Utah land for sale?
- marc
- Disciple of Jesus Christ
- Posts: 10353
- Contact:
Utah land for sale?
Is it better for the federal government to own 63% of Utah land or to sell it? Mike Lee is pushing to require the federal government to sell it. Is it a right or wrong issue?
Two links to consider:
https://www.kuer.org/politics-governmen ... or-housing
https://www.lee.senate.gov/issue-lands
Two links to consider:
https://www.kuer.org/politics-governmen ... or-housing
https://www.lee.senate.gov/issue-lands
- Fred
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7611
- Location: Zion
Re: Utah land for sale?
The government is not supposed to own ANY land except 10 square miles in DC. Even military bases and ports are to be leased from private citizens.
- gradles21
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1326
- Location: Weimar
Re: Utah land for sale?
As a hunter I think this is bad, I would like it to remain in in the federal gov't's hands.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 146
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 703
Re: Utah land for sale?
Having lived where there is no public land, I’m against selling off the current inventory. Once there is no public land then we are surfs(well, more than currently). No public beach, trails, camps, rivers, mountains……..pay to play, or, do as you’re told and eat your broth
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 166
Re: Utah land for sale?
Here's the deal:
Federal government should give ~20% of land surrounding any city or town in Utah to cities and towns that land surrounds.
Cities and towns agree that if that land is ever resold 60% of the sale will go to the federal government.
Cities and towns can develop it for public use or sell to local private developers. That would create an economic boom in many areas.
I will say the reason we like federal land in Utah (generally) is there's so much of it, no one can adequately police it and tell you what to do on it. You're not mountain biking and off roading, shooting etc. in most states like you can in Utah.
It would be wise to keep this benefit to some degree and the above idea does that.
Federal government should give ~20% of land surrounding any city or town in Utah to cities and towns that land surrounds.
Cities and towns agree that if that land is ever resold 60% of the sale will go to the federal government.
Cities and towns can develop it for public use or sell to local private developers. That would create an economic boom in many areas.
I will say the reason we like federal land in Utah (generally) is there's so much of it, no one can adequately police it and tell you what to do on it. You're not mountain biking and off roading, shooting etc. in most states like you can in Utah.
It would be wise to keep this benefit to some degree and the above idea does that.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 330
Re: Utah land for sale?
As someone who believes in the sacred nature of animals and abhors hunting I believe that hunting should be banned on public land [MODERATOR EDIT].
- Fred
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7611
- Location: Zion
Re: Utah land for sale?
This is the very limited power given to Congress in the Constitution:
“To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such district (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings” (Art I, Sect. 8, Clause 17)
Only satanists approve of National Parks. Anytime the government claims to own land, we need 50 Ammon Bundys to show them the error of their thinking. The land in Utah belongs to Utah. The constitution does not prevent a state from owning land. But if a fed comes around claiming to own or control even an inch of land, he should be lynched.
“To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such district (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings” (Art I, Sect. 8, Clause 17)
Only satanists approve of National Parks. Anytime the government claims to own land, we need 50 Ammon Bundys to show them the error of their thinking. The land in Utah belongs to Utah. The constitution does not prevent a state from owning land. But if a fed comes around claiming to own or control even an inch of land, he should be lynched.
- gradles21
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1326
- Location: Weimar
Re: Utah land for sale?
Lol762X545 wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 6:32 pmAs someone who believes in the sacred nature of animals and abhors hunting I believe that hunting should be banned on public land. I also believe that if you choose to hunt you should be required to kill yourself if you aren't successful in your hunt. Come home empty handed? Save the last round for yourself.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 703
Re: Utah land for sale?
Ignorant much?762X545 wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 6:32 pmAs someone who believes in the sacred nature of animals and abhors hunting I believe that hunting should be banned on public land. I also believe that if you choose to hunt you should be required to kill yourself if you aren't successful in your hunt. Come home empty handed? Save the last round for yourself.
- mudflap
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 3227
- Location: The South
- Contact:
Re: Utah land for sale?
I guess there's not a hell deep enough for Hezekiah, then, is there:762X545 wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 6:32 pmAs someone who believes in the sacred nature of animals and abhors hunting I believe that hunting should be banned on public land. I also believe that if you choose to hunt you should be required to kill yourself if you aren't successful in your hunt. Come home empty handed? Save the last round for yourself.
nothing wrong with hunting animals for food, and even learning how to become good at it. I have problems with sport hunting, OTOH.2 Chron 30:24 For Hezekiah king of Judah did give to the congregation a thousand bullocks and seven thousand sheep; and the princes gave to the congregation a thousand bullocks and ten thousand sheep: and a great number of priests sanctified themselves.
