This church is super lame

[Fred]

As lame as you guys claim the Church is, it seems like its critics are growing ever lamer, no matter where on the political spectrum they might fall.

I mean, many here are flying themselves to pieces trying to explain any subject where they feel like the Church has gone astray without noticing that perhaps it is them that are going astray. Quite a few of you were offended at the talks, as well as the Church actions during the Nelson presidency.

I just look ay the habitual liars and realize that there is nothing whatsoever Christlike about a habitual liar whose lies kill people.

[AkalAish]

yep and required to raise your hand to sustain with your dog and God as the only witnesses

Super confused, but I do sincerely appreciate you being willing to answer.

What she was talking about is that during every semi-annual conference, the names of the general authorities are read, and we are asked if we sustain them, and signify by raising our hand. I guess some people do this alone in their homes.......?!?!

What happens if sustaining is failed to be realized?

Sorry for all the questions!! Still learning...

[Fred]

My apologies for ignorance, but is General Conference considered a good or a bad thing?

Depends on if you worship God or satan.

[Fred]

yep and required to raise your hand to sustain with your dog and God as the only witnesses

Super confused, but I do sincerely appreciate you being willing to answer.

What she was talking about is that during every semi-annual conference, the names of the general authorities are read, and we are asked if we sustain them, and signify by raising our hand. I guess some people do this alone in their homes.......?!?!

What happens if sustaining is failed to be realized?

Sorry for all the questions!! Still learning...

Those that do not sustain the Brethren are asked to see their Stake President. If they don't change their mind, they are excommunicated.

[AkalAish]

Super confused, but I do sincerely appreciate you being willing to answer.

What she was talking about is that during every semi-annual conference, the names of the general authorities are read, and we are asked if we sustain them, and signify by raising our hand. I guess some people do this alone in their homes.......?!?!

What happens if sustaining is failed to be realized?

Sorry for all the questions!! Still learning...

Those that do not sustain the Brethren are asked to see their Stake President. If they don't change their mind, they are excommunicated.

So...this is about acceptance? Of the person or of the content and manner of what they are saying?

[Lizzy60]

yep and required to raise your hand to sustain with your dog and God as the only witnesses

Super confused, but I do sincerely appreciate you being willing to answer.

What she was talking about is that during every semi-annual conference, the names of the general authorities are read, and we are asked if we sustain them, and signify by raising our hand. I guess some people do this alone in their homes.......?!?!

What happens if sustaining is failed to be realized?

Sorry for all the questions!! Still learning...

Fred jumped right to the worst-case scenario. Sustaining happens all the way up in the organization. In our ward and stake conferences we sustain ward and stake leaders. (A ward is about 250 members, and a stake has about 8 wards.). If you oppose someone local (instead of sustain) your Bishop or Stake President might ask you why. However, is you publicly oppose any of the First Presidency or Twelve Apostles (the top 15 in the church) you will not receive a temple recommend card. This card is your golden ticket to the Celestial Kingdom, so this is serious business. (Sarcasm alert!) If you are even more vocal, you may be excommunicated. This is because opposing the general leaders is considered apostasy.

However, I don’t agree with that definition of apostasy, as I believe apostasy is turning away from Christ and his gospel. Nothing more, nothing less. We are not required (by G-d) to worship men.

[JuneBug12000]

If it were truly your companion it would not be leading you astray from the established Church.

You see, JuneBug, this is how it works: you don't actually need the Holy Ghost to guide you, since it, in turn, can be judged by what a group of men tell you it should be telling you. Just go to the source, and eliminate the middle man. Or ghost, as it were.

Funny, not funny, that is what happen to Joan of Arc. The church of her time was less concerned about her talking to saints and angles and more concerned that she didn't get approval from them that the messages were from God. The needed their piece of the PR from the event to create relevancy and authority.

So weird to see history repeat over and over again.

[The Red Pill]

If it were truly your companion it would not be leading you astray from the established Church.

You see, JuneBug, this is how it works: you don't actually need the Holy Ghost to guide you, since it, in turn, can be judged by what a group of men tell you it should be telling you. Just go to the source, and eliminate the middle man. Or ghost, as it were.

Speaking of middle man....Joseph Smith taught that there were 2 (yes 2) members of the Godhead...and that the Holy Spirit is the collective mind of the Father and Son (lectures on faith #5)...as in no seperate ghost character. Yes...the spirit we feel is direct from the Father and Son.

