Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

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Joan7
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Joan7 »

Subcomandante wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:18 am
Kit-OTW wrote: November 20th, 2022, 6:45 pm
Kit-OTW wrote: November 19th, 2022, 5:24 pm Image
I posted this on my ward's Facebook page, because that is what the Spirit guided me to do. We will see how long it is up, and if I am expelled from the group. My brother is in the ward. I am sure this will upset many. We aren't supposed to ask hard questions, right? But, Jesus cast aside those false traditions, when He started making the church leaders very uncomfortable in His time. So, far they aren't crucifying those that believe God's word, but I expect that will change.

Very simple. No one outside the Church listened to the Church back then. The Church reiterated its doctrine in the recent statement. They just simply stated that there's no use fighting this anymore because all the nations are insistent on approving these things. They'll only fight it if any government tries to obligate them to do it. The simplest thing the Church would be able to do is to say that they no longer perform marriages in the temple, only sealings. That is down the pike. Not the ridiculous motion that the Church will support gay marriage in the temples and within the Church.

There is biblical precedent for this. Samuel told the Israelites that getting a king would lead them into captivity and fought the Israelites hard. But Israel was insistent on getting a king.

The Lord told Samuel to anoint a king, but also noted to Samuel, "They haven't rejected you. They have rejected Me." Israel wanted to be like everyone else around them.

It seems like, at least in the Gentile nations, the Church members want to be like everyone else around them, rather than obeying the commandments.

This statement reads more like "You guys asked for it, well, here it is! Don't ask us to change, because we won't."
That is not true, Sub. The leadership has been pushing the membership to be more accepting of gays since they allowed the first camel's nose into the tent by permitting leaders of scouts to be homosexual. We all saw where it went from there. They are, and have been charting a course that leads to destruction. They are the false leaders that Isaiah describes, who are dumb dogs, and filled with wine and wickedness.
I would like to point out that you are also accountable to God. Who's side are you on? Are you with God? Or are you with the Church leaders? Because they are not on the same team.

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Subcomandante
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

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Kit-OTW wrote: November 21st, 2022, 7:06 am
Subcomandante wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:18 am
Kit-OTW wrote: November 20th, 2022, 6:45 pm
Kit-OTW wrote: November 19th, 2022, 5:24 pm Image
I posted this on my ward's Facebook page, because that is what the Spirit guided me to do. We will see how long it is up, and if I am expelled from the group. My brother is in the ward. I am sure this will upset many. We aren't supposed to ask hard questions, right? But, Jesus cast aside those false traditions, when He started making the church leaders very uncomfortable in His time. So, far they aren't crucifying those that believe God's word, but I expect that will change.

Very simple. No one outside the Church listened to the Church back then. The Church reiterated its doctrine in the recent statement. They just simply stated that there's no use fighting this anymore because all the nations are insistent on approving these things. They'll only fight it if any government tries to obligate them to do it. The simplest thing the Church would be able to do is to say that they no longer perform marriages in the temple, only sealings. That is down the pike. Not the ridiculous motion that the Church will support gay marriage in the temples and within the Church.

There is biblical precedent for this. Samuel told the Israelites that getting a king would lead them into captivity and fought the Israelites hard. But Israel was insistent on getting a king.

The Lord told Samuel to anoint a king, but also noted to Samuel, "They haven't rejected you. They have rejected Me." Israel wanted to be like everyone else around them.

It seems like, at least in the Gentile nations, the Church members want to be like everyone else around them, rather than obeying the commandments.

This statement reads more like "You guys asked for it, well, here it is! Don't ask us to change, because we won't."
That is not true, Sub. The leadership has been pushing the membership to be more accepting of gays since they allowed the first camel's nose into the tent by permitting leaders of scouts to be homosexual. We all saw where it went from there. They are, and have been charting a course that leads to destruction. They are the false leaders that Isaiah describes, who are dumb dogs, and filled with wine and wickedness.
I would like to point out that you are also accountable to God. Who's side are you on? Are you with God? Or are you with the Church leaders? Because they are not on the same team.
I am with the Church leaders, and because I am with the Church leaders, I am with God.

