All is Well in Zion

[Luke]

Decided to check date of the posted image, and an amazing number appeared:
https://www.google.com/search?q=city+cr ... =659&dpr=2

Chrome is my goto browser for photo stuff. Said amazing number appears on Safari too, but not brave.

Right edge above the fold , but not left of center. gbng

Anyone confirm

I have no idea what you're talking about. Any chance of some clarification?

I think they're talking about City Creek Mall.

Weird that unique visitor count matched up with date marking end of seven years prosperity. Prolly should check correlation with City Creek Mall. But really, how did Joseph account his prosperity?

Eclipse matchups coincided with the standing prophets last birthday, and many other manifestations, have squoze personal doubt to infinitesimal proportions..

Squeeze , but not squoze. dbnp

When is the date marking the end of seven years prosperity?

[BeNotDeceived]

I have no idea what you're talking about. Any chance of some clarification?

I think they're talking about City Creek Mall.

Weird that unique visitor count matched up with date marking end of seven years prosperity. Prolly should check correlation with City Creek Mall. But really, how did Joseph account his prosperity?

Eclipse matchups coincided with the standing prophets last birthday, and many other manifestations, have squoze personal doubt to infinitesimal proportions..

Squeeze , but not squoze. dbnp

When is the date marking the end of seven years prosperity?

The end is about to begin 24,48.
Seek 7yrs prosperity , but not insincerely. dbnp

[darknesstolight]

I think there are three types, with varying degrees in each:
All is well: they think it really is pretty good. Life is good, church is good, don't work too hard unless it's fun.
All is wrong: ever since JS/BY/[pick your prophet], the apostles aren't in touch with God, aren't wise stewards, twist things, are hypocritical, don't hold the priesthood keys, etc.
All is what it is: trust the prophets, but be careful with other members (types 1 and 2) and the world; be meek and humble; work hard on your salvation; things will work out.

I think that both the first and third types are what Nephi is trying to warn us against.

2 Nephi 9:14-16
Therefore will the Lord cut off from Israel head and tail, branch and rush in one day.
The ancient, he is the head; and the prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail.
For the leaders of this people cause them to err; and they that are bled of them are destroyed.

Nephi is talking about the folks who believe that they are God's most special people whom he will never allow to be led astray, and who close their eyes to all the evidence that the men at the top are compromising their standards, becoming more wordly, and failing to warn their followers of the wrath to come.

"things will work out" - whatever the hell that means - is just a dumber way of saying "all is well."

Absolutely not. We are warned about the first and second, and told to be the third. Otherwise, you don't understand Nephi. Only a third would ever be able to understand him.

Nope, not just a dumber way to say what you think it says. Things will work out for the righteous--a testimony of that will be helpful necessary for the last days.

I think we need to be courageous and stand up for what is right and stand against wickedness no matter where we see it or in what situation. We should have the courage to respectfully disagree with ideas and policies that our leaders may try to implement that are against the principles of Christ. Our leaders should be humble enough to accept sincere disagreements and correction from others.

D2L

[MMbelieve]

I don’t know anyone who is fully “all is well”.

On the surface some may appear this way but once you talk to them, you learn otherwise.

A couple that do not argue or show displeasure in public can be seen as “all is well” but it’s actually just putting on a good face with respectful behavior towards one another in public. Those who support the church and don’t speak ill of it may just be showing respectful behavior yet still have concerns in their mind.

[Juliet]

Well, I think it's a good start to see so many agree things are not well. But going from there, you get a lot of disagreements.

Some people feel people are not having families.

Some people feel the apostles are no longer inspired.

Some people feel the church is misusing tithing.

Some people feel that members are in a cult where people are not encouraged to think for themsleves.

Some people feel the problem is we don't practice polygamy, or that we never should have.

Some people fear we are losing our rights.

Some people fear that some people are not sane enough to have rights.

And of course the craziest belief by someone here on the forum is the idea that someone can be a saint in one personality and a CIA mind controlled programmed assassin in another.

It's bad, but how bad do we want to take this? Bad like the burrito store is open on Sunday? Or bad like Taco Bell is a secret Illuminati center?

