Personal revelation and coming home from mission

[Alexander]

Elder S. Dilworth Young said:
“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.”

I was on a mission about 5 months ago, and was out about a year. The Lord impressed upon my mind that it was time for me to come home. The story is a bit complicated, but I was struggling with the mission culture and false teachings we were spreading as missionaries. I was sick of the neglect of the simple doctrine of Christ, and all of the hypocrisy I saw in the church. We were teaching salvation in everything but Christ. I wanted to teach by the spirit and proclaim the gospel. I also fervently dissected the doctrine of Christ in the Book of Mormon. I noticed I had not been born again and received the gift of the Holy Ghost. I was taught by the Lord that most missionaries haven’t either. I wondered about how the lord invited the early church apostles to seek for their “endowment from on High”, the gift of the Holy Ghost, so that they could teach with power. It thought often, Who am I to teach and invite others to receive this gift when I haven’t obtained it myself? There were many other things I was struggling to figure out on my mission. Feel free to ask any questions about it.


After I received the revelation from the Lord to go home early, I prayed for a whole week wrestling with this idea. The lord told me it was for a wise purpose and that I must come home to seek my baptism of fire. I knew in my heart it was right but was troubled of how others would react.

I told my mission President, and it led to me having a discussion with my stake president over phone. My stake president argued that the prophets “say every able bodied young man should serve a FULL time mission”, and he didn’t understand why I would need to go home and that I would not be fulfilling my duty if I didn’t serve full time (but allowed me the choice nonetheless). I ended up coming home early.

I know what the lord told me was true.

Sure the Prophet said to serve a full time mission. Sure it is a good thing. But for many, a full time mission isn’t part of one’s journey. For me, the lord has something else in mind.God knows us and knows what’s best for us. I trust in him.

The things God commands could be unconventional. The things the Lord tells you through revelation, are his commandments and words. We should listen to personal revelation above anything else.

My actions were against the words of the prophet. But my actions were in line with God’s will.

President Romney once said: “I assure you, however, that the spirit of the Lord will never direct a person to take a position in opposition to the counsel of the Presidency of His Church.”

I am here to say this is not true.

[Zathura]

Elder S. Dilworth Young said:
“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.”

I was on a mission about 5 months ago, and was out about a year. The Lord impressed upon my mind that it was time for me to come home. The story is a bit complicated, but I was struggling with the mission culture and false teachings we were spreading as missionaries. I was sick of the neglect of the simple doctrine of Christ, and all of the hypocrisy I saw in the church. We were teaching salvation in everything but Christ. I wanted to teach by the spirit and proclaim the gospel. I also fervently dissected the doctrine of Christ in the Book of Mormon. I noticed I had not been born again and received the gift of the Holy Ghost. I was taught by the Lord that most missionaries haven’t either. I wondered about how the lord invited the early church apostles to seek for their “endowment from on High”, the gift of the Holy Ghost, so that they could teach with power. It thought often, Who am I to teach and invite others to receive this gift when I haven’t obtained it myself? There were many other things I was struggling to figure out on my mission. Feel free to ask any questions about it.


After I received the revelation from the Lord to go home early, I prayed for a whole week wrestling with this idea. The lord told me it was for a wise purpose and that I must come home to seek my baptism of fire. I knew in my heart it was right but was troubled of how others would react.

I told my mission President, and it led to me having a discussion with my stake president over phone. My stake president argued that the prophets “say every able bodied young man should serve a FULL time mission”, and he didn’t understand why I would need to go home and that I would not be fulfilling my duty if I didn’t serve full time (but allowed me the choice nonetheless). I ended up coming home early.

I know what the lord told me was true.

Sure the Prophet said to serve a full time mission. Sure it is a good thing. But for many, a full time mission isn’t part of one’s journey. For me, the lord has something else in mind.God knows us and knows what’s best for us. I trust in him.

The things God commands could be unconventional. The things the Lord tells you through revelation, are his commandments and words. We should listen to personal revelation above anything else.

My actions were against the words of the prophet. But my actions were in line with God’s will.

President Romney once said: “I assure you, however, that the spirit of the Lord will never direct a person to take a position in opposition to the counsel of the Presidency of His Church.”

I am here to say this is not true.

For every Stake President that tells you you're wrong for coming home early, there's a different one that would commend you for it, given the details you shared.

It's best to follow the Spirit. A lot of people think they feel the Spirit when they really don't, so the challenge lies in actually being moved upon by the Holy Ghost, and not just following warm fuzzies and emotions. In the end only really you will ever know if it was the right decision. What I can say is that the things you found in the scriptures regarding the doctrine of Christ is the beginning of a journey that will result in experiences you can't possibly fathom, and other experiences beyond even that. Keep seeking. God asks for only one sacrifice. A broken heart and a contrite spirit.

Here is a post that I want to insert How to Leave Your Sins Behind and Become Clean

The summarized steps without the detail included in the other thread are:

1. Recognize that YOU CANNOT OVERCOME ALONE. You cannot overcome sin, this world is too much for a mortal like you and I

2. STUDY the scriptures, don't read cover to cover. STUDY. Read these over and over each day :

3.. Let those words really sink in. BELIEVE THEM. They are real, they happen in the lives of people TODAY. PONDER THESE WORDS

4.. PRAY. Pray like you've never prayed before.

