Power trip 🤯

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LDS Physician
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"

simpleton
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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creator wrote: January 10th, 2023, 11:21 am I didn't mean to ruin your fun.

Maybe I misread your intentions based on the context of other discussions you've been involved in and my perception of those discussions. :twisted: Or maybe I didn't. :D

Everything can be looked at from so many different perspectives.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Speaking of "power trips", I recall some posts I read on Reddit back in 2015 before Ronald Rasband was call as an Apostle. A church employee had predicted he would be called because they were tasked with looking into his background (and others) for any potential red flags. Anyways, others were commenting on Rasband being example of someone on a power trip, saying that he often made it clear to those beneath him in rank that he was their superior and was to be obeyed. Reminds me of this comment he made about members being obedient and wearing masks, to be good Christians, and that it had nothing to do with taking away religious liberties of the members of the Church. The guy is a great example of power tripping.
Perfect example of no light... hmmmmmm, I wonder if Joseph did a "background check" on those that were revealed by revelation to the apostleship. :evil:

simpleton
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Re: Power trip 🤯

Post by simpleton »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
There most definitely is a requisite, by God, to honor and sustain His anointed as they are as God to His people. But then His anointed, not those that are called by uninspired men, as the ones we have today.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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simpleton wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:30 am There most definitely is a requisite, by God, to honor and sustain His anointed as they are as God to His people. But then His anointed, not those that are called by uninspired men, as the ones we have today.
Just ponder that for a minute. Then think about the ten commandments. The first one in particular.
Last edited by Reluctant Watchman on January 11th, 2023, 10:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

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nightlight
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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simpleton wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:30 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
There most definitely is a requisite, by God, to honor and sustain His anointed as they are as God to His people. But then His anointed, not those that are called by uninspired men, as the ones we have today.
They are as God to the people?

No

You'll never hear the anointed ones refer to themselves as God to those they serve

Only the Holy Ghost fills this role in our day to day lives

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cyclOps
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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I’m not sure what Simpleton meant, but I take it along the lines of D&C 84:36-37, “For he that receiveth my servants receiveth me; And he that receiveth me receiveth my father;”

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cyclOps
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
Let’s just quote what Jesus did say. “he stretched forth his hand unto the multitude, and cried unto them, saying: Blessed are ye if ye shall give heed unto the words of these twelve whom I have chosen from among you to minister unto you, and to be your servants;” (3 Nephi 12:1)

simpleton
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:00 am
simpleton wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:30 am There most definitely is a requisite, by God, to honor and sustain His anointed as they are as God to His people. But then His anointed, not those that are called by uninspired men, as the ones we have today.
Just ponder that for a minute. Then think about the ten commandments. The first one in particular.
I've pondered many a season. Moses was like a God to his people, Joseph of old and of our day was the same.
I most definitely am not say they are God Almighty, but yet God most definitely sets them up to be respected as His anointed.
The worshipping we have today is the crossing of the fine line.
This idea that we can go directly to Christ and or to the Father and bypass His anointed ones to me is not correct. As BY stated, not one individual will get to heaven in this dispensation without Joseph's explicit consent. And as also others appointed for their times.
Now, don't get me wrong, we most definitely are required to pray to the Father in Christ's name. And we do not pray to Joseph or Brigham or Nielson or any other leader, anointed or otherwise. But, if we are not one with His anointed, we most definitely will not be one with Christ or Our Father.
So the secret is, to find out who is His anointed representative upon this earth, that is, if there is one. Which at the moment, nada, Imo.
The reason I make this point is that I have met a few who have gone so far as to believe that they do not even need Christ, that they can bypass Christ and go straight to the Father. And that Christ was just a man.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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cyclOps wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:35 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
Let’s just quote what Jesus did say. “he stretched forth his hand unto the multitude, and cried unto them, saying: Blessed are ye if ye shall give heed unto the words of these twelve whom I have chosen from among you to minister unto you, and to be your servants;” (3 Nephi 12:1)
And what stipulation has He taught us elsewhere about discerning the words of any man or woman?

