Dating at 16 - the new revelation

[EvanLM]

the last, me, is first. I guess with these posts and the first, you, is now last

unlike you, I have no regrets . . . .like or unlike you, I repented

[EvanLM]

In this case it is true and valid. She made up a thing about being 18 and saying it was a new revelation. I have yet to see the implied revelation and as I have said I have never heard in my 52 years of dating, children and grand children in any ward from CA, NM, OH, UT, NY, etc... never ever said 18. Sure show some references to groups being nice. But, always it was 14 for groups. Always, always because they made a big deal about being 14 for dances and group activities. 16 was for dating, always for the greater church. The 18 was never stated. And sure they will say it is always better to date in groups. But, so, they will say it is better to over pay your offerings, get to church early, fast longer, pray more, etc.... but it is not now or never been even a rule to date at 18. And after being asked there has been no evidence of this claim either. so, I am a bit miffed that stuff like this can come up. Not because it is wrong or out of bounds but because a fraudulent claim is made. Some one has some experience to support it and never does the claim get facts. Like RMN and SRA or RMN as an intentional murderer, etc....

I love LDS FF for discussions but I don't like ridiculous accusations. I mean they are ok to start a topic but if not followed up by a shred of evidence, seems wrong. but I'm just one person. But, one person who loves truth but also honor. We have a range of understandings of those but there is name calling here a few posts back that has no merit. As, opinions are fine but personal attacking gets old very quick.

I've said enough here. Like I said, I have had a bishop, EQP, YMP, etc all say that Coke is against WoW, but I'm smart enough to know the truth and sort out and not blame SLC for it. Seems like a bit of honor goes a ways as well, but I'm old fashion I guess. Not used to a "new normal"

If you look at my comments I shared what has changed.

the post title says it all . . I really thought there was something I missed and so clicked into here . . .

[Mamabear]

In this case it is true and valid. She made up a thing about being 18 and saying it was a new revelation. I have yet to see the implied revelation and as I have said I have never heard in my 52 years of dating, children and grand children in any ward from CA, NM, OH, UT, NY, etc... never ever said 18. Sure show some references to groups being nice. But, always it was 14 for groups. Always, always because they made a big deal about being 14 for dances and group activities. 16 was for dating, always for the greater church. The 18 was never stated. And sure they will say it is always better to date in groups. But, so, they will say it is better to over pay your offerings, get to church early, fast longer, pray more, etc.... but it is not now or never been even a rule to date at 18. And after being asked there has been no evidence of this claim either. so, I am a bit miffed that stuff like this can come up. Not because it is wrong or out of bounds but because a fraudulent claim is made. Some one has some experience to support it and never does the claim get facts. Like RMN and SRA or RMN as an intentional murderer, etc....

I love LDS FF for discussions but I don't like ridiculous accusations. I mean they are ok to start a topic but if not followed up by a shred of evidence, seems wrong. but I'm just one person. But, one person who loves truth but also honor. We have a range of understandings of those but there is name calling here a few posts back that has no merit. As, opinions are fine but personal attacking gets old very quick.

I've said enough here. Like I said, I have had a bishop, EQP, YMP, etc all say that Coke is against WoW, but I'm smart enough to know the truth and sort out and not blame SLC for it. Seems like a bit of honor goes a ways as well, but I'm old fashion I guess. Not used to a "new normal"

If you look at my comments I shared what has changed.

the post title says it all . . I really thought there was something I missed and so clicked into here . . .

Then why are you commenting so much? It seems you have a lot to say.

[EvanLM]

I also being quite unassuming when I was young and immodest. I had no desire to pick up men nor any intention to be immoral with either sex. What a good memory. since none of my friends were immodest we found the suggestions from the church silly as well. Since my mother approved the type of dress and it was cool then I felt ok with it.

hahahahahahahahahahahah I responded cuz I wanted to . . . I forgot that you have only one side and there is no other side to anything. a lot of inactive children grew up in the church and we do have different views on a lot of things.

I think the constitution allows me free speech still. . .till you and Biden and MSM take that away. . .you kinda act like a mormon just saying

time to build Zion

[EvanLM]

so why did you post this ? validation or different comments?