The Church leaders have already set forth the precedent from God. It is not meet for the Church to continue fighting in the political realm given that each side has their own agenda to set forth. The Church leaders are operating from an area of global responsibility, not one localized to Utah or the Intermountain West.

This is something that is understood very well in Latin America.

An expression heard often here is "Haz lo que quieres" which roughly translated means "Do what you want." But anyone that understands the artifices of Spanish double entendre, like I do, as well as many people that have served missions in Spanish speaking countries, or has a spouse from Latin America or from Spain, will tell you that the expression really means "anything that happens now is on you, it would be better for you NOT to proceed. Because if you do so, [pobre de ti]".

Yesterday in Sunday school our teacher (who in years past was an Area Seventy and has an intimate knowledge of how the prophets do things), essentially said the exact same thing which I am mentioning here. God, when a people are about to be destroyed, generally leaves people to their own devices, withholding from them sacred revelations and allows other to teach unto them falsehoods. There's a reason why the Gentiles are going to be waxed.

One of my wife's other cousins, who was living in Utah with her American husband, now desire to live in Mexico, because they simply can't stand Utah.

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gkearney
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by gkearney »

The phase “Do what you want” has the same meaning in English in many contexts.

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gradles21
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by gradles21 »

Subcomandante wrote: November 21st, 2022, 7:19 am
Kit-OTW wrote: November 21st, 2022, 7:06 am
Subcomandante wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:18 am
Kit-OTW wrote: November 20th, 2022, 6:45 pm

I posted this on my ward's Facebook page, because that is what the Spirit guided me to do. We will see how long it is up, and if I am expelled from the group. My brother is in the ward. I am sure this will upset many. We aren't supposed to ask hard questions, right? But, Jesus cast aside those false traditions, when He started making the church leaders very uncomfortable in His time. So, far they aren't crucifying those that believe God's word, but I expect that will change.

Very simple. No one outside the Church listened to the Church back then. The Church reiterated its doctrine in the recent statement. They just simply stated that there's no use fighting this anymore because all the nations are insistent on approving these things. They'll only fight it if any government tries to obligate them to do it. The simplest thing the Church would be able to do is to say that they no longer perform marriages in the temple, only sealings. That is down the pike. Not the ridiculous motion that the Church will support gay marriage in the temples and within the Church.

There is biblical precedent for this. Samuel told the Israelites that getting a king would lead them into captivity and fought the Israelites hard. But Israel was insistent on getting a king.

The Lord told Samuel to anoint a king, but also noted to Samuel, "They haven't rejected you. They have rejected Me." Israel wanted to be like everyone else around them.

It seems like, at least in the Gentile nations, the Church members want to be like everyone else around them, rather than obeying the commandments.

This statement reads more like "You guys asked for it, well, here it is! Don't ask us to change, because we won't."
That is not true, Sub. The leadership has been pushing the membership to be more accepting of gays since they allowed the first camel's nose into the tent by permitting leaders of scouts to be homosexual. We all saw where it went from there. They are, and have been charting a course that leads to destruction. They are the false leaders that Isaiah describes, who are dumb dogs, and filled with wine and wickedness.
I would like to point out that you are also accountable to God. Who's side are you on? Are you with God? Or are you with the Church leaders? Because they are not on the same team.
The Church leaders have already set forth the precedent from God. It is not meet for the Church to continue fighting in the political realm given that each side has their own agenda to set forth.
If this was true then they simply should have said nothing, but instead they got involved in the political realm by supporting this bill. This whole thing boils down to church leadership saying If you can't beat them join them.

Joan7
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Joan7 »

In my view, the Church received a letter which contained, in part, this invitation:

3 Nephi 3:7 Or in other words, yield yourselves up unto us, and unite with us and become acquainted with our secret works, and become our brethren that ye may be like unto us—not our slaves, but our brethren and partners of all our substance.

Instead of being wise stewards, and gathering in all the righteous, with the flocks and herds against the day of battle, the leaders of the Church today, said "We yield!" They are willing to be a part of this new world, with the brainwashing of children in the evil sexual lifestyle, and everything that is perverted.

