Plus, we literally have Abraham and Book of Mormon prophets using seer stones to receive revelation. Didn't Aaron use them, too? What's the difference whether a hat was used or not?Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:21 pmWhy is the difference whether or not it's used as a means of revelation?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:07 pmDid he use it to receive revelation from God? When God spoke to Moses, did He speak through the stick?Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:05 pmWhy did Moses use a stick to split oceans and make water emerge from rocks?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 3:52 pm
So after poop cakes and poor sleep, what was the medium for receiving the revelation?
People using objects for "supernatural" purposes is the same across the board.
Book of Mormon questions
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
I’m not sure I follow you there.Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:21 pmWhy is the difference whether or not it's used as a means of revelation?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:07 pmDid he use it to receive revelation from God? When God spoke to Moses, did He speak through the stick?Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:05 pmWhy did Moses use a stick to split oceans and make water emerge from rocks?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 3:52 pm
So after poop cakes and poor sleep, what was the medium for receiving the revelation?
People using objects for "supernatural" purposes is the same across the board.
Literally no one in the history of inspired scriptures has used a rock as a medium for the verbatim revelation of a lengthy history of an ancient people. Not Moses, not Ezekiel, not Isaiah, not even Mohammed or Buddha.
On literally every occasion, the medium of revelation has been the voice of God, an Angel, the Spirit, or some kind of divine presence. Not rocks.
Points if you can prove otherwise.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Other than sources Joseph wrote himself, point me to any other 1000 year, 500+ page history written solely off words magically appearing on the surface of a black and brown rock.LDS Watchman wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:30 pmPlus, we literally have Abraham and Book of Mormon prophets using seer stones to receive revelation. Didn't Aaron use them, too? What's the difference whether a hat was used or not?Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:21 pmWhy is the difference whether or not it's used as a means of revelation?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:07 pmDid he use it to receive revelation from God? When God spoke to Moses, did He speak through the stick?
People using objects for "supernatural" purposes is the same across the board.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Sidney Rigdon received the manuscript, but enlisted help getting it published.iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:38 pmI’m not sure I follow you there.Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:21 pmWhy is the difference whether or not it's used as a means of revelation?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:07 pmDid he use it to receive revelation from God? When God spoke to Moses, did He speak through the stick?
People using objects for "supernatural" purposes is the same across the board.
Literally no one in the history of inspired scriptures has used a rock as a medium for the verbatim revelation of a lengthy history of an ancient people. Not Moses, not Ezekiel, not Isaiah, not even Mohammed or Buddha.
On literally every occasion, the medium of revelation has been the voice of God, an Angel, the Spirit, or some kind of divine presence. Not rocks.
Points if you can prove otherwise.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 3:52 pmSo after poop cakes and poor sleep, what was the medium for receiving the revelation?Niemand wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 3:47 pmEzekiel 4 tells us the prophet had to eat cakes made out of human excrement and lie on one side for 390 days.iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 3:21 pmCan you think of any prophets in the OT or NT who literally pulled their revelation out of a rock in a hat?blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 1:01 pm I wish the church wasn't so afraid and ashamed of such things to the world. It would be a wonderful thing if youth were taught the significance and beauty in such things and to seek such gifts rather than continue to set such pathetically low spiritual expectations for them.
Look at how they are taught to give priesthood healing blessings......"We sure hope you can be patient and comfortable, and trust the doctors to work it all out for you".... That requires no real faith and no priesthood power.
The translation narrative that shifted over time from the Urrim and Thummim, to "it just came through revelation", to finally admitting to the seer stone and the hat. Why are we so afraid to teach that God does supernatural things, including the use of crystals and stones?
Makes Joseph Smith look tame by comparison.
Translating papyri? I mean poopyri?
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Obviously that's not possible, but the Old Testament clearly shows that the Urim and Thumim stones were used to receive revelation anciently.iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:40 pmOther than sources Joseph wrote himself, point me to any other 1000 year, 500+ page history written solely off words magically appearing on the surface of a black and brown rock.LDS Watchman wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:30 pmPlus, we literally have Abraham and Book of Mormon prophets using seer stones to receive revelation. Didn't Aaron use them, too? What's the difference whether a hat was used or not?Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:21 pmWhy is the difference whether or not it's used as a means of revelation?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:07 pm
Did he use it to receive revelation from God? When God spoke to Moses, did He speak through the stick?
