LDS Freedom Forum

ConnectTheDots wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:02 pm “Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose
teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of
Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?”

If you answer yes, then no recommend, correct?

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:04 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:02 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 12:47 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 12:28 pm
You've got to explain a little bit more about this homosexual encounter; at this point I'm assuming you went looking for another man (or innocently got into a situation where he hit on you) and when you realized what he was about to do, you beat him up.

I highly doubt you went bar cruzing looking for one to beat up. Did this guy attempt to sexually abuse you and that's why you beat him up?
[/quote
Nope. I lived a life that you would never understand. A lifestyle you couldn't handle for a week. You see, you can still barely see the swastika tattoo I have right between my shoulder blades that my cousin gave to me at age 16. I was full of misunderstanding and hate. Like you are now. I was taught to think like you do. Hate. Hate. Hate. I can tell you right now that it's just ignorance. You need to let it go. You need to grow up and mature. Get a wife. Have some children. Noone is out to get you. Immigrants aren't stealing your jobs. Gays aren't trying to convert you. Blacks aren't cursed for their unrighteousness. Most people just want to be left alone to live their lives. In fact most people wouldn't give you a second thought if you died right now. That goes for everyone. You are going to live a life of anger and bitterness. You'll mock and strike out against those who's opinions and looks differ from yours. Trust me. I've been there. The only one who will suffer from your hatred is you. No one else cares. Second. The guy who "forgave," us also supported us financially at times while we were serving time. Do you think Rusty Nelson would have done that? My heart is no longer dark. It was. I wake up at night sometimes with a hole in my gut when I remember some of the things we did to innocent people. Was I better than them? No. I was much worse. Although at the time I believed that I was. I'll pray for you. Life is too short to hate.

ROFLOL.

You know for all your claims about me getting out my hate; you've got more in you than me, my wife and all my kids combined!

Homosexuals are trying to convert me and my children; you are overcompensating because you haven't allowed Christ to forgive you; your heart is still full of hate-only the object of your hate has changed. Now you hate those who oppose your liberal ideology.

Get the hate out of your own heart before you tell others to do so!

You are still living in high school man. My "liberal ideology?" Maybe it's because I spent my teens years being angry and my 20-30s in foreign lands killing "evil Muslims," for your Republican presidents that I have grown up. Matured. Started to mind my own business rather than try to make up for my own weaknesses by bullying those different than me. Like you do.

High school??? ROFLOL except you are the one talking about what you would have done to me (or what you assume I was like).

Youz got problems dude. Learn to rely on Christ more, He'll heal the hate in your heart.

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:06 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:02 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 12:47 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 12:28 pm
You've got to explain a little bit more about this homosexual encounter; at this point I'm assuming you went looking for another man (or innocently got into a situation where he hit on you) and when you realized what he was about to do, you beat him up.

I highly doubt you went bar cruzing looking for one to beat up. Did this guy attempt to sexually abuse you and that's why you beat him up?
[/quote
Nope. I lived a life that you would never understand. A lifestyle you couldn't handle for a week. You see, you can still barely see the swastika tattoo I have right between my shoulder blades that my cousin gave to me at age 16. I was full of misunderstanding and hate. Like you are now. I was taught to think like you do. Hate. Hate. Hate. I can tell you right now that it's just ignorance. You need to let it go. You need to grow up and mature. Get a wife. Have some children. Noone is out to get you. Immigrants aren't stealing your jobs. Gays aren't trying to convert you. Blacks aren't cursed for their unrighteousness. Most people just want to be left alone to live their lives. In fact most people wouldn't give you a second thought if you died right now. That goes for everyone. You are going to live a life of anger and bitterness. You'll mock and strike out against those who's opinions and looks differ from yours. Trust me. I've been there. The only one who will suffer from your hatred is you. No one else cares. Second. The guy who "forgave," us also supported us financially at times while we were serving time. Do you think Rusty Nelson would have done that? My heart is no longer dark. It was. I wake up at night sometimes with a hole in my gut when I remember some of the things we did to innocent people. Was I better than them? No. I was much worse. Although at the time I believed that I was. I'll pray for you. Life is too short to hate.

ROFLOL.

You know for all your claims about me getting out my hate; you've got more in you than me, my wife and all my kids combined!

Homosexuals are trying to convert me and my children; you are overcompensating because you haven't allowed Christ to forgive you; your heart is still full of hate-only the object of your hate has changed. Now you hate those who oppose your liberal ideology.

Get the hate out of your own heart before you tell others to do so!

You are still living in high school man. My "liberal ideology?" Maybe it's because I spent my teens years being angry and my 20-30s in foreign lands killing "evil Muslims," for your Republican presidents that I have grown up. Matured. Started to mind my own business rather than try to make up for my own weaknesses by bullying those different than me. Like you do.

You make way too many assumptions. I never voted for any R presidents for killing overseas.

Dude, did your dad abuse you growing up? Dad not love you enough? Raised by a single mother? You've got some serious hate in your heart.

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:29 am

SPIRIT wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 9:55 am

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 8:40 am And to answer your question, I believe all people who want to follow the Savior and participate in the ordinances thereof are worthy to enter the temple if they repent. Are you perfect? Am I? Is anyone? We all make mistakes. We all have things we are dealing with. I spent 13 months and three days in the Reidsville, GA state prison for bashing a guy with a two-foot piece of rebar when I was younger. Got out. Changed my life. Spent a year applying for a waiver and joined the military. Got a degree, a wife and four kids. Should I be denied entering the temple for hatreds I used to have? If anything you are the one who should be denied entering the temple. You have hatreds and bigotries in your heart and you openly embrace them rather than trying to defeat them. If someone has abnormalities in their minds but they control them, don't ever act of them and do their best to overcome them then YES, those are the exact people the Savior wants in his temple.

not what Jesus said -

The master has told us.
Jesus said
27 ¶ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:

28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her
hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Matthew 5

and as far as same-sex attraction.
I don't care what leaders of the church say -
same-sex attraction and being homosexual IS a sin - and is wrong. period.
no matter how much you want to twist it and justify yourself
(like all those that are - do)
I've heard every excuse and justification in the book.

