LDS Freedom Forum

tdj wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 7:00 pm I'm left reeling. This started awhile back, but festered up over the weekend. I am, or WAS friends with a woman from church over facebook. I think we were friends in real life also. At least I considered her a friend. She's always been willing to help our family whenever we had an emergency. Just a really good person over all.
The problem happened when she made a comment on facebook about how the story of sodom and gomorah was inaccurately potrayed as the reason for it's destruction being homosexuality. She said this wasn't true and that it was because of the rape culture of that city. I disagreed with her and said that it may have played a role, but other things did also as well as the sin of homosexuality. She kind of went off on that. At least by HER standards. She claimed that being gay was normal and that people naturally wanted love and companionship. She said that church folk needed to stop teaching that about sodom and gomorah because it was extremely hurtful to our LBGTQ members and not true. I didn't disagree with her on the rape culture part, but pointed out that God still doesn't want people engaging in gay relations, and mentioned other scripture all thru the bible against homosexual sex. She said the validity of those scriptures was in doubt, and that it was unnecessary to bring them up anyway. Jesus was the judge, not us, and that he would judge how we treated people, and not by anything else.

The next problem arose when she posted a pic of her on facebook wearing a rainbow pin saying she was going to wear it every Sunday to support her LGBTQ church members and family. I learned her sister apparently is a lesbian since I saw that her facebook page shows her and another girl in a wedding dress. In the second post with the rainbow pin, her sister claimed she was there to verbally assault (she used those words) anyone who said anything nasty. She then referred to me after I sent an angry emoji in response to that. She said I was being hurtful by bringing up scriptures and spreading hate. Both her and the friend claimed that and I did no such thing. I approached the subject as kindly as I could, and never advocated nastiness to anyone. But she keeps insisting I did, and throws the word "hate" around like cheap candy in describing my opinion on it. She said every time she mentioned it I had to "chime in" with hateful rhetoric. I can't stress strongly enough how much of an effort I made to be NON hurtful and combative on the subject. But it just didn't matter. I finally gave up and posted that it would never happen again. She liked that post and responded thank you. Initially I unfollowed her, but after a day or two I decided to just unfriend her completely. Several backed and congratulated her. No one backed me. I'm still left reeling that this conversation even happened with another church member. And in the most conservative location in all the world at that.

Something that I took away from that. Several things: For one, Satan really has managed to get a stronghold on this world if he's managed to infiltrate so much into what traditionally is considered regular, otherwise normal every day folk. Second: Homosexuality has a real demonic component to it just based on how people are treated who disagree with it, no matter how mild a disagreement. Even with my church "friends" on facebook, there was an extra level of nasty, and vitriol on the subject. It's hard to explain, but when you've felt the vibe of a demon nearby influencing people, you recognize it when you sense it again. Homosexuality and its supporters has that vibe. Third: There's a passage in the Bible about in the end times people will be deceived. I think we are seeing this being played out right now.

This happened last week, and again several days ago, and my head is still spinning in shock.

spiritMan wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 8:12 pm

I will not sustain any member for a calling who promotes this demonic ideology.

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 7:09 pm In conversations I’ve followed for years, it has become crazy-town in the way the pro-lgbtq folks say it’s all about love, love, love, love, and that we all need to quit being judgemental.....UNTIL you don’t agree 100% with them. Then they hate you, call you the worst names in the book, and heap their judgement on you.

I’m sorry this happened to you personally. I have siblings who would do the same to me, so our relationships have fizzled. I can’t be who I am with them, so I’m better off finding real family.

the rape culture of that city

krp435 wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 7:49 pm Our ward Primary President wears a rainbow pin every Sunday.

tdj wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 7:00 pm I'm left reeling. This started awhile back, but festered up over the weekend. I am, or WAS friends with a woman from church over facebook. I think we were friends in real life also. At least I considered her a friend. She's always been willing to help our family whenever we had an emergency. Just a really good person over all.
The problem happened when she made a comment on facebook about how the story of sodom and gomorah was inaccurately potrayed as the reason for it's destruction being homosexuality. She said this wasn't true and that it was because of the rape culture of that city. I disagreed with her and said that it may have played a role, but other things did also as well as the sin of homosexuality. She kind of went off on that. At least by HER standards. She claimed that being gay was normal and that people naturally wanted love and companionship. She said that church folk needed to stop teaching that about sodom and gomorah because it was extremely hurtful to our LBGTQ members and not true. I didn't disagree with her on the rape culture part, but pointed out that God still doesn't want people engaging in gay relations, and mentioned other scripture all thru the bible against homosexual sex. She said the validity of those scriptures was in doubt, and that it was unnecessary to bring them up anyway. Jesus was the judge, not us, and that he would judge how we treated people, and not by anything else.

