and the Lord of the vineyard wept

[I AM]

We should take note that the Lord continues to give revelation to the church and it's members.

-------------
if so, WHERE ARE THEY ?
Where are all these so called revelations that the church has received ?
and please don't just try to tell me that it's all these changes the
church makes and has made in the past,
and that the prophet has made all these changes because he received
revelations to do so.

I think it's going to take just a little more convincing for
some here in the forum to believe you, than for you to just brag about your
position in the church " I am in a leadership position in my ward",
and other similar things you've said in other threads; meaning like -
therefore - trust me I know about these things and what I'm talking about
and what's really going on.
For me, if anything, that just discredits you.
You don't back anything you say by scriptures,
and you have the same mentality as ones that hold positions in the church;
which most seem to look at others, like you do, based on the same standard
of how they look at themselves; by what rank they hold in the church.
I guess for you, the more high up you are in the church , then that gives you the right to think you know things that others do not; you seem to think you have more power, and because of your authority by the position you hold, with all certainty, you think you can tell others and set them straight about things.
This is so typical of members in the church that hold positions of authority.

When you come across things, even scriptures, that look like they are showing
that the church is less than what you think it is,
you just brush it off - as being anti-Mormon ,
thinking you are doing what's right, saving yourself from possibly
having any doubts about the church,
because, after all, you know what is true , and know you are right .
“People say they love truth, but in reality they want to believe that which they love is true.”

I honestly don't know what to tell you. You already have your mind made up. It wouldn't matter one bit on anything I brought to the table such as The Proclamation, temple changes, etc, you are going to discount it all.
I already know what I know is true. I have my witness. I'm at peace with it. I know my Savior and he knows me. I have a testimony of that. I also have a testimony, a very strong o e too, that the authority of God rests upon the priesthood in our church and that we are definitely not in apostacy. I don't have to prove that to you or anyone else. I know the truth, I have my own personal witness and that I definitely am not going to share it in here. My own Patriarchal blessing given to me almost two decades ago prophesied the very day and situation I am now in. It's a testimony to me that God's power and authority are in this church.

Good day to you though.

----------------
fortunately, I put Christ first, and His words;
not the church, and theirs.
And His words, and the words of Isaiah and other
prophets in our scriptures, say contrary to what you are saying;
and we were warned, but didn't heed their warnings
and have fallen into apostasy like they did.
So now, the Lord will take the gospel from us,
and give it back to them.

But YOU, "already have your mind made up. "
and WILL NOT listen to their words;
the scriptures also predict this will happen.
You can continue to believe in what you want,
but it's NOT WHAT THE SCRIPTURES SAY.
Follow the Lord and put your trust in Him and His word in our scriptures
before it's too late; and not in men, and their precepts.

IT'S ALL IN THE SCRIPTURES !
READ THEM AND TRUST IN THEM,
and NOT IN MEN !

and please start spelling the word apostacy "apostasy" right
because you will come to find out it's meaning

[Cheetos]

We should take note that the Lord continues to give revelation to the church and it's members.

-------------
if so, WHERE ARE THEY ?
Where are all these so called revelations that the church has received ?
and please don't just try to tell me that it's all these changes the
church makes and has made in the past,
and that the prophet has made all these changes because he received
revelations to do so.

I think it's going to take just a little more convincing for
some here in the forum to believe you, than for you to just brag about your
position in the church " I am in a leadership position in my ward",
and other similar things you've said in other threads; meaning like -
therefore - trust me I know about these things and what I'm talking about
and what's really going on.
For me, if anything, that just discredits you.
You don't back anything you say by scriptures,
and you have the same mentality as ones that hold positions in the church;
which most seem to look at others, like you do, based on the same standard
of how they look at themselves; by what rank they hold in the church.
I guess for you, the more high up you are in the church , then that gives you the right to think you know things that others do not; you seem to think you have more power, and because of your authority by the position you hold, with all certainty, you think you can tell others and set them straight about things.
This is so typical of members in the church that hold positions of authority.

When you come across things, even scriptures, that look like they are showing
that the church is less than what you think it is,
you just brush it off - as being anti-Mormon ,
thinking you are doing what's right, saving yourself from possibly
having any doubts about the church,
because, after all, you know what is true , and know you are right .
“People say they love truth, but in reality they want to believe that which they love is true.”

I honestly don't know what to tell you. You already have your mind made up. It wouldn't matter one bit on anything I brought to the table such as The Proclamation, temple changes, etc, you are going to discount it all.
I already know what I know is true. I have my witness. I'm at peace with it. I know my Savior and he knows me. I have a testimony of that. I also have a testimony, a very strong o e too, that the authority of God rests upon the priesthood in our church and that we are definitely not in apostacy. I don't have to prove that to you or anyone else. I know the truth, I have my own personal witness and that I definitely am not going to share it in here. My own Patriarchal blessing given to me almost two decades ago prophesied the very day and situation I am now in. It's a testimony to me that God's power and authority are in this church.

Good day to you though.

----------------
fortunately, I put Christ first, and His words;
not the church, and theirs.
And His words, and the words of Isaiah and other
prophets in our scriptures, say contrary to what you are saying;
and we were warned, but didn't heed their warnings
and have fallen into apostasy like they did.
So now, the Lord will take the gospel from us,
and give it back to them.

But YOU, "already have your mind made up. "
and WILL NOT listen to their words;
the scriptures also predict this will happen.
You can continue to believe in what you want,
but it's NOT WHAT THE SCRIPTURES SAY.
Follow the Lord and put your trust in Him and His word in our scriptures
before it's too late; and not in men, and their precepts.

