General Conference October 2022 - Sunday Live Thread and Recap

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Bronco73idi
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Sunday Live Thread and Recap

Post by Bronco73idi »

Original_Intent wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 1:05 pm
Bronco73idi wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 12:07 pm
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:59 am Great talk President Nelson!!, If yall only knew what was coming....
Do you know?

Jospeh Smith would say blood flowing through the streets is next….
It already is in many places but will only get worse.
And as it gets worse, we will also see the Lord's power made manifest, as President Nelson stated, to a degree not seen before.
I tried to justify that blood flowing through the streets and it will get mildly worse back in 2016. The answer was no, the lord strange act and strange work hasn’t happened at all. The blood flowing through the streets is about his people, house of Israel which is Ephraim, not Judah.

Silence of a half hour hasn’t started, “even the elect” the elect is still up there preaching.

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PeacefulProtests
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by PeacefulProtests »

TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:13 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:56 am
endlessismyname wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:43 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:39 am

An Apostolic witness is a "Special Witness" Meaning they know him and have been commissioned by him. They have seen him and have received a special sacred witness. President Faust talks about it here, most miss exactly what he is saying. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgxandXWbUk
That’s because he doesn’t say what you insinuate he’s saying. Nobody’s missing it, you’re adding it.

President Oaks, on the other hand, explicitly states that as far as he knows, none of the 15 have had the type of witness you blithely claim they have.
You are so full of it, did you listen to it above? He says it right there.

If you have done any study at all you would know there are over 50 statements by apostles that they have seen christ. Those are just the ones that wanted to share.... I have seen Christ and i know they have expereincced much more than me. Tired of everyone saying there are no miracles.

Have you ever listened to this talk by matthew cowley, can you listen to this whole talk and call him a liar? https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/matthew-cowley/miracles/
so you want to quote a 70 year old talk for modern witness? I see an issue here. I also read/watched the referenced comments by Oaks from this century and this decade and he says the opposite. So where is the reality? If they have a physical witness, say it, Paul did, Peter did, Nephi did, etc... they were surely apostles.
Reminded me of a quote from the Book "Mine Errand from the Lord" by Boyd K Packer

There are some questions too sacred to discuss. There are some questions that we could not in propriety ask.
One question of this type I am asked occasionally usually by someone who is curious is, "Have you seen him"? That is a question that I have never asked of another. I have not asked that question of my brethren in the council of the Twelve, thinking that it would be so sacred and so personal that one would have to have some special inspiration - indeed, some authorization - even to ask it
Though I have not asked the question of others , I have heard them answer it, - but not when they were asked. I have heard one of my brethren declare, "I know from experience too sacred to relate, that Jesus is the Christ". I have heard another testify, I know that God lives, I know that the Lord Lives, and more than that, I know the Lord." I repeat: that they have answered this question not when they were asked, but under the prompting of the spirit, on sacred occasions, when "The spirit beareth record"
There are some things just too sacred to discuss, not secret, but sacred; not to be discussed, but to be harbored and protected and regarded with the deepest of reverence

Joan7
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by Joan7 »

PeacefulProtests wrote: October 3rd, 2022, 8:32 pm
TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:13 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:56 am
endlessismyname wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:43 am

That’s because he doesn’t say what you insinuate he’s saying. Nobody’s missing it, you’re adding it.

President Oaks, on the other hand, explicitly states that as far as he knows, none of the 15 have had the type of witness you blithely claim they have.
You are so full of it, did you listen to it above? He says it right there.

If you have done any study at all you would know there are over 50 statements by apostles that they have seen christ. Those are just the ones that wanted to share.... I have seen Christ and i know they have expereincced much more than me. Tired of everyone saying there are no miracles.

