LDS Freedom Forum

Fred has discussed the tunnel system below the SLC Temple quite a bit on this forum and he has provided some nice commentary on odd things in the state of Utah, particularly SLC. I want to discuss mysteries about SLC, the SLC temple in particular and I'm going to drift farther into far out ideas. I think Fred has a very practical approach on mysteries relating to the SLC Temple undergound, and that his ideas and commentary is probably closer to the truth than what I will discuss in this thread, but while what I discuss is probably wrong, I think it's interesting.

One of his recent threads and a trip to SLC a few months ago I had has put the SLC temple on my mind. I'm fascinated with the general idea of Tartaria--a conspiracy that has roots in a more grounded concept of a country called Tartary in Asia that was largely erased or downplayed in history--the general conspiracy of Tartaria has grown so much but it generally revolves around doubting the official stories of many of the beautifully crafted buildings found throughout the world, particularly Greco-Roman architecture of the medieval era and 1700s/1800s. Doubting the time they were made in according to history and/or doubting the level of technology they were made with according to how official history frames the technological levels of previous eras. This conspiracy can get pretty out there; space tech, antiqui-tech, star forts, Christ's Millennial Reign already came and went and we exist in apostasy and confusion before the end of it all. There are a lot of varying views on this topic.

Questions regarding the history, level of technology used in creation, and dates of construction for many extravagant works of architecture (especially the Greco-Roman-looking stuff) found on United States lands that are attributed to the 1700s and 1800s has become perhaps the most discussed aspect of Tartaria in circles interested in this conspiracy theory. And the Salt Lake City temple (and a lot of other locations in Utah) has caught the eye of a lot of buried history conspiracy theorists. Some of them are arguing that the Salt Lake City temple (and many other buildings in North American lands) are left over buildings from previous civilizations and these buildings were inherited by those who would occupy what is called the United States.





(Note the completed temple in the first image with an undeveloped surrounding area followed by an uncompleted temple surrounded by a developed area in the second and third images which also lack the remains of an old brick wall present in the first image)

(I do not necessarily believe in ALL things suggested in this thread or suggested in the varying views of the Tartaria conspiracy and mudflood conspiracy but I think they are interesting and I believe them to an extent, particularly on the matter of the history of some buildings in Utah)

Streets of Tartaria and Jon Levi are two content creators that explore this topic and both have looked into the Salt Lake City temple.

Jon's videos show the modern-day tech found in the cranes and vehicles being used for the earthquake project. The tech used for digging up so much surface area, and working on the higher areas of the building. This is all just for supplementary enhancements, how was the actual building made with far less technology AND resources for pioneers in the middle of nowhere. He also highlights the far less amount of craftsmanship found in the modern-day church office building, built in a day with far greater tech and resources and how it looks like a generic tube between the artistic and ornate SLC Temple, Joseph Smith Memorial building and Capitol Building. His research, which includes talking to people working on the earthquake renovation project seems to estimate that there is three stories worth of building found below the surface level.

Streets Of Tartaria's video generally touches on the same points.


This video from ArtofDino is fantastic and looks at more of SLC than just the temple.




So why does the SLC Temple descend so far below surface level?






Does the story about the United States scaring the saints so they buried their temple honestly and adequately address this? I'd have to imagine people building a church would rank pretty low on potential issues the United States had with Brigham's Utah, necessitating a need for the Brighamites to bury 14+ feet of construction of a temple below surface level.


So if the story of the Saints having to cover the temple up is completely true or only true to a certain extent, does it adequately address why the Salt Lake City temple descends so far below surface level? Where did the manpower and tech come from to dig so far below the surface, and then cover all that fancy marble construction up again?

What makes so much building found below surface level stand out so much is a branch off from the general Tartaria conspiracy is something called the mudflood conspiracy, that argues throughout the world you can see evidence all over of buildings having lower levels that are buried but convey a sense that at a different time, those lower levels were at a surface level but became buried in something generally attributed to catastrophic disasters (God sweeping away and starting over at different times with different people?):






Another curious relic of Utah's history showing off architectural strength and beauty unlikely to be produced by people with limited resources in an empty valley and a level of architectural strength and beauty we'd never find in a low-key resort today: The old Saltair resort



And of course it was destro-err was lost to us from a fire.

Look at what it was replaced with by people with better infrastructure, more money, more resources and better technology



The original Salt Palace of Salt Lake City. Guess what happened to it? Lost in a fire, yup. Look at our country's history. Over and over, these work-of-art buildings thrown up by people with ox, cart and hammer all go out in fire, making them out of sight and out of mind





Check out the beauty it was replaced with by people with better infrastructure, more money, more resources and better technology:





Thought this was interesting. The palace of King Brigham's favorite wife, destroyed in 1921

Ether 2: 8 wrote:And he had sworn in his wrath unto the brother of Jared, that whoso should possess this land of promise, from that time henceforth and forever, should serve him, the true and only God, or they should be swept off when the fulness of his wrath should come upon them.