IT'S THE DESIRE IN YOUR HEART - NOT THE ACT.

you don't actually have to do it !
you've already done it, just to desire it. to want it . to think it. it's all in the mind.
to be attracted means you have a desire for it - in this case, for something that's wrong.

Here's my story. 19 years old. Bashed a gay man's head in with a piece of rebar. He spent nearly three weeks in the hospital. I went to the state prison for a little bit as did my cohorts. This "evil," gay man showed up at my trial. Said he forgave me and didn't think I needed to go to prison since I was "just a kid." He was in his mid 40s and he occasionally put money on my books. He kept in touch with each of us and I actually invited him to my wedding three years after getting out. He didn't judge me and he forgave me for what we did to him and his friend. Fast forward to my early 40s. I had done my short time and eventually joined the military. Did 20 years and retired. Even got a commission. Now I'm not sure, I think it was my daughter who let it out to someone in the ward that I had served time in prison. I was immediately relieved of my EQ calling. The bishops secretary asked me to speak in church then said "wait, there's a reason you can't talk." and walked away. I have never been under church discipline yet my "past," somehow makes me "undesirable," and unclean among the pure little Mormons who have never signed. Now I don't understand homosexuality but I can tell you that one man, who had every reason to hate me and despise me showed me and my friends more Christlike kindness and forgiveness than an LDS member ever did. He wasn't evil and diseased. I was the evil and diseased one. Diseased by my blind hatred of people I never really knew. I have come to learn that LDS people are no better than those that they judge. You judge those who you hate and yet fail to recognize your own hatreds. One day you will meet the Savior and you will be embarrassed at the blackness and sick nature of your own hearts. You are not Christ's disciples. You who condemn those you have never met are wrong.

farmerchick wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 2:46 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:29 am

SPIRIT wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 9:55 am

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 8:40 am And to answer your question, I believe all people who want to follow the Savior and participate in the ordinances thereof are worthy to enter the temple if they repent. Are you perfect? Am I? Is anyone? We all make mistakes. We all have things we are dealing with. I spent 13 months and three days in the Reidsville, GA state prison for bashing a guy with a two-foot piece of rebar when I was younger. Got out. Changed my life. Spent a year applying for a waiver and joined the military. Got a degree, a wife and four kids. Should I be denied entering the temple for hatreds I used to have? If anything you are the one who should be denied entering the temple. You have hatreds and bigotries in your heart and you openly embrace them rather than trying to defeat them. If someone has abnormalities in their minds but they control them, don't ever act of them and do their best to overcome them then YES, those are the exact people the Savior wants in his temple.

not what Jesus said -

The master has told us.
Jesus said
27 ¶ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:

28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her
hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Matthew 5

and as far as same-sex attraction.
I don't care what leaders of the church say -
same-sex attraction and being homosexual IS a sin - and is wrong. period.
no matter how much you want to twist it and justify yourself
(like all those that are - do)
I've heard every excuse and justification in the book.

IT'S THE DESIRE IN YOUR HEART - NOT THE ACT.

you don't actually have to do it !
you've already done it, just to desire it. to want it . to think it. it's all in the mind.
to be attracted means you have a desire for it - in this case, for something that's wrong.

Here's my story. 19 years old. Bashed a gay man's head in with a piece of rebar. He spent nearly three weeks in the hospital. I went to the state prison for a little bit as did my cohorts. This "evil," gay man showed up at my trial. Said he forgave me and didn't think I needed to go to prison since I was "just a kid." He was in his mid 40s and he occasionally put money on my books. He kept in touch with each of us and I actually invited him to my wedding three years after getting out. He didn't judge me and he forgave me for what we did to him and his friend. Fast forward to my early 40s. I had done my short time and eventually joined the military. Did 20 years and retired. Even got a commission. Now I'm not sure, I think it was my daughter who let it out to someone in the ward that I had served time in prison. I was immediately relieved of my EQ calling. The bishops secretary asked me to speak in church then said "wait, there's a reason you can't talk." and walked away. I have never been under church discipline yet my "past," somehow makes me "undesirable," and unclean among the pure little Mormons who have never signed. Now I don't understand homosexuality but I can tell you that one man, who had every reason to hate me and despise me showed me and my friends more Christlike kindness and forgiveness than an LDS member ever did. He wasn't evil and diseased. I was the evil and diseased one. Diseased by my blind hatred of people I never really knew. I have come to learn that LDS people are no better than those that they judge. You judge those who you hate and yet fail to recognize your own hatreds. One day you will meet the Savior and you will be embarrassed at the blackness and sick nature of your own hearts. You are not Christ's disciples. You who condemn those you have never met are wrong.