Have you ever listened to this talk by matthew cowley, can you listen to this whole talk and call him a liar? https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/matthew-cowley/miracles/
so you want to quote a 70 year old talk for modern witness? I see an issue here. I also read/watched the referenced comments by Oaks from this century and this decade and he says the opposite. So where is the reality? If they have a physical witness, say it, Paul did, Peter did, Nephi did, etc... they were surely apostles.
Reminded me of a quote from the Book "Mine Errand from the Lord" by Boyd K Packer

There are some questions too sacred to discuss. There are some questions that we could not in propriety ask.
One question of this type I am asked occasionally usually by someone who is curious is, "Have you seen him"? That is a question that I have never asked of another. I have not asked that question of my brethren in the council of the Twelve, thinking that it would be so sacred and so personal that one would have to have some special inspiration - indeed, some authorization - even to ask it
Though I have not asked the question of others , I have heard them answer it, - but not when they were asked. I have heard one of my brethren declare, "I know from experience too sacred to relate, that Jesus is the Christ". I have heard another testify, I know that God lives, I know that the Lord Lives, and more than that, I know the Lord." I repeat: that they have answered this question not when they were asked, but under the prompting of the spirit, on sacred occasions, when "The spirit beareth record"
There are some things just too sacred to discuss, not secret, but sacred; not to be discussed, but to be harbored and protected and regarded with the deepest of reverence
Yet, over and over again, in the Book of Mormon and other scriptures, those that have these sacred experiences tell them to others, and convert so many. It is God's plan to have these experiences shared. For example, we just read the account of Nephi and Lehi being in prison. A bunch of wicked men came in to kill them. They were overshadowed, and heard the voice of God. They saw Nephi and Lehi in the light talking to unseen messengers. Then they heard the voice of the angels talking to them and teaching them. 300 wicked men became righteous that day. They went out and told the Lamanites and apostate Nephites of their experiences and there were thousands converted. Then, they went to teach the Nephites who thought they were still righteous, but they were consumed by pride. The testimonies of these formerly wicked men had a similar impact among the Nephites. So much so, that everyone in the land became righteous.

Yet, here, in our time, we are supposed to shut our mouths and not share the witnesses God has given amongst us?! That is not His purpose. Hasn't Joel stated the God has prepared such witnesses for our time, "young men shall dream dreams, and old men shall see visions?" Shutting the mouths of the people, and not allowing the testimonies to be heard, stops that work. It silences the voices that God would have speak, and it shields them from scrutiny when they cannot testify so powerfully as the lowly boy down the street.
Last edited by Joan7 on October 6th, 2022, 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Silver Pie
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Sunday Live Thread and Recap

Post by Silver Pie »

Amen! @Kit

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PeacefulProtests
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by PeacefulProtests »

Kit-OTW wrote: October 4th, 2022, 9:39 am
PeacefulProtests wrote: October 3rd, 2022, 8:32 pm
TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:13 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:56 am

You are so full of it, did you listen to it above? He says it right there.

If you have done any study at all you would know there are over 50 statements by apostles that they have seen christ. Those are just the ones that wanted to share.... I have seen Christ and i know they have expereincced much more than me. Tired of everyone saying there are no miracles.

Have you ever listened to this talk by matthew cowley, can you listen to this whole talk and call him a liar? https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/matthew-cowley/miracles/
so you want to quote a 70 year old talk for modern witness? I see an issue here. I also read/watched the referenced comments by Oaks from this century and this decade and he says the opposite. So where is the reality? If they have a physical witness, say it, Paul did, Peter did, Nephi did, etc... they were surely apostles.
Reminded me of a quote from the Book "Mine Errand from the Lord" by Boyd K Packer

There are some questions too sacred to discuss. There are some questions that we could not in propriety ask.
One question of this type I am asked occasionally usually by someone who is curious is, "Have you seen him"? That is a question that I have never asked of another. I have not asked that question of my brethren in the council of the Twelve, thinking that it would be so sacred and so personal that one would have to have some special inspiration - indeed, some authorization - even to ask it
Though I have not asked the question of others , I have heard them answer it, - but not when they were asked. I have heard one of my brethren declare, "I know from experience too sacred to relate, that Jesus is the Christ". I have heard another testify, I know that God lives, I know that the Lord Lives, and more than that, I know the Lord." I repeat: that they have answered this question not when they were asked, but under the prompting of the spirit, on sacred occasions, when "The spirit beareth record"
There are some things just too sacred to discuss, not secret, but sacred; not to be discussed, but to be harbored and protected and regarded with the deepest of reverence
Yet, over and over again, in the Book of Mormon and other scriptures, those that have these sacred experiences tell them to others, and convert so many. It is God's plan to have these experiences shared. For example, we just read the account of Nephi and Lehi being in prison. A bunch of wicked men came in to kill them. They were overshadowed, and heard the voice of God. They saw Nephi and Lehi in the light talking to unseen messengers. Then they heard the voice of the angels talking to them and teaching them. 300 wicked men became righteous that day. They went out and told the Lamanites and apostate Nephites of their experiences and there were thousands converted. Then, they went to teach the Nephites who thought they were still righteous, but they were consumed by pride. The testimonies of these formerly wicked men had a similar impact among the Nephites. So much so, that everyone in the land became righteous.