[SPIRIT]

I think it must be pretty bad,
if a prophet in the book of Mormon is warning us of the general attitude
that members will have, that "All is well in Zion", and that "the devil cheateth their souls, and leadeth them away carefully down to hell"

2 Nephi 28:21,24,25
21 And others will he pacify,
and lull them away into carnal security,
that they will say: All is well in Zion;
yea, Zion prospereth, all is well—
and thus the devil cheateth their souls,
and leadeth them away carefully down to hell.
24 Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!
25 Wo be unto him that crieth: All is well!

[Matchmaker]

Wilford Woodruff, while serving in the Quorum of the Twelve, said: “Brother Joseph used to counsel us in this wise: ‘The moment you permit yourselves to lay aside any duty that God calls you to perform, to gratify your own desires; the moment you permit yourselves to become careless, you lay a foundation for apostasy. Be careful; understand you are called to a work, and when God requires you to do that work do it.’

Too bad he didn't take his own advice.

Please explain further. I sense that you know something that I don't that is important. Please share.

[Mindfields]

Wilford Woodruff was a polygamist. I find it ironic that he tells others that "to gratify your own desires" will lead to apostasy all the while committing, in my opinion, adultery on a grand scale.

[lundbaek]

My interpretation of the expression "All is well in Zion" is that those who believe it think that:

Most LDS Church members are active in their various callings, paying a full tithe, are temple worthy, studying their "Come Follow Me..." lessons, and obeying ALL the commandments that God has given us.

The forces of evil are being held in check and not instigating evil among the Latter-day Saints.

What have I missed?

[SPIRIT]

2 Nephi 28

24 Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!
25 Wo be unto him that crieth: All is well!
26 Yea, wo be unto him that hearkeneth unto the precepts of men, and denieth the power of God, and the gift of the Holy Ghost!
27 Yea, wo be unto him that saith: We have received, and we need no more!
28 And in fine, wo unto all those who tremble, and are angry because of the truth of God! For behold, he that is built upon the rock receiveth it with gladness; and he that is built upon a sandy foundation trembleth lest he shall fall.
29 Wo be unto him that shall say: We have received the word of God, and we need no more of the word of God, for we have enough!
30 For behold, thus saith the Lord God: I will give unto the children of men line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little and there a little; and blessed are those who hearken unto my precepts, and lend an ear unto my counsel, for they shall learn wisdom; for unto him that receiveth I will give more; and from them that shall say, We have enough, from them shall be taken away even that which they have.
31 Cursed is he that putteth his trust in man, or maketh flesh his arm, or shall hearken unto the precepts of men, save their precepts shall be given by the power of the Holy Ghost.
32 Wo be unto the Gentiles, saith the Lord God of Hosts! For notwithstanding I shall lengthen out mine arm unto them from day to day, they will deny me; nevertheless, I will be merciful unto them, saith the Lord God, if they will repent and come unto me; for mine arm is lengthened out all the day long, saith the Lord God of Hosts.

Isaiah 29:9,10,13,
9 Stay yourselves, and wonder; cry ye out, and cry: they are drunken, but not with wine; they stagger, but not with strong drink.

10 For the Lord hath poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and hath closed your eyes: the prophets and your rulers, the seers hath he covered.

13 Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:

D&C 45:28-31
28 And when the times of the Gentiles is come in, a light shall break forth among them that sit in darkness,
and it shall be the fulness of my gospel;

29 BUT THEY RECEIVE IT NOT;
for they perceive not the light, and they turn their hearts from me because of the precepts of men.

30 And in that generation shall the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

[Matchmaker]

Wilford Woodruff was a polygamist. I find it ironic that he tells others that "to gratify your own desires" will lead to apostasy all the while committing, in my opinion, adultery on a grand scale.

But in this instance, he is doing it at the command of the Lord and not because of his own lust for other women.

[righteousrepublic]

If Zion is the pure in heart does it even exist? How many people are pure in heart anyway? What does it take to be pure in heart?
Or are there two Zions?

[Believing Joseph]

My interpretation of the expression "All is well in Zion" is that those who believe it think that:

Most LDS Church members are active in their various callings, paying a full tithe, are temple worthy, studying their "Come Follow Me..." lessons, and obeying ALL the commandments that God has given us.

The forces of evil are being held in check and not instigating evil among the Latter-day Saints.

What have I missed?

I think that's a pretty fair interpretation of the phrase.

