My post was referring to the data trend that was posted. That trend is explained through other events and not the "clot shot".Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:38 pmIf you said governments lied frequently, I would tend to agree with you, however they do also tell the truth on occasion.
When government websites in various countries admit that certain Covid shots harm people do you consider that a "false narrative" from them?
Some countries, including Canada and Hungary, blocked the import of AstraZeneca'* for use. Were they promoting a false narrative?
Also why did the British government (and others) pass legislation to waive liability on potential injuries from the shots? Is that a false narrative too?
* My first two jags, if I'd taken them up would have been AstraZeneca's mRNA serum, by the way. Which you think is alright, even though a number of national governments do not.
Deaths SPIKE by 163%
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 617
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
- Niemand
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 14231
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Many governments admit that the shots can do harm. The difference between my view and theirs is how often that occurs. I don't even believe the long term effects of mRNA therapies are fully understood. It may take ten or twenty years to study them. The tests have probably been mainly on rodents, as usual, which have much shorter lifespans and smaller bodies than humans, whereas we live much longer and have to produce more copies of cells over a longer period.Liahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:42 pmMy post was referring to the data trend that was posted. That trend is explained through other events and not the "clot shot".Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:38 pmIf you said governments lied frequently, I would tend to agree with you, however they do also tell the truth on occasion.
When government websites in various countries admit that certain Covid shots harm people do you consider that a "false narrative" from them?
Some countries, including Canada and Hungary, blocked the import of AstraZeneca'* for use. Were they promoting a false narrative?
Also why did the British government (and others) pass legislation to waive liability on potential injuries from the shots? Is that a false narrative too?
* My first two jags, if I'd taken them up would have been AstraZeneca's mRNA serum, by the way. Which you think is alright, even though a number of national governments do not.
Some of the common causes of death are in line with side effects listed in official documents. Mainly blood-related issues. However if there is a rise in deaths after the administration of the shots then that is a cause for alarm.
I have said above that I believe we do have some additional factors. Grinding people's sanity and very livelihood into the ground has killed in many cases. The doom-mongering itself in 2020 and 2021 killed people. Heart attacks, addictions, suicide, you name it. The sad thing is that there appears to have been a massive overeaction. Then there is the psychological damage which has been done to children, which will also take decades to unfold.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 617
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
There are always side effects. I don't disagree that a very small percentage of the population could have adverse effects to the vaccination but that is expected.Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:56 pmMany governments admit that the shots can do harm. The difference between my view and theirs is how often that occurs. I don't even believe the long term effects of mRNA therapies are fully understood. It may take ten or twenty years to study them. The tests have probably been mainly on rodents, as usual, which have much shorter lifespans and smaller bodies than humans, whereas we live much longer and have to produce more copies of cells over a longer period.Liahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:42 pmMy post was referring to the data trend that was posted. That trend is explained through other events and not the "clot shot".Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:38 pmIf you said governments lied frequently, I would tend to agree with you, however they do also tell the truth on occasion.
When government websites in various countries admit that certain Covid shots harm people do you consider that a "false narrative" from them?
Some countries, including Canada and Hungary, blocked the import of AstraZeneca'* for use. Were they promoting a false narrative?
Also why did the British government (and others) pass legislation to waive liability on potential injuries from the shots? Is that a false narrative too?
* My first two jags, if I'd taken them up would have been AstraZeneca's mRNA serum, by the way. Which you think is alright, even though a number of national governments do not.
Some of the common causes of death are in line with side effects listed in official documents. Mainly blood-related issues. However if there is a rise in deaths after the administration of the shots then that is a cause for alarm.
I have said above that I believe we do have some additional factors. Grinding people's sanity and very livelihood into the ground has killed in many cases. The doom-mongering itself in 2020 and 2021 killed people. Heart attacks, addictions, suicide, you name it. The sad thing is that there appears to have been a massive overeaction. Then there is the psychological damage which has been done to children, which will also take decades to unfold.
Every medication commercial will list the possible side effects. Even shows like SNL make fun of that. However, that's different than the claim you and others on the forum are making.
