LDS Freedom Forum

kittycat51 wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 3:17 pm Don’t tear apart logonbump. He was correct. There was something different about the August 2021 letter. Back in April of 2021 when they introduced the new “logo” it was said all official letters/announcements from the Church would be on official letterhead with that logo. The August letter was not on letterhead, with no church logo and no signatures. WHY I don’t have a clue. The fact of the matter is wrong is wrong. It should have not been sent in any shape or form.

But didn't Elder Renlund say that the August letter "seemed good to the Holy Ghost"? They pretty much stamped it with approval from God. Who cares if it featured their new logo, given that circumstance? I guess what I'm saying is that THEY OWN IT.

I think I remember Elder Rasband also saying something like they were all in on the writing of it.

Maybe no logo and no signatures in case they want to distance themselves from it sometime? Idk

CuriousThinker wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 2:36 pm

FoundMyEden wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 2:03 pm They will not apologize. In the FP letter read to my ward on Sunday morning they stated that it would be okay to remove masks and not space the seating and not single out the bread in little cups...but please dispose of your own water cup, etc. It went on to read, all of this can be changed now because over 90% of people have been vacccinated (big pat on the back!).

So no, like Elder Oaks said... there won't be apologies. They're sticking to the narrative.

What FP letter was 90% mentioned in?

It was read to us this last Sunday at the pulpit. Maybe I can ask for a copy of it, but the number was mentioned as a reason "why" the restrictions were being lifted.

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:49 pm

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:31 pm [quote This was a signed First Presidency letter, a highly publicized photo-op, and numerous talks and mandates. People’s lives and health have been ruined by their “counsel”. They will not apologize, and they will not recover from this.
/quote]


It was not signed by hand, and it wasn't distributed thru the normal channels.
The statements on the vaccine and encouraging members to follow local experts and officials came as a press release and appeared with only their names in typed print.

The letter was placed on the Church official website, and emailed to every person, from leadership down to the most insignificant member whose email address they have. I don’t know what you meant by “normal channels” but this exceeded normal channels. Their names are on the letter, as the letter writers and endorsers. Actual signatures mean little in this instance.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... ugust-2021

The letter was not an official communication, rather a press release; if you got it as an email, it wasn't from the church, but was passed around among local leadership.
Look in your official communication box on the Church website. Nothing found, is there? I don't know anyone who has. If you received one from someone it was sent privately, surreptitiously.
The letter has not even the appearance of signatures, rather the three FP names appear printed, not signed.

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 6:26 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:49 pm

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:31 pm [quote This was a signed First Presidency letter, a highly publicized photo-op, and numerous talks and mandates. People’s lives and health have been ruined by their “counsel”. They will not apologize, and they will not recover from this.
/quote]


It was not signed by hand, and it wasn't distributed thru the normal channels.
The statements on the vaccine and encouraging members to follow local experts and officials came as a press release and appeared with only their names in typed print.

The letter was placed on the Church official website, and emailed to every person, from leadership down to the most insignificant member whose email address they have. I don’t know what you meant by “normal channels” but this exceeded normal channels. Their names are on the letter, as the letter writers and endorsers. Actual signatures mean little in this instance.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... ugust-2021

The letter was not an official communication, rather a press release; if you got it as an email, it wasn't from the church, but was passed around among local leadership.
Look in your official communication box on the Church website. Nothing found, is there? I don't know anyone who has. If you received one from someone it was sent privately, surreptitiously.
The letter has not even the appearance of signatures, rather the three FP names appear printed, not signed.

Are you hinting that it may have been done by somebody outside the chain of authority?

endlessismyname wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 6:35 pm

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 6:26 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:49 pm

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:31 pm [quote This was a signed First Presidency letter, a highly publicized photo-op, and numerous talks and mandates. People’s lives and health have been ruined by their “counsel”. They will not apologize, and they will not recover from this.
/quote]


It was not signed by hand, and it wasn't distributed thru the normal channels.
The statements on the vaccine and encouraging members to follow local experts and officials came as a press release and appeared with only their names in typed print.

The letter was placed on the Church official website, and emailed to every person, from leadership down to the most insignificant member whose email address they have. I don’t know what you meant by “normal channels” but this exceeded normal channels. Their names are on the letter, as the letter writers and endorsers. Actual signatures mean little in this instance.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... ugust-2021

The letter was not an official communication, rather a press release; if you got it as an email, it wasn't from the church, but was passed around among local leadership.
Look in your official communication box on the Church website. Nothing found, is there? I don't know anyone who has. If you received one from someone it was sent privately, surreptitiously.
The letter has not even the appearance of signatures, rather the three FP names appear printed, not signed.

Are you hinting that it may have been done by somebody outside the chain of authority?