IT'S ALL IN THE SCRIPTURES !
READ THEM AND TRUST IN THEM,
and NOT IN MEN !

and please start spelling the word apostacy "apostasy" right
because you will come to find out it's meaning

And you are on the outside, not led by the spirit. How am I supposed to believe you?

[I AM]

-------------
if so, WHERE ARE THEY ?
Where are all these so called revelations that the church has received ?
and please don't just try to tell me that it's all these changes the
church makes and has made in the past,
and that the prophet has made all these changes because he received
revelations to do so.

I think it's going to take just a little more convincing for
some here in the forum to believe you, than for you to just brag about your
position in the church " I am in a leadership position in my ward",
and other similar things you've said in other threads; meaning like -
therefore - trust me I know about these things and what I'm talking about
and what's really going on.
For me, if anything, that just discredits you.
You don't back anything you say by scriptures,
and you have the same mentality as ones that hold positions in the church;
which most seem to look at others, like you do, based on the same standard
of how they look at themselves; by what rank they hold in the church.
I guess for you, the more high up you are in the church , then that gives you the right to think you know things that others do not; you seem to think you have more power, and because of your authority by the position you hold, with all certainty, you think you can tell others and set them straight about things.
This is so typical of members in the church that hold positions of authority.

When you come across things, even scriptures, that look like they are showing
that the church is less than what you think it is,
you just brush it off - as being anti-Mormon ,
thinking you are doing what's right, saving yourself from possibly
having any doubts about the church,
because, after all, you know what is true , and know you are right .
“People say they love truth, but in reality they want to believe that which they love is true.”

I honestly don't know what to tell you. You already have your mind made up. It wouldn't matter one bit on anything I brought to the table such as The Proclamation, temple changes, etc, you are going to discount it all.
I already know what I know is true. I have my witness. I'm at peace with it. I know my Savior and he knows me. I have a testimony of that. I also have a testimony, a very strong o e too, that the authority of God rests upon the priesthood in our church and that we are definitely not in apostacy. I don't have to prove that to you or anyone else. I know the truth, I have my own personal witness and that I definitely am not going to share it in here. My own Patriarchal blessing given to me almost two decades ago prophesied the very day and situation I am now in. It's a testimony to me that God's power and authority are in this church.

Good day to you though.

----------------
fortunately, I put Christ first, and His words;
not the church, and theirs.
And His words, and the words of Isaiah and other
prophets in our scriptures, say contrary to what you are saying;
and we were warned, but didn't heed their warnings
and have fallen into apostasy like they did.
So now, the Lord will take the gospel from us,
and give it back to them.

But YOU, "already have your mind made up. "
and WILL NOT listen to their words;
the scriptures also predict this will happen.
You can continue to believe in what you want,
but it's NOT WHAT THE SCRIPTURES SAY.
Follow the Lord and put your trust in Him and His word in our scriptures
before it's too late; and not in men, and their precepts.

IT'S ALL IN THE SCRIPTURES !
READ THEM AND TRUST IN THEM,
and NOT IN MEN !

and please start spelling the word apostacy "apostasy" right
because you will come to find out it's meaning

And you are on the outside, not led by the spirit. How am I supposed to believe you?

-------------
"outside" ? "not led by the spirit" ?

I DO NOT WANT YOU TO BELIEVE ME.
PLEASE DON'T believe me.
and don't listen to what I say either.
Just read the scriptures I post.

I AM led by the Word of God.

FIRST !
Listen to ONLY the WORD OF GOD in your scriptures,
and to NO ONE ELSE .
If Jesus Christ - your Lord and Savior was in front of you
would you listen to Him ?
of course you would.
Well, when you are reading His words in the scriptures,
He is standing in front of you speaking to you,
so listen to Him, and what He says,
and put HIS WORDS FIRST, above everyone and everything;
including the church and it's leaders.
When you do this, and put His word first, by studying the scriptures, having the
Holy Ghost guiding you; the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them, and teach you what they are saying.
And pray about what these scriptures are saying;
Again, the Lord through His spirit - the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them.

[Cheetos]

I honestly don't know what to tell you. You already have your mind made up. It wouldn't matter one bit on anything I brought to the table such as The Proclamation, temple changes, etc, you are going to discount it all.
I already know what I know is true. I have my witness. I'm at peace with it. I know my Savior and he knows me. I have a testimony of that. I also have a testimony, a very strong o e too, that the authority of God rests upon the priesthood in our church and that we are definitely not in apostacy. I don't have to prove that to you or anyone else. I know the truth, I have my own personal witness and that I definitely am not going to share it in here. My own Patriarchal blessing given to me almost two decades ago prophesied the very day and situation I am now in. It's a testimony to me that God's power and authority are in this church.

Good day to you though.

----------------
fortunately, I put Christ first, and His words;
not the church, and theirs.
And His words, and the words of Isaiah and other
prophets in our scriptures, say contrary to what you are saying;
and we were warned, but didn't heed their warnings
and have fallen into apostasy like they did.
So now, the Lord will take the gospel from us,
and give it back to them.

But YOU, "already have your mind made up. "
and WILL NOT listen to their words;
the scriptures also predict this will happen.
You can continue to believe in what you want,
but it's NOT WHAT THE SCRIPTURES SAY.
Follow the Lord and put your trust in Him and His word in our scriptures
before it's too late; and not in men, and their precepts.

IT'S ALL IN THE SCRIPTURES !
READ THEM AND TRUST IN THEM,
and NOT IN MEN !

and please start spelling the word apostacy "apostasy" right
because you will come to find out it's meaning

And you are on the outside, not led by the spirit. How am I supposed to believe you?

