Can We Unite and Fight Together? What is it We Agree On?

[Rosabella]

I just had a thought regarding how we can unite... It came to mind that even when it comes to Christianity there is little unity among the countless churches and sects. So the logically answer would be to turn to the one true church if there is one, the one Christ established and put his seal of approval upon. I'm sure we all agree and have a testimony that this is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Now applying that same thought to the Freedom Organizations. There are hundreds and as far as I know the Lord has not established his own Freedom Organization. Is He going to have one "true" freedom organization created? and how will we know which one that is? Or perhaps it already exists? I would argue that it is the LDS Church ("for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem." (Micah 4:2)) though the situation is different, while there's not a specific program focused on Freedom, but the prophets have spoken plenty of times on this topic. After all, the Church is not just about religion (good and bad, sin, repentance, baptism) it's all encompassing over every facet of life. The gospel and plan of salvation is not a Sunday-only plan, it's to be applied in all that we do in life. Even my main freedom-education has come mostly from our very own Prophets and other inspired Latter-day Saints (W. Cleon Skousen, and others). I have come to the same knowledge and understanding simply by studying the words of the Prophets and other LDS' as others have learned by studying people such as Frederic Bastiat, Thomas Paine, Adam Smith, and many of the Founding Fathers.

So, maybe it all comes back to building and further establishing the Kingdom of the Lord and bringing people unto Christ. Ezra Taft Benson counseled us to use the Book of Mormon to combat the false teachings of socialism and other -isms.

Maybe we don't need to create a "unifying freedom organization" - maybe we just need to use our knowledge and love of freedom to bring others into the Lord's Kingdom, into Christ's Church. And also put an end to the infighting and bickering amongst ourselves.

I don't claim to have all the answers but that's something to consider.

LDSConservative

I am in shock right now.....I had written this and was going to post it...when I read what you wrote. I have been pondering this today, this idea came to my mind:

It might be through the Church that things do get united. They may start doing things like they did for Prop 8 if so then the Church will fulfill what Joseph Smith said regarding the constitution hanging by a thread. For if we are unified we can do great works if we are not we can not. The greatest unifying power is the Church and its leaders for they are the voice of God and His will on this earth. As this would happen the wheat and the tares will separate. So it would have a polarizing affect and be a great example to the Christians that feel the same way our leaders do. We will lose members and gain members at the same time. I will continue my work that I need to do and was told to do by the Brethren. We each have different callings, may be Church should be where we Unite. I feel like we each need to pray to know what the Lord wants us to do. We all are part of a bigger puzzle that fits together, but we must be united by Christ and his Church. The Church is calling us to Unite and prepare and share the Gospel even on the internet.

You posted what I was thinking and feeling today........

[gruden]

I agree that many that are not LDS are doing a better job,and that we are going back to prophets of yesteryear. Do you think it may have something to do with the fact that the present ones are being watched so closely? And do you have a suggestion as to what to do?

What do you want to do? What lights your fire? Go and do it.

I'm in the beginning phases of fighting fluoridation in the water supply. I'm developing a plan, and I'm going to start it myself. It's one small part of the tyranny puzzle I feel strongly about, and it cuts to the heart of TPTB's plan to control people.

Don't wait for someone else. Decide on your area of focus, get out there and gather with likeminded people in common ground. The law of attraction does have it's purposes, but you have to get some momentum going first. Moroni had a lot of momentum, and that inspired even more people to jump on a bandwagon already rolling.

[John Adams]

I just keep reading & re-reading President Eyring's talk in the last General Conference. Unity is coming, but based on what we see even on this forum with a lot of like-minded individuals, it isn't going to be easy. Anyway, thanks for the good thread--some good things to think about.

[highfive]

So maybe what we need is a clearinghouse/vetting of different organizations that are effective in getting things done, with info/websites, etc. I'm not much of a joiner, just the church, because I don't trust a lot of other organizations. If people knew what they were getting into, that is was effective, not run by kooks, etc, maybe they would be willing to get involved.

[creator]

What is it we want to accomplish? do we want to start an organization? A petition? I would think we need to start with that. Maybe someone has a vision of what it should look like.

The problem is that we could come up with a huge list of so many things that everyone would want to do, and then we'd also realize there are already so many groups doing that, why add one more group to the pot? I'm not saying that creating an organization wouldn't be a great thing, but we'd definitely need to come up with something different, or rather, something powerful and inspirational that would cause people to pay attention... (and that would bring attention from both sides).

