Poll: Effect of $100B Church Fund

[iWriteStuff]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/investig ... story.html

I'm more curious about how this will impact your actions, rather than your immediate thoughts on it.

What changes for you?

[drtanner]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/investig ... story.html

I'm more curious about how this will impact your actions, rather than your immediate thoughts on it.

What changes for you?

What’s your vote

[iWriteStuff]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/investig ... story.html

I'm more curious about how this will impact your actions, rather than your immediate thoughts on it.

What changes for you?

What’s your vote

PM'd you my vote.

[Zathura]

Nothing changes for me. I don't pay tithing for the church or it's leaders.

Supposedly the First Presidency mandated that the funds be amassed until the Second Coming. This sounds like a dumb rumor passed around an office full of Mormons. If this is true, they are not being wise stewards and I think it will have been a tragedy that they wasted those funds. I hope they are being wise stewards and biding their time until it can be used for the benefit of all.

I didn't chose "who cares" because I do care, I think this does matter, depending on what they're are actually intending to do with those funds.

[Davka]

“ He is seeking a reward from the IRS, which offers whistleblowers a cut of unpaid taxes that it recovers.”



Let’s say the church ends up on the hook for 15 percent of $100B. That’s $15B in taxes. I don’t know what the cut to whistleblowers is, but even if it a hundredth of a percent, this guy is looking at a $1.5 MILLION payday. (I think I did my math right on that one...it’s a lot of zeroes we’re dealing with here).

I have a hard time taking the motivations behind his allegations seriously if that’s the case.

Nothing stated in the article bothers me. President Nelson isn’t flying off to a private island to drink (virgin) pina coladas every weekend. And since the leadership isn’t profiting personally beyond a salary (yes...I’m aware it’s a “high” salary...discussion for another time), I see the wealth of the church as serving some other, less obvious, purpose, one that will eventually be made clear. If the church were a typical for-profit business there would be more reason to be concerned about money being stockpiled as *somebody,* usually a major shareholder or owner or whatever would be personally profiting from that.

Until someone shows me that this money is somehow padding the bank accounts of the leadership of the church beyond their salary, I have a hard time believing that their management of all this money is motivated by greed.

The whistleblower, on the other hand...

IWriteStuff, I’d be interested in knowing your vote as well.

[jsk]

Nothing changes for me...I will continue paying a full tithe on my gross income.

I am inclined toward “who cares” and “feeling grateful for wise stewards,” but it is concerning if the allegations of deliberate tax avoidance are true. But at this point I’m more than willing to give the Church the benefit of the doubt over a disgruntled ex-employee and member looking to cash in.

[JK4Woods]

I am aware of the personal blessings I have received for paying tithing in my own life. I paid tithing in other ways when I was a private in the Army and not a member of the CoJCoLDS. I received blessings from freely giving away a portion of the bounty I have been blessed with.

The money grubbing self-justifying church fund managers and the businessmen who direct the church and set up the policy to horde the free will offerings of modest membership... well the sins be upon their heads.

The strategy of “saving up enough for the Second Coming” is total bs. Jesus Christ doesn’t need stock funds. He doesn’t need leadership that has its judgement and wisdom tainted by investing money in Babylon. What the heck is the leadership doing?!? To who are they emulating?

Remember how the original apostles went out without purse or script to gather into the fold the ones who were believers?

Must be nice to have so much money in the church coffers to be able to invest the excess into the success of Babylon.

Hopefully this won’t just blow over and be swept under the rug, with business as usual.
Hopefully there will be some Christ like inspired decisions toward transparency and benefitting the poor and needy.

[Trucker]

I care, but I still pay a full tithe. I've already sort of have had to face this decision.But I wouldn't be surprised if there isn't some instruction given to members that make tithing less of a burden, kind of like how suddenly there is caffeinated cola in the vending machines at BYU.

[Vision]

I'm staying in until the second coming so I get my ROI.

[markharr]

I'm going with... The washington Compost is a garbage rag, and I assume that anything they publish is a lie by default. Especially if it comes from anonymous sources.

