Latest from the mission field

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Christianlee
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Christianlee »

spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:00 pm
Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 3:58 pm I am sorry to interject, but two boys kissing each other on the lips is completely unnatural. Two boys feeling romantic love is completely unnatural. In the natural course of things such acts and feelings are the precursor to the union of a man and a woman having sexual relations in marriage which God has defined. The other union is completely condemned multiple times in scripture. Openly accepting such acts as natural has traditionally. been condemned by believing Christians. At least the closet protected the rest of society from the open rebellion which such acts symbolize. I understand we live in a fallen world, but Christians are called to reject acts and feelings which God’s inspired scripture condemns. Babylon will be Babylon, but we are called even in our failures to pursue self-control.
I would not say unnatural. I would say it is not Christian.

Many cultures throughout history have had homosexual behaviors and they have been labeled as perfectly fine. It is not Christian.
In the natural law tradition such acts and feelings would be considered unnatural since the acts don’t lead to the purpose nature intended. If homosexual actions were accepted in non-Christian cultures it is only a confirmation of their fallen natures.

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HereWeGo
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by HereWeGo »

I am sorry for derailing the discussion from Mission Field experiences to BYU experiences and the right and wrong of gayness.

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:05 pm
spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:00 pm
Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 3:58 pm I am sorry to interject, but two boys kissing each other on the lips is completely unnatural. Two boys feeling romantic love is completely unnatural. In the natural course of things such acts and feelings are the precursor to the union of a man and a woman having sexual relations in marriage which God has defined. The other union is completely condemned multiple times in scripture. Openly accepting such acts as natural has traditionally. been condemned by believing Christians. At least the closet protected the rest of society from the open rebellion which such acts symbolize. I understand we live in a fallen world, but Christians are called to reject acts and feelings which God’s inspired scripture condemns. Babylon will be Babylon, but we are called even in our failures to pursue self-control.
I would not say unnatural. I would say it is not Christian.

Many cultures throughout history have had homosexual behaviors and they have been labeled as perfectly fine. It is not Christian.
In the natural law tradition such acts and feelings would be considered unnatural since the acts don’t lead to the purpose nature intended. If homosexual actions were accepted in non-Christian cultures it is only a confirmation of their fallen natures.
I'm in total agreement.

I mean that I think we should be careful in saying what is natural or unnatural. The ungodly (or natural) man is consumed with lust and as such will abuse his/her body and others to fulfill that lust. Lust is ungodly and only a Judeo-Christian ethics will call that out.

We are not in a Christian world anymore (even within the Church) so that is why I think caution needs to be given to the use of the word natural/unnatural.

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

HereWeGo wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:10 pm I am sorry for derailing the discussion from Mission Field experiences to BYU experiences and the right and wrong of gayness.
I don't think it's a derailment (maybe others might); I think it's integral to the discussion.

Christianlee
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Christianlee »

HereWeGo wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:10 pm I am sorry for derailing the discussion from Mission Field experiences to BYU experiences and the right and wrong of gayness.
The original post was all about lesbians being accepted as missionaries even while openly spouting in favor of the Rainbow Jihad.

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

Queer is good! Queer is here to teach everyone else how to love better!

