A challenge for all Phil Davis/DoC junkies

[Reluctant Watchman]

Was it mentioned in this thread who Phil Davis thinks he is? I spoke with a person recently and he answered, "Well, it is up to the Spirit to tell you who Phil is." Yeah... that answer didn't fly with me.

The rumor is Lyman Wight

So... nobody knows? Does anyone have the gumption to just ask him?

I don't run in that circle anymore to interact with him, nor do I follow him at all, so it is more work than I care to put in to ask the question. I'm sure if you mention it in the DoC group a few times you'll get the answer - those who know won't deny it or they will- others might say he doesn't, but his inner circle will either do some sort of screwy lawyerly thing and make it seem like you are terrible for spreading rumors, but not actually say Phil doesn't believe that when he really does. At least that is my experience with many in that group and how they operate. Part of why I don't interact with them anymore -that said they may have changed because my experience comes from about 2 years ago or so maybe a little less or more, I can't remember when they set up there group etc... whenever that was.

This idea of an inner and outer group response is what I'm getting as well. I think I've even heard it explained on the DoC Fb page in a similar fashion.

[IcedKoffee]

Was it mentioned in this thread who Phil Davis thinks he is? I spoke with a person recently and he answered, "Well, it is up to the Spirit to tell you who Phil is." Yeah... that answer didn't fly with me.

The rumor is Lyman Wight

So... nobody knows? Does anyone have the gumption to just ask him?

According to my source Phil believes he is Lyman White. When he began preaching that Joseph was coming back he focused heavily on the events surrounding the isaac morley farm incident and those who were involved.

[IcedKoffee]

One question...IceKoffee said that PD is preaching full time who is supporting him financially?

That’s a mystery that no one has been able to figure out. I don’t know where his funding is coming from, but I know that it began sometime before he actually started preaching full time.

[BuriedTartaria]

I feel like these modern Mormon break off groups are destined to clash with one another eventually and perhaps the big Mom herself (SLC-LDS). Would make for the basis of a good religious-fiction story….

[Chris]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

[John Tavner]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

I don't know about that. Balaam was a prophet - he prophesied truth and lies.

[Shawn Henry]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

Phil would likely agree by saying all those prophecies will come true when Joseph returns and puts the house of God in order.

[BuriedTartaria]

What is Phil Davis' prophetic fruit? I'm asking in sincerity. Not attacking or being snarky.
I know he has claimed visitation of angles. I know he's written material (I've read some of it, watched some of his videos), taught concepts. But does he have anything he'd point to as revelation from the Lord that he served as an instrument in providing it to be written down and released? Has he offered explanations of visions and revelations he alleges he has experienced?

He does preaching full time and what is there to show of it? I know he has a website, doctrineofchrist.com. It doesn't seem like it gets updated very much. I feel like it's ran out of stuff to say and updates have slowed down a lot compared to when I regularly checked it out back in 2020.

[Reluctant Watchman]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

Easy. Joseph spoke of a kingdom far more expansive than the LDS org. Also, you should read Joseph's last 3 dreams right before he was murdered. He knew what was coming.

https://www.reluctantwatchman.com/josephs-last-dreams

[BuriedTartaria]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

Easy. Joseph spoke of a kingdom far more expansive than the LDS org. Also, you should read Joseph's last 3 dreams right before he was murdered. He knew what was coming.

https://www.reluctantwatchman.com/josephs-last-dreams

I only knew of one of those steamboat dreams. This is the second time I've learned something new and compelling about Joseph from your website that I did not know before. I appreciate the material you have gathered there.

[creator]

I feel like these modern Mormon break off groups are destined to clash with one another eventually..

Most groups tend to fall apart from within. I've seen big divides within both the Phil Davis DoC group and the Denver Snuffer Remnant.

[BuriedTartaria]

I feel like these modern Mormon break off groups are destined to clash with one another eventually..

Most groups tend to fall apart from within. I've seen big divides within both the Phil Davis DoC group and the Denver Snuffer Remnant.