5. THE TIME WILL COME One of those days, God will hear you. You will ask, and you will receive.

6. Convert your brethren.

7. You are not perfect, you may fall, you will be tempted. IT IS OKAY! God forgives, and forgives and forgives


Good luck on your journey !

[Alaris]

Imagine if Nephi said, "but ... but.... the leaders said don't kill!" Well, he sorta did say this a couple of times didn't he? lol

[Rick Grimes]

What "false teachings" was your mission teaching?

What hypocrisy did you witness in the church that would cause you to go home?

I agree with a good portion of what you wrote with regards to following the spirit and such, but I'm confused when you wrote these statements as to the prelude to your pondering going home.

[Bronco73idi]

Elder S. Dilworth Young said:
“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.”

I was on a mission about 5 months ago, and was out about a year. The Lord impressed upon my mind that it was time for me to come home. The story is a bit complicated, but I was struggling with the mission culture and false teachings we were spreading as missionaries. I was sick of the neglect of the simple doctrine of Christ, and all of the hypocrisy I saw in the church. We were teaching salvation in everything but Christ. I wanted to teach by the spirit and proclaim the gospel. I also fervently dissected the doctrine of Christ in the Book of Mormon. I noticed I had not been born again and received the gift of the Holy Ghost. I was taught by the Lord that most missionaries haven’t either. I wondered about how the lord invited the early church apostles to seek for their “endowment from on High”, the gift of the Holy Ghost, so that they could teach with power. It thought often, Who am I to teach and invite others to receive this gift when I haven’t obtained it myself? There were many other things I was struggling to figure out on my mission. Feel free to ask any questions about it.


After I received the revelation from the Lord to go home early, I prayed for a whole week wrestling with this idea. The lord told me it was for a wise purpose and that I must come home to seek my baptism of fire. I knew in my heart it was right but was troubled of how others would react.

I told my mission President, and it led to me having a discussion with my stake president over phone. My stake president argued that the prophets “say every able bodied young man should serve a FULL time mission”, and he didn’t understand why I would need to go home and that I would not be fulfilling my duty if I didn’t serve full time (but allowed me the choice nonetheless). I ended up coming home early.

I know what the lord told me was true.

Sure the Prophet said to serve a full time mission. Sure it is a good thing. But for many, a full time mission isn’t part of one’s journey. For me, the lord has something else in mind.God knows us and knows what’s best for us. I trust in him.

The things God commands could be unconventional. The things the Lord tells you through revelation, are his commandments and words. We should listen to personal revelation above anything else.

My actions were against the words of the prophet. But my actions were in line with God’s will.

President Romney once said: “I assure you, however, that the spirit of the Lord will never direct a person to take a position in opposition to the counsel of the Presidency of His Church.”

I am here to say this is not true.

Personally I wouldn’t have written this until I have proof of being baptized by fire. Since you think you haven’t been baptized by fire, I would think you would have question what spirit you were hearing.

Matthew 19:12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother’s womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven’s sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

I didn’t serve a mission, I went into the US Navy.

[cyclOps]

I had a similar experience. I was reading my patriarchal blessing which said I would serve the lord and teach the gospel, even if it wasn’t by way of a full time mission (just paraphrasing). I had the same impression that I was supposed to go home. It was definitely hard on my parents. My mission President wanted me to meet with a general authority before deciding to go home. I did so and still decided that’s what I would do. I was getting pushback and felt like I was stuck and backed into a corner. I ended up lying that I was unworthy and made up some indiscretions so they would send me home. I regret going about it that way.

That is the long story made short. I’m only commenting on a similar thing happening to me, not all the other details such as hypocrisy, false teachings that you talked about.

[Zathura]

Elder S. Dilworth Young said:
“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.”

I was on a mission about 5 months ago, and was out about a year. The Lord impressed upon my mind that it was time for me to come home. The story is a bit complicated, but I was struggling with the mission culture and false teachings we were spreading as missionaries. I was sick of the neglect of the simple doctrine of Christ, and all of the hypocrisy I saw in the church. We were teaching salvation in everything but Christ. I wanted to teach by the spirit and proclaim the gospel. I also fervently dissected the doctrine of Christ in the Book of Mormon. I noticed I had not been born again and received the gift of the Holy Ghost. I was taught by the Lord that most missionaries haven’t either. I wondered about how the lord invited the early church apostles to seek for their “endowment from on High”, the gift of the Holy Ghost, so that they could teach with power. It thought often, Who am I to teach and invite others to receive this gift when I haven’t obtained it myself? There were many other things I was struggling to figure out on my mission. Feel free to ask any questions about it.


After I received the revelation from the Lord to go home early, I prayed for a whole week wrestling with this idea. The lord told me it was for a wise purpose and that I must come home to seek my baptism of fire. I knew in my heart it was right but was troubled of how others would react.

I told my mission President, and it led to me having a discussion with my stake president over phone. My stake president argued that the prophets “say every able bodied young man should serve a FULL time mission”, and he didn’t understand why I would need to go home and that I would not be fulfilling my duty if I didn’t serve full time (but allowed me the choice nonetheless). I ended up coming home early.

I know what the lord told me was true.

Sure the Prophet said to serve a full time mission. Sure it is a good thing. But for many, a full time mission isn’t part of one’s journey. For me, the lord has something else in mind.God knows us and knows what’s best for us. I trust in him.