[Mamabear]

I also being quite unassuming when I was young and immodest. I had no desire to pick up men nor any intention to be immoral with either sex. What a good memory. since none of my friends were immodest we found the suggestions from the church silly as well. Since my mother approved the type of dress and it was cool then I felt ok with it.

hahahahahahahahahahahah I responded cuz I wanted to . . . I forgot that you have only one side and there is no other side to anything. a lot of inactive children grew up in the church and we do have different views on a lot of things.

I think the constitution allows me free speech still. . .till you and Biden and MSM take that away. . .you kinda act like a mormon just saying

time to build Zion

It was an observation. I don’t care if you post or not.
Yep, that’s me, like Biden, trying to silence everyone that disagrees with me…
give me a break.

[Mamabear]

so why did you post this ? validation or different comments?

I posted an observation about how dating rules have changed. Group dating at 16 has changed to one on one. That’s it.
Many kids have missed out on normal dating because of what the church taught. Some boys don’t go on a real date until they return home from their missions. Personally, I don’t think it’s good.

[Ado]

I moved around a lot growing up, but wherever I was attending young womens, I remember being taught not to date one on one in high school. Most of my peers saw it as more of a nice suggestion than anything, but a few viewed it as explicit prophetic instruction that we should obey to the T.
I started dating my husband in high school when we were 16. I served a mission, he didn’t. He waited for me. We’ll have been married 10 years this December. I guess we did things a little differently than we were encouraged to, and it worked well for us.

I mentioned the new for the strength of youth instruction to my husband and he joked that maybe the church is concerned with declining marriage numbers.

[spiritMan]

these posts always make me sooooo happy that I was raised by inactive parents. daisy duke shorts and halter tops all my teenage years . . . hitchhiking to yellowstone from Jackson and not even old enough to drive a car. . . 15 years old . . . friend and I got picked up by mototcyclists on the way up . . in a convertible, the way back down to jackson.

wasn't old enough to date but the campsite I was in had 6 of us girls and one dog. every night all the guys were at our campsite. wonder why . .

the best thing is. . some of my friends were nonmormon and all were 17 years or older. absolutely no sex and no drugs among us even though we got offers . . . week long trip and gone from home and no adults

no wonder I love those girls . . and we wore daisy dukes and halter tops and swore

that was so long ago

The sad thing is how women are so easily manipulated.

Why wear daisy dukes?
It's just like bikini's. Why in the world would a woman wear in swimming a tiny piece of cloth over her private parts.

Literally, most women would never leave house and wear bras and panties running around outside . . .but make it so they can go in the water and boom perfectly fine.

the real answer? you want the real answer? cuz my mom thought they were cute . . remember inactive . . no commitment . . . they are not illegal . . and if you are stupid enough to look and drool then shame on you. . . they were cute . . . .hahahahahahahahahahahaha actually my mom asked that we not wear them in our small town but it was ok outside our town . . .we ignored her . . . we were inactive . . . that was a long time ago . . Alma finally grew up, too

"cuz my mom thought they were cute"
"and if you are stupid enough to look and drool then shame on you"

Typical.

Women: I'm going to wear clothes that show off every aspect of my body.
Women: But if a man looks, he is stupid.

Isn't it so nice that women actually really care about how men operate. Absolutely 0 compassion as to how men operate . . .typical.

But women . . yeah they can make up all sorts of BS excuses "they were cute". Give me a break. So sad that your mother wanted you to wear clothes that make you look like you are selling something all b/c she is trying to relive her glory days of being able to swing her hips and make the boys knees shake.

Man, this culture sucks.

[Jonesy]

these posts always make me sooooo happy that I was raised by inactive parents. daisy duke shorts and halter tops all my teenage years . . . hitchhiking to yellowstone from Jackson and not even old enough to drive a car. . . 15 years old . . . friend and I got picked up by mototcyclists on the way up . . in a convertible, the way back down to jackson.

wasn't old enough to date but the campsite I was in had 6 of us girls and one dog. every night all the guys were at our campsite. wonder why . .

the best thing is. . some of my friends were nonmormon and all were 17 years or older. absolutely no sex and no drugs among us even though we got offers . . . week long trip and gone from home and no adults

no wonder I love those girls . . and we wore daisy dukes and halter tops and swore

that was so long ago

The sad thing is how women are so easily manipulated.

Why wear daisy dukes?
It's just like bikini's. Why in the world would a woman wear in swimming a tiny piece of cloth over her private parts.