I am interested to see what both amount to

[Reluctant Watchman]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

Easy. Joseph spoke of a kingdom far more expansive than the LDS org. Also, you should read Joseph's last 3 dreams right before he was murdered. He knew what was coming.

https://www.reluctantwatchman.com/josephs-last-dreams

I only knew of one of those steamboat dreams. This is the second time I've learned something new and compelling about Joseph from your website that I did not know before. I appreciate the material you have gathered there.

His last dream was quite remarkable.

[BuriedTartaria]

Was Phil Davis ever excommunicated?

[Chris]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

Easy. Joseph spoke of a kingdom far more expansive than the LDS org. Also, you should read Joseph's last 3 dreams right before he was murdered. He knew what was coming.

https://www.reluctantwatchman.com/josephs-last-dreams

How predictable you would quote that, that is the famous go to. However it is so easy to understand he is talking about the reorganized church there and not the other you know one true church. You pass over ALL the prophecies of him talking about the church being established in the rocky mountains, and how brigham will be the leader, you pass over all the dozens of people who saw the mantle of joseph fall on brigham. You pass over all the many thousands of prophecies and experiences of 1000's of saints......... You have to be blind to believe what you believe. Joseph prophesied this church would fill north and south america, it would fill the world....... Got news for you that has been done and will continue to be over the next little while. When joseph comes back it will only be for a few short years before the second coming and only to help with Zion...... Cant understand how people so blatantly ignore the 99.99% of the evidence of this being Christ true church to look at the .001% the devil loves to feed these DOC fools. They will all soon find out, how foolish they have been.

[Chris]

As far as what they each received from Joseph I’d rather not say.

So, at a minimum, they both physically met someone who was at least claiming to be Joseph?

This was a meeting that took place within the spirit realm so there was no physical contact. However, Phil would say that having a full on spiritual experience is just as real as having an experience within the physical realm. I can’t speak on my former mentor but I believe Phil would say that Joseph physically put his hands on him.

Phil breaks down visions into three types.

Type 1 - would be like hearing a voice.

Type 2 - would be like having a dream, seeing a blurry vision, or possibly even having an NDE.

Type 3 - would be described as having a full on second comforter experience where you step completely through the veil. The Lords face becomes clear as day. All of your senses become heightened. Almost like your seeing everything through the clearest high definition camera. The phrase that is often used to describe this experience is “wether in or out of the body I knew it not”!

It’s been a while but I believe Phil would classify his experience at Adam-ondi-Ahman as a type 3.

He is nuts, he is crazy. If you are going to be a fraud, he should at least be smart enough to follow true hand to head conferral. I cant believe anyone follows that guy.

[Reluctant Watchman]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

Easy. Joseph spoke of a kingdom far more expansive than the LDS org. Also, you should read Joseph's last 3 dreams right before he was murdered. He knew what was coming.

https://www.reluctantwatchman.com/josephs-last-dreams

How predictable you would quote that, that is the famous go to. However it is so easy to understand he is talking about the reorganized church there and not the other you know one true church. You pass over ALL the prophecies of him talking about the church being established in the rocky mountains, and how brigham will be the leader, you pass over all the dozens of people who saw the mantle of joseph fall on brigham. You pass over all the many thousands of prophecies and experiences of 1000's of saints......... You have to be blind to believe what you believe. Joseph prophesied this church would fill north and south america, it would fill the world....... Got news for you that has been done and will continue to be over the next little while. When joseph comes back it will only be for a few short years before the second coming and only to help with Zion...... Cant understand how people so blatantly ignore the 99.99% of the evidence of this being Christ true church to look at the .001% the devil loves to feed these DOC fools. They will all soon find out, how foolish they have been.

I’m well aware of what kingdom Joseph spoke of. Given that Brigham was a sexual predator, I cannot agree that this “Zion” that moved West was what Joseph had envisioned.

The gathering of Zion, that spoken of in 3 Nephi 21, will happen. But it will not be the LDS church. The Lord removed those blessings in His prophesy in 3 Nephi 16:10-11.