-------------
"outside" ? "not led by the spirit" ?

I DO NOT WANT YOU TO BELIEVE ME.
PLEASE DON'T believe me.
and don't listen to what I say either.
Just read the scriptures I post.

I AM led by the Word of God.

FIRST !
Listen to ONLY the WORD OF GOD in your scriptures,
and to NO ONE ELSE .
If Jesus Christ - your Lord and Savior was in front of you
would you listen to Him ?
of course you would.
Well, when you are reading His words in the scriptures,
He is standing in front of you speaking to you,
so listen to Him, and what He says,
and put HIS WORDS FIRST, above everyone and everything;
including the church and it's leaders.
When you do this, and put His word first, by studying the scriptures, having the
Holy Ghost guiding you; the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them, and teach you what they are saying.
And pray about what these scriptures are saying;
Again, the Lord through His spirit - the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them.

So, when the Holy Ghost tells me that our church isn't in apostasy then where does that put you?

[Zathura]

----------------
fortunately, I put Christ first, and His words;
not the church, and theirs.
And His words, and the words of Isaiah and other
prophets in our scriptures, say contrary to what you are saying;
and we were warned, but didn't heed their warnings
and have fallen into apostasy like they did.
So now, the Lord will take the gospel from us,
and give it back to them.

But YOU, "already have your mind made up. "
and WILL NOT listen to their words;
the scriptures also predict this will happen.
You can continue to believe in what you want,
but it's NOT WHAT THE SCRIPTURES SAY.
Follow the Lord and put your trust in Him and His word in our scriptures
before it's too late; and not in men, and their precepts.

IT'S ALL IN THE SCRIPTURES !
READ THEM AND TRUST IN THEM,
and NOT IN MEN !

and please start spelling the word apostacy "apostasy" right
because you will come to find out it's meaning

And you are on the outside, not led by the spirit. How am I supposed to believe you?

-------------
"outside" ? "not led by the spirit" ?

I DO NOT WANT YOU TO BELIEVE ME.
PLEASE DON'T believe me.
and don't listen to what I say either.
Just read the scriptures I post.

I AM led by the Word of God.

FIRST !
Listen to ONLY the WORD OF GOD in your scriptures,
and to NO ONE ELSE .
If Jesus Christ - your Lord and Savior was in front of you
would you listen to Him ?
of course you would.
Well, when you are reading His words in the scriptures,
He is standing in front of you speaking to you,
so listen to Him, and what He says,
and put HIS WORDS FIRST, above everyone and everything;
including the church and it's leaders.
When you do this, and put His word first, by studying the scriptures, having the
Holy Ghost guiding you; the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them, and teach you what they are saying.
And pray about what these scriptures are saying;
Again, the Lord through His spirit - the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them.

So, when the Holy Ghost tells me that our church isn't in apostasy then where does that put you?

So, if the Holy Ghost tells me you are an apostate where does that put you?

[Cheetos]

And you are on the outside, not led by the spirit. How am I supposed to believe you?

-------------
"outside" ? "not led by the spirit" ?

I DO NOT WANT YOU TO BELIEVE ME.
PLEASE DON'T believe me.
and don't listen to what I say either.
Just read the scriptures I post.

I AM led by the Word of God.

FIRST !
Listen to ONLY the WORD OF GOD in your scriptures,
and to NO ONE ELSE .
If Jesus Christ - your Lord and Savior was in front of you
would you listen to Him ?
of course you would.
Well, when you are reading His words in the scriptures,
He is standing in front of you speaking to you,
so listen to Him, and what He says,
and put HIS WORDS FIRST, above everyone and everything;
including the church and it's leaders.
When you do this, and put His word first, by studying the scriptures, having the
Holy Ghost guiding you; the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them, and teach you what they are saying.
And pray about what these scriptures are saying;
Again, the Lord through His spirit - the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them.

So, when the Holy Ghost tells me that our church isn't in apostasy then where does that put you?

So, if the Holy Ghost tells me you are an apostate where does that put you?

That's easy, I then know you aren't led by the spirit. You could say the same thing about me but you would be lying.

[I AM]

----------------
fortunately, I put Christ first, and His words;
not the church, and theirs.
And His words, and the words of Isaiah and other
prophets in our scriptures, say contrary to what you are saying;
and we were warned, but didn't heed their warnings
and have fallen into apostasy like they did.
So now, the Lord will take the gospel from us,
and give it back to them.

But YOU, "already have your mind made up. "
and WILL NOT listen to their words;
the scriptures also predict this will happen.
You can continue to believe in what you want,
but it's NOT WHAT THE SCRIPTURES SAY.
Follow the Lord and put your trust in Him and His word in our scriptures
before it's too late; and not in men, and their precepts.

IT'S ALL IN THE SCRIPTURES !
READ THEM AND TRUST IN THEM,
and NOT IN MEN !

and please start spelling the word apostacy "apostasy" right
because you will come to find out it's meaning

And you are on the outside, not led by the spirit. How am I supposed to believe you?

-------------
"outside" ? "not led by the spirit" ?

I DO NOT WANT YOU TO BELIEVE ME.
PLEASE DON'T believe me.
and don't listen to what I say either.
Just read the scriptures I post.

I AM led by the Word of God.

FIRST !
Listen to ONLY the WORD OF GOD in your scriptures,
and to NO ONE ELSE .
If Jesus Christ - your Lord and Savior was in front of you
would you listen to Him ?
of course you would.
Well, when you are reading His words in the scriptures,
He is standing in front of you speaking to you,
so listen to Him, and what He says,
and put HIS WORDS FIRST, above everyone and everything;
including the church and it's leaders.
When you do this, and put His word first, by studying the scriptures, having the
Holy Ghost guiding you; the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them, and teach you what they are saying.
And pray about what these scriptures are saying;
Again, the Lord through His spirit - the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them.

