Pay your tithing, Obey Authority

[nightlight]

"If a destitute family is faced with a decision of paying their tithing or eating, they should pay their tithing."

So says the fat man

It would be nice to have one laymen among the brethren. Just one who actually knows what it is like and truly represents the poor. Problem is none of them have any experience with being poor so they are clueless for the most part. I always shake my head when a rich man who has been spoon fed his whole life talks about the poor.

I agree with your sentiment. But Elder Uchtdorf was poor. I imagine others were too. Maybe the answer isn't to just have representation. Maybe transparency is the answer. And consent by the members.

Yeah, I can't remember if it was ballard or packard, but one of them was super poor - so much so that the apostles pitched in to buy Him some new shoes and a coat at one point. This is a 2nd hand account from when I used to live in the SLC area- a lot of people knew the apostles.

They get paid over 100000$ a year...lol that's not poor.

[John Tavner]

It would be nice to have one laymen among the brethren. Just one who actually knows what it is like and truly represents the poor. Problem is none of them have any experience with being poor so they are clueless for the most part. I always shake my head when a rich man who has been spoon fed his whole life talks about the poor.

I agree with your sentiment. But Elder Uchtdorf was poor. I imagine others were too. Maybe the answer isn't to just have representation. Maybe transparency is the answer. And consent by the members.

Yeah, I can't remember if it was ballard or packard, but one of them was super poor - so much so that the apostles pitched in to buy Him some new shoes and a coat at one point. This is a 2nd hand account from when I used to live in the SLC area- a lot of people knew the apostles.

They get paid over 100000$ a year...lol that's not poor.

Perhaps this is before they started receiving stipends

[nightlight]

I agree with your sentiment. But Elder Uchtdorf was poor. I imagine others were too. Maybe the answer isn't to just have representation. Maybe transparency is the answer. And consent by the members.

Yeah, I can't remember if it was ballard or packard, but one of them was super poor - so much so that the apostles pitched in to buy Him some new shoes and a coat at one point. This is a 2nd hand account from when I used to live in the SLC area- a lot of people knew the apostles.

They get paid over 100000$ a year...lol that's not poor.

Perhaps this is before they started receiving stipends

They 70 receive the same salary

[John Tavner]

Yeah, I can't remember if it was ballard or packard, but one of them was super poor - so much so that the apostles pitched in to buy Him some new shoes and a coat at one point. This is a 2nd hand account from when I used to live in the SLC area- a lot of people knew the apostles.

They get paid over 100000$ a year...lol that's not poor.

Perhaps this is before they started receiving stipends

They 70 receive the same salary

I'm aware of the stipends, what I mean is that perhaps the 12 and 70 didn't receive stipends other than to pay for travel expences back in the 1970's. If I remember right, during that time period the church was in debt or struggling with debt at that time. Maybe it was a lie, but I have no reason to believe this person would lie about that. I believe it was Packer - it has been a while I just remember the story and the person who told it.

[nightlight]

They get paid over 100000$ a year...lol that's not poor.

Perhaps this is before they started receiving stipends

They 70 receive the same salary

I'm aware of the stipends, what I mean is that perhaps the 12 and 70 didn't receive stipends other than to pay for travel expences back in the 1970's. If I remember right, during that time period the church was in debt or struggling with debt at that time. Maybe it was a lie, but I have no reason to believe this person would lie about that. I believe it was Packer - it has been a while I just remember the story and the person who told it.

Maybe. Imo it's more likely he was just wearing them out until they needed replacing.

Lol my wife will have to buy me stuff cuz I wear things until I look "homless", and shes "forced to get me new stuff" lol.

Regardless, that's a story one of them should've told at General Conference.

[JohnnyL]

"If a destitute family is faced with a decision of paying their tithing or eating, they should pay their tithing."

So says the fat man

And then they need to go to their Bishop and get a voucher for a month's supply of food from the Bishop's Storehouse and another voucher to get clothes, shoes, bedding and furniture from Deseret Industries.

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

Is it anti-tithing to believe in tithing as originally revealed?

You pay a tenth of your annual increase. So you figure how much your net worth has increased from last year and a tenth of that you pay.

That’s tithing according to the Lord in his definition. Which means that a destitute person who has no net worth hasn’t got tithing to pay.

If I’m wrong then please open the scriptures and demonstrate to me how and why.

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

[JohnnyL]

"If you have never been completely destitute and homeless, you don't know that worldly things are more important than tithing, even though you'll get worldly things afterward."