People using objects for "supernatural" purposes is the same across the board.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
I seem to remember writing appearing on a wall in the king's palace. I seem to remember God himself writing (supernaturally) upon stone tablets for Moses. (Then why not on a small stone in a hat.) I seem to remember wool that was dry when there was dew on the ground and wet when the ground was dry. Revelation in the NT says that all who inherit the celestial glory receive a special white stone with a new name written on it. I'm not sure why you seem to want to put God in your own, tiny little box. He uses supernatural means to reveal his will quite frequently. I wonder what you think of the Ark of the Covenant?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:40 pmOther than sources Joseph wrote himself, point me to any other 1000 year, 500+ page history written solely off words magically appearing on the surface of a black and brown rock.LDS Watchman wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:30 pmPlus, we literally have Abraham and Book of Mormon prophets using seer stones to receive revelation. Didn't Aaron use them, too? What's the difference whether a hat was used or not?Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:21 pmWhy is the difference whether or not it's used as a means of revelation?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:07 pm
Did he use it to receive revelation from God? When God spoke to Moses, did He speak through the stick?
People using objects for "supernatural" purposes is the same across the board.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
I suppose anyone who finds such things ridiculous would likewise question nearly every other miraculous element of the scriptures. Parted the Red Sea? Rose from the dead? Sounds ridiculous!
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
I’m asking you to evaluate the claims of the translation method and ask why the church isn’t more forthcoming about it.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:58 pmI seem to remember writing appearing on a wall in the king's palace. I seem to remember God himself writing (supernaturally) upon stone tablets for Moses. (Then why not on a small stone in a hat.) I seem to remember wool that was dry when there was dew on the ground and wet when the ground was dry. Revelation in the NT says that all who inherit the celestial glory receive a special white stone with a new name written on it. I'm not sure why you seem to want to put God in your own, tiny little box. He uses supernatural means to reveal his will quite frequently. I wonder what you think of the Ark of the Covenant?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:40 pmOther than sources Joseph wrote himself, point me to any other 1000 year, 500+ page history written solely off words magically appearing on the surface of a black and brown rock.LDS Watchman wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:30 pmPlus, we literally have Abraham and Book of Mormon prophets using seer stones to receive revelation. Didn't Aaron use them, too? What's the difference whether a hat was used or not?
Suppose you’d never heard of the church before and two teenagers approach you on the street with a book they claim was translated using a rock and a top hat. How do you think most people react to that?
Or rather, imagine NOT hearing that your entire life as a LDS. In fact, you’ve been told that was anti material fabricated by the likes of Fawn Brodie and her ilk. Now all of a sudden RMN is showcasing the rock and top hat and you’re told the words magically appeared on the rock. Verbatim.
It’s a bit to swallow. Or maybe not because magic rocks are totally normal in your world and you’re currently receiving dictation for a 500 page history of the subterranean Christians of the lost tribes?
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
The day of Pentecost when the Holy ghost fell apon the 120 disciples they spoke in Tongues and prophesied
Peter arose filled with the holy ghost and prophesied to thousands of his fellow Jews.........
That greatest of all messages that all the prophets and messengers of God before him gave witness to, many with their lives............
That Jesus of Nazerath was the Messiah, that He was slain for the sins of the world and after three days in the tomb had risen from the dead and that he Peter and his fellow Apostles were witnesses to His arising from the dead.............
Over three thousand Jews accepted Jesus of Nazerath as their Messiah that day!
We find King David in the psalms saying..
"Oh Lord, when your Spirit falls apon me,
I could jump over a mountain top,
And run thru an army"
A man having the Holy ghost dwelling in him does not need external supports, for he has the very fountainhead of prophecy and power dwelling within him as Jesus said.
"Those that believe in Me,
Out of their innermost being shall rivers of living water flow"
(Meaning the promised indwelling of the Holy Ghost)
In the New testament........
The Disciples came back to Jesus overjoyed, Master they said in your name the devils were cast out, the sick were healed!
Peter said to a cripple, Silver and gold have I none but that what I have I freely give, in the name of Jesus of Nazerath get up and walk!
After pentecost the apostles wrought daily many signs, wonders and miracles, recieved visions, dreams and revelations all thru the power of the holy ghost given them thru FAITH in the Lord Jesus.
What more does a man need than the indwelling of Gods Spirit which comes thru faith in the name of Jesus of Nazerath.
Peter arose filled with the holy ghost and prophesied to thousands of his fellow Jews.........
That greatest of all messages that all the prophets and messengers of God before him gave witness to, many with their lives............