I'm not hinting anything. I'll observe and report what I do and don't see. Do you have the famous church-wide email? Who sent it?

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 6:40 pm

endlessismyname wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 6:35 pm

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 6:26 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:49 pm

The letter was placed on the Church official website, and emailed to every person, from leadership down to the most insignificant member whose email address they have. I don’t know what you meant by “normal channels” but this exceeded normal channels. Their names are on the letter, as the letter writers and endorsers. Actual signatures mean little in this instance.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... ugust-2021

The letter was not an official communication, rather a press release; if you got it as an email, it wasn't from the church, but was passed around among local leadership.
Look in your official communication box on the Church website. Nothing found, is there? I don't know anyone who has. If you received one from someone it was sent privately, surreptitiously.
The letter has not even the appearance of signatures, rather the three FP names appear printed, not signed.

Are you hinting that it may have been done by somebody outside the chain of authority?

I'm not hinting anything. I'll observe and report what I do and don't see. Do you have the famous church-wide email? Who sent it?

The Church sent it. I got the email. It said it is an official church announcement under the heading of the church. I would share the screenshot, but don't know how. Every time I try it just shows the word 'img', but won't let me attach it. I gotta figure it out.

This is rich. I just got this from my LinkedIn feed:

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/the-chur ... 50144-OZtF

#3 on the list?

3. Freely apologize. In emotional situations, we all might make mistakes. Holding grudges or refusing to admit wrongdoing can contribute to division.

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:31 pm [quote This was a signed First Presidency letter, a highly publicized photo-op, and numerous talks and mandates. People’s lives and health have been ruined by their “counsel”. They will not apologize, and they will not recover from this.
/quote]


It was not signed by hand, and it wasn't distributed thru the normal channels.
The statements on the vaccine and encouraging members to follow local experts and officials came as a press release and appeared with only their names in typed print.

the announcement for blacks to hold the priesthood was announced on TV . . . I lived in Alabama and my non mormon neighbor told me . . .then it aired, again, onthe 6 oclock news . . . .what channel are you talking about? I think it was NBC for the priesthood announcement . . .

Silver Pie wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:59 pm

BuriedTartaria wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:19 pm Didn’t one of them once literally say “we’re not in the business of apologizing”?

"I know that the history of the church is not to seek apologies or to give them," Oaks said in an interview. "We sometimes look back on issues and say, 'Maybe that was counterproductive for what we wish to achieve,' but we look forward and not backward."

The church doesn't "seek apologies," he said, "and we don't give them."
https://archive.sltrib.com/article.php? ... type=CMSID

first time I've ever seen this . . . wow

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:49 pm

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:31 pm [quote This was a signed First Presidency letter, a highly publicized photo-op, and numerous talks and mandates. People’s lives and health have been ruined by their “counsel”. They will not apologize, and they will not recover from this.
/quote]


It was not signed by hand, and it wasn't distributed thru the normal channels.
The statements on the vaccine and encouraging members to follow local experts and officials came as a press release and appeared with only their names in typed print.

The letter was placed on the Church official website, and emailed to every person, from leadership down to the most insignificant member whose email address they have. I don’t know what you meant by “normal channels” but this exceeded normal channels. Their names are on the letter, as the letter writers and endorsers. Actual signatures mean little in this instance.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... ugust-2021

It's just cope. Regular members don't know how to cope with how unprecedented and uncalled for that letter actually was, so they rationalize.

how much more obvious does God need to make it? .

that little clip with oaks was . . . well . . . a disappointment . . . I don't like people to prove me right . . . he proved that he is an egotistical person with bad manners . . .who else would ever admit, on a live video that can be played over and over that they can behave like that . . . oh yeah, Pres Biden and his speaker Jen snarky can . . .

more prophecy fulfilled . . . The Lord revealed to Isiaah that our church leaders would reflect our government leaders . . . . . let me start with bad manners . . . .the rest you can figure out. . .

time to build Zion . . . where is that marred servant

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 6:26 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:49 pm

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:31 pm [quote This was a signed First Presidency letter, a highly publicized photo-op, and numerous talks and mandates. People’s lives and health have been ruined by their “counsel”. They will not apologize, and they will not recover from this.
/quote]


It was not signed by hand, and it wasn't distributed thru the normal channels.
The statements on the vaccine and encouraging members to follow local experts and officials came as a press release and appeared with only their names in typed print.

The letter was placed on the Church official website, and emailed to every person, from leadership down to the most insignificant member whose email address they have. I don’t know what you meant by “normal channels” but this exceeded normal channels. Their names are on the letter, as the letter writers and endorsers. Actual signatures mean little in this instance.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... ugust-2021

The letter was not an official communication, rather a press release; if you got it as an email, it wasn't from the church, but was passed around among local leadership.
Look in your official communication box on the Church website. Nothing found, is there? I don't know anyone who has. If you received one from someone it was sent privately, surreptitiously.
The letter has not even the appearance of signatures, rather the three FP names appear printed, not signed.