Follow these men who you claim to be prophets if you feel inclined to do so. False prophets aren’t my cup of tea. You’ve got one thing for certain though, they are for sure fulfilling prophecy. Just not what you’ve envisioned in your head and what the LDS org has taught you.

[Shawn Henry]

He does preaching full time and what is there to show of it?

Noting that I've seen. He would likely say that his role is simply to gather enough like-minded people. He says the same things in every podcast, quotes the same scriptures over and over again. To me it's just another second comforter club.

He actually claims JS laid hands on him but doesn't ever claim what was bestowed upon him. I would say that he implies the fulness of the priesthood was given to him, but I've never heard him outright say as much.

I find it interesting and quite telling that he is the only one that Joseph chose to fulfill this mission. Phil has never mentioned anyone else preparing a remnant for Joseph. So, whether directly or indirectly he is setting himself up as a John the Baptist, that one person with the special calling to prepare the way.

[Shawn Henry]

You pass over ALL the prophecies of him talking about the church being established in the rocky mountains, and how brigham will be the leader, you pass over all the dozens of people who saw the mantle of joseph fall on brigham. You pass over all the many thousands of prophecies and experiences of 1000's of saints

You mean all the non-contemporary accounts that the saints wrote after they were in the Rockies? I know of accounts that can actually be traced back to Joseph speaking of both Texas and Canada as new gathering places.

There are no prophecies that BY will be the new leader. In Michael D. Quinn's book he does list 3 or 4 quotes from others saying that Joseph said if BY ever led this church he would lead it to hell. Shouldn't we take those into account as well?

All the quotes, whether real or not, are moot because we have what the Lord spoke on the matter in the D&C. He designated where the Stakes of Zion were and gave a specific revelation for each Stake. He then also said that there would be no more places appointed until the ones that had been appointed were filled. We did not fill them. We got kicked out of Nauvoo by the Lord for disobedience. The scriptures are quite clear that Zion is not the whole of North and South America. How would a "Cry go forth" to physically gather to one place when everywhere is that one place? The trumpet is blown to let us know not to gather but to stay in our homes?

Why are you not quoting the Lord when he has spoken on the matter?

[IcedKoffee]

He does preaching full time and what is there to show of it?

Noting that I've seen. He would likely say that his role is simply to gather enough like-minded people. He says the same things in every podcast, quotes the same scriptures over and over again. To me it's just another second comforter club.

He actually claims JS laid hands on him but doesn't ever claim what was bestowed upon him. I would say that he implies the fulness of the priesthood was given to him, but I've never heard him outright say as much.

I find it interesting and quite telling that he is the only one that Joseph chose to fulfill this mission. Phil has never mentioned anyone else preparing a remnant for Joseph. So, whether directly or indirectly he is setting himself up as a John the Baptist, that one person with the special calling to prepare the way.

“He actually claims JS laid hands on him but doesn't ever claim what was bestowed upon him. I would say that he implies the fulness of the priesthood was given to him, but I've never heard him outright say as much.”

I’m not sure if this was the exact moment when “it happened” (Joseph laying his hands on him to confer the fullness of the priesthood) but we were all at a camp retreat when Phil claims to have ascended to the throne room of God. According to him he was brought into the presence of God the Father, Jesus Christ, and Joseph Smith. Afterwards he did indeed say that Joseph placed his hands on him. Wether or not he claims to have received the fullness at that point I can’t say for certain. But I have heard him say on a few occasions that he has received the FOP. Mike Stroud was also a part of our camp retreat. It was like watching a battle of the Gurus!

[Shawn Henry]

I’m not sure if this was the exact moment when “it happened” (Joseph laying his hands on him to confer the fullness of the priesthood) but we were all at a camp retreat when Phil claims to have ascended to the throne room of God. According to him he was brought into the presence of God the Father, Jesus Christ, and Joseph Smith. Afterwards he did indeed say that Joseph placed his hands on him. Whether or not he claims to have received the fullness at that point I can’t say for certain. But I have heard him say on a few occasions that he has received the FOP. Mike Stroud was also a part of our camp retreat. It was like watching a battle of the Gurus!