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cyclOps
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:41 am
cyclOps wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:35 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
Let’s just quote what Jesus did say. “he stretched forth his hand unto the multitude, and cried unto them, saying: Blessed are ye if ye shall give heed unto the words of these twelve whom I have chosen from among you to minister unto you, and to be your servants;” (3 Nephi 12:1)
And what stipulation has He taught us elsewhere about discerning the words of any man or woman?
Please feel free to quote His words.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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simpleton wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:41 am I've pondered many a season. Moses was like a God to his people, Joseph of old and of our day was the same.
I most definitely am not say they are God Almighty, but yet God most definitely sets them up to be respected as His anointed.
The worshipping we have today is the crossing of the fine line.
This idea that we can go directly to Christ and or to the Father and bypass His anointed ones to me is not correct. As BY stated, not one individual will get to heaven in this dispensation without Joseph's explicit consent. And as also others appointed for their times.
Now, don't get me wrong, we most definitely are required to pray to the Father in Christ's name. And we do not pray to Joseph or Brigham or Nielson or any other leader, anointed or otherwise. But, if we are not one with His anointed, we most definitely will not be one with Christ or Our Father.
So the secret is, to find out who is His anointed representative upon this earth, that is, if there is one. Which at the moment, nada, Imo.
The reason I make this point is that I have met a few who have gone so far as to believe that they do not even need Christ, that they can bypass Christ and go straight to the Father. And that Christ was just a man.
Oh, there's nothing "fine" about it. :)

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cyclOps
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
I again quote Jesus, “he said unto those twelve whom he had chosen: Ye are my disciples; and ye are a light unto this people,” (3 Nephi 15:11-12).

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Re: Power trip 🤯

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cyclOps wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:43 am Please feel free to quote His words.
2 Nephi 28:31

Cursed is he that putteth his trust in man, or maketh flesh his arm, or shall hearken unto the precepts of men, save their precepts shall be given by the power of the Holy Ghost.

JST Mark 9

44 Therefore, let every man stand or fall, by himself, and not for another; or not trusting another.

45 Seek unto my Father, and it shall be done in that very moment what ye shall ask, if ye ask in faith, believing that ye shall receive.

46 And if thine eye which seeth for thee, him that is appointed to watch over thee to show thee light, become a transgressor and offend thee, pluck him out.

47 It is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God, with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.

48 For it is better that thyself should be saved, than to be cast into hell with thy brother, where their worm dieth not, and where the fire is not quenched.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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cyclOps wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:44 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
I again quote Jesus, “he said unto those twelve whom he had chosen: Ye are my disciples; and ye are a light unto this people,” (3 Nephi 15:11-12).
They are only a light when they teach the precepts and doctrine of Christ. To suggest that we follow someone solely based upon a position of leadership is cultish.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Power trip 🤯

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

Given how prevalent the ancient prophets spoke of false prophets and errant prophets in our day, I suggest the two verses I quoted be internalized a bit.

Lemarque
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Re: Power trip 🤯

Post by Lemarque »

blitzinstripes wrote: January 10th, 2023, 4:29 pm
I imagine that what I should expect to hear from a true servant would be something to this effect:

Please do not ever put me on a pedestal. I am just an imperfect man and I am subject to sin and error as are all of us. I promise to do my best to follow the Spirit and do the will of the Lord, but I cannot promise that I will not fail you. That I may someday succumb to temptation or pride. That I could not be deceived by the devil, and subsequently lead you astray, if you are not in tune with the Spirit. For that reason, I implore you to always trust in the Holy Spirit and the revealed word of God in the scriptures. Never seek to praise, honor, or emulate me. Jesus Christ, alone must be your light and your example. He is the Rock. Not Peter, Not Joseph Smith. Not me. Only HIM.
And Jesus said unto him, "Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God:" Matt 19:17

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LDS Physician
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
Agreed. We are wayyyyyyyyy too prophet-focused. Remember when Joseph Smith warned the Relief Society that they were looking to him too much?

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LDS Physician
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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Lemarque wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:46 am
blitzinstripes wrote: January 10th, 2023, 4:29 pm
I imagine that what I should expect to hear from a true servant would be something to this effect:

Please do not ever put me on a pedestal. I am just an imperfect man and I am subject to sin and error as are all of us. I promise to do my best to follow the Spirit and do the will of the Lord, but I cannot promise that I will not fail you. That I may someday succumb to temptation or pride. That I could not be deceived by the devil, and subsequently lead you astray, if you are not in tune with the Spirit. For that reason, I implore you to always trust in the Holy Spirit and the revealed word of God in the scriptures. Never seek to praise, honor, or emulate me. Jesus Christ, alone must be your light and your example. He is the Rock. Not Peter, Not Joseph Smith. Not me. Only HIM.
And Jesus said unto him, "Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God:" Matt 19:17
One of my absolute favorite scriptures because the magnanimity of what he said is amazing. Jesus saying that! It's a great example of how each of us, even prophets, should consider ourselves. In just a few words the Savior exemplifies perfect (good? lol) humility, deference to God, dedication to God, and acknowledgement to God.

