Stake Centers and Chapels are a Luxury

[Lizzy60]

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

[mes5464]

I gave you the source in the OP. Did you miss it? Or do you not consider Dew's biography a reliable source? The quote is from Sheri Dew's book "Insights from a Prophet's Life: Russell M. Nelson" - you can buy it on Amazon if you want - https://www.amazon.com/Insights-Prophet ... way&sr=8-1

Sorry, I didn't catch that.

[Mark]

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

[justme]

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Actually Lizzy was just pointing out a fact. There is no intended slight on the Brethren or especially Elder Gong who I respect. It is more a jab on those who think that the cfr is some sort of nefarious colllection of boogie men trying to take over the world.

[Mark]

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Actually Lizzy was just pointing out a fact. There is no intended slight on the Brethren or especially Elder Gong who I respect. It is more a jab on those who think that the cfr is some sort of nefarious colllection of boogie men trying to take over the world.

Actually most posters on this site think the CFR really is a nefarious collection of boogie men trying to take over the world. Just ask Lizzy. I'm sure she is one. You are one of the only people on this site who doesn't think it is so. To funny.

[kittycat51]

Isn't there a correction? Elder Gong is not listed now as a member of the cfr. It's been many years ago if I remember correct that he was. (It was discussed on a previous thread right after he was sustained.)

[justme]

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Actually Lizzy was just pointing out a fact. There is no intended slight on the Brethren or especially Elder Gong who I respect. It is more a jab on those who think that the cfr is some sort of nefarious colllection of boogie men trying to take over the world.

Actually most posters on this site think the CFR really is a nefarious collection of boogie men trying to take over the world. Just ask Lizzy. I'm sure she is one. You are one of the only people on this site who doesn't think it is so. To funny.

I would be more concerned if someone was a member of the cougar club than the cfr.

[nightlight]

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Actually Lizzy was just pointing out a fact. There is no intended slight on the Brethren or especially Elder Gong who I respect. It is more a jab on those who think that the cfr is some sort of nefarious colllection of boogie men trying to take over the world.

Actually most posters on this site think the CFR really is a nefarious collection of boogie men trying to take over the world. Just ask Lizzy. I'm sure she is one. You are one of the only people on this site who doesn't think it is so. To funny.

Lol lol what is funny is you laughing at a Mormon for the thinking CFR was founded by Gadiantons.................lol it's funny cuz you are lds................................

[justme]

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Actually Lizzy was just pointing out a fact. There is no intended slight on the Brethren or especially Elder Gong who I respect. It is more a jab on those who think that the cfr is some sort of nefarious colllection of boogie men trying to take over the world.

Actually most posters on this site think the CFR really is a nefarious collection of boogie men trying to take over the world. Just ask Lizzy. I'm sure she is one. You are one of the only people on this site who doesn't think it is so. To funny.

Lol lol what is funny is you laughing at a Mormon for the thinking CFR was founded by Gadiantons.................lol it's funny cuz you are lds................................

Now we are getting twisted around and confused. I am LDS. But frankly, and I know it may see offensive so I'm sorry, but whenever I read this stuff about the cfr etc I chuckle because an image of Blofield holding a fluffy white cat on his lap in a wheel chair pops into mind.

[nightlight]

Actually Lizzy was just pointing out a fact. There is no intended slight on the Brethren or especially Elder Gong who I respect. It is more a jab on those who think that the cfr is some sort of nefarious colllection of boogie men trying to take over the world.

Actually most posters on this site think the CFR really is a nefarious collection of boogie men trying to take over the world. Just ask Lizzy. I'm sure she is one. You are one of the only people on this site who doesn't think it is so. To funny.

Lol lol what is funny is you laughing at a Mormon for the thinking CFR was founded by Gadiantons.................lol it's funny cuz you are lds................................

Now we are getting twisted around and confused. I am LDS. But frankly, and I know it may see offensive so I'm sorry, but whenever I read this stuff about the cfr etc I chuckle because an image of Blofield holding a fluffy white cat on his lap in a wheel chair pops into mind.

No offense taken....just makes me chuckle too (for a different reason).

LDS folks believe in Gadiantons. For a LDS to laugh at someone for thinking an organization like CFR is Gadianton.... is hypocritical/stupid/insane.

I think CFR is Gadianton. I understand that wouldn't make all CFR members Gadianton.

[EmmaLee]

The government wouldn't be the only threat to church buildings. The wickedness of the people. As for Lot, in Sodom and Gomorrah, the streets were not even safe.

While that is true (and likely with shooters and such coming into church buildings, killing people en mass, like they've done in many U.S. churches recently), the government is the only entity currently with the power to forcibly remove us from our buildings, as in, take them away from the Church (which they've done before; history repeats and it will again). I don't believe for a second that they'd stop with ward/stake buildings though - the temples would be the real prize, and with the gay agenda in full swing, that is most likely how it will happen, IMO.

