Temple Recommend Question Number 7

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Luke
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Luke »

cab wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 6:11 am I don’t believe God told Joseph to marry 40 women. And I don't believe he did.
I don’t believe Joseph taught Brigham Young to marry 40 women. But he did.
1/4.

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iWriteStuff
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by iWriteStuff »

Mamabear wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 4:55 am The church is not honest or transparent at all and we should be interviewing them instead.

Also people need to stop putting their faith in objects. Garments, temples, tithing, temple recommends, etc. They associate their salvation with these things and it’s not healthy but superstitious.
FWIW, the day Joseph was killed at Carthage, he:

1) Wasn't wearing his garments.
2) Drank wine.
3) Shot at people using fire arms they smuggled in.
4) Yelled out Masonic signals in hopes his lodge brethren would save him.

It's interesting food for thought.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

Mindfields wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 5:58 am [Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?]

The leaders redefine teachings, practices, and doctrine, nearly everyday. This is their church not yours. Conform or get out. Your choice.
That’s what you get with a “living” church.

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Subcomandante
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Subcomandante »

ransomme wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 4:18 am
Subcomandante wrote: November 21st, 2022, 8:40 pm
LDS Physician wrote: November 21st, 2022, 6:32 pm "Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"


Can any of the 15 answer this in the negative after their declared support of the marriage act?


I've already had 2 members ask me this when I've read this question to them during recommend interviews.


It reminds me back in the day when I'd ask the (now changed) question which asked "Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"

Multiple members would ask me, "Do the Boy Scouts of America count?" Back when the BSA was wandering into LGBT realms.

This is getting ... uncomfortable.
They can answer in the affirmative even after declaring support for the act.

The reason for this is that they are not affirming that teaching within the bounds of the Church. The moment they do that, then they can answer in the negative.

The moment when any LDS Church official starts officiating in a same sex marriage ceremony within his calling (not as a clerk for example), is the moment which he commits an act of apostasy and he would be excommunicable.
The Church affiliated with the UN, various LGBTQ groups, and many other groups that conflict.
If you call working on different projects where there is common agreement (while recognizing differences) as an affiliation, then the Church has had MANY unsavory affiliations with people who you don't like very much. Now, guess which president of the Church started off these affiliations?

That's right. It was President Ezra Taft Benson. A shocker to be sure by many people on this forum, especially his rhetoric against these organisms in the 60s.

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ransomme
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by ransomme »

Subcomandante wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 7:28 am
ransomme wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 4:18 am
Subcomandante wrote: November 21st, 2022, 8:40 pm
LDS Physician wrote: November 21st, 2022, 6:32 pm "Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"


Can any of the 15 answer this in the negative after their declared support of the marriage act?


I've already had 2 members ask me this when I've read this question to them during recommend interviews.


It reminds me back in the day when I'd ask the (now changed) question which asked "Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"

Multiple members would ask me, "Do the Boy Scouts of America count?" Back when the BSA was wandering into LGBT realms.

This is getting ... uncomfortable.
They can answer in the affirmative even after declaring support for the act.

The reason for this is that they are not affirming that teaching within the bounds of the Church. The moment they do that, then they can answer in the negative.

The moment when any LDS Church official starts officiating in a same sex marriage ceremony within his calling (not as a clerk for example), is the moment which he commits an act of apostasy and he would be excommunicable.
The Church affiliated with the UN, various LGBTQ groups, and many other groups that conflict.
If you call working on different projects where there is common agreement (while recognizing differences) as an affiliation, then the Church has had MANY unsavory affiliations with people who you don't like very much. Now, guess which president of the Church started off these affiliations?

That's right. It was President Ezra Taft Benson. A shocker to be sure by many people on this forum, especially his rhetoric against these organisms in the 60s.
The common agreement they have with the UN is to use the Church to push political, social, and financial agendas like COVID shots, sustainability, etc.

So there is a huge problem there. The LGBTQ crap is selfish nonsense. The Church only cares about its institutional freedom, not about our individual freedoms. Before long their liberty-forfeiting agreements won't protect themselves either. They are very short-sighted.

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InfoWarrior82
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by InfoWarrior82 »

Yikes... The Q15 can't even get temple recommends...

I was told by my church leaders that having a temple recommend was something that lets me know I am worthy of the celestial kingdom. So... The Q15 aren't worthy of the celestial kingdom? Yikes.