What? So you brutally beat up a gay guy...he forgave you......you've seen the error of your ways after a stint in jail and hate the judgy people at church....did I get this right? Who is propagating violence on someone who doesn't agree with your ideals? You think the church thought it was ok to bash the gay guy in the first place? Just trying to understand your point here....your saying that the gay guy is a better christian for forgiving you than the holy moly Mormons at your ward? And now the gay guy is vindicated for everything because he forgave you the sinner who is now repented.....? And this makes it all good to be gay? Who taught you to be blind and diseased in this way? I mean if you had stopped the story after the forgiveness part your logic may have been credible....but you go on to judge and condemn the members for being judgy to you....lol....idk...seems kinda crazy to me....but this is the last days and all manner of insanity seems to be prevalent.......

TrueFaith wrote: ↑November 5th, 2021, 3:57 pm This is from an article posted front and center on LDS.org right now.

"Reach out to individuals who are familiar with LGBT issues to help you learn and understand their perspectives. This could include your stake president, your ward council, other bishops in your area, trusted friends, and members of your ward who identify as LGBT and their families.
...
Remember that what someone feels and how they choose to respond to those feelings are not the same thing. A Gospel Topics essay explains: “The Church distinguishes between same-sex attraction and homosexual behavior. People who experience same-sex attraction or identify as gay, lesbian, or bisexual can make and keep covenants with God and fully and worthily participate in the Church. Identifying as gay, lesbian, or bisexual or experiencing same-sex attraction is not a sin and does not prohibit one from participating in the Church, holding callings, or attending the temple.”
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... s?lang=eng

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Identifying with a lie IS A SIN.

If I accept a man as a woman who simply thinks he is a woman, I am participating in a lie. Plain and simple. "Understanding" them truthfully means that I accept the gender God gave them at birth, not a make-believe fantasy of their own imagination. There is no other definition of "understanding". "Understanding" means arriving closer to truth, what they are pushing makes us understand reality less, not more

Along with the Covid BS they push, this is just as agregious to me. I don’t know how so many can stand being a part of this every Sunday. Every time we participate in lies like this, it puts a burden on our conscience. It's like locking a ball and chain to our ankles putting us into a silent form of slavery.

Peace leaves your life when you carry lies around. Its not a healthy way to live. Joseph taught that the "Standard" of our church was, "Truth". We have abandoned that eternal standard for a temporary potage of deception. It continues to get worse every day, it's becoming so obvious and so disgusting to witness.

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:57 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:06 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:02 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 12:47 pm
ROFLOL.

You know for all your claims about me getting out my hate; you've got more in you than me, my wife and all my kids combined!

Homosexuals are trying to convert me and my children; you are overcompensating because you haven't allowed Christ to forgive you; your heart is still full of hate-only the object of your hate has changed. Now you hate those who oppose your liberal ideology.

Get the hate out of your own heart before you tell others to do so!

You are still living in high school man. My "liberal ideology?" Maybe it's because I spent my teens years being angry and my 20-30s in foreign lands killing "evil Muslims," for your Republican presidents that I have grown up. Matured. Started to mind my own business rather than try to make up for my own weaknesses by bullying those different than me. Like you do.

You make way too many assumptions. I never voted for any R presidents for killing overseas.

Dude, did your dad abuse you growing up? Dad not love you enough? Raised by a single mother? You've got some serious hate in your heart.

Nope. Grew up in Peachtree City Ga. A town that has more miles of golf cart paths than it does actual roads. Look it up. You'll want to move there. Dad was a corporate attorney for Phillips petroleum. Bishop. All around awesome guy. Mom was a stay at home mom who worked part time at a doctor's office. I was super spoiled and got a brand new Nissan truck when I turned 16. Graduated HS with high honors. Awesome kid. Just quit my Dept. Of Defense job because I won't take the vax and I'm living off of dad's life insurance and building my wealth trading crypto all day.

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 2:57 pm

farmerchick wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 2:46 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:29 am

SPIRIT wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 9:55 am

not what Jesus said -

The master has told us.
Jesus said
27 ¶ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:

28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her
hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Matthew 5

and as far as same-sex attraction.
I don't care what leaders of the church say -
same-sex attraction and being homosexual IS a sin - and is wrong. period.
no matter how much you want to twist it and justify yourself
(like all those that are - do)
I've heard every excuse and justification in the book.

IT'S THE DESIRE IN YOUR HEART - NOT THE ACT.

you don't actually have to do it !
you've already done it, just to desire it. to want it . to think it. it's all in the mind.
to be attracted means you have a desire for it - in this case, for something that's wrong.

Here's my story. 19 years old. Bashed a gay man's head in with a piece of rebar. He spent nearly three weeks in the hospital. I went to the state prison for a little bit as did my cohorts. This "evil," gay man showed up at my trial. Said he forgave me and didn't think I needed to go to prison since I was "just a kid." He was in his mid 40s and he occasionally put money on my books. He kept in touch with each of us and I actually invited him to my wedding three years after getting out. He didn't judge me and he forgave me for what we did to him and his friend. Fast forward to my early 40s. I had done my short time and eventually joined the military. Did 20 years and retired. Even got a commission. Now I'm not sure, I think it was my daughter who let it out to someone in the ward that I had served time in prison. I was immediately relieved of my EQ calling. The bishops secretary asked me to speak in church then said "wait, there's a reason you can't talk." and walked away. I have never been under church discipline yet my "past," somehow makes me "undesirable," and unclean among the pure little Mormons who have never signed. Now I don't understand homosexuality but I can tell you that one man, who had every reason to hate me and despise me showed me and my friends more Christlike kindness and forgiveness than an LDS member ever did. He wasn't evil and diseased. I was the evil and diseased one. Diseased by my blind hatred of people I never really knew. I have come to learn that LDS people are no better than those that they judge. You judge those who you hate and yet fail to recognize your own hatreds. One day you will meet the Savior and you will be embarrassed at the blackness and sick nature of your own hearts. You are not Christ's disciples. You who condemn those you have never met are wrong.

