The Holy Spirit and The Holy Ghost are the Same

[righteousrepublic]

Question: Why were the Lectures on Faith removed from the Doctrine and Covenants in 1921?
The Church said that they were removed because they had never been presented to or accepted by the membership as being anything other than theological lectures or lessons

The Church removed the Lectures from the Doctrine and Covenants in the 1921 edition with an explanation that the Lectures "were never presented to nor accepted by the Church as being otherwise than theological lectures or lessons". This is in contrast to the remaining pages of the original Doctrine and Covenants which are officially recognized as divine revelation given specifically to the church.

Joseph Fielding Smith said the following concerning their removal:

a) They were not received as revelations by the prophet Joseph Smith.
b) They are instructions relative to the general subject of faith. They are explanations of this principle but not doctrine.
c) They are not complete as to their teachings regarding the Godhead. More complete instructions on the point of doctrine are given in section 130 of the 1876 and all subsequent editions of the Doctrine and Covenants.
d) It was thought by Elder James E. Talmage, chairman, and other members of the committee who were responsible for their omission that to avoid confusion and contention on this vital point of belief, it would be better not to have them bound in the same volume as the commandments or revelations which make up the Doctrine and Covenants.

Source: https://www.fairmormon.org/answers/Doct ... in_1921.3F

And yet they leave other sections in the D&C which are not revelation and stated as not revelations is brought up in https://seekingyhwh.com/2019/06/09/the- ... -the-same/

I believe letter "c" applies most. Throughout scripture we read The Father, The Son, and The Holy Ghost. There is no doubt that there are three distinct individuals in the Godhead. All three think alike, act alike and testify of the other alike, being one God.

Think about it, God wants us to think like him, act like him and testify of him. They, the Father, Son and Holy Ghost all want us to become one with them. Scriptures to this truth have been posted time and time again. One in mind and purpose. What purpose is that? To bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man.

[righteousrepublic]

Please don't take this the wrong way - Are you a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? I mean, using the word "Mormons" isn't a dead giveaway, but the fact you don't seem to include yourself in that so-two-months-ago name does make me wonder. Not that I condemn you for not being a member if you're not - it would just help me understand why you're trying to attribute this belief erroneously as I don't find it very plausible that an actual member would conclude such.

I'm every bit as Mormon as you are. I fulfill my calling, I pay my tithing, I seek to better my ward. I remain within my own stewardship, I sustain my leaders both local and GA's. I was born a member, I will always be a member of the Church. Just the other day I was one of two witnesses at a sealing.

Perhaps you should discuss this topic with more people, I've met plenty of members of the church that believe precisely what I believe.

It really shouldn't be strange to you for someone to have this belief, as this is the only belief one could possibly have if you read the Book of Mormon and the Bible.
I came to believe these things on my mission when I had nothing but the Book of Mormon, Bible and D&C and Pearl of Great Price. On my mission, both in the MTC and the Mission Field I was told to focus on the BoM and the Bible and less on D&C.The Book of Mormon and the Bible do not refer to the Holy Ghost as anything but an IT. If I'm focusing on those 2 books, it's impossible to think of the Holy Ghost as a HE because it literally is never referred to as a HE, only an it. Your version of the Holy Ghost is nonexistent in the Book of Mormon and the Bible, hence why you have to resort to convincing others that 1 Nephi 11 is the Holy Ghost when it says no such thing, and no other scripture refers back to it clarifying that it is the Holy Ghost.

And, btw, in 1 Nephi 11, the spirit mentioned is also called an angel. The Holy Ghost is not an angel. He is a God. Therefore, you are correct. This chapter is not at all about the Holy Ghost.

[righteousrepublic]

IMHO,The Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit, no less than Jehovah when He revealed himself to the brother of Jared.

Ether 3:16
16 Behold, this body, which ye now behold, is the body of my spirit; and man have I created after the body of my spirit; and even as I appear unto thee to be in the spirit will I appear unto my people in the flesh. ----thus Mosiah 15:1-5

Unless the Holy Ghost is has no spirit or body, remaining in the intelligence form. Somehow I doubt this however. Otherwise, how could he be called Holy Spirit?

Spirit, the Holy: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... y?lang=eng

The third Person in the Godhead, being a personage of spirit, whereas the Father and the Son each are personages of spirit tabernacled with a tangible body of flesh and bones (D&C 130:22). See Holy Ghost.

The Holy Ghost has many names, ie, Holy Ghost, Holy Spirit, Spirit of God, Spirit of the Lord, Comforter, and Spirit.
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... t?lang=eng

Holy Ghost

The third member of the Godhead and a personage of Spirit, not possessing a body of flesh and bones (D&C 130:22). The Holy Ghost has been manifest in every dispensation of the gospel since the beginning, being first made known to Adam (1 Ne. 10:17–22; Moses 6:51–68). The Holy Ghost is manifested to men on the earth both as the power of the Holy Ghost and as the gift of the Holy Ghost. The power can come upon one before baptism and is the convincing witness that the gospel is true. By the power of the Holy Ghost a person receives a testimony of Jesus Christ and of His work and the work of His servants upon the earth. The gift can come only after proper and authorized baptism and is conferred by the laying on of hands, as in Acts 8:12–25 and Moro. 2. The gift of the Holy Ghost is the right to have, whenever one is worthy, the companionship of the Holy Ghost. For those who receive this gift, the Holy Ghost acts as a cleansing agent to purify them and sanctify them from all sin. Thus it is often spoken of as “fire” (Matt. 3:11; 2 Ne. 31:17; D&C 19:31). The manifestation on the day of Pentecost (Acts 2) was the gift of the Holy Ghost that came upon the Twelve, without which they were not ready for their ministries to the world.

For some reason not fully explained in the scriptures, the Holy Ghost did not operate in the fulness among the Jews during the years of Jesus’ mortal sojourn (John 7:39; 16:7). Statements to the effect that the Holy Ghost did not come until after Jesus was resurrected must of necessity refer to that particular dispensation only, for it is abundantly clear that the Holy Ghost was operative in earlier dispensations. Furthermore, it has reference only to the gift of the Holy Ghost not being present, since the power of the Holy Ghost was operative during the ministries of John the Baptist and Jesus; otherwise no one would have received a testimony of the truths that these men taught (Matt. 16:16–17; see also 1 Cor. 12:3). When a person speaks by the power of the Holy Ghost that same power carries a conviction of the truth unto the heart of the hearer (2 Ne. 33:1). The Holy Ghost knows all things (D&C 35:19) and can lead one to know of future events (2 Pet. 1:21).

if the HG is YHWH spirit then how is it a third member?

Simply put, the Holy Ghost is not Jehovah. Jehovah is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. He also created our bodies and this earth we stand on.
The HG is a messenger of truth, a testifier of the Father and Son, a companion to those who receive the gift of the HG and live their life so as to retain that companionship. He is the Holy Spirit of Promise that seals one's eternal salvation after they have passed the tests of their faith and commitment to keeping God's commandments, including the New and Everlasting Covenant of marriage.

[Alaris]

Please don't take this the wrong way - Are you a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? I mean, using the word "Mormons" isn't a dead giveaway, but the fact you don't seem to include yourself in that so-two-months-ago name does make me wonder. Not that I condemn you for not being a member if you're not - it would just help me understand why you're trying to attribute this belief erroneously as I don't find it very plausible that an actual member would conclude such.

I'm every bit as Mormon as you are. I fulfill my calling, I pay my tithing, I seek to better my ward. I remain within my own stewardship, I sustain my leaders both local and GA's. I was born a member, I will always be a member of the Church. Just the other day I was one of two witnesses at a sealing.

Perhaps you should discuss this topic with more people, I've met plenty of members of the church that believe precisely what I believe.

It really shouldn't be strange to you for someone to have this belief, as this is the only belief one could possibly have if you read the Book of Mormon and the Bible.
I came to believe these things on my mission when I had nothing but the Book of Mormon, Bible and D&C and Pearl of Great Price. On my mission, both in the MTC and the Mission Field I was told to focus on the BoM and the Bible and less on D&C.The Book of Mormon and the Bible do not refer to the Holy Ghost as anything but an IT. If I'm focusing on those 2 books, it's impossible to think of the Holy Ghost as a HE because it literally is never referred to as a HE, only an it. Your version of the Holy Ghost is nonexistent in the Book of Mormon and the Bible, hence why you have to resort to convincing others that 1 Nephi 11 is the Holy Ghost when it says no such thing, and no other scripture refers back to it clarifying that it is the Holy Ghost.

I'm all for esoteric knowledge as you are well aware, but the Holy Ghost being a he and a third member of the godhead is a fundamental belief of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I like how you say I have to restort to taking 1 Nephi 11 at its word. Uh oh I called 1 Nephi 11 "it" - is Nephi going to disappear?

This is exactly what the "I don't personally like polygamy" folks do. They try to isolate the evidence and pretend each isolated piece of evidence is the sole piece of evidence.

Please explain John 14:26 to me and how it's only two people involved. In fact, please explain every reference to him in John 14-16.

Also, please explain the baptismal ordinance.

I'm pretty sure I've asked for this already.

[Zathura]

This is exactly what the "I don't personally like polygamy" folks do. They try to isolate the evidence and pretend each isolated piece of evidence is the sole piece of evidence.

