Could there be a purging of the Church? What do you think??

[pjbrownie]

One thought I had on this was the idea that private study meetings were a big no-no. I remember this.

Well now we have the Internet. It's like a massive viral infection that has gotten into the Church body for good and for ill. It seems like the Church is resigned not to put on lid on that - at least now.

[Stephen]

As events unfold, IMO those who fail to heed the counsel to get food storage are more likely to be the ones in trouble... and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the importance of food storage!

The latest pamphlet from the Church discusses 3-month storage AND "long-term" storage (rather than the previous "1-year supply". That "Long-term" descriptor allows for more than 1 year (IMO), and perhaps that's why the change in wording.

The latest pamphlet tells us that the Lord "commands" us to "prepare every needful thing...so that we may care for ourselves...AND OUR NEIGHBORS...AND SUPPORT BISHOPS AS THEY SUPPORT OTHERS". So how much food and supplies are you going to need to supply everything that you are going to need...and your neighbors...and what you give to bishops to help others! How long are the calamaties and a time of scarcity last? That could be a lot of supplies! So how much to store?...well...that is between you and our God!

[Stephen]

Doctrinally...we know that there WILL be a cleansing of the church...not just that it "may" happen.

Althought there are many scenarios that could play out to cleanse the church...here is some documentation to show that perhaps at least to some degree that cleansing will come because of the LDS being ill prepared for times of scarcity...

In this talk by Ezra Taft Benson in 1973...

http://library.lds.org/nxt/gateway.dll/ ... plates$3.0

Here then is the key—look to the prophets for the words of God, that will show us how to prepare for the calamities which are to come. For the Lord, in that same section, states: “What I the Lord have spoken, I have spoken, and I excuse not myself; and though the heavens and the earth pass away, my word shall not pass away, but shall all be fulfilled, whether by mine own voice or by the voice of my servants, it is the same.” (D&C 1:38.)

Again, the Lord warned those who will reject the inspired words of his representatives, in these words: “… and the day cometh that they who will not hear the voice of the Lord, neither the voice of his servants, neither give heed to the words of the prophets and apostles, shall be cut off from among the people.” (D&C 1:14.)

The thing that is so noteworthy about that is the context. In a talk on preparedness and food storage...he quotes D&C 1:14. I have this talk on a cassette tape in my car. It has a permanent place in my tape deck...and every time I listen to it...that part sticks out...glowing in importance.

In that same talk he points out that...

"For the righteous the gospel provides a warning before a calamity, a program for the crises, a refuge for each disaster......
The Lord has warned us of famines, but the righteous will have listened to prophets and stored at least a year’s supply of survival food."

So the righteous have listened to the prophets...and stored at least a years supply of survivial food. So if a person has not listened and obeyed...then by Ezra Taft Bensons definition...it would follow that they are not "righteous". What then...are they "wicked"? I guess that would be fitting for people that have willfully disobeyed.

Bruce R. McConkie told us that "The wicked and ungodly shall be swept from the Church, and the little stone will continue to grow until it fills the whole earth." http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?v ... &hideNav=1

Ezra Taft Benson was without question talking about a cleansing over the food storage issue as a possible way it may happen when he said...

"Should the Lord decide at this time to cleanse the Church-and the need for that cleansing seems to be increasing-a famine in this land of one year’s duration could wipe out a large percentage of slothful members, including some ward and stake officers. Yet we cannot say that we have not been warned." (Ezra Taft Benson GC April 1965)

[WYp8riot]

LDS Church leaders from central and southern Utah complained of such ``troublesome ideologies'' during a Nov. 13-14 meeting at the Edgemont Stake Center in Provo. Elder Jeppson outlined a profile of dissidents. Stake presidents have used that profile to compile a list of warning signs.

``There is a lot of concern about some things that are going on,'' says Harold Nicholl, one of six Sanpete County stake presidents using the list as a guide for excommunications.

Among activities sounding the alarm at stake houses across the West:
Again this is a Salt Lake tribune article not scripture and not doctirine and not a quote from General conference.

I look at this list and have to laugh...

-- The practice of home schooling. (who has been exed for this? I know Homeschooling families in my ward now in good standing)

-- Having leanings or membership in the John Birch Society. (here the tribune again has tried to smear a good secular organization, who has ever been exed for being a member of the JBS?, When has any church authority stated that members should not be involved with the JBS, which is a good cause)

-- Holding study groups. (I beieve this is a farse also, unless of course as stated it is teaching church doctirine against the teachings of the church etc)

-- An inordinate preoccupation with food storage. (again this is a joke, who has ever been exed for having too much food storage? LOL)

-- Reading doomsday books and other materials unapproved by the church. (this should include the SALT LAKE TRIBUNE which is not approved church doctirine, LOL )

-- People who sell their services of gospel understanding for money. (this may be some truth mixed with fiction, It may be a legit statement, but isn't Deseret book full of such books?)

-- Quoting the exact day of the coming of Jesus Christ. ( If passed as fact and doctrine this could be a concern)

-- Performing temple ordinances outside the temple. (This would be a concern, would it not?)

[WYp8riot]

Doctrinally...we know that there WILL be a cleansing of the church...not just that it "may" happen.