- nightowl
- captain of 100
- Posts: 272
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Exactly survival of COVID was like 99%. No shot was ever needed.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 3:31 pmYeah not Covid aka the vaccine. If it was Covid related they would have seen a spike in deaths in 2020 but they didn'tLiahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 2:21 pmThe report said it was non-pandemic related.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 2:17 pmIt is the Clot shot according to the data. The evidence is pretty undeniable when you see it for yourself
https://www.amazon.ca/Cause-Epidemic-Su ... 179&sr=8-1
Now we have people blaming a rise in death on stress and other factors.
- Niemand
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 14231
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Hundreds of millions have had these so yes, we would expect high numbers on that basis alone. However, it gets worse: not only is mRNA therapy a relatively new treatment (for the public at least), but these shots have far higher rates of reported side-effects than traditional vaccinations. That adds up on the macro-scale.
Yes, you're going to play the anecdote card again, but I know of a number of individuals who did not report their side-effects to medical personnel and continue to take boosters. If this is typical, and I suspect it is, then if one scales that up, that probably translates into a much larger number worldwide. I have told off a few people for not reporting their issues. If people don't do so then little can be done about them.
People have certainly been more tolerant of pain than they would be normally. If your arm still hurts a week or more after your injection, you've got a problem. Ditto if you feel woolly headed after one. Yet most individuals don't seem to view it that way.
That's mostly the USA. I laughed my head off the first time I saw American advertising for some hayfever remedy TV. Think I'd rather have taken a few sneezing fits and having scratchy eyes over nose bleeds and worse.Every medication commercial will list the possible side effects. Even shows like SNL make fun of that. However, that's different than the claim you and others on the forum are making.
- Niemand
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 14231
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
I would tend to agree with you, but I have seen deaths and major health issues which are not directly attributable to the virus or the shots. Suicide certainly isn't.
Alcoholism, drug addiction and domestic abuse all went through the roof in 2020. Those will have had effects. I have also seen the stress and heartache small business owners have had to put up with. Those led to health problems before these shots were even brought in. Many people are in debt or bankrupted. I know a café owner who took a heart attack during 2020 for example. I doubt he's very healthy these days, with or without the jab.
- PeacefulProtests
- captain of 100
- Posts: 330
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Jan 2010 - 26,952,000 disabledLiahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:33 pmIt's been a rising trend since the middle of 2010 (Obamacare roll out...actually giving people access to healthcare for once). Lockdowns prevented a lot of access to medical care and the ability to diagnose, which is why you see the downward trend in 2020. Removal of the lockdowns and people were able to get back to their lives...which is why you see the sharp increase.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 3:33 pmDon't forget disabilities which have risen by a staggering 3 million people in the USA since the rollout of the vaccine according to Government dataBeing There wrote: ↑January 6th, 2023, 4:44 pm Deaths SPIKE by 163%
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/m4lL5YTJLDM
hmm
now I wonder what could of caused that.
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU00074597
"Clot shots" harming people is a FALSE narrative.
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Increase of 2.89 million over an 11 year period
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Dec 2022 - 32,874,000 disabled
Increase of 3.02 million over just a 2 year period
A few missed months of medical appointments and diagnoses doesn't explain an 11+ year increase in just a 2 year span. Its unheard of
- PeacefulProtests
- captain of 100
- Posts: 330
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
I know multiple people in my own circle of friends and family that have been injured by this thing.Liahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:01 pmThere are always side effects. I don't disagree that a very small percentage of the population could have adverse effects to the vaccination but that is expected.Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:56 pmMany governments admit that the shots can do harm. The difference between my view and theirs is how often that occurs. I don't even believe the long term effects of mRNA therapies are fully understood. It may take ten or twenty years to study them. The tests have probably been mainly on rodents, as usual, which have much shorter lifespans and smaller bodies than humans, whereas we live much longer and have to produce more copies of cells over a longer period.Liahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:42 pmMy post was referring to the data trend that was posted. That trend is explained through other events and not the "clot shot".Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:38 pm
If you said governments lied frequently, I would tend to agree with you, however they do also tell the truth on occasion.