I haven't done this. People do this on all sides on all topics, even outside of the Church(Politics???!), you know this is true.
I have been very thorough on Polygamy. You've seen how large my posts can be(As large as many as yours). You know I haven't personally isolated evidence and pretended it was the only piece of evidence. If you don't know, then you haven't read what I've said close enough or you didn't read it at all. I've got very in depth on dozens of stories and examples, acknowledge rebuttals, made concessions etc.
I've addressed D&C 132, something that nobody ever has an answer to. I've addressed William Law, I've gone in detail on the supposed wives of Hyrum. I've addressed Fanny Alger, I've addressed every single known public statement on the matter, I've addressed John Bennett, I've addressed the affidavits. Some of those affidavits are from the same people but give contradicting statements. I've addressed the Temple Lot case, I've addressed the changing of Joseph's words in the Journals. I've addressed Emma Smith's own testimony, I've addressed Joseph Smith III 's words on it, the dozens of interviews he did , the conclusion he came to. I've addressed the varying legitimacy of the various claims of Joseph's wives, the claims of Emma complaining, the claims of the Angel with the Sword etc. etc. etc.

That is not a single piece of evidence being used as "The only piece of evidence". I only state those things to refute your claim that I have somehow in Ignorance taken one tiny scrap of evidence and conflated it to mean something more than it really means.

No need to derail here, start another thread if need be(PLEASE SAVE US FROM ANOTHER THREAD ON POLYGAMY). I will refuse to continue talking about polygamy on this thread.

Very few people acknowledge the information I put together, that's not my problem, that's theirs.

Uh oh I called 1 Nephi 11 "it" - is Nephi going to disappear?

Somehow you always make me laugh. Thanks

Please explain John 14:26 to me and how it's only two people involved. In fact, please explain every reference to him in John 14-16.

I did respond to this, I linked to the Church website on that chapter because I think their answer suffices? This is why I ask you to really read what I write because it doesn't seem like you do. IF you did read it then tell me my response wasn't good enough and I'll give you a better one.

The Church taught for decades(until they changed the footnotes in 2013) that "Another Comforter" and that "Other Comforter" is Jesus himself. "The Spirit of Truth" has referred both to Jesus himself and to the Holy Ghost throughout the scriptures, so that phrase in and of itself cannot be used as evidence of either argument. Therefore when he says "HE" in regards to that other comforter, he is talking about himself, who is indeed a HE. The Church taught this for decades, the Church has not come out and said otherwise or corrected the Manual teaching this.

https://www.lds.org/study/manual/new-te ... john-14-16

In the New Testament, the Greek word paraklētos, translated “Comforter” in the King James Version, appears only in the writings of John. The word is composed of para, meaning “beside,” and klētos, meaning “one who is summoned.” A paraklētos is one who is summoned to another’s side as a helper, intercessor, or advocate. In John’s writings, the title paraklētos is applied to two individuals: the Holy Ghost and Jesus Christ. The Savior promised His disciples that after He departed, they would not be left alone but would have the companionship of the Holy Ghost to help them (see John 14:16, 26; 15:26; 16:7). The Savior’s promise that He would give His disciples the Holy Ghost as “another Comforter” (John 14:16; italics added) meant that He Himself was also a Comforter. The Prophet Joseph Smith spoke of the two Comforters in this way:

“There are two Comforters spoken of. One is the Holy Ghost, the same as given on the day of Pentecost, and that all Saints receive after faith, repentance, and baptism. This first Comforter [is the] Holy Ghost. …

“The other Comforter spoken of is a subject of great interest, and perhaps understood by few of this generation. After a person has faith in Christ, repents of his sins, and is baptized for the remission of his sins and receives the Holy Ghost, (by the laying on of hands), which is the first Comforter, then let him continue to humble himself before God, hungering and thirsting after righteousness, and living by every word of God, and the Lord will soon say unto him, Son, thou shalt be exalted. When the Lord has thoroughly proved him, and finds that the man is determined to serve Him at all hazards, then the man will find his calling and his election made sure, then it will be his privilege to receive the other Comforter, which the Lord hath promised the Saints, as is recorded in the testimony of St. John, in the 14th chapter, from the 12th to the 27th verses.

“Note the 16, 17, 18, 21, 23 verses. …

“Now what is this other Comforter? It is no more nor less than the Lord Jesus Christ Himself; and this is the sum and substance of the whole matter; that when any man obtains this last Comforter, he will have the personage of Jesus Christ to attend him, or appear unto him from time to time, and even He will manifest the Father unto him, and they will take up their abode with him, and the visions of the heavens will be opened unto him, and the Lord will teach him face to face, and he may have a perfect knowledge of the mysteries of the Kingdom of God” (in History of the Church, 3:380–81).

Also, please explain the baptismal ordinance.

Why? I don't see why the Holy Ghost needs to be a personage in order to bare record of the Father and the Son. Lectures on Faith discusses only 2 personages, yet as I showed earlier, the Holy Spirit still bares record. I see no need for there to be an explanation. You are the one insisting that this idea of the Holy Ghost not being a personage destroys the baptismal ordinance, so it is YOU that needs to show why that is, it is not I that needs to show why it isn't.

[Alaris]

This is exactly what the "I don't personally like polygamy" folks do. They try to isolate the evidence and pretend each isolated piece of evidence is the sole piece of evidence.

I haven't done this. People do this on all sides on all topics, even outside of the Church(Politics???!), you know this is true.
I have been very thorough on Polygamy. You've seen how large my posts can be(As large as many as yours). You know I haven't personally isolated evidence and pretended it was the only piece of evidence. If you don't know, then you haven't read what I've said close enough or you didn't read it at all. I've got very in depth on dozens of stories and examples, acknowledge rebuttals, made concessions etc.
I've addressed D&C 132, something that nobody ever has an answer to. I've addressed William Law, I've gone in detail on the supposed wives of Hyrum. I've addressed Fanny Alger, I've addressed every single known public statement on the matter, I've addressed John Bennett, I've addressed the affidavits. Some of those affidavits are from the same people but give contradicting statements. I've addressed the Temple Lot case, I've addressed the changing of Joseph's words in the Journals. I've addressed Emma Smith's own testimony, I've addressed Joseph Smith III 's words on it, the dozens of interviews he did , the conclusion he came to. I've addressed the varying legitimacy of the various claims of Joseph's wives, the claims of Emma complaining, the claims of the Angel with the Sword etc. etc. etc.

That is not a single piece of evidence being used as "The only piece of evidence". I only state those things to refute your claim that I have somehow in Ignorance taken one tiny scrap of evidence and conflated it to mean something more than it really means.

No need to derail here, start another thread if need be(PLEASE SAVE US FROM ANOTHER THREAD ON POLYGAMY). I will refuse to continue talking about polygamy on this thread.

Very few people acknowledge the information I put together, that's not my problem, that's theirs.

Uh oh I called 1 Nephi 11 "it" - is Nephi going to disappear?

Somehow you always make me laugh. Thanks

The fact you get my jokes means you're no slouch. I haven't given up on you yet!

Please explain John 14:26 to me and how it's only two people involved. In fact, please explain every reference to him in John 14-16.

I did respond to this, I linked to the Church website on that chapter because I think their answer suffices? This is why I ask you to really read what I write because it doesn't seem like you do. IF you did read it then tell me my response wasn't good enough and I'll give you a better one.

The Church taught for decades(until they changed the footnotes in 2013) that "Another Comforter" and that "Other Comforter" is Jesus himself. "The Spirit of Truth" has referred both to Jesus himself and to the Holy Ghost throughout the scriptures, so that phrase in and of itself cannot be used as evidence of either argument. Therefore when he says "HE" in regards to that other comforter, he is talking about himself, who is indeed a HE. The Church taught this for decades, the Church has not come out and said otherwise or corrected the Manual teaching this.

https://www.lds.org/study/manual/new-te ... john-14-16

In the New Testament, the Greek word paraklētos, translated “Comforter” in the King James Version, appears only in the writings of John. The word is composed of para, meaning “beside,” and klētos, meaning “one who is summoned.” A paraklētos is one who is summoned to another’s side as a helper, intercessor, or advocate. In John’s writings, the title paraklētos is applied to two individuals: the Holy Ghost and Jesus Christ. The Savior promised His disciples that after He departed, they would not be left alone but would have the companionship of the Holy Ghost to help them (see John 14:16, 26; 15:26; 16:7). The Savior’s promise that He would give His disciples the Holy Ghost as “another Comforter” (John 14:16; italics added) meant that He Himself was also a Comforter. The Prophet Joseph Smith spoke of the two Comforters in this way:

“There are two Comforters spoken of. One is the Holy Ghost, the same as given on the day of Pentecost, and that all Saints receive after faith, repentance, and baptism. This first Comforter [is the] Holy Ghost. …

“The other Comforter spoken of is a subject of great interest, and perhaps understood by few of this generation. After a person has faith in Christ, repents of his sins, and is baptized for the remission of his sins and receives the Holy Ghost, (by the laying on of hands), which is the first Comforter, then let him continue to humble himself before God, hungering and thirsting after righteousness, and living by every word of God, and the Lord will soon say unto him, Son, thou shalt be exalted. When the Lord has thoroughly proved him, and finds that the man is determined to serve Him at all hazards, then the man will find his calling and his election made sure, then it will be his privilege to receive the other Comforter, which the Lord hath promised the Saints, as is recorded in the testimony of St. John, in the 14th chapter, from the 12th to the 27th verses.

