President Nelson says church will donate to mosques

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Joel
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President Nelson says church will donate to mosques

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President Nelson meets New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern, says church will donate to mosques

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WELLINGTON, New Zealand — On her first day back at work after a triumphant trip to Paris that substantiated her No. 2 ranking on Fortune's list of the world's greatest leaders, New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern welcomed President Russell M. Nelson, leader of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

President Nelson told Ardern the church will make donations Tuesday night to leaders of the two mosques where a gunman killed 51 people in attacks on March 15 in Christchurch, 270 miles south of here.

"We will be making contributions to those mosques to help them repair from their damages," he said.

He called it a great privilege to meet with her and praised Ardern's leadership in the wake of those attacks.

"She's courageous," he said, adding, "The world will discover they've got a real leader here. It's an unlikely scenario, a young mother leading a great nation, a peacemaker, a policymaker, a consensus-builder. We're very confident she'll have a great future."

A pacesetter

Ardern swept into power amid "Jacindamania" throughout New Zealand, bore a child in office last year and then rocketed to worldwide acclaim for her leadership in the wake of the mosque attacks.

Immediately after the attacks, Ardern wore a hijab to grieve with New Zealand's Muslims, earning gratitude throughout the Muslim world, and then quickly led new, virtually unanimous legislation to ban most semi-automatic weapons and some pump-action shotguns, action that made worldwide headlines.

Last week, her expanding global clout brought some of the world's most powerful digital powerhouses to the table with government leaders in Paris to spearhead a stunning agreement to curb internet extremism.

Ardern pulled off a "blinder," a New Zealand term for an excellent performance in sports or elsewhere.

Eight technology companies, including tech titans Amazon, Facebook, Google, Twitter, Microsoft and YouTube, signed the agreement on Thursday, along with 17 nations and the European Union.

In the meeting

Ardern discussed the Christchurch call to action in Paris with President Nelson and his wife, Sister Wendy Nelson, and Elder Gerrit W. Gong of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles and his wife, Sister Susan Gong.

"One of the topics that came up was the importance of using social media in a proper way," Elder Gong said. "There needs to be a balance between religious freedom and the ability to speak out but also to use it in a way that is responsible, particularly when it involves what children might see. That's something the prime minister was concerned about. She and President Nelson had a very important dialogue on that."

The Christchurch gunman had violated Facebook rules. Facebook announced last week it now will block users who violate rules from livestreaming, a Facebook feature the gunman used during his attack.

In the three-page Christchurch Call agreement, the tech giants all agreed to stop livestreaming extremist content and said they would review algorithms that could drive users to terrorist content and redirect them. They also committed to develop crisis response protocols to respond to online terrorism.

The agreement also directed signatories to abide by the principles of free speech and an open, secure internet.

The White House issued a statement supporting the principles behind the call but did not join the agreement out of ongoing concerns about free speech implications. Ardern defended the U.S. position but said the agreement does not infringe on free speech.


Church donations

The attacks were a blow to all Pacific islanders, said Elder O. Vincent Haleck, president of the church's Pacific Area Presidency and a native of American Samoa who was accompanied by his wife, Sister Peggy Haleck. He said the donations to the mosques come from a desire to help.

"We're clearly sensitive to what's happened there," he said of Christchurch. "Our hearts were broken when we heard about the tragedy that happened and the loss of life, and so the church is reaching out as it does in these kinds of situations in other parts of the world to lend a hand, to be there for our brothers and sisters who are of another ethnicity and another religious group. That doesn't matter to us. We're there to help and that's the reason why we are helping and continue to help, not just for tomorrow but continuing."

The meeting took place in the Parliament known as the beehive here in Wellington, the nation's seaside capital. Afterward, President Nelson spoke to media as New Zealand flags flapped in the breeze of a cool, sunny fall day in the Southern Hemisphere.

He said they talked about helping diverse populations live together.

"It's a multicultural community in New Zealand, a diverse community, but she's a peacemaker," he said. "We have that problem in all the countries of the world, really, how people can have differing points of view and can learn to love and live with one another."

"President Nelson is a natural diplomat," Elder Gong said. "He's a prophet for the church and he's also a prophet for the world."

A gift

The Nelsons and Gongs and Halecks were joined by Ardern's uncle, Elder Ian S. Ardern and Sister Paula Ardern. The prime minister's parents, including Elder Ardern's twin brother, were in the meeting, as was the prime minister's young daughter.

"We felt like family, really," President Nelson said.

"Part of the warmth of the meeting was the prime minister describing her rich family heritage and the great values that she takes from her upbringing," Elder Gong said. "In fact, she said she was so grateful that she received, once she first became the prime minister, her family genealogy and the roots of her family. That was a source of great warmth."

Ardern was raised in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints but is no longer a practicing member. She showed the church contingent the books the church prepared for her about her family ancestry after she became prime minister.

During Monday's meeting, President Nelson presented her with a leather-bound copy of the Book of Mormon with her name embossed on the front.

"That's mine," she told her mother, Elder Ardern said with a laugh.

President Nelson is on a tour of six Pacific nations. He spoke first at a devotional in Hawaii on Thursday followed by another Saturday in Samoa and a third Sunday in Australia. He will speak here in Auckland on Tuesday night, then in Fiji on Wednesday, Tonga on Thursday and finally wrap up in Tahiti on Friday.

In Samoa he met with the prime minister and the head of state.

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Elizabeth
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:?

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Joel
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Joel
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I wonder how President Nelson feels about Ardern's efforts in disarming her citizens?



Fiannan
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Note the credits at the end of the video. Also, why the abrupt cutoff? I would have liked to have heard what he said just afterwards.

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Joel
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here is the whole video if you are curious https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgIgNDw22-k

thestock
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I've been considering donating my 10% to charities, food banks, and organizations that help with addiction and poverty instead of giving it to the Church. I have wrestled with this but in the end, I think I can look Christ in the eyes easier and say "I did my best to help people that needed it" than I can and say "I gave money to a church" especially when that church builds shopping malls, office buildings, and runs other for-profit businesses and donates to religions that don't even acknowledge Jesus Christ.

This may just be the final straw for me.

Juliet
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We are supposed to love one another and show compassion to each other regardless of religion.

Is this money truly given in that spirit, or is it given to buy appreciation from one religion to another?

If it is the former then it's fine. If it's the latter then that is wrong.

Aprhys
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thestock wrote: May 21st, 2019, 6:50 am I've been considering donating my 10% to charities, food banks, and organizations that help with addiction and poverty instead of giving it to the Church. I have wrestled with this but in the end, I think I can look Christ in the eyes easier and say "I did my best to help people that needed it" than I can and say "I gave money to a church" especially when that church builds shopping malls, office buildings, and runs other for-profit businesses and donates to religions that don't even acknowledge Jesus Christ.

This may just be the final straw for me.
I started doing this a year ago and I feel much better inside when I donate to the needy than when I donate to a real estate corporation. You should try it and see how it feels to you. I suppose that individual results may vary.

Juliet
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Re: President Nelson says church will donate to mosques

Post by Juliet »

Joel wrote: May 20th, 2019, 9:24 pm I wonder how President Nelson feels about Ardern's efforts in disarming her citizens?


President Nelson said that God allows us to have our agency and men have passed laws to allow guns to go to men that shouldn't have them.

It would be those who chose to murder who are responsible for their actions. Men cannot know who should and shouldn't have a gun. Because we have agency we cannot predict someone's actions in advance whether they will be good or evil.
Last edited by Juliet on May 21st, 2019, 7:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

tdj
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thestock wrote: May 21st, 2019, 6:50 am I've been considering donating my 10% to charities, food banks, and organizations that help with addiction and poverty instead of giving it to the Church. I have wrestled with this but in the end, I think I can look Christ in the eyes easier and say "I did my best to help people that needed it" than I can and say "I gave money to a church" especially when that church builds shopping malls, office buildings, and runs other for-profit businesses and donates to religions that don't even acknowledge Jesus Christ.

This may just be the final straw for me.
I forget, who was responsible for that attack? Was it a muslim?
Either way, I see the strategic cunning in this. That area has a high percentage of lds members, and I think this was a way to maybe protect them? Possibly anyway. It's kind of like when you visit a friend or relative at prison or the county lock up. If you are super nice and accommodating to the jailers and staff, then they are more apt to be nice to whoever you visited. On the opposite angle, if you are nasty, for any reason, they'll take it out on that person and it won't be pretty.

thestock
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tdj wrote: May 21st, 2019, 7:12 am
thestock wrote: May 21st, 2019, 6:50 am I've been considering donating my 10% to charities, food banks, and organizations that help with addiction and poverty instead of giving it to the Church. I have wrestled with this but in the end, I think I can look Christ in the eyes easier and say "I did my best to help people that needed it" than I can and say "I gave money to a church" especially when that church builds shopping malls, office buildings, and runs other for-profit businesses and donates to religions that don't even acknowledge Jesus Christ.

This may just be the final straw for me.
I forget, who was responsible for that attack? Was it a muslim?
Either way, I see the strategic cunning in this. That area has a high percentage of lds members, and I think this was a way to maybe protect them? Possibly anyway. It's kind of like when you visit a friend or relative at prison or the county lock up. If you are super nice and accommodating to the jailers and staff, then they are more apt to be nice to whoever you visited. On the opposite angle, if you are nasty, for any reason, they'll take it out on that person and it won't be pretty.
I am going to attempt to tread lightly here.....but if it WERE ME.....and I wanted to do something to make a difference after this attack.....why would I go hang out with a politician and bring a lackey church cameraman/journalist with me? Wouldn't I rather go to the ground zero, speak with the spiritual leaders, stress the commonalities of our two faiths, celebrate the differences that give us unique heritage and culture, and offer to assist in any way possible?

I dont see going to hang out with a politician in a very PR type of way as being geniune. As you said, more like "strategic cunning".....

tdj
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thestock wrote: May 21st, 2019, 7:24 am
tdj wrote: May 21st, 2019, 7:12 am
thestock wrote: May 21st, 2019, 6:50 am I've been considering donating my 10% to charities, food banks, and organizations that help with addiction and poverty instead of giving it to the Church. I have wrestled with this but in the end, I think I can look Christ in the eyes easier and say "I did my best to help people that needed it" than I can and say "I gave money to a church" especially when that church builds shopping malls, office buildings, and runs other for-profit businesses and donates to religions that don't even acknowledge Jesus Christ.

This may just be the final straw for me.
I forget, who was responsible for that attack? Was it a muslim?
Either way, I see the strategic cunning in this. That area has a high percentage of lds members, and I think this was a way to maybe protect them? Possibly anyway. It's kind of like when you visit a friend or relative at prison or the county lock up. If you are super nice and accommodating to the jailers and staff, then they are more apt to be nice to whoever you visited. On the opposite angle, if you are nasty, for any reason, they'll take it out on that person and it won't be pretty.
I am going to attempt to tread lightly here.....but if it WERE ME.....and I wanted to do something to make a difference after this attack.....why would I go hang out with a politician and bring a lackey church cameraman/journalist with me? Wouldn't I rather go to the ground zero, speak with the spiritual leaders, stress the commonalities of our two faiths, celebrate the differences that give us unique heritage and culture, and offer to assist in any way possible?

I dont see going to hang out with a politician in a very PR type of way as being geniune. As you said, more like "strategic cunning".....
Oh, I get what you're saying, and now that I think of it, it would have been a very compassionate and gracious gesture to have visited some of the victims. Then again, maybe he DID and we just didn't hear about it because it was made a more private affair? Who knows. But I did look up the attacker and he wasn't muslim at all, but was a white supremist. Kind of rare these days for that kind of attack from a white supremicst person, but here we are. I've also noticed in general, that more coverage and outrage happens when the attacker deviats from the norm of being muslim and instead is a white person with a white powerish agenda, and I can't help but wonder how the visit may or may not have been different had that been the case? Mind you this is pure speculation. When the airport bomb went off in Brussels, the apostles made it a point to personally visit the missionary's in their hospital rooms.

MMbelieve
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Did we donate to the Jewish synagogues?

EmmaLee
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MMbelieve wrote: May 21st, 2019, 4:06 pm Did we donate to the Jewish synagogues?
Or to all the Christian churches that have been burned to the ground by Muslims, after they butchered all the Christians in and around them? This isn't just past-tense, as it's still happening on a regular, current basis. I'd love to read about the donations our Church has made to the families of the murdered Christians, and to the congregations (or what's left of them) of the burned out Christians churches, if anyone can provide a link.

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Elizabeth
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Anyone who professes to be a Muslim and follows the Koran is an enemy to any Christian and non Muslim and to their countries.
The agenda of Islam is to dominate the world, to lie whenever it suits them to further that cause, for their adherents to have as many children as possible.. mostly supported financially by welfare from non Muslims / Infidels.
The Koran encourages Muslims to kill anyone who does not agree to follow their “religion”.

ALL Muslims should be sent to a Muslim country and refused entry to non Muslim countries.

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https://bigleaguepolitics.com/google-ap ... blasphemy/
The app, “Smart Pakem”, which launched in Indonesia at the request of the Indonesian government, will allow users and government officials to uphold Sharia law and target and report people who hold “misguided” beliefs in violation of Islamic law, which forbids insults of Islam, insults against the Prophet Mohammed, or the recognition of any other religion besides Islam.
The penalty for violating Article 156(a) of Indonesia’s criminal code is a maximum of five years imprisonment.

sushi_chef
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ummm..., kinda similarity with church stance in 2008 proposition 8??!! trying swimming against the flow?? sending a diplomatic false sign?? :arrow:

dezNatDefender
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tdj wrote: May 21st, 2019, 12:33 pm
But I did look up the attacker and he wasn't muslim at all, but was a white supremist. Kind of rare these days for that kind of attack from a white supremicst person, but here we are.
Sort of yes, sort of no. The attacker was actually quite a complicated individual and actually really intelligent. He wrote a very, very long screed and there is a lot of stuff in there that is clearly not good and a lot of stuff in there that is like. . . hmm that is scary accurate.

He isn't alt-right. He is on the far, far end of the spectrum of the "right". But he is more of what I'd call a amoral, atheistic, white agitatarian. Obviously, what the guy did is anti-Christian, anti-God, an evil despicable act. But he was very calculated in what he did.

As sick as it may sound in his own words he did what he did specifically to push the ball down the court.

In his view (and not without justification), multiculturalism is overtaking traditional white, European cultures. Except for Eastern Europe, there are no predominately white Christian nations that espouse and uphold traditional European values as a moral good. No one ever talks about Japan needing to be more culturally diverse, or that China needs more diversity, or that even Nigeria needs to be more multicultural-it's only in predominately western european countries. Western European countries are importing non-western peoples into their countries at a fairly large rate-compound that with a below repopulation birth rate for european peoples and you get a massive shift in the demographics in a country. Shift the demographics, you shift the culture, value, laws, etc.

He lays all of this out, which is nothing new. Where he goes off the rails is that in his view the only way to stop this process is to speed it up. His viewpoint is that more and more people are recognizing the yuck that is "multiculturalism" and that the only way for european values to not disappear is for more people to recognize what is happening. Now everyone who is an actual moral person is going to say, the key is education, discussion, etc. Violent killing is so morally wrong-hell is waiting for that crap.

Since he is godless, his idea is that by committing a horrific atrocity, it will just further drive multiculturalism into high gear. You will get massive sympathy for the Muslim community, you will get gun control, and you will get more importation of Muslim. His idea is to kick multiculturalism into high gear so that more people will recognize what it is and then resist it.

In essence, the guy is a bomb-thrower provacator.

The scary thing is how many things he predicted that would happen from his attack, did happen.

As cultures clash . . . be prepared for more of this type of horrific crap to happen.

sushi_chef
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from the perspective of early american muslim....

"Image
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The first words to pass between Europeans and Americans (one-sided and confusing as they must have been) were in the sacred language of Islam. Christopher Columbus had hoped to sail to Asia and had prepared to communicate at its great courts in one of the major languages of Eurasian commerce. So when Columbus’s interpreter, a Spanish Jew, spoke to the Taíno of Hispaniola, he did so in Arabic. Not just the language of Islam, but the religion itself likely arrived in America in 1492, more than 20 years before Martin Luther nailed his theses to the door, igniting the Protestant reformation.

Moors – African and Arab Muslims – had conquered much of the Iberian peninsula in 711, establishing a Muslim culture that lasted nearly eight centuries. By 1491, the Spanish monarchs Ferdinand and Isabella completed the Reconquista, defeating the last of the Muslim kingdoms, Granada. By the end of the century, the Inquisition, which had begun a century earlier, had coerced between 300,000 and 800,000 Muslims (and probably at least 70,000 Jews) to convert to Christianity. Spanish Catholics often suspected these Moriscos or conversos of practising Islam (or Judaism) in secret, and the Inquisition pursued and persecuted them. Some, almost certainly, sailed in Columbus’s crew, carrying Islam in their hearts and minds.

Eight centuries of Muslim rule left a deep cultural legacy on Spain, one evident in clear and sometimes surprising ways during the Spanish conquest of the Americas. Bernal Díaz del Castillo, the chronicler of Hernán Cortés’s conquest of Meso-America, admired the costumes of native women dancers by writing ‘muy bien vestidas a su manera y que parecían moriscas’, or ‘very well-dressed in their own way, and seemed like Moorish women’. The Spanish routinely used ‘mezquita’ (Spanish for mosque) to refer to Native American religious sites. Travelling through Anahuac (today’s Texas and Mexico), Cortés reported that he saw more than 400 mosques.

Islam served as a kind of blueprint or algorithm for the Spanish in the New World. As they encountered people and things new to them, they turned to Islam to try to understand what they were seeing, what was happening. Even the name ‘California’ might have some Arabic lineage. The Spanish gave the name, in 1535, taking it from The Deeds of Esplandian (1510), a romance novel popular with the conquistadores. The novel features a rich island – California – ruled by black Amazonians and their queen Calafia. The Deeds of Esplandian had been published in Seville, a city that had for centuries been part of the Umayyad caliphate (caliph, Calafia, California).