The things God commands could be unconventional. The things the Lord tells you through revelation, are his commandments and words. We should listen to personal revelation above anything else.

My actions were against the words of the prophet. But my actions were in line with God’s will.

President Romney once said: “I assure you, however, that the spirit of the Lord will never direct a person to take a position in opposition to the counsel of the Presidency of His Church.”

I am here to say this is not true.

Personally I wouldn’t have written this until I have proof of being baptized by fire. Since you think you haven’t been baptized by fire, I would think you would have question what spirit you were hearing.

Matthew 19:12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother’s womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven’s sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

I didn’t serve a mission, I went into the US Navy.

Even though he has not experienced it yet, the scriptures are plain and he can take comfort in seeing them as they really are.
Yes, often people don’t see the scriptures for what they are until they’ve had their spiritual awakening, but others shed themselves of unbelief and this allows them to see things as they really are, even prior to their spiritual awakening.

[Robin Hood]

Elder S. Dilworth Young said:
“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.”

I was on a mission about 5 months ago, and was out about a year. The Lord impressed upon my mind that it was time for me to come home. The story is a bit complicated, but I was struggling with the mission culture and false teachings we were spreading as missionaries. I was sick of the neglect of the simple doctrine of Christ, and all of the hypocrisy I saw in the church. We were teaching salvation in everything but Christ. I wanted to teach by the spirit and proclaim the gospel. I also fervently dissected the doctrine of Christ in the Book of Mormon. I noticed I had not been born again and received the gift of the Holy Ghost. I was taught by the Lord that most missionaries haven’t either. I wondered about how the lord invited the early church apostles to seek for their “endowment from on High”, the gift of the Holy Ghost, so that they could teach with power. It thought often, Who am I to teach and invite others to receive this gift when I haven’t obtained it myself? There were many other things I was struggling to figure out on my mission. Feel free to ask any questions about it.


After I received the revelation from the Lord to go home early, I prayed for a whole week wrestling with this idea. The lord told me it was for a wise purpose and that I must come home to seek my baptism of fire. I knew in my heart it was right but was troubled of how others would react.

I told my mission President, and it led to me having a discussion with my stake president over phone. My stake president argued that the prophets “say every able bodied young man should serve a FULL time mission”, and he didn’t understand why I would need to go home and that I would not be fulfilling my duty if I didn’t serve full time (but allowed me the choice nonetheless). I ended up coming home early.

I know what the lord told me was true.

Sure the Prophet said to serve a full time mission. Sure it is a good thing. But for many, a full time mission isn’t part of one’s journey. For me, the lord has something else in mind.God knows us and knows what’s best for us. I trust in him.

The things God commands could be unconventional. The things the Lord tells you through revelation, are his commandments and words. We should listen to personal revelation above anything else.

My actions were against the words of the prophet. But my actions were in line with God’s will.

President Romney once said: “I assure you, however, that the spirit of the Lord will never direct a person to take a position in opposition to the counsel of the Presidency of His Church.”

I am here to say this is not true.

I think you just wanted to quit but needed an excuse.

[Alexander]

What "false teachings" was your mission teaching?

What hypocrisy did you witness in the church that would cause you to go home?

I agree with a good portion of what you wrote with regards to following the spirit and such, but I'm confused when you wrote these statements as to the prelude to your pondering going home.

Things like baptism of water washes away sins, and the sacrament makes you clean. I heard the leadership including an area 70 teach the missionaries that the number of baptisms was the most important thing. We were teaching that salvation is in the temple, and we were denying the power of God. I saw a lot of pride. We would boast in our success as missionaries. We would boast about how our church was best to other people. Service projects (even the ones done by the mission overall) were done without charity and focused on pushing the name of the church out to others, and not to fully help others. Everything had nothing to do with Christ. I read through the Book of Mormon and saw all of the prophecies come to pass in our day in our church. I saw the missionaries put down others from other faiths and mock and laugh at humble Christians. I saw bickering. I saw missionaries leave the beggars on the street and pass them by as if they were nobody. I saw lessons and discussions without the spirit. I saw class separation. I saw missionaries without the gift of the Holy Ghost. I saw humble repentant sinners denied baptism because they couldn’t abandon smoking. I saw self righteousness. I saw idol worship. Pride and prejudice abounded. I saw the Doctrine of Christ was changed and added upon. “All is well in Zion” was the common theme among the mission.

I took all of this in. I struggled for months of heartbreak, and loneliness, and fear until I asked the lord what I should do, and he told me to come home, and seek the baptism of fire.

I left because the Lord told me to, and I can’t deny that.

[Zathura]

What "false teachings" was your mission teaching?

What hypocrisy did you witness in the church that would cause you to go home?

I agree with a good portion of what you wrote with regards to following the spirit and such, but I'm confused when you wrote these statements as to the prelude to your pondering going home.

I’m not speaking for him, but I imagine he’s referring to some of the following that is often taught by missionaries, local ward leaders, and even from the pulpit of conference.

Examples

Water baptism cleanses sin and you are born again as a result of it.Obviously the remission of sins and spiritually rebirth comes by fire and the Holy Ghost, this is easily shown with scripture.

The confirmation automatically results in the reception of the Holy Ghost, and is an Imperceptible experience, and it something you receive over time.