A friend of mine told me that one of the downfall's of the Freemen Institute (started by W. Cleon Skousen) is that because it was so much of a threat the evil doers and because of their (the secret combination) influence and control over many things, many of the Freemen Institute leaders lost their jobs/money and families were broken up and other things. I don't remember the exact details of what happened by my friends family got out as they saw this coming; it eventually led to disbanding of the organization. Perhaps someone on the forum was involved in the Freemen institute?

Also, for anyone that has a suggestion of we "should be doing" - are you doing that now? if not, why not? I realize that there is more strength in unity and organization, but that's no reason to put off what you want to be doing. If you are already doing it, great.

Unity is coming, but based on what we see even on this forum with a lot of like-minded individuals, it isn't going to be easy.

Isn't it amazing? We are all so like-minded yet many of us have so many different opinions on what to actually do. Could it be the Freedom-lover within each of us?

[highfive]

John Adams,

I tend to agree that we are going to have to wait for the Church - We will know that what they ask us to do is inspired. We probably wouldn't subordinate our own ideas to anyone but prophet. And our families won't think we are crazy;)

[lundbaek]

I suspect the present GAs are being watched closely. That is the only way I can account for some if the things they have said and for some of the things they have not said any more.

[creator]

While I do feel strongly, and agree with Bella, that the Church is the organization we should be unified with, and I believe that even in our teaching of the principles of Freedom we can bring others to Christ. (I know of several examples that testify of this)... I decided I should be more specific in answering some questions.

The questions were asked, What is it we want to accomplish? do we want to start an organization? A petition? etc.

Realize, I will answer with what I want to accomplish, though I hope it resonates with others as well.

What is the goal/mission/purpose?

My purpose/goal is to educate others on the Principles of Liberty, and help them awake to the truth of the Secret Combination, so that many more individuals will be found on the Lord's side of the battle for agency and liberty. That's the main goal, is simply to convert others to the truth. A secondary goal would be to encourage individuals and groups to take action to make their community a better place, to establish Zion.

The education would hopefully result in people being able to recognize when something is unconstitutional or not of Christ, but of the devil. They'll be able to hear a proposal, law, bill, etc. and immediately know whether it is unrighteous and violates principle.

The education would also help people to recognize more of the truths within our own scriptures. Everytime I read the Book of Mormon and other scriptures I see things I missed before, because previously I was ignorant to many truths.

What would the organization look like?

It would consist of a council of maybe 6 to 12 people who are the "masterminds" or board members of the organization to provide it with direction and intention.

There would be chapters established in communities. Each chapter would have 3 leaders. They would hold weekly or monthly meetings. The meetings would have multiple purposes: to educate, strategize and take action (this would be determined based on what each chapter feels would be most effective for their chapter/community).

There would be a recommended outline, with information on recommendations for educating on not only the principles of Freedom but also principles having to do with other realms of life that the Secret Combination has control and influence over: Economics, Religion, Health, Media, Politics, etc.

There would be speakers bureaus to enhance the education portion.

Videos would be created as teaching tools to be used to powerfully inspire and convert others to the truth.

That is what my organization would look like. There are many other organizations already doing a lot. If you want to contact your representatives regarding various dangerous bills and be involved at the State capitol, join the Eagle Forum or the John Birch Society. The JBS also does a great deal of educating, and has great videos and The New America magazine which Ezra Taft Benson highly recommended. There's also the Campaign for Liberty (Ron Paul), the Republican Liberty Caucus (for reforming the Republican Party), and many others.

Another thought is that to create an effective organization requires a lot of money. Imagine how high the costs are of running the LDS Church? the costs of the JBS and other larger organizations? Yes, we can do a lot without money, but there is a limit.

I'm not saying this is how it "should" be done, simply that this is one way it could be done.

[lundbaek]

About a year ago as my wife and I were in the last month of our mission at the FH Library i SLC, the question came up what would I like to do as a third mission. My answer was that I would like to participate in a Church program to awaken members of the Church to their responsibility to befriend the US Constitution as commanded in D&C 98:6. I figured that was not going to happen, so I looked for other was to accomplish the same thing. In my case I came up with the idea of running for US Congress for the Constitution Party along with activity in the John Birch Society. These activities provided me many, many opportunities to point out to many members of the Church their responsibility to befriend the US Constitution as commanded in D&C 98:6. Also, a lot of people, LDS and non-LDS became aware of the write-in candidacy of Chuch Baldwin for the Constitution Party and reportedly 1371 people were able to vote for him because I and the CP Chairman alone secured ballot access and publicity for him. The media totally ignored him.

[buffalo_girl]

I heard a man discuss some details regarding the 'rebellion against England' among the Boston colonists. Those in favor of separating themselves from England allied themselves with people they knew and trusted in their own circles. Many such circles were created in various communities. The curious thing about this is that only one or two individuals belonged to more than one such group. Paul Revere was one. Their plans were thus protected.