That Jesus of Nazerath was the Messiah, that He was slain for the sins of the world and after three days in the tomb had risen from the dead and that he Peter and his fellow Apostles were witnesses to His arising from the dead.............
Over three thousand Jews accepted Jesus of Nazerath as their Messiah that day!
We find King David in the psalms saying..
"Oh Lord, when your Spirit falls apon me,
I could jump over a mountain top,
And run thru an army"
A man having the Holy ghost dwelling in him does not need external supports, for he has the very fountainhead of prophecy and power dwelling within him as Jesus said.
"Those that believe in Me,
Out of their innermost being shall rivers of living water flow"
(Meaning the promised indwelling of the Holy Ghost)
In the New testament........
The Disciples came back to Jesus overjoyed, Master they said in your name the devils were cast out, the sick were healed!
Peter said to a cripple, Silver and gold have I none but that what I have I freely give, in the name of Jesus of Nazerath get up and walk!
After pentecost the apostles wrought daily many signs, wonders and miracles, recieved visions, dreams and revelations all thru the power of the holy ghost given them thru FAITH in the Lord Jesus.
What more does a man need than the indwelling of Gods Spirit which comes thru faith in the name of Jesus of Nazerath.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
I already addressed that all in my original post. I think they SHOULD be forthcoming with the truth. ALL of it. Own that.iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:05 pmI’m asking you to evaluate the claims of the translation method and ask why the church isn’t more forthcoming about it.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:58 pmI seem to remember writing appearing on a wall in the king's palace. I seem to remember God himself writing (supernaturally) upon stone tablets for Moses. (Then why not on a small stone in a hat.) I seem to remember wool that was dry when there was dew on the ground and wet when the ground was dry. Revelation in the NT says that all who inherit the celestial glory receive a special white stone with a new name written on it. I'm not sure why you seem to want to put God in your own, tiny little box. He uses supernatural means to reveal his will quite frequently. I wonder what you think of the Ark of the Covenant?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:40 pmOther than sources Joseph wrote himself, point me to any other 1000 year, 500+ page history written solely off words magically appearing on the surface of a black and brown rock.LDS Watchman wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:30 pm
Plus, we literally have Abraham and Book of Mormon prophets using seer stones to receive revelation. Didn't Aaron use them, too? What's the difference whether a hat was used or not?
Suppose you’d never heard of the church before and two teenagers approach you on the street with a book they claim was translated using a rock and a top hat. How do you think most people react to that?
Or rather, imagine NOT hearing that your entire life as a LDS. In fact, you’ve been told that was anti material fabricated by the likes of Fawn Brodie and her ilk. Now all of a sudden RMN is showcasing the rock and top hat and you’re told the words magically appeared on the rock. Verbatim.
It’s a bit to swallow. Or maybe not because magic rocks are totally normal in your world and you’re currently receiving dictation for a 500 page history of the subterranean Christians of the lost tribes?
The reason such things seem strange to us is because this faithless generation has been taught not to believe in the supernatural.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
The truth does not bode well for them.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:34 pmI already addressed that all in my original post. I think they SHOULD be forthcoming with the truth. ALL of it. Own that.iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:05 pmI’m asking you to evaluate the claims of the translation method and ask why the church isn’t more forthcoming about it.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:58 pmI seem to remember writing appearing on a wall in the king's palace. I seem to remember God himself writing (supernaturally) upon stone tablets for Moses. (Then why not on a small stone in a hat.) I seem to remember wool that was dry when there was dew on the ground and wet when the ground was dry. Revelation in the NT says that all who inherit the celestial glory receive a special white stone with a new name written on it. I'm not sure why you seem to want to put God in your own, tiny little box. He uses supernatural means to reveal his will quite frequently. I wonder what you think of the Ark of the Covenant?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:40 pm
Other than sources Joseph wrote himself, point me to any other 1000 year, 500+ page history written solely off words magically appearing on the surface of a black and brown rock.
Suppose you’d never heard of the church before and two teenagers approach you on the street with a book they claim was translated using a rock and a top hat. How do you think most people react to that?
Or rather, imagine NOT hearing that your entire life as a LDS. In fact, you’ve been told that was anti material fabricated by the likes of Fawn Brodie and her ilk. Now all of a sudden RMN is showcasing the rock and top hat and you’re told the words magically appeared on the rock. Verbatim.
It’s a bit to swallow. Or maybe not because magic rocks are totally normal in your world and you’re currently receiving dictation for a 500 page history of the subterranean Christians of the lost tribes?