“Note the 16, 17, 18, 21, 23 verses. …

“Now what is this other Comforter? It is no more nor less than the Lord Jesus Christ Himself; and this is the sum and substance of the whole matter; that when any man obtains this last Comforter, he will have the personage of Jesus Christ to attend him, or appear unto him from time to time, and even He will manifest the Father unto him, and they will take up their abode with him, and the visions of the heavens will be opened unto him, and the Lord will teach him face to face, and he may have a perfect knowledge of the mysteries of the Kingdom of God” (in History of the Church, 3:380–81).

The Holy Ghost is the first comforter. Jesus is the second. So when the second comforter says "Another comforter" He means "apart from me" - Parakletos - Advocate. I will admit that when Joseph Smith called Jesus "The Second Comforter" it may be slightly confusing. However "second" is sequential in progression. Receive the first Comforter - the Holy Ghost - then the second. Easy-to-understand. You're welcome!

I apologize for asking an explanation twice, but last time you cited the church which teaches, accurately, that one of the two comforters is the Holy Ghost and one is Jesus Christ. And you quoted some more stuff above that again reads like they're two people.

Also, please explain the baptismal ordinance.

Why? I don't see why the Holy Ghost needs to be a personage in order to bare record of the Father and the Son. Lectures on Faith discusses only 2 personages, yet as I showed earlier, the Holy Spirit still bares record. I see no need for there to be an explanation. You are the one insisting that this idea of the Holy Ghost not being a personage destroys the baptismal ordinance, so it is YOU that needs to show why that is, it is not I that needs to show why it isn't.

Why? Because this little prayer destroys the heresy that the Holy Ghost does not exist. If he's nobody why do we baptize in the name of nobody? The prayer is so plain and simple. The name of the father ... and of the son...and of the Holy Ghost. So when Nephi says the three are one God ... you think that means two individuals and a power?

See, so it was YOU after all who needs to show why it is that it isn't what it is that you think it isn't after all!

[Alaris]

If you can read through these verses and think Jesus is referring to a power or referring to Himself and not to a separate person ....


John 14:15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments.

16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, (irony) neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
...
25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.

26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.


I mean the context given by verse 25 leading into verse 26 - I am present with you, but the comforter who is the Holy Ghost - whom the Father will send in my name - this is clearly three people.


John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:


Note here that the Comforter testifies of Jesus Christ. ... how ... how can this be two people?

Please read this and see


John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;

10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;

11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.

13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.


If I go not away the Comforter will not come. When he is come he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgement. Remember John 15:26? Well John 16:13 says the Spirit of Truth will not speak of himself but only what he shall hear ... you know ...sort of like the Angel of the Lord who is to Jehovah as Aaron was to Moses.

He shall glorify Jesus! Q: Who glorifies himself? A: The devil.

He shall take of mine and shew it unto you. How on Earth can you say the Holy Ghost is a he after reading this?

The Rod of Jesse who is a servant in the hands of Christ on whom is laid much power. Is the power of the Holy Ghost not much power?? How does nobody seem to connect John 16 and Isaiah 11? Look at all the many things they have in common:


Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:

2 And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord;

3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the Lord: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:

4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.


Now that is about as plain a connection as there can be made of a man who is a he who modern revelation says is coincidentally of the bloodline of Jesse. Or did the Greatest Of Us All carefully, expertly, accidentally make a half dozen word links that link the Comforter to the Rod of Isaiah who exhibits seven qualities? Whoopsie! This is plain, and clear - yet nobody seems to be able to see this. That spirit of deep sleep - that's not in Isaiah is it? Oh wait what's this?


Isaiah 29:9 ¶ Stay yourselves, and wonder; cry ye out, and cry: they are drunken, but not with wine; they stagger, but not with strong drink.

10 For the Lord hath poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and hath closed your eyes: the prophets and your rulers, the seers hath he covered.


Note: this is the work of the Lord to cover the eyes of the prophets and rulers and seers (before anyone gets eager to disabuse) - might He do this as a means to an end? Might He be hiding this truth in plain sight where folks cannot see if when plain language is connected with nice bold, italics, and color? How long, Lord, will people be unable to see?

Isaiah 6;11 Then said I, Lord, how long? And he answered, Until the cities be wasted without inhabitant, and the houses without man, and the land be utterly desolate,

12 And the Lord have removed men far away, and there be a great forsaking in the midst of the land.

13 ¶ But yet in it shall be a tenth, and it shall return, and shall be eaten: as a teil tree, and as an oak, whose substance is in them, when they cast their leaves: so the holy seed shall be the substance thereof.


Shear-Jashub - how will you make yourself a tithe of the Lord's chosen?

[SJR3t2]

I'm every bit as Mormon as you are. I fulfill my calling, I pay my tithing, I seek to better my ward. I remain within my own stewardship, I sustain my leaders both local and GA's. I was born a member, I will always be a member of the Church. Just the other day I was one of two witnesses at a sealing.

Perhaps you should discuss this topic with more people, I've met plenty of members of the church that believe precisely what I believe.

It really shouldn't be strange to you for someone to have this belief, as this is the only belief one could possibly have if you read the Book of Mormon and the Bible.
I came to believe these things on my mission when I had nothing but the Book of Mormon, Bible and D&C and Pearl of Great Price. On my mission, both in the MTC and the Mission Field I was told to focus on the BoM and the Bible and less on D&C.The Book of Mormon and the Bible do not refer to the Holy Ghost as anything but an IT. If I'm focusing on those 2 books, it's impossible to think of the Holy Ghost as a HE because it literally is never referred to as a HE, only an it. Your version of the Holy Ghost is nonexistent in the Book of Mormon and the Bible, hence why you have to resort to convincing others that 1 Nephi 11 is the Holy Ghost when it says no such thing, and no other scripture refers back to it clarifying that it is the Holy Ghost.

I believe you will like this video and the rest in the series, which I have recently found.

Understanding the Ruach/Spirit - Part 1
https://youtu.be/ua2Po-nq1m8

[SJR3t2]

I believe letter "c" applies most. Throughout scripture we read The Father, The Son, and The Holy Ghost. There is no doubt that there are three distinct individuals in the Godhead. All three think alike, act alike and testify of the other alike, being one God.

Think about it, God wants us to think like him, act like him and testify of him. They, the Father, Son and Holy Ghost all want us to become one with them. Scriptures to this truth have been posted time and time again. One in mind and purpose. What purpose is that? To bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man.

I see something different in scriptures. Quotes from https://seekingyhwh.com/2019/06/09/the- ... -the-same/

Numbers 11:17 And I will come down and talk with thee there: and I will take of the SPIRIT [RUACH] which is upon thee, and will put IT upon them; and they shall bear the burden of the people with thee, that thou bear it not thyself alone.
Numbers 11:25 And the Lord came down in a cloud, and spake unto him, and took of the SPIRIT [RUACH] that was upon him, and gave IT unto the seventy elders: and it came to pass, that, when the SPIRIT [RUACH] rested upon them, they PROPHESIED, and did not cease.

The translation of Ruach to MIND reminds me of what Joseph Smith taught in Lectures on Faith lecture 5 where it states six times in verse 2 that the HOLY SPIRIT is the MIND of GOD. In the Questions and Answers section of lecture 5 it quotes Philippians 2:5 that teaches the same thing in plain English.

Philippians 2:5 Let this MIND be IN you, which was also IN CHRIST JESUS; who being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God; but made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of man, and, being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

Question 3: How many personages are there in the Godhead?
Two: the Father and the Son. (5:1)
Lectures on Faith 5 Question 3

Verse 2 of Lectures on Faith 5 is a bit long, but easy to follow and understand. It teaches that there are only two personages in the Godhead, and that the HOLY SPIRIT is the MIND of God.

There are two personages who constitute the great, matchless, governing and supreme power over all things—by whom all things were created and made, that are created and made, whether visible or invisible: whether in heaven, on earth, or in the earth, under the earth, or throughout the immensity of space—They are the Father and the Son
Lectures on Faith 5:2

possessing the same MIND with the Father, which MIND is the HOLY SPIRIT, that bears record of the Father and the Son, and these three are one, or in other words, these three constitute the great, matchless, governing and supreme power over all things: by whom all things were created and made, that were created and made: and these three constitute the Godhead, and are one: The Father and the Son possessing the same MIND, the same WISDOM, GLORY, POWER and FULNESS: Filling all in all—the Son being filled with the fulness of the MIND, glory and power, or, in other words, the SPIRIT, glory and power of the Father—possessing all knowledge and glory, and the same kingdom: sitting at the right hand of power, in the express image and likeness of the Father—a Mediator for man—being filled with the fulness of the MIND of the Father, or, in other words, the SPIRIT of the Father:
Lectures on Faith 5:2

“The HOLY SPIRIT, that bears record” from Lectures on Faith 5:2 reminds me of Moses 6:61. Which also shows that Comforter is not a personage.

Moses 6:61 Therefore IT is given to abide in you; the record of heaven; the Comforter; the peaceable things of immortal glory; the truth of all things; THAT which QUICKENETH ALL THINGS, which maketh ALIVE ALL THINGS; THAT which knoweth ALL THINGS, and hath all power according to wisdom, mercy, truth, justice, and judgment.