Recently, Elder Renlund, in a meeting posted by the church on their channel, said that all Fifteen of them, the FP and Q12, reviewed and discussed the letter, and that they felt the approval of the Holy Ghost in what was said in the letter. So, a bit more than a press release, passed around among members.

afterthought: I feel ashamed of being too smug since I haven't had anyone close to me die or get a heart attack from the shot, yet . . . but God bless those parents of the children, and our youth, who went on missions that have possibly ruined an organ in their body for the rest of their lives . . .by taking a shot just to go on a mission . .

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:31 pm It was not signed by hand, and it wasn't distributed thru the normal channels.
The statements on the vaccine and encouraging members to follow local experts and officials came as a press release and appeared with only their names in typed print.

I don't know if you've seen this, but here's Elder Rasband's take. Are you saying he's lying here?

Elder Rasband wrote:Since I'm also in communications, like you Thalia, I was involved as the First Presidency wrote this to be given to the members of the church throughout the world.

You can skip to 11:33 to hear him saying it. For context, you can hear his entire response to the question "should I get vaxxed" starting at 6:30 and he explains why it's so vitally important to God's plan that all members of the church get the shot. He also mentions his October GC talk was all about the vax, too, for anybody thinking they can twist what he's saying to mean something other than what he plainly said.

we will be judged by even the words we speak . . . . .or have recorded (sarcasm) . . . this whole mess just makes me cry . . I have been deceived many times through my life . . .was so hard to accept the truth . . . . almost lost my life over someone deceiving me . . . .also been lied to right to my face and didn't know it . . . found out later that i had been lied to . . .

of course, many times I haven't been deceived and the HG was prompting me . . . and I responded . . . this man has been deceived by the very government and health leaders that he thinks he should trust. . .

when JS was deceived, which resulted in the losing of a lot of translated material, then he lost the gift of translation . . . . he felt it . . . took it pretty hard . . .

but, God tried top tell him and did he listen . . .no . . .so here comes the punishment . . . poof. . .gift gone

I believe and can claim to know that God warns us through the HG every time we are about to do something wrong . . . . sometimes, we just don't listen . . .

darknesstolight wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 3:06 pm

The Red Pill wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 3:00 pm

endlessismyname wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 1:01 pm https://www.bitchute.com/video/0T5Xc54fVZcS/

This is the type of human being I can continue to work with as we move forward.

This is what I want from our leaders. A simple acknowledgment they were wrong, and that they’re sorry.

You know, repentance.

It is nice to see an apology...but it is a year late and hundreds of thousands of lives short.

Dr. Peter McCollough figured out the deadly jab in January of 2021...front line doctors figured out the COVID fraud in March of 2020.

Personally speaking, it looks like a CYA career surviving statement. Since the 40% increase in insurance deaths came out, it's hard NOT to understand the truth.

Look for BOATLOADS of similar statements from docs trying to save their credibility.


Q15 should have had a press conference the day after the insurance stats were released...reversing their position.

They CAN'T walk it back now....even if they wanted to...

THIS ISSUE WILL BLOW THE CHURCH UP...when the masses figure out the truth about the deadly-jab!!!

The masses will not figure it out unless we who know boldly speak out against it and do it with knowledge, reason, facts, and truth. But we can't be waiting on them to find out. I don't know you so I'm not saying this at you directly but I see so many people who are up in arms online but do or say nothing at Church or in real life. They seem to afraid of the social consequences. They needs to stop or it will not get better.

...