The next problem arose when she posted a pic of her on facebook wearing a rainbow pin saying she was going to wear it every Sunday to support her LGBTQ church members and family. I learned her sister apparently is a lesbian since I saw that her facebook page shows her and another girl in a wedding dress. In the second post with the rainbow pin, her sister claimed she was there to verbally assault (she used those words) anyone who said anything nasty. She then referred to me after I sent an angry emoji in response to that. She said I was being hurtful by bringing up scriptures and spreading hate. Both her and the friend claimed that and I did no such thing. I approached the subject as kindly as I could, and never advocated nastiness to anyone. But she keeps insisting I did, and throws the word "hate" around like cheap candy in describing my opinion on it. She said every time she mentioned it I had to "chime in" with hateful rhetoric. I can't stress strongly enough how much of an effort I made to be NON hurtful and combative on the subject. But it just didn't matter. I finally gave up and posted that it would never happen again. She liked that post and responded thank you. Initially I unfollowed her, but after a day or two I decided to just unfriend her completely. Several backed and congratulated her. No one backed me. I'm still left reeling that this conversation even happened with another church member. And in the most conservative location in all the world at that.

Something that I took away from that. Several things: For one, Satan really has managed to get a stronghold on this world if he's managed to infiltrate so much into what traditionally is considered regular, otherwise normal every day folk. Second: Homosexuality has a real demonic component to it just based on how people are treated who disagree with it, no matter how mild a disagreement. Even with my church "friends" on facebook, there was an extra level of nasty, and vitriol on the subject. It's hard to explain, but when you've felt the vibe of a demon nearby influencing people, you recognize it when you sense it again. Homosexuality and its supporters has that vibe. Third: There's a passage in the Bible about in the end times people will be deceived. I think we are seeing this being played out right now.

This happened last week, and again several days ago, and my head is still spinning in shock.

spiritMan wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 8:16 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 7:09 pm In conversations I’ve followed for years, it has become crazy-town in the way the pro-lgbtq folks say it’s all about love, love, love, love, and that we all need to quit being judgemental.....UNTIL you don’t agree 100% with them. Then they hate you, call you the worst names in the book, and heap their judgement on you.

I’m sorry this happened to you personally. I have siblings who would do the same to me, so our relationships have fizzled. I can’t be who I am with them, so I’m better off finding real family.

It is coming to a head real soon. I think within the next 5 years we are going to have a resolution one way or the other. Look how far it has come in 5 years and then just project out in 5 more years.

I told my wife just recently; our oldest is getting ready for FSY. He is our eyes and ears (since they won't release the curriculum prior) and he is very savy. If there is any preaching of LGBTQ+ism or CRT at FSY (and I'm pretty sure there will be); we are done and out.

I will pull my kids from the Church and we will find somewhere else to go; not because I don't believe the Book of Mormon (or JS), but I will not allow my children to be in a religion where at the tender young men/young women ages they are being indoctrinated into this crap.

I will probably still go to the local ward to fight it; but I won't allow my children to go and I will let everyone in the ward know why. That's a red line for me.

tdj wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 7:00 pm I'm left reeling. This started awhile back, but festered up over the weekend. I am, or WAS friends with a woman from church over facebook. I think we were friends in real life also. At least I considered her a friend. She's always been willing to help our family whenever we had an emergency. Just a really good person over all.
The problem happened when she made a comment on facebook about how the story of sodom and gomorah was inaccurately potrayed as the reason for it's destruction being homosexuality. She said this wasn't true and that it was because of the rape culture of that city. I disagreed with her and said that it may have played a role, but other things did also as well as the sin of homosexuality. She kind of went off on that. At least by HER standards. She claimed that being gay was normal and that people naturally wanted love and companionship. She said that church folk needed to stop teaching that about sodom and gomorah because it was extremely hurtful to our LBGTQ members and not true. I didn't disagree with her on the rape culture part, but pointed out that God still doesn't want people engaging in gay relations, and mentioned other scripture all thru the bible against homosexual sex. She said the validity of those scriptures was in doubt, and that it was unnecessary to bring them up anyway. Jesus was the judge, not us, and that he would judge how we treated people, and not by anything else.

The next problem arose when she posted a pic of her on facebook wearing a rainbow pin saying she was going to wear it every Sunday to support her LGBTQ church members and family. I learned her sister apparently is a lesbian since I saw that her facebook page shows her and another girl in a wedding dress. In the second post with the rainbow pin, her sister claimed she was there to verbally assault (she used those words) anyone who said anything nasty. She then referred to me after I sent an angry emoji in response to that. She said I was being hurtful by bringing up scriptures and spreading hate. Both her and the friend claimed that and I did no such thing. I approached the subject as kindly as I could, and never advocated nastiness to anyone. But she keeps insisting I did, and throws the word "hate" around like cheap candy in describing my opinion on it. She said every time she mentioned it I had to "chime in" with hateful rhetoric. I can't stress strongly enough how much of an effort I made to be NON hurtful and combative on the subject. But it just didn't matter. I finally gave up and posted that it would never happen again. She liked that post and responded thank you. Initially I unfollowed her, but after a day or two I decided to just unfriend her completely. Several backed and congratulated her. No one backed me. I'm still left reeling that this conversation even happened with another church member. And in the most conservative location in all the world at that.