Granted, all but the last of your statements can be true without saying much in favor of our spiritual condition. You can be active in your calling, pay a full tithe, be temple worthy, study your "Come Follow Me" lessons, and still be a bad Christian. You just have to be like this guy:

Luke 18:10-12
Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess....

It seems fairly straightforward to me: Some forms of religion attract lukewarm followers. Just do what you're told to do: Go to the temple, pay your tithing, and make a point of avoiding a few prominent sins like adultery. It's actually quite easy to live a prideful, materialistic, and frivolous life within the constraints of any major religion, Mormonism included.

Sometimes when people realize that, they complain that we need even more rules, but they're missing the point. Make any set of worthiness protocalls you want, and people will still find a way to conform even though their heart is in the wrong place.

As for the last item, "obeying ALL the commandments that God has given us," well, if you think that ever described us, you've got another think coming.

[righteousrepublic]

Wilford Woodruff was a polygamist. I find it ironic that he tells others that "to gratify your own desires" will lead to apostasy all the while committing, in my opinion, adultery on a grand scale.

Aren't you glad it is only your opinion? Opinions are like navels, everyone has one.

[sandman45]

I think there are three types, with varying degrees in each:
All is well: they think it really is pretty good. Life is good, church is good, don't work too hard unless it's fun.
All is wrong: ever since JS/BY/[pick your prophet], the apostles aren't in touch with God, aren't wise stewards, twist things, are hypocritical, don't hold the priesthood keys, etc.
All is what it is: trust the prophets, but be careful with other members (types 1 and 2) and the world; be meek and humble; work hard on your salvation; things will work out.

I think that both the first and third types are what Nephi is trying to warn us against.

2 Nephi 19:14-16
Therefore will the Lord cut off from Israel head and tail, branch and rush in one day.
The ancient, he is the head; and the prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail.
For the leaders of this people cause them to err; and they that are led of them are destroyed.

Nephi is talking about the folks who believe that they are God's most special people whom he will never allow to be led astray, and who close their eyes to all the evidence that the men at the top are compromising their standards, becoming more wordly, and failing to warn their followers of the wrath to come.

"things will work out" - whatever the hell that means - is just a dumber way of saying "all is well."

It’s Isaiah but Nephi did put them into his record word for word because they were of great worth to the children of men.

From the intro to the chapter in the Book of Mormon
“2 Nephi : Chapter 19
Isaiah speaks messianically—The people in darkness will see a great light—Unto us a child is born—He will be the Prince of Peace and will reign on David’s throne—Compare Isaiah 9. About 559–545 B.C.”.

The meaning is the same and I agree with what Isaiah and Nephi are saying.

All is definitely NOT WELL in Zion

[cab]

My interpretation of the expression "All is well in Zion" is that those who believe it think that:

Most LDS Church members are active in their various callings, paying a full tithe, are temple worthy, studying their "Come Follow Me..." lessons, and obeying ALL the commandments that God has given us.

The forces of evil are being held in check and not instigating evil among the Latter-day Saints.

What have I missed?

I think that's a pretty fair interpretation of the phrase.

Granted, all but the last of your statements can be true without saying much in favor of our spiritual condition. You can be active in your calling, pay a full tithe, be temple worthy, study your "Come Follow Me" lessons, and still be a bad Christian. You just have to be like this guy:

Luke 18:10-12
Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess....

It seems fairly straightforward to me: Some forms of religion attract lukewarm followers. Just do what you're told to do: Go to the temple, pay your tithing, and make a point of avoiding a few prominent sins like adultery. It's actually quite easy to live a prideful, materialistic, and frivolous life within the constraints of any major religion, Mormonism included.

Sometimes when people realize that, they complain that we need even more rules, but they're missing the point. Make any set of worthiness protocalls you want, and people will still find a way to conform even though their heart is in the wrong place.

As for the last item, "obeying ALL the commandments that God has given us," well, if you think that ever described us, you've got another think coming.

BJ - Giving your post a simple thumbs up doesn't give it proper credit... So here:

[JohnnyL]

My interpretation of the expression "All is well in Zion" is that those who believe it think that:

Most LDS Church members are active in their various callings, paying a full tithe, are temple worthy, studying their "Come Follow Me..." lessons, and obeying ALL the commandments that God has given us.