What? So you brutally beat up a gay guy...he forgave you......you've seen the error of your ways after a stint in jail and hate the judgy people at church....did I get this right? Who is propagating violence on someone who doesn't agree with your ideals? You think the church thought it was ok to bash the gay guy in the first place? Just trying to understand your point here....your saying that the gay guy is a better christian for forgiving you than the holy moly Mormons at your ward? And now the gay guy is vindicated for everything because he forgave you the sinner who is now repented.....? And this makes it all good to be gay? Who taught you to be blind and diseased in this way? I mean if you had stopped the story after the forgiveness part your logic may have been credible....but you go on to judge and condemn the members for being judgy to you....lol....idk...seems kinda crazy to me....but this is the last days and all manner of insanity seems to be prevalent.......

My whole point was asking what is wrong for someone who is attracted to the same sex yet doesn't act on those attractions to attend the temple anymore than a straight person who is attracted to a different sex yet lives a chaste life can attend the temple? If the temple is only for those who have committed no sin and are perfect in every way then no one could attend. How is this wrong or blasphemous? I am not saying marriage in the temple btw. It seems as though too many people view gays though they are all demonic threats to civilization. I was telling my tale of how I used to view them as such yet learned a lesson that for the most part people are good people.

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 2:57 pm

farmerchick wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 2:46 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:29 am

SPIRIT wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 9:55 am

not what Jesus said -

The master has told us.
Jesus said
27 ¶ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:

28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her
hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Matthew 5

and as far as same-sex attraction.
I don't care what leaders of the church say -
same-sex attraction and being homosexual IS a sin - and is wrong. period.
no matter how much you want to twist it and justify yourself
(like all those that are - do)
I've heard every excuse and justification in the book.

IT'S THE DESIRE IN YOUR HEART - NOT THE ACT.

you don't actually have to do it !
you've already done it, just to desire it. to want it . to think it. it's all in the mind.
to be attracted means you have a desire for it - in this case, for something that's wrong.

Here's my story. 19 years old. Bashed a gay man's head in with a piece of rebar. He spent nearly three weeks in the hospital. I went to the state prison for a little bit as did my cohorts. This "evil," gay man showed up at my trial. Said he forgave me and didn't think I needed to go to prison since I was "just a kid." He was in his mid 40s and he occasionally put money on my books. He kept in touch with each of us and I actually invited him to my wedding three years after getting out. He didn't judge me and he forgave me for what we did to him and his friend. Fast forward to my early 40s. I had done my short time and eventually joined the military. Did 20 years and retired. Even got a commission. Now I'm not sure, I think it was my daughter who let it out to someone in the ward that I had served time in prison. I was immediately relieved of my EQ calling. The bishops secretary asked me to speak in church then said "wait, there's a reason you can't talk." and walked away. I have never been under church discipline yet my "past," somehow makes me "undesirable," and unclean among the pure little Mormons who have never signed. Now I don't understand homosexuality but I can tell you that one man, who had every reason to hate me and despise me showed me and my friends more Christlike kindness and forgiveness than an LDS member ever did. He wasn't evil and diseased. I was the evil and diseased one. Diseased by my blind hatred of people I never really knew. I have come to learn that LDS people are no better than those that they judge. You judge those who you hate and yet fail to recognize your own hatreds. One day you will meet the Savior and you will be embarrassed at the blackness and sick nature of your own hearts. You are not Christ's disciples. You who condemn those you have never met are wrong.

What? So you brutally beat up a gay guy...he forgave you......you've seen the error of your ways after a stint in jail and hate the judgy people at church....did I get this right? Who is propagating violence on someone who doesn't agree with your ideals? You think the church thought it was ok to bash the gay guy in the first place? Just trying to understand your point here....your saying that the gay guy is a better christian for forgiving you than the holy moly Mormons at your ward? And now the gay guy is vindicated for everything because he forgave you the sinner who is now repented.....? And this makes it all good to be gay? Who taught you to be blind and diseased in this way? I mean if you had stopped the story after the forgiveness part your logic may have been credible....but you go on to judge and condemn the members for being judgy to you....lol....idk...seems kinda crazy to me....but this is the last days and all manner of insanity seems to be prevalent.......

My whole point was asking what is wrong for someone who is attracted to the same sex yet doesn't act on those attractions ...

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:05 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:57 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:06 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:02 pm
You are still living in high school man. My "liberal ideology?" Maybe it's because I spent my teens years being angry and my 20-30s in foreign lands killing "evil Muslims," for your Republican presidents that I have grown up. Matured. Started to mind my own business rather than try to make up for my own weaknesses by bullying those different than me. Like you do.

You make way too many assumptions. I never voted for any R presidents for killing overseas.

Dude, did your dad abuse you growing up? Dad not love you enough? Raised by a single mother? You've got some serious hate in your heart.

Nope. Grew up in Peachtree City Ga. A town that has more miles of golf cart paths than it does actual roads. Look it up. You'll want to move there. Dad was a corporate attorney for Phillips petroleum. Bishop. All around awesome guy. Mom was a stay at home mom who worked part time at a doctor's office. I was super spoiled and got a brand new Nissan truck when I turned 16. Graduated HS with high honors. Awesome kid. Just quit my Dept. Of Defense job because I won't take the vax and I'm living off of dad's life insurance and building my wealth trading crypto all day.