Yet, here, in our time, we are supposed to shut our mouths and not share the witnesses God has given amongst us?! That is not His purpose. Hasn't Joel stated the God has prepared such witnesses for our time, "young men shall dream dreams, and old men shall see visions?" Shutting the mouths of the people, and not allowing the testimonies to be heard, stops that work. It silences the voices that God would have speak, and it shields them from scrutiny when they cannot testify so powerfully as the lowly boy down the street.
I think you may be underestimating the wickedness of this generation

As Packer said "in the right time and place"

"That they have answered this question not when they were asked, but under the prompting of the spirit, on sacred occasions, when "The spirit beareth record"

Otherwise its pearls before swine

Mormon 9: 19-20

19 And if there were miracles wrought then, why has God ceased to be a God of miracles and yet be an unchangeable Being? And behold, I say unto you he changeth not; if so he would cease to be God; and he ceaseth not to be God, and is a God of miracles.

20 And the reason why he ceaseth to do miracles among the children of men is because that they dwindle in unbelief, and depart from the right way, and know not the God in whom they should trust.

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Fred
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Sunday Live Thread and Recap

Post by Fred »

Serragon wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 1:16 pm
cyclOps wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:43 am Russel M Nelson currently preaching repentance.
But he really doesn't teach what needs to be repented of.

I thought Pres. Nelson's talk was excellent, and I wholeheartedly agree with almost all of it. But once again,

While the president of the church is speaking about giving up our favorite sins and overcoming our natural man, the church itself is increasingly accepting of homosexuality and trans-generism. They are increasingly silent on abortion. They are feminizing our temple ceremonies. They are advocating for complete obedience to worldly authorities, even when that means violating your natural rights or where it interferes with your rights to exercise your religion.
When you do it unto the least of these, you have done it to me. Who is more of a "least of these" than the unborn? Their right to life is removed.

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ransomme
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by ransomme »

endlessismyname wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:22 am “Apostolic witness”

There’s that mushy terminology again.

Elder Holland, what’s the difference between an apostolic witness, and my witness?
God is not a respecter of persons, the only difference between one witness and another is if it is accompanied by the Spirit.

*If not off
Last edited by ransomme on October 17th, 2022, 4:03 am, edited 2 times in total.

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ransomme
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by ransomme »

Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:39 am
TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:28 am
endlessismyname wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:22 am “Apostolic witness”

There’s that mushy terminology again.

Elder Holland, what’s the difference between an apostolic witness, and my witness?
exactly what I exclaimed when he said this? I've heard it before but what is it?
An Apostolic witness is a "Special Witness" Meaning they know him and have been commissioned by him. They have seen him and have received a special sacred witness. President Faust talks about it here, most miss exactly what he is saying. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgxandXWbUk
Hmmm, they never finished that temple in Nauvoo, they tried to dedicate the temple in pieces, but never as a whole.

I'm sorry he never said that he saw Christ. He only said he felt this or that. Didn't see Him or hear His voice. It's careful language so that people can read into them what they will.

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ransomme
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by ransomme »

TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:13 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:56 am
endlessismyname wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:43 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:39 am

An Apostolic witness is a "Special Witness" Meaning they know him and have been commissioned by him. They have seen him and have received a special sacred witness. President Faust talks about it here, most miss exactly what he is saying. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgxandXWbUk
That’s because he doesn’t say what you insinuate he’s saying. Nobody’s missing it, you’re adding it.