The forces of evil are being held in check and not instigating evil among the Latter-day Saints.

What have I missed?

I think that's a pretty fair interpretation of the phrase.

Granted, all but the last of your statements can be true without saying much in favor of our spiritual condition. You can be active in your calling, pay a full tithe, be temple worthy, study your "Come Follow Me" lessons, and still be a bad Christian. You just have to be like this guy:

Luke 18:10-12
Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess....

That's not being temple-worthy, if we're honest about it.

And we miss the biggest problem with "all is well": pride; or, the lack of humility and meekness and gratitude, which leads to an inability to see the lack and needs of others (and ourselves).

[SPIRIT]

I think there are three types, with varying degrees in each:
All is well: they think it really is pretty good. Life is good, church is good, don't work too hard unless it's fun.
All is wrong: ever since JS/BY/[pick your prophet], the apostles aren't in touch with God, aren't wise stewards, twist things, are hypocritical, don't hold the priesthood keys, etc.
All is what it is: trust the prophets, but be careful with other members (types 1 and 2) and the world; be meek and humble; work hard on your salvation; things will work out.

I think that both the first and third types are what Nephi is trying to warn us against.

2 Nephi 19:14-16
Therefore will the Lord cut off from Israel head and tail, branch and rush in one day.
The ancient, he is the head; and the prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail.
For the leaders of this people cause them to err; and they that are led of them are destroyed.

Nephi is talking about the folks who believe that they are God's most special people whom he will never allow to be led astray, and who close their eyes to all the evidence that the men at the top are compromising their standards, becoming more wordly, and failing to warn their followers of the wrath to come.

"things will work out" - whatever the hell that means - is just a dumber way of saying "all is well."

It’s Isaiah but Nephi did put them into his record word for word because they were of great worth to the children of men.

From the intro to the chapter in the Book of Mormon
“2 Nephi : Chapter 19
Isaiah speaks messianically—The people in darkness will see a great light—Unto us a child is born—He will be the Prince of Peace and will reign on David’s throne—Compare Isaiah 9. About 559–545 B.C.”.

The meaning is the same and I agree with what Isaiah and Nephi are saying.

All is definitely NOT WELL in Zion

Isaiah 9

14 Therefore Jehovah will cut off from Israel
head and tail, palm top and reed, in a single day;
15 the elders or notables are the head,
the prophets who teach falsehoods, the tail.
16 The leaders of these people have misled them,
and those who are led are confused.

As in ancient times, the political and ecclesiastical leaders of Jehovah’s end-time people resemble one another. Because of their wickedness, Jehovah “cuts off” both from his presence in “a single day”—his Day of Judgment (Isaiah 48:18-19). Because a people’s leaders reflect what the people are, the leaders’ misleading and confusing “these people”—Jehovah’s alienated people—constitutes an integral part of their punishment (cf. Isaiah 3:12). Most reprehensible in the prophets who represent Jehovah to his people are the “falsehoods” or “lies” (seqer) they teach (Isaiah 28:7; 29:10; 32:6-7).

*note
In Isaiah - "Egypt" is the U.S. - just as anciently Egypt was the superpower.

Isaiah 19

14 Jehovah has permeated them
with a spirit of confusion;
they have misled Egypt in all that it does,
causing it to stagger like a drunkard into his vomit.
15 And there shall be nothing the Egyptians
can do about it,
neither head nor tail, palm top or reed.

Egypt’s ruling elite resemble disoriented persons possessed by a spirit of confusion who lead an entire nation astray, politically and economically. The people’s cumulative guilt has reached its saturation point. Only Jehovah’s judgments can cleanse the nation of its wickedness and idolatry (v 3). The motifs of a “drunkard” who “staggers” into his “vomit” link the nation of Egypt to Jehovah’s people of the tribe of Ephraim and to Ephraim’s intoxicated prophets (Isaiah 28:1, 3, 7-8; 56:10-12). The “head” and “tail,” “palm top” and “reed” allude to the people’s leaders (Isaiah 7:8-9; 9:14-15; 36:6).

[buffalo_girl]

I suspect the best any of us can do to correct the "all is well in Zion" mentality is rely on the Holy Spirit to guide and prompt at any given moment in our conversations with others. I don't suggest we 'list' the more obvious failures and grievances in our religious communities, but rather - when the occasion arises on a more intimate basis - to offer a different perspective which may or may not help correct some commonly rampant conceits.

