www.nsvrc.org/sites/default/fil ... orting.pdf

When my special needs son was being anally raped and I tried to get him help, EVERY MAN HE KNOWS (including his own stupid paranoid selfish father) scattered like cockroaches because every one of them were afraid of being accused of hurting him (turns out a woman did it to him anyway) - INSTEAD OF STANDING UP FOR A LITTLE BOY WHO NEVER GOT HELP, WHOSE BODY WAS DESTROYED FOR AWHILE BEFORE IT HEALED - NOT TO MENTION WHAT IT DID TO HIS SOUL, AND DESPITE THREE DOCTORS AND THE FORENSIC EXAMINER SHOWING EVERYONE WHAT HAPPENED TO HIM, ALL THE PEOPLE WHO SUPPOSEDLY LOVED HIM WERE TOO SCARED FOR THEMSELVES.

Too bad for ALLLLLLL the victims more people are worried about being accused (OR EXPOSED), than getting people help and standing up for victims.

Thankfully he had you to stand up for him.

If he would have had more SUPPORT instead of paranoid people calling me a "false accuser" and fighting against me trying to get help for my son, he would have been able to get HELP on top of having an awesome Mamma who would do ANYTHING for him.

[Robin Hood]

I don't know about this yet...I am trying to decide if I can stomach the read....

If you have a hard time with the pace memo… I suggest you really pray about reading JR Sweets journal entries. (Whether you should or not). They are seriously the grossest subject matter I’ve ever read.

I think you mentioned this character a while back. I checked it out. Maybe the claims and descriptions are true, maybe they aren't. I don't know and I'm prepared to admit I don't know.
However, I do know that in my country and yours a person is considered innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
It has it's flaws, but it's the best system we have.

What I find interesting is your choice of words in how you describe these people. They are almost universally derogatory in nature. Do I believe all of the SRA stories? No. But the “coincidences” are no longer coincidences for me. People who abuse like to hide, to cover up the truth, or to say “you’re crazy.”

I really wish none of this was going on. I honestly hope that a person who says they are “the Lord’s anointed” doesn’t play with fire and brimstone. But the simple fact that the church doesn’t want to talk about it, and actively campaigns to demean or silence those who do speak up, is a major red flag. I mean, just look at the whole child sex abuse cases. The church was far more interested in protecting their image (sorry, “the good name of the church”) over the precious young spirits that were being abused.

So, what would you do if you were running the church?
I'm not defending wrongdoing, I am trying to look at how to solve these issues. Offences are going to happen, Jesus tells us that, so what would you do if you were in charge?

[FoxMammaWisdom]

Some interesting comments there

https://www.amazon.com/Paperdolls-Heali ... B000QBPWBK

[Reluctant Watchman]

If you have a hard time with the pace memo… I suggest you really pray about reading JR Sweets journal entries. (Whether you should or not). They are seriously the grossest subject matter I’ve ever read.

I think you mentioned this character a while back. I checked it out. Maybe the claims and descriptions are true, maybe they aren't. I don't know and I'm prepared to admit I don't know.
However, I do know that in my country and yours a person is considered innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
It has it's flaws, but it's the best system we have.

What I find interesting is your choice of words in how you describe these people. They are almost universally derogatory in nature. Do I believe all of the SRA stories? No. But the “coincidences” are no longer coincidences for me. People who abuse like to hide, to cover up the truth, or to say “you’re crazy.”

I really wish none of this was going on. I honestly hope that a person who says they are “the Lord’s anointed” doesn’t play with fire and brimstone. But the simple fact that the church doesn’t want to talk about it, and actively campaigns to demean or silence those who do speak up, is a major red flag. I mean, just look at the whole child sex abuse cases. The church was far more interested in protecting their image (sorry, “the good name of the church”) over the precious young spirits that were being abused.

So, what would you do if you were running the church?
I'm not defending wrongdoing, I am trying to look at how to solve these issues. Offences are going to happen, Jesus tells us that, so what would you do if you were in charge?