[JohnnyL]

"If a destitute family is faced with a decision of paying their tithing or eating, they should pay their tithing."

So says the fat man

And then they need to go to their Bishop and get a voucher for a month's supply of food from the Bishop's Storehouse and another voucher to get clothes, shoes, bedding and furniture from Deseret Industries.

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

It isnt "anti tithe" to pay for your needs and kids food before you figure out your actual increase.

Preaching to pay your tithes at the expense of leaving your kids to go hungry is as bad as preaching that people ought not to take their kids for medical attention and just "pray the sickness away". I'm all about faith and miracles, but the Lord expects us to do all we can for ourselves and He will help us the rest of the way. Even the GAs go to the hospital when they are sick. Even so, the Lord does not command us to watch our children die so we can put money in the collection plate. That is a gross bastardization of the law of tithing.

In your opinion, it might be.

I'm concerned about the Lord's opinion, and it seems that He comes through.

How is it "leaving your kids to go hungry"? You know about welfare, right?

You don't believe in "pray the sickness away"?

[Silas]

And then they need to go to their Bishop and get a voucher for a month's supply of food from the Bishop's Storehouse and another voucher to get clothes, shoes, bedding and furniture from Deseret Industries.

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

Is it anti-tithing to believe in tithing as originally revealed?

You pay a tenth of your annual increase. So you figure how much your net worth has increased from last year and a tenth of that you pay.

That’s tithing according to the Lord in his definition. Which means that a destitute person who has no net worth hasn’t got tithing to pay.

If I’m wrong then please open the scriptures and demonstrate to me how and why.

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

That would be correct. Your increase is 100,000 you pay a 10,000 tithe. But your increase isn’t your income it’s the difference in your net worth from year to year.

That’s what the revelation states and what it was understood to mean at the time it was revealed.

Either my understanding is incorrect (if so please demonstrate how) or we have received a new revelation changing the law of the tithe (if so please show me this revelation) but how is one anti-tithe if they believe in the definition of tithing given by the Lord?

[Rose Garden]

"If a destitute family is faced with a decision of paying their tithing or eating, they should pay their tithing."

So says the fat man

And then they need to go to their Bishop and get a voucher for a month's supply of food from the Bishop's Storehouse and another voucher to get clothes, shoes, bedding and furniture from Deseret Industries.

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

I can if I'm paying 10% on my increase annually.

[ajax]

Stop calculating, which is implicitly pharisaical, rather:

2 Corinthians 9:

6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.

7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.

[BeNotDeceived]

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

Is it anti-tithing to believe in tithing as originally revealed?

You pay a tenth of your annual increase. So you figure how much your net worth has increased from last year and a tenth of that you pay.

That’s tithing according to the Lord in his definition. Which means that a destitute person who has no net worth hasn’t got tithing to pay.

If I’m wrong then please open the scriptures and demonstrate to me how and why.

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

That would be correct. Your increase is 100,000 you pay a 10,000 tithe. But your increase isn’t your income it’s the difference in your net worth from year to year.

That’s what the revelation states and what it was understood to mean at the time it was revealed.

Either my understanding is incorrect (if so please demonstrate how) or we have received a new revelation changing the law of the tithe (if so please show me this revelation) but how is one anti-tithe if they believe in the definition of tithing given by the Lord?

"Every member of the Church is entitled to make his own decision as to what he thinks he owes the Lord and to make payment accordingly." (March 19, 1970, letter from the First Presidency.)

Another quote from this supposed letter, but no link to the original.

Perhaps the footnotes, I’ll check.

https://www.thechurchnews.com/archives/ ... ent-138072

Footnotes, there are none.

[JohnnyL]

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

Is it anti-tithing to believe in tithing as originally revealed?

You pay a tenth of your annual increase. So you figure how much your net worth has increased from last year and a tenth of that you pay.

That’s tithing according to the Lord in his definition. Which means that a destitute person who has no net worth hasn’t got tithing to pay.

If I’m wrong then please open the scriptures and demonstrate to me how and why.

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

That would be correct. Your increase is 100,000 you pay a 10,000 tithe. But your increase isn’t your income it’s the difference in your net worth from year to year.

That’s what the revelation states and what it was understood to mean at the time it was revealed.

Either my understanding is incorrect (if so please demonstrate how) or we have received a new revelation changing the law of the tithe (if so please show me this revelation) but how is one anti-tithe if they believe in the definition of tithing given by the Lord?