Alma 37: 28 wrote:For behold, there is a curse upon all this land, that destruction shall come upon all those workers of darkness, according to the power of God, when they are fully ripe; therefore I desire that this people might not be destroyed.

Mosiah 21: 26 wrote:Nevertheless, they did find a land which had been peopled; yea, a land which was covered with dry bones; yea, a land which had been peopled and which had been destroyed; and they, having supposed it to be the land of Zarahemla, returned to the land of Nephi, having arrived in the borders of the land not many days before the coming of Ammon.

Jarom 1: 10 wrote:And it came to pass that the prophets of the Lord did threaten the people of Nephi, according to the word of God, that if they did not keep the commandments, but should fall into transgression, they should be destroyed from off the face of the land.

2 Nephi 27: 9 wrote:But the book shall be delivered unto a man, and he shall deliver the words of the book, which are the words of those who have slumbered in the dust, and he shall deliver these words unto another;

The truth is out there.

I love Jon Levi’s channel.
You did a great job putting all of this together. Thank you.
There is so much we don’t know. And the more I learn, the more I don’t know. But it’s exciting. The world is waking up to the reality that just maybe we’ve been lied to about history and timelines.
The dark force that controls this world is getting pushed out because the good people are asking questions.

FreedomJess wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 9:40 pm I love Jon Levi’s channel.
You did a great job putting all of this together. Thank you.
There is so much we don’t know. And the more I learn, the more I don’t know. But it’s exciting. The world is waking up to the reality that just maybe we’ve been lied to about history and timelines.
The dark force that controls this world is getting pushed out because the good people are asking questions.

I completely agree, especially about the timelines. I think our timelines could be completely messed up. Could some of the grand things prophesied by Joseph Smith have already come and gone? I think it's possible. Just a thought. So much ought to be considered when you are dealing with a battle between God and Satan.

Here is a similar building built a few blocks from Temple Square by the Catholics in 1909. https://toursofutah.com/blog/cathedral- ... ity-tours/

Some conspiracies require a large number of participants. Because if even one journal from the mid 1800s said what you just said, the cat would be out of the bag. I also still believe the earth is round and we went to the moon. My daughter laughs at me for being so gullible. I said, well, truthfully, I haven't researched it enough to be absolutely certain, but either way, it does not affect my life. She says: Oh yes it does. It means you have been lied to. I said that I already know I have been lied to. One more lie makes very little difference.

Then again, as someone said in a different thread, How many people are involved in the santa clause is real, cover-up?

Fred wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 10:18 pm Here is a similar building built a few blocks from Temple Square by the Catholics in 1909. https://toursofutah.com/blog/cathedral- ... ity-tours/

Some conspiracies require a large number of participants. Because if even one journal from the mid 1800s said what you just said, the cat would be out of the bag. I also still believe the earth is round and we went to the moon. My daughter laughs at me for being so gullible. I said, well, truthfully, I haven't researched it enough to be absolutely certain, but either way, it does not affect my life. She says: Oh yes it does. It means you have been lied to. I said that I already know I have been lied to. One more lie makes very little difference.

Then again, as someone said in a different thread, How many people are involved in the santa clause is real, cover-up?

I like your daughter. She sounds very smart.

I think you would enjoy learning about World Fairs and how they "built them" and basically just destroyed all the architecture right after. It's fascinating.

Fred wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 10:18 pm

Then again, as someone said in a different thread, How many people are involved in the santa clause is real, cover-up?

I remember being a kid and heard that they were tracking Santa with NORAD or something on the news. I was really confused. I spent more than a few minutes trying to figure out what was going on. Then I knew, for sure, for the first time, that the news was lying. I never forgot that the news lies after that and I never taught my kids to believe in Santa, only Jesus, because I would not lie to them EVER!

CuriousThinker wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 10:34 pm I think you would enjoy learning about World Fairs and how they "built them" and basically just destroyed all the architecture right after. It's fascinating.

Yes, I have looked into them a bit. Beautiful buildings. Beautiful photos. It truly looks like another world filled with a greater amount of the spirit of God.

FreedomJess wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 9:40 pm I love Jon Levi’s channel.
You did a great job putting all of this together. Thank you.
There is so much we don’t know. And the more I learn, the more I don’t know. But it’s exciting. The world is waking up to the reality that just maybe we’ve been lied to about history and timelines.
The dark force that controls this world is getting pushed out because the good people are asking questions.