Moses 6:61 also refutes the idea presented in paragraphs one, three, four and others that the HOLY GHOST or others words the Comforter is not the same as the SPIRIT of TRUTH. Because Moses 6:61 applies descriptions that goes with the LIGHT OF CHRIST to the Comforter which there is no doubt that is another name for the HOLY GHOST. Take a look at D&C (LDS 88:7,11–13) (RLDS 85) (1835 7) (1844 7) and see how these same descriptions are being applied to the LIGHT OF CHRIST.

D&C (LDS 88:7,11–13) (RLDS 85) (1835 7) (1844 7)
7 Which TRUTH shineth. This is the LIGHT OF CHRIST. …
11 And the light which shineth, which giveth you light, is through him [Jesus Christ] who enlighteneth your eyes, which is the same light that QUICKENETH your understandings; 12 Which light proceedeth forth from the presence of God to fill the immensity of space— 13 The light which is in ALL THINGS, which giveth LIFE to ALL THINGS, which is the law by which all things are governed, even the power of God who sitteth upon his throne, who is in the bosom of eternity, who is in the midst of all things.

There is no Book of Mormon verse I am aware of, and I have tried to find one, that refers to the GIFT of the HOLY GHOST as an IT. I am aware of six passages that refers to the HOLY SPIRIT aka the HOLY GHOST as an IT, I will share two of them here, the other four you will at the bottom of the post.

2 Nephi (LDS 33:2) (RLDS 15:2) But behold, there are many that DARDEN their HEARTS against the HOLY SPIRIT, that IT hath no place in them; wherefore, they cast many things away which are written and esteem them as things of naught.

2 Nephi (LDS 32:5) (RLDS 14:6) For behold, again I say unto you that if ye will enter in by the way, and RECEIVE the HOLY GHOST, IT will SHOW unto you all things what ye SHOULD DO.

On top of that there is no modern day revelation through Joseph Smith that refer to the HOLY SPIRIT / HOLY GHOST as a “he”. Even LDS D&C 130, which I personally do not believe in, does not apply “he” to IT. If you look at Moses 6:61 which I quoted just above, you will see it referencing the HOLY SPIRIT multiple ways including IT and THAT. Also if you were paying attention earlier when I quoted Numbers 11, verses 17 and 25 reference SPIRIT [RUACH] as IT. The only scriptures that I am aware of that uses “he” for the HOLY SPIRIT is from the New Testament which is because of translations errors.

FILL (see also IN)

Alma (LDS 31:36) (RLDS 16:116-117) Now it came to pass that when Alma had said these words, that he CLAPPED his hands upon all them who were with him. And behold, as he CLAPPED his hands upon them, they were FILLED with the HOLY SPIRIT.

Helaman (LDS 5:45) (RLDS 2:111) And behold, the HOLY SPIRIT of God did come DOWN from HEAVEN, and did enter INTO their HEARTS, and they were FILLED as if with FIRE, and they could SPEAK forth marvelous words.

***

Alma (LDS 8:30) (RLDS 6:38) And Alma went forth, and also Amulek, among the people, to declare the words of God unto them; and they were FILLED with the HOLY GHOST.

Alma (LDS 36:24) (RLDS 17:22) Yea, and from that time even until now, I have labored without ceasing, that I might bring souls unto repentance; that I might bring them to taste of the exceeding joy of which I did taste; that they might also be born of God, and be FILLED with the HOLY GHOST.

3 Nephi (LDS 12:6) (RLDS 5:53) And blessed are all they who do hunger and thirst after righteousness, for they shall be FILLED with the HOLY GHOST.

3 Nephi (LDS 19:13) (RLDS 9:14) And it came to pass when they were all baptized and had come up out of the water, the HOLY GHOST did FALL upon them, and they were FILLED with the HOLY GHOST and with FIRE.

3 Nephi (LDS 26:17) (RLDS 12:10) And it came to pass that the disciples whom Jesus had chosen began from that time forth to baptize and to teach as many as did come unto them; and as many as were baptized in the name of Jesus were FILLED with the HOLY GHOST.

3 Nephi (LDS 30:2) (RLDS 14:2-3) Turn, all ye Gentiles, from your wicked ways; and repent of your evil doings, of your lyings and deceivings, and of your whoredoms, and of your secret abominations, and your idolatries, and of your murders, and your priestcrafts, and your envyings, and your strifes, and from all your wickedness and abominations, and come unto me, and be baptized in my name, that ye may receive a REMISSION of your sins, and be FILLED with the HOLY GHOST, that ye may be numbered with my people who are of the house of Israel.

Moroni (LDS 8:26) (RLDS 8:29) And the remission of sins bringeth meekness, and lowliness of heart; and because of meekness and lowliness of heart cometh the VISITATION of the HOLY GHOST, which COMFORTER FILLETH with hope and perfect love, which love endureth by diligence unto prayer, until the end shall come, when all the saints shall dwell with God.

IN (see also FILL)

2 Nephi (LDS 33:2) (RLDS 15:2) But behold, there are many that DARDEN their HEARTS against the HOLY SPIRIT, that IT hath no place IN them; wherefore, they cast many things away which are written and esteem them as things of naught.

Alma (LDS 5:46) (RLDS 3:78-80) Behold, I say unto you they are made known unto me by the HOLY SPIRIT of God. Behold, I have fasted and prayed many days that I might know these things of myself. And now I do know of myself that they are true; for the Lord God hath made them MANIFEST unto me by his HOLY SPIRIT; and this is the spirit of REVELATION which is IN me.

Alma (LDS 7:16) (RLDS 5:28) And whosoever doeth this, and keepeth the commandments of God from thenceforth, the same will remember that I say unto him, yea, he will remember that I have said unto him, he shall have eternal life, according to the TESTIMONY of the HOLY SPIRIT, which TESTIFIETH IN me.

***

Ether (LDS 12:41) (RLDS 5:41) And now, I would commend you to seek this Jesus of whom the prophets and apostles have written, that the grace of God the Father, and also the Lord Jesus Christ, and the HOLY GHOST, which BEARETH RECORD of them, may be and ABIDE IN YOU forever. Amen.

Moroni (LDS 3:4) (RLDS 3:3) And after this manner did they ordain priests and teachers, according to the gifts and callings of God unto men; and they ordained them by the POWER of the HOLY GHOST, which was IN them.

Moroni (LDS 7:32) (RLDS 7:33-34) And by so doing, the Lord God prepareth the way that the residue of men may have faith in Christ, that the HOLY GHOST may have place IN their HEARTS, according to the POWER thereof; and after this manner bringeth to pass the Father, the covenants which he hath made unto the children of men.

IT

2 Nephi (LDS 33:2) (RLDS 15:2) But behold, there are many that DARDEN their HEARTS against the HOLY SPIRIT, that IT hath no place in them; wherefore, they cast many things away which are written and esteem them as things of naught.

***

2 Nephi (LDS 31:8-9) (RLDS 13:10-11)
8 Wherefore, after he was baptized with water the HOLY GHOST DESCENDED upon him in the form of a DOVE. 9 And again, IT showeth unto the children of men the straitness of the path, and the narrowness of the gate, by which they should enter, he [Jesus] having set the example before them.

2 Nephi (LDS 32:5) (RLDS 14:6) For behold, again I say unto you that if ye will enter in by the way, and RECEIVE the HOLY GHOST, IT will SHOW unto you all things what ye SHOULD DO.

Alma (LDS 34:38) (RLDS 16:237-238) That ye CONTEND no more against the HOLY GHOST, but that ye RECEIVE IT, and take upon you the name of Christ; that ye humble yourselves even to the dust, and worship God, in whatsoever place ye may be in, in spirit and in truth; and that ye live in thanksgiving daily, for the many mercies and blessings which he doth bestow upon you.

Alma (LDS 39:6) (RLDS 19:8-9) For behold, if ye DENY the HOLY GHOST when IT once has had place in you, and ye know that ye deny IT, behold, this is a sin which is unpardonable; yea, and whosoever murdereth against the light and knowledge of God, it is not easy for him to obtain forgiveness; yea, I say unto you, my son, that it is not easy for him to obtain a forgiveness.

Moroni (LDS 2:2) (RLDS 2:2) And he called them by name, saying: Ye shall call on the Father in my name, in mighty prayer; and after ye have done this ye shall have power that to him upon whom ye shall lay your hands, ye shall GIVE the HOLY GHOST; and in my name shall ye give IT, for thus do mine apostles.

[SJR3t2]

Just came across this podcast and it talks about the greek behind the Holy Spirit and the Holy Ghost are the same word. And how the two scribes for LDS D&C 130 don't agree regarding what was said on the Holy Ghost.

The podcast also ties the Holy Ghost and the Holy Spirit to be the same using some verses in the BoM and D&C.

They bring up an issue with the birth of Jesus if the HS is a personage.

http://ironrodpodcast.com/podcast/iron- ... oly-ghost/

[SJR3t2]

Some good examples from the Bible that the Holy Spirit/Ghost is not a personage
https://youtu.be/K7mVMDSMSlw

[righteousrepublic]

Was it the Holy Ghost that spoke to Nephi?

1 Nephi 11:11
11 And I said unto him: To know the interpretation thereof—for I spake unto him as a man speaketh; for I beheld that he was in the form of a man; yet nevertheless, I knew that it was the Spirit of the Lord; and he spake unto me as a man speaketh with another.

Holy Ghost:
Other names that sometimes refer to the Holy Ghost are Holy Spirit, Spirit of God, Spirit of the Lord, Comforter, and Spirit.

Hmmmm.

