General Conference October 2022 - Rumors & Predictions

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Dusty Wanderer
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Dusty Wanderer »

J2 wrote: September 21st, 2022, 10:47 pm I do think it's strange that, for last April's conference, they last-minute did away with the Priesthood Session and had another women's session instead.

And for this upcoming conference they are just having a regular general session for Saturday evening. No session for the men to make it fair and balanced.

If I didn't know better, I'd think that they don't care about the men in the church anymore. These days I guess even the church thinks "patriarchy" is evil.

But this has been discussed in other threads, particularly those discussing the 2019 temple changes.
I also found this very interesting.

I wonder if it isn't a deliberate widening of the gulf between the priestly cast (those in authority positions rooted in corporate positions/stipends, ie. greater bureaucratic influence) and the lay clergy and legacy patriarchy figures, ie. fathers/brothers (those that are more "beyond reproach", as I heard it put from a stake pres. once).

Must paint a clear picture to the body of the church where to turn for relevant priesthood. It's too risky to allow the legacy patriarchy figures to interpret the message to their families over the traditional dinner following Priesthood Session. It's more efficient and controllable to have them bypass said legacy patriarchy figures altogether and just go directly to their correlation daddy instead.

Mamabear
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Mamabear »

Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.
06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg
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19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
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FrankOne
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by FrankOne »

Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
just an open inquiry, what if both the mason's rituals and those of the temple are both right? Many of the concepts of masonry are found in mormon doctrine. The one that really stands out is the teaching that men are to evolve to become Gods. I don't think there are any other organizations that teach this excepting those that are affiliated or had the same root as masonry , ie, Rosicrucian.

There's a book that was an authorized print which gives some of the doctrines of Rosicrucians . The book is quite revelatory. The seeming end goal, according to Mormon doctrine , is to become a God. The Rosicrucian teaching goes one step further and says that in the 'very end' , even the Gods will return home. It's the idea that time itself is merely a teaching device and it will have an end. I tend to follow that ideal.

"The Secret Doctrine of The Rosicrucians"

Mamabear
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Mamabear »

FrankOne wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 7:09 pm
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
just an open inquiry, what if both the mason's rituals and those of the temple are both right? Many of the concepts of masonry are found in mormon doctrine. The one that really stands out is the teaching that men are to evolve to become Gods. I don't think there are any other organizations that teach this excepting those that are affiliated or had the same root as masonry , ie, Rosicrucian.

There's a book that was an authorized print which gives some of the doctrines of Rosicrucians . The book is quite revelatory. The seeming end goal, according to Mormon doctrine , is to become a God. The Rosicrucian teaching goes one step further and says that in the 'very end' , even the Gods will return home. It's the idea that time itself is merely a teaching device and it will have an end. I tend to follow that ideal.

"The Secret Doctrine of The Rosicrucians"
I believe they’re both wrong.

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Luke
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Luke »

Subcomandante wrote: September 19th, 2022, 3:24 pm
I'll scale this on a 0 to 10 scale (0 being not at all probable, 10 being a nearly absolute certainty)

* * *

"Nothing prophetic" - by LDSFF standards 8 by TBM standards 3
By actual standards, 10

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Silver Pie
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Silver Pie »

I'm pretty sure they won't admit that.

I believe that Joseph recognized something true in the mason ritual. If both he and BY were masons, that would explain why BY remembered the ritual enough to share it (with embellishments that Joseph did not put there).
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg

LDS Watchman
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by LDS Watchman »

Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
You have it backwards. Joseph Smith taught that Masonry is a corrupted form of the endowment.

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Being There
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Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
http://www.mormonthink.com/temple.htm

also

https://www.mormonstories.org/truth-cla ... y-masonry/

TEMPLE CEREMONY / MASONRY
LDS temples play an integral part in the Mormon experience, hosting the religion’s most sacred rituals and ordinances. Only members who have participated in a multi-tier personal interview process with patriarchal leaders are granted permission to enter. Therein, Mormons are instructed that the knowledge, tokens, and signs obtained within the temple will provide passage through the veil into the Kingdom of Heaven.

In the early years of the Church, numerous Mormon leaders and members of the Smith family were Freemasons, including Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Joseph’s older brother Hyrum. Joseph Smith also joined the Freemasons, introducing the LDS temple ceremonies a mere seven weeks after receiving their rituals, secret hand grips, embraces, clothing, tokens, and penalties. The Church has no records or journal entries of revelations regarding temple ceremonies or covenants. For generations, the Church vigorously denied Masonry’s influence while declaring its own ceremonies to be a different, more purifying experience. The Church even went so far as to chastise historians who accurately documented the striking similarities.

Given that the majority of temple ordinances are for the dead, some question why the Church spends billions of dollars on spacious buildings for only the exclusive few. Jesus suggested, “Let the dead bury their dead…come follow me.” Church historian Leonard Arrington said, “I have not yet come to feel the necessity of frequent attendance at the temple. I think I get as much inspiration watching birds, or looking at the mountains and the wilderness, as participating in the rituals there.” [1]

Image


MASONIC HANDSHAKES WILL LOOK FAMILIAR TO MORMONS

MASONIC ORIGINS
Masonic author Mervin Hogan observed, “It must be readily acknowledged that Mormonism and Freemasonry are so intimately and inextricably interwoven and interrelated that the two can never be dissociated.”

Freemasonry formed somewhere between the 10th and 17th centuries in England and, contrary to what one may claim, possesses no link to the Biblical temple of Solomon or temple builder Hiram Abiff that its ceremonies center on. LDS author Greg Kerney writes,“Unfortunately there is no historical evidence to support a continuous functioning line from Solomon’s temple to present. We know what went on in Solomon’s temple; it’s the ritualistic slaughter of animals. Masonry, while claiming a root in antiquity, can only be reliably traced to medieval stone tradesmen.” [2] Even Kerney’s inclusion of medieval tradesman is generous, as the earliest Lodges were primarily composed of aristocratic intellectuals.

During Joseph Smith’s upbringing, Masonry was regarded as a mysterious organization full of secret combinations and viewed as a threat to free government. Scholars note that it may have worked its way into the Book of Mormon, becoming the Gadianton Robber narrative with their secret oaths, covenants, and desires to overthrow a democratic Nephite government. [3]

Joseph Smith Sr. became a Grand Master Mason in 1818. Hyrum Smith affiliated with Masonry in 1825 before running afoul of the brotherhood by not paying his debts, as evidenced by brother Joseph’s 1830 letter of warning to “..beware of the freemasons…who care more for his body than the debt…heard were in Manchester, got a warrant.” [4] Joseph again wrote Hyrum in March 1831, warning that creditors were again pursuing Smith Sr. for unpaid debts, “Come to Fayette, bring father, do not go through Buffalo for they lie in wait for you.” [5]

Oliver Cowdery’s father, at least three of his brothers, and his cousin were Masons. Heber C. Kimball, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow and Newell Whitney remained Masons for life.

Joseph Smith was expedited into Masonry on March 15, 1842, and remained a member for life. Because of his father’s rank as Grand Master, he was raised to the rank of first degree Mason within one day. Smith recorded, “I officiated as grand chaplain at the installation of the Nauvoo Lodge of Free Masons. . . . In the evening I received the first degree in Freemasonry in the Nauvoo Lodge.” [6] Smith also recorded, “I was with the Masonic Lodge and rose to the sublime degree.” [7]

On May 4-5, 1842, mere weeks after obtaining the Masonic rituals, Smith introduced the LDS endowment ceremony to close friends, including Masonry’s nearly identical tokens, signs, penalties, prayer circle, new name ritual, apron, etc. Richard Bushman suggests “He had a green thumb for growing ideas from tiny seeds.” [8]

Mormonism’s bond with masonry ebbed and flowed with the political landscape, but by October 1842, Nauvoo’s 253 member lodge outnumbered the 227 Masons in all other Illinois lodges combined. Nauvoo Masons held a fundraising play on April 24, 1844 to pay Smith’s mounting legal bills. Brigham Young and other LDS Church leaders participated in lead roles. Years later, Heber C. Kimball quipped, “We have the true Masonry…they have now and then a thing that is correct, but we have the real thing.” [9] Smith’s last words when he was murdered in Carthage Jail came as he attempted to jump out of the window, “Oh Lord, my God…,” were the likely the first words of the Masonic cry of distress: “Oh Lord, my God, is there no help for the widow’s son?”

Some of the similarities between Masonry and Mormonism (specifically in the temple) include the following:

All Seeing Eye
Apron
Beehive
Square / Compass
Emblem of the clasped hands
Five points of fellowship
Special garments applied to initiates
Garment markings
Special hand grips
The phrase: “Holiness to the Lord”
A new name given
Blood/death oaths of secrecy with gestures and words describing specific penalties agreed to if secrets are revealed. Mormons going through the temple post-1990 may not be familiar with these.
Location (possession of) Throne of the “Holy of Holies”
Star, Sun, Moon symbols
Tabernacles, Temples
Mormon temple ceremonies have changed significantly over the years, but anyone who has experienced the LDS temple endowment will recognize the Masonic rituals. All the signs and tokens are essentially shared with Masonry or only slightly embellished. Mormon temple ceremonies are so similar that one historian called the endowment Celestial Masonry. [10]

LEARN MORE:

Mormon Expression: Mormonism and Masonry
Scottish Mason Lodge History
Development of Temple Endowment
See Duncan’s Masonic Ritual and Monitor of 1866
Signology.org – Masonic Signs
DENIALS OF MASONIC ORIGINS
Mormonism has long shared an awkward relationship with Freemasonry, unsure when to embrace or shun shun it completely. Prohibited from discussing the temple rituals, many members take it upon faith that ambiguous symbolism and hidden meanings stem from sacred and ancient origins.

The LDS Church has generally adopted the position that its temple rituals remain uninfluenced by Masonry. Efforts to propagate such thinking include the 1934 publication of Relationship of Mormonism and Masonry by general authority Anthony Ivins. The introduction of his book admonishes members to “refrain from identifying themselves with any secret, oath-bound society,” as such affiliation “tends to draw people away from the performance of Church duties.”

The Church’s sensitivity to its Masonic roots eased little over the decades. In 1974, Reed Durham, President of Mormon History Association and Director of Institute at University of Utah, delivered a speech on Masonry at their annual gathering. The Church reacted strongly, forcing him to write an apology before demoting him, effectively ending his career. [11] The Church today suggests that Masonic events and ideas served as a mere catalyst for further revelation.

BLOOD OATH
A penal oath, commonly referred to as a blood oath, was a known Masonic ritual requiring members to swear to surrender their lives rather than reveal the secret tokens and signs given them. Ceremony participants covenanted, “I will never reveal the [token]… Rather than do so, I would suffer my life to be taken.” The sworn obligation to secrecy and psychologically controlling aspects surrounding the temple experience are textbook indoctrination.

Members grew increasingly unconformable with the cryptic ritual, resulting in declining temple attendance, so the Church conducted a survey in 1988 to gauge member sentiment. The penal oath and explicitly performed penalties – pantomiming slitting of the throat, disemboweling oneself and ripping out the heart – were removed from LDS ceremony in 1990. Though no longer clearly identified in LDS ceremony today, remnants of the signs and penalty motions remain. At one point in the ceremony, temple patrons are instructed during a hand gesture to extend the thumb, which represents the blade with which you cut the throat and belly.

LEARN MORE:

LDS Temple Blood Oath
Mormon temple endowment ceremony transcript
1988 Temple Survey
LDS Temple Penalties
OATH OF VENGEANCE
Soon after Joseph Smith’s death in 1844, Brigham Young added an Oath of Vengeance to the LDS temple ceremony. “You and each of you do covenant and promise that you will pray and never cease to pray to Almighty God to avenge the blood of the prophets upon this nation, and that you will teach the same to your children and to your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.” The sacred practice was not eliminated until the early 1930s.

LEARN MORE:

MormonThink: Oath of Vengeance
SECRET NEW NAME
During the temple endowment ceremony, each member receives a new name which they are instructed to always remember, keep sacred and never reveal, except at a specific place inside the temple. Since January 1, 1965, each male and female who goes through the temple on any given day receives the exact same new name for each sex, regardless of which temple they attend across the globe.

These “secret” names are provided to the temple workers daily during a special prayer meeting. Every temple has a set of placards containing the male and female names, in addition to a number representing the day of the month. The new name each temple patron receives depends only on their gender, whether the ordinance is live or proxy, and the day of the month. An exception occurs if the name of the day coincides with the person’s actual first name, in which case he/she receives the replacement name of Adam/Eve respectively. For endowments given in languages other than English, new names are translated to their nearest equivalent in that language.

GARMENTS
Garments (specially designed underwear initially resembling long johns, and now t-shirts and boxer briefs) are to be worn at all times, day and night, to serve as a constant reminder of the covenants made within LDS temples. Members are provided specific instruction regarding how to care for the underwear, when it may be removed, and that they should not alter it in any way.