Darkness thrives in secrecy, and shuns the light. Darkness loves the lack of transparency. Darkness likes to manipulate and abuse. Darkness loves lies. The Lord will never use a lie to teach a truth.

Light loves freedom and honesty. Light loves integrity and transparency. Light is willing to be persecuted for what is right. Light defends the poor and hopeless, the defenseless and weak in spirit.

The simple fact that you can’t publicly disagree with a church leader without being viewed as an apostate is worrisome at best. Another red flag. This single piece in the handbook is so abused.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Consider this, the LDS church has settled hundreds, if not thousands of sex abuse cases out of court. When that happens, (after paying millions upon millions of dollars in settlement fees), those who have been abused have a gag order placed on them. They can’t say a word without having repercussions. If the church is truly concerned for the welfare of the abused, they would not only compensate the abused, but publish the abuses far and wide. They would shine a helluva big light on these evil acts.

Make the evil filth run and hide in their dark little corners. All they’ve been doing is helping evil hide in plain sight.

[Robin Hood]

I think you mentioned this character a while back. I checked it out. Maybe the claims and descriptions are true, maybe they aren't. I don't know and I'm prepared to admit I don't know.
However, I do know that in my country and yours a person is considered innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
It has it's flaws, but it's the best system we have.

What I find interesting is your choice of words in how you describe these people. They are almost universally derogatory in nature. Do I believe all of the SRA stories? No. But the “coincidences” are no longer coincidences for me. People who abuse like to hide, to cover up the truth, or to say “you’re crazy.”

I really wish none of this was going on. I honestly hope that a person who says they are “the Lord’s anointed” doesn’t play with fire and brimstone. But the simple fact that the church doesn’t want to talk about it, and actively campaigns to demean or silence those who do speak up, is a major red flag. I mean, just look at the whole child sex abuse cases. The church was far more interested in protecting their image (sorry, “the good name of the church”) over the precious young spirits that were being abused.

So, what would you do if you were running the church?
I'm not defending wrongdoing, I am trying to look at how to solve these issues. Offences are going to happen, Jesus tells us that, so what would you do if you were in charge?

Darkness thrives in secrecy, and shuns the light. Darkness loves the lack of transparency. Darkness likes to manipulate and abuse. Darkness loves lies. The Lord will never use a lie to teach a truth.

Light loves freedom and honesty. Light loves integrity and transparency. Light is willing to be persecuted for what is right. Light defends the poor and hopeless, the defenseless and weak in spirit.

The simple fact that you can’t publicly disagree with a church leader without being viewed as an apostate is worrisome at best. Another red flag. This single piece in the handbook is so abused.

You still haven't said how you would deal with this if you were in charge. Lots of words, but tell us, what would you actually do? What steps would you take?

[Reluctant Watchman]

You still haven't said how you would deal with this if you were in charge. Lots of words, but tell us, what would you actually do? What steps would you take?

Publish the abuses, let the abused know they've been heard and not gagged.

As far as what else, I'd first have to have access to any and all records of the church and full access to any and all people. Then we could begin to talk. You can't fight what you don't know. I don't know how the church operates behind the scenes. And apparently, according to the SEC, they don't want you to know.

[BigT]

The following site includes more information, for those interested. Here is an excerpt:

Why would anyone commit ritual abuse? "Most of us, in our truly honest moments, can imagine ourselves committing virtually every other crime, if provoked.

Though we may have no temptation.... we can understand why [others do].... But most of us find it impossible to imagine... [the] senseless torturing of children and slaughtering of animals." They quote one survivor who suffered criminal cult abuse from the age of eighteen months until she ran away from home at fourteen. Angered at those who repeatedly asked, "Why would anyone do such things?" she shouted, "Because they CAN! And as long as they can, they will." The authors point out that the Holocaust, within the living memory of most, also perpetrated unthinkable crimes. They add that much cult activity is multigenerational. Hence, victims accept terrible and painful practices as "part of the way things are." Another reason is that for many cultists, such acts "constitute religious worship."