So, when the Holy Ghost tells me that our church isn't in apostasy then where does that put you?

-------------
you claim that the Holy Ghost tells you things,
and yet you know not the words of Christ in our scriptures,
nor study or place any importance on them, or
on the prophet Isaiah, which the Lord
give a commandment to search his words diligently;
"for great are the words of Isaiah";
and yet you do not follow this commandment
given by the Lord; nor "feast upon the words of Christ"
So where does that put you ?

How can the Holy Ghost tell you anything ?
What spirit are you really listening to ?

2 Nephi 32
3 "Angels speak by the power of the Holy Ghost; wherefore, they speak the words of Christ. Wherefore, I said unto you, feast upon the words of Christ; for behold,
the words of Christ will tell you all things what ye should do."

[Zathura]

-------------
"outside" ? "not led by the spirit" ?

I DO NOT WANT YOU TO BELIEVE ME.
PLEASE DON'T believe me.
and don't listen to what I say either.
Just read the scriptures I post.

I AM led by the Word of God.

FIRST !
Listen to ONLY the WORD OF GOD in your scriptures,
and to NO ONE ELSE .
If Jesus Christ - your Lord and Savior was in front of you
would you listen to Him ?
of course you would.
Well, when you are reading His words in the scriptures,
He is standing in front of you speaking to you,
so listen to Him, and what He says,
and put HIS WORDS FIRST, above everyone and everything;
including the church and it's leaders.
When you do this, and put His word first, by studying the scriptures, having the
Holy Ghost guiding you; the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them, and teach you what they are saying.
And pray about what these scriptures are saying;
Again, the Lord through His spirit - the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them.

So, when the Holy Ghost tells me that our church isn't in apostasy then where does that put you?

So, if the Holy Ghost tells me you are an apostate where does that put you?

That's easy, I then know you aren't led by the spirit. You could say the same thing about me but you would be lying.

I can’t help but notice you haven’t backed up your claims in your other post. Will continue as a liar and slanderer or you will you explain why you call a fellow Saint the worst name you could call a member of the church?
If you don’t explain yourself, you’re no better than the liars and slanderers who defame the name of Joseph Smith with lies and false claims and accusations with no basis.


Will you continue on as a child? Unable to play well with others? Hurting other children when you don’t get what you want but unable to explain to your dad why you did what you did?

[Cheetos]

So, when the Holy Ghost tells me that our church isn't in apostasy then where does that put you?

So, if the Holy Ghost tells me you are an apostate where does that put you?

That's easy, I then know you aren't led by the spirit. You could say the same thing about me but you would be lying.

I can’t help but notice you haven’t backed up your claims in your other post. Will continue as a liar and slanderer or you will you explain why you call a fellow Saint the worst name you could call a member of the church?
If you don’t explain yourself, you’re no better than the liars and slanderers who defame the name of Joseph Smith with lies and false claims and accusations with no basis.


Will you continue on as a child? Unable to play well with others? Hurting other children when you don’t get what you want but unable to explain to your dad why you did what you did?

What claim are you referring to?

[Cheetos]

And you are on the outside, not led by the spirit. How am I supposed to believe you?

-------------
"outside" ? "not led by the spirit" ?

I DO NOT WANT YOU TO BELIEVE ME.
PLEASE DON'T believe me.
and don't listen to what I say either.
Just read the scriptures I post.

I AM led by the Word of God.

FIRST !
Listen to ONLY the WORD OF GOD in your scriptures,
and to NO ONE ELSE .
If Jesus Christ - your Lord and Savior was in front of you
would you listen to Him ?
of course you would.
Well, when you are reading His words in the scriptures,
He is standing in front of you speaking to you,
so listen to Him, and what He says,
and put HIS WORDS FIRST, above everyone and everything;
including the church and it's leaders.
When you do this, and put His word first, by studying the scriptures, having the
Holy Ghost guiding you; the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them, and teach you what they are saying.
And pray about what these scriptures are saying;
Again, the Lord through His spirit - the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them.

So, when the Holy Ghost tells me that our church isn't in apostasy then where does that put you?

-------------
you claim that the Holy Ghost tells you things,
and yet you know not the words of Christ in our scriptures,
nor study or place any importance on them, or
on the prophet Isaiah, which the Lord
give a commandment to search his words diligently;
"for great are the words of Isaiah";
and yet you do not follow this commandment
given by the Lord; nor "feast upon the words of Christ"
So where does that put you ?

How can the Holy Ghost tell you anything ?
What spirit are you really listening to ?

2 Nephi 32
3 "Angels speak by the power of the Holy Ghost; wherefore, they speak the words of Christ. Wherefore, I said unto you, feast upon the words of Christ; for behold,
the words of Christ will tell you all things what ye should do."

I read the scriptures a lot. I fast and pray to know their meaning. My main study is the Book of Mormon. As moved upon by the Holy Ghost, we speak with the tongue of angels, it is true.

I don't know all things or even very much of anything to any degree of perfection but I do know and can discern good from bad, right from wrong. And this I know- wherever the keys of the priesthood are there you will find the authority of God. And right now our church has that authority and power.

[I AM]

-------------
"outside" ? "not led by the spirit" ?

I DO NOT WANT YOU TO BELIEVE ME.
PLEASE DON'T believe me.
and don't listen to what I say either.
Just read the scriptures I post.