Or was it that same Spirit who showed himself to the brother of Jared?

Ether 3:15–16
15 And never have I showed myself unto man whom I have created, for never has man believed in me as thou hast. Seest thou that ye are created after mine own image? Yea, even all men were created in the beginning after mine own image.

16 Behold, this body, which ye now behold, is the body of my spirit; and man have I created after the body of my spirit; and even as I appear unto thee to be in the spirit will I appear unto my people in the flesh.
.................................................................................................................................................................
And what does the HG mean when he says he is the Only Begotten?

Moses 5:9
9 And in that day the Holy Ghost fell upon Adam, which beareth record of the Father and the Son, saying: I am the Only Begotten of the Father from the beginning, henceforth and forever, that as thou hast fallen thou mayest be redeemed, and all mankind, even as many as will.

[SJR3t2]

Was it the Holy Ghost that spoke to Nephi?

1 Nephi 11:11
11 And I said unto him: To know the interpretation thereof—for I spake unto him as a man speaketh; for I beheld that he was in the form of a man; yet nevertheless, I knew that it was the Spirit of the Lord; and he spake unto me as a man speaketh with another.

Holy Ghost:
Other names that sometimes refer to the Holy Ghost are Holy Spirit, Spirit of God, Spirit of the Lord, Comforter, and Spirit.

Hmmmm.

Or was it that same Spirit who showed himself to the brother of Jared?

Ether 3:15–16
15 And never have I showed myself unto man whom I have created, for never has man believed in me as thou hast. Seest thou that ye are created after mine own image? Yea, even all men were created in the beginning after mine own image.

16 Behold, this body, which ye now behold, is the body of my spirit; and man have I created after the body of my spirit; and even as I appear unto thee to be in the spirit will I appear unto my people in the flesh.
.................................................................................................................................................................
And what does the HG mean when he says he is the Only Begotten?

Moses 5:9
9 And in that day the Holy Ghost fell upon Adam, which beareth record of the Father and the Son, saying: I am the Only Begotten of the Father from the beginning, henceforth and forever, that as thou hast fallen thou mayest be redeemed, and all mankind, even as many as will.

1 Nephi 11 was not the Holy Ghost.

Ether 3:15-16 was not the Holy Ghost.

[righteousrepublic]

1 Nephi 11 was not the Holy Ghost.

Ether 3:15-16 was not the Holy Ghost.

I don't think so either.

[SJR3t2]

1 Nephi 11 was not the Holy Ghost.

Ether 3:15-16 was not the Holy Ghost.

I don't think so either.

I'm confused I'm pretty sure that is what you were say there and other times in the thread.

[righteousrepublic]

1 Nephi 11 was not the Holy Ghost.

Ether 3:15-16 was not the Holy Ghost.

I don't think so either.

I'm confused I'm pretty sure that is what you were say there and other times in the thread.

Spirit of the Lord = Holy Ghost
Spirit of the Lord = Jehovah

One has to pay attention to the context in order to tell which one it is.

The Spirit of the Lord, Jehovah, showed himself to the brother of Jared prior to coming to earth. Ether 3: 14-16

In 1 Nephi 11:11 it could have been the Lord, himself, or it could have been the Holy Ghost. Doesn't clearly specify. Not any other entity claiming to be the Spirit of the Lord that I know of.

[SJR3t2]

Spirit of the Lord = Holy Ghost
Spirit of the Lord = Jehovah

One has to pay attention to the context in order to tell which one it is.

The Spirit of the Lord, Jehovah, showed himself to the brother of Jared prior to coming to earth. Ether 3: 14-16

In 1 Nephi 11:11 it could have been the Lord, himself, or it could have been the Holy Ghost. Doesn't clearly specify. Not any other entity claiming to be the Spirit of the Lord that I know of.

So I did remember right, you are just going about it a different way. We disagree. How do you explain the verses in the BoM that directly call HS/HG IT?

https://seekingyhwh.com/2019/06/09/the- ... -the-same/

IT

2 Nephi (LDS 33:2) (RLDS 15:2) But behold, there are many that DARDEN their HEARTS against the HOLY SPIRIT, that IT hath no place in them; wherefore, they cast many things away which are written and esteem them as things of naught.

***

2 Nephi (LDS 31:8-9) (RLDS 13:10-11)
8 Wherefore, after he was baptized with water the HOLY GHOST DESCENDED upon him in the form of a DOVE. 9 And again, IT showeth unto the children of men the straitness of the path, and the narrowness of the gate, by which they should enter, he [Jesus] having set the example before them.

2 Nephi (LDS 32:5) (RLDS 14:6) For behold, again I say unto you that if ye will enter in by the way, and RECEIVE the HOLY GHOST, IT will SHOW unto you all things what ye SHOULD DO.

Alma (LDS 34:38) (RLDS 16:237-238) That ye CONTEND no more against the HOLY GHOST, but that ye RECEIVE IT, and take upon you the name of Christ; that ye humble yourselves even to the dust, and worship God, in whatsoever place ye may be in, in spirit and in truth; and that ye live in thanksgiving daily, for the many mercies and blessings which he doth bestow upon you.

Alma (LDS 39:6) (RLDS 19:8-9) For behold, if ye DENY the HOLY GHOST when IT once has had place in you, and ye know that ye deny IT, behold, this is a sin which is unpardonable; yea, and whosoever murdereth against the light and knowledge of God, it is not easy for him to obtain forgiveness; yea, I say unto you, my son, that it is not easy for him to obtain a forgiveness.

Moroni (LDS 2:2) (RLDS 2:2) And he called them by name, saying: Ye shall call on the Father in my name, in mighty prayer; and after ye have done this ye shall have power that to him upon whom ye shall lay your hands, ye shall GIVE the HOLY GHOST; and in my name shall ye give IT, for thus do mine apostles.

[righteousrepublic]

Spirit of the Lord = Holy Ghost
Spirit of the Lord = Jehovah

One has to pay attention to the context in order to tell which one it is.

The Spirit of the Lord, Jehovah, showed himself to the brother of Jared prior to coming to earth. Ether 3: 14-16

In 1 Nephi 11:11 it could have been the Lord, himself, or it could have been the Holy Ghost. Doesn't clearly specify. Not any other entity claiming to be the Spirit of the Lord that I know of.

So I did remember right, you are just going about it a different way. We disagree. How do you explain the verses in the BoM that directly call HS/HG IT?

https://seekingyhwh.com/2019/06/09/the- ... -the-same/

IT

2 Nephi (LDS 33:2) (RLDS 15:2) But behold, there are many that DARDEN their HEARTS against the HOLY SPIRIT, that IT hath no place in them; wherefore, they cast many things away which are written and esteem them as things of naught. No explanation. But He must be okay with being called it, so I don't worry about the matter. It's really not important and does not effect, in any way, my own salvation.

***

2 Nephi (LDS 31:8-9) (RLDS 13:10-11)
8 Wherefore, after he was baptized with water the HOLY GHOST DESCENDED upon him in the form of a DOVE. 9 And again, IT showeth unto the children of men the straitness of the path, and the narrowness of the gate, by which they should enter, he [Jesus] having set the example before them. The word IT here refers to the action or performance of what the HG did, not to his identity.

2 Nephi (LDS 32:5) (RLDS 14:6) For behold, again I say unto you that if ye will enter in by the way, and RECEIVE the HOLY GHOST, IT will SHOW unto you all things what ye SHOULD DO. Same answer as above.

Alma (LDS 34:38) (RLDS 16:237-238) That ye CONTEND no more against the HOLY GHOST, but that ye RECEIVE IT, and take upon you the name of Christ; that ye humble yourselves even to the dust, and worship God, in whatsoever place ye may be in, in spirit and in truth; and that ye live in thanksgiving daily, for the many mercies and blessings which he doth bestow upon you. Same as above.

Alma (LDS 39:6) (RLDS 19:8-9) For behold, if ye DENY the HOLY GHOST when IT once has had place in you, and ye know that ye deny IT, behold, this is a sin which is unpardonable; yea, and whosoever murdereth against the light and knowledge of God, it is not easy for him to obtain forgiveness; yea, I say unto you, my son, that it is not easy for him to obtain a forgiveness. Same answer.

Moroni (LDS 2:2) (RLDS 2:2) And he called them by name, saying: Ye shall call on the Father in my name, in mighty prayer; and after ye have done this ye shall have power that to him upon whom ye shall lay your hands, ye shall GIVE the HOLY GHOST; and in my name shall ye give IT, for thus do mine apostles. Sounds to me, in all instances, that people 500 BC were accustomed to calling the HG by the word IT. They didn't see any offense going out against the HG. God didn't correct them either, so I'm absolutely fine with it. Again, whether called HG or it, doesn't effect my salvation in the least. If He is okay with it, so am I.

The Holy Ghost Is the Third Separate Entity in the Godhead
Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ Are the Other Members

by Krista Cook: https://www.learnreligions.com/holy-gho ... ty-2158928
Updated March 31, 2018

Mormons do not believe in the traditional Christian version of the Trinity. We believe in God, our Heavenly Father and in His son Jesus Christ and in the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is a separate and distinct entity and the third member of the Godhead.

When Jesus was baptized by John, we know the Holy Ghost alighted on Him in the form of a dove and His influence was felt at that time.