The reason such things seem strange to us is because this faithless generation has been taught not to believe in the supernatural.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Great! Glad we’re on the same page then.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:34 pmI already addressed that all in my original post. I think they SHOULD be forthcoming with the truth. ALL of it. Own that.iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:05 pmI’m asking you to evaluate the claims of the translation method and ask why the church isn’t more forthcoming about it.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:58 pmI seem to remember writing appearing on a wall in the king's palace. I seem to remember God himself writing (supernaturally) upon stone tablets for Moses. (Then why not on a small stone in a hat.) I seem to remember wool that was dry when there was dew on the ground and wet when the ground was dry. Revelation in the NT says that all who inherit the celestial glory receive a special white stone with a new name written on it. I'm not sure why you seem to want to put God in your own, tiny little box. He uses supernatural means to reveal his will quite frequently. I wonder what you think of the Ark of the Covenant?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:40 pm
Other than sources Joseph wrote himself, point me to any other 1000 year, 500+ page history written solely off words magically appearing on the surface of a black and brown rock.
Suppose you’d never heard of the church before and two teenagers approach you on the street with a book they claim was translated using a rock and a top hat. How do you think most people react to that?
Or rather, imagine NOT hearing that your entire life as a LDS. In fact, you’ve been told that was anti material fabricated by the likes of Fawn Brodie and her ilk. Now all of a sudden RMN is showcasing the rock and top hat and you’re told the words magically appeared on the rock. Verbatim.
It’s a bit to swallow. Or maybe not because magic rocks are totally normal in your world and you’re currently receiving dictation for a 500 page history of the subterranean Christians of the lost tribes?
The reason such things seem strange to us is because this faithless generation has been taught not to believe in the supernatural.
Follow up question: how do you think missionaries would feel telling the story straight as it was, top hat and all?
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Blitz, I agree with you on many things, and we have common thoughts.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:01 pm I suppose anyone who finds such things ridiculous would likewise question nearly every other miraculous element of the scriptures. Parted the Red Sea? Rose from the dead? Sounds ridiculous!
I don’t think any of the things you mentioned are ridiculous. But for me not knowing about the hat and rocks for 20 years is mind boggling. And not knowing that prophets were paid for 18 years is the same.
I heard this quote many years ago and now I’m just catching on:
“Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.”
Thomas Jefferson
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
It makes sense to me that the hat was used to cut down on the ambient light so the words made visible by the stone would be easier to read.LDS Watchman wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:30 pmPlus, we literally have Abraham and Book of Mormon prophets using seer stones to receive revelation. Didn't Aaron use them, too? What's the difference whether a hat was used or not?Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:21 pmWhy is the difference whether or not it's used as a means of revelation?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:07 pmDid he use it to receive revelation from God? When God spoke to Moses, did He speak through the stick?
People using objects for "supernatural" purposes is the same across the board.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Agreed.larsenb wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:50 pmIt makes sense to me that the hat was used to cut down on the ambient light so the words made visible by the stone would be easier to read.LDS Watchman wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:30 pmPlus, we literally have Abraham and Book of Mormon prophets using seer stones to receive revelation. Didn't Aaron use them, too? What's the difference whether a hat was used or not?Luke wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:21 pmWhy is the difference whether or not it's used as a means of revelation?iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:07 pm
Did he use it to receive revelation from God? When God spoke to Moses, did He speak through the stick?
People using objects for "supernatural" purposes is the same across the board.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Mamabear wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:42 pmBlitz, I agree with you on many things, and we have common thoughts.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:01 pm I suppose anyone who finds such things ridiculous would likewise question nearly every other miraculous element of the scriptures. Parted the Red Sea? Rose from the dead? Sounds ridiculous!
I don’t think any of the things you mentioned are ridiculous. But for me not knowing about the hat and rocks for 20 years is mind boggling. And not knowing that prophets were paid for 18 years is the same.
I heard this quote many years ago and now I’m just catching on:
“Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.”