Partaking of the sacrament renews our covenants

We are in need of additional cleansing when we sin, and the sacrament serves as a type of “rebaptism” and cleanses us of sin.

That the signs and tokens and reenactions in the temple themselves are the endowment, that they are the “real thing” rather than symbols and actions representing the actual power we should receive from on high.

Ignorance regarding the role of the Holy Spirit of promise. Belief that a man with authority is acting as the Holy Spirit of Promise. This belief that because a man with authority says some words and performs an action that you are thereby sealed. Church leaders have taught for decades that the Holy Spirit of Promise must ratify any ordinance, independent of any action taken by man, regardless of their authority. Members are ignorant of these deeply important teachings by LDS leaders.

That to seek for visions and angels and other manifestations of the spirit is “dangerous” and sign-seeking


........
No doubt you’ll disagree with me on most or all of them.

Whatever you have to say about it , I intend on being respectful and kind to you, unlike before.

Hypocrisy is obviously something he will have to explain. It exists everywhere, and no doubt most of us are guilty of it from time to time.


Edit:
He answered just before I posted and yeah, he mentioned a couple things I did

[Zathura]

Elder S. Dilworth Young said:
“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.”

I was on a mission about 5 months ago, and was out about a year. The Lord impressed upon my mind that it was time for me to come home. The story is a bit complicated, but I was struggling with the mission culture and false teachings we were spreading as missionaries. I was sick of the neglect of the simple doctrine of Christ, and all of the hypocrisy I saw in the church. We were teaching salvation in everything but Christ. I wanted to teach by the spirit and proclaim the gospel. I also fervently dissected the doctrine of Christ in the Book of Mormon. I noticed I had not been born again and received the gift of the Holy Ghost. I was taught by the Lord that most missionaries haven’t either. I wondered about how the lord invited the early church apostles to seek for their “endowment from on High”, the gift of the Holy Ghost, so that they could teach with power. It thought often, Who am I to teach and invite others to receive this gift when I haven’t obtained it myself? There were many other things I was struggling to figure out on my mission. Feel free to ask any questions about it.


After I received the revelation from the Lord to go home early, I prayed for a whole week wrestling with this idea. The lord told me it was for a wise purpose and that I must come home to seek my baptism of fire. I knew in my heart it was right but was troubled of how others would react.

I told my mission President, and it led to me having a discussion with my stake president over phone. My stake president argued that the prophets “say every able bodied young man should serve a FULL time mission”, and he didn’t understand why I would need to go home and that I would not be fulfilling my duty if I didn’t serve full time (but allowed me the choice nonetheless). I ended up coming home early.

I know what the lord told me was true.

Sure the Prophet said to serve a full time mission. Sure it is a good thing. But for many, a full time mission isn’t part of one’s journey. For me, the lord has something else in mind.God knows us and knows what’s best for us. I trust in him.

The things God commands could be unconventional. The things the Lord tells you through revelation, are his commandments and words. We should listen to personal revelation above anything else.

My actions were against the words of the prophet. But my actions were in line with God’s will.

President Romney once said: “I assure you, however, that the spirit of the Lord will never direct a person to take a position in opposition to the counsel of the Presidency of His Church.”

I am here to say this is not true.

I think you just wanted to quit but needed an excuse.

Perhaps, but only he will ever know whether that’s the case. I don’t care to speculate.

[Alexander]

What "false teachings" was your mission teaching?

What hypocrisy did you witness in the church that would cause you to go home?

I agree with a good portion of what you wrote with regards to following the spirit and such, but I'm confused when you wrote these statements as to the prelude to your pondering going home.

I’m not speaking for him, but I imagine he’s referring to some of the following that is often taught by missionaries, local ward leaders, and even from the pulpit of conference.

Examples

Water baptism cleanses sin and you are born again as a result of it.Obviously the remission of sins and spiritually rebirth comes by fire and the Holy Ghost, this is easily shown with scripture.

The confirmation automatically results in the reception of the Holy Ghost, and is an Imperceptible experience, and it something you receive over time.

Partaking of the sacrament renews our covenants

We are in need of additional cleansing when we sin, and the sacrament serves as a type of “rebaptism” and cleanses us of sin.

That the signs and tokens and reenactions in the temple themselves are the endowment, that they are the “real thing” rather than symbols and actions representing the actual power we should receive from on high.

Ignorance regarding the role of the Holy Spirit of promise. Belief that a man with authority is acting as the Holy Spirit of Promise. This belief that because a man with authority says some words and performs an action that you are thereby sealed. Church leaders have taught for decades that the Holy Spirit of Promise must ratify any ordinance, independent of any action taken by man, regardless of their authority. Members are ignorant of these deeply important teachings by LDS leaders.

That to seek for visions and angels and other manifestations of the spirit is “dangerous” and sign-seeking


........
No doubt you’ll disagree with me on most or all of them.

Whatever you have to say about it , I intend on being respectful and kind to you, unlike before.

Hypocrisy is obviously something he will have to explain. It exists everywhere, and no doubt most of us are guilty of it from time to time.


Edit:
He answered just before I posted and yeah, he mentioned a couple things I did

Yes, all the things you mentioned are a part of it too

[Rick Grimes]

........
No doubt you’ll disagree with me on most or all of them.

Whatever you have to say about it , I intend on being respectful and kind to you....


I appreciate that Stuhura, and I intend to do likewise.

