What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

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larsenb
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Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by larsenb »

gkearney wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 12:53 pm
inho wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 11:55 am Seems like we should have gkearney, our resident mason, to step in and explain some basics of masonry. Like that there are basically only three stages or degrees of masonry (Entered Apprentice, Fellow Craft, and Master Mason). Everything else is just appendices, whether it is York rite or Scottish rite or whatever.

That presentation could very well be what RoseofSharon's husband said: just some random dude giving a presentation of his theories. Can we even be sure that the presenter really is a mason? But definitely we cannot say that what was said in the video is something that all high-up masons learn.
OK here are the fundamentals of Freemasonry. First up there are only three Masonic Degrees Entered Apprentice, Fellow Craft, and Master Mason. This is sometimes referred to as "Blue Lodge Masonry". All the other degrees be they York Rite or Scottish Rite, and I have done both, are appendages to the three degrees. There is no such thing as a higher-level mason than that of a Master Mason.

The York and Scottish Rites, where we get the idea of 33-degree are inventions of the late 18th century. These masonic bodies are subordinate to and dependent upon the Grand Lodges of the state, province, or territories in which they function. The Grand Lodges are in turn made up of all the Master Masons in a given state, province, or territory. Grand Lodges are governed day to day by the Grand Master, an elected officer chosen by the members of the Grand Lodge in a yearly meeting. No Mason, regardless of whatever supplemental degrees he may have chosen to get, has any more authority in Masonry than any other or that of the Master of his lodge or the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge. Even these offices are very limited in what they may do without the lodge or Grand Lodge voting upon it.

So the appeals to authority by citing the work of someone or another being a "high degree" or 33-degree mason are bogus on their face. I'm a "high degree mason" but I don't see any of you or anyone else for that matter hanging upon my every word. As for the video, while Masonry uses the various esoteric ideas to teach moral principles I know of no Mason of any degree that takes these matters as literal in the way the video presenter does. While parts of his presentation have Masonic elements he is taking them out of the context of the degree work and presenting them as being something they are not which is some sort of "secret teaching" of Masonry. I never got this kind of lecture in any degree in Masonry. The presenter is just making things up to suit his agenda.
I'm curious. Where do you fall out on the authenticity of the more controversial writings of Albert Pike?

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gkearney
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Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by gkearney »

larsenb wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 11:57 am
gkearney wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 12:53 pm
inho wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 11:55 am Seems like we should have gkearney, our resident mason, to step in and explain some basics of masonry. Like that there are basically only three stages or degrees of masonry (Entered Apprentice, Fellow Craft, and Master Mason). Everything else is just appendices, whether it is York rite or Scottish rite or whatever.

That presentation could very well be what RoseofSharon's husband said: just some random dude giving a presentation of his theories. Can we even be sure that the presenter really is a mason? But definitely we cannot say that what was said in the video is something that all high-up masons learn.
OK here are the fundamentals of Freemasonry. First up there are only three Masonic Degrees Entered Apprentice, Fellow Craft, and Master Mason. This is sometimes referred to as "Blue Lodge Masonry". All the other degrees be they York Rite or Scottish Rite, and I have done both, are appendages to the three degrees. There is no such thing as a higher-level mason than that of a Master Mason.

The York and Scottish Rites, where we get the idea of 33-degree are inventions of the late 18th century. These masonic bodies are subordinate to and dependent upon the Grand Lodges of the state, province, or territories in which they function. The Grand Lodges are in turn made up of all the Master Masons in a given state, province, or territory. Grand Lodges are governed day to day by the Grand Master, an elected officer chosen by the members of the Grand Lodge in a yearly meeting. No Mason, regardless of whatever supplemental degrees he may have chosen to get, has any more authority in Masonry than any other or that of the Master of his lodge or the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge. Even these offices are very limited in what they may do without the lodge or Grand Lodge voting upon it.

So the appeals to authority by citing the work of someone or another being a "high degree" or 33-degree mason are bogus on their face. I'm a "high degree mason" but I don't see any of you or anyone else for that matter hanging upon my every word. As for the video, while Masonry uses the various esoteric ideas to teach moral principles I know of no Mason of any degree that takes these matters as literal in the way the video presenter does. While parts of his presentation have Masonic elements he is taking them out of the context of the degree work and presenting them as being something they are not which is some sort of "secret teaching" of Masonry. I never got this kind of lecture in any degree in Masonry. The presenter is just making things up to suit his agenda.
I'm curious. Where do you fall out on the authenticity of the more controversial writings of Albert Pike?
Albert Pike is no more authoritative on Masonic Matters than am I or any other Mason. As someone who did his Scottish Rite work in the Northern Jurisdiction, I really do not pay Pike and his esoteric ramblings much heed at all. Neither, I will point out would Scottish Rite Masons from Scotland, the UK, Canada, Australia, India, South Africa, or even the northern parts of the United States. Pike had a rather grand sounding title which he parlayed into selling books but that's about it.