When government websites in various countries admit that certain Covid shots harm people do you consider that a "false narrative" from them?
Some countries, including Canada and Hungary, blocked the import of AstraZeneca'* for use. Were they promoting a false narrative?
Also why did the British government (and others) pass legislation to waive liability on potential injuries from the shots? Is that a false narrative too?
* My first two jags, if I'd taken them up would have been AstraZeneca's mRNA serum, by the way. Which you think is alright, even though a number of national governments do not.
Some of the common causes of death are in line with side effects listed in official documents. Mainly blood-related issues. However if there is a rise in deaths after the administration of the shots then that is a cause for alarm.
I have said above that I believe we do have some additional factors. Grinding people's sanity and very livelihood into the ground has killed in many cases. The doom-mongering itself in 2020 and 2021 killed people. Heart attacks, addictions, suicide, you name it. The sad thing is that there appears to have been a massive overeaction. Then there is the psychological damage which has been done to children, which will also take decades to unfold.
Every medication commercial will list the possible side effects. Even shows like SNL make fun of that. However, that's different than the claim you and others on the forum are making.
Few examples:
My neighbors kid went to the hospital for chest pains immediately after the vaxx. Doctor gave him some meds. Seems to be doing ok now
Two close friends who live near me had bad chest pain after the second shot. First friends pain went away, second friend was sick for a year and was diagnosed with myocarditis
Lady in my branch had a heart attack right after the vaxx and then just afterwards her son died suddenly
Another lady in my branch now has a damaged heart valve after the vaxx
Guy at my local lumber yard took the second booster last summer, started having seizures immediately afterwards and two weeks later he was dead
My moms cousin got a blood clot in his arm and died a week later
Driver at my local grocery store crashed his truck in the parking lot and was rushed to the hospital. 2 days later he was dead
Dads friend diagnosed with A-fib after the booster
It would be statistically impossible for me to know this many people if side effects were "rare".
Remember when everybody was saying the Virus came from a lab in China. Well guess what else came from China: The Genetic code to create the injection. I'm fully convinced this thing is a bioweapon designed to injure and kill
- madvin
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1134
- Location: Stillwater OK
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
You may think side effects are rare ONLY if you immerse yourself in the main stream news outlets, because they won't even mention the possibility of an mrna injection as a causation.
Which is not unlike the brethren btw.
Which is not unlike the brethren btw.
-
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 8535
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
So many people are dying at younger ages, life insurance companies are quietly adjusting their rates. Average life span used to be around 80, and it has now dropped through the 70’s into the high 60’s. In two years. This was a statistically impossible drop, even in times of war — it’s like having a 9-11 disaster loss every day, on top of “normal” death numbers, or a Vietnam war death rate every month, added to the normal rate of deaths.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:27 pmJan 2010 - 26,952,000 disabledLiahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:33 pmIt's been a rising trend since the middle of 2010 (Obamacare roll out...actually giving people access to healthcare for once). Lockdowns prevented a lot of access to medical care and the ability to diagnose, which is why you see the downward trend in 2020. Removal of the lockdowns and people were able to get back to their lives...which is why you see the sharp increase.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 3:33 pmDon't forget disabilities which have risen by a staggering 3 million people in the USA since the rollout of the vaccine according to Government dataBeing There wrote: ↑January 6th, 2023, 4:44 pm Deaths SPIKE by 163%
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/m4lL5YTJLDM
hmm
now I wonder what could of caused that.
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU00074597
"Clot shots" harming people is a FALSE narrative.
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Increase of 2.89 million over an 11 year period
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Dec 2022 - 32,874,000 disabled
Increase of 3.02 million over just a 2 year period
A few missed months of medical appointments and diagnoses doesn't explain an 11+ year increase in just a 2 year span. Its unheard of
Ed Dowd, a lifetime statistician who has connections with actuaries and morticians, has solid numbers on this phenomenon. Check out any of his interviews.
- iWriteStuff
- blithering blabbermouth
- Posts: 5523
- Location: Sinope
- Contact:
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Liahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:42 pmMy post was referring to the data trend that was posted. That trend is explained through other events and not the "clot shot".Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:38 pmIf you said governments lied frequently, I would tend to agree with you, however they do also tell the truth on occasion.