I AM led by the Word of God.

FIRST !
Listen to ONLY the WORD OF GOD in your scriptures,
and to NO ONE ELSE .
If Jesus Christ - your Lord and Savior was in front of you
would you listen to Him ?
of course you would.
Well, when you are reading His words in the scriptures,
He is standing in front of you speaking to you,
so listen to Him, and what He says,
and put HIS WORDS FIRST, above everyone and everything;
including the church and it's leaders.
When you do this, and put His word first, by studying the scriptures, having the
Holy Ghost guiding you; the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them, and teach you what they are saying.
And pray about what these scriptures are saying;
Again, the Lord through His spirit - the Holy Ghost will teach you and testify
to you the truth of them.

So, when the Holy Ghost tells me that our church isn't in apostasy then where does that put you?

-------------
you claim that the Holy Ghost tells you things,
and yet you know not the words of Christ in our scriptures,
nor study or place any importance on them, or
on the prophet Isaiah, which the Lord
give a commandment to search his words diligently;
"for great are the words of Isaiah";
and yet you do not follow this commandment
given by the Lord; nor "feast upon the words of Christ"
So where does that put you ?

How can the Holy Ghost tell you anything ?
What spirit are you really listening to ?

2 Nephi 32
3 "Angels speak by the power of the Holy Ghost; wherefore, they speak the words of Christ. Wherefore, I said unto you, feast upon the words of Christ; for behold,
the words of Christ will tell you all things what ye should do."

I read the scriptures a lot. I fast and pray to know their meaning. My main study is the Book of Mormon. As moved upon by the Holy Ghost, we speak with the tongue of angels, it is true.

I don't know all things or even very much of anything to any degree of perfection but I do know and can discern good from bad, right from wrong. And this I know- wherever the keys of the priesthood are there you will find the authority of God. And right now our church has that authority and power.

-------------

Our exclusive Priesthood rights to end.

The Lord told Joseph Smith that His Restored Priesthood would
"remain through you and your lineage until the restoration of all things spoken by the mouths of all the holy prophets since the world began."
D&C 86:10
He also said we held our Priesthood jointly with those who held Dispensation Keys before us.
D&C 112: 30 -33
30 For unto you, the Twelve, and those, the First Presidency, who are appointed with you to be your counselors and your leaders, is the power of this priesthood given, for the last days and for the last time, in the which is the dispensation of the fulness of times,

31 Which power you hold, in connection with all those who have received a dispensation at any time from the beginning of the creation;

32 For verily I say unto you, the keys of the dispensation, which ye have received, have come down from the fathers, and last of all, being sent down from heaven unto you.

To Joseph Smith was given the keys of this dispensation, BUT NEVER
did he receive the presiding "keys of this ministry" of the Gospel or
"keys of the kingdom of God" of ALL dispensations from
A.D.30 to Christ's Second Coming.
These keys are held by Peter, James, and John.
Futhermore inasmuch as Peter and James have passed through
and beyond the invisible veil, it places John – the Davidic servant,
as the only one holding these certain presiding keys in the flesh.

D&C 7

1 And the Lord said unto me: John, my beloved, what desirest thou? For if you shall ask what you will, it shall be granted unto you.

2 And I said unto him: Lord, give unto me power over death, that I may live and bring souls unto thee.

3 And the Lord said unto me: Verily, verily, I say unto thee, because thou desirest this thou shalt tarry until I come in my glory, and shalt prophesy before nations, kindreds, tongues and people.

4 And for this cause the Lord said unto Peter: If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? For he desired of me that he might bring souls unto me, but thou desiredst that thou mightest speedily come unto me in my kingdom.

5 I say unto thee, Peter, this was a good desire; but my beloved has desired that he might do more, or a greater work yet among men than what he has before done.

6 Yea, he has undertaken a greater work; therefore I will make him as flaming fire and a ministering angel; he shall minister for those who shall be heirs of salvation who dwell on the earth.

7 And I will make thee to minister for him and for thy brother James; and unto you three I will give this power and the keys of this ministry until I come.

D&C 27

12 And also with Peter, and James, and John, whom I have sent unto you, by whom I have ordained you and confirmed you to be apostles, and especial witnesses of my name, and bear the keys of your ministry and of the same things which I revealed unto them;

13 Unto whom I have committed the keys of my kingdom, and a dispensation of the gospel for the last times; and for the fulness of times, in the which I will gather together in one all things, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth;

Our exclusive right to this Priesthood will therefore terminate at the return of
The lord’s end-time servant.
John the beloved - the Davidic king - the marred servant
and others.


https://ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopic.p ... 92#p914692

[I AM]

so just curious
what do you think about the Lord's end-time servant that is to come ?

you know
"The mighty and strong one" that will “ set in order the house of God";
or do you, like the church, don't believe in him or talk about him,
because he will be their downfall and the end of their rule.

This Man like Moses,
" whom rightly belongs the priesthood,
and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign,
and for the gathering of my people in the last days."

5 What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?
6 Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse,
as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood,
and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign,
and for the gathering of my people in the last days.
D&C113

This Davidic servant - this Elias - a forerunner
to the coming of Christ. Just as John the Baptist
was an Elias - a forerunner to Christ.

This "marred" servant.
"The Gentiles, will harm and mar this Servant.
A servant of God who cries repentance to the Lord's latter-day people
who have lapsed into apostasy from their destined mission to establish the kingdom of God on the earth.
He will be marred by them and then healed by the Lord in conjunction with a marvelous deliverance of an awakened remnant who will build Zion.
The Davidic Servant will be to the Mormons what Joseph Smith was to Christianity and what Jesus Christ was to the Jews and what Moses was to Paganism -- a quantum leap forward; new wine, unfit for old bottles."