President Oaks, on the other hand, explicitly states that as far as he knows, none of the 15 have had the type of witness you blithely claim they have.
You are so full of it, did you listen to it above? He says it right there.

If you have done any study at all you would know there are over 50 statements by apostles that they have seen christ. Those are just the ones that wanted to share.... I have seen Christ and i know they have expereincced much more than me. Tired of everyone saying there are no miracles.

Have you ever listened to this talk by matthew cowley, can you listen to this whole talk and call him a liar? https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/matthew-cowley/miracles/
so you want to quote a 70 year old talk for modern witness? I see an issue here. I also read/watched the referenced comments by Oaks from this century and this decade and he says the opposite. So where is the reality? If they have a physical witness, say it, Paul did, Peter did, Nephi did, etc... they were surely apostles.
This is a problem that I have. The current Brothern do not follow the pattern of PSRs in the scriptures.

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ransomme
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by ransomme »

logonbump wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:45 am
DesertWonderer2 wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:26 am
logonbump wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:23 am Bednar garment-shaming everyone now that lacks the holy robe because rebellion
His discourse is tremendous—obviously you missed the point. Sad.
From u/potatoguard on r/latterdaysaints:
"I know it’s not the true meaning of this talk, but the story of the Wedding Garment has been pretty on the nose for me.

I’ve been struggling with wearing garments. Haven’t really had a testimony of them for years and found “reasons” to convince myself it’s ok to pass on wearing them today or whatever.

Kinda feel like I got called out (in a good way) hahaha"
Umm it's not about the temple garment (*edit sp), rather I think it's about being clothed in righteousness and avoiding idolatry.
Last edited by ransomme on October 15th, 2022, 11:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ransomme
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Sunday Live Thread and Recap

Post by ransomme »

cyclOps wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:58 am This Sunday morning session was full of truth, power, hope, doctrine, and love. It is one of the best sessions in my memory.
Found a pic of cyclOps watching conference
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cyclOps
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Sunday Live Thread and Recap

Post by cyclOps »

ransomme wrote: October 14th, 2022, 6:08 am
cyclOps wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:58 am This Sunday morning session was full of truth, power, hope, doctrine, and love. It is one of the best sessions in my memory.
Found a pic of cyclOps watching conference
I take it you didn’t watch?

There were many users here on the forum who shared my sentiments about the Sunday morning session. Not just who you would conveniently label as TBM.

It is ok to do something other than criticize. Try it.

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ransomme
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Sunday Live Thread and Recap

Post by ransomme »

cyclOps wrote: October 14th, 2022, 7:35 am
ransomme wrote: October 14th, 2022, 6:08 am
cyclOps wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:58 am This Sunday morning session was full of truth, power, hope, doctrine, and love. It is one of the best sessions in my memory.
Found a pic of cyclOps watching conference
I take it you didn’t watch?

There were many users here on the forum who shared my sentiments about the Sunday morning session. Not just who you would conveniently label as TBM.

It is ok to do something other than criticize. Try it.
Actually I did watch. Saturday morning and part of the afternoon were the only ones I was able to watch live tho, as I was traveling.

I had a number of insights that were triggered by watching. But they're were also many disappointments, as I can't tune out falsehoods. There is no excuse for false teachings and carefully prepared speeches.

On one hand I don't fault people for false teachings but I hold the brethren to a higher standard. And like for many, this forum is one of the few places that people can freely speak their peace.

And the picture of the cheerleader was not meant to be derogatory just an accurate description. I didn't pull up a picture of a girly man. Instead the cheerleader is rather athletic and enthusiastic.

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cyclOps
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Sunday Live Thread and Recap

Post by cyclOps »

ransomme wrote: October 14th, 2022, 8:45 am
cyclOps wrote: October 14th, 2022, 7:35 am
ransomme wrote: October 14th, 2022, 6:08 am
cyclOps wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:58 am This Sunday morning session was full of truth, power, hope, doctrine, and love. It is one of the best sessions in my memory.
Found a pic of cyclOps watching conference
I take it you didn’t watch?

There were many users here on the forum who shared my sentiments about the Sunday morning session. Not just who you would conveniently label as TBM.