Thomas Jefferson
I'm with you, Mamabear. The true history doesn't bother me nearly as much as them lying about it for all those years. Which is why I'm in my current state of discontent.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
It would certainly be a test of courage and faith. I remember being kicked under the table by the missionaries when I was on "splits" many years ago, for talking about the Urimm and Thummim with an investigator!iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:40 pmGreat! Glad we’re on the same page then.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:34 pmI already addressed that all in my original post. I think they SHOULD be forthcoming with the truth. ALL of it. Own that.iWriteStuff wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 5:05 pmI’m asking you to evaluate the claims of the translation method and ask why the church isn’t more forthcoming about it.blitzinstripes wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 4:58 pm
I seem to remember writing appearing on a wall in the king's palace. I seem to remember God himself writing (supernaturally) upon stone tablets for Moses. (Then why not on a small stone in a hat.) I seem to remember wool that was dry when there was dew on the ground and wet when the ground was dry. Revelation in the NT says that all who inherit the celestial glory receive a special white stone with a new name written on it. I'm not sure why you seem to want to put God in your own, tiny little box. He uses supernatural means to reveal his will quite frequently. I wonder what you think of the Ark of the Covenant?
Suppose you’d never heard of the church before and two teenagers approach you on the street with a book they claim was translated using a rock and a top hat. How do you think most people react to that?
Or rather, imagine NOT hearing that your entire life as a LDS. In fact, you’ve been told that was anti material fabricated by the likes of Fawn Brodie and her ilk. Now all of a sudden RMN is showcasing the rock and top hat and you’re told the words magically appeared on the rock. Verbatim.
It’s a bit to swallow. Or maybe not because magic rocks are totally normal in your world and you’re currently receiving dictation for a 500 page history of the subterranean Christians of the lost tribes?
The reason such things seem strange to us is because this faithless generation has been taught not to believe in the supernatural.
Follow up question: how do you think missionaries would feel telling the story straight as it was, top hat and all?
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
What a caring God you describe. Saves his precious chandelier and possiblyChris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:56 pmIt is actually all through out all of the scriptures, all of those things. Jacob is the Son of Isaac, Isaac was the son of Abraham and it is in the bible and does talk about his temple expereince. Most temples also use the symbolism of the his experience. bouniful Temple is just one example of this on the windows of the Celestial room. Exaltation is talked about everywhere as well.Mamabear wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:48 pm“That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.“Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:30 pmIt isnt Sunday School, and yet it is still true. When you read that scripture you quoted below it actually implies that you do what he says. The path is very narrow and it is only as outlined by him. You cant disregard everything he says and think by some miracale you will still make it. He will just simply say "Ye know me not". That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.nightlight wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 10:51 am
Bro this isn't Sunday School. Your little LDS mantras you use as a bludgeon are shrugged off by people who actually feast on the words of Christ... Might as well look in the mirror and quote yourself
O then, my beloved brethren, come unto the Lord, the Holy One. Remember that his paths are righteous. Behold, the way for man is narrow, but it lieth in a straight course before him, and the keeper of the gate is the Holy One of Israel; and he employeth no servant there; and there is none other way save it be by the gate; for he cannot be deceived, for the Lord God is his name.
You cant say ah yea Lord you just arent right, I really dont like that prophet you called i think he is stupid and wrong and oh by the way Lord i dont think he has ever been inspired or performed a miracle, and about that church, you know the saints you have suck, oh and i dont like how they spend tithing money too, yes i know this probably makes me sound a little like Judas because i know he used to complain how the church spent its money, but it is okay that i complain about it because Judas was just you know, well Judas. I am so much batter than he. and yea i just think going to church being surronded by all those horrible people who call themselves saints is not for me. The temple oh my gosh the temple just sucks too.... I mean comeon, you know there are a couple scriptures in the bible and i think i got it all figured out. I think the church sucks, the prophets sucks according to some scriptures i think i know everything about it and all i need to do is nothing. I can claim to give all my money to those in need even though i dont and Lord i am just going to sit by and speak ill of everyone and everything and especially about this crappy prophet and crappy church. Oh but dont worry i know you will save me, because i am just cutting out all the crap and coming strait to you. I dont need to do as the scriptures say, ill just come to you and all by the way i expect you to come visit me and tell me i am so holy that i am to be exalted. By the way Lord i am stillwating for my Rameumptom Lord please send it soon so i can feel better about myself.
Besides d&c, where is this doctrine found? If the temple and the “2nd anointing” were needed for “exaltation” where was it restored from and why wasn’t it taught plainly by Christ and his disciples?
The term “exaltation” is not found in the Bible or the BOM.