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 2324
- Location: Behind the Zion Curtain
Re: Utah land for sale?
Public land is a national treasure that allows the average citizen recreational opportunities with little cost. Why would anybody in their right mind want to give up this unique opportunity.marc wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 1:42 pm Is it better for the federal government to own 63% of Utah land or to sell it? Mike Lee is pushing to require the federal government to sell it. Is it a right or wrong issue?
Two links to consider:
https://www.kuer.org/politics-governmen ... or-housing
https://www.lee.senate.gov/issue-lands
- iWriteStuff
- blithering blabbermouth
- Posts: 5523
- Location: Sinope
- Contact:
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 2324
- Location: Behind the Zion Curtain
Re: Utah land for sale?
762x545 why did God give us incisors?762X545 wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 6:32 pmAs someone who believes in the sacred nature of animals and abhors hunting I believe that hunting should be banned on public land. I also believe that if you choose to hunt you should be required to kill yourself if you aren't successful in your hunt. Come home empty handed? Save the last round for yourself.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 836
Re: Utah land for sale?
I hope this is a joke. The animals slaughtered and sold at grocery stores have far worse lives than the deer who lives a long happy life before its killed. Hunting is far more humane than mass production slaughterhouses/meat farms.762X545 wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 6:32 pmAs someone who believes in the sacred nature of animals and abhors hunting I believe that hunting should be banned on public land. I also believe that if you choose to hunt you should be required to kill yourself if you aren't successful in your hunt. Come home empty handed? Save the last round for yourself.
- Fred
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7611
- Location: Zion
Re: Utah land for sale?
The federal government is not authorized to own land. It is unconstitutional. They have two jobs only:
1. Defense against invasion
2. Make sure that none of our rights are violated.
Everything else is delegated to the states.
What possible advantage could there be to federally owned land versus state owned land? NONE.
- Fred
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7611
- Location: Zion
Re: Utah land for sale?
Only those of us that love God and hate satan. There is absolutely zero legitimate reason for the feds to own land. You must be a communist if you want the federal government to own land. That is not in their authority. Land ownership of the state is the answer, where local people decide what to do with it. Any fed that wants the feds to own land is too evil to even describe.Vision wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 8:59 amPublic land is a national treasure that allows the average citizen recreational opportunities with little cost. Why would anybody in their right mind want to give up this unique opportunity.marc wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 1:42 pm Is it better for the federal government to own 63% of Utah land or to sell it? Mike Lee is pushing to require the federal government to sell it. Is it a right or wrong issue?
Two links to consider:
https://www.kuer.org/politics-governmen ... or-housing
https://www.lee.senate.gov/issue-lands
- gradles21
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1326
- Location: Weimar
Re: Utah land for sale?
The problem from my perspective is that as soon as the land is acquired by the state, that land is then able to be sold to private individuals and then commercialized, which is what Mike Lee wants. As long as the land remains public I don't really care who owns it, the state or the federal government.Fred wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:08 amThe federal government is not authorized to own land. It is unconstitutional. They have two jobs only:
1. Defense against invasion
2. Make sure that none of our rights are violated.
Everything else is delegated to the states.
What possible advantage could there be to federally owned land versus state owned land? NONE.
- iWriteStuff
- blithering blabbermouth
- Posts: 5523
- Location: Sinope
- Contact:
Re: Utah land for sale?
What if LDS Corp bought it and built a string of mini temples and girls camps on it?gradles21 wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:19 amThe problem from my perspective is that as soon as the land is acquired by the state, that land is then able to be sold to private individuals and then commercialized, which is what Mike Lee wants. As long as the land remains public I don't really care who owns it, the state or the federal government.Fred wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:08 amThe federal government is not authorized to own land. It is unconstitutional. They have two jobs only:
1. Defense against invasion
2. Make sure that none of our rights are violated.
Everything else is delegated to the states.
What possible advantage could there be to federally owned land versus state owned land? NONE.
- gradles21
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1326
- Location: Weimar
Re: Utah land for sale?
iWriteStuff wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:41 amWhat if LDS Corp bought it and built a string of mini temples and girls camps on it?gradles21 wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:19 amThe problem from my perspective is that as soon as the land is acquired by the state, that land is then able to be sold to private individuals and then commercialized, which is what Mike Lee wants. As long as the land remains public I don't really care who owns it, the state or the federal government.Fred wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:08 amThe federal government is not authorized to own land. It is unconstitutional. They have two jobs only:
1. Defense against invasion
2. Make sure that none of our rights are violated.
Everything else is delegated to the states.