This seems like a separate event from when he felt the prints is Jesus' hands and feet.

This is a throne theophany event which is typical of an OT calling to be a prophet, but he doesn't claim to be a prophet. Fascinating!

I imagine Phil meeting Stroud to be a disastrous outcome, what was the outcome of that?

[Chris]

You pass over ALL the prophecies of him talking about the church being established in the rocky mountains, and how brigham will be the leader, you pass over all the dozens of people who saw the mantle of joseph fall on brigham. You pass over all the many thousands of prophecies and experiences of 1000's of saints

You mean all the non-contemporary accounts that the saints wrote after they were in the Rockies? I know of accounts that can actually be traced back to Joseph speaking of both Texas and Canada as new gathering places.

There are no prophecies that BY will be the new leader. In Michael D. Quinn's book he does list 3 or 4 quotes from others saying that Joseph said if BY ever led this church he would lead it to hell. Shouldn't we take those into account as well?

All the quotes, whether real or not, are moot because we have what the Lord spoke on the matter in the D&C. He designated where the Stakes of Zion were and gave a specific revelation for each Stake. He then also said that there would be no more places appointed until the ones that had been appointed were filled. We did not fill them. We got kicked out of Nauvoo by the Lord for disobedience. The scriptures are quite clear that Zion is not the whole of North and South America. How would a "Cry go forth" to physically gather to one place when everywhere is that one place? The trumpet is blown to let us know not to gather but to stay in our homes?

Why are you not quoting the Lord when he has spoken on the matter?

You clearly are cherry picking your research. There are several accounts written in journals in nauvoo the very day it happened. There are also several accounts written by many people in journals in nauvoo where joseph specifically that is where they will go and there are literally dozens on all the above in nuavoo. Heber c kimball has many. Although i am sure you probably think Heber is a evil Joseph murder though. So i guess you cant count him.

My statement about the church filling north and south America and eventually the whole world has nothing to do with what zion is or isnt. That is not a quote about zion it is a quote about the church. You need to read all the history that is very well documented instead of just looking at the crap quote DOC pushes with their agenda. There is a lot of church history and it is very visible and you are ignoring most of it to look for what you can quote to convince people to apostatize.

[Chris]

You pass over ALL the prophecies of him talking about the church being established in the rocky mountains, and how brigham will be the leader, you pass over all the dozens of people who saw the mantle of joseph fall on brigham. You pass over all the many thousands of prophecies and experiences of 1000's of saints

You mean all the non-contemporary accounts that the saints wrote after they were in the Rockies? I know of accounts that can actually be traced back to Joseph speaking of both Texas and Canada as new gathering places.

There are no prophecies that BY will be the new leader. In Michael D. Quinn's book he does list 3 or 4 quotes from others saying that Joseph said if BY ever led this church he would lead it to hell. Shouldn't we take those into account as well?

All the quotes, whether real or not, are moot because we have what the Lord spoke on the matter in the D&C. He designated where the Stakes of Zion were and gave a specific revelation for each Stake. He then also said that there would be no more places appointed until the ones that had been appointed were filled. We did not fill them. We got kicked out of Nauvoo by the Lord for disobedience. The scriptures are quite clear that Zion is not the whole of North and South America. How would a "Cry go forth" to physically gather to one place when everywhere is that one place? The trumpet is blown to let us know not to gather but to stay in our homes?

Why are you not quoting the Lord when he has spoken on the matter?

You clearly are cherry picking your research. There are several accounts written in journals in nauvoo the very day it happened. There are also several accounts written by many people in journals in nauvoo where joseph specifically that is where they will go and there are literally dozens on all the above in nuavoo. Heber c kimball has many. Although i am sure you probably think Heber is a evil Joseph murder though. So i guess you cant count him.