"Sorry, bishop, here's $10--my house payment is $4,000/month, my Bentley loan and upkeep is $2,000/month, my Armani suits are $2,000/ month, restaurant bills come out to $1,000/month, ... So, even though I'm making $150,000, my net increase is $100." Hmm...

[ajax]

Is it anti-tithing to believe in tithing as originally revealed?

You pay a tenth of your annual increase. So you figure how much your net worth has increased from last year and a tenth of that you pay.

That’s tithing according to the Lord in his definition. Which means that a destitute person who has no net worth hasn’t got tithing to pay.

If I’m wrong then please open the scriptures and demonstrate to me how and why.

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

That would be correct. Your increase is 100,000 you pay a 10,000 tithe. But your increase isn’t your income it’s the difference in your net worth from year to year.

That’s what the revelation states and what it was understood to mean at the time it was revealed.

Either my understanding is incorrect (if so please demonstrate how) or we have received a new revelation changing the law of the tithe (if so please show me this revelation) but how is one anti-tithe if they believe in the definition of tithing given by the Lord?

"Sorry, bishop, here's $10--my house payment is $4,000/month, my Bentley loan and upkeep is $2,000/month, my Armani suits are $2,000/ month, restaurant bills come out to $1,000/month, ... So, even though I'm making $150,000, my net increase is $100." Hmm...

Not your stewardship to worry about.

[Rick Grimes]

And then they need to go to their Bishop and get a voucher for a month's supply of food from the Bishop's Storehouse and another voucher to get clothes, shoes, bedding and furniture from Deseret Industries.

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

It isnt "anti tithe" to pay for your needs and kids food before you figure out your actual increase.

Preaching to pay your tithes at the expense of leaving your kids to go hungry is as bad as preaching that people ought not to take their kids for medical attention and just "pray the sickness away". I'm all about faith and miracles, but the Lord expects us to do all we can for ourselves and He will help us the rest of the way. Even the GAs go to the hospital when they are sick. Even so, the Lord does not command us to watch our children die so we can put money in the collection plate. That is a gross bastardization of the law of tithing.

In your opinion, it might be.

I'm concerned about the Lord's opinion, and it seems that He comes through.

How is it "leaving your kids to go hungry"? You know about welfare, right?

You don't believe in "pray the sickness away"?

The Lord has stated that it is on our "increase" that we are to pay tithes. Increase means after we have factored in all costs associated with living and making that increase possible. The scriptures are clear that the tithing paid was supposed to be "annual increase". In other words, after your costs are paid, whatever is leftover is your increase. The doctrine and covenants as well as the other books of scripture all state it is on "increase" that we are to pay tithing on as well.

[Silas]

Is it anti-tithing to believe in tithing as originally revealed?

You pay a tenth of your annual increase. So you figure how much your net worth has increased from last year and a tenth of that you pay.

That’s tithing according to the Lord in his definition. Which means that a destitute person who has no net worth hasn’t got tithing to pay.

If I’m wrong then please open the scriptures and demonstrate to me how and why.

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

That would be correct. Your increase is 100,000 you pay a 10,000 tithe. But your increase isn’t your income it’s the difference in your net worth from year to year.

That’s what the revelation states and what it was understood to mean at the time it was revealed.

Either my understanding is incorrect (if so please demonstrate how) or we have received a new revelation changing the law of the tithe (if so please show me this revelation) but how is one anti-tithe if they believe in the definition of tithing given by the Lord?

"Sorry, bishop, here's $10--my house payment is $4,000/month, my Bentley loan and upkeep is $2,000/month, my Armani suits are $2,000/ month, restaurant bills come out to $1,000/month, ... So, even though I'm making $150,000, my net increase is $100." Hmm...

I don’t think you understand what net worth means. Your assets are apart of your net worth. Do actually not understand what net worth is or are you just pretending to be stupid to get a rise out of people?

Why do you think people used to pay tithing with cows and other physical items?

[Thinker]

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

Again...

Changing scripture from what it states (increase) to mean “income” to get more money, is not of Christ. The reason God commanded tithe be based on increase is shown in the following example:

• 2 men earn the exact same income amount.
  1 man is the sole provider of a family of 7 and after paying bills has no increase left.
  2nd man lives with his parents who pay all his bills, so all of his income is increase.
  Yet, the church demand$ the $ame amount from each man - thereby causing the 1st family to be poor. Christ was about alleviating poverty and suffering - not causing more.

Deuteronomy 14:28-29 (conveniently ignored in lds curriculums) states that tithing collectors are to give at least 1/3 of TITHES to those in need. Christ asked those who can, to give much more.

While we are often pressured and shamed into giving “honest tithes,” church leaders keep money dark and secret, though Oaks did admit no tithes go to the poor. Funds intended for the poor go to the corporate empire of mormon leaders and we have no clue or say in how it’s spent. We do know the church had some elaborate malls built, and a list of greedy wordly companies using the name of Jesus Christ in vain. Meanwhile, about 1,000,000,000 of our brothers and sisters are starving. Who do TITHES belong to? God. And how do we love God? By loving the least of these.

[Matchmaker]

"If a destitute family is faced with a decision of paying their tithing or eating, they should pay their tithing."

So says the fat man

And then they need to go to their Bishop and get a voucher for a month's supply of food from the Bishop's Storehouse and another voucher to get clothes, shoes, bedding and furniture from Deseret Industries.

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

I wish I could afford to pay a large fast offering to my Ward every month in addition to a full tithe, but we can't. There is little left after paying mortgage, utilities, insurance {medical, dental, eye, house, and car insurance}, deductibles and co-pays on insurance, which came to $1,800 out of pocket for me in the last 2 months, groceries, gas for our cars, and minimal Christmas gifts for kids, mom, close family, and grandson, (nothing for hubby and I this year, which we are OK with}, and some in retirement savings. We have no car payments and no credit card payments. We also have no 401K either.

I would love to know what it would feel like to be able to give a large fast offering every month. It's just not possible for us at this time.

[Aprhys]

"If a destitute family is faced with a decision of paying their tithing or eating, they should pay their tithing."

So says the fat man

And then they need to go to their Bishop and get a voucher for a month's supply of food from the Bishop's Storehouse and another voucher to get clothes, shoes, bedding and furniture from Deseret Industries.

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

I wish I could afford to pay a large fast offering to my Ward every month in addition to a full tithe, but we can't. There is little left after paying mortgage, utilities, insurance {medical, dental, eye, house, and car insurance}, deductibles and co-pays on insurance, which came to $1,800 out of pocket for me in the last 2 months, groceries, gas for our cars, and minimal Christmas gifts for kids, mom, close family, and grandson, (nothing for hubby and I this year, which we are OK with}, and some in retirement savings. We have no car payments and no credit card payments. We also have no 401K either.

I would love to know what it would feel like to be able to give a large fast offering every month. It's just not possible for us at this time.

Like you we are far from wealthy. at the end of the month there isnt a ton of money left over. Often there isnt anything left over. All of our cars are rebuilt titles and Christmas is always quite small. My daughter wanted to take gymnastics at a cost of about $30 a month. I made the decision that my daughters happiness in life was what is most important to me. More important than subsidizing a quarter-million dollar chandelier for the Rome temple. I explained my thoughts to my wife and I dont feel bad in the least bit. I dont feel like I am "robbing God," at all. If he is anything like me he is more concerned with his childrens happiness than he is with how fancy his house is.

[Original_Intent]

The faith promoting stories about paying tithing first, and your other expenses miraculously take care of themselves - complete rubbish.
"Do you want to be blessed on your gross, or on your net?" Something that I'm sad to say most of us have heard multiple times, a false tradition.

[ajax]

"Do you want to be blessed on your gross, or on your net?" Something that I'm sad to say most of us have heard multiple times, a false tradition.

Agree. A clever quip designed to easily dismiss the honest inquirer and gain a laugh from the crowd.

[righteousrepublic]

"If a destitute family is faced with a decision of paying their tithing or eating, they should pay their tithing."

So says the fat man

And then they need to go to their Bishop and get a voucher for a month's supply of food from the Bishop's Storehouse and another voucher to get clothes, shoes, bedding and furniture from Deseret Industries.

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

I wish I could afford to pay a large fast offering to my Ward every month in addition to a full tithe, but we can't. There is little left after paying mortgage, utilities, insurance {medical, dental, eye, house, and car insurance}, deductibles and co-pays on insurance, which came to $1,800 out of pocket for me in the last 2 months, groceries, gas for our cars, and minimal Christmas gifts for kids, mom, close family, and grandson, (nothing for hubby and I this year, which we are OK with}, and some in retirement savings. We have no car payments and no credit card payments. We also have no 401K either.