When government websites in various countries admit that certain Covid shots harm people do you consider that a "false narrative" from them?
Some countries, including Canada and Hungary, blocked the import of AstraZeneca'* for use. Were they promoting a false narrative?
Also why did the British government (and others) pass legislation to waive liability on potential injuries from the shots? Is that a false narrative too?
* My first two jags, if I'd taken them up would have been AstraZeneca's mRNA serum, by the way. Which you think is alright, even though a number of national governments do not.
- PeacefulProtests
- captain of 100
- Posts: 330
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
I just read his new book "cause unknown". I found the biggest smoking gun to be the 1-14yr old age group who saw a negative excess mortality in 2020 and 2021as the virus and lockdowns didn't affect that age group. In 2022 excess mortality for this group jumps to 6+% after they started injecting them, you can clearly see it on the chartLizzy60 wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:59 pmSo many people are dying at younger ages, life insurance companies are quietly adjusting their rates. Average life span used to be around 80, and it has now dropped through the 70’s into the high 60’s. In two years. This was a statistically impossible drop, even in times of war — it’s like having a 9-11 disaster loss every day, on top of “normal” death numbers, or a Vietnam war death rate every month, added to the normal rate of deaths.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:27 pmJan 2010 - 26,952,000 disabledLiahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:33 pmIt's been a rising trend since the middle of 2010 (Obamacare roll out...actually giving people access to healthcare for once). Lockdowns prevented a lot of access to medical care and the ability to diagnose, which is why you see the downward trend in 2020. Removal of the lockdowns and people were able to get back to their lives...which is why you see the sharp increase.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 3:33 pm
Don't forget disabilities which have risen by a staggering 3 million people in the USA since the rollout of the vaccine according to Government data
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU00074597
"Clot shots" harming people is a FALSE narrative.
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Increase of 2.89 million over an 11 year period
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Dec 2022 - 32,874,000 disabled
Increase of 3.02 million over just a 2 year period
A few missed months of medical appointments and diagnoses doesn't explain an 11+ year increase in just a 2 year span. Its unheard of
Ed Dowd, a lifetime statistician who has connections with actuaries and morticians, has solid numbers on this phenomenon. Check out any of his interviews.
- madvin
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1134
- Location: Stillwater OK
- The Red Pill
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1673
- Location: Southern Utah
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
You just dropped a ton of bread crumbs for Liahona to pick up...problem is. ..he doesn't want to pick them up. He's got his worldview and he's got all the time in the world to argue with us...but no time to further educate himself and learn something new.Lizzy60 wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:59 pmSo many people are dying at younger ages, life insurance companies are quietly adjusting their rates. Average life span used to be around 80, and it has now dropped through the 70’s into the high 60’s. In two years. This was a statistically impossible drop, even in times of war — it’s like having a 9-11 disaster loss every day, on top of “normal” death numbers, or a Vietnam war death rate every month, added to the normal rate of deaths.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:27 pmJan 2010 - 26,952,000 disabledLiahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:33 pmIt's been a rising trend since the middle of 2010 (Obamacare roll out...actually giving people access to healthcare for once). Lockdowns prevented a lot of access to medical care and the ability to diagnose, which is why you see the downward trend in 2020. Removal of the lockdowns and people were able to get back to their lives...which is why you see the sharp increase.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 3:33 pm
Don't forget disabilities which have risen by a staggering 3 million people in the USA since the rollout of the vaccine according to Government data
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU00074597
"Clot shots" harming people is a FALSE narrative.
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Increase of 2.89 million over an 11 year period
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Dec 2022 - 32,874,000 disabled
Increase of 3.02 million over just a 2 year period
A few missed months of medical appointments and diagnoses doesn't explain an 11+ year increase in just a 2 year span. Its unheard of
Ed Dowd, a lifetime statistician who has connections with actuaries and morticians, has solid numbers on this phenomenon. Check out any of his interviews.