[EmmaLee]

These comments of President Nelson's, below, strike me as an interesting line of thinking. My own thoughts on this are, and have been for many years, that the day is quickly coming when we will not be meeting in dedicated church buildings for Sunday worship. The possible reasons for this are varied, but two main ones keep coming to the forefront - 1) that it will not be safe to meet as large groups, especially as Christians, and MOST especially as LDS Christians, and 2) the gov't will forcibly take our buildings away from us - this however, would include our temples, which I can easily see happening one day.

The Lord will have a truly virtuous people to greet him at his return, and it will take a LOT of painful refining (burning out the dross) to get a people to that level of humility and true righteousness - the vast majority will not withstand the burning, which is why the people meeting him are always referred to as "few" and a "remnant" (rem·nant noun 1. a small remaining quantity of something.
synonyms: remains, remainder, leftovers, leavings, residue, rest). I often think we don't have the slightest clue of what is coming, the magnitude, scope, and depth of it - of what some will be called to go through, and will HAVE to go through, to become such a people.

Anyway, best to prepare - mentally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually - to go without 'luxury' (of any/all types).

***

“The only buildings that are absolutely essential are temples. Stake centers and chapels are a luxury”—President Nelson

As President of the Quorum of the Twelve, President Nelson encouraged frequent conversation with his Brethren about the “imbalance between what we are doing as a church and what we must do” as he described it.

Those who drive by or enter Latter-day Saints chapels see beautiful landscaping, nice parking lots, and handsome buildings with basketball courts inside. And yet most of the people of the earth live in China, India, and the Middle East- areas where billions live stacked on top of each other, wall to wall.

“One question we’ve wrestled with,” President Nelson said, “is how to take the gospel in its simple purity and the ordinances with their eternal efficacy to all of God’s children without having basketball hoops get in the way. We are accustomed to a church that is supported at home but accomplished in the chapels. We need a complete turnaround, where we have a home-centered church supported by what takes place inside our buildings. The only buildings that are absolutely essential are temples. Stake centers and chapels are a luxury.”

“This imbalance is on our worry list—high on the list. One Muslim man said it this way, ‘When your Christianity is simple enough that I can take it on the back of a camel, I will be interested.’ Faith, repentance, baptism, the endowment, and the sealing ordinance are essential. Everything you’ll see happening in the Church from this point forward will be in that direction.” —President Nelson

Taken from Sheri Dew’s biographical book, "Insights from a Prophet's Life Russell M. Nelson"

Can you tell me where Sheri Dew got this quote from?

Sheri Dew can't even tell you where she got the quote from, as there is no footnote, no source, no reference (no when/where) for the quote - so take it for what you want (as with most things). I've seen the pages in her book where the OP quotes are printed - so the quotes ARE in her book - but no further information is given. Pretty lame, if you ask me - or maybe we're just supposed to believe everything Dew writes because she's BFF's with Nelson's wife (even more lame), who knows.

[harakim]

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Please explain how this is a jab. It literally says nothing but Elder Gong.

[EmmaLee]

I have a book that has a quote from an early apostle or prophet that says the day will come when we will be prevented from meeting together. I think it was by the government. I'll post it if I can find it.

Thanks, Mirkwood. Yes, I've heard this my whole life growing up in the Church. I believe in the SL temple dedication, it even mentions when that temple will be removed from the Saints (paraphrasing). I'm actually quite surprised that any active member, especially if they've studied Church history at all, has doubts that this (not being able to meet together; our buildings taken away from us, etc.) will happen again.

[EmmaLee]

Too bad Jesus never included the "endowment" and "sealing ordinances" in the Bible or the Book of Mormon.

Hi Mindfields, thanks for your post. I have found that the endowment and other temple ordinances are in the Book of Mormon. I remember when I was reading in 3 Nephi a couple years ago and it hit me like a ton of bricks that that is what I was reading! I was amazed I'd never connected it to the temple before, given how many times I've read 3 Nephi (my favorite book of scripture) - but now when I read it, it's so clear, plain, and obvious. Please read 3 Nephi 19. Maybe others see it differently, but to me, that chapter is the same thing as our washing and anointing, prayer circle, knocking at the veil, etc. - lots of similarities and connections in there, IMO.

[EmmaLee]

(Feeling contrary today...)

I really don’t see how either of those scenarios could ever happen in the US / Europe / Aus / NZ etc advanced world countries.

What plausible situation could there be that would cause either your 1 or 2 to happen?

Come on, bro... its dangerous to think like that.

The BOM spells out how this happens to a people of God. Gadiantons are a real thing. Their goal is to outlaw Christ. If you don't think this can happen to us ...you are alseep.