It is ok to do something other than criticize. Try it.
Actually I did watch. Saturday morning and part of the afternoon were the only ones I was able to watch live tho, as I was traveling.

I had a number of insights that were triggered by watching. But they're were also many disappointments, as I can't tune out falsehoods. There is no excuse for false teachings and carefully prepared speeches.

On one hand I don't fault people for false teachings but I hold the brethren to a higher standard. And like for many, this forum is one of the few places that people can freely speak their peace.

And the picture of the cheerleader was not meant to be derogatory just an accurate description. I didn't pull up a picture of a girly man. Instead the cheerleader is rather athletic and enthusiastic.
Haha that cheerleader looks more LGBTQ than the new For the Strength of Youth cover. Seriously though, thanks for clarifying. I don’t take offense when someone says I’m a cheerleader for truth, power, hope, doctrine, and love.

I’d also like to point out that this forum, though we may feel more free to speak our mind here, is less inspired and contains more false teachings than general conference.

God speed.

Chris
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by Chris »

ransomme wrote: October 14th, 2022, 3:28 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:39 am
TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:28 am
endlessismyname wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:22 am “Apostolic witness”

There’s that mushy terminology again.

Elder Holland, what’s the difference between an apostolic witness, and my witness?
exactly what I exclaimed when he said this? I've heard it before but what is it?
An Apostolic witness is a "Special Witness" Meaning they know him and have been commissioned by him. They have seen him and have received a special sacred witness. President Faust talks about it here, most miss exactly what he is saying. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgxandXWbUk
Hmmm, they never finished that temple in Nauvoo, they tried to dedicate the temple in pieces, but never as a whole.

I'm sorry he never said that he saw Christ. He only said he felt this or that. Didn't see Him or hear His voice. It's careful language so that people can read into them what they will.
you dont seem to know anything. They have rebuilt and redicated the temple completley. He does not say he hasnt seen him that is your insinuation. This is only one example i could list dozens where they actually say the have "seen Christ".......

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Mindfields
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by Mindfields »

PeacefulProtests wrote: October 3rd, 2022, 8:32 pm
TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:13 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:56 am
endlessismyname wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:43 am

That’s because he doesn’t say what you insinuate he’s saying. Nobody’s missing it, you’re adding it.

President Oaks, on the other hand, explicitly states that as far as he knows, none of the 15 have had the type of witness you blithely claim they have.
You are so full of it, did you listen to it above? He says it right there.

If you have done any study at all you would know there are over 50 statements by apostles that they have seen christ. Those are just the ones that wanted to share.... I have seen Christ and i know they have expereincced much more than me. Tired of everyone saying there are no miracles.

Have you ever listened to this talk by matthew cowley, can you listen to this whole talk and call him a liar? https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/matthew-cowley/miracles/
so you want to quote a 70 year old talk for modern witness? I see an issue here. I also read/watched the referenced comments by Oaks from this century and this decade and he says the opposite. So where is the reality? If they have a physical witness, say it, Paul did, Peter did, Nephi did, etc... they were surely apostles.
Reminded me of a quote from the Book "Mine Errand from the Lord" by Boyd K Packer

There are some questions too sacred to discuss. There are some questions that we could not in propriety ask.
One question of this type I am asked occasionally usually by someone who is curious is, "Have you seen him"? That is a question that I have never asked of another. I have not asked that question of my brethren in the council of the Twelve, thinking that it would be so sacred and so personal that one would have to have some special inspiration - indeed, some authorization - even to ask it
Though I have not asked the question of others , I have heard them answer it, - but not when they were asked. I have heard one of my brethren declare, "I know from experience too sacred to relate, that Jesus is the Christ". I have heard another testify, I know that God lives, I know that the Lord Lives, and more than that, I know the Lord." I repeat: that they have answered this question not when they were asked, but under the prompting of the spirit, on sacred occasions, when "The spirit beareth record"
There are some things just too sacred to discuss, not secret, but sacred; not to be discussed, but to be harbored and protected and regarded with the deepest of reverence
I'm not sure what's worse the fact that Packer writes this garbage or the fact that some members actually believe it.
Last edited by Mindfields on October 18th, 2022, 12:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Fred
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by Fred »