And...the flesh and bones part was also added later by the Brighamite crowd.

Amazing what you find in the 1835 edition of the Doctrine and Covenants...before Brigham editing.

[FoundMyEden]

As lame as you guys claim the Church is, it seems like its critics are growing ever lamer, no matter where on the political spectrum they might fall.

I mean, many here are flying themselves to pieces trying to explain any subject where they feel like the Church has gone astray without noticing that perhaps it is them that are going astray. Quite a few of you were offended at the talks, as well as the Church actions during the Nelson presidency.

Oh, believe me. I worry every day that it is me not the church. But the Holy Spirit is my companion and guide I this matter.

If it were truly your companion it would not be leading you astray from the established Church.

Are you claiming the Catholics are speaking the truth? They claim the establishment of the true church.

[BeNotDeceived]

One must always remember that there is a babe within the murky bathwater of connivance and corruption by a horde of elite corporate deceived deities.

[Subcomandante]

As lame as you guys claim the Church is, it seems like its critics are growing ever lamer, no matter where on the political spectrum they might fall.

I mean, many here are flying themselves to pieces trying to explain any subject where they feel like the Church has gone astray without noticing that perhaps it is them that are going astray. Quite a few of you were offended at the talks, as well as the Church actions during the Nelson presidency.

Oh, believe me. I worry every day that it is me not the church. But the Holy Spirit is my companion and guide I this matter.

If it were truly your companion it would not be leading you astray from the established Church.

Are you claiming the Catholics are speaking the truth? They claim the establishment of the true church.

The Catholics claim many things. Yet many of their practices go against the Scriptures. This is why a restoration of the truth was needed.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints does everything according to Scripture as well as prophetic revelation that guides the Church. No restoration is needed because the restoration continues. That some people don't like or agree with the direction the Church is going is noted.

If you want to know where i am coming from, check out what Elder Renlund had to say in his conference address. It was a good talk on how to discern revelation.

[Reluctant Watchman]

You must be the change you wish to see.

That's why many of us leave the institutionalized church. That, my friend, is some powerful change. Turning away from false beliefs and offering your heart to the heavens.

[Reluctant Watchman]

As lame as you guys claim the Church is, it seems like its critics are growing ever lamer, no matter where on the political spectrum they might fall.

I mean, many here are flying themselves to pieces trying to explain any subject where they feel like the Church has gone astray without noticing that perhaps it is them that are going astray. Quite a few of you were offended at the talks, as well as the Church actions during the Nelson presidency.

The apologists are also running around in circles, just sayin'. It's been quite enlightening to see a few of you try to explain away the last two years.

[Reluctant Watchman]

I don't think the church is lame. But I think it is getting very diluted and generic.

I think leaders have made it quite evil. But that's just me, the opinion of a heretic.

[The Red Pill]

Oh, believe me. I worry every day that it is me not the church. But the Holy Spirit is my companion and guide I this matter.

If it were truly your companion it would not be leading you astray from the established Church.

Are you claiming the Catholics are speaking the truth? They claim the establishment of the true church.

The Catholics claim many things. Yet many of their practices go against the Scriptures. This is why a restoration of the truth was needed.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints does everything according to Scripture as well as prophetic revelation that guides the Church. No restoration is needed because the restoration continues. That some people don't like or agree with the direction the Church is going is noted.

If you want to know where i am coming from, check out what Elder Renlund had to say in his conference address. It was a good talk on how to discern revelation.

The SAME Renlund that recommended the deadly-jab from the pulpit in conference????

That Renlund????

Sorry, but Renlund has ZERO, ZIP, NADA credibility on the subject of discerning revelation. He can't do it himself...what makes you think he has the right to preach it to others?

[Subcomandante]

As lame as you guys claim the Church is, it seems like its critics are growing ever lamer, no matter where on the political spectrum they might fall.

I mean, many here are flying themselves to pieces trying to explain any subject where they feel like the Church has gone astray without noticing that perhaps it is them that are going astray. Quite a few of you were offended at the talks, as well as the Church actions during the Nelson presidency.

The apologists are also running around in circles, just sayin'. It's been quite enlightening to see a few of you try to explain away the last two years.

