The Americans are planning a false flag operation in Ukraine

[Being There]

" It is over in Ukraine, the Russians have won, therefore a chemical false flag will be done."

[Being There]

General Flynn: Putin has upset the "New World Order" and "they" are not happy about it.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/uHFebqFlY2m2/

[jonrizzy]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

[Niemand]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

[TheDuke]

It makes sense to me that Putin is viewed as anti-NWO. I don't believe it. I feel he has been a part of the NWO planning all along, as was everyone at Davos but Trump. but, that after Trump, after squashing US and neutering us, and after the Covid pre-staging effort. Putin didn't like how the NWO was too Euro-centric and wanted to renegotiate his pie (like Al Capone). So, not wanting to wait to fight the united NWO, he strikes early. And not wanting to fight Russia after setting up NWO (formally), they bait him into a war where all the world can see that the only good guys are the Euro-trash bankers and leaders and after beating down Russia's claims and gaining most of the useful USSR territory for Euro-NWO leaders, they stage the beginning of New World Order power grab. Seems pretty obvious to me as in Isaiah, too many heads and powerful beasts, got to use US to wear them out.

[jonrizzy]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

Uh oh, the conspiracy crazies are getting triggered. Funny how the “independent” thinkers around here can’t handle an opposing viewpoint without going off on tangents. Understandable since you support such a nonsensical position.

[Sarah]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

"You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader."

Well, that's how it is in China.

[True]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

Putin was a young global leader in the WEF.

[Niemand]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

Uh oh, the conspiracy crazies are getting triggered. Funny how the “independent” thinkers around here can’t handle an opposing viewpoint without going off on tangents. Understandable since you support such a nonsensical position.

And funny how you can't handle sarcasm. ¡Viva Literalism!

Here's a tip for you. The World Economic Forum is real. It doesn't even bother hiding its existence. It may operate behind closed doors, but so does the LDS management. The WEF is not even theoretical (perhaps you are thinking of CERN over on the other side of Switzerland?). It gets governments and business in lockstep - hence the proliferation of "trans" debates, QR ID, carbon tax demands etc, but hey, even though different parties are all doing this, we elected them right? So that's democracy for you?

https://www.weforum.org/

Yes, we must all be crazy. Crazy to have the entire world economy shut down and have illogical and unscientific measures imposed on us for nearly two years. Crazy to think anyone should be allowed to have a different opinion in a western democracy. Crazy to expect basic civil rights like freedom of association, expression and religious practice.

[Sarah]

" It is over in Ukraine, the Russians have won, therefore a chemical false flag will be done."

Ha Ha, I thought I recognized this guy. Check out this thread, where truefreedom posted a video of him, but under a different channel name (page 4 of thread): viewtopic.php?f=1&t=65493&p=1244701#p1244701

This is what I posted in response:

"The guy gives himself away as a professional propagandist when he says his best friend is with The Duran, which site is run by another Russian propagandist, which I did a post on. The guys have ties to RT. These guys always explain things perfectly because they know what is going on and have that insider information."

There almost always seems to be some connection to Russia or RT with people who seem to be able to explain the NATO/NWO conspiracy so well.

In the linked thread, the channel was called CRP (Coach Red Pill) but the name of the channel in your OP was Gonzalo Lira. He apparently isn't concerned about viewership, as he only has a few weeks worth of video on each channel. If he's linked to the Duran, he's linked to the Russian MMC (Massive Media Complex)

[creator]

The conspiracy wants us to play the left-right game. If we pick sides, pick a team, Republican v. Democrat, Russia v. Ukraine, etc, we lose. The conspiracy wants us to play that game; they want us to pick sides/teams. They want us to view so many things as good vs evil (when the reality is it's often evil vs evil.) They want us to be focused on the propaganda they are putting in front of us. Nothing is as it seems.

[Robin Hood]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

Putin was a young global leader in the WEF.