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Niemand
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Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by Niemand »

I notice that Albert Pike's Wikipedia entry is entirely bowdlerised apart from the race issue and KKK. Nothing on his quotes about Freemasonry supposedly being connected to Luciferianism etc.

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Pazooka
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Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by Pazooka »

Niemand wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 3:59 am
Pazooka wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 3:45 pm
Niemand wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 2:04 pm The Sun is often portrayed as an eye in primitive cultures, so the idea was that it was one of a pair, with the black sun being the closed eye, or the Moon.
You’re on to something, here. The sun and moon are both eyes - literal SEERs (here I am beating a dead horse, again). But the black sun would be a fallen, darkened seer and not the moon.
There is an old tradition in Scottish mythology of the Cailleach Bheur, the old hag who is a giant and has one eye and is associated with the Moon. Some said the Moon was this eye.

I couldn't really see this connection until one night I was wandering home. The Moon was full and there was a huge halo around it due to thin cloud - this circle was a lot bigger than the diameter of the Moon in the sky... and it really did look like a giant eye looking down on me, complete with pupil.

This is similar to what I saw.
Image

I know the Sun can do this too with thin cloud, and I have seen so called Moon dogs and Sun dogs.

A lot of anti-Masons say the all seeing eye of Masonry is the Eye of Horus. I'm not sure why not Ra instead, being the sun god. I remember one anti-Mason saying, "I don't worship a one-eyed god". That I thought was a pretty good burn!

The all seeing eye of the Sun.
Image

One eyed Odin/Wotan. He gave up one eye for wisdom
Image
Some say Lucifer is the idol shepherd of Zechariah 11:17 whose right arm is stricken and withered and right eye blinded by the sword. I would imagine he would think that a sacrifice he made to gain wisdom - - the Satanic sacrifice.

The Facsimile 2, with the eyes of Fig 3 are interesting as well.

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Niemand
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Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by Niemand »

Pazooka wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 5:59 pm
Niemand wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 3:59 am
Pazooka wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 3:45 pm
Niemand wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 2:04 pm The Sun is often portrayed as an eye in primitive cultures, so the idea was that it was one of a pair, with the black sun being the closed eye, or the Moon.
You’re on to something, here. The sun and moon are both eyes - literal SEERs (here I am beating a dead horse, again). But the black sun would be a fallen, darkened seer and not the moon.
There is an old tradition in Scottish mythology of the Cailleach Bheur, the old hag who is a giant and has one eye and is associated with the Moon. Some said the Moon was this eye.

I couldn't really see this connection until one night I was wandering home. The Moon was full and there was a huge halo around it due to thin cloud - this circle was a lot bigger than the diameter of the Moon in the sky... and it really did look like a giant eye looking down on me, complete with pupil.

This is similar to what I saw.
Image

I know the Sun can do this too with thin cloud, and I have seen so called Moon dogs and Sun dogs.

A lot of anti-Masons say the all seeing eye of Masonry is the Eye of Horus. I'm not sure why not Ra instead, being the sun god. I remember one anti-Mason saying, "I don't worship a one-eyed god". That I thought was a pretty good burn!

The all seeing eye of the Sun.
Image

One eyed Odin/Wotan. He gave up one eye for wisdom
Image
Some say Lucifer is the idol shepherd of Zechariah 11:17 whose right arm is stricken and withered and right eye blinded by the sword. I would imagine he would think that a sacrifice he made to gain wisdom - - the Satanic sacrifice.

The Facsimile 2, with the eyes of Fig 3 are interesting as well.
There are one or two figures in Celtic mythology with one eye, one leg and one arm. They are usually represented as evil, unlike Norse mythology.

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Pazooka
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Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by Pazooka »

Niemand wrote: May 24th, 2022, 12:29 am
Pazooka wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 5:59 pm
Niemand wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 3:59 am
Pazooka wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 3:45 pm

You’re on to something, here. The sun and moon are both eyes - literal SEERs (here I am beating a dead horse, again). But the black sun would be a fallen, darkened seer and not the moon.
There is an old tradition in Scottish mythology of the Cailleach Bheur, the old hag who is a giant and has one eye and is associated with the Moon. Some said the Moon was this eye.

I couldn't really see this connection until one night I was wandering home. The Moon was full and there was a huge halo around it due to thin cloud - this circle was a lot bigger than the diameter of the Moon in the sky... and it really did look like a giant eye looking down on me, complete with pupil.

This is similar to what I saw.
Image

I know the Sun can do this too with thin cloud, and I have seen so called Moon dogs and Sun dogs.