Richard Ostler
Yesterday at 8:29 AM ·
Episode 570: Elder Shane Carpenter, Gay Missionary, Disciple of Christ.
My friend, Elder Shane Carpenter, joins us as a full-time missionary from the California, Anaheim Mission of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to share his story as an openly gay missionary. Elder Carpenter states he wanted to be "my authentic self so I could become something better,” and be in a better position to help people come unto Christ. His podcast episode, with approval from his Mission Leaders, was recorded in the final days of his successful mission.
Elder Carpenter talks about coming out to and receiving support from his parents (Diane and Scott Carpenter), Bishop, and Stake President before leaving to serve as well as during his mission experience.
He then shares about his supportive Mission Leaders who asked Elder Carpenter to conduct 2 mission trainings surrounding his experience as a gay Latter-day Saint—including 2 unprecedented mission--wide Q&As focused on teaching and loving our LGBTQ+ friends.
Elder Carpenter talks about his supportive companions, becoming a trainer, and success helping people come unto Christ through our Restored Gospel. You can read more about his experience becoming a trainer with this Facebook post: https://www.facebook.com/imnotashaned/p ... 3212526060
This is a great podcast for all LGBTQ+ members considering a mission as well as all those wishing to better support LGBTQ+ missionaries and church members. All involved in this story are helping to create Zion—where we are unified in our needed difference to help more come unto Christ.
Thank you, Elder Carpenter, for your courage—you are a true disciple of Christ—you are also a warrior and a pioneer. All involved in this story are helping to pave the way for future LGBTQ+ missionaries. Thanks for helping all of our Heavenly Parents’ children feel they are loved and needed.
Richard 'Papa' Ostler ❤️
https://www.listenlearnandlove.org/gay-lesbian-same-sex...
Podcast Link: https://podcasts.apple.com/.../episode.../id1347971725...
** Please Check Out My LGBTQ Book At: **
Deseret Book: http://www.deseretbook.com/.../listen-learn-and-love...
Amazon: www.amazon.com/dp/1462135773
** Want to develop church-supported LGBTQ activities in your local area? Please join our FB group below **
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1433556613672143

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

"He helped me see that my authenticity as a gay missionary was and is one of the many identities that make up my collective whole. The center of that whole, however, is not that I am gay"

Ummm . . .yeah sure right dude. Except you give podcasts about being queer, you give DIE training in the mission field about being queer. Tell me again about how the center isn't that you are queer.

What a bunch of self-righteous, jerks.

Lizzy60
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Lizzy60 »

spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:25 pm "He helped me see that my authenticity as a gay missionary was and is one of the many identities that make up my collective whole. The center of that whole, however, is not that I am gay"

Ummm . . .yeah sure right dude. Except you give podcasts about being queer, you give DIE training in the mission field about being queer. Tell me again about how the center isn't that you are queer.

What a bunch of self-righteous, jerks.
Out of over 50,000 missionaries, he is doing this podcast with Mr Ostler precisely because he is openly and proudly GAY, and his gayness has been accepted and celebrated by his parents, friends, fellow missionaries, bishop, stake president and mission presidency. This podcast was not about his collective whole, whatever the freak that is.

Lizzy60
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Lizzy60 »

Richard Ostler is a snake. A total snake.
My niece married a bisexual man, in the temple, and they have three kids, and did a podcast with Mr Ostler on how they make it work. Of course it was all about the bi-guy. At one point my niece just said, I don’t think about it, I have my own stuff to think about. Trouble in paradise???

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

My notes:

Nice . . .this podcast is approved by the Mission President.

They call him, warriors, trailblazers and heroes.
The mission president told him to talk about his homosexuality.
He was a trainer. Training as an openly queer missionary.

He is a pioneer and trailblazer. He is extremely happy to share his experiences. He is calling queers to serve as missionaries, giving them doctrinal and cultural hope to serve. His MTC experience was on-line. He wanted to be open. He made a commitment to serve authentically.

So it's all about being "authentic". No role-models, and this is a way forward for many more missionaries and mission presidents. They have used his gifts to help grow the mission.


Man . . .this poor kid. Seriously this kid is so confused. He has been so influenced by the culture and by bad examples that he needs to be authentic. In so many ways, this kid is just a pawn. I can tell in his voice that he is so confused. He has no concept of taking up your cross and crucifying your passions on the cross. Man alive, I'm so sorry for this kid. He should never have served, but he needed good leaders to help him understand Christ and understand taking up his cross.

This kid needs Christ so badly, he doesn't need to be a missionary.

I'm sorry, I can't listen to this anymore. There is nothing about Christ, nothing about repentance, nothing about coming unto Christ. It's all me, me, me, me. Nothing of self-sacrifice, nothing about bridling passions.

We are done.

Christianlee
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Christianlee »

Lizzy60 wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:35 pm Richard Ostler is a snake. A total snake.
My niece married a bisexual man, in the temple, and they have three kids, and did a podcast with Mr Ostler on how they make it work. Of course it was all about the bi-guy. At one point my niece just said, I don’t think about it, I have my own stuff to think about. Trouble in paradise???
Anyone can be bi I suppose though most simply aren’t. At least he is following God’s command to multiply and replenish the earth. I am not sure why he has a compulsion to talk about it. That may not be the best way to demonstrate faithfulness to a wife. Most men do not go around expressing their desire to commit adultery.