Ah so a spoiled rich kid. No wonder you felt you could beat up some random dude. Obviously your parents didn't teach you no proper fetchen up. So no they weren't "awesome" people-they raised a spoiled brat and didn't do anything to curb it.

My goodness man, you have some serious problems.

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:12 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:05 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:57 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:06 pm
You make way too many assumptions. I never voted for any R presidents for killing overseas.

Dude, did your dad abuse you growing up? Dad not love you enough? Raised by a single mother? You've got some serious hate in your heart.

Nope. Grew up in Peachtree City Ga. A town that has more miles of golf cart paths than it does actual roads. Look it up. You'll want to move there. Dad was a corporate attorney for Phillips petroleum. Bishop. All around awesome guy. Mom was a stay at home mom who worked part time at a doctor's office. I was super spoiled and got a brand new Nissan truck when I turned 16. Graduated HS with high honors. Awesome kid. Just quit my Dept. Of Defense job because I won't take the vax and I'm living off of dad's life insurance and building my wealth trading crypto all day.

Ah so a spoiled rich kid. No wonder you felt you could beat up some random dude. Obviously your parents didn't teach you no proper fetchen up. So no they weren't "awesome" people-they raised a spoiled brat and didn't do anything to curb it.

My goodness man, you have some serious problems.

Perhaps. But hatred and bigotry are not among them.

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:16 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:12 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:05 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 1:57 pm
Nope. Grew up in Peachtree City Ga. A town that has more miles of golf cart paths than it does actual roads. Look it up. You'll want to move there. Dad was a corporate attorney for Phillips petroleum. Bishop. All around awesome guy. Mom was a stay at home mom who worked part time at a doctor's office. I was super spoiled and got a brand new Nissan truck when I turned 16. Graduated HS with high honors. Awesome kid. Just quit my Dept. Of Defense job because I won't take the vax and I'm living off of dad's life insurance and building my wealth trading crypto all day.

Ah so a spoiled rich kid. No wonder you felt you could beat up some random dude. Obviously your parents didn't teach you no proper fetchen up. So no they weren't "awesome" people-they raised a spoiled brat and didn't do anything to curb it.

My goodness man, you have some serious problems.

Perhaps. But hatred and bigotry are not among them.

It's so fascinating to me; when you were younger you thought you were better than others and now you still think you are better than others because you have no hatred and bigotry.

I don't think you learned a thing. Go on proclaiming how great and awesome and marvelous you are because you don't have hate and bigotry and how you can look down on others who do.

ROFLOL . . .too funny.

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:27 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:16 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:12 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:05 pm
Ah so a spoiled rich kid. No wonder you felt you could beat up some random dude. Obviously your parents didn't teach you no proper fetchen up. So no they weren't "awesome" people-they raised a spoiled brat and didn't do anything to curb it.

My goodness man, you have some serious problems.

Perhaps. But hatred and bigotry are not among them.

It's so fascinating to me; when you were younger you thought you were better than others and now you still think you are better than others because you have no hatred and bigotry.

I don't think you learned a thing. Go on proclaiming how great and awesome and marvelous you are because you don't have hate and bigotry and how you can look down on others who do.

ROFLOL . . .too funny.

You are right. Having seen pure hatred first hand and having acted on that pure hatred (ignorance) and then having to lose a good part of my life and see family and friends lose a LONG part of their life because of their hatred I can say without a doubt that those who do not hate are better than those who do. Am I a better person now that I try not to hate than I was when I hated everyone and everything to the point that I would kill someone for who they were? Absolutely! How can you argue against that? I hope your hate never gets that bad. I hope you can see people for who they really are and not some stereotype. I hope you never get to experience the ugly side of humanity. I hope you can continue to enjoy a calm and easy life where you don't have anything better to worry about than someone else's sexuality. Above all I hope you and others like you can find peace. Real peace. The kind of peace that only understanding the pure love of Christ can bring. As Salaam Alaikum

Serragon wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 4:02 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:27 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:16 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:12 pm

Perhaps. But hatred and bigotry are not among them.

It's so fascinating to me; when you were younger you thought you were better than others and now you still think you are better than others because you have no hatred and bigotry.

I don't think you learned a thing. Go on proclaiming how great and awesome and marvelous you are because you don't have hate and bigotry and how you can look down on others who do.

ROFLOL . . .too funny.

You are right. Having seen pure hatred first hand and having acted on that pure hatred (ignorance) and then having to lose a good part of my life and see family and friends lose a LONG part of their life because of their hatred I can say without a doubt that those who do not hate are better than those who do. Am I a better person now that I try not to hate than I was when I hated everyone and everything to the point that I would kill someone for who they were? Absolutely! How can you argue against that? I hope your hate never gets that bad. I hope you can see people for who they really are and not some stereotype. I hope you never get to experience the ugly side of humanity. I hope you can continue to enjoy a calm and easy life where you don't have anything better to worry about than someone else's sexuality. Above all I hope you and others like you can find peace. Real peace. The kind of peace that only understanding the pure love of Christ can bring. As Salaam Alaikum

I think your story is amazing. I appreciate you sharing it with us.

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:27 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:16 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:12 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:05 pm
Ah so a spoiled rich kid. No wonder you felt you could beat up some random dude. Obviously your parents didn't teach you no proper fetchen up. So no they weren't "awesome" people-they raised a spoiled brat and didn't do anything to curb it.

My goodness man, you have some serious problems.

Perhaps. But hatred and bigotry are not among them.

It's so fascinating to me; when you were younger you thought you were better than others and now you still think you are better than others because you have no hatred and bigotry.

I don't think you learned a thing. Go on proclaiming how great and awesome and marvelous you are because you don't have hate and bigotry and how you can look down on others who do.