PeacefulProtests wrote: October 9th, 2022, 9:41 am
Kit-OTW wrote: October 4th, 2022, 9:39 am
PeacefulProtests wrote: October 3rd, 2022, 8:32 pm
TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 11:13 am

so you want to quote a 70 year old talk for modern witness? I see an issue here. I also read/watched the referenced comments by Oaks from this century and this decade and he says the opposite. So where is the reality? If they have a physical witness, say it, Paul did, Peter did, Nephi did, etc... they were surely apostles.
Reminded me of a quote from the Book "Mine Errand from the Lord" by Boyd K Packer

There are some questions too sacred to discuss. There are some questions that we could not in propriety ask.
One question of this type I am asked occasionally usually by someone who is curious is, "Have you seen him"? That is a question that I have never asked of another. I have not asked that question of my brethren in the council of the Twelve, thinking that it would be so sacred and so personal that one would have to have some special inspiration - indeed, some authorization - even to ask it
Though I have not asked the question of others , I have heard them answer it, - but not when they were asked. I have heard one of my brethren declare, "I know from experience too sacred to relate, that Jesus is the Christ". I have heard another testify, I know that God lives, I know that the Lord Lives, and more than that, I know the Lord." I repeat: that they have answered this question not when they were asked, but under the prompting of the spirit, on sacred occasions, when "The spirit beareth record"
There are some things just too sacred to discuss, not secret, but sacred; not to be discussed, but to be harbored and protected and regarded with the deepest of reverence
Yet, over and over again, in the Book of Mormon and other scriptures, those that have these sacred experiences tell them to others, and convert so many. It is God's plan to have these experiences shared. For example, we just read the account of Nephi and Lehi being in prison. A bunch of wicked men came in to kill them. They were overshadowed, and heard the voice of God. They saw Nephi and Lehi in the light talking to unseen messengers. Then they heard the voice of the angels talking to them and teaching them. 300 wicked men became righteous that day. They went out and told the Lamanites and apostate Nephites of their experiences and there were thousands converted. Then, they went to teach the Nephites who thought they were still righteous, but they were consumed by pride. The testimonies of these formerly wicked men had a similar impact among the Nephites. So much so, that everyone in the land became righteous.

Yet, here, in our time, we are supposed to shut our mouths and not share the witnesses God has given amongst us?! That is not His purpose. Hasn't Joel stated the God has prepared such witnesses for our time, "young men shall dream dreams, and old men shall see visions?" Shutting the mouths of the people, and not allowing the testimonies to be heard, stops that work. It silences the voices that God would have speak, and it shields them from scrutiny when they cannot testify so powerfully as the lowly boy down the street.
I think you may be underestimating the wickedness of this generation

As Packer said "in the right time and place"

"That they have answered this question not when they were asked, but under the prompting of the spirit, on sacred occasions, when "The spirit beareth record"

Otherwise its pearls before swine

Mormon 9: 19-20

19 And if there were miracles wrought then, why has God ceased to be a God of miracles and yet be an unchangeable Being? And behold, I say unto you he changeth not; if so he would cease to be God; and he ceaseth not to be God, and is a God of miracles.

20 And the reason why he ceaseth to do miracles among the children of men is because that they dwindle in unbelief, and depart from the right way, and know not the God in whom they should trust.
I get the part about casting pearls before swine. That only leads to being mocked. But the actual calling of Apostle is to be a missionary. You know, spread the gospel and bare testimony. Today's Apostles do neither.

Considering these men are in their 90s or so, they have had time enough to have witnessed many miracles. I don't mean bribing public officials in order to place a temple. I mean a healing. Or several. Not from the clot shot either. I mean using the power of the Priesthood to alter an event, such as certain death. I have. Many here have. How is it that our Apostles are the only ones that DON'T have a testimony? I don't mean a testimony about how tithing can make a church rich. I mean a spiritual one.

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ransomme
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by ransomme »

Chris wrote: October 15th, 2022, 4:48 pm
ransomme wrote: October 14th, 2022, 3:28 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:39 am
TheDuke wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:28 am

exactly what I exclaimed when he said this? I've heard it before but what is it?
An Apostolic witness is a "Special Witness" Meaning they know him and have been commissioned by him. They have seen him and have received a special sacred witness. President Faust talks about it here, most miss exactly what he is saying. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgxandXWbUk
Hmmm, they never finished that temple in Nauvoo, they tried to dedicate the temple in pieces, but never as a whole.