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BenMcCrea
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by BenMcCrea »

p8riot wrote: November 21st, 2022, 7:26 pm
LDS Physician wrote: November 21st, 2022, 6:32 pm "Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"


Can any of the 15 answer this in the negative after their declared support of the marriage act?


I've already had 2 members ask me this when I've read this question to them during recommend interviews.


It reminds me back in the day when I'd ask the (now changed) question which asked "Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"

Multiple members would ask me, "Do the Boy Scouts of America count?" Back when the BSA was wandering into LGBT realms.

This is getting ... uncomfortable.
What exactly is "the doctrine of the church"?
🤔
Last edited by BenMcCrea on November 22nd, 2022, 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

Atrasado
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Atrasado »

Our response to that act is unconscionable. I would ask what's next, because I have no idea what will be the next betrayal. We are carefully being led down the path to hell and no one is doing anything about it? How can every general authority be on board with this?

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The Red Pill
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

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InfoWarrior82 wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 8:23 am Yikes... The Q15 can't even get temple recommends...

I was told by my church leaders that having a temple recommend was something that lets me know I am worthy of the celestial kingdom. So... The Q15 aren't worthy of the celestial kingdom? Yikes.
In their minds, they can always fall back on their "second endowment" (calling and election made sure)...which they annoint themselves with. Joseph Smith taught that this came from Christ directly.

The Mormon version of being saved.

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InfoWarrior82
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by InfoWarrior82 »

The Red Pill wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 9:35 am
InfoWarrior82 wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 8:23 am Yikes... The Q15 can't even get temple recommends...

I was told by my church leaders that having a temple recommend was something that lets me know I am worthy of the celestial kingdom. So... The Q15 aren't worthy of the celestial kingdom? Yikes.
In their minds, they can always fall back on their "second endowment" (calling and election made sure)...which they annoint themselves with. Joseph Smith taught that this came from Christ directly.

The Mormon version of being saved.


But that would infer that they know that they are doing wrong, but are excused.

Which would then ultimately be a perfect example of "do as I say, not as I do".


In my next temple interview, I'd love to answer when asked the question:

"Why yes, I do support doctrines, teachings, and practices contrary to what the church teaches!"

And asked with what...

"Gay marriage, silly!"


And we'll all laugh and move on to the next question.

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Fred
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Fred »

JandD6572 wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 3:33 am
Fred wrote: November 21st, 2022, 9:07 pm
LDS Physician wrote: November 21st, 2022, 6:32 pm "Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"

Can any of the 15 answer this in the negative after their declared support of the marriage act?

This is getting ... uncomfortable.
"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"
should be...
"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of Jesus Christ?"


No democrat on earth could answer this truthfully in the negative. It would not be possible for any Q15 to get a recommend unless they lied.

NONE of the things the church believes in are Christlike. If they were, they could not be democrats.

I had to explain to my daughter today the real reason the church keeps building temples even though membership is in a free fall. Temples are a cash cow. Buy 500 to a thousand acres of cheap land. Announce a temple. Build 500 high dollar homes on the cheap land surrounding the temple site. Profit a hundred grand on each home. Double that if they also provide financing. Rinse and Repeat.
Wait, they do that with the land around the temples?
Yes

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h_p
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by h_p »

Sunain wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 5:56 am I was looking at the updated GEDCOM 7.0.11 tech document the other day, which is used by the church for FamilySearch and noticed that everything is setup and ready for a future update for the church to record "the diversity of human family relationships". FamilySearch is already a joke with people linking people that aren't related to the family. Next, we're going to have people going back through the records and changing sexual orientations of people. "My great-great uncle Joey was gay!"
They've already done it:
famsearch.gif
famsearch.gif (13.29 KiB) Viewed 666 times

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Wolfwoman
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Wolfwoman »

For the first time that I know of, my husband was seriously disturbed by a statement the church put out. He said, "Why couldn't they have just said nothing? Why did they have to make a statement supporting it?" I agree with him, but I have been awake since 2014 or so when I first started reading Rock Waterman's blog and listening to talks by Denver Snuffer.

My husband said if they support a serious sin like homosexuality/gay marriage, then what's to stop them from supporting other serious sins, like abortion? Whatever "the law of the land" is, they will support??

Mamabear
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Mamabear »

iWriteStuff wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 7:16 am
Mamabear wrote:November 22nd, 2022, 4:55 am The church is not honest or transparent at all and we should be interviewing them instead.