"Most importantly, he is to the Mormons what Jesus was to the Jews. He is the second advent of Messiah. He is the one mighty and strong sent to set the house of God in order.

The Mormons are prophesied to mar the Davidic Servant, in a parallel to the Jews' crucifixion of Jesus Christ. The triumphal regeneration or healing following that marring will be on a parallel with the resurrection. And as Jesus' mission was about individual salvation, the Davidic Servant's mission will be about societal salvation; and in conjunction with his healing will come a miraculous deliverance from the governmental beast which will have taken a stranglehold upon the entire earth at that point. A nation will be born in a day. The kingdom of God will be established on earth, no more to be thrown down. It will be Zion, a celestial people and city. It will start small, but will eventually (after the next 1000 years) fill the whole earth. Meanwhile, (as most citizens of the earth following the pending tribulations will be of a terrestrial order, none telestial having made it through the purgings of their own making) this Zion will be the capital of the world government that will reign in righteousness under Christ for 1000 years.

When the Mormons mar the Davidic Servant is when the times of the Gentiles is fulfilled. They will have filled the measure of their iniquity, and the kingdom will be taken from them and given back to the house of Israel. Then is when the 144,000 go forth to bring in as many as will to the church of the firstborn, which is a celestial order. The world at large will still be very wicked during this time, for the final purgings of the whole earth have not yet happened. The Jews will not yet be converted."


"We Gentiles, and also the entire World, will have two choices
when the Davidic King arrives: we will either
(1) harden our hearts to our own condemnation and destruction; or else
(2) we will repent and prepare to join Zion.
There will be a complete division between the righteous
and the wicked in that day."

also
please see more on this servant - this "forerunner to Jehovah’s coming"
"Because the servant is a forerunner to Jehovah’s coming to reign on the earth, the roles of Jehovah and his servant are closely intertwined."
http://www.isaiahexplained.com/11#commentary

Gileadi
page 4
The Gathering of Israel’s Outcasts from Exile

"A hard fact of Isaiah’s end-time scenario is that it is not those who appear to be God’s people whom God saves in the end but those who are rejected by the majority. These “outcasts” suffer “reproach” and “ridicule,” are “excluded” from God’s people, and, like God’s servant who gathers them, are “despised” and “abhorred” until God reverses their circumstances (Isaiah 49:7–8; 51:7; 60:15–16; 61:7, 9; 66:5–8). In the end, those who are excluded and betrayed by their own people, are gathered with God’s righteous remnant: “Thus says my Lord Jehovah, who gathers up the outcasts of Israel: ‘I will gather others to those already gathered’” (Isaiah 56:3, 8).

[Zathura]

So, if the Holy Ghost tells me you are an apostate where does that put you?

That's easy, I then know you aren't led by the spirit. You could say the same thing about me but you would be lying.

I can’t help but notice you haven’t backed up your claims in your other post. Will continue as a liar and slanderer or you will you explain why you call a fellow Saint the worst name you could call a member of the church?
If you don’t explain yourself, you’re no better than the liars and slanderers who defame the name of Joseph Smith with lies and false claims and accusations with no basis.


Will you continue on as a child? Unable to play well with others? Hurting other children when you don’t get what you want but unable to explain to your dad why you did what you did?

What claim are you referring to?

That I am on the other side of the fence. (A sly way of saying I'm apostate without the mods being able to do anything about it)

[Cheetos]

That's easy, I then know you aren't led by the spirit. You could say the same thing about me but you would be lying.

I can’t help but notice you haven’t backed up your claims in your other post. Will continue as a liar and slanderer or you will you explain why you call a fellow Saint the worst name you could call a member of the church?
If you don’t explain yourself, you’re no better than the liars and slanderers who defame the name of Joseph Smith with lies and false claims and accusations with no basis.


Will you continue on as a child? Unable to play well with others? Hurting other children when you don’t get what you want but unable to explain to your dad why you did what you did?

What claim are you referring to?

That I am on the other side of the fence. (A sly way of saying I'm apostate without the mods being able to do anything about it)

It's rather simple- if you are of the belief our current leaders are who they say they are- special witnesses of Jesus Christ then you must be on the other side of the fence.

[Zathura]

I can’t help but notice you haven’t backed up your claims in your other post. Will continue as a liar and slanderer or you will you explain why you call a fellow Saint the worst name you could call a member of the church?
If you don’t explain yourself, you’re no better than the liars and slanderers who defame the name of Joseph Smith with lies and false claims and accusations with no basis.


Will you continue on as a child? Unable to play well with others? Hurting other children when you don’t get what you want but unable to explain to your dad why you did what you did?

What claim are you referring to?

That I am on the other side of the fence. (A sly way of saying I'm apostate without the mods being able to do anything about it)

It's rather simple- if you are of the belief our current leaders are who they say they are- special witnesses of Jesus Christ then you must be on the other side of the fence.

Okay, I’ve never stated to you my belief on them , so how can you make this claim about me when you don’t know my belief?

And I’m glad you’ve made it clear that you have this idea of a doctrine of faith in mortal men, and that somehow this faith in this men results in some blessing. Such a doctrine does not exist, you should not have faith in a mortal man. Those mortal men serve to point you towards Jesus, towards the gate that he guards. Whether you think they are special witnesses or non-special witness is unimportant.There is a gate, and the Lord employs no servant at that gate. Your belief and faith in 15 mortal men won’t get you through that gate because they are not employed to guard that Gate. Jesus Christ alone is at that gate, and belief in him alone will determine if you make it to the other side of that gate.