This country will come under bondage...

By whom and how?

Who do you suspect are gadiantons now days?

Here is a really good article by my friend Connor - please read it, and consider who the real Gadianton's are - http://www.connorboyack.com/blog/modern ... wickedness

Excerpt -

"According to Moroni, we are directly commanded by God to ensure that similar secret combinations do not overthrow our own society. If this is the case, then two questions arise which must be answered: 1) what kind of people participate in secret combinations, and 2) what do secret combinations do?

A common belief is that secret combinations are gang members, people in the mafia, or cave-dwelling terrorists half a world away. These, however, do not meet the basic criteria for those combining in the Book of Mormon to bring down society. The most basic benchmark, other than the obvious lust for power and riches, is to overthrow the government. This is achieved not by violent revolution or external attacks, but by internal infestation. It was precisely because these combinations were able to “obtain the sole management of the government” that they were successful in their efforts.

With this criteria in place, it becomes evident that gang members or terrorists do not apply. Those involved in secret combinations of this sort are far more difficult for many people to label as such, for they look like them. They speak the same language, wear the same attire, and like the wolf in sheep’s clothing, mask themselves so well that they remain largely undetected. President Hinckley observed how these people gained power in ancient days, offering the clue as to who in our day might be so classified:

The people succumbed to the wiles of ambitious and scheming leaders who oppressed them with burdensome taxes, who lulled them with hollow promises, who countenanced and even encouraged loose and lascivious living. These evil schemers led the people into terrible wars that resulted in the death of millions and the final and total extinction of two great civilizations in two different eras.

This leads into the answer for the second question regarding what secret combinations do. The answer to this question also holds the key regarding how we can discharge the divine obligation to “suffer not that these murderous combinations shall get above you.” By obtaining positions of political power, those in secret combinations are able to ensure that their like-minded cohorts “should not suffer for their murders, and their plunderings, and their stealings.” Secret combinations don’t take down the government by attacking it from the sidelines—they do it by gutting it from within.

Those involved in this effort work to circumvent “the laws of their country” to instead carry on their nefarious deeds “according to the laws of their wickedness.” They “let[] the guilty and the wicked go unpunished because of their money” and are “held in office at the head of government, to rule and do according to their wills.”

Of course, the infestation of secret combinations into the Nephite and Jaredite societies would not have been successful without the toleration and support of the people themselves. Thus we read that a propaganda campaign was carried out to “seduce[] the more part of the righteous until they had come down to believe in their works and partake of their spoils, and to join with them in their secret murders and combinations.”

In other words, the people welcomed with open arms, and elected to various offices of power, those individuals who enabled them in their wickedness and protected them in their evil desires. Not wishing to be governed by God’s law and be held accountable for their wickedness, they embraced a corrupt system that justified them in their deviant behavior and sanctioned their wickedness in law.

The parallels to draw from these patterns are numerous and compelling. Consider one of the most recent examples, the Operation Fast and Furious scandal. This government program entailed the sale and delivery of guns to Mexican gun traffickers and drug cartels, ostensibly to track them to ferret out the individuals engaged in the trafficking. These guns have been used in a number of murders, including that of a U.S. Border Patrol agent, Brian Terry.

Amidst the eruption about who knew what and when, those at the highest levels of government have resisted investigation and dug in their heels. They have likewise promoted their own “laws of wickedness,” mandating their subordinates to not divulge any damaging information to Congress or news agencies, effectively closing ranks around those who are responsible for providing the guns used in these murders.

The financial bailouts in recent years are also an excellent example of this satanic behavior, wherein those who are guilty “go unpunished.” The institutions responsible for assuming risky debt, deemed “too big to fail” by their cohorts in this combination, were given stolen property from taxpayers to stave off their demise and instead guarantee their success. Rather than facing the consequences of their poor decisions and evil actions, they were let off the hook by like-minded politicians who have obtained “the sole management of the government.”

Any similar situation where the (moral, constitutional) laws of the country are rejected and replaced with the laws of wickedness is an example of modern-day gadiantonism. This is seen with social welfare laws stealing property from some to give to others, domestic surveillance in direct violation of the fourth amendment, TSA checkpoints which do the same, free speech restrictions which suppress dissent, Federal Reserve loans where one’s savings is deflated to help bankers amass more wealth, and on and on.

Moroni’s emphasis of what secret combinations did to two previous societies was not meant as a mere historical curiosity, but a warning and pattern for a future time—our time. “It is wisdom in God that these things should be shown you,” he wrote, to “suffer not that these murderous combinations shall get above you, which are built up to get power and gain.”