I would love to know what it would feel like to be able to give a large fast offering every month. It's just not possible for us at this time.

I have a question. Does a fast offering have to be monetary or can it be payed in useful items for the needy dispensed by the bishop?

[JohnnyL]

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

That would be correct. Your increase is 100,000 you pay a 10,000 tithe. But your increase isn’t your income it’s the difference in your net worth from year to year.

That’s what the revelation states and what it was understood to mean at the time it was revealed.

Either my understanding is incorrect (if so please demonstrate how) or we have received a new revelation changing the law of the tithe (if so please show me this revelation) but how is one anti-tithe if they believe in the definition of tithing given by the Lord?

"Sorry, bishop, here's $10--my house payment is $4,000/month, my Bentley loan and upkeep is $2,000/month, my Armani suits are $2,000/ month, restaurant bills come out to $1,000/month, ... So, even though I'm making $150,000, my net increase is $100." Hmm...

Not your stewardship to worry about.

You might be right. Ultimately, it's the Lord's. And before that, his apostles and prophets.

"I don't care, President Benson, President Hunter, President Hinckley, President Monson, President Nelson, President..., what you clearly said and taught. I decided to stick with what I think Joseph Smith said." )

So I believe you saw the fallacy of "net increase", which was the point of the post.

It's usually not most of our stewardship whether anyone does anything wrong. Yet here we are, denying the apostles and prophets their stewardships. Ironic.

[JohnnyL]

You got it! This is how it works correctly.

Tithing is a wonderful blessing. I challenge all you anti-tithers (because that's what it boils down to) to pay it in faith, then add to it a generous fast offering. Then, after doing that a year, come back and complain. I'll hear you better. Can you pay the same amount in fast offering as you do tithing?

It isnt "anti tithe" to pay for your needs and kids food before you figure out your actual increase.

Preaching to pay your tithes at the expense of leaving your kids to go hungry is as bad as preaching that people ought not to take their kids for medical attention and just "pray the sickness away". I'm all about faith and miracles, but the Lord expects us to do all we can for ourselves and He will help us the rest of the way. Even the GAs go to the hospital when they are sick. Even so, the Lord does not command us to watch our children die so we can put money in the collection plate. That is a gross bastardization of the law of tithing.

In your opinion, it might be.

I'm concerned about the Lord's opinion, and it seems that He comes through.

How is it "leaving your kids to go hungry"? You know about welfare, right?

You don't believe in "pray the sickness away"?

The Lord has stated that it is on our "increase" that we are to pay tithes. Increase means after we have factored in all costs associated with living and making that increase possible. The scriptures are clear that the tithing paid was supposed to be "annual increase". In other words, after your costs are paid, whatever is leftover is your increase. The doctrine and covenants as well as the other books of scripture all state it is on "increase" that we are to pay tithing on as well.

Did you see the problem with "increase"?

[JohnnyL]

At the beginning of the year, I had $0. At the end of the year, I had $100,000. I think I increased $100,000 over that year. Am I incorrect?

The prophets aren't prophets anymore?

Again...

Changing scripture from what it states (increase) to mean “income” to get more money, is not of Christ. The reason God commanded tithe be based on increase is shown in the following example:

• 2 men earn the exact same income amount.
  1 man is the sole provider of a family of 7 and after paying bills has no increase left.
  2nd man lives with his parents who pay all his bills, so all of his income is increase.
  Yet, the church demand$ the $ame amount from each man - thereby causing the 1st family to be poor. Christ was about alleviating poverty and suffering - not causing more.

Deuteronomy 14:28-29 (conveniently ignored in lds curriculums) states that tithing collectors are to give at least 1/3 of TITHES to those in need. Christ asked those who can, to give much more.

While we are often pressured and shamed into giving “honest tithes,” church leaders keep money dark and secret, though Oaks did admit no tithes go to the poor. Funds intended for the poor go to the corporate empire of mormon leaders and we have no clue or say in how it’s spent. We do know the church had some elaborate malls built, and a list of greedy wordly companies using the name of Jesus Christ in vain. Meanwhile, about 1,000,000,000 of our brothers and sisters are starving. Who do TITHES belong to? God. And how do we love God? By loving the least of these.

Here's the core of the problem:

Do I continue to hold the old way, which I believe definitely favors my thinking; or, do I go with the changes I believe multiple prophets and apostles have sustained and taught, which I believe don't favor me?