I don't have to explain myself away using mental gymnastics. I know of the harsh realities of an international church trying to move along during the pandemic. A lot of the solutions that have ben posited here by many would not have worked without at best a severe curtailing of the work of the Lord in a time when the work of the Lord needs to be active.

[Subcomandante]

If it were truly your companion it would not be leading you astray from the established Church.

Are you claiming the Catholics are speaking the truth? They claim the establishment of the true church.

The Catholics claim many things. Yet many of their practices go against the Scriptures. This is why a restoration of the truth was needed.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints does everything according to Scripture as well as prophetic revelation that guides the Church. No restoration is needed because the restoration continues. That some people don't like or agree with the direction the Church is going is noted.

If you want to know where i am coming from, check out what Elder Renlund had to say in his conference address. It was a good talk on how to discern revelation.

The SAME Renlund that recommended the deadly-jab from the pulpit in conference????

That Renlund????

Sorry, but Renlund has ZERO, ZIP, NADA credibility on the subject of discerning revelation. He can't do it himself...what makes you think he has the right to preach it to others?

As an Apostle and as a doctor, he certainly has more credibility to talk about medical issues than just about everyone else on this forum, myself included.

[InfoWarrior82]

As lame as you guys claim the Church is, it seems like its critics are growing ever lamer, no matter where on the political spectrum they might fall.

I mean, many here are flying themselves to pieces trying to explain any subject where they feel like the Church has gone astray without noticing that perhaps it is them that are going astray. Quite a few of you were offended at the talks, as well as the Church actions during the Nelson presidency.

The apologists are also running around in circles, just sayin'. It's been quite enlightening to see a few of you try to explain away the last two years.

I don't have to explain myself away using mental gymnastics. I know of the harsh realities of an international church trying to move along during the pandemic. A lot of the solutions that have ben posited here by many would not have worked without at best a severe curtailing of the work of the Lord in a time when the work of the Lord needs to be active.

The problem is, is that you have already decided that the prophet can never lead the church astray, and so that whatever they do, it must have automatically been from the Lord even when they are sending innocent people to their deaths. Do you really think that the Lord could not "move the work forward" any other way?

If what you believe was the truth, then this must mean that the Lord instructed President Nelson and the apostles to smile to us and lie through their teeth while members went out and got maimed and killed.

^^^^^^

This right here is what we in the real world, and have the Holy Spirit, call a "red flag".

[Reluctant Watchman]

As lame as you guys claim the Church is, it seems like its critics are growing ever lamer, no matter where on the political spectrum they might fall.

I mean, many here are flying themselves to pieces trying to explain any subject where they feel like the Church has gone astray without noticing that perhaps it is them that are going astray. Quite a few of you were offended at the talks, as well as the Church actions during the Nelson presidency.

The apologists are also running around in circles, just sayin'. It's been quite enlightening to see a few of you try to explain away the last two years.

I don't have to explain myself away using mental gymnastics. I know of the harsh realities of an international church trying to move along during the pandemic. A lot of the solutions that have ben posited here by many would not have worked without at best a severe curtailing of the work of the Lord in a time when the work of the Lord needs to be active.

I’m trying to figure out if you’ve earned a silver or gold medal in mental gymnastics.

[Subcomandante]

As lame as you guys claim the Church is, it seems like its critics are growing ever lamer, no matter where on the political spectrum they might fall.

I mean, many here are flying themselves to pieces trying to explain any subject where they feel like the Church has gone astray without noticing that perhaps it is them that are going astray. Quite a few of you were offended at the talks, as well as the Church actions during the Nelson presidency.

The apologists are also running around in circles, just sayin'. It's been quite enlightening to see a few of you try to explain away the last two years.

I don't have to explain myself away using mental gymnastics. I know of the harsh realities of an international church trying to move along during the pandemic. A lot of the solutions that have ben posited here by many would not have worked without at best a severe curtailing of the work of the Lord in a time when the work of the Lord needs to be active.

The problem is, is that you have already decided that the prophet can never lead the church astray, and so that whatever they do, it must have automatically been from the Lord even when they are sending innocent people to their deaths. Do you really think that the Lord could not "move the work forward" any other way?

If what you believe was the truth, then this must mean that the Lord instructed President Nelson and the apostles to smile to us and lie through their teeth while members went out and got maimed and killed.

