Ammo

[fireguy]

I was just in a large gun store here in CT last night, and they had plenty of ammo of all kinds. The store was pretty busy, but seemed to have no shortages, although all types of semi auto rifles had sold out.

Is it possible that ammo is just selling out due to high demand in certain areas, combined with fears about Obamatization?

[PeterPriesthood]

Well hello brethren and sistren,

Why do we need bullets anyway?

Bullets are not listed in the preparedness manual published by the Church.

I think if the Church wanted us to have bullets they would have told us.

[lamanite]

do you mean to say the church has a stockpile of bullets?

[pritchet1]

Yeah, being used in training by the Mormon Militia, the Danites and the ghosts of Nauvoo in the secret underground training facilities under the SLC temple grounds.

Me, I'm waiting on those avenging angels in Heaven that have been impatiently waiting to wreak havoc on earth. Hear the trumpet sound yet?

[Poltax]

This quote below, are you really serious with your statements?

Why do we need bullets anyway?
Bullets are not listed in the preparedness manual published by the Church.
I think if the Church wanted us to have bullets they would have told us.

Are you just going to hand over your preps to those that may try to take them from you, and or murder your family or molest your wife and kids? Are your just going to let someone do this? Just because someone may have bullets does not mean they are looking to start a fight, they are looking to protect, defense. Which by the way is allowed according to the D&C and the BofM. The phrase, "not commanded in all things", really comes to mind here. If you think that when the real tough times show up that it is going to be a cake walk you all had better wake up from your dream. Just because something is not on the "list" from SLC does not mean you can not have it or don't need it.

Does the list include syringes? If your diabetic you better have a stash of them. How about carb cleaner, what are you going to do when there is none and your ride needs its carb cleaned. Or maybe axle grease or extra bearings for your axles on your trailer or car. How about an extra chain for your motorcycle or bicycles. Is that in the manual? Or extra fan belts? Or air cleaners, how about maybe enough oil and filters for some oil changes is that in the manual? The list I can provide could go on and on......

To discuss the OP's original question, ammo is in short supply due to several factors. People are very nervous about the new President, and his stance on being anti 2nd Amendment. As a result people are buying up ammo any where they can get it. This is bringing about high prices and shortages that the manufactures have not been able to keep up with. With the above going on people who have never had an interest in weapons are buying items as well. The economy has people very nervous and if we hit a larger dip and depression then things are going to get tough and people that are not prepared and going to want to take from those that have prepared. The best example of this is during Katrina. Those that did not have, took from those that did have.

[PeterPriesthood]

I will follow the council of the brethren.

I go to church, keep the commandments and pay my tithing and I think that will keep me safe.

Just as a little on the side insurance I contribute to KBYU fundraising drives.

[hedgehog]

my Walmart was out of .22lr and cleaned out of everything else but 12ga when i went 2 weeks ago. Fortunately last fall I read someone who said when Clinton got elected there was a run on ammo and guns. So back then I bought a gun and some bulk ammo. It is an important part of my food, water, warm clothes, etc preparedness kit. I don't know what situation will happen to us but we are adaptable and not completely dependent or helpless.

After all nephi did bring his bow with him.

[caddis]

Well hello brethren and sistren,

Why do we need bullets anyway?

Bullets are not listed in the preparedness manual published by the Church.

I think if the Church wanted us to have bullets they would have told us.

How about the counsel to gather every needful thing?

[will]

I will follow the council of the brethren.

I go to church, keep the commandments and pay my tithing and I think that will keep me safe.

Just as a little on the side insurance I contribute to KBYU fundraising drives.

Where have the brethren said not to prepare Ammo ect? please enlighten me.

Well I am sure if you die by a mob, invading army ect.. you'll be just fine. (thats sarcasim in case you didn't get it) It is your responsibility as an American Citizen to own a Gun and know how to use it. The second amendment.. Isn't the Constitution a document inspired from the same God who gave us this land of freedom?To defend your religion, rights, Family, Freedom and Country. When things hit the fan please do not come knocking at the door of someone who thought to prepare with the necessities to include personal defense.

[Mullenite]

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WEAPONS OF CHOICE
Feds undercut ammo supply
But Defense policy reversed after intervention by 2 Montana senators

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Posted: March 17, 2009
9:00 pm Eastern


By Drew Zahn
© 2009 WorldNetDaily



Fired brass shell casings

Responding to two Democratic senators representing outraged private gun owners, the Department of Defense announced last night it has scrapped a new policy that would deplete the supply of ammunition by requiring destruction of fired military cartridge

brass.

The policy already had taken a bite out of the nation's stressed ammunition supply, leaving arms dealers scrambling to find ammo for private gun owners.