[Rick Grimes]

I understand that people take issue with some of the common mormondoms that are taught for doctrine to newcomers. I dont care for fairy tales either, but did you ever consider this is about them and not about you? New members need milk, not meat. Paul, the apostle, also adjusted his message for his audience and was questioned why he would modify his message. He answered because he wanted to being souls to Christ. He also used that very phrase, "milk" and "meat" of the gospel and how a lot of members could only handle things explained this way. When we are trying to convert others, we need to help them realize the urgency of not delaying the day of their repentance and salvation. Telling them that baptism will "wash away their sins" is a way to illustrate for them what repentance and baptism of water and fire will do for them. They may not be ready to recieve the baptism of fire at the time of their baptism, (few are)but they will NEVER be ready to get it if they dont enter in through the gate of baptism from an authorized priesthood holder.

Many of your objections with regards to these mormondoms, are harmless but arguably helpful for somebody with such a young and tender testimony. I'm not sure why you dont see the utility in urging new members to keep going to church to "renew their covenants" when they will lose all their covenants if they stop attending entirely. We already lose so many right out the gate after they are baptized, what is the harm in making sure we teach the importance of them continuing to attend their weekly meetings, accuracy be damned?

Your other point about missionaries "walking by poor people", is one that has been brought up before. Missionaries are poor and shoukdnt be giving away money they don't have. Even Peter didnt give poor people his scant money reserves but did offer them healing and blessings. I wouldnt suggest that missionaries differ in their approach. It can lead to serious safety issues and future missionaries being put in danger of being kidnapped, ransomed, murdered, etc.. The last thing the church needs is for missionaries to create a perception of "rich Americans" handing out money on the streets. How long do you think it would be before some bad guys wont bet that these Americans must have more money or their family has money?

Maybe the Lord did tell you to go home. By the sounds of your harsh judgements of the efforts of missionaries to bring souls to Christ and their methods, I'm not sure your heart was really in it. Maybe the Lord knew that and told you to just go home so you can work on your own testimony? I hope you do find it and I do sincerely appreciate that you heeded the Lord's admonition before you caused any damage or hurt anybody's testimony due to your own misgivings.

[Bronco73idi]

Elder S. Dilworth Young said:
“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.”

I was on a mission about 5 months ago, and was out about a year. The Lord impressed upon my mind that it was time for me to come home. The story is a bit complicated, but I was struggling with the mission culture and false teachings we were spreading as missionaries. I was sick of the neglect of the simple doctrine of Christ, and all of the hypocrisy I saw in the church. We were teaching salvation in everything but Christ. I wanted to teach by the spirit and proclaim the gospel. I also fervently dissected the doctrine of Christ in the Book of Mormon. I noticed I had not been born again and received the gift of the Holy Ghost. I was taught by the Lord that most missionaries haven’t either. I wondered about how the lord invited the early church apostles to seek for their “endowment from on High”, the gift of the Holy Ghost, so that they could teach with power. It thought often, Who am I to teach and invite others to receive this gift when I haven’t obtained it myself? There were many other things I was struggling to figure out on my mission. Feel free to ask any questions about it.


After I received the revelation from the Lord to go home early, I prayed for a whole week wrestling with this idea. The lord told me it was for a wise purpose and that I must come home to seek my baptism of fire. I knew in my heart it was right but was troubled of how others would react.

I told my mission President, and it led to me having a discussion with my stake president over phone. My stake president argued that the prophets “say every able bodied young man should serve a FULL time mission”, and he didn’t understand why I would need to go home and that I would not be fulfilling my duty if I didn’t serve full time (but allowed me the choice nonetheless). I ended up coming home early.

I know what the lord told me was true.

Sure the Prophet said to serve a full time mission. Sure it is a good thing. But for many, a full time mission isn’t part of one’s journey. For me, the lord has something else in mind.God knows us and knows what’s best for us. I trust in him.

The things God commands could be unconventional. The things the Lord tells you through revelation, are his commandments and words. We should listen to personal revelation above anything else.

My actions were against the words of the prophet. But my actions were in line with God’s will.

President Romney once said: “I assure you, however, that the spirit of the Lord will never direct a person to take a position in opposition to the counsel of the Presidency of His Church.”

I am here to say this is not true.

Personally I wouldn’t have written this until I have proof of being baptized by fire. Since you think you haven’t been baptized by fire, I would think you would have question what spirit you were hearing.

Matthew 19:12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother’s womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven’s sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

I didn’t serve a mission, I went into the US Navy.

Even though he has not experienced it yet, the scriptures are plain and he can take comfort in seeing them as they really are.
Yes, often people don’t see the scriptures for what they are until they’ve had their spiritual awakening, but others shed themselves of unbelief and this allows them to see things as they really are, even prior to their spiritual awakening.

Do you really think I don’t understand this concept? He has implied this in his story. It doesn’t fully answer Tyler’s dealings with the spirit. Im just bringing up the other possibility. I’m not saying he is wrong.

I’m saying, him coming here to talk about his decision to be a quitter before the miracle has come about is like praying loud and proud on the street corner.

[Zathura]

Paul, the apostle, also adjusted his message for his audience and was questioned why he would modify his message. He answered because he wanted to being souls to Christ. He also used that very phrase, "milk" and "meat" of the gospel and how a lot of members could only handle things explained this way.