Who the Holy Ghost Is

The Holy Ghost does not have a body. He is a spirit person. His spirit body allows Him to perform His special responsibilities on this earth. His body consists of spirit matter, but it is not a body of flesh and bones, like that of Heavenly Father or Jesus Christ.

The Holy Ghost is referred to by many terms. Some include the following:

The Holy Spirit
The Testifier
The Comforter
Spirit of Truth
Still Small Voice
Whispering of the Spirit

Whatever He is called and however He is referred to, He has distinct responsibilities.

What the Holy Ghost Does

Since coming to their earth, we have not been able to live with Heavenly Father or walk and talk with Him. The Holy Ghost communicates to us from Heavenly Father. One of his responsibilities is to witness the truth to us and bear witness of the Father and the Son.

When Heavenly Father communicates with us through the Holy Ghost, this is spiritual communication. The Holy Ghost speaks directly to our spirits, mainly through feelings and impressions in our minds and hearts.

Other responsibilities of the Holy Ghost include sanctifying us and cleansing us of sin and bringing us peace and comfort and safety. Spiritual guidance from the Holy Ghost can keep us physically and spiritually safe. Since He testifies of truth, His is the best guidance we have in mortal life.

Moroni promises us that if we read and pray about the Book of Mormon sincerely, the Holy Ghost will testify to us that it is true. This is the best example of how the Holy Ghost testifies of truth.

How to Feel the Holy Ghost

Unlike secular knowledge and the knowledge gained through our senses, spiritual communication from the Holy Ghost comes in spiritual ways. It is a spirit to spirit communication.

In fact, it is only when we are spiritually in tune, and seeking spiritual things, that we can feel the Holy Ghost's influence in our lives.

Wickedness and sin will dull our spiritual senses and make it difficult or impossible for us to hear or feel Him. Moreover, our sinning will cause the Holy Ghost to depart from us because He cannot dwell in unclean places.

Sometimes you know if you could not possibly think a thought on your own. If a sudden idea occurs to you, that you know you did not author, it could be that you are feeling spiritual communication from the Holy Ghost.

As you continue to learn and develop spiritually, you will become more adept at knowing when the Holy Ghost is speaking to you, prompting you or inspiring you.

To continue to receive communication from the Holy Ghost we must act on what we are spiritually told and follow any promptings we receive.

Why the Gift of the Holy Ghost Is Reserved for Mormons

Anyone has the ability to feel the Holy Ghost's influence in their life. However, the right to have the Holy Ghost with you at all times comes from baptism and confirmation in the Lord's true church. It is called the Gift of the Holy Ghost.

When you are confirmed a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the priesthood holder says, "Receive the Holy Ghost" you receive this gift.

The Holy Ghost was manifested after John the Baptist baptized Jesus Christ. The Gift of the Holy Ghost is given to you after your own baptism.

This gives you the right to have the Holy Ghost with you continuously until you die and return to heaven. It is a phenomenal gift and one we should cherish and use throughout our lives.

[SJR3t2]

Spirit of the Lord = Holy Ghost
Spirit of the Lord = Jehovah

One has to pay attention to the context in order to tell which one it is.

The Spirit of the Lord, Jehovah, showed himself to the brother of Jared prior to coming to earth. Ether 3: 14-16

In 1 Nephi 11:11 it could have been the Lord, himself, or it could have been the Holy Ghost. Doesn't clearly specify. Not any other entity claiming to be the Spirit of the Lord that I know of.

So I did remember right, you are just going about it a different way. We disagree. How do you explain the verses in the BoM that directly call HS/HG IT?

https://seekingyhwh.com/2019/06/09/the- ... -the-same/

IT

2 Nephi (LDS 33:2) (RLDS 15:2) But behold, there are many that DARDEN their HEARTS against the HOLY SPIRIT, that IT hath no place in them; wherefore, they cast many things away which are written and esteem them as things of naught. No explanation. But He must be okay with being called it, so I don't worry about the matter. It's really not important and does not effect, in any way, my own salvation.

***

2 Nephi (LDS 31:8-9) (RLDS 13:10-11)
8 Wherefore, after he was baptized with water the HOLY GHOST DESCENDED upon him in the form of a DOVE. 9 And again, IT showeth unto the children of men the straitness of the path, and the narrowness of the gate, by which they should enter, he [Jesus] having set the example before them. The word IT here refers to the action or performance of what the HG did, not to his identity.

2 Nephi (LDS 32:5) (RLDS 14:6) For behold, again I say unto you that if ye will enter in by the way, and RECEIVE the HOLY GHOST, IT will SHOW unto you all things what ye SHOULD DO. Same answer as above.

Alma (LDS 34:38) (RLDS 16:237-238) That ye CONTEND no more against the HOLY GHOST, but that ye RECEIVE IT, and take upon you the name of Christ; that ye humble yourselves even to the dust, and worship God, in whatsoever place ye may be in, in spirit and in truth; and that ye live in thanksgiving daily, for the many mercies and blessings which he doth bestow upon you. Same as above.

Alma (LDS 39:6) (RLDS 19:8-9) For behold, if ye DENY the HOLY GHOST when IT once has had place in you, and ye know that ye deny IT, behold, this is a sin which is unpardonable; yea, and whosoever murdereth against the light and knowledge of God, it is not easy for him to obtain forgiveness; yea, I say unto you, my son, that it is not easy for him to obtain a forgiveness. Same answer.

Moroni (LDS 2:2) (RLDS 2:2) And he called them by name, saying: Ye shall call on the Father in my name, in mighty prayer; and after ye have done this ye shall have power that to him upon whom ye shall lay your hands, ye shall GIVE the HOLY GHOST; and in my name shall ye give IT, for thus do mine apostles. Sounds to me, in all instances, that people 500 BC were accustomed to calling the HG by the word IT. They didn't see any offense going out against the HG. God didn't correct them either, so I'm absolutely fine with it. Again, whether called HG or it, doesn't effect my salvation in the least. If He is okay with it, so am I.

The Holy Ghost Is the Third Separate Entity in the Godhead
Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ Are the Other Members

by Krista Cook: https://www.learnreligions.com/holy-gho ... ty-2158928
Updated March 31, 2018

Mormons do not believe in the traditional Christian version of the Trinity. We believe in God, our Heavenly Father and in His son Jesus Christ and in the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is a separate and distinct entity and the third member of the Godhead.

When Jesus was baptized by John, we know the Holy Ghost alighted on Him in the form of a dove and His influence was felt at that time.

Who the Holy Ghost Is

The Holy Ghost does not have a body. He is a spirit person. His spirit body allows Him to perform His special responsibilities on this earth. His body consists of spirit matter, but it is not a body of flesh and bones, like that of Heavenly Father or Jesus Christ.

The Holy Ghost is referred to by many terms. Some include the following:

The Holy Spirit
The Testifier
The Comforter
Spirit of Truth
Still Small Voice
Whispering of the Spirit

Whatever He is called and however He is referred to, He has distinct responsibilities.

What the Holy Ghost Does

Since coming to their earth, we have not been able to live with Heavenly Father or walk and talk with Him. The Holy Ghost communicates to us from Heavenly Father. One of his responsibilities is to witness the truth to us and bear witness of the Father and the Son.

When Heavenly Father communicates with us through the Holy Ghost, this is spiritual communication. The Holy Ghost speaks directly to our spirits, mainly through feelings and impressions in our minds and hearts.

Other responsibilities of the Holy Ghost include sanctifying us and cleansing us of sin and bringing us peace and comfort and safety. Spiritual guidance from the Holy Ghost can keep us physically and spiritually safe. Since He testifies of truth, His is the best guidance we have in mortal life.

Moroni promises us that if we read and pray about the Book of Mormon sincerely, the Holy Ghost will testify to us that it is true. This is the best example of how the Holy Ghost testifies of truth.

How to Feel the Holy Ghost

Unlike secular knowledge and the knowledge gained through our senses, spiritual communication from the Holy Ghost comes in spiritual ways. It is a spirit to spirit communication.

In fact, it is only when we are spiritually in tune, and seeking spiritual things, that we can feel the Holy Ghost's influence in our lives.

Wickedness and sin will dull our spiritual senses and make it difficult or impossible for us to hear or feel Him. Moreover, our sinning will cause the Holy Ghost to depart from us because He cannot dwell in unclean places.

Sometimes you know if you could not possibly think a thought on your own. If a sudden idea occurs to you, that you know you did not author, it could be that you are feeling spiritual communication from the Holy Ghost.

As you continue to learn and develop spiritually, you will become more adept at knowing when the Holy Ghost is speaking to you, prompting you or inspiring you.

To continue to receive communication from the Holy Ghost we must act on what we are spiritually told and follow any promptings we receive.

Why the Gift of the Holy Ghost Is Reserved for Mormons

Anyone has the ability to feel the Holy Ghost's influence in their life. However, the right to have the Holy Ghost with you at all times comes from baptism and confirmation in the Lord's true church. It is called the Gift of the Holy Ghost.

When you are confirmed a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the priesthood holder says, "Receive the Holy Ghost" you receive this gift.

The Holy Ghost was manifested after John the Baptist baptized Jesus Christ. The Gift of the Holy Ghost is given to you after your own baptism.

This gives you the right to have the Holy Ghost with you continuously until you die and return to heaven. It is a phenomenal gift and one we should cherish and use throughout our lives.

More interested in scriptures than opinions

[righteousrepublic]

More interested in scriptures than opinions

Who's scriptures exactly? And what do you see as an opinion?