Certainly, we aren't talking about an underground here, but as a principle which allows for greater security and safety it is one to remember.

[Blip]

Everything/everyone is being monitored and recorded. I think it is a bad idea for you all to communicate here on some things. I would suggest that you get eachother's addresses and come up with some code that only you understand and communicate/shcedule in that way if you are going to start an "underground". You are getting into some messy waters on that and will be treated as a cell if you are not careful. But chances are that everyone will be treated as such anyway. You would need a good front like 'feeding the homeless get togethers'. I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole and like the idea of waiting for church leaders to say something. Any of that activity would attract flies.

[creator]

...and like the idea of waiting for church leaders to say something

You're in luck! They already have said something...

"And now as to the last neutralizer that the devil uses most effectively—it is simply this: "Don't do anything in the fight for freedom until the Church sets up its own specific program to save the Constitution." This brings us right back to the scripture I opened with today—to those slothful servants who will not do anything until they are "compelled in all things." Maybe the Lord will never set up a specific church program for the purpose of saving the Constitution. Perhaps if he set one up at this time it might split the Church asunder, and perhaps he does not want that to happen yet for not all the wheat and tares are fully ripe.

"The Prophet Joseph Smith declared it will be the elders of Israel who will step forward to help save the Constitution, not the Church. And have we elders been warned? Yes, we have. And have we elders been given the guide lines? Yes indeed, we have. And besides, if the Church should ever inaugurate a program, who do you think would be in the forefront to get it moving? It would not be those who were sitting on the sidelines prior to that time or those who were appeasing the enemy. It would be those choice spirits who, not waiting to be "commanded in all things," used their own free will, the counsel of the prophets and the Spirit of the Lord as guidelines and who entered the battle "in a good cause" and brought to pass much righteousness in freedom's cause.

"Years ago Elder Joseph F. Merrill of the Council of the Twelve encouraged the members of the Church to join right-to-work leagues and President Heber J. Grant concurred. For our day President David O. McKay has called communism the greatest threat to the Church, and it is certainly the greatest mortal threat this country has ever faced. What are you doing to fight it?

"'The War in Heaven' Is Raging on Earth Today

"Brethren, if we had done our homework and were faithful, we could step forward at this time and help save this country. The fact that most of us are unprepared to do it is an indictment we will have to bear. The longer we wait, the heavier the chains, the deeper the blood, the more the persecution and the less we can carry out our God-given mandate and world-wide mission. The war in heaven is raging on earth today. Are you being neutralized in the battle?

"'Verily I say, men should be anxiously engaged in a good cause and do many things of their own free will, and bring to pass much righteousness;

"'For the power is in them, wherein they are agents unto themselves. . . ." (D&C 58:27-28.)

Source: Ezra Taft Benson. General Conference Talk - April 1965. Not Commanded in All Things.

And this was only one of the multiple quotes I could list in which a prophet or apostle has specifically told us to do something regarding Freedom.

[ktg]

For the past 2 month's home teaching lessons I put together some information and taught from "The Great and Abominable Church of the Devil", "The Book of Mormon and the Constitution", and the article about which I posted here: http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopi ... =19&t=5975. I think that would be something that all of us could and should do for home teaching and visiting teaching. We've been commanded to warn our neighbors.

D&C 38
41 And let your preaching be the warning voice, every man to his neighbor, in mildness and in meekness.

D&C 88
81 Behold, I sent you out to testify and warn the people, and it becometh every man who hath been warned to warn his neighbor.


I also got their emails and sent them copies of the 3 V.H. Anderson books available for FREE on this site. Hopefully I'll help awaken them. They all seemed very interested. In fact, one of the sisters told us we could stay all night and talk to them.

[Blip]

That is a good answer LDSC. Unfortunetly your group does not appeal to my types. Anyone got a rope? There is bad noose everywhere I turn.

I think it is a noble cause though. God bless you in your pursuits (no sarcasm).

[Rosabella]

For the past 2 month's home teaching lessons I put together some information and taught from "The Great and Abominable Church of the Devil", "The Book of Mormon and the Constitution", and the article about which I posted here: http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopi ... =19&t=5975. I think that would be something that all of us could and should do for home teaching and visiting teaching. We've been commanded to warn our neighbors.

D&C 38
41 And let your preaching be the warning voice, every man to his neighbor, in mildness and in meekness.

D&C 88
81 Behold, I sent you out to testify and warn the people, and it becometh every man who hath been warned to warn his neighbor.


I also got their emails and sent them copies of the 3 V.H. Anderson books available for FREE on this site. Hopefully I'll help awaken them. They all seemed very interested. In fact, one of the sisters told us we could stay all night and talk to them.