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

Lizzy60 wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:32 pm
spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:25 pm "He helped me see that my authenticity as a gay missionary was and is one of the many identities that make up my collective whole. The center of that whole, however, is not that I am gay"

Ummm . . .yeah sure right dude. Except you give podcasts about being queer, you give DIE training in the mission field about being queer. Tell me again about how the center isn't that you are queer.

What a bunch of self-righteous, jerks.
Out of over 50,000 missionaries, he is doing this podcast with Mr Ostler precisely because he is openly and proudly GAY, and his gayness has been accepted and celebrated by his parents, friends, fellow missionaries, bishop, stake president and mission presidency. This podcast was not about his collective whole, whatever the freak that is.
My God Liz. . . . seriously I feel so incredibly horrible for this young man.

He is being used as a total pawn. Now, I'm sure he has some culpability in allowing himself to be used, but it's evident this kid wants to do what is right. He has just been told and preached to that the best way to do what is right is to be "authentic", that being queer is his "identity" that he has to do these things.

This is going to get real, real bad. Ostler has some serious reach, this is going to get out, now that MPs are endorsing this. There is absolutely a deep dark underbelly here and he is being used as a pawn.

Christianlee
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Christianlee »

Maybe they need to start publishing “The Miracle of Forgiveness” again. Sure it made people feel guilty and face the fact people need to repent, but it seems like that could be helpful to this generation.

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:58 pm Maybe they need to start publishing “The Miracle of Forgiveness” again. Sure it made people feel guilty and face the fact people need to repent, but it seems like that could be helpful to this generation.
Not going to happen. TMF isn't even published by Deseret Books anymore.

Lizzy60
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Lizzy60 »

spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 5:02 pm
Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:58 pm Maybe they need to start publishing “The Miracle of Forgiveness” again. Sure it made people feel guilty and face the fact people need to repent, but it seems like that could be helpful to this generation.
Not going to happen. TMF isn't even published by Deseret Books anymore.
There are several people who search for copies at Deseret Industries and buy them and burn them to get them out of circulation. They post pics online.

Christianlee
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Christianlee »

Lizzy60 wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 5:15 pm
spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 5:02 pm
Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:58 pm Maybe they need to start publishing “The Miracle of Forgiveness” again. Sure it made people feel guilty and face the fact people need to repent, but it seems like that could be helpful to this generation.
Not going to happen. TMF isn't even published by Deseret Books anymore.
There are several people who search for copies at Deseret Industries and buy them and burn them to get them out of circulation. They post pics online.
That about says it all about the current generation of Mormons. We all are damaged goods, but not facing that fact and recognizing we are called to holiness is a cop-out. God gave us Jesus because he knows we can do so much better with Him at our side. Instead we revel in our sin and choose our own desires over His desire for us. It may take a nuke to wake us up. And I mean woke in the right way. I don’t exempt myself from needing that wake-up call.

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 5:30 pm
Lizzy60 wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 5:15 pm
spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 5:02 pm
Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:58 pm Maybe they need to start publishing “The Miracle of Forgiveness” again. Sure it made people feel guilty and face the fact people need to repent, but it seems like that could be helpful to this generation.
Not going to happen. TMF isn't even published by Deseret Books anymore.
There are several people who search for copies at Deseret Industries and buy them and burn them to get them out of circulation. They post pics online.
That about says it all about the current generation of Mormons. We all are damaged goods, but not facing that fact and recognizing we are called to holiness is a cop-out. God gave us Jesus because he knows we can do so much better with Him at our side. Instead we revel in our sin and choose our own desires over His desire for us. It may take a nuke to wake us up. And I mean woke in the right way. I don’t exempt myself from needing that wake-up call.
Same here, I make no excuses for my poor behavior, I need a good call to repentance myself.