For some purpose only the Lord knows, my life experiences have not allowed me to develop a sense of entitlement or a straight path to spiritual and temporal success either for myself personally or for my family members. I certainly do not have many of the wonderful advantages most faithful LDS people have 'earned' and enjoy. In many ways, that has been a true blessing in that I often see things differently than other folks.

At the same time, that 'perspective' and lack of temporal standing seem to disqualify me from certain callings. When I do have the opportunity to converse with other members of the church, I like to hear what they are doing and thinking. If I feel prompted to say something based on my experience - which may offer a different way of thinking - I say it. These contributions to the dialogue are often delivered with the help & power of the Holy Spirit. I say that, not to boast, but to suggest we can make a difference on a personal basis to those within our sphere of influence, and upon whom we may well need to rely in a day of humbling for us all.

The Lord Jesus Christ exercised a keen sense of humor in his dialogue with those who worried about protocol and station. Not everyone 'got it', but I believe some did and were converted to what He called 'The Spirit of the Law' which should - if only we can apply it - get us where He wants us to be.

[cab]

I think there are three types, with varying degrees in each:
All is well: they think it really is pretty good. Life is good, church is good, don't work too hard unless it's fun.
All is wrong: ever since JS/BY/[pick your prophet], the apostles aren't in touch with God, aren't wise stewards, twist things, are hypocritical, don't hold the priesthood keys, etc.
All is what it is: trust the prophets, but be careful with other members (types 1 and 2) and the world; be meek and humble; work hard on your salvation; things will work out.

I think that both the first and third types are what Nephi is trying to warn us against.

2 Nephi 19:14-16
Therefore will the Lord cut off from Israel head and tail, branch and rush in one day.
The ancient, he is the head; and the prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail.
For the leaders of this people cause them to err; and they that are led of them are destroyed.

Nephi is talking about the folks who believe that they are God's most special people whom he will never allow to be led astray, and who close their eyes to all the evidence that the men at the top are compromising their standards, becoming more wordly, and failing to warn their followers of the wrath to come.

"things will work out" - whatever the hell that means - is just a dumber way of saying "all is well."

It’s Isaiah but Nephi did put them into his record word for word because they were of great worth to the children of men.

From the intro to the chapter in the Book of Mormon
“2 Nephi : Chapter 19
Isaiah speaks messianically—The people in darkness will see a great light—Unto us a child is born—He will be the Prince of Peace and will reign on David’s throne—Compare Isaiah 9. About 559–545 B.C.”.

The meaning is the same and I agree with what Isaiah and Nephi are saying.

All is definitely NOT WELL in Zion

Isaiah 9

14 Therefore Jehovah will cut off from Israel
head and tail, palm top and reed, in a single day;
15 the elders or notables are the head,
the prophets who teach falsehoods, the tail.
16 The leaders of these people have misled them,
and those who are led are confused.

As in ancient times, the political and ecclesiastical leaders of Jehovah’s end-time people resemble one another. Because of their wickedness, Jehovah “cuts off” both from his presence in “a single day”—his Day of Judgment (Isaiah 48:18-19). Because a people’s leaders reflect what the people are, the leaders’ misleading and confusing “these people”—Jehovah’s alienated people—constitutes an integral part of their punishment (cf. Isaiah 3:12). Most reprehensible in the prophets who represent Jehovah to his people are the “falsehoods” or “lies” (seqer) they teach (Isaiah 28:7; 29:10; 32:6-7).

*note
In Isaiah - "Egypt" is the U.S. - just as anciently - Egypt was the superpower.

Isaiah 19

14 Jehovah has permeated them
with a spirit of confusion;
they have misled Egypt in all that it does,
causing it to stagger like a drunkard into his vomit.
15 And there shall be nothing the Egyptians
can do about it,
neither head nor tail, palm top or reed.

Egypt’s ruling elite resemble disoriented persons possessed by a spirit of confusion who lead an entire nation astray, politically and economically. The people’s cumulative guilt has reached its saturation point. Only Jehovah’s judgments can cleanse the nation of its wickedness and idolatry (v 3). The motifs of a “drunkard” who “staggers” into his “vomit” link the nation of Egypt to Jehovah’s people of the tribe of Ephraim and to Ephraim’s intoxicated prophets (Isaiah 28:1, 3, 7-8; 56:10-12). The “head” and “tail,” “palm top” and “reed” allude to the people’s leaders (Isaiah 7:8-9; 9:14-15; 36:6).