Speaking of the bountiful temple. I know someone who was cleaning in the Bountiful temple at night. He was changing bulbs on that big beautiful chandaler. the chain snapped holding the chandaler up instead of it crushing him. The whole thing floated from one end of the room to the other and was gently set down on the floor. Not one crystal fell off. There were 9 people in the room that witnessed it happen. Pretty amazing miracle if it was not considered the Lords house.....
the life of a member janitor while ignoring the pleading prayers of thousands if not millions of people in desperate need. What a petty God.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Once upon a time the Ultimate Warrior and I would go boonin’ beyond the big B. There I discovered a big bubble on the tip of a mountain that bears my middle name. Years later I worked there before and after training near where me strange photo was taken. The fact that a miracle occurred there comes as no surprise to me.Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:56 pmIt is actually all through out all of the scriptures, all of those things. Jacob is the Son of Isaac, Isaac was the son of Abraham and it is in the bible and does talk about his temple expereince. Most temples also use the symbolism of the his experience. bouniful Temple is just one example of this on the windows of the Celestial room. Exaltation is talked about everywhere as well.Mamabear wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:48 pm“That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.“Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:30 pmIt isnt Sunday School, and yet it is still true. When you read that scripture you quoted below it actually implies that you do what he says. The path is very narrow and it is only as outlined by him. You cant disregard everything he says and think by some miracale you will still make it. He will just simply say "Ye know me not". That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.nightlight wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 10:51 am
Bro this isn't Sunday School. Your little LDS mantras you use as a bludgeon are shrugged off by people who actually feast on the words of Christ... Might as well look in the mirror and quote yourself
O then, my beloved brethren, come unto the Lord, the Holy One. Remember that his paths are righteous. Behold, the way for man is narrow, but it lieth in a straight course before him, and the keeper of the gate is the Holy One of Israel; and he employeth no servant there; and there is none other way save it be by the gate; for he cannot be deceived, for the Lord God is his name.
You cant say ah yea Lord you just arent right, I really dont like that prophet you called i think he is stupid and wrong and oh by the way Lord i dont think he has ever been inspired or performed a miracle, and about that church, you know the saints you have suck, oh and i dont like how they spend tithing money too, yes i know this probably makes me sound a little like Judas because i know he used to complain how the church spent its money, but it is okay that i complain about it because Judas was just you know, well Judas. I am so much batter than he. and yea i just think going to church being surronded by all those horrible people who call themselves saints is not for me. The temple oh my gosh the temple just sucks too.... I mean comeon, you know there are a couple scriptures in the bible and i think i got it all figured out. I think the church sucks, the prophets sucks according to some scriptures i think i know everything about it and all i need to do is nothing. I can claim to give all my money to those in need even though i dont and Lord i am just going to sit by and speak ill of everyone and everything and especially about this crappy prophet and crappy church. Oh but dont worry i know you will save me, because i am just cutting out all the crap and coming strait to you. I dont need to do as the scriptures say, ill just come to you and all by the way i expect you to come visit me and tell me i am so holy that i am to be exalted. By the way Lord i am stillwating for my Rameumptom Lord please send it soon so i can feel better about myself.
Besides d&c, where is this doctrine found? If the temple and the “2nd anointing” were needed for “exaltation” where was it restored from and why wasn’t it taught plainly by Christ and his disciples?
The term “exaltation” is not found in the Bible or the BOM.
Speaking of the bountiful temple. I know someone who was cleaning in the Bountiful temple at night. He was changing bulbs on that big beautiful chandaler. the chain snapped holding the chandaler up instead of it crushing him. The whole thing floated from one end of the room to the other and was gently set down on the floor. Not one crystal fell off. There were 9 people in the room that witnessed it happen. Pretty amazing miracle if it was not considered the Lords house.....
What was the date of said miracle?
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
It was in the early 2000'sBeNotDeceived wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 6:18 pmOnce upon a time the Ultimate Warrior and I would go boonin’ beyond the big B. There I discovered a big bubble on the tip of a mountain that bears my middle name. Years later I worked there before and after training near where me strange photo was taken. The fact that a miracle occurred there comes as no surprise to me.Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:56 pmIt is actually all through out all of the scriptures, all of those things. Jacob is the Son of Isaac, Isaac was the son of Abraham and it is in the bible and does talk about his temple expereince. Most temples also use the symbolism of the his experience. bouniful Temple is just one example of this on the windows of the Celestial room. Exaltation is talked about everywhere as well.Mamabear wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:48 pm“That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.“Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:30 pm
It isnt Sunday School, and yet it is still true. When you read that scripture you quoted below it actually implies that you do what he says. The path is very narrow and it is only as outlined by him. You cant disregard everything he says and think by some miracale you will still make it. He will just simply say "Ye know me not". That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.