The chapter concludes with a warning that any child could be at risk, partly because cultists "will be neatly dressed and groomed, friendly and active citizens" who are often "dissociative and thus unaware of their other cult-involved selves." They offer specific advice about prevention, symptoms of ritualistic abuse, and helpful attitudes to take during the healing process. One section is devoted to the assistance to be provided by ecclesiastical leaders:

Priesthood leaders must consider themselves part of the therapeutic team; if they do not help to heal the spiritual wounds, who will? If rebuffed or dismissed with a smile, a pat on the back, and glib reassurance that "It will all work out," a survivor may have his or her worst fears confirmed, and wander on the fringes for years. The professional therapists have their work, and the spiritual counselors have theirs. Neither can do the work of the other....

Most survivors of ritual abuse have been programmed to believe that no one outside the cult could possibly love them, because of the crimes they have participated in. They have been convinced that God does not love them, or he would have saved them. Family and ecclesiastical leaders can help the healing by manifesting patient, unconditional love and by sharing their testimony that God does indeed love the survivor….

Remember that some survivors have been tortured amid the mock trappings of church or temple; the real church or temple services may trigger recurrences of the trauma. It is crucial for ecclesiastical leaders NOT to punish or reject in any way a person who feels unable to work out healing in the religious context. Some individuals may have to heal spiritually outside of the organized church context.

https://mormon-alliance.org/casereports ... 1p1c06.htm

[Redpilled Mormon]

The absolute slavish cult-like devotion of the Left to the losing issue of abortion puzzled me for many years.

Why was abortion the hill the Left was always willing to die on? The conventional explanation that there was a lot of money in the abortion industry never made sense to me; the Left has unlimited money anyway.

But now I think it makes sense from a logistic standpoint. These satanic ceremonies require innocent blood. Almost every testimony of SRA makes mention of sacrificing (sometimes eating) infants. But how can this be hidden, wouldn't someone notice all the babies going missing?

Abortion clinics can supply the needed material for the ceremonies. And that's why the Left cares so passionately about this issue.

Just a theory.

[endlessQuestions]

The absolute slavish cult-like devotion of the Left to the losing issue of abortion puzzled me for many years.

Why was abortion the hill the Left was always willing to die on? The conventional explanation that there was a lot of money in the abortion industry never made sense to me; the Left has unlimited money anyway.

But now I think it makes sense from a logistic standpoint. These satanic ceremonies require innocent blood. Almost every testimony of SRA makes mention of sacrificing (sometimes eating) infants. But how can this be hidden, wouldn't someone notice all the babies going missing?

Abortion clinics can supply the needed material for the ceremonies. And that's why the Left cares so passionately about this issue.

Just a theory.

I’m not against theories. One I’ve heard is that forced migration breaks apart families which allows for easy access to victims.

It was interesting to see Trump clamp down on this and then watch Biden frantically get it started again as one of his top priorities.

Also interesting how supportive of “refugees” the Church is. Why don’t we use our influence and raiders to try to stop people from being forced out of their homelands instead?

Not a Trump fan, just to head that off.

[BigT]

Excessive illegal immigration provides access to children, a valuable resource for those who prey on them, for evil and nefarious purposes. Separate kids from parents, then disappear the kids to places unknown to parents. Child trafficking is rampant and the demand is rising. Search for the “China Lake Naval Base.”

https://fightingmonarch.com/2019/06/23/ ... t-monarch/

[Redpilled Mormon]

More “BS” I guess:

I know this family better than probably most of you on the forum. This hits really close to home.

Finally got a chance to watch this. Extremely credible and very well documented.

A church leader accusing 6 year-olds of being sexually promiscuous. Incredible.

[Ebenezer]

David Leavitt now lives in Scotland. In a castle. Seriously. He bought a castle. https://twitter.com/adamherbets/status/ ... A5ivja7-7Q