There are plenty of examples of that on here.

https://sharylattkisson.com/2019/01/50- ... tive-list/

[Obrien]

I am 1 of 12 votes at this point, and I represent the entire 8% of poll respondents who are not paying tithing to the CoJCoLDS any longer. I stopped several years ago, when the hints of perfidy in church finance (wealth accumulation for its own sake) were centered on City Creek Mall. Overabundance of money tends to corrupt people, even good people. $40M / year in charitable contributions v $7B / yr in tithes confirms that institutional priorities are out of balance. DONATE TO BOUNTIFUL CHILDREN'S FOUNDATION (formerly Liahona Children's Foundation) IN LIEU OF LDSCo.

[Trucker]

At least we are using the correct name of the church. That's the important thing.

[Silas]

I’m taking the stoic approach. I don’t know. Need more information. Could be some serious corruption. Could be a misunderstanding.

Whether the leaders of the church are corrupt or faithful has no effect on the Book of Mormon being the word of God. Nor does it interfere with my relationship with Christ.

[ChooseTruth]

Changes nothing for me. I’ve known of the state of corruption within the church for quite a while. The tares grow among the wheat, even in the church. Much of our leadership is corrupt.

That doesn’t change the fact that we still have the most correct doctrine, saving ordinances and priesthood authority. I still see a great deal of good being done on individual and ward levels. So, this remains the place to be for now.

We are on the slippery slope of apostasy though we haven’t reached the tipping point yet. For me, that will likely turn on the lgbt issue. Once the church officially accepts sin, I will have some difficult decisions to make.

[etravis0219]

I have ZERO problem with this amount of money in the church coffers... in fact I hope it keeps growing. Some reasons below:

-I don’t know the mind of The Lord
-I don’t know the future and what that money might be needed for. Economic collapse or perhaps massive growth; or combine those two and you have HUGE expenses but not much money coming in...
-New Jerusalem will be will be expensive to build.
-Tithing is for OUR benefit...not the church/The Lord.
-We are responsible for being charitable and serving our fellow man and shouldn’t expect the Church to do it. We are to be transformed into new creatures in Christ.
-I pay my part and don’t try to counsel The Lord.

[Matchmaker]

I believe there is probably some substance to Nielsen's complaint about the way the money fund has been managed since President Hinckley's death, but I don't blame the General Authorities for it. Just because he stands to profit from the disclosure doesn't imply that he must be lying about it. If anything, I blame the Investment Managers of the Ensign Fund for not keeping accurate records for tax purposes.

I expect we'll see some heads roll at the "Investment Division" of Church Headquarters and for the Church to be on the hook for additional taxes, but other than that, life for us will go on as usual.

[mahalanobis]

If these were Brigham-and-Taylor days, when we didn't like the US, we'd have no problem telling the IRS to 'pound sand' and to get off our backs.

Further, It's also not nearly as much of a scandal as the Kirtland safety anti-banking society going down in flames with the private savings of the members.

In historical context it's kinda a nothing-burger IMO.

I will cede that the uber-secrecy of Ensign is pretty sketchy though. (Yes, I read the whole article).

[mahalanobis]

“ He is seeking a reward from the IRS, which offers whistleblowers a cut of unpaid taxes that it recovers.”



Let’s say the church ends up on the hook for 15 percent of $100B. That’s $15B in taxes. I don’t know what the cut to whistleblowers is, but even if it a hundredth of a percent, this guy is looking at a $1.5 MILLION payday. (I think I did my math right on that one...it’s a lot of zeroes we’re dealing with here).

I have a hard time taking the motivations behind his allegations seriously if that’s the case.

Nothing stated in the article bothers me. President Nelson isn’t flying off to a private island to drink (virgin) pina coladas every weekend. And since the leadership isn’t profiting personally beyond a salary (yes...I’m aware it’s a “high” salary...discussion for another time), I see the wealth of the church as serving some other, less obvious, purpose, one that will eventually be made clear. If the church were a typical for-profit business there would be more reason to be concerned about money being stockpiled as *somebody,* usually a major shareholder or owner or whatever would be personally profiting from that.

Until someone shows me that this money is somehow padding the bank accounts of the leadership of the church beyond their salary, I have a hard time believing that their management of all this money is motivated by greed.

The whistleblower, on the other hand...

IWriteStuff, I’d be interested in knowing your vote as well.

I had many of the same thoughts as I read the article. It's like you were checking the boxes of everything I noticed as well.