Because words have consequences I want to make it clear that I am not a person who wants to tear down the Church. I am not advocating for departure from the Church or being disruptive. There are multiple reasons for that but I'll keep this short. If I have a sincerely held position and it is not out of spite, it is not just for the heck of it, it is truly and sincerely what I have come to know as true or at least I think its the truth, then I ought to be able to speak it in relevant situations. And, by the way, in order to make that list of things that I know as truth or believe to be truth they would have to be things that I am living and practicing in my life now, today, on account of the fact that I believe them to be true principles or good ideas by which to live by. I recognize that I have very many things in my life that are not good things to live by. Some of these not good things to live by are known by me. Other's of them are not known by me, yet they exist and have consequences. I say that to make it plain that I do not think for a moment that I am better than the leaders of the Church and I don't think that I am better than anyone. Not to say that I don't recognize advantages and disadvantages, gifts, etc. but I believe and live my life in such a way that all have intrinsic value and have within them a potential that is great or divine. And I know that it is cliche but in this case there is no better way of saying it. None of that is strictly relevant to the point except to say that this I am not judging the leaders as someone who thinks they are better but rather someone who is aware that the last two years were some of the strangest, and in many cases horrific, times of my life. At least top 5. This has been traumatic. How do humans, people, deal with trauma in a good and healthy way? They talk about it! At this point there is enough verifiably true information that calls in to question the virus, the response, the "vaccine", and everything COVID19 related such as monies being given to businesses, churches, institutions, States, cities, townships, and even grandma got a cut to hopefully and sometimes even under law make them sell the COVID narrative, "for the 'good' and 'safety' of everyone" and, hey, don't say anything, but you'll get filthy rich too!! Oh yeah, monies are gonna flow and hospitals and hospital doctors, you whores are gonna get paid big time. And you church whores, you got it coming too. And you name it whores, they got paid. And this isn't theory, it's documented fact. It's just what happened. Ignore it, pretend its not real, don't be bothered by it, whatever, its verifiably true. So, we should be able to talk about verifiably true things in a relevant context pertaining to the COVID era without fear of reprisal. We should be able to acknowledge, without fear of some reprisal, that the "vaccine" is some shady $h!t and it's done some horrible damage and it was probably NOT the best idea for EVERYONE to take it and IT was NOT ready for primetime. The WHOLE population was used as experimental subjects and the human damage is great. It is so great that even as I type this I struggle to believe it is real, yet, these are verifiably true things. They happened based on the documentation of the "vaccine" maker themselves and based on all sorts of other data that are verifiably accurate and correct.

It's a level of crazy that I'm not willing to live by to simply ignore things that are factual and true and which have had such tremendous consequences on people's lives. To combat that and to not just put my blinders on I speak my mind and say the things that I know to be true when my opinion is asked or when a question is posed and I feel like I have a relevant answer. I won't contend but that doesn't mean that I will simply just be silent or stay quiet. I try to keep in mind that this person is my equal and they have a sincere held belief or idea like I do. Many things hinge on those beliefs and I understand how that feels. I also do not want to be condescending. Again, equals. Just as I want to be heard, I allow them to be heard and I listen sincerely. My response will try to address their concern while at the same time standing firm to the things I know or think I know to be true. I'll challenge someone trying to silence my thoughts or I'll try and address their concern for what I'm saying and wanting to stop me from speaking. That may or may not work but I use logic and reason and try to say only things that I can actually back up or if I can't say it with precision then I need to communicate that. I've found that if I don't get upset that I am being "shushed" and sincerely respond to what their concern is with reason and with as much truth as I can muster in the situation, that people sense that you aren't trying to attack them. I know from experience that getting offended can really ruin your chances of persuading anyone that what you are saying is true. So I try and check my ego at the door. Although I do not shy away from opportunities to evangelize the "truth" at church I don't approach it all "activist" like, and I don't believe that it's my place to disrupt the way that the leaders of the organization want to run the organization that they rightfully have authority to run. They are allowed to run it to heaven or run it to hell. Until I'm called in to that position it's not my responsibility, that part. Yet, that doesn't mean I have to accept untruth as truth just because a leader says it. And I will not kowtow to nonsense or things I know to be false because I know what the truth is. But, unless there is clear and present danger I don't think it's my place to antagonize or disrespect the local leadership or Area authority directives and so on. I'll choose based on what my conscience tells me what is relevant or what isn't. I'll take any good and corrective counsel and I'll reject any what I would say is nonsense.

...

I didn't follow all that you said , but this man has been deceived . . . or he is willingly following a NWO plot to kill people . . .ya know genocide . .

JS was deceived . . .he repented and then wrote about it and it was published in the D&C . . . evidently being deceived is a real problem with us . . don't know where it started but examples are pre existence with a punishment of no body, Eve . . who repented and started the race of people on this earth . . . . its written about allover the scriptures

notice. . . I am not backing my comments up . . . someone else has already done that . . .backed up my comments . .

darknesstolight wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 3:06 pm ...I see so many people who are up in arms online but do or say nothing at Church or in real life. They seem to afraid of the social consequences. They needs to stop or it will not get better.

Yup.

Doing nothing is supporting evil. Moroni executed the kingmen NOT because they were fighting against him but because they wouldn't take up arms to defend freedom.

Apathy is evil

logonbump wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 6:26 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑March 7th, 2022, 7:21 pm Recently, Elder Renlund, in a meeting posted by the church on their channel, said that all Fifteen of them, the FP and Q12, reviewed and discussed the letter, and that they felt the approval of the Holy Ghost in what was said in the letter. So, a bit more than a press release, passed around among members.

A thread if anyone hasn't seen it:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=65128

Jesus had nothing to apologize for, being sinless. The rest of us do. However, there is a camp which also will never apologize. They are called satanists. Perhaps Oaks belongs to that camp.