You cant say ah yea Lord you just arent right, I really dont like that prophet you called i think he is stupid and wrong and oh by the way Lord i dont think he has ever been inspired or performed a miracle, and about that church, you know the saints you have suck, oh and i dont like how they spend tithing money too, yes i know this probably makes me sound a little like Judas because i know he used to complain how the church spent its money, but it is okay that i complain about it because Judas was just you know, well Judas. I am so much batter than he. and yea i just think going to church being surronded by all those horrible people who call themselves saints is not for me. The temple oh my gosh the temple just sucks too.... I mean comeon, you know there are a couple scriptures in the bible and i think i got it all figured out. I think the church sucks, the prophets sucks according to some scriptures i think i know everything about it and all i need to do is nothing. I can claim to give all my money to those in need even though i dont and Lord i am just going to sit by and speak ill of everyone and everything and especially about this crappy prophet and crappy church. Oh but dont worry i know you will save me, because i am just cutting out all the crap and coming strait to you. I dont need to do as the scriptures say, ill just come to you and all by the way i expect you to come visit me and tell me i am so holy that i am to be exalted. By the way Lord i am stillwating for my Rameumptom Lord please send it soon so i can feel better about myself.
Besides d&c, where is this doctrine found? If the temple and the “2nd anointing” were needed for “exaltation” where was it restored from and why wasn’t it taught plainly by Christ and his disciples?
The term “exaltation” is not found in the Bible or the BOM.
Speaking of the bountiful temple. I know someone who was cleaning in the Bountiful temple at night. He was changing bulbs on that big beautiful chandaler. the chain snapped holding the chandaler up instead of it crushing him. The whole thing floated from one end of the room to the other and was gently set down on the floor. Not one crystal fell off. There were 9 people in the room that witnessed it happen. Pretty amazing miracle if it was not considered the Lords house.....
What was the date of said miracle?
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Now that would have been something to witness/experience. I've been on cleaning expeditions in that temple a few times, but have yet to see anything like what you describe. And of course, I would love to talk to the person you know. Care to share (pm/email, etc.)?Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:56 pmIt is actually all through out all of the scriptures, all of those things. Jacob is the Son of Isaac, Isaac was the son of Abraham and it is in the bible and does talk about his temple expereince. Most temples also use the symbolism of the his experience. bouniful Temple is just one example of this on the windows of the Celestial room. Exaltation is talked about everywhere as well.Mamabear wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:48 pm“That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.“Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:30 pmIt isnt Sunday School, and yet it is still true. When you read that scripture you quoted below it actually implies that you do what he says. The path is very narrow and it is only as outlined by him. You cant disregard everything he says and think by some miracale you will still make it. He will just simply say "Ye know me not". That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.nightlight wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 10:51 am
Bro this isn't Sunday School. Your little LDS mantras you use as a bludgeon are shrugged off by people who actually feast on the words of Christ... Might as well look in the mirror and quote yourself
O then, my beloved brethren, come unto the Lord, the Holy One. Remember that his paths are righteous. Behold, the way for man is narrow, but it lieth in a straight course before him, and the keeper of the gate is the Holy One of Israel; and he employeth no servant there; and there is none other way save it be by the gate; for he cannot be deceived, for the Lord God is his name.
You cant say ah yea Lord you just arent right, I really dont like that prophet you called i think he is stupid and wrong and oh by the way Lord i dont think he has ever been inspired or performed a miracle, and about that church, you know the saints you have suck, oh and i dont like how they spend tithing money too, yes i know this probably makes me sound a little like Judas because i know he used to complain how the church spent its money, but it is okay that i complain about it because Judas was just you know, well Judas. I am so much batter than he. and yea i just think going to church being surronded by all those horrible people who call themselves saints is not for me. The temple oh my gosh the temple just sucks too.... I mean comeon, you know there are a couple scriptures in the bible and i think i got it all figured out. I think the church sucks, the prophets sucks according to some scriptures i think i know everything about it and all i need to do is nothing. I can claim to give all my money to those in need even though i dont and Lord i am just going to sit by and speak ill of everyone and everything and especially about this crappy prophet and crappy church. Oh but dont worry i know you will save me, because i am just cutting out all the crap and coming strait to you. I dont need to do as the scriptures say, ill just come to you and all by the way i expect you to come visit me and tell me i am so holy that i am to be exalted. By the way Lord i am stillwating for my Rameumptom Lord please send it soon so i can feel better about myself.