Literally, most women would never leave house and wear bras and panties running around outside . . .but make it so they can go in the water and boom perfectly fine.

the real answer? you want the real answer? cuz my mom thought they were cute . . remember inactive . . no commitment . . . they are not illegal . . and if you are stupid enough to look and drool then shame on you. . . they were cute . . . .hahahahahahahahahahahaha actually my mom asked that we not wear them in our small town but it was ok outside our town . . .we ignored her . . . we were inactive . . . that was a long time ago . . Alma finally grew up, too

"cuz my mom thought they were cute"
"and if you are stupid enough to look and drool then shame on you"

Typical.

Women: I'm going to wear clothes that show off every aspect of my body.
Women: But if a man looks, he is stupid.

Isn't it so nice that women actually really care about how men operate. Absolutely 0 compassion as to how men operate . . .typical.

But women . . yeah they can make up all sorts of BS excuses "they were cute". Give me a break. So sad that your mother wanted you to wear clothes that make you look like you are selling something all b/c she is trying to relive her glory days of being able to swing her hips and make the boys knees shake.

Man, this culture sucks.

Warning: Dave Chappelle

[Reluctant Watchman]

Why doesn't the church just teach the principle of the Law of Virture/Chastity and then get out of the way? Stop meddling in people's lives.

[Mamabear]

Why doesn't the church just teach the principle of the Law of Virture/Chastity and then get out of the way? Stop meddling in people's lives.

That’s how it always should have been. There should be no pamphlet.
But they have to tell us how to do every single thing.
Case in point, the handbook.

[spiritMan]

Why doesn't the church just teach the principle of the Law of Virture/Chastity and then get out of the way? Stop meddling in people's lives.

Stop messing in people's lives?

Isn't that what a religion is supposed to do? Teach you the proper way to behave in this world?

According to you the only thing the Church should really teach is don't have sex before marriage.

[blitzinstripes]

Just another "commandment" of men and not of God.

But, man, they sure do love their cult level powers of control.

Better walk their line.

[spiritMan]

Why doesn't the church just teach the principle of the Law of Virture/Chastity and then get out of the way? Stop meddling in people's lives.

That’s how it always should have been. There should be no pamphlet.
But they have to tell us how to do every single thing.
Case in point, the handbook.

I would disagree.

People need guidelines they need implementation rules.

Just saying, don't have sex before marriage, whatever else you do is up to you is a real good way to have a completely fractured religion.

Now there has to be a balance between micro managing and saying well just govern yourself.

What we are doing right now is just throwing open the barn doors.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Why doesn't the church just teach the principle of the Law of Virture/Chastity and then get out of the way? Stop meddling in people's lives.

Stop messing in people's lives?

Isn't that what a religion is supposed to do? Teach you the proper way to behave in this world?

According to you the only thing the Church should really teach is don't have sex before marriage.

I guess I should clarify things here. I don't believe the LDS churches teaches the Law of Virtue well at all. I'm talking about a far more in-depth discussion about Virtue, not the myopic view the church teaches in their temples.

[spiritMan]

Why doesn't the church just teach the principle of the Law of Virture/Chastity and then get out of the way? Stop meddling in people's lives.

That’s how it always should have been. There should be no pamphlet.
But they have to tell us how to do every single thing.
Case in point, the handbook.

I totally agree on things like the silliness of one pair of earrings.

Silliness of no green tea.

I think there is a balance and we are way out of balance right now.

[spiritMan]

Why doesn't the church just teach the principle of the Law of Virture/Chastity and then get out of the way? Stop meddling in people's lives.

Stop messing in people's lives?

Isn't that what a religion is supposed to do? Teach you the proper way to behave in this world?

According to you the only thing the Church should really teach is don't have sex before marriage.

I guess I should clarify things here. I don't believe the LDS churches teaches the Law of Virtue well at all. I'm talking about a far more in-depth discussion about Virtue, not the myopic view the church teaches in their temples.

Totally agree with you on that.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Case in point, the handbook.

If members could only see how Pharisaical that thing is.

[blitzinstripes]

"We teach them correct principles and let them govern themselves."- JS

Is it needful to be commanded in very little thing?

It sure seems like Lucifer was a fan of BIG government. In church and politics.