Also people need to stop putting their faith in objects. Garments, temples, tithing, temple recommends, etc. They associate their salvation with these things and it’s not healthy but superstitious.
FWIW, the day Joseph was killed at Carthage, he:

1) Wasn't wearing his garments.
2) Drank wine.
3) Shot at people using fire arms they smuggled in.
4) Yelled out Masonic signals in hopes his lodge brethren would save him.

It's interesting food for thought.
Interesting.
I relate with the first two. I have yet to shoot at people or use masonry distress signals. :?

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InfoWarrior82
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by InfoWarrior82 »

Wolfwoman wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 12:25 pm For the first time that I know of, my husband was seriously disturbed by a statement the church put out. He said, "Why couldn't they have just said nothing? Why did they have to make a statement supporting it?" I agree with him, but I have been awake since 2014 or so when I first started reading Rock Waterman's blog and listening to talks by Denver Snuffer.

My husband said if they support a serious sin like homosexuality/gay marriage, then what's to stop them from supporting other serious sins, like abortion? Whatever "the law of the land" is, they will support??


This is why they had to come out and make a statement supporting it:

(Page 44)
https://wedocs.unep.org/bitstream/handl ... sAllowed=y
Archived here in case they take it down: (https://web.archive.org/web/20200517082 ... sAllowed=y)

17 "sustainable" development goals of Agenda 2030
https://www.stonewall.org.uk/system/files/sdg-guide.pdf


https://lgbtq.hkspublications.org/2020/ ... ell-being/


https://www.un.org/sustainabledevelopme ... /tag/lgbt/


https://health.gov/healthypeople/object ... tives/lgbt


https://mpactglobal.org/wp-content/uplo ... y-2017.pdf


https://inee.org/resources/sustainable- ... -inclusion


https://www.patientmetrx.com/2021/06/th ... inclusion/


https://static1.squarespace.com/static/ ... lusion.pdf

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iWriteStuff
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by iWriteStuff »

Mamabear wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 1:10 pm
iWriteStuff wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 7:16 am
Mamabear wrote:November 22nd, 2022, 4:55 am The church is not honest or transparent at all and we should be interviewing them instead.

Also people need to stop putting their faith in objects. Garments, temples, tithing, temple recommends, etc. They associate their salvation with these things and it’s not healthy but superstitious.
FWIW, the day Joseph was killed at Carthage, he:

1) Wasn't wearing his garments.
2) Drank wine.
3) Shot at people using fire arms they smuggled in.
4) Yelled out Masonic signals in hopes his lodge brethren would save him.

It's interesting food for thought.
Interesting.
I relate with the first two. I have yet to shoot at people or use masonry distress signals. :?
haha well let's hope you never do.

Just thought of another one:

5) He was a practicing polygamist.

That wouldn't align very well with the current TR questions either, but, well, the times they did a-change.

Mamabear
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Mamabear »

iWriteStuff wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 1:53 pm
Mamabear wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 1:10 pm
iWriteStuff wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 7:16 am
Mamabear wrote:November 22nd, 2022, 4:55 am The church is not honest or transparent at all and we should be interviewing them instead.

Also people need to stop putting their faith in objects. Garments, temples, tithing, temple recommends, etc. They associate their salvation with these things and it’s not healthy but superstitious.
FWIW, the day Joseph was killed at Carthage, he:

1) Wasn't wearing his garments.
2) Drank wine.
3) Shot at people using fire arms they smuggled in.
4) Yelled out Masonic signals in hopes his lodge brethren would save him.

It's interesting food for thought.
Interesting.
I relate with the first two. I have yet to shoot at people or use masonry distress signals. :?
haha well let's hope you never do.

Just thought of another one:

5) He was a practicing polygamist.

That wouldn't align very well with the current TR questions either, but, well, the times they did a-change.
They sure did. Joseph was a-marrying….
Was your “a” reference a coincidence or do you know? ;)

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Niemand
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Niemand »

Robin Hood wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 6:50 am
JandD6572 wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 3:33 am
Fred wrote: November 21st, 2022, 9:07 pm
LDS Physician wrote: November 21st, 2022, 6:32 pm "Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"

Can any of the 15 answer this in the negative after their declared support of the marriage act?

This is getting ... uncomfortable.
"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"
should be...
"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of Jesus Christ?"


No democrat on earth could answer this truthfully in the negative. It would not be possible for any Q15 to get a recommend unless they lied.

NONE of the things the church believes in are Christlike. If they were, they could not be democrats.