ROFLOL . . .too funny.

You are right. Having seen pure hatred first hand and having acted on that pure hatred (ignorance) and then having to lose a good part of my life and see family and friends lose a LONG part of their life because of their hatred I can say without a doubt that those who do not hate are better than those who do. Am I a better person now that I try not to hate than I was when I hated everyone and everything to the point that I would kill someone for who they were? Absolutely! How can you argue against that? I hope your hate never gets that bad. I hope you can see people for who they really are and not some stereotype. I hope you never get to experience the ugly side of humanity. I hope you can continue to enjoy a calm and easy life where you don't have anything better to worry about than someone else's sexuality. Above all I hope you and others like you can find peace. Real peace. The kind of peace that only understanding the pure love of Christ can bring. As Salaam Alaikum

farmerchick wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 4:25 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:27 pm

alurker wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:16 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:12 pm

Perhaps. But hatred and bigotry are not among them.

It's so fascinating to me; when you were younger you thought you were better than others and now you still think you are better than others because you have no hatred and bigotry.

I don't think you learned a thing. Go on proclaiming how great and awesome and marvelous you are because you don't have hate and bigotry and how you can look down on others who do.

ROFLOL . . .too funny.

You are right. Having seen pure hatred first hand and having acted on that pure hatred (ignorance) and then having to lose a good part of my life and see family and friends lose a LONG part of their life because of their hatred I can say without a doubt that those who do not hate are better than those who do. Am I a better person now that I try not to hate than I was when I hated everyone and everything to the point that I would kill someone for who they were? Absolutely! How can you argue against that? I hope your hate never gets that bad. I hope you can see people for who they really are and not some stereotype. I hope you never get to experience the ugly side of humanity. I hope you can continue to enjoy a calm and easy life where you don't have anything better to worry about than someone else's sexuality. Above all I hope you and others like you can find peace. Real peace. The kind of peace that only understanding the pure love of Christ can bring. As Salaam Alaikum

Are you blaming yourself for your hatred of others in your younger life..or the church...or what exactly? I can tell you I respect all people in all walks of life......But I don't want to know about sexual proclivities of others at church.....why would I care to know? Why would you care to know? Why can't we all agree that homosexual relations have no place in my Sunday school lesson? I don't want to hate anyone...i want to trudge on my individual path to hopefully exaltation without the baggage of someone else telling me about their sodomy desires and I have to listen and accept.......i don't care...has nothing to do with me individually....it does however tear down the family values we hold collectively within our church and taints our future as a society as we have been warned what will happen to us if we don't follow God's pattern as outlined in the scriptures. .i don't want gays thrown off a building or beaten with rebar or have any other legal repercussions in society in housing or employment...but same sex relationships are not valued the same as hetero sexual relationships in Gods eyes as far as the scriptures tell us...so why are we being indoctrinated at church to accept this? I can be civil to a gay person...i can rent or sell them a home. I can be respectful and decent to them in conversation,, I can employ them...i can sit with them in the pews....i can generally show love to them as a person but that doesn't mean I agree with them or their philosophies/agenda.......the gay agenda isn't just toleration...it's saturation of society to the point that it will be desirable and mainstream......why are some gay people so vocal? It's because they want all of us to affirm their choices in positive ways and if we won't they will make us.....it's a form of societal control being perpetrated by people who are using the gay agenda to infiltrate and change our family structure so our way of life as we have known it in America will be gone... ...the gay agenda is a vehicle used by people in power to divide us and conquer us...to take our personal freedoms, religion, and prosperity away from us......this is so much bigger than just accepting a gay lifestyle.......why because equality is not the goal...it's equity.....it's about destroying the foundation of the western world one person at a time using fair minded tolerant people to do it. And everyone seems to be getting on the bandwagon.....there is no peace in delighting in sin....the plan of happiness is not about Adam and Steve adopting a child and telling religiois people they are better because they worked a work around gods creative powers......homosexuals are being normalized all around us as warm loving human beings....while straight white traditional family Men are abusers of women and children and the environment.....the wholesomeness of family values are obsolete and the new way will be love is love.....who can argue against that? The goal is to change the traditional family structure that allows for liberty to exist and replace it with government who will mandate all things to all people for their own good.... Peace will not be found unless people follow the pattern God set out for us to follow......the storm rages all around us and will be in our home as we continue to listen and embrace the doctrines of men. Hate is one of those doctrines that destroys as you so aptly pointed out......SOOO I guess your story is very instructive.

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 11:53 am

mahalanobis wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:55 am

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:29 am

SPIRIT wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 9:55 am

not what Jesus said -

The master has told us.
Jesus said
27 ¶ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:

28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her
hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Matthew 5

and as far as same-sex attraction.
I don't care what leaders of the church say -
same-sex attraction and being homosexual IS a sin - and is wrong. period.
no matter how much you want to twist it and justify yourself
(like all those that are - do)
I've heard every excuse and justification in the book.

IT'S THE DESIRE IN YOUR HEART - NOT THE ACT.

you don't actually have to do it !
you've already done it, just to desire it. to want it . to think it. it's all in the mind.
to be attracted means you have a desire for it - in this case, for something that's wrong.