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Fred
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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The thing that irritates me is the strict obedience required of Bishops and Stake Presidents. Many of them know that the jab is bad. They are sympathetic to people's complaints. But come hell or high water, the will of the Q15 will be done. No matter if it is anti-Christ or not.

I would like to see Bishops and Stake Presidents able to use their own mind to discern truth. When in doubt, do as you are told. But if you know better, don't sin against the congregation. Especially knowing it is a life and death matter.

For instance, on this forum, there are people that claim to have received conflicting revelation. They express it. We condemn neither. But we decide for ourselves.

If I tell my Bishop that God has made it very clear to me that the shot is a bad idea, he will tell me that I am preaching against the Brethren. No. I am preaching against the shot. I worship the God that was against Lucifer's plan of forced vaxxes and other things. I am for freedom.

If a Bishop, Stake President, or even just a member, does not want to commit suicide, objecting to the recommendation should not be considered disobedience to God or His true church.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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Fred wrote: January 11th, 2023, 11:47 am The thing that irritates me is the strict obedience required of Bishops and Stake Presidents. Many of them know that the jab is bad. They are sympathetic to people's complaints. But come hell or high water, the will of the Q15 will be done. No matter if it is anti-Christ or not.

I would like to see Bishops and Stake Presidents able to use their own mind to discern truth. When in doubt, do as you are told. But if you know better, don't sin against the congregation. Especially knowing it is a life and death matter.

For instance, on this forum, there are people that claim to have received conflicting revelation. They express it. We condemn neither. But we decide for ourselves.

If I tell my Bishop that God has made it very clear to me that the shot is a bad idea, he will tell me that I am preaching against the Brethren. No. I am preaching against the shot. I worship the God that was against Lucifer's plan of forced vaxxes and other things. I am for freedom.

If a Bishop, Stake President, or even just a member, does not want to commit suicide, objecting to the recommendation should not be considered disobedience to God or His true church.
In a ward conference during the plandemic my stake president said from the pulpit, "I will follow the brethren to the ends of the earth, and do whatever they ask me to do."

I about lost my marbles.

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cyclOps
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Re: Power trip 🤯

Post by cyclOps »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:45 am
cyclOps wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:44 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
LDS Physician wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:07 am If you read the Book of Mormon and try to really analyze what its message is (especially the words of the resurrected Savior Himself), it isn't telling us in the last days to "cling to the prophet", to treat as celebrities the apostles, to "follow the covenant path", to attend the temple weekly, etc etc.
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
I again quote Jesus, “he said unto those twelve whom he had chosen: Ye are my disciples; and ye are a light unto this people,” (3 Nephi 15:11-12).
They are only a light when they teach the precepts and doctrine of Christ. To suggest that we follow someone solely based upon a position of leadership is cultish.
Who suggested that?

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Power trip 🤯

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

cyclOps wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:40 pm
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:45 am
cyclOps wrote: January 11th, 2023, 10:44 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 11th, 2023, 9:21 am
Can the honest at heart truly believe that Christ would make an invitation such as this to those gathered at Bountiful:

"Do you sustain Nephi, the president of the church, as prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain these additional twelve as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church?"
I again quote Jesus, “he said unto those twelve whom he had chosen: Ye are my disciples; and ye are a light unto this people,” (3 Nephi 15:11-12).
They are only a light when they teach the precepts and doctrine of Christ. To suggest that we follow someone solely based upon a position of leadership is cultish.
Who suggested that?
How do you interpret the verse you quoted? What you stated was true, but most members take a scripture like that and say, “Look, we need to follow the prophets”…. And with trailing breath, “… because they can never lead us astray.”

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Silver Pie
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Re: Power trip 🤯

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In regards to the op, I would think that any man (or woman) would find it nearly impossible to be affected by the adoration and rapt attention of millions to the point that your every opinion was considered God's own truth. Add to that the billions and billions of dollars in cash and assets. How could any mere mortal not be taken for a ride with all that?

The surprise would be if that didn't turn their head.

blitzinstripes
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Re: Power trip 🤯

Post by blitzinstripes »

No doubt there are members who would follow along so blindly, that they would offer up their underage daughters to the 'brethren', if so asked, even consider it an honor.

Wait......that already happened. 😮

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