Are you "I AM"?

[Zathura]

I think that both the first and third types are what Nephi is trying to warn us against.



Nephi is talking about the folks who believe that they are God's most special people whom he will never allow to be led astray, and who close their eyes to all the evidence that the men at the top are compromising their standards, becoming more wordly, and failing to warn their followers of the wrath to come.

"things will work out" - whatever the hell that means - is just a dumber way of saying "all is well."

It’s Isaiah but Nephi did put them into his record word for word because they were of great worth to the children of men.

From the intro to the chapter in the Book of Mormon
“2 Nephi : Chapter 19
Isaiah speaks messianically—The people in darkness will see a great light—Unto us a child is born—He will be the Prince of Peace and will reign on David’s throne—Compare Isaiah 9. About 559–545 B.C.”.

The meaning is the same and I agree with what Isaiah and Nephi are saying.

All is definitely NOT WELL in Zion

Isaiah 9

14 Therefore Jehovah will cut off from Israel
head and tail, palm top and reed, in a single day;
15 the elders or notables are the head,
the prophets who teach falsehoods, the tail.
16 The leaders of these people have misled them,
and those who are led are confused.

As in ancient times, the political and ecclesiastical leaders of Jehovah’s end-time people resemble one another. Because of their wickedness, Jehovah “cuts off” both from his presence in “a single day”—his Day of Judgment (Isaiah 48:18-19). Because a people’s leaders reflect what the people are, the leaders’ misleading and confusing “these people”—Jehovah’s alienated people—constitutes an integral part of their punishment (cf. Isaiah 3:12). Most reprehensible in the prophets who represent Jehovah to his people are the “falsehoods” or “lies” (seqer) they teach (Isaiah 28:7; 29:10; 32:6-7).

*note
In Isaiah - "Egypt" is the U.S. - just as anciently - Egypt was the superpower.

Isaiah 19

14 Jehovah has permeated them
with a spirit of confusion;
they have misled Egypt in all that it does,
causing it to stagger like a drunkard into his vomit.
15 And there shall be nothing the Egyptians
can do about it,
neither head nor tail, palm top or reed.

Egypt’s ruling elite resemble disoriented persons possessed by a spirit of confusion who lead an entire nation astray, politically and economically. The people’s cumulative guilt has reached its saturation point. Only Jehovah’s judgments can cleanse the nation of its wickedness and idolatry (v 3). The motifs of a “drunkard” who “staggers” into his “vomit” link the nation of Egypt to Jehovah’s people of the tribe of Ephraim and to Ephraim’s intoxicated prophets (Isaiah 28:1, 3, 7-8; 56:10-12). The “head” and “tail,” “palm top” and “reed” allude to the people’s leaders (Isaiah 7:8-9; 9:14-15; 36:6).

Are you "I AM"?

If MMP isn’t a true doctrine, it sure is a real thing on this forum. Half the people around here are on their 3rd or 4th probation

[cab]

It’s Isaiah but Nephi did put them into his record word for word because they were of great worth to the children of men.

From the intro to the chapter in the Book of Mormon
“2 Nephi : Chapter 19
Isaiah speaks messianically—The people in darkness will see a great light—Unto us a child is born—He will be the Prince of Peace and will reign on David’s throne—Compare Isaiah 9. About 559–545 B.C.”.

The meaning is the same and I agree with what Isaiah and Nephi are saying.

All is definitely NOT WELL in Zion

Isaiah 9

14 Therefore Jehovah will cut off from Israel
head and tail, palm top and reed, in a single day;
15 the elders or notables are the head,
the prophets who teach falsehoods, the tail.
16 The leaders of these people have misled them,
and those who are led are confused.

