LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 659
LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
Specifically, the idea that a family in good standing with the Church should be expected to pay $500 a month in addition to 10% of their income plus fast offerings is ridiculous for an organization that has 150 billion dollars at it's disposal. This is a travesty, especially when you consider how poor missionaries are and that they barely.scrape by.
Honestly as I get older and see things more clearly I think the way the Church treats it's young missionaries is awful. The fact that their families are expected to pay out of pocket for that experience is equally awful for such a wealthy church.
Honestly as I get older and see things more clearly I think the way the Church treats it's young missionaries is awful. The fact that their families are expected to pay out of pocket for that experience is equally awful for such a wealthy church.
- largerthanlife2
- captain of 100
- Posts: 180
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
My dad tells me that church leaders used to come to your house to collect money for chapel building funds. The church leaders would give you a money figure to pay and you were supposed to pay it right there. I also remember my dad paying a large amount for the temple fund. He told me that I couldn't have a car because of the payment to the temple fund.
- InfoWarrior82
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 10861
- Location: "There are 15 on the earth today, you can trust them completely." -President Nelson (Jan 2022)
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
I remember a time during 2007-2010 timeframe when the church was trying to *SAVE* money by moving the missionaries in with members in their homes. lol.
-
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 8520
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
Yes, they tried that in the Fort Worth area during that time. If I had known about Ensign Peak at the time, I would have openly disagreed. I don’t know of anyone who took the missionaries into their homes.InfoWarrior82 wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 10:35 am I remember a time during 2007-2010 timeframe when the church was trying to *SAVE* money by moving the missionaries in with members in their homes. lol.
- Fred
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7611
- Location: Zion
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
2022 Revised Edition of 1st discussion
Good Morning, Mr. Jensen. I want to tell you about Jesus. He loves you and paid the ultimate price for your salvation, if you choose to accept it. Never mind the lying bastards in Salt Lake that will try to take your money and even kill you. I want to tell you of the Celestial Kingdom, where there will not be a single democrat. So none of the church leadership will be there. You will live forever in a place so wonderful, you can't even dream that good. You will have the opportunity to build your own worlds. You can become a god. You basically need to learn just one principle, today and that is that in the United States, democrats are the root of all evil. There are no exceptions. When you understand this one simple truth, call me and get baptized.
Good Morning, Mr. Jensen. I want to tell you about Jesus. He loves you and paid the ultimate price for your salvation, if you choose to accept it. Never mind the lying bastards in Salt Lake that will try to take your money and even kill you. I want to tell you of the Celestial Kingdom, where there will not be a single democrat. So none of the church leadership will be there. You will live forever in a place so wonderful, you can't even dream that good. You will have the opportunity to build your own worlds. You can become a god. You basically need to learn just one principle, today and that is that in the United States, democrats are the root of all evil. There are no exceptions. When you understand this one simple truth, call me and get baptized.
- Ebenezer
- captain of 100
- Posts: 631
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
I think it’s interesting that any surplus a member has on a missionary account, which is usually the cost of one month or less, can’t be refunded. It must be redirected as a donation. I know of one case where a family is sitting on a couple hundred bucks in their now-returned missionary’s account just waiting for their younger son to go so they can roll it into his account rather than watch it disappear into the general fund.
- Durzan
- The Lord's Trusty Maverick
- Posts: 3728
- Location: Standing between the Light and the Darkness.
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
Wait... does this mean that the LDS church is de facto using the Law of Consecration as a means to justify the scamming of its members?largerthanlife2 wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 10:15 am My dad tells me that church leaders used to come to your house to collect money for chapel building funds. The church leaders would give you a money figure to pay and you were supposed to pay it right there. I also remember my dad paying a large amount for the temple fund. He told me that I couldn't have a car because of the payment to the temple fund.
- The Red Pill
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1661
- Location: Southern Utah
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
Don't forget that missionaries have to buy their own bicycle once they get to the mission...so parents just bought clothing (for 2 years), luggage, supplies...then surprise, surprise, surprise...a $500 to $700 bicycle expense.
I was so upset when I learned about Ensign Peak Advisors.
I was so upset when I learned about Ensign Peak Advisors.
- kittycat51
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1794
- Location: Looking for Zion
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
What's Ensign Peak Advisors?The Red Pill wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:24 am Don't forget that missionaries have to buy their own bicycle once they get to the mission...so parents just bought clothing (for 2 years), luggage, supplies...then surprise, surprise, surprise...a $500 to $700 bicycle expense.
I was so upset when I learned about Ensign Peak Advisors.
- Reluctant Watchman
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 15321
- Location: “if thine eye offend thee, pluck him out.”
- Contact:
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
I think the church is slacking. A true consecrated society would ask for everything after you’ve met your stewardship needs. But then again, the church would be giving everything to those in need as well.
- The Red Pill
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1661
- Location: Southern Utah
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
That's who holds the churches $150 billion stock portfolio slush fund.kittycat51 wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:40 amWhat's Ensign Peak Advisors?The Red Pill wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:24 am Don't forget that missionaries have to buy their own bicycle once they get to the mission...so parents just bought clothing (for 2 years), luggage, supplies...then surprise, surprise, surprise...a $500 to $700 bicycle expense.
I was so upset when I learned about Ensign Peak Advisors.
- FoxMammaWisdom
- The Heretic
- Posts: 3778
- Location: I think and I know things.
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
My son used his entire settlement from having his head chewed up by a German shepherd and stapled back together, to pay for his mission, while both his separate single parents couldn't afford to pay for him to go. And yes of course they turned that crap into some faith-promoting story to use on his mission.[email protected] wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 8:48 am Specifically, the idea that a family in good standing with the Church should be expected to pay $500 a month in addition to 10% of their income plus fast offerings is ridiculous for an organization that has 150 billion dollars at it's disposal. This is a travesty, especially when you consider how poor missionaries are and that they barely.scrape by.
Honestly as I get older and see things more clearly I think the way the Church treats it's young missionaries is awful. The fact that their families are expected to pay out of pocket for that experience is equally awful for such a wealthy church.
- Fred
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 7611
- Location: Zion
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
I would not recommend that anyone go on a mission, unless they have authorization signed by the First Presidency as well as his/her area authority, local Stake President, and Bishop, to tell the truth.
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1104
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
There was a $10,000 surplus in the ward mission fund in our ward because a family had prepaid the whole mission and the missionary quit the mission in the MTC. This actually enabled another boy to go whose family was truly destitute. I was the bishop at the time.Ebenezer wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:04 am I think it’s interesting that any surplus a member has on a missionary account, which is usually the cost of one month or less, can’t be refunded. It must be redirected as a donation. I know of one case where a family is sitting on a couple hundred bucks in their now-returned missionary’s account just waiting for their younger son to go so they can roll it into his account rather than watch it disappear into the general fund.
While I'm grateful he was able to go because of this,this is why I have always advised people not to prepay or pay ahead for missions. You just never know, and it's not refundable. If your child died on a mission, the money would pale in comparison to your loss,but why prepay when none of us knows day to day if our time is up or not?
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 659
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
A Church with 150 billion in assets doesn't need to have it's members pay for their own voluntary service to said Church. It's beyond cheap, it's unethical.Rubicon wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 12:50 pmThere was a $10,000 surplus in the ward mission fund in our ward because a family had prepaid the whole mission and the missionary quit the mission in the MTC. This actually enabled another boy to go whose family was truly destitute. I was the bishop at the time.Ebenezer wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:04 am I think it’s interesting that any surplus a member has on a missionary account, which is usually the cost of one month or less, can’t be refunded. It must be redirected as a donation. I know of one case where a family is sitting on a couple hundred bucks in their now-returned missionary’s account just waiting for their younger son to go so they can roll it into his account rather than watch it disappear into the general fund.
While I'm grateful he was able to go because of this,this is why I have always advised people not to prepay or pay ahead for missions. You just never know, and it's not refundable. If your child died on a mission, the money would pale in comparison to your loss,but why prepay when none of us knows day to day if our time is up or not?
- LDS Physician
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1812
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
https://youtu.be/KDlFZF3RyhEkittycat51 wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:40 amWhat's Ensign Peak Advisors?The Red Pill wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:24 am Don't forget that missionaries have to buy their own bicycle once they get to the mission...so parents just bought clothing (for 2 years), luggage, supplies...then surprise, surprise, surprise...a $500 to $700 bicycle expense.
I was so upset when I learned about Ensign Peak Advisors.
- Pazooka
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 5222
- Location: FEMA District 8
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
Shouldn’t the reasons LDS missions should never cost a dime be because missionaries are to operate without purse or script?
- InfoWarrior82
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 10861
- Location: "There are 15 on the earth today, you can trust them completely." -President Nelson (Jan 2022)
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
LDS Physician wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 4:00 pmkittycat51 wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:40 amWhat's Ensign Peak Advisors?The Red Pill wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:24 am Don't forget that missionaries have to buy their own bicycle once they get to the mission...so parents just bought clothing (for 2 years), luggage, supplies...then surprise, surprise, surprise...a $500 to $700 bicycle expense.
I was so upset when I learned about Ensign Peak Advisors.
This is mind-blowing. Every single member of the church needs to watch this one hour video.
And it sounds like Babylon has quite the leverage to apply to the church if they don't play along with all agendas of the United Nations in which they joined with.
Plus... if there ever comes a time when government needs cash fast, they'll turn their sights onto Ensign Peak Advisors.
Lastly, there is absolutely no way it is possible these men can truthfully answer the question: 9. Do you strive to be honest in all that you do?
Last edited by InfoWarrior82 on July 30th, 2022, 5:50 pm, edited 4 times in total.
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 3351
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
Not to mention the extras. My son just had to buy a very expensive bike for an area he is in right now.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 330
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
Not necessarily. I was given a date that my bank account would be closed. We were also advised to only withdraw what we needed for that last week and our travels hims. It was a week or so before I went home. Guess what I did a week before that? I took all of my money out except for the like $5 minimum I had to keep in there.Ebenezer wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:04 am I think it’s interesting that any surplus a member has on a missionary account, which is usually the cost of one month or less, can’t be refunded. It must be redirected as a donation. I know of one case where a family is sitting on a couple hundred bucks in their now-returned missionary’s account just waiting for their younger son to go so they can roll it into his account rather than watch it disappear into the general fund.
We ate out every evening an I believe I used the rest to put a down payment on my truck. I had saved almost 2k while on my mission.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 659
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
I was barely able to feed myself consistently on my mission. Went to Rio where we got something like 180 Reais a month (assuming the mission office deposited the money on time). Back then (circa 2004) that was less than 60$ a month for food and transportation. Quite frankly it was really bad, so bad I had to get a backup credit card from my parents to survive. On top of that we lived in a dump most of the time filled with cockroaches, mold, and peeling dry wall.762X545 wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 8:49 pmNot necessarily. I was given a date that my bank account would be closed. We were also advised to only withdraw what we needed for that last week and our travels hims. It was a week or so before I went home. Guess what I did a week before that? I took all of my money out except for the like $5 minimum I had to keep in there.Ebenezer wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:04 am I think it’s interesting that any surplus a member has on a missionary account, which is usually the cost of one month or less, can’t be refunded. It must be redirected as a donation. I know of one case where a family is sitting on a couple hundred bucks in their now-returned missionary’s account just waiting for their younger son to go so they can roll it into his account rather than watch it disappear into the general fund.
We ate out every evening an I believe I used the rest to put a down payment on my truck. I had saved almost 2k while on my mission.
Meanwhile the Mission President lived like a king. Had HUGE apartment in downtown Rio fully furnished with food catering, and a complementary Church-issued SUV.
Thinking about all these unnecessary hardships I went through on my mission (most of them could have been aliviated financially) and then learning about Ensign Peak Associates was a big factor in me going inactive, although it wasn't the only reason.
- Subcomandante
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 4411
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
This is one example of how the Church uses this type of funding to be able to send missionaries overseas; you can't send them without purse or scrip; there would be no country that would accept them without proof of funds.[email protected] wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 8:48 am Specifically, the idea that a family in good standing with the Church should be expected to pay $500 a month in addition to 10% of their income plus fast offerings is ridiculous for an organization that has 150 billion dollars at it's disposal. This is a travesty, especially when you consider how poor missionaries are and that they barely.scrape by.
Honestly as I get older and see things more clearly I think the way the Church treats it's young missionaries is awful. The fact that their families are expected to pay out of pocket for that experience is equally awful for such a wealthy church.
Not everyone pays 500 dollars. It depends on the country. I know the current rate that they ask of Mexican families is about 3,500 pesos per missionary per month. That's about 170 dollars.
-
- captain of 100
- Posts: 659
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
That's not really the point. The point is, why is an organization with $150 billion in excess assets requiring it's members to pay anything addtional for voluntary missionary service on top of what they pay in tithes and offerings?Subcomandante wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:01 pmThis is one example of how the Church uses this type of funding to be able to send missionaries overseas; you can't send them without purse or scrip; there would be no country that would accept them without proof of funds.[email protected] wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 8:48 am Specifically, the idea that a family in good standing with the Church should be expected to pay $500 a month in addition to 10% of their income plus fast offerings is ridiculous for an organization that has 150 billion dollars at it's disposal. This is a travesty, especially when you consider how poor missionaries are and that they barely.scrape by.
Honestly as I get older and see things more clearly I think the way the Church treats it's young missionaries is awful. The fact that their families are expected to pay out of pocket for that experience is equally awful for such a wealthy church.
Not everyone pays 500 dollars. It depends on the country. I know the current rate that they ask of Mexican families is about 3,500 pesos per missionary per month. That's about 170 dollars.
It was about $350 a month when I served (plus all the upfront costs like clothes/garmets) but I can tell you I only saw a small fraction of that actually directly support me and had to dip even more into my parent's funds just to survive.
Like I said the church is beyond cheap, they're exploitative when they do that.
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1224
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
that is so wrong!Ebenezer wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:04 am I think it’s interesting that any surplus a member has on a missionary account, which is usually the cost of one month or less, can’t be refunded. It must be redirected as a donation. I know of one case where a family is sitting on a couple hundred bucks in their now-returned missionary’s account just waiting for their younger son to go so they can roll it into his account rather than watch it disappear into the general fund.
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1224
Re: LDS Missions should not cost a dime.
[email protected] wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 10:56 pmI was barely able to feed myself consistently on my mission. Went to Rio where we got something like 180 Reais a month (assuming the mission office deposited the money on time). Back then (circa 2004) that was less than 60$ a month for food and transportation. Quite frankly it was really bad, so bad I had to get a backup credit card from my parents to survive. On top of that we lived in a dump most of the time filled with cockroaches, mold, and peeling dry wall.762X545 wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 8:49 pmNot necessarily. I was given a date that my bank account would be closed. We were also advised to only withdraw what we needed for that last week and our travels hims. It was a week or so before I went home. Guess what I did a week before that? I took all of my money out except for the like $5 minimum I had to keep in there.Ebenezer wrote: ↑July 30th, 2022, 11:04 am I think it’s interesting that any surplus a member has on a missionary account, which is usually the cost of one month or less, can’t be refunded. It must be redirected as a donation. I know of one case where a family is sitting on a couple hundred bucks in their now-returned missionary’s account just waiting for their younger son to go so they can roll it into his account rather than watch it disappear into the general fund.
We ate out every evening an I believe I used the rest to put a down payment on my truck. I had saved almost 2k while on my mission.
Meanwhile the Mission President lived like a king. Had HUGE apartment in downtown Rio fully furnished with food catering, and a complementary Church-issued SUV.
Thinking about all these unnecessary hardships I went through on my mission (most of them could have been aliviated financially) and then learning about Ensign Peak Associates was a big factor in me going inactive, although it wasn't the only reason.