PHYSICAL PROTECTION
Early temple endowment practices had much more to do with polygamy than eternal families, and William Law’s public accusations brought the contentious issue to a head. Before coming out of hiding and surrendering to authorities, Smith instructed those who accompanied him to remove their garments. [12] Joseph, Hyrum and John Taylor removed their garments, while Willard Richards retained his. As the mob rushed into the small cell, Willard hid behind the heavy door and thus avoided harm. Folklore spread about how Smith’s death resulted from his not wearing garments.

Historian D. Michael Quinn writes, “In Mormon folklore the temple garment sometimes functions as a classic amulet that has power in itself. To some Mormons, the garment has power to protect only what it touches.” [13] Testimonies of physical protection powers occurred prior to Smith’s death, but accelerated dramatically thereafter. The Church has also promoted the physical protection aspect of garments. Bill Marriott declared in a 60 Minutes interview that his underwear protected him from certain harm, while Mike Wallace displays his professionalism during the exchange.



Paul H. Dunn also claimed that garments protected him in battle. As many of his sports/war stories were revealed to be fabrications, it became a turning point away from LDS literal protection claims.

Today, Mormons are offered ambiguous notions of spiritual protection and covenant reminders by wearing their temple garments day and night. By 1998, the Church was officially discounting the idea that garments offer physical protection, but that they merely guard against temptation and evil. [14]

LEARN MORE
LDS Endowment Timeline
IRR.org – Mormon Temple Endowment
My Temple Experience
Why So Many Duplicate Ordinances Performed?
[1] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 132.
[2] LDS author on FAIR and Mason.
[3] No Man Knows My History, 281.
[4] Smith to Colesville Saints, Dec 2, 1830.
[5] Jessee, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith.
[6] History of the Church, Deseret Book, 1978, Vol.4, Ch. 32, p. 550.
[7] History of the Church, vol 4, ch 32, 552.
[8] Rough Stone Rolling, 436, 449.
[9] Salt Lake City, Nov 9, 1858.
[10] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 257.
[11] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 259.
[12] Heber Kimball journal, Dec 21, 1845.
[13] Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, 276.
[14] Church Handbook of Instruction, Book 1, 69.


User avatar
Being There
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:15 am
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
http://www.mormonthink.com/temple.htm

also

https://www.mormonstories.org/truth-cla ... y-masonry/

TEMPLE CEREMONY / MASONRY
LDS temples play an integral part in the Mormon experience, hosting the religion’s most sacred rituals and ordinances. Only members who have participated in a multi-tier personal interview process with patriarchal leaders are granted permission to enter. Therein, Mormons are instructed that the knowledge, tokens, and signs obtained within the temple will provide passage through the veil into the Kingdom of Heaven.

In the early years of the Church, numerous Mormon leaders and members of the Smith family were Freemasons, including Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Joseph’s older brother Hyrum. Joseph Smith also joined the Freemasons, introducing the LDS temple ceremonies a mere seven weeks after receiving their rituals, secret hand grips, embraces, clothing, tokens, and penalties. The Church has no records or journal entries of revelations regarding temple ceremonies or covenants. For generations, the Church vigorously denied Masonry’s influence while declaring its own ceremonies to be a different, more purifying experience. The Church even went so far as to chastise historians who accurately documented the striking similarities.

Given that the majority of temple ordinances are for the dead, some question why the Church spends billions of dollars on spacious buildings for only the exclusive few. Jesus suggested, “Let the dead bury their dead…come follow me.” Church historian Leonard Arrington said, “I have not yet come to feel the necessity of frequent attendance at the temple. I think I get as much inspiration watching birds, or looking at the mountains and the wilderness, as participating in the rituals there.” [1]

Image


MASONIC HANDSHAKES WILL LOOK FAMILIAR TO MORMONS

MASONIC ORIGINS
Masonic author Mervin Hogan observed, “It must be readily acknowledged that Mormonism and Freemasonry are so intimately and inextricably interwoven and interrelated that the two can never be dissociated.”

Freemasonry formed somewhere between the 10th and 17th centuries in England and, contrary to what one may claim, possesses no link to the Biblical temple of Solomon or temple builder Hiram Abiff that its ceremonies center on. LDS author Greg Kerney writes,“Unfortunately there is no historical evidence to support a continuous functioning line from Solomon’s temple to present. We know what went on in Solomon’s temple; it’s the ritualistic slaughter of animals. Masonry, while claiming a root in antiquity, can only be reliably traced to medieval stone tradesmen.” [2] Even Kerney’s inclusion of medieval tradesman is generous, as the earliest Lodges were primarily composed of aristocratic intellectuals.

During Joseph Smith’s upbringing, Masonry was regarded as a mysterious organization full of secret combinations and viewed as a threat to free government. Scholars note that it may have worked its way into the Book of Mormon, becoming the Gadianton Robber narrative with their secret oaths, covenants, and desires to overthrow a democratic Nephite government. [3]

Joseph Smith Sr. became a Grand Master Mason in 1818. Hyrum Smith affiliated with Masonry in 1825 before running afoul of the brotherhood by not paying his debts, as evidenced by brother Joseph’s 1830 letter of warning to “..beware of the freemasons…who care more for his body than the debt…heard were in Manchester, got a warrant.” [4] Joseph again wrote Hyrum in March 1831, warning that creditors were again pursuing Smith Sr. for unpaid debts, “Come to Fayette, bring father, do not go through Buffalo for they lie in wait for you.” [5]

Oliver Cowdery’s father, at least three of his brothers, and his cousin were Masons. Heber C. Kimball, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow and Newell Whitney remained Masons for life.

Joseph Smith was expedited into Masonry on March 15, 1842, and remained a member for life. Because of his father’s rank as Grand Master, he was raised to the rank of first degree Mason within one day. Smith recorded, “I officiated as grand chaplain at the installation of the Nauvoo Lodge of Free Masons. . . . In the evening I received the first degree in Freemasonry in the Nauvoo Lodge.” [6] Smith also recorded, “I was with the Masonic Lodge and rose to the sublime degree.” [7]

On May 4-5, 1842, mere weeks after obtaining the Masonic rituals, Smith introduced the LDS endowment ceremony to close friends, including Masonry’s nearly identical tokens, signs, penalties, prayer circle, new name ritual, apron, etc. Richard Bushman suggests “He had a green thumb for growing ideas from tiny seeds.” [8]

Mormonism’s bond with masonry ebbed and flowed with the political landscape, but by October 1842, Nauvoo’s 253 member lodge outnumbered the 227 Masons in all other Illinois lodges combined. Nauvoo Masons held a fundraising play on April 24, 1844 to pay Smith’s mounting legal bills. Brigham Young and other LDS Church leaders participated in lead roles. Years later, Heber C. Kimball quipped, “We have the true Masonry…they have now and then a thing that is correct, but we have the real thing.” [9] Smith’s last words when he was murdered in Carthage Jail came as he attempted to jump out of the window, “Oh Lord, my God…,” were the likely the first words of the Masonic cry of distress: “Oh Lord, my God, is there no help for the widow’s son?”

Some of the similarities between Masonry and Mormonism (specifically in the temple) include the following:

All Seeing Eye
Apron
Beehive
Square / Compass
Emblem of the clasped hands
Five points of fellowship
Special garments applied to initiates
Garment markings
Special hand grips
The phrase: “Holiness to the Lord”
A new name given
Blood/death oaths of secrecy with gestures and words describing specific penalties agreed to if secrets are revealed. Mormons going through the temple post-1990 may not be familiar with these.
Location (possession of) Throne of the “Holy of Holies”
Star, Sun, Moon symbols
Tabernacles, Temples
Mormon temple ceremonies have changed significantly over the years, but anyone who has experienced the LDS temple endowment will recognize the Masonic rituals. All the signs and tokens are essentially shared with Masonry or only slightly embellished. Mormon temple ceremonies are so similar that one historian called the endowment Celestial Masonry. [10]

LEARN MORE:

Mormon Expression: Mormonism and Masonry
Scottish Mason Lodge History
Development of Temple Endowment
See Duncan’s Masonic Ritual and Monitor of 1866
Signology.org – Masonic Signs
DENIALS OF MASONIC ORIGINS
Mormonism has long shared an awkward relationship with Freemasonry, unsure when to embrace or shun shun it completely. Prohibited from discussing the temple rituals, many members take it upon faith that ambiguous symbolism and hidden meanings stem from sacred and ancient origins.

The LDS Church has generally adopted the position that its temple rituals remain uninfluenced by Masonry. Efforts to propagate such thinking include the 1934 publication of Relationship of Mormonism and Masonry by general authority Anthony Ivins. The introduction of his book admonishes members to “refrain from identifying themselves with any secret, oath-bound society,” as such affiliation “tends to draw people away from the performance of Church duties.”

The Church’s sensitivity to its Masonic roots eased little over the decades. In 1974, Reed Durham, President of Mormon History Association and Director of Institute at University of Utah, delivered a speech on Masonry at their annual gathering. The Church reacted strongly, forcing him to write an apology before demoting him, effectively ending his career. [11] The Church today suggests that Masonic events and ideas served as a mere catalyst for further revelation.

BLOOD OATH
A penal oath, commonly referred to as a blood oath, was a known Masonic ritual requiring members to swear to surrender their lives rather than reveal the secret tokens and signs given them. Ceremony participants covenanted, “I will never reveal the [token]… Rather than do so, I would suffer my life to be taken.” The sworn obligation to secrecy and psychologically controlling aspects surrounding the temple experience are textbook indoctrination.

Members grew increasingly unconformable with the cryptic ritual, resulting in declining temple attendance, so the Church conducted a survey in 1988 to gauge member sentiment. The penal oath and explicitly performed penalties – pantomiming slitting of the throat, disemboweling oneself and ripping out the heart – were removed from LDS ceremony in 1990. Though no longer clearly identified in LDS ceremony today, remnants of the signs and penalty motions remain. At one point in the ceremony, temple patrons are instructed during a hand gesture to extend the thumb, which represents the blade with which you cut the throat and belly.

LEARN MORE:

LDS Temple Blood Oath
Mormon temple endowment ceremony transcript
1988 Temple Survey
LDS Temple Penalties
OATH OF VENGEANCE
Soon after Joseph Smith’s death in 1844, Brigham Young added an Oath of Vengeance to the LDS temple ceremony. “You and each of you do covenant and promise that you will pray and never cease to pray to Almighty God to avenge the blood of the prophets upon this nation, and that you will teach the same to your children and to your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.” The sacred practice was not eliminated until the early 1930s.

LEARN MORE:

MormonThink: Oath of Vengeance
SECRET NEW NAME
During the temple endowment ceremony, each member receives a new name which they are instructed to always remember, keep sacred and never reveal, except at a specific place inside the temple. Since January 1, 1965, each male and female who goes through the temple on any given day receives the exact same new name for each sex, regardless of which temple they attend across the globe.

These “secret” names are provided to the temple workers daily during a special prayer meeting. Every temple has a set of placards containing the male and female names, in addition to a number representing the day of the month. The new name each temple patron receives depends only on their gender, whether the ordinance is live or proxy, and the day of the month. An exception occurs if the name of the day coincides with the person’s actual first name, in which case he/she receives the replacement name of Adam/Eve respectively. For endowments given in languages other than English, new names are translated to their nearest equivalent in that language.

GARMENTS
Garments (specially designed underwear initially resembling long johns, and now t-shirts and boxer briefs) are to be worn at all times, day and night, to serve as a constant reminder of the covenants made within LDS temples. Members are provided specific instruction regarding how to care for the underwear, when it may be removed, and that they should not alter it in any way.

PHYSICAL PROTECTION
Early temple endowment practices had much more to do with polygamy than eternal families, and William Law’s public accusations brought the contentious issue to a head. Before coming out of hiding and surrendering to authorities, Smith instructed those who accompanied him to remove their garments. [12] Joseph, Hyrum and John Taylor removed their garments, while Willard Richards retained his. As the mob rushed into the small cell, Willard hid behind the heavy door and thus avoided harm. Folklore spread about how Smith’s death resulted from his not wearing garments.

Historian D. Michael Quinn writes, “In Mormon folklore the temple garment sometimes functions as a classic amulet that has power in itself. To some Mormons, the garment has power to protect only what it touches.” [13] Testimonies of physical protection powers occurred prior to Smith’s death, but accelerated dramatically thereafter. The Church has also promoted the physical protection aspect of garments. Bill Marriott declared in a 60 Minutes interview that his underwear protected him from certain harm, while Mike Wallace displays his professionalism during the exchange.



Paul H. Dunn also claimed that garments protected him in battle. As many of his sports/war stories were revealed to be fabrications, it became a turning point away from LDS literal protection claims.

Today, Mormons are offered ambiguous notions of spiritual protection and covenant reminders by wearing their temple garments day and night. By 1998, the Church was officially discounting the idea that garments offer physical protection, but that they merely guard against temptation and evil. [14]

LEARN MORE
LDS Endowment Timeline
IRR.org – Mormon Temple Endowment
My Temple Experience
Why So Many Duplicate Ordinances Performed?
[1] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 132.
[2] LDS author on FAIR and Mason.
[3] No Man Knows My History, 281.
[4] Smith to Colesville Saints, Dec 2, 1830.
[5] Jessee, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith.
[6] History of the Church, Deseret Book, 1978, Vol.4, Ch. 32, p. 550.
[7] History of the Church, vol 4, ch 32, 552.
[8] Rough Stone Rolling, 436, 449.
[9] Salt Lake City, Nov 9, 1858.
[10] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 257.
[11] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 259.
[12] Heber Kimball journal, Dec 21, 1845.
[13] Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, 276.
[14] Church Handbook of Instruction, Book 1, 69.
Mormonism and Freemasonry
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_Freemasonry

User avatar
Being There
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:25 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:15 am
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
http://www.mormonthink.com/temple.htm

also

https://www.mormonstories.org/truth-cla ... y-masonry/

TEMPLE CEREMONY / MASONRY
LDS temples play an integral part in the Mormon experience, hosting the religion’s most sacred rituals and ordinances. Only members who have participated in a multi-tier personal interview process with patriarchal leaders are granted permission to enter. Therein, Mormons are instructed that the knowledge, tokens, and signs obtained within the temple will provide passage through the veil into the Kingdom of Heaven.

In the early years of the Church, numerous Mormon leaders and members of the Smith family were Freemasons, including Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Joseph’s older brother Hyrum. Joseph Smith also joined the Freemasons, introducing the LDS temple ceremonies a mere seven weeks after receiving their rituals, secret hand grips, embraces, clothing, tokens, and penalties. The Church has no records or journal entries of revelations regarding temple ceremonies or covenants. For generations, the Church vigorously denied Masonry’s influence while declaring its own ceremonies to be a different, more purifying experience. The Church even went so far as to chastise historians who accurately documented the striking similarities.

Given that the majority of temple ordinances are for the dead, some question why the Church spends billions of dollars on spacious buildings for only the exclusive few. Jesus suggested, “Let the dead bury their dead…come follow me.” Church historian Leonard Arrington said, “I have not yet come to feel the necessity of frequent attendance at the temple. I think I get as much inspiration watching birds, or looking at the mountains and the wilderness, as participating in the rituals there.” [1]

Image


MASONIC HANDSHAKES WILL LOOK FAMILIAR TO MORMONS

MASONIC ORIGINS
Masonic author Mervin Hogan observed, “It must be readily acknowledged that Mormonism and Freemasonry are so intimately and inextricably interwoven and interrelated that the two can never be dissociated.”

Freemasonry formed somewhere between the 10th and 17th centuries in England and, contrary to what one may claim, possesses no link to the Biblical temple of Solomon or temple builder Hiram Abiff that its ceremonies center on. LDS author Greg Kerney writes,“Unfortunately there is no historical evidence to support a continuous functioning line from Solomon’s temple to present. We know what went on in Solomon’s temple; it’s the ritualistic slaughter of animals. Masonry, while claiming a root in antiquity, can only be reliably traced to medieval stone tradesmen.” [2] Even Kerney’s inclusion of medieval tradesman is generous, as the earliest Lodges were primarily composed of aristocratic intellectuals.

During Joseph Smith’s upbringing, Masonry was regarded as a mysterious organization full of secret combinations and viewed as a threat to free government. Scholars note that it may have worked its way into the Book of Mormon, becoming the Gadianton Robber narrative with their secret oaths, covenants, and desires to overthrow a democratic Nephite government. [3]

Joseph Smith Sr. became a Grand Master Mason in 1818. Hyrum Smith affiliated with Masonry in 1825 before running afoul of the brotherhood by not paying his debts, as evidenced by brother Joseph’s 1830 letter of warning to “..beware of the freemasons…who care more for his body than the debt…heard were in Manchester, got a warrant.” [4] Joseph again wrote Hyrum in March 1831, warning that creditors were again pursuing Smith Sr. for unpaid debts, “Come to Fayette, bring father, do not go through Buffalo for they lie in wait for you.” [5]

Oliver Cowdery’s father, at least three of his brothers, and his cousin were Masons. Heber C. Kimball, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow and Newell Whitney remained Masons for life.

Joseph Smith was expedited into Masonry on March 15, 1842, and remained a member for life. Because of his father’s rank as Grand Master, he was raised to the rank of first degree Mason within one day. Smith recorded, “I officiated as grand chaplain at the installation of the Nauvoo Lodge of Free Masons. . . . In the evening I received the first degree in Freemasonry in the Nauvoo Lodge.” [6] Smith also recorded, “I was with the Masonic Lodge and rose to the sublime degree.” [7]

On May 4-5, 1842, mere weeks after obtaining the Masonic rituals, Smith introduced the LDS endowment ceremony to close friends, including Masonry’s nearly identical tokens, signs, penalties, prayer circle, new name ritual, apron, etc. Richard Bushman suggests “He had a green thumb for growing ideas from tiny seeds.” [8]

Mormonism’s bond with masonry ebbed and flowed with the political landscape, but by October 1842, Nauvoo’s 253 member lodge outnumbered the 227 Masons in all other Illinois lodges combined. Nauvoo Masons held a fundraising play on April 24, 1844 to pay Smith’s mounting legal bills. Brigham Young and other LDS Church leaders participated in lead roles. Years later, Heber C. Kimball quipped, “We have the true Masonry…they have now and then a thing that is correct, but we have the real thing.” [9] Smith’s last words when he was murdered in Carthage Jail came as he attempted to jump out of the window, “Oh Lord, my God…,” were the likely the first words of the Masonic cry of distress: “Oh Lord, my God, is there no help for the widow’s son?”

Some of the similarities between Masonry and Mormonism (specifically in the temple) include the following:

All Seeing Eye
Apron
Beehive
Square / Compass
Emblem of the clasped hands
Five points of fellowship
Special garments applied to initiates
Garment markings
Special hand grips
The phrase: “Holiness to the Lord”
A new name given
Blood/death oaths of secrecy with gestures and words describing specific penalties agreed to if secrets are revealed. Mormons going through the temple post-1990 may not be familiar with these.
Location (possession of) Throne of the “Holy of Holies”
Star, Sun, Moon symbols
Tabernacles, Temples
Mormon temple ceremonies have changed significantly over the years, but anyone who has experienced the LDS temple endowment will recognize the Masonic rituals. All the signs and tokens are essentially shared with Masonry or only slightly embellished. Mormon temple ceremonies are so similar that one historian called the endowment Celestial Masonry. [10]

LEARN MORE:

Mormon Expression: Mormonism and Masonry
Scottish Mason Lodge History
Development of Temple Endowment
See Duncan’s Masonic Ritual and Monitor of 1866
Signology.org – Masonic Signs
DENIALS OF MASONIC ORIGINS
Mormonism has long shared an awkward relationship with Freemasonry, unsure when to embrace or shun shun it completely. Prohibited from discussing the temple rituals, many members take it upon faith that ambiguous symbolism and hidden meanings stem from sacred and ancient origins.

The LDS Church has generally adopted the position that its temple rituals remain uninfluenced by Masonry. Efforts to propagate such thinking include the 1934 publication of Relationship of Mormonism and Masonry by general authority Anthony Ivins. The introduction of his book admonishes members to “refrain from identifying themselves with any secret, oath-bound society,” as such affiliation “tends to draw people away from the performance of Church duties.”

The Church’s sensitivity to its Masonic roots eased little over the decades. In 1974, Reed Durham, President of Mormon History Association and Director of Institute at University of Utah, delivered a speech on Masonry at their annual gathering. The Church reacted strongly, forcing him to write an apology before demoting him, effectively ending his career. [11] The Church today suggests that Masonic events and ideas served as a mere catalyst for further revelation.

BLOOD OATH
A penal oath, commonly referred to as a blood oath, was a known Masonic ritual requiring members to swear to surrender their lives rather than reveal the secret tokens and signs given them. Ceremony participants covenanted, “I will never reveal the [token]… Rather than do so, I would suffer my life to be taken.” The sworn obligation to secrecy and psychologically controlling aspects surrounding the temple experience are textbook indoctrination.

Members grew increasingly unconformable with the cryptic ritual, resulting in declining temple attendance, so the Church conducted a survey in 1988 to gauge member sentiment. The penal oath and explicitly performed penalties – pantomiming slitting of the throat, disemboweling oneself and ripping out the heart – were removed from LDS ceremony in 1990. Though no longer clearly identified in LDS ceremony today, remnants of the signs and penalty motions remain. At one point in the ceremony, temple patrons are instructed during a hand gesture to extend the thumb, which represents the blade with which you cut the throat and belly.

LEARN MORE:

LDS Temple Blood Oath
Mormon temple endowment ceremony transcript
1988 Temple Survey
LDS Temple Penalties
OATH OF VENGEANCE
Soon after Joseph Smith’s death in 1844, Brigham Young added an Oath of Vengeance to the LDS temple ceremony. “You and each of you do covenant and promise that you will pray and never cease to pray to Almighty God to avenge the blood of the prophets upon this nation, and that you will teach the same to your children and to your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.” The sacred practice was not eliminated until the early 1930s.

LEARN MORE:

MormonThink: Oath of Vengeance
SECRET NEW NAME
During the temple endowment ceremony, each member receives a new name which they are instructed to always remember, keep sacred and never reveal, except at a specific place inside the temple. Since January 1, 1965, each male and female who goes through the temple on any given day receives the exact same new name for each sex, regardless of which temple they attend across the globe.

These “secret” names are provided to the temple workers daily during a special prayer meeting. Every temple has a set of placards containing the male and female names, in addition to a number representing the day of the month. The new name each temple patron receives depends only on their gender, whether the ordinance is live or proxy, and the day of the month. An exception occurs if the name of the day coincides with the person’s actual first name, in which case he/she receives the replacement name of Adam/Eve respectively. For endowments given in languages other than English, new names are translated to their nearest equivalent in that language.

GARMENTS
Garments (specially designed underwear initially resembling long johns, and now t-shirts and boxer briefs) are to be worn at all times, day and night, to serve as a constant reminder of the covenants made within LDS temples. Members are provided specific instruction regarding how to care for the underwear, when it may be removed, and that they should not alter it in any way.

PHYSICAL PROTECTION
Early temple endowment practices had much more to do with polygamy than eternal families, and William Law’s public accusations brought the contentious issue to a head. Before coming out of hiding and surrendering to authorities, Smith instructed those who accompanied him to remove their garments. [12] Joseph, Hyrum and John Taylor removed their garments, while Willard Richards retained his. As the mob rushed into the small cell, Willard hid behind the heavy door and thus avoided harm. Folklore spread about how Smith’s death resulted from his not wearing garments.

Historian D. Michael Quinn writes, “In Mormon folklore the temple garment sometimes functions as a classic amulet that has power in itself. To some Mormons, the garment has power to protect only what it touches.” [13] Testimonies of physical protection powers occurred prior to Smith’s death, but accelerated dramatically thereafter. The Church has also promoted the physical protection aspect of garments. Bill Marriott declared in a 60 Minutes interview that his underwear protected him from certain harm, while Mike Wallace displays his professionalism during the exchange.



Paul H. Dunn also claimed that garments protected him in battle. As many of his sports/war stories were revealed to be fabrications, it became a turning point away from LDS literal protection claims.

Today, Mormons are offered ambiguous notions of spiritual protection and covenant reminders by wearing their temple garments day and night. By 1998, the Church was officially discounting the idea that garments offer physical protection, but that they merely guard against temptation and evil. [14]

LEARN MORE
LDS Endowment Timeline
IRR.org – Mormon Temple Endowment
My Temple Experience
Why So Many Duplicate Ordinances Performed?
[1] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 132.
[2] LDS author on FAIR and Mason.
[3] No Man Knows My History, 281.
[4] Smith to Colesville Saints, Dec 2, 1830.
[5] Jessee, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith.
[6] History of the Church, Deseret Book, 1978, Vol.4, Ch. 32, p. 550.
[7] History of the Church, vol 4, ch 32, 552.
[8] Rough Stone Rolling, 436, 449.
[9] Salt Lake City, Nov 9, 1858.
[10] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 257.
[11] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 259.
[12] Heber Kimball journal, Dec 21, 1845.
[13] Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, 276.
[14] Church Handbook of Instruction, Book 1, 69.
Mormonism and Freemasonry
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_Freemasonry
what close friends the church has. SMH


evil men
Image

User avatar
cyclOps
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1395

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by cyclOps »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:31 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:25 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:15 am
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
http://www.mormonthink.com/temple.htm

also

https://www.mormonstories.org/truth-cla ... y-masonry/

TEMPLE CEREMONY / MASONRY
LDS temples play an integral part in the Mormon experience, hosting the religion’s most sacred rituals and ordinances. Only members who have participated in a multi-tier personal interview process with patriarchal leaders are granted permission to enter. Therein, Mormons are instructed that the knowledge, tokens, and signs obtained within the temple will provide passage through the veil into the Kingdom of Heaven.

In the early years of the Church, numerous Mormon leaders and members of the Smith family were Freemasons, including Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Joseph’s older brother Hyrum. Joseph Smith also joined the Freemasons, introducing the LDS temple ceremonies a mere seven weeks after receiving their rituals, secret hand grips, embraces, clothing, tokens, and penalties. The Church has no records or journal entries of revelations regarding temple ceremonies or covenants. For generations, the Church vigorously denied Masonry’s influence while declaring its own ceremonies to be a different, more purifying experience. The Church even went so far as to chastise historians who accurately documented the striking similarities.

Given that the majority of temple ordinances are for the dead, some question why the Church spends billions of dollars on spacious buildings for only the exclusive few. Jesus suggested, “Let the dead bury their dead…come follow me.” Church historian Leonard Arrington said, “I have not yet come to feel the necessity of frequent attendance at the temple. I think I get as much inspiration watching birds, or looking at the mountains and the wilderness, as participating in the rituals there.” [1]

Image


MASONIC HANDSHAKES WILL LOOK FAMILIAR TO MORMONS

MASONIC ORIGINS
Masonic author Mervin Hogan observed, “It must be readily acknowledged that Mormonism and Freemasonry are so intimately and inextricably interwoven and interrelated that the two can never be dissociated.”

Freemasonry formed somewhere between the 10th and 17th centuries in England and, contrary to what one may claim, possesses no link to the Biblical temple of Solomon or temple builder Hiram Abiff that its ceremonies center on. LDS author Greg Kerney writes,“Unfortunately there is no historical evidence to support a continuous functioning line from Solomon’s temple to present. We know what went on in Solomon’s temple; it’s the ritualistic slaughter of animals. Masonry, while claiming a root in antiquity, can only be reliably traced to medieval stone tradesmen.” [2] Even Kerney’s inclusion of medieval tradesman is generous, as the earliest Lodges were primarily composed of aristocratic intellectuals.

During Joseph Smith’s upbringing, Masonry was regarded as a mysterious organization full of secret combinations and viewed as a threat to free government. Scholars note that it may have worked its way into the Book of Mormon, becoming the Gadianton Robber narrative with their secret oaths, covenants, and desires to overthrow a democratic Nephite government. [3]

Joseph Smith Sr. became a Grand Master Mason in 1818. Hyrum Smith affiliated with Masonry in 1825 before running afoul of the brotherhood by not paying his debts, as evidenced by brother Joseph’s 1830 letter of warning to “..beware of the freemasons…who care more for his body than the debt…heard were in Manchester, got a warrant.” [4] Joseph again wrote Hyrum in March 1831, warning that creditors were again pursuing Smith Sr. for unpaid debts, “Come to Fayette, bring father, do not go through Buffalo for they lie in wait for you.” [5]

Oliver Cowdery’s father, at least three of his brothers, and his cousin were Masons. Heber C. Kimball, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow and Newell Whitney remained Masons for life.

Joseph Smith was expedited into Masonry on March 15, 1842, and remained a member for life. Because of his father’s rank as Grand Master, he was raised to the rank of first degree Mason within one day. Smith recorded, “I officiated as grand chaplain at the installation of the Nauvoo Lodge of Free Masons. . . . In the evening I received the first degree in Freemasonry in the Nauvoo Lodge.” [6] Smith also recorded, “I was with the Masonic Lodge and rose to the sublime degree.” [7]

On May 4-5, 1842, mere weeks after obtaining the Masonic rituals, Smith introduced the LDS endowment ceremony to close friends, including Masonry’s nearly identical tokens, signs, penalties, prayer circle, new name ritual, apron, etc. Richard Bushman suggests “He had a green thumb for growing ideas from tiny seeds.” [8]

Mormonism’s bond with masonry ebbed and flowed with the political landscape, but by October 1842, Nauvoo’s 253 member lodge outnumbered the 227 Masons in all other Illinois lodges combined. Nauvoo Masons held a fundraising play on April 24, 1844 to pay Smith’s mounting legal bills. Brigham Young and other LDS Church leaders participated in lead roles. Years later, Heber C. Kimball quipped, “We have the true Masonry…they have now and then a thing that is correct, but we have the real thing.” [9] Smith’s last words when he was murdered in Carthage Jail came as he attempted to jump out of the window, “Oh Lord, my God…,” were the likely the first words of the Masonic cry of distress: “Oh Lord, my God, is there no help for the widow’s son?”

Some of the similarities between Masonry and Mormonism (specifically in the temple) include the following:

All Seeing Eye
Apron
Beehive
Square / Compass
Emblem of the clasped hands
Five points of fellowship
Special garments applied to initiates
Garment markings
Special hand grips
The phrase: “Holiness to the Lord”
A new name given
Blood/death oaths of secrecy with gestures and words describing specific penalties agreed to if secrets are revealed. Mormons going through the temple post-1990 may not be familiar with these.
Location (possession of) Throne of the “Holy of Holies”
Star, Sun, Moon symbols
Tabernacles, Temples
Mormon temple ceremonies have changed significantly over the years, but anyone who has experienced the LDS temple endowment will recognize the Masonic rituals. All the signs and tokens are essentially shared with Masonry or only slightly embellished. Mormon temple ceremonies are so similar that one historian called the endowment Celestial Masonry. [10]

LEARN MORE:

Mormon Expression: Mormonism and Masonry
Scottish Mason Lodge History
Development of Temple Endowment
See Duncan’s Masonic Ritual and Monitor of 1866
Signology.org – Masonic Signs
DENIALS OF MASONIC ORIGINS
Mormonism has long shared an awkward relationship with Freemasonry, unsure when to embrace or shun shun it completely. Prohibited from discussing the temple rituals, many members take it upon faith that ambiguous symbolism and hidden meanings stem from sacred and ancient origins.

The LDS Church has generally adopted the position that its temple rituals remain uninfluenced by Masonry. Efforts to propagate such thinking include the 1934 publication of Relationship of Mormonism and Masonry by general authority Anthony Ivins. The introduction of his book admonishes members to “refrain from identifying themselves with any secret, oath-bound society,” as such affiliation “tends to draw people away from the performance of Church duties.”

The Church’s sensitivity to its Masonic roots eased little over the decades. In 1974, Reed Durham, President of Mormon History Association and Director of Institute at University of Utah, delivered a speech on Masonry at their annual gathering. The Church reacted strongly, forcing him to write an apology before demoting him, effectively ending his career. [11] The Church today suggests that Masonic events and ideas served as a mere catalyst for further revelation.

BLOOD OATH
A penal oath, commonly referred to as a blood oath, was a known Masonic ritual requiring members to swear to surrender their lives rather than reveal the secret tokens and signs given them. Ceremony participants covenanted, “I will never reveal the [token]… Rather than do so, I would suffer my life to be taken.” The sworn obligation to secrecy and psychologically controlling aspects surrounding the temple experience are textbook indoctrination.

Members grew increasingly unconformable with the cryptic ritual, resulting in declining temple attendance, so the Church conducted a survey in 1988 to gauge member sentiment. The penal oath and explicitly performed penalties – pantomiming slitting of the throat, disemboweling oneself and ripping out the heart – were removed from LDS ceremony in 1990. Though no longer clearly identified in LDS ceremony today, remnants of the signs and penalty motions remain. At one point in the ceremony, temple patrons are instructed during a hand gesture to extend the thumb, which represents the blade with which you cut the throat and belly.

LEARN MORE:

LDS Temple Blood Oath
Mormon temple endowment ceremony transcript
1988 Temple Survey
LDS Temple Penalties
OATH OF VENGEANCE
Soon after Joseph Smith’s death in 1844, Brigham Young added an Oath of Vengeance to the LDS temple ceremony. “You and each of you do covenant and promise that you will pray and never cease to pray to Almighty God to avenge the blood of the prophets upon this nation, and that you will teach the same to your children and to your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.” The sacred practice was not eliminated until the early 1930s.

LEARN MORE:

MormonThink: Oath of Vengeance
SECRET NEW NAME
During the temple endowment ceremony, each member receives a new name which they are instructed to always remember, keep sacred and never reveal, except at a specific place inside the temple. Since January 1, 1965, each male and female who goes through the temple on any given day receives the exact same new name for each sex, regardless of which temple they attend across the globe.

These “secret” names are provided to the temple workers daily during a special prayer meeting. Every temple has a set of placards containing the male and female names, in addition to a number representing the day of the month. The new name each temple patron receives depends only on their gender, whether the ordinance is live or proxy, and the day of the month. An exception occurs if the name of the day coincides with the person’s actual first name, in which case he/she receives the replacement name of Adam/Eve respectively. For endowments given in languages other than English, new names are translated to their nearest equivalent in that language.

GARMENTS
Garments (specially designed underwear initially resembling long johns, and now t-shirts and boxer briefs) are to be worn at all times, day and night, to serve as a constant reminder of the covenants made within LDS temples. Members are provided specific instruction regarding how to care for the underwear, when it may be removed, and that they should not alter it in any way.

PHYSICAL PROTECTION
Early temple endowment practices had much more to do with polygamy than eternal families, and William Law’s public accusations brought the contentious issue to a head. Before coming out of hiding and surrendering to authorities, Smith instructed those who accompanied him to remove their garments. [12] Joseph, Hyrum and John Taylor removed their garments, while Willard Richards retained his. As the mob rushed into the small cell, Willard hid behind the heavy door and thus avoided harm. Folklore spread about how Smith’s death resulted from his not wearing garments.

Historian D. Michael Quinn writes, “In Mormon folklore the temple garment sometimes functions as a classic amulet that has power in itself. To some Mormons, the garment has power to protect only what it touches.” [13] Testimonies of physical protection powers occurred prior to Smith’s death, but accelerated dramatically thereafter. The Church has also promoted the physical protection aspect of garments. Bill Marriott declared in a 60 Minutes interview that his underwear protected him from certain harm, while Mike Wallace displays his professionalism during the exchange.



Paul H. Dunn also claimed that garments protected him in battle. As many of his sports/war stories were revealed to be fabrications, it became a turning point away from LDS literal protection claims.

Today, Mormons are offered ambiguous notions of spiritual protection and covenant reminders by wearing their temple garments day and night. By 1998, the Church was officially discounting the idea that garments offer physical protection, but that they merely guard against temptation and evil. [14]

LEARN MORE
LDS Endowment Timeline
IRR.org – Mormon Temple Endowment
My Temple Experience
Why So Many Duplicate Ordinances Performed?
[1] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 132.
[2] LDS author on FAIR and Mason.
[3] No Man Knows My History, 281.
[4] Smith to Colesville Saints, Dec 2, 1830.
[5] Jessee, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith.
[6] History of the Church, Deseret Book, 1978, Vol.4, Ch. 32, p. 550.
[7] History of the Church, vol 4, ch 32, 552.
[8] Rough Stone Rolling, 436, 449.
[9] Salt Lake City, Nov 9, 1858.
[10] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 257.
[11] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 259.
[12] Heber Kimball journal, Dec 21, 1845.
[13] Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, 276.
[14] Church Handbook of Instruction, Book 1, 69.
Mormonism and Freemasonry
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_Freemasonry
what close friends the church has. SMH


evil men
Image
Wait, Thomas S Monson shook George W Bush’s hand? Say it ain’t so!

User avatar
Being There
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:31 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:25 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:15 am
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
http://www.mormonthink.com/temple.htm

also

https://www.mormonstories.org/truth-cla ... y-masonry/

TEMPLE CEREMONY / MASONRY
LDS temples play an integral part in the Mormon experience, hosting the religion’s most sacred rituals and ordinances. Only members who have participated in a multi-tier personal interview process with patriarchal leaders are granted permission to enter. Therein, Mormons are instructed that the knowledge, tokens, and signs obtained within the temple will provide passage through the veil into the Kingdom of Heaven.

In the early years of the Church, numerous Mormon leaders and members of the Smith family were Freemasons, including Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Joseph’s older brother Hyrum. Joseph Smith also joined the Freemasons, introducing the LDS temple ceremonies a mere seven weeks after receiving their rituals, secret hand grips, embraces, clothing, tokens, and penalties. The Church has no records or journal entries of revelations regarding temple ceremonies or covenants. For generations, the Church vigorously denied Masonry’s influence while declaring its own ceremonies to be a different, more purifying experience. The Church even went so far as to chastise historians who accurately documented the striking similarities.

Given that the majority of temple ordinances are for the dead, some question why the Church spends billions of dollars on spacious buildings for only the exclusive few. Jesus suggested, “Let the dead bury their dead…come follow me.” Church historian Leonard Arrington said, “I have not yet come to feel the necessity of frequent attendance at the temple. I think I get as much inspiration watching birds, or looking at the mountains and the wilderness, as participating in the rituals there.” [1]

Image


MASONIC HANDSHAKES WILL LOOK FAMILIAR TO MORMONS

MASONIC ORIGINS
Masonic author Mervin Hogan observed, “It must be readily acknowledged that Mormonism and Freemasonry are so intimately and inextricably interwoven and interrelated that the two can never be dissociated.”

Freemasonry formed somewhere between the 10th and 17th centuries in England and, contrary to what one may claim, possesses no link to the Biblical temple of Solomon or temple builder Hiram Abiff that its ceremonies center on. LDS author Greg Kerney writes,“Unfortunately there is no historical evidence to support a continuous functioning line from Solomon’s temple to present. We know what went on in Solomon’s temple; it’s the ritualistic slaughter of animals. Masonry, while claiming a root in antiquity, can only be reliably traced to medieval stone tradesmen.” [2] Even Kerney’s inclusion of medieval tradesman is generous, as the earliest Lodges were primarily composed of aristocratic intellectuals.

During Joseph Smith’s upbringing, Masonry was regarded as a mysterious organization full of secret combinations and viewed as a threat to free government. Scholars note that it may have worked its way into the Book of Mormon, becoming the Gadianton Robber narrative with their secret oaths, covenants, and desires to overthrow a democratic Nephite government. [3]

Joseph Smith Sr. became a Grand Master Mason in 1818. Hyrum Smith affiliated with Masonry in 1825 before running afoul of the brotherhood by not paying his debts, as evidenced by brother Joseph’s 1830 letter of warning to “..beware of the freemasons…who care more for his body than the debt…heard were in Manchester, got a warrant.” [4] Joseph again wrote Hyrum in March 1831, warning that creditors were again pursuing Smith Sr. for unpaid debts, “Come to Fayette, bring father, do not go through Buffalo for they lie in wait for you.” [5]

Oliver Cowdery’s father, at least three of his brothers, and his cousin were Masons. Heber C. Kimball, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow and Newell Whitney remained Masons for life.

Joseph Smith was expedited into Masonry on March 15, 1842, and remained a member for life. Because of his father’s rank as Grand Master, he was raised to the rank of first degree Mason within one day. Smith recorded, “I officiated as grand chaplain at the installation of the Nauvoo Lodge of Free Masons. . . . In the evening I received the first degree in Freemasonry in the Nauvoo Lodge.” [6] Smith also recorded, “I was with the Masonic Lodge and rose to the sublime degree.” [7]

On May 4-5, 1842, mere weeks after obtaining the Masonic rituals, Smith introduced the LDS endowment ceremony to close friends, including Masonry’s nearly identical tokens, signs, penalties, prayer circle, new name ritual, apron, etc. Richard Bushman suggests “He had a green thumb for growing ideas from tiny seeds.” [8]

Mormonism’s bond with masonry ebbed and flowed with the political landscape, but by October 1842, Nauvoo’s 253 member lodge outnumbered the 227 Masons in all other Illinois lodges combined. Nauvoo Masons held a fundraising play on April 24, 1844 to pay Smith’s mounting legal bills. Brigham Young and other LDS Church leaders participated in lead roles. Years later, Heber C. Kimball quipped, “We have the true Masonry…they have now and then a thing that is correct, but we have the real thing.” [9] Smith’s last words when he was murdered in Carthage Jail came as he attempted to jump out of the window, “Oh Lord, my God…,” were the likely the first words of the Masonic cry of distress: “Oh Lord, my God, is there no help for the widow’s son?”

Some of the similarities between Masonry and Mormonism (specifically in the temple) include the following:

All Seeing Eye
Apron
Beehive
Square / Compass
Emblem of the clasped hands
Five points of fellowship
Special garments applied to initiates
Garment markings
Special hand grips
The phrase: “Holiness to the Lord”
A new name given
Blood/death oaths of secrecy with gestures and words describing specific penalties agreed to if secrets are revealed. Mormons going through the temple post-1990 may not be familiar with these.
Location (possession of) Throne of the “Holy of Holies”
Star, Sun, Moon symbols
Tabernacles, Temples
Mormon temple ceremonies have changed significantly over the years, but anyone who has experienced the LDS temple endowment will recognize the Masonic rituals. All the signs and tokens are essentially shared with Masonry or only slightly embellished. Mormon temple ceremonies are so similar that one historian called the endowment Celestial Masonry. [10]

LEARN MORE:

Mormon Expression: Mormonism and Masonry
Scottish Mason Lodge History
Development of Temple Endowment
See Duncan’s Masonic Ritual and Monitor of 1866
Signology.org – Masonic Signs
DENIALS OF MASONIC ORIGINS
Mormonism has long shared an awkward relationship with Freemasonry, unsure when to embrace or shun shun it completely. Prohibited from discussing the temple rituals, many members take it upon faith that ambiguous symbolism and hidden meanings stem from sacred and ancient origins.

The LDS Church has generally adopted the position that its temple rituals remain uninfluenced by Masonry. Efforts to propagate such thinking include the 1934 publication of Relationship of Mormonism and Masonry by general authority Anthony Ivins. The introduction of his book admonishes members to “refrain from identifying themselves with any secret, oath-bound society,” as such affiliation “tends to draw people away from the performance of Church duties.”

The Church’s sensitivity to its Masonic roots eased little over the decades. In 1974, Reed Durham, President of Mormon History Association and Director of Institute at University of Utah, delivered a speech on Masonry at their annual gathering. The Church reacted strongly, forcing him to write an apology before demoting him, effectively ending his career. [11] The Church today suggests that Masonic events and ideas served as a mere catalyst for further revelation.

BLOOD OATH
A penal oath, commonly referred to as a blood oath, was a known Masonic ritual requiring members to swear to surrender their lives rather than reveal the secret tokens and signs given them. Ceremony participants covenanted, “I will never reveal the [token]… Rather than do so, I would suffer my life to be taken.” The sworn obligation to secrecy and psychologically controlling aspects surrounding the temple experience are textbook indoctrination.

Members grew increasingly unconformable with the cryptic ritual, resulting in declining temple attendance, so the Church conducted a survey in 1988 to gauge member sentiment. The penal oath and explicitly performed penalties – pantomiming slitting of the throat, disemboweling oneself and ripping out the heart – were removed from LDS ceremony in 1990. Though no longer clearly identified in LDS ceremony today, remnants of the signs and penalty motions remain. At one point in the ceremony, temple patrons are instructed during a hand gesture to extend the thumb, which represents the blade with which you cut the throat and belly.

LEARN MORE:

LDS Temple Blood Oath
Mormon temple endowment ceremony transcript
1988 Temple Survey
LDS Temple Penalties
OATH OF VENGEANCE
Soon after Joseph Smith’s death in 1844, Brigham Young added an Oath of Vengeance to the LDS temple ceremony. “You and each of you do covenant and promise that you will pray and never cease to pray to Almighty God to avenge the blood of the prophets upon this nation, and that you will teach the same to your children and to your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.” The sacred practice was not eliminated until the early 1930s.

LEARN MORE:

MormonThink: Oath of Vengeance
SECRET NEW NAME
During the temple endowment ceremony, each member receives a new name which they are instructed to always remember, keep sacred and never reveal, except at a specific place inside the temple. Since January 1, 1965, each male and female who goes through the temple on any given day receives the exact same new name for each sex, regardless of which temple they attend across the globe.

These “secret” names are provided to the temple workers daily during a special prayer meeting. Every temple has a set of placards containing the male and female names, in addition to a number representing the day of the month. The new name each temple patron receives depends only on their gender, whether the ordinance is live or proxy, and the day of the month. An exception occurs if the name of the day coincides with the person’s actual first name, in which case he/she receives the replacement name of Adam/Eve respectively. For endowments given in languages other than English, new names are translated to their nearest equivalent in that language.

GARMENTS
Garments (specially designed underwear initially resembling long johns, and now t-shirts and boxer briefs) are to be worn at all times, day and night, to serve as a constant reminder of the covenants made within LDS temples. Members are provided specific instruction regarding how to care for the underwear, when it may be removed, and that they should not alter it in any way.

PHYSICAL PROTECTION
Early temple endowment practices had much more to do with polygamy than eternal families, and William Law’s public accusations brought the contentious issue to a head. Before coming out of hiding and surrendering to authorities, Smith instructed those who accompanied him to remove their garments. [12] Joseph, Hyrum and John Taylor removed their garments, while Willard Richards retained his. As the mob rushed into the small cell, Willard hid behind the heavy door and thus avoided harm. Folklore spread about how Smith’s death resulted from his not wearing garments.

Historian D. Michael Quinn writes, “In Mormon folklore the temple garment sometimes functions as a classic amulet that has power in itself. To some Mormons, the garment has power to protect only what it touches.” [13] Testimonies of physical protection powers occurred prior to Smith’s death, but accelerated dramatically thereafter. The Church has also promoted the physical protection aspect of garments. Bill Marriott declared in a 60 Minutes interview that his underwear protected him from certain harm, while Mike Wallace displays his professionalism during the exchange.



Paul H. Dunn also claimed that garments protected him in battle. As many of his sports/war stories were revealed to be fabrications, it became a turning point away from LDS literal protection claims.

Today, Mormons are offered ambiguous notions of spiritual protection and covenant reminders by wearing their temple garments day and night. By 1998, the Church was officially discounting the idea that garments offer physical protection, but that they merely guard against temptation and evil. [14]

LEARN MORE
LDS Endowment Timeline
IRR.org – Mormon Temple Endowment
My Temple Experience
Why So Many Duplicate Ordinances Performed?
[1] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 132.
[2] LDS author on FAIR and Mason.
[3] No Man Knows My History, 281.
[4] Smith to Colesville Saints, Dec 2, 1830.
[5] Jessee, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith.
[6] History of the Church, Deseret Book, 1978, Vol.4, Ch. 32, p. 550.
[7] History of the Church, vol 4, ch 32, 552.
[8] Rough Stone Rolling, 436, 449.
[9] Salt Lake City, Nov 9, 1858.
[10] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 257.
[11] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 259.
[12] Heber Kimball journal, Dec 21, 1845.
[13] Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, 276.
[14] Church Handbook of Instruction, Book 1, 69.
Mormonism and Freemasonry
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_Freemasonry
what close friends the church has. SMH


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Being There
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Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:21 am
Standing in the remote location of Elbert County, Georgia resides what is known as the American Stonehenge, or the Georgia Guidestones. Purposely placed in nature’s grasp, undisturbed by city life, this massive monument has an alarming message to convey to the world. Although the message is a beautiful ideal—tracing its roots back to the concept of a Utopia—it also entails sinister prospects for the future of humanity.

10 Masonic Commandments
The message is considered as the new 10 commandments for an age governed by reason. They read as follows:

1 – Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature.

2 – Guide reproduction wisely – improving fitness and diversity.

3 – Unite humanity with a living new language.

4 – Rule passion – faith – tradition – and all things with tempered reason.

5 – Protect people and nations with fair laws and just courts.

6 – Let all nations rule internally resolving external disputes in a world court.

7 – Avoid petty laws and useless officials.

8 – Balance personal rights with social duties.

9 – Prize truth – beauty – love – seeking harmony with the infinite.

10 – Be not a cancer on the earth – Leave room for nature.


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iWriteStuff
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Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by iWriteStuff »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:15 am
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
http://www.mormonthink.com/temple.htm

also

https://www.mormonstories.org/truth-cla ... y-masonry/

TEMPLE CEREMONY / MASONRY
LDS temples play an integral part in the Mormon experience, hosting the religion’s most sacred rituals and ordinances. Only members who have participated in a multi-tier personal interview process with patriarchal leaders are granted permission to enter. Therein, Mormons are instructed that the knowledge, tokens, and signs obtained within the temple will provide passage through the veil into the Kingdom of Heaven.

In the early years of the Church, numerous Mormon leaders and members of the Smith family were Freemasons, including Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Joseph’s older brother Hyrum. Joseph Smith also joined the Freemasons, introducing the LDS temple ceremonies a mere seven weeks after receiving their rituals, secret hand grips, embraces, clothing, tokens, and penalties. The Church has no records or journal entries of revelations regarding temple ceremonies or covenants. For generations, the Church vigorously denied Masonry’s influence while declaring its own ceremonies to be a different, more purifying experience. The Church even went so far as to chastise historians who accurately documented the striking similarities.

Given that the majority of temple ordinances are for the dead, some question why the Church spends billions of dollars on spacious buildings for only the exclusive few. Jesus suggested, “Let the dead bury their dead…come follow me.” Church historian Leonard Arrington said, “I have not yet come to feel the necessity of frequent attendance at the temple. I think I get as much inspiration watching birds, or looking at the mountains and the wilderness, as participating in the rituals there.” [1]

Image


MASONIC HANDSHAKES WILL LOOK FAMILIAR TO MORMONS

MASONIC ORIGINS
Masonic author Mervin Hogan observed, “It must be readily acknowledged that Mormonism and Freemasonry are so intimately and inextricably interwoven and interrelated that the two can never be dissociated.”

Freemasonry formed somewhere between the 10th and 17th centuries in England and, contrary to what one may claim, possesses no link to the Biblical temple of Solomon or temple builder Hiram Abiff that its ceremonies center on. LDS author Greg Kerney writes,“Unfortunately there is no historical evidence to support a continuous functioning line from Solomon’s temple to present. We know what went on in Solomon’s temple; it’s the ritualistic slaughter of animals. Masonry, while claiming a root in antiquity, can only be reliably traced to medieval stone tradesmen.” [2] Even Kerney’s inclusion of medieval tradesman is generous, as the earliest Lodges were primarily composed of aristocratic intellectuals.

During Joseph Smith’s upbringing, Masonry was regarded as a mysterious organization full of secret combinations and viewed as a threat to free government. Scholars note that it may have worked its way into the Book of Mormon, becoming the Gadianton Robber narrative with their secret oaths, covenants, and desires to overthrow a democratic Nephite government. [3]

Joseph Smith Sr. became a Grand Master Mason in 1818. Hyrum Smith affiliated with Masonry in 1825 before running afoul of the brotherhood by not paying his debts, as evidenced by brother Joseph’s 1830 letter of warning to “..beware of the freemasons…who care more for his body than the debt…heard were in Manchester, got a warrant.” [4] Joseph again wrote Hyrum in March 1831, warning that creditors were again pursuing Smith Sr. for unpaid debts, “Come to Fayette, bring father, do not go through Buffalo for they lie in wait for you.” [5]

Oliver Cowdery’s father, at least three of his brothers, and his cousin were Masons. Heber C. Kimball, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow and Newell Whitney remained Masons for life.

Joseph Smith was expedited into Masonry on March 15, 1842, and remained a member for life. Because of his father’s rank as Grand Master, he was raised to the rank of first degree Mason within one day. Smith recorded, “I officiated as grand chaplain at the installation of the Nauvoo Lodge of Free Masons. . . . In the evening I received the first degree in Freemasonry in the Nauvoo Lodge.” [6] Smith also recorded, “I was with the Masonic Lodge and rose to the sublime degree.” [7]

On May 4-5, 1842, mere weeks after obtaining the Masonic rituals, Smith introduced the LDS endowment ceremony to close friends, including Masonry’s nearly identical tokens, signs, penalties, prayer circle, new name ritual, apron, etc. Richard Bushman suggests “He had a green thumb for growing ideas from tiny seeds.” [8]

Mormonism’s bond with masonry ebbed and flowed with the political landscape, but by October 1842, Nauvoo’s 253 member lodge outnumbered the 227 Masons in all other Illinois lodges combined. Nauvoo Masons held a fundraising play on April 24, 1844 to pay Smith’s mounting legal bills. Brigham Young and other LDS Church leaders participated in lead roles. Years later, Heber C. Kimball quipped, “We have the true Masonry…they have now and then a thing that is correct, but we have the real thing.” [9] Smith’s last words when he was murdered in Carthage Jail came as he attempted to jump out of the window, “Oh Lord, my God…,” were the likely the first words of the Masonic cry of distress: “Oh Lord, my God, is there no help for the widow’s son?”

Some of the similarities between Masonry and Mormonism (specifically in the temple) include the following:

All Seeing Eye
Apron
Beehive
Square / Compass
Emblem of the clasped hands
Five points of fellowship
Special garments applied to initiates
Garment markings
Special hand grips
The phrase: “Holiness to the Lord”
A new name given
Blood/death oaths of secrecy with gestures and words describing specific penalties agreed to if secrets are revealed. Mormons going through the temple post-1990 may not be familiar with these.
Location (possession of) Throne of the “Holy of Holies”
Star, Sun, Moon symbols
Tabernacles, Temples
Mormon temple ceremonies have changed significantly over the years, but anyone who has experienced the LDS temple endowment will recognize the Masonic rituals. All the signs and tokens are essentially shared with Masonry or only slightly embellished. Mormon temple ceremonies are so similar that one historian called the endowment Celestial Masonry. [10]

LEARN MORE:

Mormon Expression: Mormonism and Masonry
Scottish Mason Lodge History
Development of Temple Endowment
See Duncan’s Masonic Ritual and Monitor of 1866
Signology.org – Masonic Signs
DENIALS OF MASONIC ORIGINS
Mormonism has long shared an awkward relationship with Freemasonry, unsure when to embrace or shun shun it completely. Prohibited from discussing the temple rituals, many members take it upon faith that ambiguous symbolism and hidden meanings stem from sacred and ancient origins.

The LDS Church has generally adopted the position that its temple rituals remain uninfluenced by Masonry. Efforts to propagate such thinking include the 1934 publication of Relationship of Mormonism and Masonry by general authority Anthony Ivins. The introduction of his book admonishes members to “refrain from identifying themselves with any secret, oath-bound society,” as such affiliation “tends to draw people away from the performance of Church duties.”

The Church’s sensitivity to its Masonic roots eased little over the decades. In 1974, Reed Durham, President of Mormon History Association and Director of Institute at University of Utah, delivered a speech on Masonry at their annual gathering. The Church reacted strongly, forcing him to write an apology before demoting him, effectively ending his career. [11] The Church today suggests that Masonic events and ideas served as a mere catalyst for further revelation.

BLOOD OATH
A penal oath, commonly referred to as a blood oath, was a known Masonic ritual requiring members to swear to surrender their lives rather than reveal the secret tokens and signs given them. Ceremony participants covenanted, “I will never reveal the [token]… Rather than do so, I would suffer my life to be taken.” The sworn obligation to secrecy and psychologically controlling aspects surrounding the temple experience are textbook indoctrination.

Members grew increasingly unconformable with the cryptic ritual, resulting in declining temple attendance, so the Church conducted a survey in 1988 to gauge member sentiment. The penal oath and explicitly performed penalties – pantomiming slitting of the throat, disemboweling oneself and ripping out the heart – were removed from LDS ceremony in 1990. Though no longer clearly identified in LDS ceremony today, remnants of the signs and penalty motions remain. At one point in the ceremony, temple patrons are instructed during a hand gesture to extend the thumb, which represents the blade with which you cut the throat and belly.

LEARN MORE:

LDS Temple Blood Oath
Mormon temple endowment ceremony transcript
1988 Temple Survey
LDS Temple Penalties
OATH OF VENGEANCE
Soon after Joseph Smith’s death in 1844, Brigham Young added an Oath of Vengeance to the LDS temple ceremony. “You and each of you do covenant and promise that you will pray and never cease to pray to Almighty God to avenge the blood of the prophets upon this nation, and that you will teach the same to your children and to your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.” The sacred practice was not eliminated until the early 1930s.

LEARN MORE:

MormonThink: Oath of Vengeance
SECRET NEW NAME
During the temple endowment ceremony, each member receives a new name which they are instructed to always remember, keep sacred and never reveal, except at a specific place inside the temple. Since January 1, 1965, each male and female who goes through the temple on any given day receives the exact same new name for each sex, regardless of which temple they attend across the globe.

These “secret” names are provided to the temple workers daily during a special prayer meeting. Every temple has a set of placards containing the male and female names, in addition to a number representing the day of the month. The new name each temple patron receives depends only on their gender, whether the ordinance is live or proxy, and the day of the month. An exception occurs if the name of the day coincides with the person’s actual first name, in which case he/she receives the replacement name of Adam/Eve respectively. For endowments given in languages other than English, new names are translated to their nearest equivalent in that language.

GARMENTS
Garments (specially designed underwear initially resembling long johns, and now t-shirts and boxer briefs) are to be worn at all times, day and night, to serve as a constant reminder of the covenants made within LDS temples. Members are provided specific instruction regarding how to care for the underwear, when it may be removed, and that they should not alter it in any way.

PHYSICAL PROTECTION
Early temple endowment practices had much more to do with polygamy than eternal families, and William Law’s public accusations brought the contentious issue to a head. Before coming out of hiding and surrendering to authorities, Smith instructed those who accompanied him to remove their garments. [12] Joseph, Hyrum and John Taylor removed their garments, while Willard Richards retained his. As the mob rushed into the small cell, Willard hid behind the heavy door and thus avoided harm. Folklore spread about how Smith’s death resulted from his not wearing garments.

Historian D. Michael Quinn writes, “In Mormon folklore the temple garment sometimes functions as a classic amulet that has power in itself. To some Mormons, the garment has power to protect only what it touches.” [13] Testimonies of physical protection powers occurred prior to Smith’s death, but accelerated dramatically thereafter. The Church has also promoted the physical protection aspect of garments. Bill Marriott declared in a 60 Minutes interview that his underwear protected him from certain harm, while Mike Wallace displays his professionalism during the exchange.



Paul H. Dunn also claimed that garments protected him in battle. As many of his sports/war stories were revealed to be fabrications, it became a turning point away from LDS literal protection claims.

Today, Mormons are offered ambiguous notions of spiritual protection and covenant reminders by wearing their temple garments day and night. By 1998, the Church was officially discounting the idea that garments offer physical protection, but that they merely guard against temptation and evil. [14]

LEARN MORE
LDS Endowment Timeline
IRR.org – Mormon Temple Endowment
My Temple Experience
Why So Many Duplicate Ordinances Performed?
[1] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 132.
[2] LDS author on FAIR and Mason.
[3] No Man Knows My History, 281.
[4] Smith to Colesville Saints, Dec 2, 1830.
[5] Jessee, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith.
[6] History of the Church, Deseret Book, 1978, Vol.4, Ch. 32, p. 550.
[7] History of the Church, vol 4, ch 32, 552.
[8] Rough Stone Rolling, 436, 449.
[9] Salt Lake City, Nov 9, 1858.
[10] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 257.
[11] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 259.
[12] Heber Kimball journal, Dec 21, 1845.
[13] Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, 276.
[14] Church Handbook of Instruction, Book 1, 69.
One footnote: “Let the dead bury their dead” is kinda out of context here.

The expression from the hesitant disciple to Jesus (“let me first bury my father”) was not stating that his father just died. That expression was a common one in their day that implied, basically, “hey let me get my inheritance from my father first (when he dies), and then I’ll follow you”.

He wanted to be set up financially before walking away from the world. This was a form of worldliness that Jesus was denouncing by telling him to “let the (spiritually) dead bury their dead.” Jesus wanted men who would leave their nets, not men who wanted to wait until their parents died and left them a huge chunk of money.

Context matters.

The rest of your historical post is spot on.

User avatar
Being There
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

cyclOps wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:33 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:31 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:25 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:15 am

http://www.mormonthink.com/temple.htm

also

https://www.mormonstories.org/truth-cla ... y-masonry/

TEMPLE CEREMONY / MASONRY
LDS temples play an integral part in the Mormon experience, hosting the religion’s most sacred rituals and ordinances. Only members who have participated in a multi-tier personal interview process with patriarchal leaders are granted permission to enter. Therein, Mormons are instructed that the knowledge, tokens, and signs obtained within the temple will provide passage through the veil into the Kingdom of Heaven.

In the early years of the Church, numerous Mormon leaders and members of the Smith family were Freemasons, including Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Joseph’s older brother Hyrum. Joseph Smith also joined the Freemasons, introducing the LDS temple ceremonies a mere seven weeks after receiving their rituals, secret hand grips, embraces, clothing, tokens, and penalties. The Church has no records or journal entries of revelations regarding temple ceremonies or covenants. For generations, the Church vigorously denied Masonry’s influence while declaring its own ceremonies to be a different, more purifying experience. The Church even went so far as to chastise historians who accurately documented the striking similarities.

Given that the majority of temple ordinances are for the dead, some question why the Church spends billions of dollars on spacious buildings for only the exclusive few. Jesus suggested, “Let the dead bury their dead…come follow me.” Church historian Leonard Arrington said, “I have not yet come to feel the necessity of frequent attendance at the temple. I think I get as much inspiration watching birds, or looking at the mountains and the wilderness, as participating in the rituals there.” [1]

Image


MASONIC HANDSHAKES WILL LOOK FAMILIAR TO MORMONS

MASONIC ORIGINS
Masonic author Mervin Hogan observed, “It must be readily acknowledged that Mormonism and Freemasonry are so intimately and inextricably interwoven and interrelated that the two can never be dissociated.”

Freemasonry formed somewhere between the 10th and 17th centuries in England and, contrary to what one may claim, possesses no link to the Biblical temple of Solomon or temple builder Hiram Abiff that its ceremonies center on. LDS author Greg Kerney writes,“Unfortunately there is no historical evidence to support a continuous functioning line from Solomon’s temple to present. We know what went on in Solomon’s temple; it’s the ritualistic slaughter of animals. Masonry, while claiming a root in antiquity, can only be reliably traced to medieval stone tradesmen.” [2] Even Kerney’s inclusion of medieval tradesman is generous, as the earliest Lodges were primarily composed of aristocratic intellectuals.

During Joseph Smith’s upbringing, Masonry was regarded as a mysterious organization full of secret combinations and viewed as a threat to free government. Scholars note that it may have worked its way into the Book of Mormon, becoming the Gadianton Robber narrative with their secret oaths, covenants, and desires to overthrow a democratic Nephite government. [3]

Joseph Smith Sr. became a Grand Master Mason in 1818. Hyrum Smith affiliated with Masonry in 1825 before running afoul of the brotherhood by not paying his debts, as evidenced by brother Joseph’s 1830 letter of warning to “..beware of the freemasons…who care more for his body than the debt…heard were in Manchester, got a warrant.” [4] Joseph again wrote Hyrum in March 1831, warning that creditors were again pursuing Smith Sr. for unpaid debts, “Come to Fayette, bring father, do not go through Buffalo for they lie in wait for you.” [5]

Oliver Cowdery’s father, at least three of his brothers, and his cousin were Masons. Heber C. Kimball, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow and Newell Whitney remained Masons for life.

Joseph Smith was expedited into Masonry on March 15, 1842, and remained a member for life. Because of his father’s rank as Grand Master, he was raised to the rank of first degree Mason within one day. Smith recorded, “I officiated as grand chaplain at the installation of the Nauvoo Lodge of Free Masons. . . . In the evening I received the first degree in Freemasonry in the Nauvoo Lodge.” [6] Smith also recorded, “I was with the Masonic Lodge and rose to the sublime degree.” [7]

On May 4-5, 1842, mere weeks after obtaining the Masonic rituals, Smith introduced the LDS endowment ceremony to close friends, including Masonry’s nearly identical tokens, signs, penalties, prayer circle, new name ritual, apron, etc. Richard Bushman suggests “He had a green thumb for growing ideas from tiny seeds.” [8]

Mormonism’s bond with masonry ebbed and flowed with the political landscape, but by October 1842, Nauvoo’s 253 member lodge outnumbered the 227 Masons in all other Illinois lodges combined. Nauvoo Masons held a fundraising play on April 24, 1844 to pay Smith’s mounting legal bills. Brigham Young and other LDS Church leaders participated in lead roles. Years later, Heber C. Kimball quipped, “We have the true Masonry…they have now and then a thing that is correct, but we have the real thing.” [9] Smith’s last words when he was murdered in Carthage Jail came as he attempted to jump out of the window, “Oh Lord, my God…,” were the likely the first words of the Masonic cry of distress: “Oh Lord, my God, is there no help for the widow’s son?”

Some of the similarities between Masonry and Mormonism (specifically in the temple) include the following:

All Seeing Eye
Apron
Beehive
Square / Compass
Emblem of the clasped hands
Five points of fellowship
Special garments applied to initiates
Garment markings
Special hand grips
The phrase: “Holiness to the Lord”
A new name given
Blood/death oaths of secrecy with gestures and words describing specific penalties agreed to if secrets are revealed. Mormons going through the temple post-1990 may not be familiar with these.
Location (possession of) Throne of the “Holy of Holies”
Star, Sun, Moon symbols
Tabernacles, Temples
Mormon temple ceremonies have changed significantly over the years, but anyone who has experienced the LDS temple endowment will recognize the Masonic rituals. All the signs and tokens are essentially shared with Masonry or only slightly embellished. Mormon temple ceremonies are so similar that one historian called the endowment Celestial Masonry. [10]

LEARN MORE:

Mormon Expression: Mormonism and Masonry
Scottish Mason Lodge History
Development of Temple Endowment
See Duncan’s Masonic Ritual and Monitor of 1866
Signology.org – Masonic Signs
DENIALS OF MASONIC ORIGINS
Mormonism has long shared an awkward relationship with Freemasonry, unsure when to embrace or shun shun it completely. Prohibited from discussing the temple rituals, many members take it upon faith that ambiguous symbolism and hidden meanings stem from sacred and ancient origins.

The LDS Church has generally adopted the position that its temple rituals remain uninfluenced by Masonry. Efforts to propagate such thinking include the 1934 publication of Relationship of Mormonism and Masonry by general authority Anthony Ivins. The introduction of his book admonishes members to “refrain from identifying themselves with any secret, oath-bound society,” as such affiliation “tends to draw people away from the performance of Church duties.”

The Church’s sensitivity to its Masonic roots eased little over the decades. In 1974, Reed Durham, President of Mormon History Association and Director of Institute at University of Utah, delivered a speech on Masonry at their annual gathering. The Church reacted strongly, forcing him to write an apology before demoting him, effectively ending his career. [11] The Church today suggests that Masonic events and ideas served as a mere catalyst for further revelation.

BLOOD OATH
A penal oath, commonly referred to as a blood oath, was a known Masonic ritual requiring members to swear to surrender their lives rather than reveal the secret tokens and signs given them. Ceremony participants covenanted, “I will never reveal the [token]… Rather than do so, I would suffer my life to be taken.” The sworn obligation to secrecy and psychologically controlling aspects surrounding the temple experience are textbook indoctrination.

Members grew increasingly unconformable with the cryptic ritual, resulting in declining temple attendance, so the Church conducted a survey in 1988 to gauge member sentiment. The penal oath and explicitly performed penalties – pantomiming slitting of the throat, disemboweling oneself and ripping out the heart – were removed from LDS ceremony in 1990. Though no longer clearly identified in LDS ceremony today, remnants of the signs and penalty motions remain. At one point in the ceremony, temple patrons are instructed during a hand gesture to extend the thumb, which represents the blade with which you cut the throat and belly.

LEARN MORE:

LDS Temple Blood Oath
Mormon temple endowment ceremony transcript
1988 Temple Survey
LDS Temple Penalties
OATH OF VENGEANCE
Soon after Joseph Smith’s death in 1844, Brigham Young added an Oath of Vengeance to the LDS temple ceremony. “You and each of you do covenant and promise that you will pray and never cease to pray to Almighty God to avenge the blood of the prophets upon this nation, and that you will teach the same to your children and to your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.” The sacred practice was not eliminated until the early 1930s.

LEARN MORE:

MormonThink: Oath of Vengeance
SECRET NEW NAME
During the temple endowment ceremony, each member receives a new name which they are instructed to always remember, keep sacred and never reveal, except at a specific place inside the temple. Since January 1, 1965, each male and female who goes through the temple on any given day receives the exact same new name for each sex, regardless of which temple they attend across the globe.

These “secret” names are provided to the temple workers daily during a special prayer meeting. Every temple has a set of placards containing the male and female names, in addition to a number representing the day of the month. The new name each temple patron receives depends only on their gender, whether the ordinance is live or proxy, and the day of the month. An exception occurs if the name of the day coincides with the person’s actual first name, in which case he/she receives the replacement name of Adam/Eve respectively. For endowments given in languages other than English, new names are translated to their nearest equivalent in that language.

GARMENTS
Garments (specially designed underwear initially resembling long johns, and now t-shirts and boxer briefs) are to be worn at all times, day and night, to serve as a constant reminder of the covenants made within LDS temples. Members are provided specific instruction regarding how to care for the underwear, when it may be removed, and that they should not alter it in any way.

PHYSICAL PROTECTION
Early temple endowment practices had much more to do with polygamy than eternal families, and William Law’s public accusations brought the contentious issue to a head. Before coming out of hiding and surrendering to authorities, Smith instructed those who accompanied him to remove their garments. [12] Joseph, Hyrum and John Taylor removed their garments, while Willard Richards retained his. As the mob rushed into the small cell, Willard hid behind the heavy door and thus avoided harm. Folklore spread about how Smith’s death resulted from his not wearing garments.

Historian D. Michael Quinn writes, “In Mormon folklore the temple garment sometimes functions as a classic amulet that has power in itself. To some Mormons, the garment has power to protect only what it touches.” [13] Testimonies of physical protection powers occurred prior to Smith’s death, but accelerated dramatically thereafter. The Church has also promoted the physical protection aspect of garments. Bill Marriott declared in a 60 Minutes interview that his underwear protected him from certain harm, while Mike Wallace displays his professionalism during the exchange.



Paul H. Dunn also claimed that garments protected him in battle. As many of his sports/war stories were revealed to be fabrications, it became a turning point away from LDS literal protection claims.

Today, Mormons are offered ambiguous notions of spiritual protection and covenant reminders by wearing their temple garments day and night. By 1998, the Church was officially discounting the idea that garments offer physical protection, but that they merely guard against temptation and evil. [14]

LEARN MORE
LDS Endowment Timeline
IRR.org – Mormon Temple Endowment
My Temple Experience
Why So Many Duplicate Ordinances Performed?
[1] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 132.
[2] LDS author on FAIR and Mason.
[3] No Man Knows My History, 281.
[4] Smith to Colesville Saints, Dec 2, 1830.
[5] Jessee, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith.
[6] History of the Church, Deseret Book, 1978, Vol.4, Ch. 32, p. 550.
[7] History of the Church, vol 4, ch 32, 552.
[8] Rough Stone Rolling, 436, 449.
[9] Salt Lake City, Nov 9, 1858.
[10] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 257.
[11] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 259.
[12] Heber Kimball journal, Dec 21, 1845.
[13] Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, 276.
[14] Church Handbook of Instruction, Book 1, 69.
Mormonism and Freemasonry
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_Freemasonry
what close friends the church has. SMH


evil men
Image
Wait, Thomas S Monson shook George W Bush’s hand? Say it ain’t so!
ya,
you should go and join The Men in Black - Nelson has.

GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS


"in good company"
Image
Image

ALL SUCH GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS !
(what evil men)
now that Nelson is a member, I think we need to send him a gift -
one of those long black overcoats. lol.

User avatar
Being There
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

Atticus wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:04 am
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
You have it backwards. Joseph Smith taught that Masonry is a corrupted form of the endowment.
Atticus - or is it Attis

The Statue of Liberty - A Monument to Masonic Values
https://www.bitchute.com/video/EDF9irNLyic/


User avatar
Being There
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:16 am
Atticus wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:04 am
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
You have it backwards. Joseph Smith taught that Masonry is a corrupted form of the endowment.
Atticus - or is it Attis

The Statue of Liberty - A Monument to Masonic Values
https://www.bitchute.com/video/EDF9irNLyic/


User avatar
cyclOps
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1395

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by cyclOps »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:06 am
cyclOps wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:33 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:31 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:25 am

Mormonism and Freemasonry
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism_and_Freemasonry
what close friends the church has. SMH


evil men
Image
Wait, Thomas S Monson shook George W Bush’s hand? Say it ain’t so!
ya,
you should go and join The Men in Black - Nelson has.

GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS


"in good company"
Image
Image

ALL SUCH GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS !
(what evil men)
now that Nelson is a member, I think we need to send him a gift -
one of those long black overcoats. lol.
Anyways… back to the handshake. What was wrong with that handshake?

User avatar
gkearney
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5364

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by gkearney »

cyclOps wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:31 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:06 am
cyclOps wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:33 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:31 am

what close friends the church has. SMH


evil men
Image
Wait, Thomas S Monson shook George W Bush’s hand? Say it ain’t so!
ya,
you should go and join The Men in Black - Nelson has.

GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS


"in good company"
Image
Image

ALL SUCH GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS !
(what evil men)
now that Nelson is a member, I think we need to send him a gift -
one of those long black overcoats. lol.
Anyways… back to the handshake. What was wrong with that handshake?
Nothing is wrong with it. It’s not even a Masonic token.

User avatar
cyclOps
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1395

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by cyclOps »

gkearney wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:46 am
cyclOps wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:31 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:06 am
cyclOps wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:33 am

Wait, Thomas S Monson shook George W Bush’s hand? Say it ain’t so!
ya,
you should go and join The Men in Black - Nelson has.

GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS


"in good company"
Image
Image

ALL SUCH GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS !
(what evil men)
now that Nelson is a member, I think we need to send him a gift -
one of those long black overcoats. lol.
Anyways… back to the handshake. What was wrong with that handshake?
Nothing is wrong with it. It’s not even a Masonic token.
I concur. Nor is it a token in the temple. I am wondering why Being There thinks it’s a problem.

User avatar
FrankOne
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2937

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by FrankOne »

cyclOps wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:50 am
gkearney wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:46 am
cyclOps wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:31 am
Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 10:06 am

ya,
you should go and join The Men in Black - Nelson has.

GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS


"in good company"
Image
Image

ALL SUCH GOOD GLOBAL CITIZENS !
(what evil men)
now that Nelson is a member, I think we need to send him a gift -
one of those long black overcoats. lol.
Anyways… back to the handshake. What was wrong with that handshake?
Nothing is wrong with it. It’s not even a Masonic token.
I concur. Nor is it a token in the temple. I am wondering why Being There thinks it’s a problem.
Perhaps others have had different experiences, but I've never shook a mans hand where he put his index finger on my inner wrist. It's odd. I've had some fun experiences, in my youth, where girls gave "funny" handshakes , but that was a different story. Handshakes mean more than people usually consider. Messages are conveyed by handshakes, it's been done for millennia.

User avatar
creator
(of the Forum)
Posts: 8267
Location: The Matrix
Contact:

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by creator »

FrankOne wrote: September 24th, 2022, 12:03 pmPerhaps others have had different experiences, but I've never shook a mans hand where he put his index finger on my inner wrist. It's odd.
It can very easily accidentally happen. But I do have giant hands, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

User avatar
Being There
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2947

Re: General Conference October 2022 - Rumors, Predictions, Live Thread, and Recap

Post by Being There »

Being There wrote: September 24th, 2022, 9:15 am
Mamabear wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:40 pm Maybe they’ll finally admit temple rituals were derived from masonry.

06EB23C2-11FD-4FE6-9F68-F3E3C542E9C1.jpeg

19149854-D4C5-4456-97A5-EE3EA0F59AD2.jpeg
http://www.mormonthink.com/temple.htm

also

https://www.mormonstories.org/truth-cla ... y-masonry/

TEMPLE CEREMONY / MASONRY
LDS temples play an integral part in the Mormon experience, hosting the religion’s most sacred rituals and ordinances. Only members who have participated in a multi-tier personal interview process with patriarchal leaders are granted permission to enter. Therein, Mormons are instructed that the knowledge, tokens, and signs obtained within the temple will provide passage through the veil into the Kingdom of Heaven.

In the early years of the Church, numerous Mormon leaders and members of the Smith family were Freemasons, including Brigham Young, Heber Kimball and Joseph’s older brother Hyrum. Joseph Smith also joined the Freemasons, introducing the LDS temple ceremonies a mere seven weeks after receiving their rituals, secret hand grips, embraces, clothing, tokens, and penalties. The Church has no records or journal entries of revelations regarding temple ceremonies or covenants. For generations, the Church vigorously denied Masonry’s influence while declaring its own ceremonies to be a different, more purifying experience. The Church even went so far as to chastise historians who accurately documented the striking similarities.

Given that the majority of temple ordinances are for the dead, some question why the Church spends billions of dollars on spacious buildings for only the exclusive few. Jesus suggested, “Let the dead bury their dead…come follow me.” Church historian Leonard Arrington said, “I have not yet come to feel the necessity of frequent attendance at the temple. I think I get as much inspiration watching birds, or looking at the mountains and the wilderness, as participating in the rituals there.” [1]

Image


MASONIC HANDSHAKES WILL LOOK FAMILIAR TO MORMONS

MASONIC ORIGINS
Masonic author Mervin Hogan observed, “It must be readily acknowledged that Mormonism and Freemasonry are so intimately and inextricably interwoven and interrelated that the two can never be dissociated.”

Freemasonry formed somewhere between the 10th and 17th centuries in England and, contrary to what one may claim, possesses no link to the Biblical temple of Solomon or temple builder Hiram Abiff that its ceremonies center on. LDS author Greg Kerney writes,“Unfortunately there is no historical evidence to support a continuous functioning line from Solomon’s temple to present. We know what went on in Solomon’s temple; it’s the ritualistic slaughter of animals. Masonry, while claiming a root in antiquity, can only be reliably traced to medieval stone tradesmen.” [2] Even Kerney’s inclusion of medieval tradesman is generous, as the earliest Lodges were primarily composed of aristocratic intellectuals.

During Joseph Smith’s upbringing, Masonry was regarded as a mysterious organization full of secret combinations and viewed as a threat to free government. Scholars note that it may have worked its way into the Book of Mormon, becoming the Gadianton Robber narrative with their secret oaths, covenants, and desires to overthrow a democratic Nephite government. [3]

Joseph Smith Sr. became a Grand Master Mason in 1818. Hyrum Smith affiliated with Masonry in 1825 before running afoul of the brotherhood by not paying his debts, as evidenced by brother Joseph’s 1830 letter of warning to “..beware of the freemasons…who care more for his body than the debt…heard were in Manchester, got a warrant.” [4] Joseph again wrote Hyrum in March 1831, warning that creditors were again pursuing Smith Sr. for unpaid debts, “Come to Fayette, bring father, do not go through Buffalo for they lie in wait for you.” [5]

Oliver Cowdery’s father, at least three of his brothers, and his cousin were Masons. Heber C. Kimball, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow and Newell Whitney remained Masons for life.

Joseph Smith was expedited into Masonry on March 15, 1842, and remained a member for life. Because of his father’s rank as Grand Master, he was raised to the rank of first degree Mason within one day. Smith recorded, “I officiated as grand chaplain at the installation of the Nauvoo Lodge of Free Masons. . . . In the evening I received the first degree in Freemasonry in the Nauvoo Lodge.” [6] Smith also recorded, “I was with the Masonic Lodge and rose to the sublime degree.” [7]

On May 4-5, 1842, mere weeks after obtaining the Masonic rituals, Smith introduced the LDS endowment ceremony to close friends, including Masonry’s nearly identical tokens, signs, penalties, prayer circle, new name ritual, apron, etc. Richard Bushman suggests “He had a green thumb for growing ideas from tiny seeds.” [8]

Mormonism’s bond with masonry ebbed and flowed with the political landscape, but by October 1842, Nauvoo’s 253 member lodge outnumbered the 227 Masons in all other Illinois lodges combined. Nauvoo Masons held a fundraising play on April 24, 1844 to pay Smith’s mounting legal bills. Brigham Young and other LDS Church leaders participated in lead roles. Years later, Heber C. Kimball quipped, “We have the true Masonry…they have now and then a thing that is correct, but we have the real thing.” [9] Smith’s last words when he was murdered in Carthage Jail came as he attempted to jump out of the window, “Oh Lord, my God…,” were the likely the first words of the Masonic cry of distress: “Oh Lord, my God, is there no help for the widow’s son?”

Some of the similarities between Masonry and Mormonism (specifically in the temple) include the following:

All Seeing Eye
Apron
Beehive
Square / Compass
Emblem of the clasped hands
Five points of fellowship
Special garments applied to initiates
Garment markings
Special hand grips
The phrase: “Holiness to the Lord”
A new name given
Blood/death oaths of secrecy with gestures and words describing specific penalties agreed to if secrets are revealed. Mormons going through the temple post-1990 may not be familiar with these.
Location (possession of) Throne of the “Holy of Holies”
Star, Sun, Moon symbols
Tabernacles, Temples
Mormon temple ceremonies have changed significantly over the years, but anyone who has experienced the LDS temple endowment will recognize the Masonic rituals. All the signs and tokens are essentially shared with Masonry or only slightly embellished. Mormon temple ceremonies are so similar that one historian called the endowment Celestial Masonry. [10]

LEARN MORE:

Mormon Expression: Mormonism and Masonry
Scottish Mason Lodge History
Development of Temple Endowment
See Duncan’s Masonic Ritual and Monitor of 1866
Signology.org – Masonic Signs
DENIALS OF MASONIC ORIGINS
Mormonism has long shared an awkward relationship with Freemasonry, unsure when to embrace or shun shun it completely. Prohibited from discussing the temple rituals, many members take it upon faith that ambiguous symbolism and hidden meanings stem from sacred and ancient origins.

The LDS Church has generally adopted the position that its temple rituals remain uninfluenced by Masonry. Efforts to propagate such thinking include the 1934 publication of Relationship of Mormonism and Masonry by general authority Anthony Ivins. The introduction of his book admonishes members to “refrain from identifying themselves with any secret, oath-bound society,” as such affiliation “tends to draw people away from the performance of Church duties.”

The Church’s sensitivity to its Masonic roots eased little over the decades. In 1974, Reed Durham, President of Mormon History Association and Director of Institute at University of Utah, delivered a speech on Masonry at their annual gathering. The Church reacted strongly, forcing him to write an apology before demoting him, effectively ending his career. [11] The Church today suggests that Masonic events and ideas served as a mere catalyst for further revelation.

BLOOD OATH
A penal oath, commonly referred to as a blood oath, was a known Masonic ritual requiring members to swear to surrender their lives rather than reveal the secret tokens and signs given them. Ceremony participants covenanted, “I will never reveal the [token]… Rather than do so, I would suffer my life to be taken.” The sworn obligation to secrecy and psychologically controlling aspects surrounding the temple experience are textbook indoctrination.

Members grew increasingly unconformable with the cryptic ritual, resulting in declining temple attendance, so the Church conducted a survey in 1988 to gauge member sentiment. The penal oath and explicitly performed penalties – pantomiming slitting of the throat, disemboweling oneself and ripping out the heart – were removed from LDS ceremony in 1990. Though no longer clearly identified in LDS ceremony today, remnants of the signs and penalty motions remain. At one point in the ceremony, temple patrons are instructed during a hand gesture to extend the thumb, which represents the blade with which you cut the throat and belly.

LEARN MORE:

LDS Temple Blood Oath
Mormon temple endowment ceremony transcript
1988 Temple Survey
LDS Temple Penalties
OATH OF VENGEANCE
Soon after Joseph Smith’s death in 1844, Brigham Young added an Oath of Vengeance to the LDS temple ceremony. “You and each of you do covenant and promise that you will pray and never cease to pray to Almighty God to avenge the blood of the prophets upon this nation, and that you will teach the same to your children and to your children’s children unto the third and fourth generation.” The sacred practice was not eliminated until the early 1930s.

LEARN MORE:

MormonThink: Oath of Vengeance
SECRET NEW NAME
During the temple endowment ceremony, each member receives a new name which they are instructed to always remember, keep sacred and never reveal, except at a specific place inside the temple. Since January 1, 1965, each male and female who goes through the temple on any given day receives the exact same new name for each sex, regardless of which temple they attend across the globe.

These “secret” names are provided to the temple workers daily during a special prayer meeting. Every temple has a set of placards containing the male and female names, in addition to a number representing the day of the month. The new name each temple patron receives depends only on their gender, whether the ordinance is live or proxy, and the day of the month. An exception occurs if the name of the day coincides with the person’s actual first name, in which case he/she receives the replacement name of Adam/Eve respectively. For endowments given in languages other than English, new names are translated to their nearest equivalent in that language.

GARMENTS
Garments (specially designed underwear initially resembling long johns, and now t-shirts and boxer briefs) are to be worn at all times, day and night, to serve as a constant reminder of the covenants made within LDS temples. Members are provided specific instruction regarding how to care for the underwear, when it may be removed, and that they should not alter it in any way.

PHYSICAL PROTECTION
Early temple endowment practices had much more to do with polygamy than eternal families, and William Law’s public accusations brought the contentious issue to a head. Before coming out of hiding and surrendering to authorities, Smith instructed those who accompanied him to remove their garments. [12] Joseph, Hyrum and John Taylor removed their garments, while Willard Richards retained his. As the mob rushed into the small cell, Willard hid behind the heavy door and thus avoided harm. Folklore spread about how Smith’s death resulted from his not wearing garments.

Historian D. Michael Quinn writes, “In Mormon folklore the temple garment sometimes functions as a classic amulet that has power in itself. To some Mormons, the garment has power to protect only what it touches.” [13] Testimonies of physical protection powers occurred prior to Smith’s death, but accelerated dramatically thereafter. The Church has also promoted the physical protection aspect of garments. Bill Marriott declared in a 60 Minutes interview that his underwear protected him from certain harm, while Mike Wallace displays his professionalism during the exchange.



Paul H. Dunn also claimed that garments protected him in battle. As many of his sports/war stories were revealed to be fabrications, it became a turning point away from LDS literal protection claims.

Today, Mormons are offered ambiguous notions of spiritual protection and covenant reminders by wearing their temple garments day and night. By 1998, the Church was officially discounting the idea that garments offer physical protection, but that they merely guard against temptation and evil. [14]

LEARN MORE
LDS Endowment Timeline
IRR.org – Mormon Temple Endowment
My Temple Experience
Why So Many Duplicate Ordinances Performed?
[1] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 132.
[2] LDS author on FAIR and Mason.
[3] No Man Knows My History, 281.
[4] Smith to Colesville Saints, Dec 2, 1830.
[5] Jessee, The Personal Writings of Joseph Smith.
[6] History of the Church, Deseret Book, 1978, Vol.4, Ch. 32, p. 550.
[7] History of the Church, vol 4, ch 32, 552.
[8] Rough Stone Rolling, 436, 449.
[9] Salt Lake City, Nov 9, 1858.
[10] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 257.
[11] Leonard Arrington, Writing of Mormon History, 259.
[12] Heber Kimball journal, Dec 21, 1845.
[13] Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, 276.
[14] Church Handbook of Instruction, Book 1, 69.
as I've posted before

BEWARE THE MORMON ENDOWMENT
viewtopic.php?p=1265922&hilit=BEWARE+TH ... T#p1265922

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