This is all well and good

When we are trying to convert others, we need to help them realize the urgency of not delaying the day of their repentance and salvation. Telling them that baptism will "wash away their sins" is a way to illustrate for them what repentance and baptism of water and fire will do for them. They may not be ready to recieve the baptism of fire at the time of their baptism, (few are)but they will NEVER be ready to get it if they dont enter in through the gate of baptism from an authorized priesthood holder.

True, the problem I see is that when it's time to shed unbelief, they have a hard time shedding the incorrect teachings they were taught, so in the end it's almost as if it's harder for them to have their sins washed away, because at that point they think their sins already were washed away, and they'll fight and kick to keep those beliefs.

Many of your objections with regards to these mormondoms, are harmless but arguably helpful for somebody with such a young and tender testimony. I'm not sure why you dont see the utility in urging new members to keep going to church to "renew their covenants" when they will lose all their covenants if they stop attending entirely. We already lose so many right out the gate after they are baptized, what is the harm in making sure we teach the importance of them continuing to attend their weekly meetings, accuracy be damned?

I have the same objection. I personally take issue with them taking the liberty to fabricate a new doctrine to basically manipulate people to come to church. There are all kinds of angles you can take to get someone to come, but to make them think they are "renewing" their covenants or they are being "baptized" again is just manipulation. Look, unlike others have said or implicated, I don't think the 12(15) get together and decide together they will purposely blind and manipulate the masses into attending church so that they can get our tithing money. I do think that this whole sacrament covenant renewal thing unintentionally became a tool of manipulation. The usage of a false doctrine to persuade people to come to church who otherwise wouldn't come wouldn't really make a difference to them in the grand scheme of things IMO. I see the "Utility" of it, as you say, but that doesn't make it right. In my opinion.

What does it matter if they attend if inside they are spiritually dead? What good is their covenant if they have not the spirit? The spirit won't have ratified their covenants, so this "Utility" is seeking to protect something that's not even in force.

If taught the pure doctrine of Christ as found in scripture, and taught to seek what the people experienced over and over in the scriptures, then they would be alive, and they would have a proper relationship with God, you won't need any "Utility" to bring them to church.

Do you suppose Heavenly Father left certain parts out of the plan of salvation, or made little white lies to convince us to come down to earth for the greater good? I have a hard time believing he'd do that, or approve of that.

Your other point about missionaries "walking by poor people", is one that has been brought up before. Missionaries are poor and shoukdnt be giving away money they don't have. Even Peter didnt give poor people his scant money reserves but did offer them healing and blessings. I wouldnt suggest that missionaries differ in their approach. It can lead to serious safety issues and future missionaries being put in danger of being kidnapped, ransomed, murdered, etc.. The last thing the church needs is for missionaries to create a perception of "rich Americans" handing out money on the streets. How long do you think it would be before some bad guys wont bet that these Americans must have more money or their family has money?

Maybe there would be all sorts of bad consequences from missionaries giving money to the poor, but IMO, that doesn't matter. I think that King Benjamin's teachings apply in all situations. He pointed out that perhaps we might think to ourselves that this beggar deserves what he has now,maybe he just wasted money on drugs and alcohol. Whatever it is, it doesn't matter. God gives to us freely , something we don't deserve, something we will waste, and yet he gives freely.
Likewise, yes, maybe there will be safety issues, maybe a perception of "rich americans"(This perception already exists, and will never be shed) will exist, but at least we will be doing what God asked us to do, we will be doing for others what God does for us. Keep in mind, this is something King Benjamin taught his people to do in order to retain a remission of sins. Obviously this is all my personal belief, based on scripture and my own experience.

Maybe the Lord did tell you to go home. By the sounds of your harsh judgements of the efforts of missionaries to bring souls to Christ and their methods, I'm not sure your heart was really in it. Maybe the Lord knew that and told you to just go home so you can work on your own testimony? I hope you do find it and I do sincerely appreciate that you heeded the Lord's admonition before you caused any damage or hurt anybody's testimony due to your own misgivings.

I think all Missionaries should have the very thing he left his mission to seek, before they go on a mission. It is the entire purpose of the Gospel. It is the first step to true priesthood power. It's the first experience that gives you an idea of where you're at in your spiritual journey, it shows that you do have unshakable faith in Jesus(2 Nephi 31), obviously the results of unshakable faith will have certain results in the mission field. It is THE source of obtaining a testimony of Jesus. It is the mighty change of heart, the change of your very nature. Again, this will have certain consequences in the mission field.

Was he looking for an excuse to go home? Maybe. This is something he'll be working out with God, and I'm confident that whatever his inner motives , his heart is seeking the right things, and the things he is looking for will come. Everything he's experienced and done will play a role in this. I wish him the best

[Alexander]

Elder S. Dilworth Young said:
“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.”

I was on a mission about 5 months ago, and was out about a year. The Lord impressed upon my mind that it was time for me to come home. The story is a bit complicated, but I was struggling with the mission culture and false teachings we were spreading as missionaries. I was sick of the neglect of the simple doctrine of Christ, and all of the hypocrisy I saw in the church. We were teaching salvation in everything but Christ. I wanted to teach by the spirit and proclaim the gospel. I also fervently dissected the doctrine of Christ in the Book of Mormon. I noticed I had not been born again and received the gift of the Holy Ghost. I was taught by the Lord that most missionaries haven’t either. I wondered about how the lord invited the early church apostles to seek for their “endowment from on High”, the gift of the Holy Ghost, so that they could teach with power. It thought often, Who am I to teach and invite others to receive this gift when I haven’t obtained it myself? There were many other things I was struggling to figure out on my mission. Feel free to ask any questions about it.