Besides d&c, where is this doctrine found? If the temple and the “2nd anointing” were needed for “exaltation” where was it restored from and why wasn’t it taught plainly by Christ and his disciples?
The term “exaltation” is not found in the Bible or the BOM.
Speaking of the bountiful temple. I know someone who was cleaning in the Bountiful temple at night. He was changing bulbs on that big beautiful chandaler. the chain snapped holding the chandaler up instead of it crushing him. The whole thing floated from one end of the room to the other and was gently set down on the floor. Not one crystal fell off. There were 9 people in the room that witnessed it happen. Pretty amazing miracle if it was not considered the Lords house.....
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
I go boonin' a bit south of there all the time. Also ran into something quite disturbing in that locale . . . . .BeNotDeceived wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 6:18 pmOnce upon a time the Ultimate Warrior and I would go boonin’ beyond the big B. There I discovered a big bubble on the tip of a mountain that bears my middle name. Years later I worked there before and after training near where me strange photo was taken. The fact that a miracle occurred there comes as no surprise to me.Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:56 pmIt is actually all through out all of the scriptures, all of those things. Jacob is the Son of Isaac, Isaac was the son of Abraham and it is in the bible and does talk about his temple expereince. Most temples also use the symbolism of the his experience. bouniful Temple is just one example of this on the windows of the Celestial room. Exaltation is talked about everywhere as well.Mamabear wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:48 pm“That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.“Chris wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 12:30 pm
It isnt Sunday School, and yet it is still true. When you read that scripture you quoted below it actually implies that you do what he says. The path is very narrow and it is only as outlined by him. You cant disregard everything he says and think by some miracale you will still make it. He will just simply say "Ye know me not". That strait course starts with Jacobs ladder ( Temple ), then Baptism by fire, 2nd anoiting and then Exaltation. You just cant skip any steps along the way.
You cant say ah yea Lord you just arent right, I really dont like that prophet you called i think he is stupid and wrong and oh by the way Lord i dont think he has ever been inspired or performed a miracle, and about that church, you know the saints you have suck, oh and i dont like how they spend tithing money too, yes i know this probably makes me sound a little like Judas because i know he used to complain how the church spent its money, but it is okay that i complain about it because Judas was just you know, well Judas. I am so much batter than he. and yea i just think going to church being surronded by all those horrible people who call themselves saints is not for me. The temple oh my gosh the temple just sucks too.... I mean comeon, you know there are a couple scriptures in the bible and i think i got it all figured out. I think the church sucks, the prophets sucks according to some scriptures i think i know everything about it and all i need to do is nothing. I can claim to give all my money to those in need even though i dont and Lord i am just going to sit by and speak ill of everyone and everything and especially about this crappy prophet and crappy church. Oh but dont worry i know you will save me, because i am just cutting out all the crap and coming strait to you. I dont need to do as the scriptures say, ill just come to you and all by the way i expect you to come visit me and tell me i am so holy that i am to be exalted. By the way Lord i am stillwating for my Rameumptom Lord please send it soon so i can feel better about myself.
Besides d&c, where is this doctrine found? If the temple and the “2nd anointing” were needed for “exaltation” where was it restored from and why wasn’t it taught plainly by Christ and his disciples?
The term “exaltation” is not found in the Bible or the BOM.
Speaking of the bountiful temple. I know someone who was cleaning in the Bountiful temple at night. He was changing bulbs on that big beautiful chandaler. the chain snapped holding the chandaler up instead of it crushing him. The whole thing floated from one end of the room to the other and was gently set down on the floor. Not one crystal fell off. There were 9 people in the room that witnessed it happen. Pretty amazing miracle if it was not considered the Lords house.....
What was the date of said miracle?
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
I do not believe Joseph looked in a hat. I believe that he used the Urim and Thummim to translate just as Joseph said and as had been prepared for him with the golden plates. I do not believe he used a brown stone.
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Re: Book of Mormon questions
Read “Rough Stone Rolling”? After he lost the 116 pages, apparently Moroni took away the plates and the Urim and Thummim. The majority of the remaining translation happened sans U&T or even the golden plates themselves.CuriousThinker wrote: ↑October 22nd, 2022, 7:04 pm I do not believe Joseph looked in a hat. I believe that he used the Urim and Thummim to translate just as Joseph said and as had been prepared for him with the golden plates. I do not believe he used a brown stone.