LDS Freedom Forum

Posted: **March 26th, 2022, 7:52 pm**

Artaxerxes wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:53 am
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:52 am
Artaxerxes wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:49 am
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:48 am
You really think he is unwealthy?
Relative to the American idea of wealth, yes.
Based on...? Bank accounts, jobs/ job descriptions, etc.?
Based on his job and country of origin.

So Brazilians are poor?

BA in accountant + economics, MBA.
He was an accountant and auditor for multinational corporations in Brazil. That experience prepared him to work in the Church’s finance department, which in turn prepared him at age 31 to become one of the Church’s youngest directors of temporal affairs.

Posted: **March 26th, 2022, 7:56 pm**

JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 7:52 pm
Artaxerxes wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:53 am
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:52 am
Artaxerxes wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:49 am

Relative to the American idea of wealth, yes.
Based on...? Bank accounts, jobs/ job descriptions, etc.?
Based on his job and country of origin.
So Brazilians are poor?

BA in accountant + economics, MBA.
He was an accountant and auditor for multinational corporations in Brazil. That experience prepared him to work in the Church’s finance department, which in turn prepared him at age 31 to become one of the Church’s youngest directors of temporal affairs.

By American standards, yes.

I don't know if you've ever known any church employees, but no one's getting rich from a church salary.

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 12:10 am**

InfoWarrior82 wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 9:48 am
Subcomandante wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 9:12 am
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:44 am
InfoWarrior82 wrote: ↑March 24th, 2022, 10:08 am Who was the last blue-collar Apostle?

Who was the last that was not wealthy?
Well, how many blue collar apostles in the days of Joseph Smith?

Any poor apostles since his days?

Any farmers/plumbers in the original 12 in Jerusalem?

Most men just wouldn't have the capability to be an apostle now, as things are.
Bingo.

Someone might possess the gifts of an Apostle, yet not be called as one, precisely because they would be in no condition to handle the things an Apostle has to handle on day-to-day business.

And this is what Moroni, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Amos, and many other actual prophets didn't like about what the church would be in the last days.

Moroni, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Amos, and many Scriptural prophets did not have to go through the difficulties that the current leadership have to go through. For one thing, their world that they lived in was very small, with fairly uniform laws and regulations. Such is not the case today.

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 12:17 am**

Subcomandante wrote: ↑March 27th, 2022, 12:10 am
InfoWarrior82 wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 9:48 am
Subcomandante wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 9:12 am
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:44 am

Well, how many blue collar apostles in the days of Joseph Smith?

Any poor apostles since his days?

Any farmers/plumbers in the original 12 in Jerusalem?

Most men just wouldn't have the capability to be an apostle now, as things are.
Bingo.

Someone might possess the gifts of an Apostle, yet not be called as one, precisely because they would be in no condition to handle the things an Apostle has to handle on day-to-day business.

And this is what Moroni, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Amos, and many other actual prophets didn't like about what the church would be in the last days.
Moroni, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Amos, and many Scriptural prophets did not have to go through the difficulties that the current leadership have to go through. For one thing, their world that they lived in was very small, with fairly uniform laws and regulations. Such is not the case today.

You mean the difficulty of having the discernment and integrity to see, understand, and rebuke their cultural upbringing in the church -- which is the very thing that led this church down the path of apostasy? No, they haven't done that or even come close to hinting that they know this. Simply put, they run a 501c3 corporation with an impressive stock portfolio without any actual revelation from the Lord. In the end, this places us on par with any other church in the world. They will lead us down any and all roads that protect their amassed wealth. Even ones that call for a complete renouncement of true doctrine. We're long down that road already, my friend.

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 8:02 am**

Subcomandante wrote: ↑March 27th, 2022, 12:10 am
InfoWarrior82 wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 9:48 am
Subcomandante wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 9:12 am
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:44 am

Well, how many blue collar apostles in the days of Joseph Smith?

Any poor apostles since his days?

Any farmers/plumbers in the original 12 in Jerusalem?

Most men just wouldn't have the capability to be an apostle now, as things are.
Bingo.

Someone might possess the gifts of an Apostle, yet not be called as one, precisely because they would be in no condition to handle the things an Apostle has to handle on day-to-day business.

And this is what Moroni, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Amos, and many other actual prophets didn't like about what the church would be in the last days.
Moroni, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Amos, and many Scriptural prophets did not have to go through the difficulties that the current leadership have to go through. For one thing, their world that they lived in was very small, with fairly uniform laws and regulations. Such is not the case today.

And there was a man in the desert, lived on locusts and honey, yet the scriptures say there was no greater Prophet than John..........
Also a man from Nazerath, whoms mother was so poor she could not afford to pay the price of a lamb for her purification, so offered up the poor folks fee of two doves..........
Her son was your typical working class hard working man, thought of as no account in his church, in fact was excommunicated and called a Bastard, unclean, a heretic....
Yet this obscure Jew was no other than the very God of Israel manifest in the flesh, whom created the very heavens and the earth.........
And so wearing an expensive American suit and patent leather shoes, having a worldly education and rising up the ranks of the worlds system, having diplomas, bussinesses and prestige and an abundance of wealth are certainly not requirements to be servants of God and your fellow man..........