After I received the revelation from the Lord to go home early, I prayed for a whole week wrestling with this idea. The lord told me it was for a wise purpose and that I must come home to seek my baptism of fire. I knew in my heart it was right but was troubled of how others would react.

I told my mission President, and it led to me having a discussion with my stake president over phone. My stake president argued that the prophets “say every able bodied young man should serve a FULL time mission”, and he didn’t understand why I would need to go home and that I would not be fulfilling my duty if I didn’t serve full time (but allowed me the choice nonetheless). I ended up coming home early.

I know what the lord told me was true.

Sure the Prophet said to serve a full time mission. Sure it is a good thing. But for many, a full time mission isn’t part of one’s journey. For me, the lord has something else in mind.God knows us and knows what’s best for us. I trust in him.

The things God commands could be unconventional. The things the Lord tells you through revelation, are his commandments and words. We should listen to personal revelation above anything else.

My actions were against the words of the prophet. But my actions were in line with God’s will.

President Romney once said: “I assure you, however, that the spirit of the Lord will never direct a person to take a position in opposition to the counsel of the Presidency of His Church.”

I am here to say this is not true.

Personally I wouldn’t have written this until I have proof of being baptized by fire. Since you think you haven’t been baptized by fire, I would think you would have question what spirit you were hearing.

Matthew 19:12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother’s womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven’s sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

I didn’t serve a mission, I went into the US Navy.

Even though he has not experienced it yet, the scriptures are plain and he can take comfort in seeing them as they really are.
Yes, often people don’t see the scriptures for what they are until they’ve had their spiritual awakening, but others shed themselves of unbelief and this allows them to see things as they really are, even prior to their spiritual awakening.

Do you really think I don’t understand this concept? He has implied this in his story. It doesn’t fully answer Tyler’s dealings with the spirit. Im just bringing up the other possibility. I’m not saying he is wrong.

I’m saying, him coming here to talk about his decision to be a quitter before the miracle has come about is like praying loud and proud on the street corner.

Just trying to understand what you’re saying. This is what I understand so far, and correct me if I’m wrong.

I see you say there is a possibility that I was deceived by an evil spirit, because I won’t know for sure until I receive my baptism of fire? Because what the Lord told me is different that what church leaders have said, I could be wrong?

You call me a quitter and say I’m boasting?

[Zathura]

We already lose so many right out the gate after they are baptized, what is the harm in making sure we teach the importance of them continuing to attend their weekly meetings, accuracy be damned?

Although I personally think there's harm in doing this...

THANK YOU for not pretending this is a doctrine found in the scriptures and just being honest about it. THANK YOU

[Alexander]

I want to make it clear that the hard events of my mission were not an excuse to come home. I would have stayed out there and struggled a whole other year, or however long if that was what the Lord wanted. In fact, it was only a few months into my mission that I was questioning staying out. I asked and the Lord told me to stay, and that he would tell me when my “time here was over.” It wasn’t until a year out that the Lord told me it was time.

I was using this post to explain my story, to just let things out that have been bottled up so long, and to show what I understand in terms of following the spirit.

[johnBob]

I want to make it clear that the hard events of my mission were not an excuse to come home. I would have stayed out there and struggled a whole other year, or however long if that was what the Lord wanted. In fact, it was only a few months into my mission that I was questioning staying out. I asked and the Lord told me to stay, and that he would tell me when my “time here was over.” It wasn’t until a year out that the Lord told me it was time.

I was using this post to explain my story, to just let things out that have been bottled up so long, and to show what I understand in terms of following the spirit.

The older I get the more I become convinced most people don't have a clue when God is talking to them or when they are really hearing themselves or when they hear other spirits.

I hear and see so many people saying things like the above but just switch out the context-it could be anything from "God told me to divorce my wife" to "God told me to start dating the same-sex".

I'm not convinced you have the slightest clue of when God is talking to you and when He's not.

Quite frankly, if you are/were so convinced it was God talking to you-you wouldn't need to come anonymously on some internet website looking for support that it really was God talking to you. If it was God talking to you-you won't need to "let things out that have been bottled up so long" and to "show you understand" following the "spirit".

Why are you looking for validation and support in random strangers who know nothing of you. If it really was God talking to you (which it wasn't), you'd have the self-confidence to know and you'd never need to proselytize your abnormal experience by trying to make it appear as you really are some righteous dude who knows Gods will in order to justify your behavior in quitting a mission.

[Alexander]

I want to make it clear that the hard events of my mission were not an excuse to come home. I would have stayed out there and struggled a whole other year, or however long if that was what the Lord wanted. In fact, it was only a few months into my mission that I was questioning staying out. I asked and the Lord told me to stay, and that he would tell me when my “time here was over.” It wasn’t until a year out that the Lord told me it was time.

I was using this post to explain my story, to just let things out that have been bottled up so long, and to show what I understand in terms of following the spirit.

The older I get the more I become convinced most people don't have a clue when God is talking to them or when they are really hearing themselves or when they hear other spirits.

I hear and see so many people saying things like the above but just switch out the context-it could be anything from "God told me to divorce my wife" to "God told me to start dating the same-sex".

I'm not convinced you have the slightest clue of when God is talking to you and when He's not.

Quite frankly, if you are/were so convinced it was God talking to you-you wouldn't need to come anonymously on some internet website looking for support that it really was God talking to you.

I wasn’t asking for support or other people’s opinion to know if the Lord truly spoke to me. I came to share an example.My point was that the Lord’s commands could be unconventional at times and that we should always do what the Lord tells you to do.

I am not setting myself above you. I am not saying I am more righteous than you. I am not bragging. This post was for your benefit, not mine.

[johnBob]

Much of what you've said about a baptism of fire is true-yet God wouldn't send you home from a mission; he'd tell you to help others while you are on a mission.

Nope-something(s) happened on your mission to which you said-I'm done. And then you asked God, "I'm done, I want to go home", and you believe God said "yeap, sure, go home, quit being a missionary in a foreign land". Nah, I don't buy it-your story does not fall in-line with the pattern of righteous people who have talked to God and understand His voice.

[johnBob]

I want to make it clear that the hard events of my mission were not an excuse to come home. I would have stayed out there and struggled a whole other year, or however long if that was what the Lord wanted. In fact, it was only a few months into my mission that I was questioning staying out. I asked and the Lord told me to stay, and that he would tell me when my “time here was over.” It wasn’t until a year out that the Lord told me it was time.

I was using this post to explain my story, to just let things out that have been bottled up so long, and to show what I understand in terms of following the spirit.

The older I get the more I become convinced most people don't have a clue when God is talking to them or when they are really hearing themselves or when they hear other spirits.

I hear and see so many people saying things like the above but just switch out the context-it could be anything from "God told me to divorce my wife" to "God told me to start dating the same-sex".

I'm not convinced you have the slightest clue of when God is talking to you and when He's not.

Quite frankly, if you are/were so convinced it was God talking to you-you wouldn't need to come anonymously on some internet website looking for support that it really was God talking to you.

I wasn’t asking for support or other people’s opinion to know if the Lord truly spoke to me. I came to share an example.My point was that the Lord’s commands could be unconventional at times and that we should always do what the Lord tells you to do.

I am not setting myself above you. I am not saying I am more righteous that you. I am not bragging. This post was for your benefit, not mine.

Do you even hear yourself?

"I'm not setting myself above you"
"This post was for your benefit, not mine"
"I came to share an example" (i.e. I know better than you).

[johnBob]

I want to make it clear that the hard events of my mission were not an excuse to come home. I would have stayed out there and struggled a whole other year, or however long if that was what the Lord wanted. In fact, it was only a few months into my mission that I was questioning staying out. I asked and the Lord told me to stay, and that he would tell me when my “time here was over.” It wasn’t until a year out that the Lord told me it was time.

I was using this post to explain my story, to just let things out that have been bottled up so long, and to show what I understand in terms of following the spirit.

The older I get the more I become convinced most people don't have a clue when God is talking to them or when they are really hearing themselves or when they hear other spirits.

I hear and see so many people saying things like the above but just switch out the context-it could be anything from "God told me to divorce my wife" to "God told me to start dating the same-sex".

I'm not convinced you have the slightest clue of when God is talking to you and when He's not.

Quite frankly, if you are/were so convinced it was God talking to you-you wouldn't need to come anonymously on some internet website looking for support that it really was God talking to you.

I wasn’t asking for support or other people’s opinion to know if the Lord truly spoke to me. I came to share an example.My point was that the Lord’s commands could be unconventional at times and that we should always do what the Lord tells you to do.

I am not setting myself above you. I am not saying I am more righteous than you. I am not bragging. This post was for your benefit, not mine.

Right and I'm sure the next thing I'll hear from some other joker who believes "God" spoke to them by giving them an "unconventional" command is that it's cool for 2 men to date and get married.

Please . . . I don't think so.

[darknesstolight]

I want to make it clear that the hard events of my mission were not an excuse to come home. I would have stayed out there and struggled a whole other year, or however long if that was what the Lord wanted. In fact, it was only a few months into my mission that I was questioning staying out. I asked and the Lord told me to stay, and that he would tell me when my “time here was over.” It wasn’t until a year out that the Lord told me it was time.

I was using this post to explain my story, to just let things out that have been bottled up so long, and to show what I understand in terms of following the spirit.

The older I get the more I become convinced most people don't have a clue when God is talking to them or when they are really hearing themselves or when they hear other spirits.

I hear and see so many people saying things like the above but just switch out the context-it could be anything from "God told me to divorce my wife" to "God told me to start dating the same-sex".

I'm not convinced you have the slightest clue of when God is talking to you and when He's not.

Quite frankly, if you are/were so convinced it was God talking to you-you wouldn't need to come anonymously on some internet website looking for support that it really was God talking to you. If it was God talking to you-you won't need to "let things out that have been bottled up so long" and to "show you understand" following the "spirit".

Why are you looking for validation and support in random strangers who know nothing of you. If it really was God talking to you (which it wasn't), you'd have the self-confidence to know and you'd never need to proselytize your abnormal experience by trying to make it appear as you really are some righteous dude who knows Gods will in order to justify your behavior in quitting a mission.

So, tell me in positive, clear, and in plain terms how you know God is talking to you?

...