Are you sure about that?
After he finished university he joined the KGB and was stationed in East Germany. Then, with German reunification he found himself out of work for a while and drove a taxi in order to make a living.
One of his friends got elected to office in St Petersburg and he was offered a job working for him. His friend lost his job but recommended Putin to Yeltsin. The rest is history.
Don't know when he would have the opportunity to complete his WEF young global leader training.

[jonrizzy]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

Uh oh, the conspiracy crazies are getting triggered. Funny how the “independent” thinkers around here can’t handle an opposing viewpoint without going off on tangents. Understandable since you support such a nonsensical position.

And funny how you can't handle sarcasm. ¡Viva Literalism!

Here's a tip for you. The World Economic Forum is real. It doesn't even bother hiding its existence. It may operate behind closed doors, but so does the LDS management. The WEF is not even theoretical (perhaps you are thinking of CERN over on the other side of Switzerland?). It gets governments and business in lockstep - hence the proliferation of "trans" debates, QR ID, carbon tax demands etc, but hey, even though different parties are all doing this, we elected them right? So that's democracy for you?

https://www.weforum.org/

Yes, we must all be crazy. Crazy to have the entire world economy shut down and have illogical and unscientific measures imposed on us for nearly two years. Crazy to think anyone should be allowed to have a different opinion in a western democracy. Crazy to expect basic civil rights like freedom of association, expression and religious practice.

Perhaps crazy is too strong. Just unwitting of how illogical your position is. I know you’d really like to get rid of me. But it’s a freedom forum right? So sorry.

As was just mentioned here, there is a ton of evil on both sides. But the idea that Russia is somehow justified in this invasion is laughable. Reposting Russian propaganda, which Sarah just proved it is, doesn’t add anything.

As for all your civil rights, WEF, rantings. You are just strawmaning. Doesn’t need a response.

[Artaxerxes]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

Putin was a young global leader in the WEF.

Are you sure about that?
After he finished university he joined the KGB and was stationed in East Germany. Then, with German reunification he found himself out of work for a while and drove a taxi in order to make a living.
One of his friends got elected to office in St Petersburg and he was offered a job working for him. His friend lost his job but recommended Putin to Yeltsin. The rest is history.
Don't know when he would have the opportunity to complete his WEF young global leader training.

Klaus Schwab said he was. Most think he misspoke.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xc2JZ8mq2Ec

[jreuben]

Hearing what another of satan's butt-buddies, romney, is saying helps us see the big picture too:
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/tulsi-gabbard-smeared-treasonous-liar-sen-romney-over-ukraine-biolab-concerns

[mudflap]

The conspiracy wants us to play the left-right game. If we pick sides, pick a team, Republican v. Democrat, Russia v. Ukraine, etc, we lose. The conspiracy wants us to play that game; they want us to pick sides/teams. They want us to view so many things as good vs evil (when the reality is it's often evil vs evil.) They want us to be focused on the propaganda they are putting in front of us. Nothing is as it seems.

I think we're almost at the point of Mormon 3:16

I did even as the Lord had commanded me; and I did stand as an idle witness to manifest unto the world the things which I saw and heard

And let me just add: if you are FOR censoring "Russian disinformation", you are in fact taking sides on this, since the disinformation is coming from everywhere at this point. We should not trust info from any government, IMO.

[True]

Looks like the Tiger King is very pro Russia. He would fit right in around here.

Well, you're very pro-World Economic Forum. You would fit right in Davos.

Say, you're not the man saying all the damage from the injections was all in people's imaginations, are you? (Even though it's documented on the websites of governments pushing it.)

You need to give us your Global Citizen QR code so we can report you to your block leader.

Putin was a young global leader in the WEF.

Are you sure about that?
After he finished university he joined the KGB and was stationed in East Germany. Then, with German reunification he found himself out of work for a while and drove a taxi in order to make a living.
One of his friends got elected to office in St Petersburg and he was offered a job working for him. His friend lost his job but recommended Putin to Yeltsin. The rest is history.
Don't know when he would have the opportunity to complete his WEF young global leader training.