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tmac
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

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Kit-OTW wrote: November 21st, 2022, 7:53 am In my view, the Church received a letter which contained, in part, this invitation:

3 Nephi 3:7 Or in other words, yield yourselves up unto us, and unite with us and become acquainted with our secret works, and become our brethren that ye may be like unto us—not our slaves, but our brethren and partners of all our substance.

Instead of being wise stewards, and gathering in all the righteous, with the flocks and herds against the day of battle, the leaders of the Church today, said "We yield!" They are willing to be a part of this new world, with the brainwashing of children in the evil sexual lifestyle, and everything that is perverted.
You are absolutely right. Instead of standing up and apart and being willing to be separate from the World, the Church and the vast majority of its membership have simply yielded, rolled-over, and are going along to get along. This is just one of many, many ways that they have expressed and demonstrated willingness to be part of "this New World." This is just the latest, and seemingly most egregious. What evidence is there that this has anything to do with God?

We reap what we sow. By their fruits ye shall know them.

anonymous91
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by anonymous91 »

So we've gone from apostasy & ex-communication for those who live an openly homosexual lifestyle

to it's a serious transgression, but no longer considered apostasy (no excommunication).

"Instead, the changes reflect the continuing revelation that has been a part of the modern Church since the Restoration."

“These policy changes come after an extended period of counseling with our brethren in the Quorum the Twelve Apostles after fervent, united prayer to understand the will of the Lord,” wrote President Russell M. Nelson and his counselors in the First Presidency, President Oaks and President Henry B. Eyring, in the statement."

- https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/chu ... s?lang=eng

To now stating:

"We are grateful for the continuing efforts of those who work to ensure the Respect for Marriage Act includes appropriate religious freedom protections while respecting the law and preserving the rights of our LGBTQ brothers and sisters.

We believe this approach is the way forward. As we work together to preserve the principles and practices of religious freedom together with the rights of LGBTQ individuals, much can be accomplished to heal relationships and foster greater understanding."

If this goes through, then the church will not be able to discipline anyone that is in a "legal marriage" since their sins are now being protected by a corrupt government and recognized and acknowledged by so-called prophets.

The next step is that legal same-sex marriage couples will use this as a battering ram to get their temple recommendations, just as any other married couple can now do. There won't be any reason that the church can stop them now. While marriage is an option in the temple, they'll take advantage of that too.

However, there is nothing we should worry about, Right? SMH

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The Red Pill
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

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anonymous91 wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:18 am
The next step is that legal same-sex marriage couples will use this as a battering ram to get their temple recommendations, just as any other married couple can now do. There won't be any reason that the church can stop them now. While marriage is an option in the temple, they'll take advantage of that too.
Given the complete 180 degree shift from the Proclamation to the World, the pre-2010 Handbook of Instruction, the scriptures and what Christians have known for thousands of years...

...I would say with the current Q15...your conclusions reached are a intended FEATURE (they intended) and not a flaw...from their perspective.

They gotta live up to Isaiah’s "drunkards of Ephraim" you know...

spiritMan
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by spiritMan »

The Red Pill wrote: November 21st, 2022, 11:21 am
anonymous91 wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:18 am
The next step is that legal same-sex marriage couples will use this as a battering ram to get their temple recommendations, just as any other married couple can now do. There won't be any reason that the church can stop them now. While marriage is an option in the temple, they'll take advantage of that too.
Given the complete 180 degree shift from the Proclamation to the World, the pre-2010 Handbook of Instruction, the scriptures and what Christians have known for thousands of years...

...I would say with the current Q15...your conclusions reached are a intended FEATURE (they intended) and not a flaw...from their perspective.

They gotta live up to Isaiah’s "drunkards of Ephraim" you know...
And yet the TBMs are just like sub. This isn't really a change. They just did this for political reasons. The doctrine really, really, really hasn't changed.

When I was raising the warning flag many years ago about the Church allowing openly homosexual to id. as such with no consequences, I was told the same thing. It's not that big of a deal-the doctrine hasn't really, really changed.

And today we have missionaries who have dated, kissed, been romantically involved with the same-sex prior to their missions, openly promote it, proclaim it was of god, there is no need to repent and they are protected by Mission Presidents.