Something that I took away from that. Several things: For one, Satan really has managed to get a stronghold on this world if he's managed to infiltrate so much into what traditionally is considered regular, otherwise normal every day folk. Second: Homosexuality has a real demonic component to it just based on how people are treated who disagree with it, no matter how mild a disagreement. Even with my church "friends" on facebook, there was an extra level of nasty, and vitriol on the subject. It's hard to explain, but when you've felt the vibe of a demon nearby influencing people, you recognize it when you sense it again. Homosexuality and its supporters has that vibe. Third: There's a passage in the Bible about in the end times people will be deceived. I think we are seeing this being played out right now.

This happened last week, and again several days ago, and my head is still spinning in shock.

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 12:33 am Me personally, I would only say something if they ask my opinion. I may not sustain them in a calling, I have been lucky and never ran into the issues I have read here.

spiritMan wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 1:00 am

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 12:33 am Me personally, I would only say something if they ask my opinion. I may not sustain them in a calling, I have been lucky and never ran into the issues I have read here.

That's very stylish of you... Until your kids made fun of and called bigots and homophobes in Church bc they don't support or affirm queers.

Your statement above is EXACTLY why this is a major problem. No one wants to stand up for godliness, too many are just a bunch of cowards and too afraid of being called a bad name.

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 4:17 am

spiritMan wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 1:00 am

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 12:33 am Me personally, I would only say something if they ask my opinion. I may not sustain them in a calling, I have been lucky and never ran into the issues I have read here.

That's very stylish of you... Until your kids made fun of and called bigots and homophobes in Church bc they don't support or affirm queers.

Your statement above is EXACTLY why this is a major problem. No one wants to stand up for godliness, too many are just a bunch of cowards and too afraid of being called a bad name.

I’m called those names before I’m asked my opinion, normally.

Lexew1899 wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 5:21 am With people like this it’s probably better to just sever ties than pretend you can get along. Unless you want to walk in egg shells around them forever. I’m sure there is something else they would blow up about in the future. The church today isn’t the one we grew up in or joined.

JuneBug12000 wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 11:11 pm

tdj wrote: ↑March 28th, 2022, 7:00 pm I'm left reeling. This started awhile back, but festered up over the weekend. I am, or WAS friends with a woman from church over facebook. I think we were friends in real life also. At least I considered her a friend. She's always been willing to help our family whenever we had an emergency. Just a really good person over all.
The problem happened when she made a comment on facebook about how the story of sodom and gomorah was inaccurately potrayed as the reason for it's destruction being homosexuality. She said this wasn't true and that it was because of the rape culture of that city. I disagreed with her and said that it may have played a role, but other things did also as well as the sin of homosexuality. She kind of went off on that. At least by HER standards. She claimed that being gay was normal and that people naturally wanted love and companionship. She said that church folk needed to stop teaching that about sodom and gomorah because it was extremely hurtful to our LBGTQ members and not true. I didn't disagree with her on the rape culture part, but pointed out that God still doesn't want people engaging in gay relations, and mentioned other scripture all thru the bible against homosexual sex. She said the validity of those scriptures was in doubt, and that it was unnecessary to bring them up anyway. Jesus was the judge, not us, and that he would judge how we treated people, and not by anything else.

The next problem arose when she posted a pic of her on facebook wearing a rainbow pin saying she was going to wear it every Sunday to support her LGBTQ church members and family. I learned her sister apparently is a lesbian since I saw that her facebook page shows her and another girl in a wedding dress. In the second post with the rainbow pin, her sister claimed she was there to verbally assault (she used those words) anyone who said anything nasty. She then referred to me after I sent an angry emoji in response to that. She said I was being hurtful by bringing up scriptures and spreading hate. Both her and the friend claimed that and I did no such thing. I approached the subject as kindly as I could, and never advocated nastiness to anyone. But she keeps insisting I did, and throws the word "hate" around like cheap candy in describing my opinion on it. She said every time she mentioned it I had to "chime in" with hateful rhetoric. I can't stress strongly enough how much of an effort I made to be NON hurtful and combative on the subject. But it just didn't matter. I finally gave up and posted that it would never happen again. She liked that post and responded thank you. Initially I unfollowed her, but after a day or two I decided to just unfriend her completely. Several backed and congratulated her. No one backed me. I'm still left reeling that this conversation even happened with another church member. And in the most conservative location in all the world at that.