Here is what I found:

https://anti-empire.com/why-does-klaus- ... al-leader/

[Niemand]

Perhaps crazy is too strong. Just unwitting of how illogical your position is. I know you’d really like to get rid of me.

I've no reason to want rid of you, but you repeat the same party line I hear repeated 24/7 off the TV and newspapers, and even the public. It's not original Barely anyone challenging it. Few people even seem to notice we have a potential nuclear issue here.... or had even heard of this Zelensky chancer six months ago. (Yes, I know Trump tried something on him, but that's probably not well remembered.)

But the idea that Russia is somehow justified in this invasion is laughable. Reposting Russian propaganda, which Sarah just proved it is, doesn’t add anything.

Most of what you've seen is propaganda of some kind or another. I don't believe the vast majority of reporting on the Ukraine just now... a lot of the pictures and stories are staged or "improved" for a human interest angle, even before the political. This is not unusual.

As for all your civil rights, WEF, rantings. You are just strawmaning. Doesn’t need a response.

The strawman seems to be the midwit's go to "logical fallacy". I often wonder if they've heard of any others. It certainly doesn't apply to anything I've just said. You claim elsewhere you are a Reaganite, which may apply to brinksmanship, but it certainly doesn't apply to your ideas on invididuals and freedoms.

The WEF isn't a theory. It's real. Even you can work that out. It's also decided what it going on round the world. We live in two different countries yet they keep doing many of the same things even when they have no scientific basis and are economically damaging. I know people in continental Europe, Australia and elsewhere who tell me the same things are going on there. Just a coincidence, they came up with that independently. Nothing to see here, keep moving.

[Niemand]

Interesting picture here. Look who's between Gorby and Raisa.

Former Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev and his wife, Raisa Gorbachev, talk to journalists during their visit to St. Petersburg in April 1994

St. Petersburg is Putin's patch. But it's curious to see these two leaders together.

[jonrizzy]

Perhaps crazy is too strong. Just unwitting of how illogical your position is. I know you’d really like to get rid of me.

I've no reason to want rid of you, but you repeat the same party line I hear repeated 24/7 off the TV and newspapers, and even the public. It's not original Barely anyone challenging it. Few people even seem to notice we have a potential nuclear issue here.... or had even heard of this Zelensky chancer six months ago. (Yes, I know Trump tried something on him, but that's probably not well remembered.)

But the idea that Russia is somehow justified in this invasion is laughable. Reposting Russian propaganda, which Sarah just proved it is, doesn’t add anything.

Most of what you've seen is propaganda of some kind or another. I don't believe the vast majority of reporting on the Ukraine just now... a lot of the pictures and stories are staged or "improved" for a human interest angle, even before the political. This is not unusual.

As for all your civil rights, WEF, rantings. You are just strawmaning. Doesn’t need a response.

The strawman seems to be the midwit's go to "logical fallacy". I often wonder if they've heard of any others. It certainly doesn't apply to anything I've just said. You claim elsewhere you are a Reaganite, which may apply to brinksmanship, but it certainly doesn't apply to your ideas on invididuals and freedoms.

The WEF isn't a theory. It's real. Even you can work that out. It's also decided what it going on round the world. We live in two different countries yet they keep doing many of the same things even when they have no scientific basis and are economically damaging. I know people in continental Europe, Australia and elsewhere who tell me the same things are going on there. Just a coincidence, they came up with that independently. Nothing to see here, keep moving.

It is a strawman. I’ve never made an argument for or against the WEF. You are talking yourself in circles. Like a dog chasing his tail. Makes me wonder if you even know the meaning of strawman.

If you actually had a substantive argument against what I’m saying, I’d be happy to consider it.