Yep! My husband just did his home teaching on the first vision, he testified of its truthfulness and told them how the world has now redefining Christ. He explained that these new ideas that promote world peace and the inner divine are the teachings occult doctrines. He explained what the difference was between Joseph Smith’s Christ and the politically correct “Christ within” From there he was able to talk about the whole conspiracy that Lucifer has, Lucifer’s Plan. They agreed completely and were thrilled to hear it explained the way my husband did. But he came from the spiritual side not the political. This is something good members can recognize as evil. That family now wants to meet with my husband and I to understand more.

We really must understand the whole picture. If we do not recognize the spiritual conspiracy and only focus on the political we will not get anywhere. People do not tend to listen. But it does work the other way. Testify of Christ and the Spirit opens the doors for the rest to be understood. This is a spiritual conspiracy not just political one.

Every person that I have talked with in length and taught the spiritual conspiracy they automatically get the political, it is not even an issue. The only ones that have not gotten it.. are the ones that are holding onto the occult doctrines like the law of attraction. Most of those have actually been people that believe in a conspiracy already…..ironically. They just will not give up their “power” and submit to the will of the Lord. They will not give up the occult part. They think they know more then the Prophet and the rest of the GAs.

[lundbaek]

Around these parts, home and visitng teachers are expected to present the First Presidency Message each month.

[ktg]

Around these parts, home and visitng teachers are expected to present the First Presidency Message each month.

I usually do but my home teacher for the past 14 years, who also happens to be our High Priest leader, has NEVER used the First Presidency Message. I figured I could get away with the same for a few months.

[buffalo_girl]

I just heard the rebroadcast of Dr. Edwin Viera on Alex Jones. He was quite clear about his conviction that since WE are the Government, WE can work together at the local level to implement Constitutional Principles that will re-establish the God given role of government beginning with our individual state legislatures.

The website Committees of Safety offers excellent material and the basic framework to begin the task in our communities:

http://www.committeesofsafety.org/principals/

[lundbaek]

Don't misunderstand me, KTG. I'm delighted you could present the subjects that you did. I wish I could do the same. I occasionally try to broach the subjects of freedom and Constitution after giving the lesson to 2 of my assigned families, but the other 2 are not ready for that yet. I have concluded that there will be practically no interest in freedom or Constitution in our stake unless/until the stake presidency decides to make them an issue.

[Blip]

I have concluded that there will be practically no interest in freedom or Constitution in our stake unless/until the stake presidency decides to make them an issue.

Bingo, That is the only source of orders I would take now. Divinely inspired by God. That is the only thing I put any loyalty in. I won't make the same mistake twice.

[Blip]

I have concluded that there will be practically no interest in freedom or Constitution in our stake unless/until the stake presidency decides to make them an issue.

If they do make an issue out of it then I am sure it comes from the prophet. That is how the chain works. Any deviation is subject to the corruption of man. A beast that I have no faith in any longer.

[lundbaek]

I consider it a tragedy that there will be practically no interest in freedom or Constitution in our stake unless/until the stake presidency decides to make them an issue. The scriptures alone are clear enough on these issues. If one has read and pondered D&C 134:1, D&C 101:77-80, and D&C 98:6 and the Preface to D&C 98, one should not need to be comanded any further. If one has read and pondered the scriptures that deal with the Gadiantons and secret combinations, one should not need further clarification of what's coming down the pike at us for ignoring these admonitons and warnings. If nothing else, it should motivate preparedness.

[NoGreaterLove]

Reading the posts on this subject seems to single out those who do not believe in a certain view of how to properly address the constitution issue as being not valiant, or not in tuned with the spirit, or lacking in their understanding of the scriptures.
I happen to love the constitution and support it with all my heart. Even give my life for it if necessary. However, I do not share the sentiments of some who have alluded to underground movements etc.. I, like you, am very close to my Savior and depend upon the Spirit to guide me. I have never felt it appropriate to sway in the direction you proclaim. So who is wrong here? Maybe neither one of us. But I ask that a fair view be considered when addressing the actions that we on this forum feel is appropriate to take. We all have personal revelation and hopefully are acting in accordance with that revelation. As for me I would offend God if I took the stance that so many on this subject have taken. I do not say you are doing what is wrong, but I know for me it would be against Heavenly Father's will.

[lost ark]

Around these parts, home and visitng teachers are expected to present the First Presidency Message each month.

Wow, do you people do radical things like read the handbook, too?

[firend]

It would be cool to all have a meet. All the people on this forum get together in like Utah or something for a big barbaque and such. make a weekend out of it