[ThePowerofEternity111]

“I have often said to the Latter-day Saints - Live so that you will know whether I teach you the truth or not.
Suppose you are careless and unconcerned, and give way to the spirit of the world, and I am led, likewise, to preach the things of this world and to accept things that are NOT of God, how easy it would be for me to lead you astray! But I say to you, live so that you will know for yourselves whether I tell the truth or NOT That is the way we want all Saints to live.” Brigham Young (JD 18:248)

“I told the people that if they would not believe the revelations that God had given, He would suffer the devil to give revelations, Have I seen this fulfilled? I have. I told the people that as true as God lived, if they would NOT have truth, they would have error sent unto them and they would believe it." Brigham Young (Deseret News, June 8, 1873; 2 Thes. 2:10-12)

For the Lord hath said: This is my church, and I will establish it; and nothing shall overthrow it, save it is the *transgression of my people.

I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world will HATE YOU.” Also “Blessed are ye, when men shall persecute you, and shall say ALL manner of EVIL AGAINST YOU falsely, for my sake. Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven.” But “Woe, Woe, unto you, when ALL men shall speak WELL OF YOU! for so did they unto the FALSE prophets which were before you.”

When the spirit of persecution, the spirit of hatred, of wrath and malice ceases in the world against this (LDS) people, it will be the time that this (LDS) people have APOSTATIZED and joined hands with the wicked, and never until then.” Brigham Young (JD 4:327)

"Behold, I speak unto you as if ye were present, and yet ye are not. But behold, Jesus Christ hath shown you unto me, and I know your doing... O ye pollutions, ye hypocrites, ye teachers, who sell yourselves for that which will canker, why have ye polluted the holy church of God?

5 The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have transgressed the laws, changed the ordinance, broken the everlasting covenant.

6 Therefore hath the curse devoured the earth, and they that dwell therein are desolate: therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left.

When we see the time that we can willingly strike hands and have full fellowship with those who despise the Kingdom of God know ye then that the Priesthood of the Son of God is out of your possession. Let us be careful how we make friends with and fellowship unrighteousness, lest the curse of God descends heavily upon us. Brigham Young (J.D. Vol. 10:273)

[Thinker]

Joseph Smith dictated the way he read the bible. So, obviously.....since he read chiasmus in the bible, his brilliant sermons are full of chiasmus. Pretty elementary really.

If you think about it, back then, there wasn’t a lot to do indoors during winters especially for a poor family crammed into a little cabin with not much belongings. I imagine the bible may have been one of the few books Joseph Smith’s family owned & the bible may have been the source of education as well as religion - so Joseph Smith was likely very familiar with it - much more than most are today. Not until after Joseph Smith (1850’s) was there compulsory education of children made a law. Before then, maybe the bible was the primary source of children’s home-schooling.

And considering the popularity of the bible along with religious controversies, an intelligent person would capitalize on it by knowing it inside and out.

“How long has the Bible been a best seller?
Since the printing press was invented by German inventor Johannes Gutenberg produced a copy as the first book to be printed. That was in the 15th Century AD. The Bible has been on the N.Y. Times best seller list since 1953. The Bible is for sure the best selling book ever.”

[ThePowerofEternity111]

The day is soon and almost here many shall know then they never knew the Son of God, yet called on his name and thought they were his people yet they rejected him for abides not his word and knew not his spirit, and the Holy Ghost shall rebuke them and saith ye have never known me for ye know not the Lord.

[I AM]

Brigham Young quotes Joseph Smith in J. of D. 4, p. 271 who said: "I am a
God to this people." When I presented my Ms. for my booklet: "The Holy Ghost
is Who and What" to the Brethren, Apostle Callis and Jos. A. Merrill, rejected
it as junk, saying, "Joseph Smith was JUST a prophet like unto Paul." Now
then, when you consider that the L.D.S. Church leaders and major portion of
the Saints have cut to pieces and ignored Joseph Smith's teachings and
warnings -- isn't that sinning against the personage of the Holy Ghost?
Do you blame me for my desire to sound warning to them? I can truly see 90% of them headed for the great, in size, Terrestrial Glory.
President John Taylor
foretold that only 10% of the Saints would remain faithful, beginning with the
7th president. That was Grant. They are truly not valiant in living and
teaching the fulness of the Gospel and they hate those who do.
They are truly hanging onto the sleeve of the blind.

[Cheetos]

What claim are you referring to?

That I am on the other side of the fence. (A sly way of saying I'm apostate without the mods being able to do anything about it)

It's rather simple- if you are of the belief our current leaders are who they say they are- special witnesses of Jesus Christ then you must be on the other side of the fence.

Okay, I’ve never stated to you my belief on them , so how can you make this claim about me when you don’t know my belief?

And I’m glad you’ve made it clear that you have this idea of a doctrine of faith in mortal men, and that somehow this faith in this men results in some blessing. Such a doctrine does not exist, you should not have faith in a mortal man. Those mortal men serve to point you towards Jesus, towards the gate that he guards. Whether you think they are special witnesses or non-special witness is unimportant.There is a gate, and the Lord employs no servant at that gate. Your belief and faith in 15 mortal men won’t get you through that gate because they are not employed to guard that Gate. Jesus Christ alone is at that gate, and belief in him alone will determine if you make it to the other side of that gate.

I'm not sure how one finds himself on the right side of the fence if he rejects the belief that the living prophets have the authority to act for and in behalf of God (have authority of God's holy priesthood).