Tell me again how it hasn't "changed".

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SempiternalHarbinger
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by SempiternalHarbinger »

No, Jason Whitlock, the church has sold out to the devil himself.

Christianlee
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Christianlee »

They apparently are giving up on converting religious conservatives. This is a big unforced error. Just shut up..

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The Red Pill
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by The Red Pill »

TBM Church members reacting to the Q15 (golden calf) announcement of supporting gay marriage bill...

Idols can change.
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pho·to·syn·the·sis
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by pho·to·syn·the·sis »

It is not meet for the Church to continue fighting in the political realm given that each side has their own agenda to set forth.
Then why make a public endorsement at all?

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Dusty Wanderer
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Dusty Wanderer »

Lizzy60 wrote: November 19th, 2022, 11:41 am Instead of dredging up one of the old LGBTQ threads, I will just leave this tidbit here.

The Washington DC Gay Men’s Choir will be singing again at the Temple Visitor’s Center of the Washington DC Temple. Because we all love a good wholesome choir. Because there are so few musical groups in the area to fill the calendar. Because we need to virtue signal.
Were all the other choirs booked already? You know, the ones not vainly using God as a vehicle to broadcast their sexual fetishes and perversions.

If virtue signaling the cool kids club just for publicity sake was all they were after, they could’ve had any number of all-black choirs come, or even better all-black women’s choir (tons of diverse options in DC). Nah, they carefully chose what they exactly wanted.

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h_p
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by h_p »

pho·to·syn·the·sis wrote: November 21st, 2022, 3:53 pm
It is not meet for the Church to continue fighting in the political realm given that each side has their own agenda to set forth.
Then why make a public endorsement at all?
The one question none of the TBMs can ever seem to answer. I'm not sure they can even hear it being asked.

Serragon
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Serragon »

Subcomandante wrote: November 21st, 2022, 7:19 am
I am with the Church leaders, and because I am with the Church leaders, I am with God.
This really is it in a nutshell. No search for truth. Instead, a blind faith in the institution as a proxy for God. If you come at it from this perspective, then all you do is find reasons why God wants this to be instead of finding out what Gods actually wants. And since you never actually measure your belief against any objective standard, you are unaware just how ridiculous some of your explanations end up being.

I know many like this. The church is their real foundation, not Christ.

Christianlee
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Christianlee »

Look up Aaron Sherinian’s feed on Twitter. All you need to know about where the LDS Church is headed.

https://www.deseretmanagement.com/execu ... -sherinian

Letfreedumbring
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Letfreedumbring »

Subcomandante wrote: November 21st, 2022, 7:19 am
Yesterday in Sunday school our teacher (who in years past was an Area Seventy and has an intimate knowledge of how the prophets do things), essentially said the exact same thing which I am mentioning here. God, when a people are about to be destroyed, generally leaves people to their own devices, withholding from them sacred revelations and allows other to teach unto them falsehoods. There's a reason why the Gentiles are going to be waxed.
If only there was a higher source that we could compare to, to know if God would do the same things that the prophets do. When Jesus was asked about something he did not want to go along with, he remained silent and drew in the sand with his finger. He did not announce his support for a stoning campaign. (John 8:3-6)

This is the whole problem with having an institution as the gateway to or placeholder of God. We can know these things. All we care about is the actions of God not of men not of what we think men of God think they are doing.

When "this is the way it is has always been" thinking sets in then we have given ourselves and our agency over to the traditions of our fathers which is exactly what Satan wants as it is the easiest way to control people. If that wasn't even enough irony for the day here is more sweet irony to be tasted.

https://www.thechurchnews.com/1989/2/4/ ... -and-truth

Christianlee
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Christianlee »

Dusty Wanderer wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:29 pm
Lizzy60 wrote: November 19th, 2022, 11:41 am Instead of dredging up one of the old LGBTQ threads, I will just leave this tidbit here.

The Washington DC Gay Men’s Choir will be singing again at the Temple Visitor’s Center of the Washington DC Temple. Because we all love a good wholesome choir. Because there are so few musical groups in the area to fill the calendar. Because we need to virtue signal.
Were all the other choirs booked already? You know, the ones not vainly using God as a vehicle to broadcast their sexual fetishes and perversions.

If virtue signaling the cool kids club just for publicity sake was all they were after, they could’ve had any number of all-black choirs come, or even better all-black women’s choir (tons of diverse options in DC). Nah, they carefully chose what they exactly wanted.
This doesn’t seem to be the gay choir’s first appearance at the D.C Temple. Aaron Sherinian on Twitter was praising an appearance last April. They are regulars.

Christianlee
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Christianlee »

Sometimes I think the younger members are jost poking the eyes out of the baby boomers and older. Is RMN running the church or just some millennials in the background?

Lizzy60
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Lizzy60 »

Christianlee wrote: November 21st, 2022, 5:40 pm
Dusty Wanderer wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:29 pm
Lizzy60 wrote: November 19th, 2022, 11:41 am Instead of dredging up one of the old LGBTQ threads, I will just leave this tidbit here.

The Washington DC Gay Men’s Choir will be singing again at the Temple Visitor’s Center of the Washington DC Temple. Because we all love a good wholesome choir. Because there are so few musical groups in the area to fill the calendar. Because we need to virtue signal.
Were all the other choirs booked already? You know, the ones not vainly using God as a vehicle to broadcast their sexual fetishes and perversions.

If virtue signaling the cool kids club just for publicity sake was all they were after, they could’ve had any number of all-black choirs come, or even better all-black women’s choir (tons of diverse options in DC). Nah, they carefully chose what they exactly wanted.
This doesn’t seem to be the gay choir’s first appearance at the D.C Temple. Aaron Sherinian on Twitter was praising an appearance last April. They are regulars.
They performed a Christmas concert a few years ago, then it was shut down for covid.

Christianlee
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Christianlee »

Lizzy60 wrote: November 21st, 2022, 6:50 pm
Christianlee wrote: November 21st, 2022, 5:40 pm
Dusty Wanderer wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:29 pm
Lizzy60 wrote: November 19th, 2022, 11:41 am Instead of dredging up one of the old LGBTQ threads, I will just leave this tidbit here.

The Washington DC Gay Men’s Choir will be singing again at the Temple Visitor’s Center of the Washington DC Temple. Because we all love a good wholesome choir. Because there are so few musical groups in the area to fill the calendar. Because we need to virtue signal.
Were all the other choirs booked already? You know, the ones not vainly using God as a vehicle to broadcast their sexual fetishes and perversions.

If virtue signaling the cool kids club just for publicity sake was all they were after, they could’ve had any number of all-black choirs come, or even better all-black women’s choir (tons of diverse options in DC). Nah, they carefully chose what they exactly wanted.
This doesn’t seem to be the gay choir’s first appearance at the D.C Temple. Aaron Sherinian on Twitter was praising an appearance last April. They are regulars.
They performed a Christmas concert a few years ago, then it was shut down for covid.
I really don’t get it. What does the Church gain from all of this gay pandering? There has to be an angle. Are they just worried about their ESG score?

NowWhat
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by NowWhat »

I waited for something to be said about this, Sunday, and...crickets--from the podium and the people. No one was freaking out, concerned, or even conversing about it. Anything from the Q15 goes. Instead, I heard three fun references to Disneyland and Disney movies, from the pulpit. Hello? Disney? Really? I give up.

Letfreedumbring
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Letfreedumbring »

NowWhat wrote: November 21st, 2022, 8:08 pm I waited for something to be said about this, Sunday, and...crickets--from the podium and the people. No one was freaking out, concerned, or even conversing about it. Anything from the Q15 goes. Instead, I heard three fun references to Disneyland and Disney movies, from the pulpit. Hello? Disney? Really? I give up.
The desensitization is complete. You can literally tell mormons (used in keeping with the victory for satan) anything these days and whatever the current guy says goes.

Christianlee
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Re: Official Church statement: Respect for Marriage Act

Post by Christianlee »

I have faith that at some point Jesus will intervene to destroy Satan's plan. It will be dramatic.

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