Here is another link to the Ed Dowd book. Will he read it? No he will not.
https://www.amazon.com/Cause-Epidemic-S ... 211&sr=8-2
I have met so many people like Liahona. They have all the "truth" they need. Not taking in anything more. Facts mean nothing, logic means nothing, reason means nothing. Truth is relative to them.
Let the fish go...
Cut the line...
- Being There
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 2964
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
if you haven't seen this already.
"Why do we never believe them?
For centuries, the global elite have broadcast their intentions to depopulate the world -
even to the point of carving them into stone. And yet… we never seem to believe them"
DIED SUDDENLY
https://www.stewpeters.com/video/2022/1 ... mber-21st/
"Why do we never believe them?
For centuries, the global elite have broadcast their intentions to depopulate the world -
even to the point of carving them into stone. And yet… we never seem to believe them"
DIED SUDDENLY
https://www.stewpeters.com/video/2022/1 ... mber-21st/
- h_p
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 2811
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Reposting these stats again here for reference. I'll assume the CDC will be publishing 2022's some time next year, and I'll add it to the list once they're available. My prediction (NOT A PROPHECY) is we'll see an additional increase over 2021's.
This is all-cause mortality by age group, btw, not excess deaths.
=== deaths per 100,000 US population ===
2016 - 2017: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db328-h.pdf
2017 - 2018: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db355-h.pdf
2018 - 2019: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db395-H.pdf
2019 - 2020: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db427.htm
2021: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/ ... 17e1-H.pdf
2021 references: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/ ... References
age 1-4:
2016 no data
2017 no data
2018 24.0
2019 23.3
2020 22.7
2021 24.7
age 5-14:
2016 no data
2017 no data
2018 13.3
2019 13.4
2020 13.7
2021 14.6 (+6.5%)
age 15-24:
2016 74.9
2017 74.0
2018 70.2 (-5.1%)
2019 69.7
2020 84.2 (+20.8%)
2021 90.2 (+7.1%) +29.4% above 2019
age 25-34:
2016 129.0
2017 132.8 (+2.9%)
2018 128.8 (-3.0%)
2019 128.8
2020 159.5 (+23.8%)
2021 178.6 (+12.0%) +38.7% above 2019
age 35-44:
2016 192.2
2017 195.2 (+1.6%)
2018 194.7
2019 199.2 (+2.3%)
2020 248.0 (+24.5%)
2021 292.0 (+17.7%) +46.6% above 2019
age 45-54:
2016 405.5
2017 401.5 (-1.0%)
2018 395.9 (-1.4%)
2019 392.4 (-0.9%)
2020 473.5 (+20.7%)
2021 538.5 (+13.7%) +37.2% above 2019
age 55-64:
2016 883.8
2017 885.8
2018 886.7
2019 883.3
2020 1038.9 (+17.6%)
2021 1131.8 (+8.9%) +28.1% above 2019
This is all-cause mortality by age group, btw, not excess deaths.
=== deaths per 100,000 US population ===
2016 - 2017: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db328-h.pdf
2017 - 2018: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db355-h.pdf
2018 - 2019: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/databriefs/db395-H.pdf
2019 - 2020: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db427.htm
2021: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/ ... 17e1-H.pdf
2021 references: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/ ... References
age 1-4:
2016 no data
2017 no data
2018 24.0
2019 23.3
2020 22.7
2021 24.7
age 5-14:
2016 no data
2017 no data
2018 13.3
2019 13.4
2020 13.7
2021 14.6 (+6.5%)
age 15-24:
2016 74.9
2017 74.0
2018 70.2 (-5.1%)
2019 69.7
2020 84.2 (+20.8%)
2021 90.2 (+7.1%) +29.4% above 2019
age 25-34:
2016 129.0
2017 132.8 (+2.9%)
2018 128.8 (-3.0%)
2019 128.8
2020 159.5 (+23.8%)
2021 178.6 (+12.0%) +38.7% above 2019
age 35-44:
2016 192.2
2017 195.2 (+1.6%)
2018 194.7
2019 199.2 (+2.3%)
2020 248.0 (+24.5%)
2021 292.0 (+17.7%) +46.6% above 2019
age 45-54:
2016 405.5
2017 401.5 (-1.0%)
2018 395.9 (-1.4%)
2019 392.4 (-0.9%)
2020 473.5 (+20.7%)
2021 538.5 (+13.7%) +37.2% above 2019
age 55-64:
2016 883.8
2017 885.8
2018 886.7
2019 883.3
2020 1038.9 (+17.6%)
2021 1131.8 (+8.9%) +28.1% above 2019
- HereWeGo
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1270
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
I imagine Liahona doesn't watch sports where you see athletes dropping on the field. Probably hasn't lost people he knows.The Red Pill wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 6:58 pm You just dropped a ton of bread crumbs for Liahona to pick up...problem is. ..he doesn't want to pick them up. He's got his worldview and he's got all the time in the world to argue with us...but no time to further educate himself and learn something new.