My statement about the church filling north and south America and eventually the whole world has nothing to do with what zion is or isnt. That is not a quote about zion it is a quote about the church. You need to read all the history that is very well documented instead of just looking at the crap quote DOC pushes with their agenda. There is a lot of church history and it is very visible and you are ignoring most of it to look for what you can quote to convince people to apostatize.

I dont have time to find the quote for you. But here is a excellent video that shares the quote at the beginning. I know this video may be very hard to watch as it shares some peoples experiences in the church that are favorable, but it is actually really good. <iframe width="664" height="506" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/pIAO01iRHjM" title="An Ensign to the Nations (1997)" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Chris]

I dont know how anyone can follow that nut job. How can anyone claim to follow Joseph Smith and then disavow the other prophets and church ( which go hand in hand with Josephs prophecy's ) You cant it is impossible. Joseph Spoke of and prophesied of this church and its future and you cant ignore that. Cant claim him as a prophet and not take ALL of his prophecies.......

Easy. Joseph spoke of a kingdom far more expansive than the LDS org. Also, you should read Joseph's last 3 dreams right before he was murdered. He knew what was coming.

https://www.reluctantwatchman.com/josephs-last-dreams

How predictable you would quote that, that is the famous go to. However it is so easy to understand he is talking about the reorganized church there and not the other you know one true church. You pass over ALL the prophecies of him talking about the church being established in the rocky mountains, and how brigham will be the leader, you pass over all the dozens of people who saw the mantle of joseph fall on brigham. You pass over all the many thousands of prophecies and experiences of 1000's of saints......... You have to be blind to believe what you believe. Joseph prophesied this church would fill north and south america, it would fill the world....... Got news for you that has been done and will continue to be over the next little while. When joseph comes back it will only be for a few short years before the second coming and only to help with Zion...... Cant understand how people so blatantly ignore the 99.99% of the evidence of this being Christ true church to look at the .001% the devil loves to feed these DOC fools. They will all soon find out, how foolish they have been.

I’m well aware of what kingdom Joseph spoke of. Given that Brigham was a sexual predator, I cannot agree that this “Zion” that moved West was what Joseph had envisioned.

The gathering of Zion, that spoken of in 3 Nephi 21, will happen. But it will not be the LDS church. The Lord removed those blessings in His prophesy in 3 Nephi 16:10-11.

Follow these men who you claim to be prophets if you feel inclined to do so. False prophets aren’t my cup of tea. You’ve got one thing for certain though, they are for sure fulfilling prophecy. Just not what you’ve envisioned in your head and what the LDS org has taught you.

So Brigham is a sexual predator, but joseph isnt? i guess you probably think Joseph didnt practice plural marriage huh? Well what about Moses, was he a sexual predator? How about Abraham, Isaac and Jacob? They all predators too?

You know i am no fool, I have had the 2nd comforter and it was amazing. But it was because of this church that i did and it was real, not some stupid fake experience. I know several apostles and i can tell you they are very aware of what is going on and they are just like Joseph having more experiences and visions then their "meat and drink" As joseph said so well you cant turn against the light and leave this church and think you wont fall into satans power. I have news for you. You cant claim joseph and the savior and deny this church. You leave this church and you loose all 3 and the eternal blessings. Things are about to go down in the next 2 years. If i were you i would do some soul searching and repenting. I am not trying to be a jerk, but i hope you find your way back before it is too late. Because this DOC crap is nuts. You cant pick little pieces and ignore the whole. The Heber c kimball quote about the test is playing out right now. The shots is the test. ( I didnt get one because i was told no ) But the test is can you stick with the church through it all whatever side you are on...... I wish you the best

[BeNotDeceived]

I feel like these modern Mormon break off groups are destined to clash with one another eventually..

Most groups tend to fall apart from within. I've seen big divides within both the Phil Davis DoC group and the Denver Snuffer Remnant.

I am interested to see what both amount to

A whole hill of beans that goes nowhere, but to distract from the real deal.