I had to explain to my daughter today the real reason the church keeps building temples even though membership is in a free fall. Temples are a cash cow. Buy 500 to a thousand acres of cheap land. Announce a temple. Build 500 high dollar homes on the cheap land surrounding the temple site. Profit a hundred grand on each home. Double that if they also provide financing. Rinse and Repeat.
Wait, they do that with the land around the temples?
They didn't here.
They didn't, but there are some very nice houses down the side of the Preston Temple. That said Chorley isn't a prime location for property.

It is, however, a much cleverer location than London's which seems to have been based on some GA's love of Gatwick airport.

The obvious development site for the Preston temple is the field behind the stake house. I believe the church owns it. But it is getting towards the motorway.

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Fred
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Fred »

Robin Hood wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 6:50 am
JandD6572 wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 3:33 am
Fred wrote: November 21st, 2022, 9:07 pm
LDS Physician wrote: November 21st, 2022, 6:32 pm "Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"

Can any of the 15 answer this in the negative after their declared support of the marriage act?

This is getting ... uncomfortable.
"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"
should be...
"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of Jesus Christ?"


No democrat on earth could answer this truthfully in the negative. It would not be possible for any Q15 to get a recommend unless they lied.

NONE of the things the church believes in are Christlike. If they were, they could not be democrats.

I had to explain to my daughter today the real reason the church keeps building temples even though membership is in a free fall. Temples are a cash cow. Buy 500 to a thousand acres of cheap land. Announce a temple. Build 500 high dollar homes on the cheap land surrounding the temple site. Profit a hundred grand on each home. Double that if they also provide financing. Rinse and Repeat.
Wait, they do that with the land around the temples?
They didn't here.
Depends on the location. They did it in Snowflake, Arizona. Not possible in Taylorsville, Utah as the temple site was an old chapel site that is already surrounded by homes. The proposed site near Tooele, Utah was moved due to residents protesting this very thing.

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pho·to·syn·the·sis
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by pho·to·syn·the·sis »

Now, guess which president of the Church started off these affiliations
Could you give an example of the foundations/ histories of these affiliations?

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Dusty Wanderer
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Dusty Wanderer »

"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"

Hadn't thought about this from the perspective of the OP. Rather than the typical introspection initiated by this question, for some, it's having the inverse effect, evaluating which of the Church's promoted teachings or policies fall short of their individual standards.

"Does the Church promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine that is contrary to those that are found in the standard works or that you have covenanted to live by?"

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Fred
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Fred »

Dusty Wanderer wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 8:19 pm "Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"

Hadn't thought about this from the perspective of the OP. Rather than the typical introspection initiated by this question, for some, it's having the inverse effect, evaluating which of the Church's promoted teachings or policies fall short of their individual standards.

"Does the Church promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine that is contrary to those that are found in the standard works or that you have covenanted to live by?"
There is that little thing about Ephraim's Drunkards that they either don't believe or misunderstand.

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ransomme
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by ransomme »

Fun fact, the 70s get their recommends with one signature from the first presidency. It also has no expiration date.

I imagine it's the same for the Q15. I wonder if they bother with the interview questions?

NowWhat
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by NowWhat »

They are bullies. Amen to the Priesthood of that man. Those men. Whatever.

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Robin Hood
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Re: Temple Recommend Question Number 7

Post by Robin Hood »

Niemand wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 5:38 pm
Robin Hood wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 6:50 am
JandD6572 wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 3:33 am
Fred wrote: November 21st, 2022, 9:07 pm

"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"
should be...
"Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of Jesus Christ?"


No democrat on earth could answer this truthfully in the negative. It would not be possible for any Q15 to get a recommend unless they lied.

NONE of the things the church believes in are Christlike. If they were, they could not be democrats.

I had to explain to my daughter today the real reason the church keeps building temples even though membership is in a free fall. Temples are a cash cow. Buy 500 to a thousand acres of cheap land. Announce a temple. Build 500 high dollar homes on the cheap land surrounding the temple site. Profit a hundred grand on each home. Double that if they also provide financing. Rinse and Repeat.
Wait, they do that with the land around the temples?
They didn't here.
They didn't, but there are some very nice houses down the side of the Preston Temple. That said Chorley isn't a prime location for property.

It is, however, a much cleverer location than London's which seems to have been based on some GA's love of Gatwick airport.

The obvious development site for the Preston temple is the field behind the stake house. I believe the church owns it. But it is getting towards the motorway.
The properties near the temple were already there. The temple site itself was earmarked for light industry/business park development, so there was a lot of opposition from the local authority initially. The church does own the field but it can't be developed for housing.

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