For the record, I can't stand opinions given in place of scripture, either, but when someone speaks words that are backed by scripture then I can be enlightened and grateful.

Compare the above with this from LDS.org. https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... 8?lang=eng

Holy Ghost

The Holy Ghost is the third member of the Godhead. He is a personage of spirit, without a body of flesh and bones (see D&C 130:22). He is often referred to as the Spirit, the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of God, the Spirit of the Lord, or the Comforter.

Roles of the Holy Ghost

The Holy Ghost works in perfect unity with Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ, fulfilling several roles to help you live righteously and receive the blessings of the gospel.

He “witnesses of the Father and the Son” (2 Nephi 31:18) and reveals and teaches “the truth of all things” (Moroni 10:5). You can receive a sure testimony of Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ only by the power of the Holy Ghost. His communication to your spirit carries far more certainty than any communication you can receive through your natural senses.

As you strive to stay on the path that leads to eternal life, the Holy Ghost “will show unto you all things what [you] should do” (see 2 Nephi 32:1–5). He can guide you in your decisions and protect you from physical and spiritual danger.

Through Him, you can receive gifts of the Spirit for your benefit and for the benefit of those you love and serve (see D&C 46:9–11).

He is the Comforter (John 14:26). As the soothing voice of a loving parent can quiet a crying child, the whisperings of the Spirit can calm your fears, hush the nagging worries of your life, and comfort you when you grieve. The Holy Ghost can fill you “with hope and perfect love” and “teach you the peaceable things of the kingdom” (Moroni 8:26; D&C 36:2).

Through His power, you are sanctified as you repent, receive the ordinances of baptism and confirmation, and remain true to your covenants (see Mosiah 5:1–6; 3 Nephi 27:20; Moses 6:64–68).

He is the Holy Spirit of Promise (see Ephesians 1:13; D&C 132:7, 18–19, 26). In this capacity, He confirms that the priesthood ordinances you have received and the covenants you have made are acceptable to God. This approval depends on your continued faithfulness.

The Gift of the Holy Ghost

All honest seekers of the truth can feel the influence of the Holy Ghost, leading them to Jesus Christ and His gospel. However, the fulness of the blessings given through the Holy Ghost are available only to those who receive the gift of the Holy Ghost and remain worthy.

After you were baptized into The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, one or more Melchizedek Priesthood holders laid their hands on your head and, in a sacred priesthood ordinance, confirmed you a member of the Church. As part of this ordinance, called confirmation, you were given the gift of the Holy Ghost.

The gift of the Holy Ghost is different from the influence of the Holy Ghost. Before your baptism, you could feel the influence of the Holy Ghost from time to time, and through that influence you could receive a testimony of the truth. Now that you have the gift of the Holy Ghost, you have the right to the constant companionship of that member of the Godhead if you keep the commandments.

Full enjoyment of the gift of the Holy Ghost includes receiving revelation and comfort, serving and blessing others through spiritual gifts, and being sanctified from sin and made fit for exaltation in the celestial kingdom. These blessings depend on your worthiness; they come a little at a time as you are ready for them. As you bring your life in harmony with God’s will, you gradually receive the Holy Ghost in great measure. The Prophet Joseph Smith declared that the mysteries of God’s kingdom “are only to be seen and understood by the power of the Holy Spirit, which God bestows on those who love him, and purify themselves before him” (see D&C 76:114–116).

Remember that “the Spirit of the Lord doth not dwell in unholy temples” (Helaman 4:24). Even though you have received the gift of the Holy Ghost, the Spirit will dwell with you only when you keep the commandments. He will withdraw if you offend Him by profanity, uncleanliness, disobedience, rebellion, or other sins. Keep yourself clean. Fill your life with goodness so you can be worthy of the constant companionship of the Holy Ghost.
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Or how about this from Joseph Fielding Smith: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... 8?lang=eng

Teachings of Joseph F. Smith
The gift of the Holy Ghost is an abiding witness.

The Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit, he constitutes the third person in the Trinity, the Godhead. The gift or presentation of the Holy Ghost is the authoritative act of conferring him upon man. The Holy Ghost in person may visit men and will visit those who are worthy and bear witness to their spirit of God and Christ, but may not tarry with them [see D&C 130:22–23].3

“The gift of the Holy Ghost,” is a special blessing sealed upon baptized repentant believers in Jesus Christ, and is “an abiding witness.” The spirit of God may be enjoyed as a temporary influence by which divine light and power come to mankind for special purposes and occasions. But the gift of the Holy Ghost, which … is bestowed in confirmation, is a permanent witness and higher endowment.4

How shall we obtain the Holy Ghost? The method or manner is clearly marked out. We are told to have faith in God, to believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of all who diligently seek him; to repent of our sins, subdue our passions, follies, and improprieties; to be virtuous, honest, and upright in all our dealings one with another, and enter into covenant with God that we will from thenceforth abide in the principles of truth, and observe the commandments which he has given us, then to be baptized for the remission of our sins, by one having authority; and when this ordinance of the gospel is complied with, we may receive the gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying on of the hands of those clothed with the authority of the Priesthood. Thus the Spirit and power of God—the Comforter—may be in us a well of water springing up unto everlasting life. He will bear record of the Father, testifying of Jesus, and “take of the things of the Father and reveal them unto us,” confirming our faith, establishing us in the truth, that we shall be no longer tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine; but shall “know of the doctrine” whether it be of God or of man [see Ephesians 4:14; John 7:17].5

The Holy Ghost, who bears record of the Father and the Son, who takes of the things of the Father and shows them unto men, who testifies of Jesus Christ, and of the everliving God, the Father of Jesus Christ, and who bears witness of the truth—this Spirit, this Intelligence, is not given unto all men until they repent of their sins and come into a state of worthiness before the Lord [see 3 Nephi 28:11]. Then they receive the gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying on of the hands of those who are authorized of God to bestow his blessings upon the heads of the children of men.6

The presentation or “gift” of the Holy Ghost simply confers upon a man the right to receive at any time, when he is worthy of it and desires it, the power and light of truth of the Holy Ghost, although he may often be left to his own spirit and judgment.7
The Holy Ghost is a lamp to light our onward march.

The office of the Holy Ghost is to bear record of Christ, or to testify of him, and confirm the believer in the truth, by bringing to his recollection things that have passed, and showing or revealing to the mind things present and to come. “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.” [John 14:26.] “He will guide you into all truth.” [John 16:13.]8

It is the duty of Latter-day Saints to teach their children … the necessity of receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying on of hands, which will lead them into all truth, and which will reveal to them things that have passed and things which are to come, and show to them more clearly those things which are present with them, that they may comprehend the truth, and that they may walk in the light as Christ is in the light; that they may have fellowship with him and that his blood may cleanse them from all sin.9

There is a course marked out for us to walk in—it is that strait and narrow path which leads back to the presence of God; the lamp to light our onward march is the Holy Ghost, which we received on or after our new birth. If we falter and turn aside, our lamp will burn dim and finally go out, when lo, the Comforter, the source of revelation, will leave us, and darkness will take its place; then how great will be that darkness! In proportion to the light we possessed will darkness overpower us, and unless a speedy repentance is made the darkness will increase within us until we lose sight of our calling and forget Him who redeemed us and claimed us for his own.10

The office of the Holy Spirit is to enlighten the minds of the people with regard to the things of God, to convince them at the time of their conversion of their having done the will of the Father, and to be in them an abiding testimony as a companion through life, acting as the sure and safe guide into all truth and filling them day by day with joy and gladness, with a disposition to do good to all men, to suffer wrong rather than to do wrong, to be kind and merciful, long suffering and charitable. All who possess this inestimable gift, this pearl of great price, have a continual thirst after righteousness. Without the aid of the Holy Spirit no mortal can walk in the straight and narrow way, being unable to discern right from wrong, the genuine from the counterfeit, so nearly alike can they be made to appear. Therefore it behooves the Latter-day Saints to live pure and upright, in order that this Spirit may abide in them; for it is only possessed on the principle of righteousness. I cannot receive it for you, nor you for me; every one must stand for him or her self, whether of high or humble birth, learned or unlearned, and it is the privilege of all alike to be made partakers of it.11

The Holy Ghost descends only upon the righteous and upon those who are forgiven of their sins. … So long as the Latter-day Saints are content to obey the commandments of God, to appreciate the privileges and blessings which they enjoy in the Church, and will use their time, their substance, in honor to the name of God, to build up Zion, and to establish truth and righteousness in the earth, so long our heavenly Father is bound by his oath and covenant to protect them from every opposing foe, and to help them to overcome every obstacle that can possibly be arrayed against them, or thrown in their pathway; but the moment a community begin to be wrapt up in themselves, become selfish, become engrossed in the temporalities of life, and put their faith in riches, that moment the power of God begins to withdraw from them, and if they repent not the Holy Spirit will depart from them entirely, and they will be left to themselves.12

You who have obeyed the requirements of the everlasting Gospel, and have been chosen out of the world, having received the gift of the Holy Ghost through the laying on of hands, it is your privilege to receive the witness of the Spirit for yourselves; it is your privilege to discern the mind and will of the Father respecting your own welfare, and respecting the final triumph of the work of God.13

Through the power of the Holy Ghost, we are born again.