Althought there are many scenarios that could play out to cleanse the church...here is some documentation to show that perhaps at least to some degree that cleansing will come because of the LDS being ill prepared for times of scarcity...

In this talk by Ezra Taft Benson in 1973...

http://library.lds.org/nxt/gateway.dll/ ... plates$3.0

Here then is the key—look to the prophets for the words of God, that will show us how to prepare for the calamities which are to come. For the Lord, in that same section, states: “What I the Lord have spoken, I have spoken, and I excuse not myself; and though the heavens and the earth pass away, my word shall not pass away, but shall all be fulfilled, whether by mine own voice or by the voice of my servants, it is the same.” (D&C 1:38.)

Again, the Lord warned those who will reject the inspired words of his representatives, in these words: “… and the day cometh that they who will not hear the voice of the Lord, neither the voice of his servants, neither give heed to the words of the prophets and apostles, shall be cut off from among the people.” (D&C 1:14.)

The thing that is so noteworthy about that is the context. In a talk on preparedness and food storage...he quotes D&C 1:14. I have this talk on a cassette tape in my car. It has a permanent place in my tape deck...and every time I listen to it...that part sticks out...glowing in importance.

In that same talk he points out that...

"For the righteous the gospel provides a warning before a calamity, a program for the crises, a refuge for each disaster......
The Lord has warned us of famines, but the righteous will have listened to prophets and stored at least a year’s supply of survival food."

So the righteous have listened to the prophets...and stored at least a years supply of survivial food. So if a person has not listened and obeyed...then by Ezra Taft Bensons definition...it would follow that they are not "righteous". What then...are they "wicked"? I guess that would be fitting for people that have willfully disobeyed.

Bruce R. McConkie told us that "The wicked and ungodly shall be swept from the Church, and the little stone will continue to grow until it fills the whole earth." http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?v ... &hideNav=1

Ezra Taft Benson was without question talking about a cleansing over the food storage issue as a possible way it may happen when he said...

"Should the Lord decide at this time to cleanse the Church-and the need for that cleansing seems to be increasing-a famine in this land of one year’s duration could wipe out a large percentage of slothful members, including some ward and stake officers. Yet we cannot say that we have not been warned." (Ezra Taft Benson GC April 1965)

Lets not forget that THE scriptures clearly state in D&C that the Church is under condemnation. Additionally the scriptures clearly state the result of our lack of involvement and allowing secret combinations to get above us.

[Truth will Prevail]

D&C 112

23 Verily, verily, I say unto you, darkness covereth the earth, and gross darkness the minds of the people, and all flesh has become corrupt before my face.
24 Behold, vengeance cometh speedily upon the inhabitants of the earth, a day of wrath, a day of burning, a day of desolation, of weeping, of mourning, and of lamentation; and as a whirlwind it shall come upon all the face of the earth, saith the Lord.
25 And upon my ahouse shall it begin, and from my house shall it go forth, saith the Lord;
26 First among those among you, saith the Lord, who have professed to know my name and have not known me, and have blasphemed against me in the midst of my house, saith the Lord.

Here is a link of Cleon Skousen talking of this event http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfe58j_Cjhc

Also here is a link with John Taylors vision, could this be it??? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwmllaXB ... re=related

Could it be this that causes the seperation, the parable of the 10 virgins being fullfilled the scripture in section 112 of D&C?? John taylors vision, or are we just to ignore all that think its going to happen slowly and people will just leave??? I was told that once somone has the light of the Gospel they can never leave it alone they become just a dark as they were light and this were we get the worst apostates.

Also check out here what Pres Benson says,

" There is a real sifting going on in the church and it is going to become more pronounced with passing of time. It will sift the wheat from the tares, because we face some difficult days, the like of which we have never experienced in our lives. And those days are going to require faith and testimony and family unity, the like of which we have never had."

Ezra Taft Benson, Grantsville Utah Stake Conference, 1 Sept 1974

[ktg]

As Lucifer appears as an angel of light he will deceive even the elect.

Mark 13: 22
22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.


What's your take on "if it were possible"?

I would say this.

There are those that are truly elect, like Prophets and the more humble and faithful saints that the Lord knows will follow his will regardless of Lucifer appearing as an angel of Light. There are those that may think they are elect of God or may aspire to be the elect of God. Those can and in many cases will be deceived.

I think what the scripture means is this. That if the elect did not have faith in Father 100%, that they would be deceived because the false christs seem so good and have supernatural power. What saves the elect is their humility and desire to submit to Father’s will. If they do not have that as part of their core nature, they will be deceived.

This is happening today....

President Brigham Young said: “All who believe, have honest hearts, and bring forth fruits of righteousness, are the elect of God and heirs to all things.”

[NoGreaterLove]

I feel todays topic which we will cover in Sunday School is well timed
http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?v ... ntLocale=0

[Mahonri]

I feel todays topic which we will cover in Sunday School is well timed
http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?v ... ntLocale=0

I agree, but unfortunately I only know maybe one or two who really know what that even means.

[NoGreaterLove]

I think I am wrong about this lesson being for today. Lesson 27 belongs to the Priesthood lesson today. Sorry folks.