The problem with near-death experiences is that it mimics prophecy

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Trucker
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The problem with near-death experiences is that it mimics prophecy

Post by Trucker »

...without it actually needing to be prophecy. An individual can just "report what they saw" and pass it on the others, yet if the same person claimed to have seen a vision or had been visited by an angel, not many people would believe it. So nowadays you can claim to have an NDE and people will not automatically reject it, and so then you can insert all sorts of doctrine and teachings along with the NDE.

I would argue that NDEs should be treated like prophecy. We can test it, not just through praying about it, but by seeing if what they say comes to pass.

"21 And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the Lord hath not spoken?
22 When a prophet speaketh in the name of the Lord, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him."

Deuteronomy 18:21-22

Pretty simple. But sometimes the NDEs have no fixed date, or it's just continually sometime in the future.

This doesn't mean an individual can't prophecy, but it does mean you don't get a pass at evaluation just because it was an NDE. You also don't get a pass if you play the victim, that everyone is being so mean to you because of your message. That doesn't mean people can be rude, but it doesn't mean your message can't be criticized, either.

The Lord's pattern of revelation is through more then one witness:

"28 And now, behold, I give unto you, and also unto my servant Joseph, the keys of this gift, which shall bring to light this ministry; and in the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established."
D&C 6:28

Most revelation we have in the church from Joseph Smith came from Joseph Smith plus at least one other person: baptism (Oliver Cowdery), Aaronic Priesthood (Oliver Cowdery), Melchizedek Priesthood (Olivery Cowdery), Book of Mormon and Bible translations (Olivery Cowdery translated a little, several others were scribes), vision of the kingdom's of glory (Martin Harris with several others in the room), all the visits of angels in the Kirtland Temple (Oliver Cowdery). In fact, the doctrines we have that may be problematic in the church pretty much all come from individual revelators. The Lord's pattern provides multiple witnesses.

Multiple believers is ok, but that's not the same as multiple witnesses. There may be multiple people who say they believe a person who prophesied, but that's not the same as multiple other people saying they were there or saw for themselves the things that were prophecied. The Lord's pattern if multiple witnesses, so we should expect that.

It seems to me the way to get a following today as a spiritual leader in the Mormon community it to claim to have an NDE. People don't scrutinize the claims as much as they should. And it opens the door to insert all sorts of doctrine to too many people accept.

Trucker
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Re: The problem with near-death experiences is that it mimics prophecy

Post by Trucker »

...also sincerity does not equal truth. Just because a person really believes something doesn't make it true. People sometimes think they are so honest, pure, with good intentions, that if they believe something it must be true, and anyone who doesn't believe is attacking their character, and must be deceived or afraid.

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Thinker
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Re: The problem with near-death experiences is that it mimics prophecy

Post by Thinker »

No 2 people see anything - including spirituality - the same way. Think of spiritual dreams - they are sifted through the person’s unique subconscious filter. The way God speaks to us - is very personal. True that “God is no respector of persons” and loves all, “But even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: ye are of more value than many sparrows.”

This also is a reminder of the warning given in the opening of the Book of Mormon - that if you find fault in the writings, blame the fallible writers/editors/translators - not God.
  • "Search the scriptures, search the prophets, and learn what portion of them belongs to you." - Joseph Smith
That pretty much applies to everything. In this “too-much-information-age,” it is imperative to be selective and discern reasonably and spiritually personal vs universal truth.. from personal vs universal error. :)

Still. I and others have often found great comfort and faith in learning about others’ NDE’s. Last night, a friend was really sad, grieving the relatively recent loss of her mother, sister and husband. Besides trying to be there for her, I sent her this simple but reassuring story of a NDE (starts about 7:00)... and she said it helped.

Enlightenment
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Re: The problem with near-death experiences is that it mimics prophecy

Post by Enlightenment »

Howard Storm has quite a few interviews online. This is probably one of the longer ones but I really like the depth of questions the interview gives Howard on this one. It is 3 hours but it is really good. I think the last hour if I remember right is the interviewers own thoughts so you can skip that.

https://youtu.be/6G5UDCFSOTc

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BruceRGilbert
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Location: Near the "City of Trees," Idaho

Re: The problem with near-death experiences is that it mimics prophecy

Post by BruceRGilbert »

The significance of this N.D.E. is astounding in terms of its implications because of its conversion power for 1.) the "non-believer" who experienced it, 2.) the testimony of a scientist and 3.) the significance of a "grain" of intelligence. We, you and I, are comprised of many "intelligences" that are joined together to comprise who we are - each "singularity" having the "germ" of the whole.

JohnnyL
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Re: The problem with near-death experiences is that it mimics prophecy

Post by JohnnyL »

I've found most of them to be lacking, and in fact, when you preach half truths, it usually hurts more than helps. And I've seen it with all the people who run after the people that preach them.

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