The Savior said to Nicodemus, “Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God,” [see John 3:5] and that is true today. A man must be born from ignorance into truth, today. … If he is not so born, he is more blind than the one whom Christ healed, for having eyes he sees not, and having ears, hears not.14

That change comes today to every son and daughter of God who repents of his or her sins, who humble themselves before the Lord, and who seek forgiveness and remission of sin by baptism by immersion, by one having authority to administer this sacred ordinance of the gospel of Jesus Christ. For it is this new birth that was spoken of by Christ to Nicodemus as absolutely essential that men might see the kingdom of God, and without which no man could enter into the kingdom. Each of us can remember, perhaps, the change that came into our hearts when we were baptized for the remission of our sins. … I speak of the influence and power of the Holy Spirit that I experienced when I had been baptized for the remission of my sins. The feeling that came upon me was that of pure peace, of love and of light. …

Oh! that I could have kept that same spirit and that same earnest desire in my heart every moment of my life from that day to this. Yet many of us who have received that witness, that new birth, that change of heart, while we may have erred in judgment or have made many mistakes, and often perhaps come short of the true standard in our lives, we have repented of the evil, and we have sought from time to time forgiveness at the hand of the Lord; so that until this day the same desire and purpose which pervaded our souls when we were baptized and received a remission of our sins, still holds possession of our hearts, and is still the ruling sentiment and passion of our souls. Though at times we may be stirred to anger, and our wrath move us to say and do things which are not pleasing in the sight of God, yet instantly on regaining our sober senses and recovering from our lapse into the power of darkness, we feel humble, repentant, and to ask forgiveness for the wrong that we have done to ourselves, and perchance to others. The great, earnest, overwhelming desire, which is born of the truth and of the witness of the Holy Spirit in the hearts of the people who obey the truth, assumes sway and again takes possession of our souls, to lead us on in the path of duty. This is my testimony and I know it is true.15
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The Holy Ghost by Robert D Hales:

Are all these merely opinions as well?

[Contemplator]

This topic is a mess because of word use that has been inconsistent over time. It is true that at times Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit seem to be the same thing. But, at times they seem to be different. Let me propose a different approach. Let’s see if we can agree on a simple definition of two things that the word “spirit” may be describing.

First, spirit could be a personage of spirit. You and I and the Father, and Jesus and the Holy Ghost all have been, and still have within us, a personage of spirit. And, without a mortal or eternal body/tabernacle, would still be a personage of spirit.

Second, spirit could refer to the stuff that is matter, but more refined, that emanates from God, through Christ, that is in and through everything (as described in D&C 88). This is the mind, power, and law of God. It is the means of oneness with God. Let me call it spirit stuff to differentiate from spirit personages.

So, when we are reading and seeking to understand we need to know whether the words are referring to spirit stuff or spirit personages.

Now for a few other observations.

Nowhere that I have found in the scriptures is the Godhead defined as the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. That is tradition. It may be based on the fact that the scriptures do say that the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one god. Allow yourself to consider that “godhead” and “one god” may not mean the same thing.

Joseph, with his coauthors, defines the godhead in lecture five of Lectures on Faith as two personages and something that is functionally equivalent to the spirit stuff described in D&C 88. If you assume that Holy Spirit in lecture 5 means Holy Ghost then the lecture is confusing. If you look at the thing described in lecture 5 and compare it to other revelation through Joseph, then lecture 5 may make more sense. The Father and the Son, who are one through the spirit stuff described consistently in lecture 5 and D&C 88, are defined as the Godhead. This is not inconsistent with scripture because the godhead is not defined in other scripture.

The Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit. It is in a state of probation, it has yet to take on a body (resurrected and eternal) as the Father and the Son have). The Holy Ghost, when made one with the Father and Jesus Christ is part of “One God” comprised of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost, Juan as the scriptures repeatedly say.

In lecture 5 we are also invited to become one, through the spirit stuff that is described in that lecture, with the Father and the Son. Thus, we are invited to be like the Holy Ghost, i.e., a personage of spirit, in a state of probation, still yet to take a resurrected or eternal body like the Father or the Son.

I am not declaring the identity of the Holy Ghost in the above observations. It could be Michael, it could be the davidic servant, it could be an undefined god, it could be your own spirit made holy. These are all possibilities. God has not revealed, in any general authoritative way, the identity of the Holy Ghost. That is to be had by personal revelation. So, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. But, maybe it would be better if we did not try to compel each other to our own current thinking on the topic.

[Contemplator]

I will also post here something that I recently posted in another thread because it seems relevant here.

A very real barrier to learning more is the belief that one already fully knows a topic. In D&C 121 we are told:

26 God shall give unto you knowledge by his Holy Spirit, yea, by the unspeakable gift of the Holy Ghost, that has not been revealed since the world was until now;

Here are some interesting things about this verse. First, it uses the words “Holy Ghost” and “Holy Spirit.” It says that the Holy Spirit is “his” Holy Spirit. This may mean that Holy Spirit is the spirit that is associated with the attributes of God like that which is described in D&C 88. The Holy Ghost is associated with a gift. It is not stated definitively whether the Holy Ghost is the gift, or the giver of the gift. It is not stated definitively whether Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit mean the same thing or refer to things that are different but related.

Second, the verse says there is something that has not been revealed since the beginning of the world until now (Mar 20, 1839). The grammar is ambiguous. The thing that has not been revealed could be the unspeakable gift of the Holy Ghost or it could be the knowledge alluded to at the start of the verse.

A fascinating verse that suggests a very important idea. The Lord is telling us that knowledge, the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Ghost (including an unspeakable gift) are closely related to each other. As Finrock has said, the truth of how these things are related is to be had by personal revelation. It had not been revealed generally in 1839 and I do not know of any revelation being publicly published since then either.

Do not assume you know how knowledge, the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Ghost are related. Instead, seek for further revelation for yourself from God. What I have learned through this seeking has been filled with God’s love, has humbled me, and brought me to Christ.

[righteousrepublic]

Nowhere that I have found in the scriptures is the Godhead defined as the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. That is tradition.

1 Nephi 10
17 And it came to pass after I, Nephi, having heard all the words of my father, concerning the things which he saw in a vision, and also the things which he spake by the power of the Holy Ghost, which power he received by faith on the Son of God—and the Son of God was the Messiah who should come—I, Nephi, was desirous also that I might see, and hear, and know of these things, by the power of the Holy Ghost, which is the gift of God unto all those who diligently seek him, as well in times of old as in the time that he should manifest himself unto the children of men.
22 And the Holy Ghost giveth authority that I should speak these things, and deny them not.

Sounds like the HG being one entity, right?

2 Nephi 16
8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying: Whom shall I send, and who will go for us? Then I said: Here am I; send me.

Sounds like two separate individuals, correct?

The Father, Son and Holy Ghost are three separate entities, yet they think alike, act alike and do all things alike. This makes them all one in purpose.
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Now let's look at Luke 3:22
22 And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.

All three in just one sentence, right? Jesus in the water, the Holy Ghost descending upon him and the Father above saying "Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased."

Who here thinks that Jesus was a ventriloquist?

[righteousrepublic]

I will also post here something that I recently posted in another thread because it seems relevant here.

A very real barrier to learning more is the belief that one already fully knows a topic. In D&C 121 we are told:

26 God shall give unto you knowledge by his Holy Spirit, yea, by the unspeakable gift of the Holy Ghost, that has not been revealed since the world was until now;

Here are some interesting things about this verse. First, it uses the words “Holy Ghost” and “Holy Spirit.” It says that the Holy Spirit is “his” Holy Spirit. This may mean that Holy Spirit is the spirit that is associated with the attributes of God like that which is described in D&C 88. The Holy Ghost is associated with a gift. It is not stated definitively whether the Holy Ghost is the gift, or the giver of the gift. It is not stated definitively whether Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit mean the same thing or refer to things that are different but related.

Second, the verse says there is something that has not been revealed since the beginning of the world until now (Mar 20, 1839). The grammar is ambiguous. The thing that has not been revealed could be the unspeakable gift of the Holy Ghost or it could be the knowledge alluded to at the start of the verse.

A fascinating verse that suggests a very important idea. The Lord is telling us that knowledge, the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Ghost (including an unspeakable gift) are closely related to each other. As Finrock has said, the truth of how these things are related is to be had by personal revelation. It had not been revealed generally in 1839 and I do not know of any revelation being publicly published since then either.

Do not assume you know how knowledge, the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Ghost are related. Instead, seek for further revelation for yourself from God. What I have learned through this seeking has been filled with God’s love, has humbled me, and brought me to Christ.

26 God shall give unto you knowledge by his Holy Spirit, yea, by the unspeakable gift of the Holy Ghost, that has not been revealed since the world was until now;

Someone with better English knowledge can break this down better than I, but I do know that when one removes a portion of the sentence it reads: 26 God shall give unto you knowledge that has not been revealed since the world was until now;

Then we can realize that we gain this knowledge by the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit and Holy Ghost are one in the same.

Then when one follows the provided references they come to find out that it IS mysteries not known to man that will be revealed and that more scripture is to be given in the future.

Such as Alma 40:3
3 Behold, he bringeth to pass the resurrection of the dead. But behold, my son, the resurrection is not yet. Now, I unfold unto you a mystery; nevertheless, there are many mysteries which are kept, that no one knoweth them save God himself.

[Alaris]

2 Nephi 31:21 And now, behold, my beloved brethren, this is the way; and there is none other way nor name given under heaven whereby man can be saved in the kingdom of God. And now, behold, this is the doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen