LDS Freedom Forum

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 1st, 2019, 11:56 pm
Did you name yourself “I Am” because you think you are the one, the annoying man child?

When the anointed man child emerges we will know.

justme wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 10:19 am It seems to be human nature yet I would think an immature side of it to think we are special. That is why people for so long fought against the heliocentric model since "obviously" we are the center of the solar system if not universe. This also manifests itself in a preoccupation that our time on earth is important or central. In our church culture it lends itself to the idea that the end is near, definitely within our lifetime. Problem is people have thought that since the resurrection. Even in our latter days people have thought the end was near, like 1890 and so forth. But our grandparents have come and gone and it didn't happen in their lifetime, why is ours different.

I remember looking forward to 1984 to see how close Orwell had his predictions. Then people were all worked up about 2000. In the church people were looking at April 6, 2003 since that was the first year of the millennium where April 6 was on a Sunday. Then there was the 2012 hype. And on and on and yet we are still here.

The Book of Mormon people were constantly warned that they would be destroyed when they were ripe. But that took a thousand years. God time is not our time and we are not special. So like I have said before and above. I think it will be at least decades if not centuries.

Davka wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 12:54 pm

justme wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 10:19 am It seems to be human nature yet I would think an immature side of it to think we are special. That is why people for so long fought against the heliocentric model since "obviously" we are the center of the solar system if not universe. This also manifests itself in a preoccupation that our time on earth is important or central. In our church culture it lends itself to the idea that the end is near, definitely within our lifetime. Problem is people have thought that since the resurrection. Even in our latter days people have thought the end was near, like 1890 and so forth. But our grandparents have come and gone and it didn't happen in their lifetime, why is ours different.

I remember looking forward to 1984 to see how close Orwell had his predictions. Then people were all worked up about 2000. In the church people were looking at April 6, 2003 since that was the first year of the millennium where April 6 was on a Sunday. Then there was the 2012 hype. And on and on and yet we are still here.

The Book of Mormon people were constantly warned that they would be destroyed when they were ripe. But that took a thousand years. God time is not our time and we are not special. So like I have said before and above. I think it will be at least decades if not centuries.

You have a legitimate point about everyone thinking they are the ones living in the prophesied timeframe. Thing is...at some point, there will be a group of people that actually are. So, you can assume you are that group or assume you’re not that group. The latter, I believe, is a safer bet.

I AM wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 8:26 am

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 12:13 am

I AM wrote: ↑July 2nd, 2019, 2:12 pm

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 2nd, 2019, 12:49 pm

I don’t know you to judge you, I know the words of the lord are elegant or sharp. Yours are neither, they are all over the map like anger.

Take a deep breath and be sharp only when you need to be, be elegant all other times.

Man thinks respect is earned.

What did the lord show us when he sat with the wicked?

--------------
and the Lord said -
"O faithless generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you?"
"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword."

sorry my friend, but these are not my words,
but the words of the Lord I'm quoting in the scriptures I posted.
so It's not me at all that you would be judging;
it would be the Lord.

Are judging me that I’m apart of the faithless generation because I told you that your post are not organized and elegant? If it isn’t of the one it’s of the other. Would the lord talk like you do?

--------------
yes
those were His words that I quoted- not mine.
so yes, the Lord DOES talk that way.
but as far as His words that I quoted,
" how long shall I be with you?" how long shall I suffer you?"
is because that's how I feel, because people don't believe,
even though I continue to put forth the words of Christ,
they only mock.

Davka wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 12:54 pm

justme wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 10:19 am It seems to be human nature yet I would think an immature side of it to think we are special. That is why people for so long fought against the heliocentric model since "obviously" we are the center of the solar system if not universe. This also manifests itself in a preoccupation that our time on earth is important or central. In our church culture it lends itself to the idea that the end is near, definitely within our lifetime. Problem is people have thought that since the resurrection. Even in our latter days people have thought the end was near, like 1890 and so forth. But our grandparents have come and gone and it didn't happen in their lifetime, why is ours different.

I remember looking forward to 1984 to see how close Orwell had his predictions. Then people were all worked up about 2000. In the church people were looking at April 6, 2003 since that was the first year of the millennium where April 6 was on a Sunday. Then there was the 2012 hype. And on and on and yet we are still here.

The Book of Mormon people were constantly warned that they would be destroyed when they were ripe. But that took a thousand years. God time is not our time and we are not special. So like I have said before and above. I think it will be at least decades if not centuries.

You have a legitimate point about everyone thinking they are the ones living in the prophesied timeframe. Thing is...at some point, there will be a group of people that actually are. So, you can assume you are that group or assume you’re not that group. The latter, I believe, is a safer bet.

justme wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 2:18 pm

Davka wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 12:54 pm

justme wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 10:19 am It seems to be human nature yet I would think an immature side of it to think we are special. That is why people for so long fought against the heliocentric model since "obviously" we are the center of the solar system if not universe. This also manifests itself in a preoccupation that our time on earth is important or central. In our church culture it lends itself to the idea that the end is near, definitely within our lifetime. Problem is people have thought that since the resurrection. Even in our latter days people have thought the end was near, like 1890 and so forth. But our grandparents have come and gone and it didn't happen in their lifetime, why is ours different.

I remember looking forward to 1984 to see how close Orwell had his predictions. Then people were all worked up about 2000. In the church people were looking at April 6, 2003 since that was the first year of the millennium where April 6 was on a Sunday. Then there was the 2012 hype. And on and on and yet we are still here.

The Book of Mormon people were constantly warned that they would be destroyed when they were ripe. But that took a thousand years. God time is not our time and we are not special. So like I have said before and above. I think it will be at least decades if not centuries.

You have a legitimate point about everyone thinking they are the ones living in the prophesied timeframe. Thing is...at some point, there will be a group of people that actually are. So, you can assume you are that group or assume you’re not that group. The latter, I believe, is a safer bet.

True, so I like the quote from Wilford Woodruff, iircc, about the second coming. " I live as if it is tomorrow but I'm still planting cherry trees"

justme wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 12:48 pm The wikipedia article for this phenomena has some interesting insights in its introduction and an extensive list of past predictions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_d ... tic_events

I did find the following paragraph with statistics to be interesting.

Polls conducted in 2012 across 20 countries found over 14% of people believe the world will end in their lifetime, with percentages ranging from 6% of people in France to 22% in the US and Turkey. Belief in the apocalypse is most prevalent in people with lower rates of education, lower household incomes, and those under the age of 35.[9][10] In the UK in 2015, 23% of the general public believed the apocalypse was likely to occur in their lifetime, compared to 10% of experts from the Global Challenges Foundation. The general public believed the likeliest cause would be nuclear war, while experts thought it would be artificial intelligence. Only 3% of Britons thought the end would be caused by the Last Judgement, compared to 16% of Americans. Between one and three percent of people from both countries thought the apocalypse would be caused by zombies or alien invasion.[11][12][13]

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 1:34 pm

I AM wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 8:26 am

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 12:13 am

I AM wrote: ↑July 2nd, 2019, 2:12 pm
--------------
and the Lord said -
"O faithless generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you?"
"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword."

sorry my friend, but these are not my words,
but the words of the Lord I'm quoting in the scriptures I posted.
so It's not me at all that you would be judging;
it would be the Lord.

Are judging me that I’m apart of the faithless generation because I told you that your post are not organized and elegant? If it isn’t of the one it’s of the other. Would the lord talk like you do?

--------------
yes
those were His words that I quoted- not mine.
so yes, the Lord DOES talk that way.
but as far as His words that I quoted,
" how long shall I be with you?" how long shall I suffer you?"
is because that's how I feel, because people don't believe,
even though I continue to put forth the words of Christ,
they only mock.

Matthew 15:26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children’s bread, and to cast it to dogs.

Am I justified to you these words against any woman or man that is not of the House of Israel?

We are not mocking the lord’s words. We are asking why do you feel justified in using them to shame us into repentance?

I AM wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 6:46 pm

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 1:34 pm

I AM wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 8:26 am

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 12:13 am

Are judging me that I’m apart of the faithless generation because I told you that your post are not organized and elegant? If it isn’t of the one it’s of the other. Would the lord talk like you do?

--------------
yes
those were His words that I quoted- not mine.
so yes, the Lord DOES talk that way.
but as far as His words that I quoted,
" how long shall I be with you?" how long shall I suffer you?"
is because that's how I feel, because people don't believe,
even though I continue to put forth the words of Christ,
they only mock.

Matthew 15:26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children’s bread, and to cast it to dogs.

Am I justified to you these words against any woman or man that is not of the House of Israel?

We are not mocking the lord’s words. We are asking why do you feel justified in using them to shame us into repentance?

--------------
if you feel that way, then you might ask yourself why.
And WHY would you think I feel justified ?
Just because I post the scriptures !
How can I feel justified - just for showing scriptures (that I didn't write)
that are very important we heed.
I can't take credit, or thinking I'm better just because I'm posting
these scriptures that are calling members to repent.

If you feel that these words in the scriptures I post shame people into repentance,
then that's what they're suppose to do; and it's the author that wrote them
for that very purpose, and not me.
Do you think that I'm thinking I'm better than everyone else, ?
just by showing and warning everyone about what these scriptures are saying.
Believe me, I'm far from perfect; and if you think that I'm saying they apply to you
and all the members and not me, you're wrong, they probably apply to me even more.

I wish there was a way that these scriptures could just be posted anonymously.

just pretend that I'm anonymous (which I almost am)
and these scriptures just appeared (only scriptures)
then you would have no one to blame and say -
"why are you telling us these scriptures"
"do you think you're better than us".
In order for us to progress individually,
and as a church and a people,
we have to repent and see that these scriptures that condemn,
and the warnings in them are for us.
These words are there in our scriptures,
so even though they might not be very easy to read,
especially when they are condemning us,
we need to read them and heed their warnings
so we can repent and change our ways
before it's too late.

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 10:35 pm

I AM wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 6:46 pm

Bronco73idi wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 1:34 pm

I AM wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 8:26 am
--------------
yes
those were His words that I quoted- not mine.
so yes, the Lord DOES talk that way.
but as far as His words that I quoted,
" how long shall I be with you?" how long shall I suffer you?"
is because that's how I feel, because people don't believe,
even though I continue to put forth the words of Christ,
they only mock.

Matthew 15:26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children’s bread, and to cast it to dogs.

Am I justified to you these words against any woman or man that is not of the House of Israel?

We are not mocking the lord’s words. We are asking why do you feel justified in using them to shame us into repentance?

--------------
if you feel that way, then you might ask yourself why.
And WHY would you think I feel justified ?
Just because I post the scriptures !
How can I feel justified - just for showing scriptures (that I didn't write)
that are very important we heed.
I can't take credit, or thinking I'm better just because I'm posting
these scriptures that are calling members to repent.

If you feel that these words in the scriptures I post shame people into repentance,
then that's what they're suppose to do; and it's the author that wrote them
for that very purpose, and not me.
Do you think that I'm thinking I'm better than everyone else, ?
just by showing and warning everyone about what these scriptures are saying.
Believe me, I'm far from perfect; and if you think that I'm saying they apply to you
and all the members and not me, you're wrong, they probably apply to me even more.

I wish there was a way that these scriptures could just be posted anonymously.

just pretend that I'm anonymous (which I almost am)
and these scriptures just appeared (only scriptures)
then you would have no one to blame and say -
"why are you telling us these scriptures"
"do you think you're better than us".
In order for us to progress individually,
and as a church and a people,
we have to repent and see that these scriptures that condemn,
and the warnings in them are for us.
These words are there in our scriptures,
so even though they might not be very easy to read,
especially when they are condemning us,
we need to read them and heed their warnings
so we can repent and change our ways
before it's too late.

Why did the lord call the Canaanite woman a dog? To educate his apostles.

Who do you think you are to use the lord’s sharp words to educate me or my brothers and sisters on this forum? A prophet???

If the lord needs me to read his words he will not remove my stumbling blocks until I repent.

Doc wrote: ↑July 1st, 2019, 8:44 am The prophet bluntly called for the saints to repent this last priesthood session. I know what you want, it’s what we all want...but maybe this is what’s partly meant by the “silence” in heaven. Maybe the times of the gentiles are fulfilled and it’s too late for our country??

I’ve tested all of our prophet’s challenges (daily repentance, focus on personal revelation, etc..), and I have never been more converted to the Lord. While you may not agree, I believe there is wisdom in how our true prophet is leading the church.

I want justice and judgement called down upon the wicked in a glorious and miraculous way...but take a step back and look at each member of our fallen country like a father looks at his son. God loves the sinner too and He will ensure a maximal return on His holy investment in this Earth. His ways are not ours.

I respect your fervor, but I see things a little different.

I AM wrote: ↑July 3rd, 2019, 11:58 pm well, I can't say that I'm surprised.
I expected such a reply.
Jesus warned of such, that would not hear His words
and fight against them.
But I guess that's free agency.
Such opposition - led by the spirit and father of contention -
full of anger and hostility - has always opposed and fought against truth.

I AM wrote: ↑July 5th, 2019, 8:41 am like I said -
True prophets call people to repent

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it.
He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it."

Martin Luther King, Jr.

justme wrote: ↑July 5th, 2019, 8:56 am

I AM wrote: ↑July 5th, 2019, 8:41 am like I said -
True prophets call people to repent

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it.
He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it."

Martin Luther King, Jr.

I agree.
Here is an excellent talk by President Nelson on repentance.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... repentance

Have a great Friday, I am.

I AM wrote: ↑July 1st, 2019, 7:51 pm

capctr wrote: ↑July 1st, 2019, 7:20 pm

I AM wrote: ↑July 1st, 2019, 10:51 am are the LGBT'S in the church doing something that is not accepted
and CAN NOT be accepted by God ?
Are church leaders calling them to repent ? NO !
so are church leaders accepted by God ? NO ! ! !

The" King of Assyria" will hurl "The Drunkards of Ephraim" to the ground !

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=51987&p=943977#p943977

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=51987&p=943981#p943981

The " King of Assyria " !

The Lord uses him (His left hand)
against the church ( The Drunkards of Ephraim )

Isaiah 28

1 Woe to the garlands of glory
of the drunkards of Ephraim!
Their crowning splendor has become as fading wreaths
on the heads of the opulent overcome with wine.

Chapters 28-31, which form a didactic unit comprising Part VI of Isaiah’s Seven-Part Structure (Isaiah 28-31; 55-59),
each commence with a “woe” or covenant curse.
Ephraim’s chief sins of pride and drunkenness catch up with Israel’s birthright tribe in Jehovah’s Day of Judgment. Instead of acknowledging current inconvenient truths,
the people of Ephraim look back on past glories earned in more righteous times as if they still apply today. Ephraim’s self-deception, stemming from intoxication with “wine” at the highest levels, compounds the hard times that lie ahead (v 7; Isaiah 56:10-12).

"Isaiah's prophecy concerning Ephraim consists mostly of censure.
Ephraim lives in the past, acting as if former glories were current ones: “Woe to the garlands of glory of the drunkards of Ephraim!
Their crowning splendor has become as fading wreaths on the heads of the opulent overcome with wine” (Isaiah 28:1).
The king of Assyria—a new Flood (Isaiah 8:7–8)—will invade Ephraim’s land:

2.“My Lord has in store one mighty and strong: as a ravaging hailstorm sweeping down, or like an inundating deluge of mighty waters,
he will hurl them to the ground by his hand.

The proud garlands of the drunkards of Ephraim shall be trodden underfoot”(Isaiah 28:2–3)."


The imagery of “a ravaging hailstorm sweeping down” and of “an inundating deluge of mighty waters” identifies the king of Assyria/Babylon and his alliance of aggressor nations (Isaiah 8:7-8; 17:12; 18:2).
A second “one mighty and strong” in the Book of Isaiah is Jehovah’s servant, who makes an end of him at the last. Although Jehovah provides a refuge for a repentant remnant of his people against the storms of their enemies (Isaiah 4:6; 25:4-5; 57:13), he empowers the archtyrant—Jehovah’s (left) hand—over “the drunkards of Ephraim” to cast their illustriousness to the ground (cf. vv 1, 3).(Bold & Italics mine)


Isaiah 28

22 Jehovah will smite Egypt, and by smiting heal it: they will turn back to Jehovah, and he will respond to their pleas and heal them.