^^^^^^

This right here is what we in the real world, and have the Holy Spirit, call a "red flag".

I'll say it again. The work would NOT have been moved forward any other way. In ANY other way.

I challenge ANYONE on this board to show me differently.

[The Red Pill]

The apologists are also running around in circles, just sayin'. It's been quite enlightening to see a few of you try to explain away the last two years.

I don't have to explain myself away using mental gymnastics. I know of the harsh realities of an international church trying to move along during the pandemic. A lot of the solutions that have ben posited here by many would not have worked without at best a severe curtailing of the work of the Lord in a time when the work of the Lord needs to be active.

The problem is, is that you have already decided that the prophet can never lead the church astray, and so that whatever they do, it must have automatically been from the Lord even when they are sending innocent people to their deaths. Do you really think that the Lord could not "move the work forward" any other way?

If what you believe was the truth, then this must mean that the Lord instructed President Nelson and the apostles to smile to us and lie through their teeth while members went out and got maimed and killed.

^^^^^^

This right here is what we in the real world, and have the Holy Spirit, call a "red flag".

I'll say it again. The work would NOT have been moved forward any other way. In ANY other way.

I challenge ANYONE on this board to show me differently.

Seriously...

Hydroxychloroquine distributed widely to the population...as entire countries did successfully.

No masks, no social distancing, no death protocol in hospitals...and no need for the deadly-jab.

...which would have INCREASED the work....as in no temple closings, no ward zoom, no missionaries sitting in apartments, no looking like buffoons at conference, no BYU basketball centers getting myocarditis, no members dying from the jab.

You don't seem to be aware of the reality which surrounded you the last two years.

[InfoWarrior82]

The apologists are also running around in circles, just sayin'. It's been quite enlightening to see a few of you try to explain away the last two years.

I don't have to explain myself away using mental gymnastics. I know of the harsh realities of an international church trying to move along during the pandemic. A lot of the solutions that have ben posited here by many would not have worked without at best a severe curtailing of the work of the Lord in a time when the work of the Lord needs to be active.

The problem is, is that you have already decided that the prophet can never lead the church astray, and so that whatever they do, it must have automatically been from the Lord even when they are sending innocent people to their deaths. Do you really think that the Lord could not "move the work forward" any other way?

If what you believe was the truth, then this must mean that the Lord instructed President Nelson and the apostles to smile to us and lie through their teeth while members went out and got maimed and killed.

^^^^^^

This right here is what we in the real world, and have the Holy Spirit, call a "red flag".

I'll say it again. The work would NOT have been moved forward any other way. In ANY other way.

I challenge ANYONE on this board to show me differently.

So you speak for the Lord now? The Lord instructed His prophets and Apostles to smile and lie?

[Destroyer]

The fact that we couldn't gather together as a Church, missionaries were locked up and only able to "work" via social media, and now that the "pandemic" is over there are fewer people active in the Church indicates to me that the work did not move forward. No, it appears that the work lost ground- it moved backward.

[CuriousThinker]

The apologists are also running around in circles, just sayin'. It's been quite enlightening to see a few of you try to explain away the last two years.

I don't have to explain myself away using mental gymnastics. I know of the harsh realities of an international church trying to move along during the pandemic. A lot of the solutions that have ben posited here by many would not have worked without at best a severe curtailing of the work of the Lord in a time when the work of the Lord needs to be active.

The problem is, is that you have already decided that the prophet can never lead the church astray, and so that whatever they do, it must have automatically been from the Lord even when they are sending innocent people to their deaths. Do you really think that the Lord could not "move the work forward" any other way?

If what you believe was the truth, then this must mean that the Lord instructed President Nelson and the apostles to smile to us and lie through their teeth while members went out and got maimed and killed.

^^^^^^

This right here is what we in the real world, and have the Holy Spirit, call a "red flag".

I'll say it again. The work would NOT have been moved forward any other way. In ANY other way.

I challenge ANYONE on this board to show me differently.

You are presenting an either/or fallacy. You have no way of proving you're right either that it was the only way.

[madvin]

I'll say it again. The work would NOT have been moved forward any other way. In ANY other way.

I challenge ANYONE on this board to show me differently.

How did it move forward? It didn't move forward, and wouldn't move forward whatever would have been decided to do during this thing most still call a pandemic (although there is no evidence of it being one whatsoever).