Church statement on Arizona abuse case

[tribrac]

Do what is right let the consequence follow....

[inho]

Quote from the church's statement and from the court records side by side:
https://twitter.com/esherhouse/status/1 ... 9472730112

Not looking good for the church.

[Artaxerxes]

Quote from the church's statement and from the court records side by side:
https://twitter.com/esherhouse/status/1 ... 9472730112

Not looking good for the church.

The "court record" they're quoting is a hearsay statement from a separate case.

[inho]

Quote from the church's statement and from the court records side by side:
https://twitter.com/esherhouse/status/1 ... 9472730112

Not looking good for the church.

The "court record" they're quoting is a hearsay statement from a separate case.

I agree, court record was a wrong term. But what do you mean by separate case?

[Fred]

The Pace memo was more about satanic ritual abuse than just the average, run of the mill child rape. This video explains that the sole purpose of CPS was to traffic children for money. It is what democrats do.

I wonder why no conservatives are allowed in the Q15? Probably because they frown on child abuse, support the Constitution, oppose abortion, and do not think the millennium includes the NWO.

https://rumble.com/v1ef59d-live-world-p ... -ones.html

[Artaxerxes]

Quote from the church's statement and from the court records side by side:
https://twitter.com/esherhouse/status/1 ... 9472730112

Not looking good for the church.

The "court record" they're quoting is a hearsay statement from a separate case.

I agree, court record was a wrong term. But what do you mean by separate case?

It was from an interview in the criminal prosecution of the victim's mother.

[inho]

Quote from the church's statement and from the court records side by side:
https://twitter.com/esherhouse/status/1 ... 9472730112

Not looking good for the church.

The "court record" they're quoting is a hearsay statement from a separate case.

I agree, court record was a wrong term. But what do you mean by separate case?

It was from an interview in the criminal prosecution of the victim's mother.

The point is that the timeline presented in the church's statement is misleading. The statement makes it sound like the bishop knew only one molestation incident in 2011 and the full extent was revealed in 2017.

The record says:

Q. Did Bishop Herrod tell you approximately when this took place?
A. He described it to me it was between 2011, 2012. It was on the tail end of his tenure in Bisbee as a bishop.
Q. okay. Did the Bishop, aside from actual sexual molestation or assaulting of M-1, did the Bishop have any further detail about what Paul Adams was doing with M- 1?
A. He did. During the counseling session Paul Adams explained to Bishop Herrod that Paul Adams was visually -- he was taking video of M-1 orally stimulating Paul Adams. He said that he had taken video of this, and he's done it numerous times.

[Artaxerxes]

The "court record" they're quoting is a hearsay statement from a separate case.

I agree, court record was a wrong term. But what do you mean by separate case?

It was from an interview in the criminal prosecution of the victim's mother.

The point is that the timeline presented in the church's statement is misleading. The statement makes it sound like the bishop knew only one molestation incident in 2011 and the full extent was revealed in 2017.

The record says:

Q. Did Bishop Herrod tell you approximately when this took place?
A. He described it to me it was between 2011, 2012. It was on the tail end of his tenure in Bisbee as a bishop.
Q. okay. Did the Bishop, aside from actual sexual molestation or assaulting of M-1, did the Bishop have any further detail about what Paul Adams was doing with M- 1?
A. He did. During the counseling session Paul Adams explained to Bishop Herrod that Paul Adams was visually -- he was taking video of M-1 orally stimulating Paul Adams. He said that he had taken video of this, and he's done it numerous times.

I'm saying that I wouldn't put so much reliance on a hearsay statement.

[Mindfields]

The church is a corporation, it shouldn't surprise anyone when it acts like one. A corporation likes popularity, loathes scandal and criticism, bolsters the bottom line, and has a strong legal team in place to minimize liability and embarrassment.

As if there hasn't already been enough, there will be more and more reasons for people to stop idolizing the church or its past and/or present leaders.

The Lord hasn't abandoned the church, nor are its ordinances fruitless, the expanded inspired canon is still being printed and distributed, and it offers an opportunity for people to serve and rub shoulders with others they'd rather not be around. All of which has been a blessing in my life, and points to Him, who is the keeper of the gate, and He employs no servant there.

Agree with the Corporation bit. However logically if the Lord hasn't abandoned the church despite it's many gross sins then I suppose that the Catholic church and all the other "apostate" churches aren't abandoned either.

[Mindfields]

The latest Official Statement makes my head and heart hurt. It may be time to fire the PR or legal firm that put out this response. Ugh!

Or maybe we can get a quote from Jesus Christ? Is that too much to ask from prophets of God?

Pretty sure God doesn't talk to those guys.

[Mindfields]

I agree, court record was a wrong term. But what do you mean by separate case?

It was from an interview in the criminal prosecution of the victim's mother.

The point is that the timeline presented in the church's statement is misleading. The statement makes it sound like the bishop knew only one molestation incident in 2011 and the full extent was revealed in 2017.

The record says:

Q. Did Bishop Herrod tell you approximately when this took place?
A. He described it to me it was between 2011, 2012. It was on the tail end of his tenure in Bisbee as a bishop.
Q. okay. Did the Bishop, aside from actual sexual molestation or assaulting of M-1, did the Bishop have any further detail about what Paul Adams was doing with M- 1?
A. He did. During the counseling session Paul Adams explained to Bishop Herrod that Paul Adams was visually -- he was taking video of M-1 orally stimulating Paul Adams. He said that he had taken video of this, and he's done it numerous times.

I'm saying that I wouldn't put so much reliance on a hearsay statement.

Unless it's regarding polygamy that is.

[Mindfields]

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. Without it you have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." Steven Weinberg, Nobel Laureate, Physics

[Artaxerxes]

It was from an interview in the criminal prosecution of the victim's mother.

The point is that the timeline presented in the church's statement is misleading. The statement makes it sound like the bishop knew only one molestation incident in 2011 and the full extent was revealed in 2017.

The record says:

Q. Did Bishop Herrod tell you approximately when this took place?
A. He described it to me it was between 2011, 2012. It was on the tail end of his tenure in Bisbee as a bishop.
Q. okay. Did the Bishop, aside from actual sexual molestation or assaulting of M-1, did the Bishop have any further detail about what Paul Adams was doing with M- 1?
A. He did. During the counseling session Paul Adams explained to Bishop Herrod that Paul Adams was visually -- he was taking video of M-1 orally stimulating Paul Adams. He said that he had taken video of this, and he's done it numerous times.

I'm saying that I wouldn't put so much reliance on a hearsay statement.

Unless it's regarding polygamy that is.

I love how the anti-polygamy people HAVE to ignore the mountains of first hand evidence and only criticize the secondhand statements, because they have nothing to go after the firsthand ones.

[h_p]

The point is that the timeline presented in the church's statement is misleading. The statement makes it sound like the bishop knew only one molestation incident in 2011 and the full extent was revealed in 2017.

The record says:

Q. Did Bishop Herrod tell you approximately when this took place?
A. He described it to me it was between 2011, 2012. It was on the tail end of his tenure in Bisbee as a bishop.
Q. okay. Did the Bishop, aside from actual sexual molestation or assaulting of M-1, did the Bishop have any further detail about what Paul Adams was doing with M- 1?
A. He did. During the counseling session Paul Adams explained to Bishop Herrod that Paul Adams was visually -- he was taking video of M-1 orally stimulating Paul Adams. He said that he had taken video of this, and he's done it numerous times.

I'll add that the "A" here is Special Agent Robert Edwards, who works for the Department of Homeland Security, who personally interviewed Bishop Herrod in 2017 while investigating the abuse allegations against Paul Adams for the oldest daughter.

So whatever may be hearsay, true, or not true, the church's statement doesn't just conflict with the AP article, it conflicts with agent Edwards' sworn-under-oath statement of the facts.

Here's the full proceeding: https://mormonleaks.io/wiki/documents/5 ... ENCING.pdf

The statements regarding the bishop starts on page 41, if you want to read it for full context.