A lot of anti-Masons say the all seeing eye of Masonry is the Eye of Horus. I'm not sure why not Ra instead, being the sun god. I remember one anti-Mason saying, "I don't worship a one-eyed god". That I thought was a pretty good burn!

The all seeing eye of the Sun.
Image

One eyed Odin/Wotan. He gave up one eye for wisdom
Image
Some say Lucifer is the idol shepherd of Zechariah 11:17 whose right arm is stricken and withered and right eye blinded by the sword. I would imagine he would think that a sacrifice he made to gain wisdom - - the Satanic sacrifice.

The Facsimile 2, with the eyes of Fig 3 are interesting as well.
There are one or two figures in Celtic mythology with one eye, one leg and one arm. They are usually represented as evil, unlike Norse mythology.
Yeah, the Norse from the North - they’re tricky. They paint the one-eyed figure as the hero, just like the Luciferians.

larsenb
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Posts: 10813
Location: Between here and Standing Rock

Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by larsenb »

gkearney wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 1:39 pm
larsenb wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 11:57 am
gkearney wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 12:53 pm
inho wrote: May 22nd, 2022, 11:55 am Seems like we should have gkearney, our resident mason, to step in and explain some basics of masonry. Like that there are basically only three stages or degrees of masonry (Entered Apprentice, Fellow Craft, and Master Mason). Everything else is just appendices, whether it is York rite or Scottish rite or whatever.

That presentation could very well be what RoseofSharon's husband said: just some random dude giving a presentation of his theories. Can we even be sure that the presenter really is a mason? But definitely we cannot say that what was said in the video is something that all high-up masons learn.
OK here are the fundamentals of Freemasonry. First up there are only three Masonic Degrees Entered Apprentice, Fellow Craft, and Master Mason. This is sometimes referred to as "Blue Lodge Masonry". All the other degrees be they York Rite or Scottish Rite, and I have done both, are appendages to the three degrees. There is no such thing as a higher-level mason than that of a Master Mason.

The York and Scottish Rites, where we get the idea of 33-degree are inventions of the late 18th century. These masonic bodies are subordinate to and dependent upon the Grand Lodges of the state, province, or territories in which they function. The Grand Lodges are in turn made up of all the Master Masons in a given state, province, or territory. Grand Lodges are governed day to day by the Grand Master, an elected officer chosen by the members of the Grand Lodge in a yearly meeting. No Mason, regardless of whatever supplemental degrees he may have chosen to get, has any more authority in Masonry than any other or that of the Master of his lodge or the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge. Even these offices are very limited in what they may do without the lodge or Grand Lodge voting upon it.

So the appeals to authority by citing the work of someone or another being a "high degree" or 33-degree mason are bogus on their face. I'm a "high degree mason" but I don't see any of you or anyone else for that matter hanging upon my every word. As for the video, while Masonry uses the various esoteric ideas to teach moral principles I know of no Mason of any degree that takes these matters as literal in the way the video presenter does. While parts of his presentation have Masonic elements he is taking them out of the context of the degree work and presenting them as being something they are not which is some sort of "secret teaching" of Masonry. I never got this kind of lecture in any degree in Masonry. The presenter is just making things up to suit his agenda.
I'm curious. Where do you fall out on the authenticity of the more controversial writings of Albert Pike?
Albert Pike is no more authoritative on Masonic Matters than am I or any other Mason. As someone who did his Scottish Rite work in the Northern Jurisdiction, I really do not pay Pike and his esoteric ramblings much heed at all. Neither, I will point out would Scottish Rite Masons from Scotland, the UK, Canada, Australia, India, South Africa, or even the northern parts of the United States. Pike had a rather grand sounding title which he parlayed into selling books but that's about it.
He does come across as a rather evil fellow, if you take his readings seriously.

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mcusick
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Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by mcusick »

Pazooka wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 5:59 pm The Facsimile 2, with the eyes of Fig 3 are interesting as well.
How so?

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Pazooka
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Re: What 33rd degree masons learn about the earth

Post by Pazooka »

mcusick wrote: June 1st, 2022, 7:58 am
Pazooka wrote: May 23rd, 2022, 5:59 pm The Facsimile 2, with the eyes of Fig 3 are interesting as well.
How so?
Egyptians understood the right wedjat eye to be the sun and the left to be the moon. They are feminine, like the two olive trees of Zechariah 4, which were explained to be ”the two *anointing* ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.” KJV has “anointed ones” but it should better be translated “anointing ones.” They are the same olive trees of Revelation 11: ”These are the two olive trees...standing before the God of the earth.” Like the tree of life, these trees would be feminine.

Over the millennia, we have made everything masculine, including the witnesses of Revelation. Enoch and Elijah were anointed from the “oil” (figurative) of these trees but are not these trees.
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