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ithink
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by ithink »

spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 2:59 pm
Narnia wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 2:11 pm
Artaxerxes wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 12:43 pm
Narnia wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 12:32 pm

3 Nephi 12
27 Behold, it is written by them of old time, that thou shalt not commit adultery;
28 But I say unto you, that whosoever looketh on a woman, to lust after her, hath committed adultery already in his heart.
Should we not keep out hearts & thoughts pure as well as actions?
We absolutely should keep our thoughts and hearts pure. But recognizing our temptations is not the same thing as lusting. Straight people recognize that they're attracted to people of the other gender. That isn't a sin. Choosing to indulge in lustful thoughts is.

The same standard applies to people with same sex attraction.
When they openly identify themselves are lgbt, they should not be allow to go to serve a mission! They put their companions in danger because they live together. Why do BYU’s dormitories or approved apartments have to separate girls from boys? At least it keeps the temptation away from them, right? Now, we are saying it’s ok for the same sex attraction guys to live with the same sex companions? Is that ok to put that temptation to them just because they are the same sex? Or are we ok to allow those same sex attraction guys to brain wash their companions, so they can breeding more same sex attraction guys?
Yes, yes, yes.

I have been shouting this for years that the house is on fire, the house is on fire, the house is on fire.

In 2016 to 2017 the Church changed a fundamental doctrine. For the first time, they stated on the Church's website that it was OFFICIALLY okay for an individual to openly proclaim and self-identify as LGBTQ. As long as they did not DO anything else-they were "worthy in every single way".

That change has lead to where we are now in the Church. It is why we have openly homosexual missionaries. It is why the rainbow is so strong now.

It is why in the previous FSY booklet (and in the previous handbook) it explicitly stated ALL homosexual activities are sinful. Now it does not.

The Church is left in limbo . . .well one can openly proclaim one is LGBTQ . . .okay now what? Can a person go on a romantic same-sex date; they haven't had homosexual sex? Are they worthy now?

The Church handbook allows baptized men to proclaim they are women and they can now go into the relief society.
The Church handbook allows a homosexual couple who is NOT members of the Church to have babies that they have somehow obtained (through adoption, surrogacy, divorce, etc.) to be blessed and given a name on Church records! A couple that isn't even members, is living in gross sin is allowed to have a baby put on Church records.

What the hell are we doing?
Those babies might grow up to be rock hard straight up tithepaying members. :o

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

ithink wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 6:10 pm
spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 2:59 pm
Narnia wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 2:11 pm
Artaxerxes wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 12:43 pm

We absolutely should keep our thoughts and hearts pure. But recognizing our temptations is not the same thing as lusting. Straight people recognize that they're attracted to people of the other gender. That isn't a sin. Choosing to indulge in lustful thoughts is.

The same standard applies to people with same sex attraction.
When they openly identify themselves are lgbt, they should not be allow to go to serve a mission! They put their companions in danger because they live together. Why do BYU’s dormitories or approved apartments have to separate girls from boys? At least it keeps the temptation away from them, right? Now, we are saying it’s ok for the same sex attraction guys to live with the same sex companions? Is that ok to put that temptation to them just because they are the same sex? Or are we ok to allow those same sex attraction guys to brain wash their companions, so they can breeding more same sex attraction guys?
Yes, yes, yes.

I have been shouting this for years that the house is on fire, the house is on fire, the house is on fire.

In 2016 to 2017 the Church changed a fundamental doctrine. For the first time, they stated on the Church's website that it was OFFICIALLY okay for an individual to openly proclaim and self-identify as LGBTQ. As long as they did not DO anything else-they were "worthy in every single way".

That change has lead to where we are now in the Church. It is why we have openly homosexual missionaries. It is why the rainbow is so strong now.

It is why in the previous FSY booklet (and in the previous handbook) it explicitly stated ALL homosexual activities are sinful. Now it does not.

The Church is left in limbo . . .well one can openly proclaim one is LGBTQ . . .okay now what? Can a person go on a romantic same-sex date; they haven't had homosexual sex? Are they worthy now?

The Church handbook allows baptized men to proclaim they are women and they can now go into the relief society.
The Church handbook allows a homosexual couple who is NOT members of the Church to have babies that they have somehow obtained (through adoption, surrogacy, divorce, etc.) to be blessed and given a name on Church records! A couple that isn't even members, is living in gross sin is allowed to have a baby put on Church records.