[thestock]

Joseph Smith dictated the way he read the bible. So, obviously.....since he read chiasmus in the bible, his brilliant sermons are full of chiasmus. Pretty elementary really.

If you think about it, back then, there wasn’t a lot to do indoors during winters especially for a poor family crammed into a little cabin with not much belongings. I imagine the bible may have been one of the few books Joseph Smith’s family owned & the bible may have been the source of education as well as religion - so Joseph Smith was likely very familiar with it - much more than most are today. Not until after Joseph Smith (1850’s) was there compulsory education of children made a law. Before then, maybe the bible was the primary source of children’s home-schooling.

And considering the popularity of the bible along with religious controversies, an intelligent person would capitalize on it by knowing it inside and out.

“How long has the Bible been a best seller?
Since the printing press was invented by German inventor Johannes Gutenberg produced a copy as the first book to be printed. That was in the 15th Century AD. The Bible has been on the N.Y. Times best seller list since 1953. The Bible is for sure the best selling book ever.”

Exactly correct. I sort of roll my eyes a bit when people cite presence of chiasmus as evidence that the BoM is a divine translation. To this day I still speak "scripture speak" when I pray or give a sermon. I use the language of the scriptures, complete with "thee" and "thou" etc. So many accounts testify that this is how Joseph spoke; he spoke the language of the scriptures. It was second nature to him. He was intimately familiar with the OT. To me, it would seem obvious that his BoM sermons would look similar to OT sermons......

[Zathura]

That I am on the other side of the fence. (A sly way of saying I'm apostate without the mods being able to do anything about it)

It's rather simple- if you are of the belief our current leaders are who they say they are- special witnesses of Jesus Christ then you must be on the other side of the fence.

Okay, I’ve never stated to you my belief on them , so how can you make this claim about me when you don’t know my belief?

And I’m glad you’ve made it clear that you have this idea of a doctrine of faith in mortal men, and that somehow this faith in this men results in some blessing. Such a doctrine does not exist, you should not have faith in a mortal man. Those mortal men serve to point you towards Jesus, towards the gate that he guards. Whether you think they are special witnesses or non-special witness is unimportant.There is a gate, and the Lord employs no servant at that gate. Your belief and faith in 15 mortal men won’t get you through that gate because they are not employed to guard that Gate. Jesus Christ alone is at that gate, and belief in him alone will determine if you make it to the other side of that gate.

I'm not sure how one finds himself on the right side of the fence if he rejects the belief that the living prophets have the authority to act for and in behalf of God (have authority of God's holy priesthood).

I’m not sure how one can hear Jesus say he employs no servant at the gate and yet still convince themselves that surely Jesus employs someone at the gate.

Having faith in mortal men, insisting that you must have faith in mortal men, and defending such garbage. Such a sad state.

[I AM]

ya, like I said

trusting in men. and their precepts,
and in the arm of the flesh.

Be Wary of Man and His Words
http://www.7witnesses.com/uploads/3/8/9 ... _words.pdf

and btw
because of our apostasy
we have lost the priesthood
and authority

[jmack]

Studying Acts so far it is apparent that the apostles and disciples were well versed in the scriptures. They all took scripture (as did Christ) from the Old testament and made it there own. I would hope if God is unchanging he would have given the same word to the Nephites and the Lamanites. That is why we see so much similarity between the BOM and the Bible. God's word does not change no matter what time, clime, or nation we live in this world.

We see so much similarity between the BOM and the Bible because Joseph Smith was an expert in the Bible and, in fact, copies it verbatim to the tune of about 1/5 of the BoM text is a direct copy and paste.

I don't know of any 20 year old's that are expert in anything in the History of the world.

So because you dont know them, they dont exist? Stupid farmboy Joseph Smith was smarter than you think. 3 years after the publication of the BOM he is teaching Hebrew to his followers in the school of the prophets. Yeah, what a dummy.....

Joseph's critics are all over the map on this. He's a super diabolical genius or he's the horny village idiot of Palmyra. Come on people make up your minds!! And fyi, he wasn't teaching Hebrew, he hired Professor Joshua Sexias. He was an exceptional student though. Get your facts straight.

[jmack]

It's rather simple- if you are of the belief our current leaders are who they say they are- special witnesses of Jesus Christ then you must be on the other side of the fence.

Okay, I’ve never stated to you my belief on them , so how can you make this claim about me when you don’t know my belief?

And I’m glad you’ve made it clear that you have this idea of a doctrine of faith in mortal men, and that somehow this faith in this men results in some blessing. Such a doctrine does not exist, you should not have faith in a mortal man. Those mortal men serve to point you towards Jesus, towards the gate that he guards. Whether you think they are special witnesses or non-special witness is unimportant.There is a gate, and the Lord employs no servant at that gate. Your belief and faith in 15 mortal men won’t get you through that gate because they are not employed to guard that Gate. Jesus Christ alone is at that gate, and belief in him alone will determine if you make it to the other side of that gate.

I'm not sure how one finds himself on the right side of the fence if he rejects the belief that the living prophets have the authority to act for and in behalf of God (have authority of God's holy priesthood).

I’m not sure how one can hear Jesus say he employs no servant at the gate and yet still convince themselves that surely Jesus employs someone at the gate.

Having faith in mortal men, insisting that you must have faith in mortal men, and defending such garbage. Such a sad state.

Do you believe the Israelites were duped into thinking they were supposed to listen to Moses? How about Abraham, Issac and Jacob? How about John the Baptist and Peter? Did Satan influence men to pretend to receive revelation and write scripture to make themselves a go between that God did not want? Or was it ok to follow ancient prophets but modern one's who try to lead serve the Devil?