To repeat, my argument is that Russia is an evil actor here. You seem to think that because they are fighting the west, their atrocities are understandable and we should just ignore it to prevent escalation. But would that not just embolden Putin?

Evil fights evil all the time right? A despotic country invading another country and bombing civilians is wrong. No matter how you want to spin it.

That must mean I want WW3!!

If that was true, wouldn’t I be advocating direct conflict? We use proportional response. That’s what worked in the Cold War. It’s not perfect, escalation could still happen. But it’s our best bet. The Neville Chamberlain approach doesn’t work against expansionist despotism.

Now, how exactly does this argument lead you to believe I don’t believe in freedom or individual liberty? Please, show me the connection there. That’s a logical jump of epic proportions.

[Niemand]

To repeat, my argument is that Russia is an evil actor here. You seem to think that because they are fighting the west, their atrocities are understandable and we should just ignore it to prevent escalation. But would that not just embolden Putin?

Evil fights evil all the time right? A despotic country invading another country and bombing civilians is wrong. No matter how you want to spin it.

That must mean I want WW3!!

If that was true, wouldn’t I be advocating direct conflict? We use proportional response. That’s what worked in the Cold War. It’s not perfect, escalation could still happen. But it’s our best bet. The Neville Chamberlain approach doesn’t work against expansionist despotism.

Now, how exactly does this argument lead you to believe I don’t believe in freedom or individual liberty? Please, show me the connection there. That’s a logical jump of epic proportions.

As I've just said, the "strawman" is the only logical fallacy most folk online have heard of. Ironically you've turned the term itself into one.

You might want to brush up on a few others, although I disagree with the notion of some of these really being fallacies, and some of them may be relevant and useful in certain cases:
https://www.logicalfallacies.org/

Anyway, you have little right to be lecturing us about logical fallacy - you came out with an abusive statement and then didn't like it when you were pulled up for it. It is easy to call people names - for many people, it's been their sole method of defending their opinion for the past two years, so why change? You call people "conspiratorial", but then dislike it when the actual involvement of a shady organisation is pointed out to you, or the fact that distinctive measures have been brought in across the world.

You seem to think that because they are fighting the west, their atrocities are understandable and we should just ignore it to prevent escalation. But would that not just embolden Putin?

The only "good actors" here are the people who've unwillingly been forced into this war. You, like many people, have made no attempt to understand why this has really happened. There is a spectrum of possibilities here - from Putin trying to secure the "independence" of Crimea and the two other "reoublics" (much as he did with Georgia a few years ago) right over to complete integration into a reformed Soviet Union style entity (which I suspect you probably subscribe to). Putin installing a different puppet ruler is another possibility (and I think a probability.)

Georgia is not without merit as a model here. Both of these incidents have taken place in the aftermath of a Colour Revolution which was to "realign" a government towards the west. (That's a euphemistic way of putting it.)

The Neville Chamberlain approach doesn’t work against expansionist despotism.

Reductio ad Hitlerum (there's a second logical fallacy for you to add to your list).

Has it ever dawned on you that some Russians may view the modern Ukraine not so much as 1930s Czechoslovakia, but more like the Americans viewed 1960s Cuba?

It is all about geopolitics, but it's not just the Russians playing at that.

Now, how exactly does this argument lead you to believe I don’t believe in freedom or individual liberty? Please, show me the connection there. That’s a logical jump of epic proportions.

Because like many people these days, your argument is not so much, "I don't agree with you, but you're entitled to an opinion", as "if you don't agree with the mainstream view, you're a dangerous conspiracy theorist."

[HereWeGo]

When is the best time to stop feeding a troll? It is easy to spot the new trolls when they appear because they immediately begin to use the same tactics of the old trolls who have gone away. Perhaps the old ones just return with new names.

[jonrizzy]

When is the best time to stop feeding a troll? It is easy to spot the new trolls when they appear because they immediately begin to use the same tactics of the old trolls who have gone away. Perhaps the old ones just return with new names.