Although it is Jehovah who smites the wicked—both his own people and the nations (Isaiah 9:13; 27:7-8; 60:10)—he uses the king of Assyria/Babylon as his instrument (Isaiah 5:25; 10:20; 14:6).
Jehovah’s intent, however, is to cause the wicked to “turn back” to him—to “repent” and “return”—so that he may heal them. He heals them when at last they “see with their eyes and hear with their ears, understand in their heart, and repent, and are healed” (Isaiah 6:10; cf. 58:1-8).
Too often, however, only when wickedness results in covenant curses, does such healing occur (Isaiah 26:16; 27:4-5; 54:7-8).
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=51691&p=935863#p935863

The Drunkards of Ephraim
Isaiah 28:

quote

"First we must note here that Isaiah is speaking to "the drunkards of Ephraim”.
There is no question that the Latter-Day Saints refer to themselves as “Ephraim” and there is no question that the Church teaches that the very next chapter of Isaiah (chapter 29) refers to our day or the coming forth of the Church, and the Book of Mormon. Therefore, it would seem quite logical that Isaiah 28 would also refer to Ephraim of our day."
----------------------------------

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=51748&p=937148#p937148

I find it absurd that some, (the "all is well in Zion" crowd )
can say that Isaiah 28 has nothing to do with the church,
while the church itself says that Isaiah 29 does. AMAZING !

"First we must note here that Isaiah is speaking to "the drunkards of Ephraim”.
There is no question that the Latter-Day Saints refer to themselves as “Ephraim” and there is no question that the Church teaches that the very next chapter of Isaiah (chapter 29) refers to our day or the coming forth of the Church, and the Book of Mormon. Therefore, it would seem quite logical that Isaiah 28 would also refer to Ephraim of our day."

taken from: LDS Seminary Student Study Guide

"Isaiah 29 is one place in the Bible where the Book of Mormon is referred to, even though it is not mentioned by name.
As you read this chapter, look for prophecies of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon and the impact this book will have on the world."

If you want a big wake up call please read and study the 28th chapter of Isaiah,
it will reveal that every word applies to our church in these days
and to no other people.
Isaiah cites that this people would be given "precept upon precept;
precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little and there a little."
These identical words, were used by the Prophet Joseph Smith among his closing instructions
to the latter day saints, warning us to go forward not backward. D.C.128:21-22 ; 2Nephi 28:30

Isaiah 28:13 "But the word of the Lord was unto them
precept upon precept, precept upon precept;
line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little;
that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken,
and snared, and taken."

We are still satisfied with the ABC portions of the gospel.
We will not accept the meat portions of the gospel.

Isaiah 28:
9 Whom shall he give instruction?
Whom shall he enlighten with revelation?
Weanlings weaned from milk,those just taken from the breast?
10 For it is but line upon line, line upon line,precept upon precept,
precept upon precept;a trifle here, a trifle there.

Let me just cut to the chase:

Do you consider yourself to be a/the true prophet?
I admit, that despite some interesting things you sometimes post, I find myself veiwing you as little more than an antagonist, sowing seeds of distrust...you are straight up toxic sometimes, dude.

--------------
now let me guess -
you're one of the LGBT"S ?
that doesn't like to be told they're doing something wrong
and will try to justify themselves to the death. Am I right ?

regardless, doesn't matter anyway,;
I knew someone might make such a comment
and try to make me look like I'm thinking I'm a prophet,
despite the fact that I have said many times that these ARE NOT MY WORDS
but the words of Jesus Christ and the prophet Isaiah - who's words He said where great.
so READ THEM !

I AM wrote: ↑July 5th, 2019, 8:41 am like I said -
True prophets call people to repent

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it.
He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it."

Martin Luther King, Jr.

I AM wrote: ↑July 5th, 2019, 3:37 pm I choose to follow Christ - and His words - not the prophet and his.
And the commandment He gave was
"that ye search these things diligently;
for great are the words of Isaiah."

I wonder why ?
why are Isaiah's words so great ?
and why should we "search these things diligently";
because Isaiah's words tell of the follies of the church
and say that we have fallen into apostasy.

So it is not I that is "casting doubts on the living Prophet";
It's Isaiah's words, that Christ said to search diligently;
"for great are the words of Isaiah.""

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=51987&p=943978#p943978