Here's my story. 19 years old. Bashed a gay man's head in with a piece of rebar. He spent nearly three weeks in the hospital. I went to the state prison for a little bit as did my cohorts. This "evil," gay man showed up at my trial. Said he forgave me and didn't think I needed to go to prison since I was "just a kid." He was in his mid 40s and he occasionally put money on my books. He kept in touch with each of us and I actually invited him to my wedding three years after getting out. He didn't judge me and he forgave me for what we did to him and his friend. Fast forward to my early 40s. I had done my short time and eventually joined the military. Did 20 years and retired. Even got a commission. Now I'm not sure, I think it was my daughter who let it out to someone in the ward that I had served time in prison. I was immediately relieved of my EQ calling. The bishops secretary asked me to speak in church then said "wait, there's a reason you can't talk." and walked away. I have never been under church discipline yet my "past," somehow makes me "undesirable," and unclean among the pure little Mormons who have never signed. Now I don't understand homosexuality but I can tell you that one man, who had every reason to hate me and despise me showed me and my friends more Christlike kindness and forgiveness than an LDS member ever did. He wasn't evil and diseased. I was the evil and diseased one. Diseased by my blind hatred of people I never really knew. I have come to learn that LDS people are no better than those that they judge. You judge those who you hate and yet fail to recognize your own hatreds. One day you will meet the Savior and you will be embarrassed at the blackness and sick nature of your own hearts. You are not Christ's disciples. You who condemn those you have never met are wrong.

That is Christlike indeed. I'm glad you've been blessed by gracious people, and I'm sorry the LDS members have treated you so. Clearly there are severe cultural/policy issues among the membership.

Here is a question: Do you think that the act of the LDS leadership changing the law of chastity and the doctrine of eternal marriage would:
1) Make the LDS more forgiving/gracious/Christlike?
2) Make the LDS less forgiving/gracious/Christlike?
3) Have no effect on the level of forgiving/gracious/Christlike?

I am of the opinion that going down the woke path will result in option #2. The woke ideology is cult-like in nature and offers no redemption except through ascending through intersectional hierarchies.

Curious to get your thoughts.

First off I don't believe that the current leaders of the church are guided by Christ in any way shape or form. Second, I believe that the church should stick with it's original standards. No. Homosexuals should not be allowed to get married in the temple. Should a celibate and chaste homosexual be allowed to obtain the ordinances in the temple? Absolutely. Just as a chaste and celibate single person should.

Alexander wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 3:05 pm

TrueFaith wrote: ↑November 5th, 2021, 3:57 pm This is from an article posted front and center on LDS.org right now.

"Reach out to individuals who are familiar with LGBT issues to help you learn and understand their perspectives. This could include your stake president, your ward council, other bishops in your area, trusted friends, and members of your ward who identify as LGBT and their families.
...
Remember that what someone feels and how they choose to respond to those feelings are not the same thing. A Gospel Topics essay explains: “The Church distinguishes between same-sex attraction and homosexual behavior. People who experience same-sex attraction or identify as gay, lesbian, or bisexual can make and keep covenants with God and fully and worthily participate in the Church. Identifying as gay, lesbian, or bisexual or experiencing same-sex attraction is not a sin and does not prohibit one from participating in the Church, holding callings, or attending the temple.”
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... s?lang=eng

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Identifying with a lie IS A SIN.

If I accept a man as a woman who simply thinks he is a woman, I am participating in a lie. Plain and simple. "Understanding" them truthfully means that I accept the gender God gave them at birth, not a make-believe fantasy of their own imagination. There is no other definition of "understanding". "Understanding" means arriving closer to truth, what they are pushing makes us understand reality less, not more

Along with the Covid BS they push, this is just as agregious to me. I don’t know how so many can stand being a part of this every Sunday. Every time we participate in lies like this, it puts a burden on our conscience. It's like locking a ball and chain to our ankles putting us into a silent form of slavery.

Peace leaves your life when you carry lies around. Its not a healthy way to live. Joseph taught that the "Standard" of our church was, "Truth". We have abandoned that eternal standard for a temporary potage of deception. It continues to get worse every day, it's becoming so obvious and so disgusting to witness.

"set a more inclusive tone with regard to all of our LGBT brothers and sisters"..."inclusivity"

What are "LGBT members" being excluded from? What does being "inclusive" even mean?

mahalanobis wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 5:06 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 11:53 am

mahalanobis wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:55 am

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:29 am

Here's my story. 19 years old. Bashed a gay man's head in with a piece of rebar. He spent nearly three weeks in the hospital. I went to the state prison for a little bit as did my cohorts. This "evil," gay man showed up at my trial. Said he forgave me and didn't think I needed to go to prison since I was "just a kid." He was in his mid 40s and he occasionally put money on my books. He kept in touch with each of us and I actually invited him to my wedding three years after getting out. He didn't judge me and he forgave me for what we did to him and his friend. Fast forward to my early 40s. I had done my short time and eventually joined the military. Did 20 years and retired. Even got a commission. Now I'm not sure, I think it was my daughter who let it out to someone in the ward that I had served time in prison. I was immediately relieved of my EQ calling. The bishops secretary asked me to speak in church then said "wait, there's a reason you can't talk." and walked away. I have never been under church discipline yet my "past," somehow makes me "undesirable," and unclean among the pure little Mormons who have never signed. Now I don't understand homosexuality but I can tell you that one man, who had every reason to hate me and despise me showed me and my friends more Christlike kindness and forgiveness than an LDS member ever did. He wasn't evil and diseased. I was the evil and diseased one. Diseased by my blind hatred of people I never really knew. I have come to learn that LDS people are no better than those that they judge. You judge those who you hate and yet fail to recognize your own hatreds. One day you will meet the Savior and you will be embarrassed at the blackness and sick nature of your own hearts. You are not Christ's disciples. You who condemn those you have never met are wrong.