However, it is only a matter of time until Liahona starts losing friends and family to deaths for which the doctors can't give a very good explanation (like the rest of us have experienced). Perhaps deceased loved ones will force open eyes which are willfully closed.
We probably will not hear from Liahona when this happens so I would like to say to Liahona that I am sorry for your losses in advance.
- Fred
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7789
- Location: Zion
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
There are only side effects when you put your trust in satan. God's logo does not include the serpent that tempted Eve. All of Big Pharma solutions have side effects.Liahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:01 pmThere are always side effects. I don't disagree that a very small percentage of the population could have adverse effects to the vaccination but that is expected.Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:56 pmMany governments admit that the shots can do harm. The difference between my view and theirs is how often that occurs. I don't even believe the long term effects of mRNA therapies are fully understood. It may take ten or twenty years to study them. The tests have probably been mainly on rodents, as usual, which have much shorter lifespans and smaller bodies than humans, whereas we live much longer and have to produce more copies of cells over a longer period.Liahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:42 pmMy post was referring to the data trend that was posted. That trend is explained through other events and not the "clot shot".Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:38 pm
If you said governments lied frequently, I would tend to agree with you, however they do also tell the truth on occasion.
When government websites in various countries admit that certain Covid shots harm people do you consider that a "false narrative" from them?
Some countries, including Canada and Hungary, blocked the import of AstraZeneca'* for use. Were they promoting a false narrative?
Also why did the British government (and others) pass legislation to waive liability on potential injuries from the shots? Is that a false narrative too?
* My first two jags, if I'd taken them up would have been AstraZeneca's mRNA serum, by the way. Which you think is alright, even though a number of national governments do not.
Some of the common causes of death are in line with side effects listed in official documents. Mainly blood-related issues. However if there is a rise in deaths after the administration of the shots then that is a cause for alarm.
I have said above that I believe we do have some additional factors. Grinding people's sanity and very livelihood into the ground has killed in many cases. The doom-mongering itself in 2020 and 2021 killed people. Heart attacks, addictions, suicide, you name it. The sad thing is that there appears to have been a massive overeaction. Then there is the psychological damage which has been done to children, which will also take decades to unfold.
Every medication commercial will list the possible side effects. Even shows like SNL make fun of that. However, that's different than the claim you and others on the forum are making.
When trusting in God, there are no side effects. When someone is healed by a blessing or prayer, there are no side effects. When someone does not catch the disease to begin with, due to a healthy immune system from God, or following the Word of Wisdom, or even being under God's protection, there is never a side effect.
We were all born with an immune system. Big Pharma has caused some immune systems to be compromised or suppressed. Even so, there are MANY ways to receive God's protection. Have you even asked for it? Or did you just assume following satan was the way to go? Like most any good parent, a child's requests are granted simply for the asking. Millions, perhaps billions refuse to even ask. Asking is not a guarantee, but it is a start.
Fear of catching covid can in itself get you covid. Fear suppresses the immune system. It is a fact.
People that listen to a false prophet or lying Bishop or Stake President that requires a mask or promotes a shot, should have zero expectation of having God's protection. When a person has God's protection, one does not concern themselves with silliness.