A couple little known facts are that the COB is 33 stories tall, with 3 below the ground. Most sources say it stands 28 stories tall. A statue of JS was likewise 38 feet tall, to represent the 38 years of his life. My first job was on the evening COB cleaning crew,. It was the site of my first strange March 8 encounter, when I trained Cheryl to clean the elevators. Much later, I returned as a member of the Eagle Gate 18th ward, and listened to ETBs birthday service, just before getting my PB. Fred's building was right up the street from my fort, that I gave up when I got married in the Fern Grotto.

https://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message5070210/pg1 wrote: The Mormon sealing is very simllar to what is done in witchcraft called handfasting, and it is also similar to marriage sealing in Satanism. Joseph Smith, whose famlly practiced witchcraft, had many types of seals around their house which were used in magic. According to a magic book of 1830 "Demonology and Witchcraft" by Walter Scott (pp. 165, 220-221) seer stones were to be anointed with oil, and sealed with holy characters. In 1837, Mormon leaders performed such a magical sealing for James Cohn Brewster. (Mormonism and the Magic World View. p.209-210) Joseph Smith had a cane with a serpent on the top of it, and astrological seals below. Magick staff or canes are important in Satanism. The seal of Mars was carved on the Smith family athame which was used by the family to draw circles for magic incantations. (Mormonism & the Magic World View p. 142) In 1835, a ritual done by Joseph Smith to commune with a spirit messenger is recorder by Oliver Cowdery. Joseph Smith used two Seals of the Earth to conjure up the spirit. (Ibid, p. 120) Smith’s ritual was in accordance with the best occult guidebooks then The Book of Knowledge and Barrett’s Magus.

There's some more weird stuff. He was warned not to pretend to any other gifts, and he thought using magic was the way to complete his legitimate calling. Everything after 1834 is highly suspect.

A couple pictures from northern Utah. I love looking for this kind of stuff ever since I was exposed to the mudflood idea back in 2019. Although in many cases it really just seems to be that people built basements and then needed to fill in windows as roads got bigger for cars. But the multi-story underground levels are a lot harder to explain away.

First, this is the basement of a building in Tremonton that burned down last year (2021). 3 windows that were blocked in that would have the view of the bottom of a sidewalk. I took the picture during the annual business trick or treat, hence the costumes people are wearing.
These next two are in Logan at the intersection of Main Street and Center Street from Google Street View:

First is one that shows at least 3 arched windows that are underground.
Second shows some work that has been done on the building across the street. I wish I could find the picture I took that had a much better angle, but the area under the sidewalk was completely hollow. The concrete of the sidewalk was about 8 inches thick covering it up, but walking on the sidewalk there you are walking over underground rooms. You can see in this picture where the excavation extends out further towards the road, but the along the whole section there were rooms that extended at least that far out from the building. It's weird, the day I took pictures of the Logan site was a day of a gingerbread house event in Logan. In looking through my photos, I see a picture of a gingerbread house I took that day. But none of the building.

There are a lot of buildings like that. The building in Logan where the Herald Journal used to be before they built the new building has underground windows. I just figured they wanted natural light in the basement. Even some relatively new homes have windows in the basement.

Fred wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 11:32 pm There are a lot of buildings like that. The building in Logan where the Herald Journal used to be before they built the new building has underground windows. I just figured they wanted natural light in the basement. Even some relatively new homes have windows in the basement.

For emergency egress.

Fascinating stuff. I have never lived in Utah, so I didn't know about the other buildings. I only knew about the Salt Lake Temple.

I don’t get it. I’ve always lived in a home with a basement WITH windows. Is this just a Utah thing?

I've been through the underground tunnels a number of times as a church employee in the mid-2000's. Pretty boring actually. Except when President Hinkley would ride through them on his bullet bike (on off hours of course) LOL!
If I knew about any statues to move or books to pull that lead into the BatCave I would be the first to let you know about it.

Those are all cool pictures.

It is neat to see good architecture done in the past.

It doesn't seem weird to me that the Salt Lake Temple has a really deep basement.

Although I no longer live in Utah, I grew up there, and basements are everywhere.

The BYU Marriott School is built in such a way that one side is five stories lower than the other side and both sides enter/exit at the "ground level". For example, in this picture, you are looking out through windows, but if you turned around, you would be 20 feet underground.

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com ... =1&nofb=1

The BYU library goes VERY deep, and has many places that are completely underground.
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com ... 3DApi&f=1

From a personal basis, my childhood bedroom was in a basement, in a location that didn't even have a window. It was very quiet down there. I have often wanted a basement but where I live does not have basements.

The Wasatch front is conducive to basements because it is the bottom of the former lake Bonneville.

What actually seems weird to me is when I go into a new, modern temple outside of Utah and see a baptismal font which is not deep down in the ground. I always thought that was a requirement.

The SLC courthouse and the library still blow my mind, two of the most beautiful buildings I've ever seen. As far as the temple goes, it's obvious to me from the recent excavation pictures that what was buried was meant to be underground, if there was some kind of mudflood, it happened before the temple was built.

So according to Tartarian theory, the Mormon pioneers crossed the plains (with their extensive personal journals) and when they arrived in the Salt Lake Valley, Brigham Young threw open the east doors of the massive, abandoned granite edifice they found and said, "This here place would make a cool temple".

And not one single pioneer recorded that version in their journal.

Interesting theory.