Something that I took away from that. Several things: For one, Satan really has managed to get a stronghold on this world if he's managed to infiltrate so much into what traditionally is considered regular, otherwise normal every day folk. Second: Homosexuality has a real demonic component to it just based on how people are treated who disagree with it, no matter how mild a disagreement. Even with my church "friends" on facebook, there was an extra level of nasty, and vitriol on the subject. It's hard to explain, but when you've felt the vibe of a demon nearby influencing people, you recognize it when you sense it again. Homosexuality and its supporters has that vibe. Third: There's a passage in the Bible about in the end times people will be deceived. I think we are seeing this being played out right now.

This happened last week, and again several days ago, and my head is still spinning in shock.

I know how you feel; fight or flight, sick to your stomach shock. And yes, the demons are real. I would encourage you to cast them out after such encounters.

I have been in 2 RS lessons where what you described happened in real time.

I prayed for you to recover a feeling of calm and peace.

It really is disconcerting and a bit hard to recover from. The week after the first incident (RS teacher had queer friend "teach" RS about how things were going to be now, right after Supreme Court decision back in 2015) I had a handful of sisters stop by my house to visit and try to get their bearing on what had happened.

A separate time, I quoted the Family a Proclamation during RS when the lesson was on family. (Crazy right? lol) And the person who commented after me just tore into me. It was so unexpected I actually got tunnel vision and dropped the microphone I was holding (we used microphones so the older sisters could hear the comments.)

I didn't want to go back to RS, but God is good and I was called into nursery soon after and stayed there for 3 years.

Unfortunately, when I returned to RS after that calling was the meeting where the woman asked a question about protecting her children from what was happening with LGBTQ stuff and a handful of women started yelling and actually got up out of their seats and moved toward her. The meeting was ended immediately, but she was too scared to ever come back to RS. She would come with her family to Sacrament meeting only.

farmerchick wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 1:24 am WE are living in the last dispensation of time with not a lot of the dispensation left. This is the oldest trick in the book...it's all about our bodies and what we will do with them.....we are free to choose anything at this point.....everything is acceptable now. I have thought about this for at least a year now because it's sooo in your face....there is an arrogant attitude that precedes from most lgbtqiia+ and some allies.... A defensiveness before any interaction almost...but also an aura of superiority.....like they are enlightened and so far ahead of anyone who believes in traditional family values or outdated gender ideas. The superiority complex transcends all philosophies that have throughout history allowed the human family to progress and come to this point...like religion and provident living principles that are tried and true.....because they know better.....and yet they believe they are oppressed and victimized at every turn...in housing , employment, sports, education, wardrobe, religion ect. ...always blaming someone else for their failures, self doubt and even self harm.....the transgender craze where they mutilate/medicate themselves to create the gender they believe they are, is embraced and encouraged by the media and medical community...like it's not dangerous and only good can come from it..... And yet we have these excited exuberant loud lgbtqiia+ people/victims trying to take over any institution they can and if they get any pushback at all they threaten suicide....so are they really that gay as in happy and ecstatic as they portray themselves....is love really love like they say....and if sooo why try to change the very institutions that they say have oppressed them forever....? Why not just be happy and enjoy the overall societal embrace? Why worry about the rest of us????Why is it so important to indoctrinate children in the name of tolerance, fairness and equality as soon as they get in the public school system? Why do these people need to be in my face with the force of government telling me how to treat them? Time is short, the devil only has so many plays....he uses the same thing over and over again. Satan knows that lgbtqiia + confuses and destroys.....and our church is now fully integrated into the program whether they admit it or not....i guess the good news is that the end is near....so hold on to the iron rod and allow the members in the great and spacious building to mock and scoff to a point.....Btw women who would yell and intimidate another women in rs because of a question about lgbtqiia+ should have been quietly interrupted by someone diplomatically spouting the lgbtqiia+ mantra of compassion, tolerance of all, fairness and equality for those with differing opinions and told that we want all to feel safe and welcomed at church no matter what......so sit down and shut up......what a teachable moment....it would have taken them completely off guard....and if that hadn't worked I would have demanded softly and with a smile that they take it outside as the spirit can't reside in a room with contentious women in it.....because this is not love sisters....we must do better to include diverse people and ideas......lol.....i would have enjoyed that.......we live in adventurous times.....we need to learn to combat this with their own tactics...

the forces of evil are fighting desperately to capture as many souls as they can.

FoundMyEden wrote: ↑March 29th, 2022, 7:56 am The demons are real. I have previously talked about an incident (in primary) where the nursery leader verbally attacked me in front of a room full of kids and parents. I had to cast out the demon by calling on Christ. I could them hissing from her mouth and when she left the room it went silent.