[Great8]

"We are puzzled as to why or how a media source as respected as the Associated Press would make such egregious errors in reporting and editing." Too funny! Maybe they have other agendas? Like our respected medical and global leaders!!!! Gads abound! Either the Q15 are uninspired or very naive or both or perhaps in on the secret combo or are being blackmailed...where's the railroad dude to finish his story???...

[Wolfwoman]

The point is that the timeline presented in the church's statement is misleading. The statement makes it sound like the bishop knew only one molestation incident in 2011 and the full extent was revealed in 2017.

The record says:

Q. Did Bishop Herrod tell you approximately when this took place?
A. He described it to me it was between 2011, 2012. It was on the tail end of his tenure in Bisbee as a bishop.
Q. okay. Did the Bishop, aside from actual sexual molestation or assaulting of M-1, did the Bishop have any further detail about what Paul Adams was doing with M- 1?
A. He did. During the counseling session Paul Adams explained to Bishop Herrod that Paul Adams was visually -- he was taking video of M-1 orally stimulating Paul Adams. He said that he had taken video of this, and he's done it numerous times.

I'll add that the "A" here is Special Agent Robert Edwards, who works for the Department of Homeland Security, who personally interviewed Bishop Herrod in 2017 while investigating the abuse allegations against Paul Adams for the oldest daughter.

So whatever may be hearsay, true, or not true, the church's statement doesn't just conflict with the AP article, it conflicts with agent Edwards' sworn-under-oath statement of the facts.

Here's the full proceeding: https://mormonleaks.io/wiki/documents/5 ... ENCING.pdf

The statements regarding the bishop starts on page 41, if you want to read it for full context.

Thanks for sharing this. When I read the church's statement, I thought maybe the AP really did get it wrong. Heaven knows they've gotten lots of things wrong in the past. This story is so, so sad.

[InfoWarrior82]

I agree, court record was a wrong term. But what do you mean by separate case?

It was from an interview in the criminal prosecution of the victim's mother.

The point is that the timeline presented in the church's statement is misleading. The statement makes it sound like the bishop knew only one molestation incident in 2011 and the full extent was revealed in 2017.

The record says:

Q. Did Bishop Herrod tell you approximately when this took place?
A. He described it to me it was between 2011, 2012. It was on the tail end of his tenure in Bisbee as a bishop.
Q. okay. Did the Bishop, aside from actual sexual molestation or assaulting of M-1, did the Bishop have any further detail about what Paul Adams was doing with M- 1?
A. He did. During the counseling session Paul Adams explained to Bishop Herrod that Paul Adams was visually -- he was taking video of M-1 orally stimulating Paul Adams. He said that he had taken video of this, and he's done it numerous times.

I'm saying that I wouldn't put so much reliance on a hearsay statement.

So it IS possible for hearsay to be admitted as testimony?

[Subcomandante]

The Pace memo was more about satanic ritual abuse than just the average, run of the mill child rape. This video explains that the sole purpose of CPS was to traffic children for money. It is what democrats do.

I wonder why no conservatives are allowed in the Q15? Probably because they frown on child abuse, support the Constitution, oppose abortion, and do not think the millennium includes the NWO.

https://rumble.com/v1ef59d-live-world-p ... -ones.html

Pretty much everyone on the Q15 (with the exceptions of Uchtdorf and Gong, and perhaps Soares) are conservative. But I will agree that there is no Trump "conservative" among the 15.

The apostles not only frown of child abuse, they absolutely abhor it.
The apostles support the Constitution, but not the Bircher interpretation of the Constitution, but the Godly interpretation of it.
The apostles oppose abortion, but they are not going to go around the entire country demanding that a ten-year-old raped by her uncle should carry the baby to term.
The millennium will not include the NWO. The apostles have made it clear that the planning that the NWO is carrying out will always be doomed to failure if not centered in the eternal teachings of Jesus Christ.

[Artaxerxes]

It was from an interview in the criminal prosecution of the victim's mother.

The point is that the timeline presented in the church's statement is misleading. The statement makes it sound like the bishop knew only one molestation incident in 2011 and the full extent was revealed in 2017.