That is Christlike indeed. I'm glad you've been blessed by gracious people, and I'm sorry the LDS members have treated you so. Clearly there are severe cultural/policy issues among the membership.

Here is a question: Do you think that the act of the LDS leadership changing the law of chastity and the doctrine of eternal marriage would:
1) Make the LDS more forgiving/gracious/Christlike?
2) Make the LDS less forgiving/gracious/Christlike?
3) Have no effect on the level of forgiving/gracious/Christlike?

I am of the opinion that going down the woke path will result in option #2. The woke ideology is cult-like in nature and offers no redemption except through ascending through intersectional hierarchies.

Curious to get your thoughts.

First off I don't believe that the current leaders of the church are guided by Christ in any way shape or form. Second, I believe that the church should stick with it's original standards. No. Homosexuals should not be allowed to get married in the temple. Should a celibate and chaste homosexual be allowed to obtain the ordinances in the temple? Absolutely. Just as a chaste and celibate single person should.

Re: "leaders not guided by Christ": I'm still studying this out in my mind. I think it's a very mixed bag, at best.
Re: "chaste [same sex attraction] individual to obtain ordinances in the temple": agreed

I think my biggest complaint is that hetero members have no restraint. They start off being "accepting" and "inclusive" and "nice" to practicing gays or celibate SSA people, and literally 30 seconds later they are groaning on an on about how it has shaken their faith that gays cannot be sealed together for eternity. I'm not sure why, but it seems to be a universal trend I've noticed.

I have no problem whatsoever befriending or including sinners of any variety, (as long as they are not a direct physical threat to me or my children), but I feel like I'm alone in my stance to keep the standards the same. So it only amplifies my frustration each time the church leaders move the goal posts while regurgitating woke intersectionality propaganda.

Serragon wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 6:08 pm

mahalanobis wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 5:06 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 11:53 am

mahalanobis wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 10:55 am

That is Christlike indeed. I'm glad you've been blessed by gracious people, and I'm sorry the LDS members have treated you so. Clearly there are severe cultural/policy issues among the membership.

Here is a question: Do you think that the act of the LDS leadership changing the law of chastity and the doctrine of eternal marriage would:
1) Make the LDS more forgiving/gracious/Christlike?
2) Make the LDS less forgiving/gracious/Christlike?
3) Have no effect on the level of forgiving/gracious/Christlike?

I am of the opinion that going down the woke path will result in option #2. The woke ideology is cult-like in nature and offers no redemption except through ascending through intersectional hierarchies.

Curious to get your thoughts.

First off I don't believe that the current leaders of the church are guided by Christ in any way shape or form. Second, I believe that the church should stick with it's original standards. No. Homosexuals should not be allowed to get married in the temple. Should a celibate and chaste homosexual be allowed to obtain the ordinances in the temple? Absolutely. Just as a chaste and celibate single person should.

Re: "leaders not guided by Christ": I'm still studying this out in my mind. I think it's a very mixed bag, at best.
Re: "chaste [same sex attraction] individual to obtain ordinances in the temple": agreed

I think my biggest complaint is that hetero members have no restraint. They start off being "accepting" and "inclusive" and "nice" to practicing gays or celibate SSA people, and literally 30 seconds later they are groaning on an on about how it has shaken their faith that gays cannot be sealed together for eternity. I'm not sure why, but it seems to be a universal trend I've noticed.

I have no problem whatsoever befriending or including sinners of any variety, (as long as they are not a direct physical threat to me or my children), but I feel like I'm alone in my stance to keep the standards the same. So it only amplifies my frustration each time the church leaders move the goal posts while regurgitating woke intersectionality propaganda.

Our language has mirrored that of the critical theorists and intersectionalists.

As an example, we now have "Emblems of Belonging" in our youth program instead of awards for accomplishing something in personal progress or Duty to God. This may not seem like much, but it is a complete shift from awards based on individual merit to awards given because you are part of the tribe. It is a fundamental shift. That we use the language of the wokeists is telling as well.

SPIRIT wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 7:35 pm as I said in my post

it's NOT what it's about - the church and the fake Vax
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=63741

why do I get the feeling that all these TBM - these members that defend their fallen church so much -
(that even some may even work for the church and be sent here to defend it)
Why do I get the feeling that they think what this whole things about -
is about the church's stance on this whole Plannedemic - this FAKE VAX - this KILL SHOT !
like as if this is the only thing that the church could have been wrong on - made the wrong decisions on. lol.
like as if the church has been perfect up until now, but even church leaders are allowed to make a mistake
once in a while. lol.

It's not what it's about ! - the church has been in apostasy FOR YEARS now.
This is just the last straw that broke the camels back.

TrueFaith wrote: ↑November 5th, 2021, 3:57 pm Wrong, wrong, wrong. Identifying with a lie IS A SIN.

Subcomandante wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 7:37 pm

SPIRIT wrote: ↑November 6th, 2021, 7:35 pm as I said in my post

it's NOT what it's about - the church and the fake Vax
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=63741

why do I get the feeling that all these TBM - these members that defend their fallen church so much -
(that even some may even work for the church and be sent here to defend it)
Why do I get the feeling that they think what this whole things about -
is about the church's stance on this whole Plannedemic - this FAKE VAX - this KILL SHOT !
like as if this is the only thing that the church could have been wrong on - made the wrong decisions on. lol.
like as if the church has been perfect up until now, but even church leaders are allowed to make a mistake
once in a while. lol.

It's not what it's about ! - the church has been in apostasy FOR YEARS now.
This is just the last straw that broke the camels back.

How so?

You can start a new thread on this subject if you like.