I’m trying to have a conversation, in what way is that trolling? Give me a good argument to consider.

You guys want to live in an echo chamber I know. So sorry.

[jonrizzy]

To repeat, my argument is that Russia is an evil actor here. You seem to think that because they are fighting the west, their atrocities are understandable and we should just ignore it to prevent escalation. But would that not just embolden Putin?

Evil fights evil all the time right? A despotic country invading another country and bombing civilians is wrong. No matter how you want to spin it.

That must mean I want WW3!!

If that was true, wouldn’t I be advocating direct conflict? We use proportional response. That’s what worked in the Cold War. It’s not perfect, escalation could still happen. But it’s our best bet. The Neville Chamberlain approach doesn’t work against expansionist despotism.

Now, how exactly does this argument lead you to believe I don’t believe in freedom or individual liberty? Please, show me the connection there. That’s a logical jump of epic proportions.

As I've just said, the "strawman" is the only logical fallacy most folk online have heard of. Ironically you've turned the term itself into one.

You might want to brush up on a few others, although I disagree with the notion of some of these really being fallacies, and some of them may be relevant and useful in certain cases:
https://www.logicalfallacies.org/

Anyway, you have little right to be lecturing us about logical fallacy - you came out with an abusive statement and then didn't like it when you were pulled up for it. It is easy to call people names - for many people, it's been their sole method of defending their opinion for the past two years, so why change? You call people "conspiratorial", but then dislike it when the actual involvement of a shady organisation is pointed out to you, or the fact that distinctive measures have been brought in across the world.

You seem to think that because they are fighting the west, their atrocities are understandable and we should just ignore it to prevent escalation. But would that not just embolden Putin?

The only "good actors" here are the people who've unwillingly been forced into this war. You, like many people, have made no attempt to understand why this has really happened. There is a spectrum of possibilities here - from Putin trying to secure the "independence" of Crimea and the two other "reoublics" (much as he did with Georgia a few years ago) right over to complete integration into a reformed Soviet Union style entity (which I suspect you probably subscribe to). Putin installing a different puppet ruler is another possibility (and I think a probability.)

Georgia is not without merit as a model here. Both of these incidents have taken place in the aftermath of a Colour Revolution which was to "realign" a government towards the west. (That's a euphemistic way of putting it.)

The Neville Chamberlain approach doesn’t work against expansionist despotism.

Reductio ad Hitlerum (there's a second logical fallacy for you to add to your list).

Has it ever dawned on you that some Russians may view the modern Ukraine not so much as 1930s Czechoslovakia, but more like the Americans viewed 1960s Cuba?

It is all about geopolitics, but it's not just the Russians playing at that.

Now, how exactly does this argument lead you to believe I don’t believe in freedom or individual liberty? Please, show me the connection there. That’s a logical jump of epic proportions.

Because like many people these days, your argument is not so much, "I don't agree with you, but you're entitled to an opinion", as "if you don't agree with the mainstream view, you're a dangerous conspiracy theorist."

My argument is that you aren’t bringing any evidence to the table that Russia’s invasion is reasonable or “understandable” as you say. Here’s the arguments I’ve heard so far.

1. The US did it, why can’t Russia?

2. They aren’t really bombing civilians. (Despite the hundreds of videos showing they are)

3. There are separatists that want to be in Russia or at least out of Ukraine. Therefore it’s somehow ok to invade a sovereign country? That doesn’t apply anywhere.

I call this conspiratorial thinking because your evidence sucks. It’s basically other people giving opinions online. Show me proof (or at least some indication) that the many, many videos of civilian bombings are fake.

The WW2 comparison isn’t perfect. But the principle of standing up to evil expansionist fascists clearly applies.

I’m also waiting for your reasoning on how my argument translates to being against civil rights. Even if I did think your argument was dangerous, you are certainly entitled to it. Just as I’m entitled to refute it.