What the hell are we doing?
Those babies might grow up to be rock hard straight up tithepaying members. :o
Right... and all the while I'm sure that in 20 years they will say the adults who raised them were wicked and ungodly.

I'm sure the ward will stand firm in saying homosexuality is sinful.

But hey all that really matters is that they keep paying money to an organization.

Yeap you got that exactly right. All that matters is that people pay that tithing money... who really cares if they actually take upon themselves the cross and put to death their ungodly desires.

Just as long as they keep paying tithing!!!!!
Pay that money to get into heaven.

logonbump
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by logonbump »

Sunain wrote: October 1st, 2022, 9:19 am
Lineman1012 wrote: September 30th, 2022, 9:53 pm Recently had dinner with a couple that have a daughter on a mission here in the USA. They had just talk to her that day on her weekly call home. She said she wanted to come home as she is very discouraged. She’s On her third rainbow companion. These girls are out there on the gay agenda. They even go against the teachings of the church. My friend’s daughter says she spends more time defending the church against her companions than with the people.

The thing that was new to me was how many missionaries have left the mission field and gone home. She reported that 14 missionaries had come out together from the MTC. That 12 had gone home and that there was only one sister and one elder still in the mission field from that group after one year. She also reported that the mission president is discourage because everyone’s quitting and going home. There’s not much he can do.

That really sounds like a lot of homesick missionaries. That can’t be the normal attrition rate, can it?

Homosexuality should disqualify you from missionary service just like the list of all the other sins that do.

Can you imagine being seduced, as a missionary, by your own companion?

spiritMan
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by spiritMan »

logonbump wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 8:47 pm
Sunain wrote: October 1st, 2022, 9:19 am
Lineman1012 wrote: September 30th, 2022, 9:53 pm Recently had dinner with a couple that have a daughter on a mission here in the USA. They had just talk to her that day on her weekly call home. She said she wanted to come home as she is very discouraged. She’s On her third rainbow companion. These girls are out there on the gay agenda. They even go against the teachings of the church. My friend’s daughter says she spends more time defending the church against her companions than with the people.

The thing that was new to me was how many missionaries have left the mission field and gone home. She reported that 14 missionaries had come out together from the MTC. That 12 had gone home and that there was only one sister and one elder still in the mission field from that group after one year. She also reported that the mission president is discourage because everyone’s quitting and going home. There’s not much he can do.

That really sounds like a lot of homesick missionaries. That can’t be the normal attrition rate, can it?

Homosexuality should disqualify you from missionary service just like the list of all the other sins that do.

Can you imagine being seduced, as a missionary, by your own companion?
Go on a mission, find your eternal queer companion!

Lizzy60
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Lizzy60 »

spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 9:00 pm
logonbump wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 8:47 pm
Sunain wrote: October 1st, 2022, 9:19 am
Lineman1012 wrote: September 30th, 2022, 9:53 pm Recently had dinner with a couple that have a daughter on a mission here in the USA. They had just talk to her that day on her weekly call home. She said she wanted to come home as she is very discouraged. She’s On her third rainbow companion. These girls are out there on the gay agenda. They even go against the teachings of the church. My friend’s daughter says she spends more time defending the church against her companions than with the people.

The thing that was new to me was how many missionaries have left the mission field and gone home. She reported that 14 missionaries had come out together from the MTC. That 12 had gone home and that there was only one sister and one elder still in the mission field from that group after one year. She also reported that the mission president is discourage because everyone’s quitting and going home. There’s not much he can do.

That really sounds like a lot of homesick missionaries. That can’t be the normal attrition rate, can it?

Homosexuality should disqualify you from missionary service just like the list of all the other sins that do.

Can you imagine being seduced, as a missionary, by your own companion?
Go on a mission, find your eternal queer companion!
That is actually happening, right now, today. Not just missions, but FSY, girls’ camps, young men’s activities, queer proms at Utah high schools.......Mormon youth don’t need those queer dating apps, they have it all right in front of them. Currently Utah is probably the best place for queer LDS to meet like-minded life companions.