There are things I don't like about this, but in the wake of the article I was strangely calm and at peace about it.

[mahalanobis]

I’m taking the stoic approach. I don’t know. Need more information. Could be some serious corruption. Could be a misunderstanding.

Whether the leaders of the church are corrupt or faithful has no effect on the Book of Mormon being the word of God. Nor does it interfere with my relationship with Christ.

My thoughts exactly.

Also, the widow's mite wasn't a powerful story because the mite was used to feed the poor. Remember that the church in her day was corrupt and in apostasy. In my opinion, we are not in such a dire position as that church.

My contributions are a tiny tiny drop in that bucket. If it prevents me from affording a down payment on a house, so be it. I care more about being like that widow than getting my torches and pitchforks ready to go after my leaders based on allegations that clearly have ulterior motives.

[Alaris]

This is either the Lord's church or it isn't. If it is, then the Lord can bless the church with wealth just as He did King Solomon. (*whispers* There's a new Kingdom of Israel coming.) And, in that case, the wealth of the church is a testament of the Lord's blessing of His people with prosperity. "...to the building up of the Kingdom of God." The church does not equal the Kingdom but it gives birth to it. I heard that the church said this was for the Second Coming - boom, there you go.

So if you had enough oil in your lamp, this is something that shouldn't even be a blip on your radar other than a "yep this is the Lord's church. There's His blessing and His readying us for the Kingdom through His wise stewards and prosperous people."

[Michelle]

Doctrine and Covenants 78:13 Behold, this is the preparation wherewith I prepare you, and the foundation, and the ensample which I give unto you, whereby you may accomplish the commandments which are given you;

14 That through my providence, notwithstanding the tribulation which shall descend upon you, that the church may stand independent above all other creatures beneath the celestial world;

I'm no fan of cross-posting, but I think this verse should be on all the threads addressing this topic.

[markharr]

The government can't wait to get their hands on it.

That's why the Washington Post is writing about it.

[SmallFarm]

If I still worked and payed tithes my tithes would be to God whether they were stolen by corrupt men or not.

[Robbinius]

This is either the Lord's church or it isn't. If it is, then the Lord can bless the church with wealth just as He did King Solomon. (*whispers* There's a new Kingdom of Israel coming.) And, in that case, the wealth of the church is a testament of the Lord's blessing of His people with prosperity. "...to the building up of the Kingdom of God." The church does not equal the Kingdom but it gives birth to it. I heard that the church said this was for the Second Coming - boom, there you go.

So if you had enough oil in your lamp, this is something that shouldn't even be a blip on your radar other than a "yep this is the Lord's church. There's His blessing and His readying us for the Kingdom through His wise stewards and prosperous people."

Love what you said about the oil in the lamp. So true. I had been praying for months to know whether this was still the Lord's Church with Christ at the helm and received an answer about a month ago that yes, yes it still is. Therefore the brethren get the benefit of the doubt from me. I know the church is still led by Christ and that this will all make sense one day for everyone.

It already makes sense to me that this would be for the coming millennial kingdom. If that's what it's for, then I'm happy to have donated to it thus far.

[nightlight]

To hell with the feds. Soooo rich coming from the IRS aka King George goons.
If they want to open our books....let's open theirs and see who is what. I can't stand them.
We all pay our taxes....they can't touch our tithing. I mean....they can't, but they will.
Lol there is is a reason the IRS is buying up gun ammo.

It's chill though.....Zion won't be built with the US dollar.

I hope this money stacking is for future food/water /medicine need.
Though....Me thinks the feds will take it eventually. again...It's chill though,this might be why we have it, a parting payment...

24When they had come to [h]Capernaum, those who received the temple tax came to Peter and said, “Does your Teacher not pay the temple tax?”

25He said, “Yes.”

And when he had come into the house, Jesus anticipated him, saying, “What do you think, Simon? From whom do the kings of the earth take customs or taxes, from their sons or from strangers?”

26Peter said to Him, “From strangers.”

Jesus said to him, “Then the sons are free. 27Nevertheless, lest we offend them, go to the sea, cast in a hook, and take the fish that comes up first. And when you have opened its mouth, you will find a [j]piece of money; take that and give it to them for Me and you.”
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