- Robin Hood
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 13159
- Location: England
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
I think the problem is that most people in the UK seem to believe the only alternative to the NHS is the American system. But there are good models to emulate in Europe, especially places like Germany and the Scandinavian countries.Niemand wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 3:08 pmI agree. I don't want an American style health system but the entire thing is bloated. There is also the problem of PFI bleeding things dry. These lockdowns have also exposed weaknesses and crowbarred them open. I would also attribute some of it to the rising prices of medication and machinery. The himan element is gone. All our data being put online.Robin Hood wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 2:52 pm The NHS is finished.
It was always going to fail eventually.
The politicians carry some of the blame, but so do the practitioners. There is just so much waste.
A shame because there are some aspects of it which are admirable.
(I'll explain some of this to non-UK users on request.)
I found it interesting to learn that there is only one other country which has the same health service model as the UK, and that's Cuba.
Enough said.
- Niemand
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 14231
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Cuban healthcare seems to be one of the better aspects of their regime but it would still have to work on a slightly different model. For one, unlike here, there would be no private healthcare AFAIK and also their budgeting must be quite different due to their economy and population (11 mil. apparently.) The one thing to be taken from the Cubans, from what I hear, is that they place more emphasis on things like physiotherapy and so on, rather than the NHS which prefers to use overpriced medication. The Cubans also use some preventative and alternative treatment methods, which the NHS wouldn't touch. Cuba exports a lot of nurses and other medical staff, because a) a lot of Cubans wish to live elsewhere and b) Communist Cuba has always given military and medical aid to various Third World countries as part of its propaganda efforts (although less than it once did).Robin Hood wrote: ↑January 9th, 2023, 12:47 am I think the problem is that most people in the UK seem to believe the only alternative to the NHS is the American system. But there are good models to emulate in Europe, especially places like Germany and the Scandinavian countries.
I found it interesting to learn that there is only one other country which has the same health service model as the UK, and that's Cuba.
Enough said.
Scandinavia has very high taxation rates – worse than UK – so a lot of people would object to that.
German healthcare seems to be better run, but Germans tend to be better at running a lot of things, so I always wonder how much is transferable. The French system AFAIK is similar to the German, and also runs better.
I have a Spanish friend who has had a lot of recent experience with the NHS (long story), and she is not flattering about it. She says that she has found Spanish healthcare better. (She is from Madrid, mind you, not a small town.) One of her criticisms is that NHS staff are very dismissive of patients' own remarks until a serious problem arises. She also says waiting lists are far worse on the NHS.
I have some minor experience of Irish healthcare. A lot of the Irish people I've spoken to are very critical of it. As you would expect, most of it is centred on Dublin. If you happen to be out in the wilds of Kerry or Donegal then services are not so good. Apparently it's been very dependent on immigrant doctors, nurses etc for decades (much like the NHS). The Irish system is not a good one to emulate and they also export a lot of their severe cases to the UK.
There are numerous other systems which I know little about. I would be interested to know about Japan's but I suspect it's probably very expensive.
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- captain of 100
- Posts: 617
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Facts mean a lot but so many on this forum throw them out the window to uphold the narrative.The Red Pill wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 6:58 pmYou just dropped a ton of bread crumbs for Liahona to pick up...problem is. ..he doesn't want to pick them up. He's got his worldview and he's got all the time in the world to argue with us...but no time to further educate himself and learn something new.Lizzy60 wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:59 pmSo many people are dying at younger ages, life insurance companies are quietly adjusting their rates. Average life span used to be around 80, and it has now dropped through the 70’s into the high 60’s. In two years. This was a statistically impossible drop, even in times of war — it’s like having a 9-11 disaster loss every day, on top of “normal” death numbers, or a Vietnam war death rate every month, added to the normal rate of deaths.PeacefulProtests wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 5:27 pmJan 2010 - 26,952,000 disabledLiahona wrote: ↑January 8th, 2023, 4:33 pm
It's been a rising trend since the middle of 2010 (Obamacare roll out...actually giving people access to healthcare for once). Lockdowns prevented a lot of access to medical care and the ability to diagnose, which is why you see the downward trend in 2020. Removal of the lockdowns and people were able to get back to their lives...which is why you see the sharp increase.