Look at churchs today that are filled with the rich, the learned and the affuent, were are the Gifts of God, the speaking, praising and singing in tongues, the prophesieing, the healings, signs , wonders, miracles amongst them?
Oft replaced by human wisdom, worldly learning and bussiness like management .............
Yet amongst those considered as "Apostate Christianity" there are those having an abundance of joy in their gatherings, were the gift of tongues, prophecy, signs wonders and miracles are evidenced, have you not noticed amongst the born again christians there are not many wealthy or learned, but are mostly poor folks whoms only wealth is their faith.......

Whenever a church suppresses these precious gifts of God in meetings, He seeks out another people to bless with his Gifts, oft those considered as dross by proud religious church goers whom have long since quenched the gifts of God in their churchs.
I firmly believe that God is gathering devout Christians together out of every denomination and church,, many are experiencing the Holy Ghost and are casting their differences aside due to their common bond of love for Jesus and are gathering together at the foot of the cross in preparation for the soon return of their great God and Saviour Christ Jesus............

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 8:08 am**

TheChristian wrote: ↑March 27th, 2022, 8:02 am
Whenever a church suppresses these precious gifts of God in meetings, He seeks out another people to bless with his Gifts, oft those considered as dross by proud religious church goers whom have long since quenched the gifts of God in their churchs.
I firmly believe that God is gathering devout Christians together out of every denomination and church,, many are experiencing the Holy Ghost …

Are any aware of the Davidic Servant and the role he is to play?

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 8:31 am**

Artaxerxes wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 7:56 pm
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 7:52 pm
Artaxerxes wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:53 am
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:52 am
Based on...? Bank accounts, jobs/ job descriptions, etc.?
Based on his job and country of origin.
So Brazilians are poor?

BA in accountant + economics, MBA.
He was an accountant and auditor for multinational corporations in Brazil. That experience prepared him to work in the Church’s finance department, which in turn prepared him at age 31 to become one of the Church’s youngest directors of temporal affairs.
By American standards, yes.

I don't know if you've ever known any church employees, but no one's getting rich from a church salary.

I agree.
Comfortable but not rich.
Also, the church requires it's pound of flesh. It is not a very good employer, from what I have been told.

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 8:33 am**

Niemand wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 5:47 pm
EvanLM wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 5:17 pm I love to make this comment to one of my friends and hear them laugh . . . . " I work at Walmart which tells you nothing about me . . . .but your reaction tells me a lot about you. " honest to woops . . .can't say that expression . . .I have seen the reactions of good mormons to where I work . . . anyway they think they are good
I had some woman - an investigator no less! - trying to probe me about what I did for a living in the chapel. It was actually very uncomfortable. She even doubted some of what I told her.

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 8:34 am**

Subcomandante wrote: ↑March 27th, 2022, 12:10 am
InfoWarrior82 wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 9:48 am
Subcomandante wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 9:12 am
JohnnyL wrote: ↑March 26th, 2022, 8:44 am

Well, how many blue collar apostles in the days of Joseph Smith?

Any poor apostles since his days?

Any farmers/plumbers in the original 12 in Jerusalem?

Most men just wouldn't have the capability to be an apostle now, as things are.
Bingo.

Someone might possess the gifts of an Apostle, yet not be called as one, precisely because they would be in no condition to handle the things an Apostle has to handle on day-to-day business.

And this is what Moroni, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Amos, and many other actual prophets didn't like about what the church would be in the last days.
Moroni, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Amos, and many Scriptural prophets did not have to go through the difficulties that the current leadership have to go through. For one thing, their world that they lived in was very small, with fairly uniform laws and regulations. Such is not the case today.

now that is the funniest thing I have ever seen you post . . . bwahahahahahahha

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 8:38 am**

Godhas the same spiritual rules for everyone . . .if one choses to avoid those rules and fails in his progression then . . . it is their own neglect or procrastination or distractions of things of this world or whatever that keeps them from being prepared . . .or stepping up to the plate . . . . the Lord put the lives of these men in the scriptures as a model . . .

for us in our mission and them in their mission . . .it is always our choice. . . we are not victims of our times

Posted: **March 27th, 2022, 8:49 am**

btw ; the current "brethren" and many of their wives look down on all the saints . . . the large and spacious building people mock those who are true followers of Christ . . . I think that their disdain has been made clear in their books and lectures . ..

have we not been currently called prejudice? I'll stop here with the comments from our leaders since I find many of them offensive . . .

the pattern of leaders is to be leaders and teaching repentence . . not that of judge with no teaching of truth . . . .

the prophets in the scriptures teach the sin . . .then the doctrine or practice of Christ's law that would help us overcome that sin . . . . hmmmm . . .read or listento current talks and lectures with that in mind . . .

locally, in the past 20 years I can count on two hands the time that Christ has been taught across the pulpit or even mentioned in name until the speaker says in the name of . . .

we are not worthy of even been taught about Christ over the local pulpit . . .what do our fellow members think of us when they continue to teach the doctrines of man when given time to teach ?

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