Thus we are commanded by God that when (not if) we see them in power, “that [we] shall awake to a sense of [our] awful situation.” Recognition of evil is the first step in counteracting it; unfortunately, too many people fail to realize that past, prophetic warnings are openly being fulfilled in our day."

[EmmaLee]

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

That's a strange way to think. Elder Gong is no longer a member of the CFR, as near as I can tell - but he once was. Did he wake up to the fact that it is an evil organization? Or did he just get too busy with other things, so he gave up his membership in that group? Or something else? Who knows, none of us do. It's erroneous to think though, that just because someone is a member of the Twelve they can't make bad/wrong choices/decisions. God doesn't take anyone's agency away, not even the apostles, and thank God for that.

[EmmaLee]

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Do you ever have anything constructive, or informational to say, or anything worthwhile to add to the discussion, or even remotely related to the OP, on ANY thread, Mark?? It seems that all you do on LDSFF is troll around looking to attack others who may have some different beliefs than you. What a sad, pathetic existence. And this particular post of yours is especially pathetic, as Lizzy did/said nothing other than to CORRECTLY name the apostle who did, in fact, belong to the CFR at one time. Why would you consider that a "jab", Mark?

Internet Troll - definition - In Internet slang, a troll is a person who starts quarrels or upsets people on the Internet to distract and sow discord by posting inflammatory and digressive, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses and normalizing tangential discussion, whether for the troll's amusement or a specific gain.

[EmmaLee]

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Actually Lizzy was just pointing out a fact. There is no intended slight on the Brethren or especially Elder Gong who I respect. It is more a jab on those who think that the cfr is some sort of nefarious colllection of boogie men trying to take over the world.

The CFR IS a very nefarious collection of REAL Gadianton robbers who are indeed trying to "take over the world". Going by your posts and political proclivities that you've expressed on the forum, you won't believe it, of course, and you will continue to mock and belittle anyone who disagrees with you, but that's okay. For those who care to learn something though, please read -

https://www.thenewamerican.com/world-ne ... orld-order

https://www.thenewamerican.com/print-ma ... sed-to-see

https://www.thenewamerican.com/tech/env ... ate-summit

[EmmaLee]

Elder Gong

Just waiting for someone to throw a jab at one of the Brethren in this thread. You never disappoint Lizzy..

Actually Lizzy was just pointing out a fact. There is no intended slight on the Brethren or especially Elder Gong who I respect. It is more a jab on those who think that the cfr is some sort of nefarious colllection of boogie men trying to take over the world.

Actually most posters on this site think the CFR really is a nefarious collection of boogie men trying to take over the world. Just ask Lizzy. I'm sure she is one. You are one of the only people on this site who doesn't think it is so. To funny.

Socialists of the world, unite!!

[Rand]

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Hollow accusation with no proof.

[Lizzy60]

Here is the documentation. It appears he left the organization some time ago.

viewtopic.php?t=48113


If you consider it an "accusation" to claim he was once a member of an organization, then you must believe that the organization is not one a good person should be associated with, am I correct?

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Hollow accusation with no proof.

[Silver Pie]

The only place I can find this quote is on Reddit. Does anyone have a more reliable source?

All I know is that I got the info in an email from AVOW. I'm not a paying member so I can't go to the link Christopher shared and see where he got it.

Edit: I might be confused. I'm not talking about Sheri Dew's book, but about an email I got today from AVOW in which they said (all emphases theirs):

"Dear AVOW member:
SingerGuy posted an amazing quote from President Nelson that might give us a very powerful insight into many of the changes we are seeing in the church of late AND a glimpse of what may yet be coming!

If you have a moment I strongly encourage you to come read his post. [link, which I did not copy]

"The only buildings that are absolutely essential are temples.
Stake centers and chapels are a luxury."

...

Everything you'll see happening in the Church from this point forward will be in that direction."

--President Nelson

[Lizzy60]

Back onto the topic of the OP, and the "quote" by Pres Nelson. Since Sherri and Wendy are BFF's, and they have been spending a lot of time traveling together, perhaps the "quote was from a private discussion somewhere, sometime. As such, perhaps she didn't provide attribution, because saying something like, Pres Nelson told us this while at dinner one night, or some such occasion. I have seen attributions that say "email exchange with so-and-so" or "private conversation with so-and-so" but maybe that didn't carry as much weight in Sister Dew's mind as just leaving out the documentation. Who knows?

I've been saying much the same thing in private conversations for about 10 years now, but I'm not an authority figure, LOL!!!

[EmmaLee]

I remember hearing when I was younger that the cfr was the arch enemy. That must not be the case since we now have a cfr member in the 12.

Who?

There are still those who think the CFR has evil purposes. Source: https://youtu.be/mXti2K_6Re0

Elder Gong

Hollow accusation with no proof.

The extreme irony is, your post is the one that is actually a hollow accusation with no proof.