I'm sorry he never said that he saw Christ. He only said he felt this or that. Didn't see Him or hear His voice. It's careful language so that people can read into them what they will.
you dont seem to know anything. They have rebuilt and redicated the temple completley. He does not say he hasnt seen him that is your insinuation. This is only one example i could list dozens where they actually say the have "seen Christ".......
When were they commanded to build a temple in Nauvoo? Was that original temple ever completed? Nope.
In fact, B.Y. was trying to sell the Temple even before they performed ordinances in the partially completed temple until the uncompleted structure burnt down.

And as others have pointed out DHO comments, and I can cite other Presidents' words admitting that they have never seen in person or vision the Savior or other true messengers from God. IMO that makes it hard to be a special witness.

But you are welcome to share what you believe to be statements affirming such visitations or visions.

Chris
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Posts: 319

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Saturday Live Thread and Recap

Post by Chris »

ransomme wrote: October 15th, 2022, 11:44 pm
Chris wrote: October 15th, 2022, 4:48 pm
ransomme wrote: October 14th, 2022, 3:28 am
Chris wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 10:39 am

An Apostolic witness is a "Special Witness" Meaning they know him and have been commissioned by him. They have seen him and have received a special sacred witness. President Faust talks about it here, most miss exactly what he is saying. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgxandXWbUk
Hmmm, they never finished that temple in Nauvoo, they tried to dedicate the temple in pieces, but never as a whole.

I'm sorry he never said that he saw Christ. He only said he felt this or that. Didn't see Him or hear His voice. It's careful language so that people can read into them what they will.
you dont seem to know anything. They have rebuilt and redicated the temple completley. He does not say he hasnt seen him that is your insinuation. This is only one example i could list dozens where they actually say the have "seen Christ".......
When were they commanded to build a temple in Nauvoo? Was that original temple ever completed? Nope.
In fact, B.Y. was trying to sell the Temple even before they performed ordinances in the partially completed temple until the uncompleted structure burnt down.

And as others have pointed out DHO comments, and I can cite other Presidents' words admitting that they have never seen in person or vision the Savior or other true messengers from God. IMO that makes it hard to be a special witness.

But you are welcome to share what you believe to be statements affirming such visitations or visions.
Here are just a few ------

President Wilford Woodruff
At the dedication of the Salt Lake Temple in April of 1893, Woodruff stated, "Our Savior had appeard unto [me] in the East Room in the Holy of Holies, & told [me] that He had accepted of the Temple & of the dedication services, & that the Lord forgave us His Saints who had assisted in any manner towards the erection and completion of the Temple."[1]

President Lorenzo Snow
This is a more-well known account, which occurred in the House of the Lord at Salt Lake City immediately after the death of Woodruff. President Snow said that "the Lord Jesus Christ appeared to me at the time of the death of President Woodruff. He instructed me to go right ahead and reorganize the First Presidency of the Church at once and not wait as had been done after the death of the previous presidents."[2]

President George Q. Cannon
This experience also occurred during the almost month-long dedication of the House of the Lord in 1893. President Cannon said, "My mind has been rapt in vision and have saw [sic] the beaties and Glory of God. I have saw [sic] and conversed with the Savior face to face."[3]

Elder Orson F. Whitney
Elder Whitney was ordained an Apostle in 1906, along with David O. McKay and George F. Richards. His experience happened while he was on his first mission as a youth. He recollected, "One night I dreamed … that I was in the Garden of Gethsemane, a witness of the Savior’s agony. . . . As He prayed the tears streamed down His face, which was [turned] toward me. . . . Three times this happened, until I was perfectly familiar with His appearance—face, form, and movements. He was of noble stature and of majestic mien . . . the very God that He was and is, yet as meek and lowly as a little child. . . . I could endure it no longer. I ran from behind the tree, fell at His feet, clasped Him around the knees, and begged Him to take me with Him. I shall never forget the kind and gentle manner in which He stooped and raised me up and embraced me. It was so vivid, so real that I felt the very warmth of His bosom against which I rested."