What possible advantage could there be to federally owned land versus state owned land? NONE.
- mudflap
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 3227
- Location: The South
- Contact:
Re: Utah land for sale?
well................ I don't know:iWriteStuff wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 9:07 am I wouldn’t live in Utah if they were giving the land away for free
any of these would do me fine:
https://goo.gl/maps/pFoYrABnd9xYwz4y5
https://goo.gl/maps/8rEYiV7ws4GYHVRU9
https://goo.gl/maps/p4Zf1Qj3r72tYEFU8
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 2324
- Location: Behind the Zion Curtain
Re: Utah land for sale?
I can't imagine the bounteous blessing you get for loving God so much.Fred wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:12 amOnly those of us that love God and hate satan. There is absolutely zero legitimate reason for the feds to own land. You must be a communist if you want the federal government to own land. That is not in their authority. Land ownership of the state is the answer, where local people decide what to do with it. Any fed that wants the feds to own land is too evil to even describe.Vision wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 8:59 amPublic land is a national treasure that allows the average citizen recreational opportunities with little cost. Why would anybody in their right mind want to give up this unique opportunity.marc wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 1:42 pm Is it better for the federal government to own 63% of Utah land or to sell it? Mike Lee is pushing to require the federal government to sell it. Is it a right or wrong issue?
Two links to consider:
https://www.kuer.org/politics-governmen ... or-housing
https://www.lee.senate.gov/issue-lands
- Fred
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7611
- Location: Zion
Re: Utah land for sale?
I find it hard to believe myself, sometimes.Vision wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 6:00 pmI can't imagine the bounteous blessing you get for loving God so much.Fred wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:12 amOnly those of us that love God and hate satan. There is absolutely zero legitimate reason for the feds to own land. You must be a communist if you want the federal government to own land. That is not in their authority. Land ownership of the state is the answer, where local people decide what to do with it. Any fed that wants the feds to own land is too evil to even describe.Vision wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 8:59 amPublic land is a national treasure that allows the average citizen recreational opportunities with little cost. Why would anybody in their right mind want to give up this unique opportunity.marc wrote: ↑November 9th, 2022, 1:42 pm Is it better for the federal government to own 63% of Utah land or to sell it? Mike Lee is pushing to require the federal government to sell it. Is it a right or wrong issue?
Two links to consider:
https://www.kuer.org/politics-governmen ... or-housing
https://www.lee.senate.gov/issue-lands
- tmac
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 4526
- Location: Reality
Re: Utah land for sale?
Whether because of out-sized love for God or other reasons, there is no legitimate justification for the federal government to own and control this land. How is it not Marxist socialism? It should be transferred to the state, and if even half of it were sold into private ownership with millions of acres still remaining in state ownership there would still be more than ample “public lands” for hunting, hiking, camping, recreation, etc. There is no legitimate justification for 75%+ public land.
But sadly, the LDS Church, Bill Gates, and the Chinese, are some of the other largest landowners in the U.S.
But sadly, the LDS Church, Bill Gates, and the Chinese, are some of the other largest landowners in the U.S.
- harakim
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 2819
- Location: Salt Lake Megalopolis
Re: Utah land for sale?
I agree with this to some degree. Maybe the federal government shouldn't own it, but turning it over to their corporate lackeys is not a good solution. If they could be turned over to some kind of trust that could preserve the land that needs preserving, that would be better. I used to work fairly closely with Utah land developers and to a large degree, they are dangerous people with no conception of right and wrong. Turning over the land to them is just turning it back over to the gads. From one gad to another. At least the federal government is somewhat accountable. There is almost no accountability for private property.gradles21 wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:19 amThe problem from my perspective is that as soon as the land is acquired by the state, that land is then able to be sold to private individuals and then commercialized, which is what Mike Lee wants. As long as the land remains public I don't really care who owns it, the state or the federal government.Fred wrote: ↑November 10th, 2022, 11:08 amThe federal government is not authorized to own land. It is unconstitutional. They have two jobs only:
1. Defense against invasion
2. Make sure that none of our rights are violated.
Everything else is delegated to the states.
What possible advantage could there be to federally owned land versus state owned land? NONE.
It's a rock and a hard place, but I am sure there's a viable solution involving the, uh, free(?) market. (It's pretty hard to call it a free market when the main source of income last year was government handouts.)