As in ancient times, the political and ecclesiastical leaders of Jehovah’s end-time people resemble one another. Because of their wickedness, Jehovah “cuts off” both from his presence in “a single day”—his Day of Judgment (Isaiah 48:18-19). Because a people’s leaders reflect what the people are, the leaders’ misleading and confusing “these people”—Jehovah’s alienated people—constitutes an integral part of their punishment (cf. Isaiah 3:12). Most reprehensible in the prophets who represent Jehovah to his people are the “falsehoods” or “lies” (seqer) they teach (Isaiah 28:7; 29:10; 32:6-7).

*note
In Isaiah - "Egypt" is the U.S. - just as anciently - Egypt was the superpower.

Isaiah 19

14 Jehovah has permeated them
with a spirit of confusion;
they have misled Egypt in all that it does,
causing it to stagger like a drunkard into his vomit.
15 And there shall be nothing the Egyptians
can do about it,
neither head nor tail, palm top or reed.

Egypt’s ruling elite resemble disoriented persons possessed by a spirit of confusion who lead an entire nation astray, politically and economically. The people’s cumulative guilt has reached its saturation point. Only Jehovah’s judgments can cleanse the nation of its wickedness and idolatry (v 3). The motifs of a “drunkard” who “staggers” into his “vomit” link the nation of Egypt to Jehovah’s people of the tribe of Ephraim and to Ephraim’s intoxicated prophets (Isaiah 28:1, 3, 7-8; 56:10-12). The “head” and “tail,” “palm top” and “reed” allude to the people’s leaders (Isaiah 7:8-9; 9:14-15; 36:6).

Are you "I AM"?

If MMP isn’t a true doctrine, it sure is a real thing on this forum. Half the people around here are on their 3rd or 4th probation

Hahaha! Types and shadows... When will brlenox condescend amongst us again?

[Zathura]

Isaiah 9

14 Therefore Jehovah will cut off from Israel
head and tail, palm top and reed, in a single day;
15 the elders or notables are the head,
the prophets who teach falsehoods, the tail.
16 The leaders of these people have misled them,
and those who are led are confused.

As in ancient times, the political and ecclesiastical leaders of Jehovah’s end-time people resemble one another. Because of their wickedness, Jehovah “cuts off” both from his presence in “a single day”—his Day of Judgment (Isaiah 48:18-19). Because a people’s leaders reflect what the people are, the leaders’ misleading and confusing “these people”—Jehovah’s alienated people—constitutes an integral part of their punishment (cf. Isaiah 3:12). Most reprehensible in the prophets who represent Jehovah to his people are the “falsehoods” or “lies” (seqer) they teach (Isaiah 28:7; 29:10; 32:6-7).

*note
In Isaiah - "Egypt" is the U.S. - just as anciently - Egypt was the superpower.

Isaiah 19

14 Jehovah has permeated them
with a spirit of confusion;
they have misled Egypt in all that it does,
causing it to stagger like a drunkard into his vomit.
15 And there shall be nothing the Egyptians
can do about it,
neither head nor tail, palm top or reed.

Egypt’s ruling elite resemble disoriented persons possessed by a spirit of confusion who lead an entire nation astray, politically and economically. The people’s cumulative guilt has reached its saturation point. Only Jehovah’s judgments can cleanse the nation of its wickedness and idolatry (v 3). The motifs of a “drunkard” who “staggers” into his “vomit” link the nation of Egypt to Jehovah’s people of the tribe of Ephraim and to Ephraim’s intoxicated prophets (Isaiah 28:1, 3, 7-8; 56:10-12). The “head” and “tail,” “palm top” and “reed” allude to the people’s leaders (Isaiah 7:8-9; 9:14-15; 36:6).

Are you "I AM"?

If MMP isn’t a true doctrine, it sure is a real thing on this forum. Half the people around here are on their 3rd or 4th probation

Hahaha! Types and shadows... When will brlenox condescend amongst us again?

When will I come again?

[cab]

Are you "I AM"?

If MMP isn’t a true doctrine, it sure is a real thing on this forum. Half the people around here are on their 3rd or 4th probation

Hahaha! Types and shadows... When will brlenox condescend amongst us again?

When will I come again?

Dude... That's deep.

[buffalo_girl]

2Nephi 28
30 For behold, thus saith the Lord God: I will give unto the children of men line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little and there a little; and blessed are those who hearken unto my precepts, and lend an ear unto my counsel, for they shall learn wisdom; for unto him that receiveth I will give more; and from them that shall say, We have enough, from them shall be taken away even that which they have.