"Clot shots" harming people is a FALSE narrative.
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Increase of 2.89 million over an 11 year period
Jan 2021 - 29,851,000 disabled
Dec 2022 - 32,874,000 disabled
Increase of 3.02 million over just a 2 year period
A few missed months of medical appointments and diagnoses doesn't explain an 11+ year increase in just a 2 year span. Its unheard of
Ed Dowd, a lifetime statistician who has connections with actuaries and morticians, has solid numbers on this phenomenon. Check out any of his interviews.
Here is another link to the Ed Dowd book. Will he read it? No he will not.
https://www.amazon.com/Cause-Epidemic-S ... 211&sr=8-2
I have met so many people like Liahona. They have all the "truth" they need. Not taking in anything more. Facts mean nothing, logic means nothing, reason means nothing. Truth is relative to them.
Let the fish go...
Cut the line...
I think the Church has done a great job at holding a centrist view while fringe groups separate themselves from it.
You see that in action happening here.
- Niemand
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 14231
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
Well it is a fact that you've dodged several questions about whether you have used other aliases on this forum.
It's also a fact that you question the church's LGBT+ policy but won't allow us to question something that relates to our own personal sovereignty.
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- captain of 100
- Posts: 617
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
I don’t need to be subjected to questioning like that. If you think I have aliases then take it up with the Creator. He can look at the IP addresses.Niemand wrote: ↑January 9th, 2023, 6:35 amWell it is a fact that you've dodged several questions about whether you have used other aliases on this forum.
It's also a fact that you question the church's LGBT+ policy but won't allow us to question something that relates to our own personal sovereignty.
Hint: I have none.
- Niemand
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 14231
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
I think you do need to be picked up on the obvious contradiction of you believing the church needs to have "dialogue" over the gay/trans issue, but that you don't think there should be one over medical ethics and/or any related authoritarian measures.Liahona wrote: ↑January 9th, 2023, 5:19 pmI don’t need to be subjected to questioning like that. If you think I have aliases then take it up with the Creator. He can look at the IP addresses.Niemand wrote: ↑January 9th, 2023, 6:35 amWell it is a fact that you've dodged several questions about whether you have used other aliases on this forum.
It's also a fact that you question the church's LGBT+ policy but won't allow us to question something that relates to our own personal sovereignty.
You say the church might be wrong about LGBT+, but happily follow its lines on shots, even though governments themselves ban some versions of them. Like the AstraZeneca that I was due to be pumped full of, in an appointment which I never agreed to.
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- captain of 100
- Posts: 617
Re: Deaths SPIKE by 163%
I think you’re conflating the two topics. I don’t view the LGBTQ+ debate as right or wrong but rather of understanding. Much like Blacks and the Priesthood, it will be sorted out.Niemand wrote: ↑January 9th, 2023, 5:24 pmI think you do need to be picked up on the obvious contradiction of you believing the church needs to have "dialogue" over the gay/trans issue, but that you don't think there should be one over medical ethics and/or any related authoritarian measures.Liahona wrote: ↑January 9th, 2023, 5:19 pmI don’t need to be subjected to questioning like that. If you think I have aliases then take it up with the Creator. He can look at the IP addresses.Niemand wrote: ↑January 9th, 2023, 6:35 amWell it is a fact that you've dodged several questions about whether you have used other aliases on this forum.
It's also a fact that you question the church's LGBT+ policy but won't allow us to question something that relates to our own personal sovereignty.
You say the church might be wrong about LGBT+, but happily follow its lines on shots, even though governments themselves ban some versions of them. Like the AstraZeneca that I was due to be pumped full of, in an appointment which I never agreed to.
I welcome debate over the shot. My stance is that the Church did nothing wrong in advising to recommend them. Church members still had the choice and could decide appropriately.
I had the shot. My family had the shot. Many of my ward members and friends had the shot. No issues.
If YOU don’t want the shot, I respect that. I have no problems with your choice. Perhaps respect mine?