The record says:

Q. Did Bishop Herrod tell you approximately when this took place?
A. He described it to me it was between 2011, 2012. It was on the tail end of his tenure in Bisbee as a bishop.
Q. okay. Did the Bishop, aside from actual sexual molestation or assaulting of M-1, did the Bishop have any further detail about what Paul Adams was doing with M- 1?
A. He did. During the counseling session Paul Adams explained to Bishop Herrod that Paul Adams was visually -- he was taking video of M-1 orally stimulating Paul Adams. He said that he had taken video of this, and he's done it numerous times.

I'm saying that I wouldn't put so much reliance on a hearsay statement.

So it IS possible for hearsay to be admitted as testimony?

It was not admitted as testimony. It was part of a presentence report, which does not have the same safeguards as a trial

[Joan7]

The Pace memo was more about satanic ritual abuse than just the average, run of the mill child rape. This video explains that the sole purpose of CPS was to traffic children for money. It is what democrats do.

I wonder why no conservatives are allowed in the Q15? Probably because they frown on child abuse, support the Constitution, oppose abortion, and do not think the millennium includes the NWO.

https://rumble.com/v1ef59d-live-world-p ... -ones.html

Pretty much everyone on the Q15 (with the exceptions of Uchtdorf and Gong, and perhaps Soares) are conservative. But I will agree that there is no Trump "conservative" among the 15.

The apostles not only frown of child abuse, they absolutely abhor it.
The apostles support the Constitution, but not the Bircher interpretation of the Constitution, but the Godly interpretation of it.
The apostles oppose abortion, but they are not going to go around the entire country demanding that a ten-year-old raped by her uncle should carry the baby to term.
The millennium will not include the NWO. The apostles have made it clear that the planning that the NWO is carrying out will always be doomed to failure if not centered in the eternal teachings of Jesus Christ.

Sub, if you are honest with yourself, and look closely at what is coming out of Salt Lake, and its associations like Magazines, BYU, the MTC, Women's Conference et al, you can plainly see the Q15 are all about the NWO. They even use the same verbiage.
Open Your Eyes, and see.

For crying out loud, they up and pointed their members to Babylon in order to fix them with a shot.

[Joan7]

"We are puzzled as to why or how a media source as respected as the Associated Press would make such egregious errors in reporting and editing." Too funny! Maybe they have other agendas? Like our respected medical and global leaders!!!! Gads abound! Either the Q15 are uninspired or very naive or both or perhaps in on the secret combo or are being blackmailed..."

I will choose option 3, for $500. Do you know why I believe that? It is because Wilford Woodruff, and his church leader friends, became enmeshed with the Gadiantons in San Francisco in 1895. There is no walking away from that unblemished. We can see that throughout history. The method is always the same, cause them the make an oath, which is unbreakable on pain of death. Knowing the Gadianton organization he visited, it involved Satanic ritual. To evaluate this episode correctly, has the Church ever publicly repented of that action, and charted a new course toward righteousness? Has the Church shaken off the chains placed more than one hundred years ago? If not, they are still in captivity to this day. That is how Satan ensnares.

[Christianlee]

Priesthood correlation at its finest. The Southern Baptists at least have the advantage of being made up of thousands of independent congregations which should limit the liability of the SBC as a denomination. The tight control coming from SLC exposes the central LDS Church to greater liability.

[NowWhat]

KIT, Your situation made me think of an abuse issue with a former spouse--emotional and some physical abuse by my spouse and the father of my kids. We were new members, and my husband only had the Aaronic Priesthood--and he didn't follow the WoW. I told one Bishop about the abusive behavior, and he gave my husband the Melchizedek Priesthood! I was a novice in the Church, and I believed the Church would change him-ha! The kids grew to be teens and we went to another bishop, with concerns about "Amen to the Priesthood of that man," and he told us point blank that we were wrong.

[blitzinstripes]

FB_IMG_1661534317287.jpg (45.35 KiB) Viewed 383 times

Should change that title to SLC. And change those names to the Q15.

[DesertWonderer2]

https://publicsquaremag.org/sexuality-f ... yZ8ZQ41COg

10 ways How the AP story misrepresented the facts.