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Lineman1012
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by Lineman1012 »

spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 2:59 pm
Narnia wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 2:11 pm
Artaxerxes wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 12:43 pm
Narnia wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 12:32 pm

3 Nephi 12
27 Behold, it is written by them of old time, that thou shalt not commit adultery;
28 But I say unto you, that whosoever looketh on a woman, to lust after her, hath committed adultery already in his heart.
Should we not keep out hearts & thoughts pure as well as actions?
We absolutely should keep our thoughts and hearts pure. But recognizing our temptations is not the same thing as lusting. Straight people recognize that they're attracted to people of the other gender. That isn't a sin. Choosing to indulge in lustful thoughts is.

The same standard applies to people with same sex attraction.
When they openly identify themselves are lgbt, they should not be allow to go to serve a mission! They put their companions in danger because they live together. Why do BYU’s dormitories or approved apartments have to separate girls from boys? At least it keeps the temptation away from them, right? Now, we are saying it’s ok for the same sex attraction guys to live with the same sex companions? Is that ok to put that temptation to them just because they are the same sex? Or are we ok to allow those same sex attraction guys to brain wash their companions, so they can breeding more same sex attraction guys?
Yes, yes, yes.

I have been shouting this for years that the house is on fire, the house is on fire, the house is on fire.

In 2016 to 2017 the Church changed a fundamental doctrine. For the first time, they stated on the Church's website that it was OFFICIALLY okay for an individual to openly proclaim and self-identify as LGBTQ. As long as they did not DO anything else-they were "worthy in every single way".

That change has lead to where we are now in the Church. It is why we have openly homosexual missionaries. It is why the rainbow is so strong now.

It is why in the previous FSY booklet (and in the previous handbook) it explicitly stated ALL homosexual activities are sinful. Now it does not.

The Church is left in limbo . . .well one can openly proclaim one is LGBTQ . . .okay now what? Can a person go on a romantic same-sex date; they haven't had homosexual sex? Are they worthy now?

The Church handbook allows baptized men to proclaim they are women and they can now go into the relief society.
The Church handbook allows a homosexual couple who is NOT members of the Church to have babies that they have somehow obtained (through adoption, surrogacy, divorce, etc.) to be blessed and given a name on Church records! A couple that isn't even members, is living in gross sin is allowed to have a baby put on Church records.

What the hell are we doing?
We are heading towards “the abomination of desolation “ - which is marrying/sealing a gay couple in the temple.

LGBTQ+ = death. It’s simply using your procreative powers every way you can think of except for the way it is supposed to be used to create life. And sealing a gay/lesbian/queer (whatever you want to all it) together for eternity (even if it’s just symbolic) is a slap in the face of God.

A gay/queer missionary - Where is the shame?

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gruden2.0
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by gruden2.0 »

Looking at it from a personal point of view, my wife and I and our combined siblings produced 3 missionaries from among us, and at one time was 9 active church members. Now only 2 are active (of course those 2 are former missionaries).
Combined we all have 10 children who are or will soon be at missionary age, but have only produced 1 missionary (he arrived home earlier this year, he served a full mission). He will be the only one, the rest have already passed or shown zero interest.

In my city we had 2 wards, now they have collapsed them into a single ward recently.

From what I've seen, the Millenials aren't terribly interested in religion, particularly ones with more conservative or traditional-based doctrines and liturgies like Mormonism. It would not surprise me if the leadership made a play to lure them back by liberalizing the doctrines and liturgies. I don't think it will end well.

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gruden2.0
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Re: Latest from the mission field

Post by gruden2.0 »

Lizzy60 wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 5:15 pm
spiritMan wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 5:02 pm
Christianlee wrote: October 2nd, 2022, 4:58 pm Maybe they need to start publishing “The Miracle of Forgiveness” again. Sure it made people feel guilty and face the fact people need to repent, but it seems like that could be helpful to this generation.
Not going to happen. TMF isn't even published by Deseret Books anymore.
There are several people who search for copies at Deseret Industries and buy them and burn them to get them out of circulation. They post pics online.
Odd that people would go through so much effort. I read it years ago, I don't think it was a helpful book, but I wouldn't burn it (not a believer in burning books). I did throw my copy of Visions of Glory away.

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