The gospel of JC is beautiful and SIMPLE. Learn and understand those basic principles and allow yourself to be led by the Spirit and revelation. Or you can not have faith in personal revelation and sub contract your right to such to be led by 15 other men. Middle men between you and Christ, who are more than willing to command you in every little thing. In fact, I think they enjoy it very much.

Choose wisely.

[Mamabear]

Why doesn't the church just teach the principle of the Law of Virture/Chastity and then get out of the way? Stop meddling in people's lives.

That’s how it always should have been. There should be no pamphlet.
But they have to tell us how to do every single thing.
Case in point, the handbook.

I would disagree.

People need guidelines they need implementation rules.

Just saying, don't have sex before marriage, whatever else you do is up to you is a real good way to have a completely fractured religion.

Now there has to be a balance between micro managing and saying well just govern yourself.

What we are doing right now is just throwing open the barn doors.

That’s up to the parents not the church. The church needs to teach doctrine contained in the scriptures (which is pretty detailed in the New Testament by Christ and his apostles regarding virtue and purity) and let parents lead their children.

[Reluctant Watchman]

"We teach them correct principles and let them govern themselves."- JS

Is it needful to be commanded in very little thing?

It sure seems like Lucifer was a fan of BIG government. In church and politics.

The gospel of JC is beautiful and SIMPLE. Learn and understand those basic principles and allow yourself to be led by the Spirit and revelation. Or you can not have faith in personal revelation and sub contract your right to such to be led by 15 other men. Middle men between you and Christ, who are more than willing to command you in every little thing. In fact, I think they enjoy it very much.

Choose wisely.

Lower kingdoms require more "commandments" of men. Higher kingdoms require less control by leadership.

[francisco.colaco]

The gospel of JC is beautiful and SIMPLE. Learn and understand those basic principles and allow yourself to be led by the Spirit and revelation. Or you can not have faith in personal revelation and sub contract your right to such to be led by 15 other men. Middle men between you and Christ, who are more than willing to command you in every little thing. In fact, I think they enjoy it very much.

Choose wisely.

Well, we don't really have to choose, do we? Personal revelation does not replace general revelation, but supplements it.

Uphold the latter, and you'll have plenty of the former. Reject the servants of the Lord and the Lord will think you shan't need any of your own.

It's all a matter of circles of influence: I cannot receive, safe in very special and rare circumstances, which also came up to me once or twice, revelation for those to whom I have no responsibility: a neighbour, a friend, an acquaintance or a person who does not enter on my circle of authority. Besides that, I have NO right, safe under very stressful and rare circumstances, to receive revelation on those issues that do not pertain to me about anyone, even under my responsibility. Hence the word STRESSFUL, which I carefully measured. That is why, for GENERIC issues on GENERIC populations, the Lord will require availed and certified prophets.

And then you can receive personal revelation. I would recall that those that talk more on personal revelation versus the revelation by Church quora once believed and were confirmed by the "Spirit" the spews of Julie Rowe, Spencer, and that Hector guy; and, from time to time, put here that infamous and famed Wilford Woodruff revelation that would require a 160 years old man living in Utah for it to come forth.

Did I mention that ALL THOSE PROPHETS OF HEAVY-STOMACH NIGHTMARES FAILED MISERABLY? That should be a lesson to everyone that talks here about Nelson. Oh!, and let me mention: it takes intelligence to learn lessons before hitting the dust face down, coming into the realisation that too much wrong path has been travelled to be able to correct the course.

[francisco.colaco]

Lower kingdoms require more "commandments" of men. Higher kingdoms require less control by leadership.

Understanding what you say, and agreeing in generics, let me say that leadership does not control. If you think the Church controls you too much, try to live your life without the Church. Then you'll know what real control is!

It is Satan who gives you an illusion of freedom, while he measures the rope that will constrain you.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Lower kingdoms require more "commandments" of men. Higher kingdoms require less control by leadership.

Understanding what you say, and agreeing in generics, let me say that leadership does not control. If you think the Church controls you too much, try to live your life without the Church. Then you'll know what real control is!

It is Satan who gives you an illusion of freedom, while he measures the rope that will constrain you.

True leadership does not control, coerce or compel. They teach and invite.

Oh, and yes, I am living my life without "the church", but not without Jesus and his teachings and love and mercy.