The elect are not and will not be deceived

[TheDuke]

Wrong example for this OP “deceived unto losing salvation “ not being imperfect.

[EvanLM]

I remember that a part of it is the foot washing ceremony BUT the wife washes the husbands feet. . . I think the wife is supposed to represent the church and the husband is supposes to represent Christ . . . scriptures mention this relationship and talk about the marriage . . . I don't get the meaning behind most of it, so can't remeber it and don't care . . .cuz I would only believe Christ telling me that i had made it . . .I would not believe Holland or any other prophet. . .

in my patriarchal blessing it says that it is the voice of the Lord and " I seal you up unto eternal life and against the destroyer, etc." . . that's good enough for me

I hope that saints will realize that the gifts of God are real and that we need to have confidence that we can receive those . . .we also need to support our brothers and sisters who have already recieved them . . it is not fair to put too much doubt on people or condemn them when you question their experience . . .

but, I guess it is a part of the persecutions that make one humble

In response to the bolded part - it was Christ that did the foot washing, since the wife washes the husband's feet, she represents Christ, not the husband. It is important to understand what washing of the feet ritually symbolizes.
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When apostles are set apart then they are not getting their calling and election . . . you are confusing this setting apart with calling and election . . .they are not the same . . . the men who told their stories on utube explaioned this and they were not apostles when they received the ordinance. . . . they claimed that it was explained to them this way . . .they could be wrong . . .I could be wrong . . . two different ordinances

[EvanLM]

maybe you can explain what washing ritualily symbolizes so I can see what you are saying. . . .cuz when we move to a higher position towards godhood, then God indicates this new level and calls us by the right hand . . no washing of feet . . . the scriptures only speak of washing in conjunction with apostleship . . . this is why I have never accepted aclling and elcetion . . .I can't find it in scrfipture . . . BUT I can find the higher level indicated as being received by God's right hand . . .

help me here and I really, really, really believe that a person can know that they are no longer being deceived . . . seems to be a higher level as well . . .a trust in God. . .a trust in the HG . . . a testimony to truthfulness and not a vain self centered declaration . . .

God wants us to receive all that he has. . .all the covenants . . .all the gifts . . eternal life . . .and testify of their truthfulness and power . . . and recognize that we have received the gift from him cuz he doesn't give gifts to those who scoff . . .everyone can be deceived but if we reach the level of elect then we cannot be deceived . . .God does not lie. . .every word he speaks he will then fulfill . . . what a wonderful gift that everyone should obtain . . . .

[EvanLM]

funn thing, when I was younger and got some odd promptings, quite often they would be followed with. . . "Well, quit being so vain, what makes you think that God would ask you to do that? What makes you think you are good enought todo that?, or that idea goes against everything that you have believed so why would it be true and why would God tell you, etc.

As I have gotten older then I have resisted those words. . .if God tells me to do something through the HG then I should just do it. I made a new years resolution a few years ago to avoid other people that make me feel bad about myself . . . .avoid satan, too when he makes me feel bad . . .

would this be vanity finally or GROWTH . . . just believe it when it is revealed. .

My brother as a volunteer, was called to a home where a woman on drugs needed his and his partners help. He had the distinct impression to give her a blessing . . .even though he did not know her . . . the next thought was . "Who do you think you are. . .who says you are worthy to exercise the priesthood in this way . . " . . he was worthy but was taken a back by the audible words in his mind . . . he performed the blessing. . .

we learn in the temple that . . when we try to worship God, when we try to pray, when we try to speak to the good guys, when we try to listen to God . . .satan is always there interfering

[Mamabear]

Joseph explains below that any church that does not teach calling and election will be damned.

“Now for the secret & grand key. though they might hear the voice of God & know that Jesus was the son of God this would be no evidence that their election & calling & election was made shure that they had part with Christ & was a Joint heir with him, they then would want that more sure word of prophecy that they were sealed in the heavens & had the promise of eternal live in the kingdom of God— then having this promise sealed unto them it was as an anchor to the soul sure & steadfast though the thunders might roll; & lightnings flash & earthquakes Bellow & war gather thick around yet this hope & knowledge would support the soul in evry hour of trial trouble & tribulation Then knowledge through our Lord & Savior Jesus Christ— is the grand key that unlocks the glories & misteries of the kingdom of heaven. Compare this principle once with Christendom at the present day & whare are they with all their boasted religion piety & sacredness while at the same time they are crying out against Prophets Apostles Angels Revelations Prophesyings, & visions &c. why they are Just ripening for the damnation of hell, they will be damned for they reject the most glorious principle of the gospel of Jesus Christ & treat with disdain & trample under foot the main key that unlocks the heavens & puts in our possession the glories of the celestial world. yes I say such will be damned with all their professed godliness.
Then I would exhort you to go on & continue to call upon God untill you make your calling & election sure for yourselves by obtaining this more sure word of Prophescy & wait patiently for the promise untill you obtain it.”
Joseph Smith TPJS p. 298-299

[darknesstolight]

I reject the premise that the elect cannot be deceived. There has been and probably forever will be a debate about the reading "...if it were possible..." a technical reading of current English would say there is an implied "bit it's not [possible]."

The turn of phrase typically just means "will be giving the utmost effort" with no prediction of success or failure.

I think the idea is false because show me one person on earth who is not translated who is not susceptible to deceit. I think it is a part of existence here regardless of how good you are or how connected to the powers of heaven you are. Yes, you can safeguard yourself against catastrophic missteps and deception - but no one is immune imho.

I agree.

It doesn't mean that every descion an "elect" makes will be done without error or with perfect knowledge. Even when you have the Holy Ghost you are still in the game and have to finish playing the game.

I'd say the elect are never deceived in knowing what game to play but as they are playing the game they will make mistakes and will be learning how to play the game better.

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