Elder Melvin J. Ballard
Elder Melvin J. Ballard was ordained an Apostle in 1919, serving until 1939. Incidentally, he is the grandfather and namesake of current LDS Apostle M. Russell Ballard. Elder Melvin Ballard had this vision while he was a Mission President in Portland, Oregon, shortly before his ordination to the Apostleship. He remembered, "'I saw, seated on a raised platform, the most glorious Being my eyes have ever beheld or that I ever conceived existed in all the eternal worlds. As I approached to be introduced, He arose and stepped towards me with extended arms, and He smiled as He softly spoke my name. If I shall live to be a million years old, I shall never forget that smile. He took me into his arms and kissed me, pressed me to His bosom, and blessed me, until the marrow of my bones seemed to melt! When He had finished, I fell at His feet, and, as I bathed them with my tears and kisses, I saw the prints of the nails in the feet of the Redeemer of the world. The feeling that I had in the presence of Him who hath all things in His hands, to have His love, His affection, and His blessing was such that if I ever can receive that of which I had but a foretaste, I would give all that I am, all that I ever hope to be, to feel what I then felt!' (quoted by Bryant S. Hinckley, in Sermons and Missionary Service of Melvin J. Ballard [1949], 156)."

Elder David B. Haight
This is the most recent, given in a 1989 General Conference talk, wherein the Apostle recollected his comatose-induced vision he had after a heart attack. Elder Haight said, "I was shown a panoramic view of His earthly ministry: His baptism, His teaching, His healing the sick and lame, the mock trial, His crucifixion, His resurrection and ascension. There followed scenes of His earthly ministry to my mind in impressive detail, confirming scriptural eyewitness accounts. . . . I was given, by the gift and power of the Holy Ghost, a more perfect knowledge of His mission. . . . I cannot begin to convey to you the deep impact that these scenes have confirmed upon my soul."

I hope this information is helpful in helping you understand the true meaning of what it means to be an Apostle of the Lord Jesus Christ.

"In conclusion, please be assured that senior Church leaders who preside over the divinely appointed purposes of the Church receive divine assistance. This guidance comes from the Spirit and sometimes directly from the Savior. Both kinds of spiritual guidance are given. I am grateful to have received such assistance."

- Elder Quentin L. Cook

"We do not talk of those sacred interviews that qualify the servants of the Lord to bear a special witness of Him, for we have been commanded not to do so. But we are free, indeed, we are obliged, to bear that special witness."

"I declare to you that I know that Jesus is the Christ. I know that He lives. He was born in the meridian of time. He taught His gospel, was tried, was crucified. He rose on the third day. He was the first fruits of the resurrection. He has a body of flesh and bone. Of this I bear testimony. Of Him I am a witness.”

-Elder Boyd K. Packer

"Why don’t our talks in general conference and local meetings say more about the miracles we have seen? Most of the miracles we experience are not to be shared. Consistent with the teachings of the scriptures, we hold them sacred and share them only when the Spirit prompts us to do so…In bearing testimonies and in our public addresses we rarely mention our most miraculous experiences, and we rarely rely on signs that the gospel is true. We usually just affirm our testimony of the truthfulness of the restored gospel and give few details on how we obtained it."

-Dallin H Oaks

"I don’t know just how to answer people when they ask the question, ‘Have you seen the Lord?’ I think that the witness that I have and the witness that each of us [apostles] has, and the details of how it came, are too sacred to tell. I have never told anybody some of the experiences I have had, not even my wife. I know that God lives. I not only know that he lives, but I know him."

-Marion G. Romney

"Our Savior had appeard unto [me] in the East Room in the Holy of Holies, & told [me] that He had accepted of the Temple & of the dedication services, & that the Lord forgave us His Saints who had assisted in any manner towards the erection and completion of the Temple."

-Wilford Woodruff

"I know that Jesus lives; for I have seen Him."

-George Q. Cannon

"I know that God lives. I know that Jesus Christ lives,” said John Taylor, my predecessor, “for I have seen him.” I bear this testimony to you brethren in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen."

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