Mark Cunningham, a legislative affairs representative with the Defense Logistics Agency, explained in an e-mail last night to the office of Sen. Jon Tester, D-Mont., that the Department of Defense had placed small arms cartridge cases on its list of sensitive munitions items as part of an overall effort to ensure national security is not jeopardized in the sale of any Defense property.

The small arms cases were identified as a senstive item and were held pending review of policy, he said.

"Upon review, the Defense Logistics Agency has determined the cartridge cases could be appropriately placed in a category of government property allowing for their release for sale," Cunningham wrote.

The Defense Department liaison was responding to a letter yesterday to the Defense Logistic Agency's Vice Admiral Alan S. Thompson from Tester and fellow Montana Democrat Sen. Max Baucus. The senators argued "prohibiting the sale of fired military brass would reduce the supply of ammunition - preventing individual gun owners from fully exercising their Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms. We urge you to address this situation promptly."

Learn here why it's your right -- and duty -- to be armed.

One of the companies that brought attention to the issue is Georgia Arms, which for the last 15 years has been purchasing fired brass casings from the Department of Defense and private government surplus liquidators. The military collects the discarded casings from fired rounds, then sells them through liquidators to companies like Georgia Arms that remanufacture the casings into ammunition for the law enforcement and civilian gun owner communities.

But earlier this month, Georgia Arms received a canceled order, informed by its supplier that the government now requires fired brass casings be mutilated, in other words, destroyed to a scrap metal state.

The policy change, handed down from the Department of Defense through the Defense Logistics Agency, cut a supply leg out from underneath ammunition manufacturers

.

The policy compelled Georgia Arms to cancel all sales of .223 and .308 ammunition, rounds used, respectively, in semi-automatic and deer hunting rifles, until further notice. Sharch Manufacturing, Inc. had announced the same cancellation of its .223 and .308 brass reloading components.

"They just reclassified brass to allow destruction of it, based on what?" Georgia Arms owner Larry Haynie asked WND. "We've been 'going green' for the last dozen years, and brass is one of the most recyclable materials out there. A cartridge case can be used over and over again. And now we're going to destroy it based on what? We don't want the civilian public to have it? It's a government injustice."

(Story continues below

[Mullenite]

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I don't know what scares me the most, people hiding their guns or people trying to come up with some lie as to what happened to their guns. AT SOME POINT YOU HAVE TO STAND UP AND FIGHT!!!! People, if TPTB are willing to completely ignore the Constitution of the U.S.A., then it is time to fight, not hide or be a weasel. Remember, "Give me liberty or give me death!"
Now is NOT the time to back down. Even if for some reason the SCOTUS rules against the 2nd Amendment, our rights are God given rights that are not to be taken away by an evil govt or a liberal court. FIGHT! Once the guns are gone, so will be all our other rights. Find friends and family that are of like mind and prepare to make the stand that is needed. We must find the courage of our Founding Fathers

[shadow]

Just as a little on the side insurance I contribute to KBYU fundraising drives.

That's funny!
Welcome to the site.

[sisyphus]

If someone's concerned with not having enough (or any) ammo, it should be a steady part of their budget plan and looked after regularly just like any other prep. Anyone with serious concerns about it should consider making their own from components and keeping at it as another handy skill to fall back on if things get bad.

"Every needful thing" sounds like a good enough reason to me as well.

[wordpur]

I will follow the council of the brethren.

I go to church, keep the commandments and pay my tithing and I think that will keep me safe.
Just as a little on the side insurance I contribute to KBYU fundraising drives.

Welcome. . . er ah "sunbeam" (should be "SON-beam" if you into REAL SON worshipper and not into "sun" worship?)

You got to be spoofing! LOL

Whats these say. . . .
"He that has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." — Jesus (Bible, Luke 22:36)

"When a strong man, fully armed, guards his house, his possessions are safe."— Jesus Christ (Bible, Luke 11:21)

"If the thief be found breaking in, and be smitten so that he dieth, there shall be no blood guiltiness for him." — Bible, Exodus 22:2 (American Standard Version)

Most never really really READ the Old Testament, and really really understood it?

FACT: Like it was more than 7/8s of the WHOLE WORD! OR
Maybe some of the NT creationists believe their god "CHANGED" like their NEW "leader mr "0" from Can-ya, who expects "CHANGE," and worships duh "sun," duh moon, and duh d-evil!

[gruden]

"According to a Deputy Sheriff, ammunition will no longer be supplied to retail outlets for the public. What outlets have on the shelves and in stock now, is all they will be getting. Ammunition will be directed to the Military and Police Forces, ONLY. This 'word' comes from a long time friend of the family who is a Deputy Sheriff and has been for some 15 years.

I have no proof of this claim, but I am positive you will be hearing more about it soon."

On a recent Alex Jones show he said what the authorities are planning is that to remain a legal gun owner you'll have to undergo psychological testing, or something of that sort.

Taken on the whole, it appears to be an end-run around the 2nd amendment. They're not banning guns, they're just tacking on onerous regulations that are impossible to comply with, which is becoming a familiar tactic. If the gov't wants to get rid of something (like organic farming and guns) don't ban it outright, just regulate it to death.

In this world it's very hard to imagine a shortage of ammunition. If it's one thing we do in this world very well, it's making and using weapons. The ammunition exists somewhere, just not on store shelves where the public can get it.

What I'd like to know is where is the NRA in all this? It used to be whenever a new gun control law came up they were right there making a scene and rallying the troops, as it were. Now they're seldom to be heard when the real threat finally arrives.

[Poltax]

I think this says alot. Use the Spirit.


Quote by Joseph Smith

There is one principle which is eternal; it is the duty of all men to protect their lives and the lives of the household, whenever necessity requires, and no power has the right to forbid it, should the last extreme arrive, but I anticipate no such extreme, but caution is the parent of safety.
Author: Joseph Smith, Source: Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 391

Also check out this link: http://www.nothingwavering.org/post/26/ ... lf-defense



The Right and Responsibility of Self-Defense
by Connor (03/17/2009 12:29 am)

photo credit: ~Tatankanuk~

Husbands and fathers have three primary roles in their stewardship: provide, preside, and protect. It seems from my personal observation that they are generally prioritized and proactively worked on in this order. Almost all men recognize the duty to work and provide for their family; most men do a good job at being the patriarch and being the leader of the family; and some take the issue of protection and defense seriously enough to fulfill this duty. In today’s world of outsourcing and delegation, though, it seems that most prefer to appoint the duty of defense to the police department rather than worry about it themselves. Political leftist fearmongering, Hollywood hype, and a general misunderstanding of the history and practical use of weaponry has resulted in a massively successful campaign to create an atmosphere in which very few people know how or are ready to defend themselves.

Joseph Smith—himself known for organizing a strong defensive force when faced with personal threats—once commented on this subject as follows:

There is one principle which is eternal; it is the duty of all men to protect their lives and the lives of the household, whenever necessity requires, and no power has the right to forbid it, should the last extreme arrive, but I anticipate no such extreme, but caution is the parent of safety. (Joseph Smith, via Quoty)

Also calling those who will not defend their families cowards and bastards, the Prophet seemed to emphasize this basic duty of every man. A similar statement was unanimously approved for canonization in the “declaration of belief regarding government” in section 134 of the Doctrine and Covenants:

…we believe that all men are justified in defending themselves, their friends, and property, and the government, from the unlawful assaults and encroachments of all persons in times of exigency, where immediate appeal cannot be made to the laws, and relief afforded. (Doctrine and Covenants 134:11)

Note the conditional: we are justified in defending ourselves, our family and friends, our property, and our nation when another recourse is not available given the time constraints. This caveat perfectly illustrates why every family should be armed and knowledgeable in defense. Most rely on the police to defend them should something happen, but the average response time of a police officer nationwide is seven minutes. This amount of time, of course, is an eternity when faced with an immediate threat. The reality is that the police do not prevent crime at all—their job is primarily to write crime reports after the crime took place. Sometimes they even get lucky and solve a crime. But by no means are they a proper and adequate substitution for personal defense.

From what I’ve observed, fear seems to be the main deterrent in taking the necessary steps to become armed and skilled. First, there is fear of the threat itself. If faced with a physical threat, some would rather give up and die, throwing their life upon the mercy of the assailant. These seem to be the “cowards” the Prophet described—unwilling to ensure the safety and security of themselves and their family. The other fear is a fear of the weapon. This irrational uneasiness stems largely from inexperience and ignorance. When properly trained and upon implementing necessary security and precaution, a weapon inside the home is no more a threat than the matches in the garage or the swimming pool outside.

Ignorance has never been a justifiable excuse for inaction. Whether the subject is education, food storage, health care, self-defense, or anything else, it is our responsibility to seek the proper training, experience, and self-confidence that will help us better fulfill the duties we inherently have and responsibilities associated with our role as protector of the family. Women are not exempt from this; just as the police aren’t able to continually defend each individual, so too are husbands away at work or elsewhere on a regular basis. Thus, the individual right of self-defense is also an individual responsibility, and men and women alike need to equip themselves with the skills and tools necessary to successfully repel a would-be aggressor.

That aggressor can be a variety of things, from a needy drug addict to the government itself. As George Washington warned, we must be prepared to repel any and every threat we may face:

A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government. (George Washington, via Quoty)

Brigham Young, who agreed with President Washington, also went further on another occasion with this thought in saying that self-defense is a commandment from the Lord:

We all believe that the Lord will fight our battles; but how? Will He do it while we are unconcerned and make no effort whatever for our own safety when an enemy is upon us? If we make no effort to guard our towns, our houses, our cities, our wives and children, will the Lord guard them for us? He will not; but if we pursue the opposite course and strive to help Him to accomplish His designs, then will He fight our battles. We are baptized for the remission of sins; but it would be quite as unreasonable to expect a remission of sins without baptism, as to expect the Lord to fight our battles without our taking every precaution to be prepared to defend ourselves. The Lord requires us to be quite as willing to fight our own battles as to have Him fight them for us. If we are not ready for an enemy when he comes upon us, we have not lived up to the requirements of Him who guides the ship of Zion, or who dictates the affairs of his kingdom. (Brigham Young, via Quoty)

Self-defense is one of the few inherent rights that can never be fully delegated to another person. Those who would prefer to shirk this right and submit themselves to an attacker are certainly entitled to do so, since it is their life. This attitude, though, is cowardly and irresponsible—even more so when that individual has other people for whom he or she is responsible. Oddly, we all go to great lengths to insure our lives and possessions, yet few take the proactive (and less costly) steps that would make such insurance much less needed.

Taking the time now to acquire the necessary tools and skills for defense will prove immensely valuable should they ever be needed. Like so many other items in the preparedness world, we pray that we never have to use these things in anything other than practice and proper recreation. But anybody who takes their life seriously—and those of their family members, friends, and neighbors—has a firm obligation to invest the necessary time and money in an effort to become better equipped to successfully repel any potential threat. When you’re faced with physical peril, all the previous fear, ignorance, and false trust in police will spell your demise should you be unprepared to use some sort of weapon in your own defense.

Are we at last brought to such humiliating and debasing degradation, that we can not be trusted with arms for our own defense? Where is the difference in having our arms in possession and under our direction, and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands? (Patrick Henry, via Quoty)

[Mullenite]

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As widely reported, commercial ammunition is in short supply - in particular, .223 Remington (5.56) rounds suitable for all sporting and military-style rifles including the AR-15 and Ruger Mini-14. America's Truth Forum (ATF) is pleased to announce that a patriotic American corporation has agreed to fill this void by manufacturing and distributing small-arms ammunition, to qualified purchasers, in support of our educational initiative.



.223 Ammo for sale....

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http://www.americastruthforum.com/atf-f ... arket.html


Caliber .223 Remington (5.56)
Bullet Weight 55 Grains
Muzzle Velocity 3200 FPS
Place of Origin USA
New Manufactured NOT RELOADS!
Packaging 1000 Round Cases

(20/50 Round Boxes)

Price $455.00 / 1000 rounds

Plus $20.00 Shipping Charge

[TheBrotherOfJared]

This quote below, are you really serious with your statements?

Why do we need bullets anyway?
Bullets are not listed in the preparedness manual published by the Church.
I think if the Church wanted us to have bullets they would have told us.

And Jesus said; That a poor man should sell the clothes off his back to buy a sword to defend his liberty.

[lundbaek]

PeterPriesthood, are you one of those who has to be commanded in all things?

[M249Gunner]

PeterPriesthood, are you one of those who has to be commanded in all things?

Come on, he's just being silly! He's trying to frost yer wallaby!

[M249Gunner]

Remember John Browning....one of the greatest gun designers that ever lived....ever wonder if he had any designs that he held back?

You bet I remember him! Check out the little photo to the left. That was his firearms shop in Nauvoo. The early saints knew the importance of having a local firearms manufacturer/store!

[lundbaek]

Statements from Church members like "Bullets are not listed in the preparedness manual published by the Church." and "I think if the Church wanted us to have bullets they would have told us." do not surprise me, even on this forum. By way of example, I still remember a forum member or two suggesting we support President Bush instead of discussing his horrible actions that contributed so much toward the ruination of our country.

[pritchet1]

There are better weapons available than bullets.

But the most important weapon of choice is the power of the Priesthood. At the meridian of time, they did not have millions who held that power. Now we do. We just have to learn how to be worthy to exercise it when needed.

And there are a whole lot in the hosts of heaven who are ready, wiling and able to help us.

We just have to exercise our faith. THAT is the awesome power that will cause all nations to tremble as they fight against us or come to us for protection.

[kgrigio]

Our local Walmart has been out of ammo for some time and there are waiting lists for when the one or two boxes a month come in. I am currently 6th in line for the next box of 100 40 S&W and I didn't even bother to get on the list for the 9mm as the list is 12 long. It has been this way all around the Iowa at least as I talk to my friends in other parts of the state.

[lundbaek]

We just have to exercise our faith? Hows about works to go with it?

I may be misunderstanding Pritch, but I hear far too much of talk about just faith and letting the Lord bail us out of the jams that we got ourselves into in large part by not doing the works that prophets and apostles asked us to do years ago.