Across the Western hemisphere, whenever they arrived at new lands or encountered native peoples, Spanish conquistadores read the requerimiento, a stylised legal pronouncement. In essence, it announced a new state of society: offering Native Americans the chance to convert to Christianity and submit to Spanish rule, or else bear responsibility for all the ‘deaths and losses’ that would follow. A formal and public announcement of the intent to conquer, including an offer to the faithless of a chance to submit and become believers, is the first formal requirement of jihad. Following centuries of war with the Muslims, the Spanish had adopted this practice, Christianised it, called it the requerimiento, and took it to America. Iberian Christians might have thought Islam wrong, or even diabolical, but they also knew it well. If they thought it strange, it must be counted a very familiar strange.

By 1503, we know that Muslims themselves, from West Africa, were in the New World. In that year, Hispaniola’s royal governor wrote to Isabella requesting that she curtail their importation. They were, he wrote, ‘a source of scandal to the Indians’. They had, he wrote, repeatedly ‘fled their owners’. On Christmas morning 1522, in the New World’s first slave rebellion, 20 Hispaniola sugarmill slaves rose and began slaughtering Spaniards. The rebels, the governor noted, were mostly Wolof, a Senegambian people, who have been Muslim since the 11th century. Muslims were more likely than other enslaved Africans to be literate: an ability rarely looked upon with favour by plantation-owners. In the five decades following the 1522 slave rebellion on Hispaniola, Spain issued five decrees prohibiting the importation of Muslim slaves.

Muslims thus arrived in America more than a century before the Virginia Company founded the Jamestown colony in 1607. Muslims came to America more than a century before the Puritans founded the Massachusetts Bay Colony in 1630. Muslims were living in America not only before Protestants, but before Protestantism existed. After Catholicism, Islam was the second monotheistic religion in the Americas.

The popular misunderstanding, even among educated people, that Islam and Muslims are recent additions to America tells us important things about how American history has been written. In particular, it reveals how historians have justified and celebrated the emergence of the modern nation-state. One way to valorise the United States of America has been to minimise the heterogeneity and scale – the cosmopolitanism, diversity and mutual co-existence of peoples – in America during the first 300 years of European presence...
" https://aeon.co/essays/muslims-lived-in ... ket-newtab
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muslims early america
https://search.yahoo.co.jp/search?ei=UT ... %20america
:arrow:

wargames83
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Post by wargames83 »

dezNatDefender wrote: May 22nd, 2019, 7:41 pm
No one ever talks about Japan needing to be more culturally diverse,
Japan could use a little diversity. The Japanese are having children well below replacement rate.

wargames83
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Elizabeth wrote: May 21st, 2019, 6:08 pm

ALL Muslims should be sent to a Muslim country and refused entry to non Muslim countries.
Let's see, that would be against human rights, the first amendment, the 11th article of faith, freedom of consciousness..., any I missed?

Aprhys
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And yet here we are...
Screenshot_2019-05-23-03-10-29-1.png
Screenshot_2019-05-23-03-10-29-1.png (239.26 KiB) Viewed 999 times

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David13
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Post by David13 »

That video shows Pres Nelson to be an educated fool, an idiot.

There is no law that "allows guns into the hands of those who shouldn't have them", any more than there is any law that would prevent guns from getting into the hands of those who shouldn't have them, or use them for evil purpose.

Is there any law that allows drug users to buy their illegal drugs on the black market? Only an idiot would think that.

He may be a revelator, seer and prophet, but he sure got that one wrong.

And there is a hypocrisy to it as well, as he uses armed guards.
dc

He got the free agency part, the free will, which includes the free will to do evil, he has that part right. Is there any law that would prevent free agency? Only an idiot would think so.

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gkearney
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Aprhys wrote: May 23rd, 2019, 5:10 am And yet here we are...Screenshot_2019-05-23-03-10-29-1.png
There are three possibilities to explain this:

First, and by far the most likely, is that the pictures were covered by well meaning but ill informed LDS Church members who are under the mistaken belief that a picture of Christ would somehow be offensive to Muslims.

Second, the picture was covered out of respect for the Muslim practice of not having art forms that represent things that are created by God. This would then apply to pictures of people, animals or even landscapes. The reasoning for this is to avoid anything even remotely connected to idol worship. This is why Islamic art is generally focused on geometric patterns. The history here is that the Prophet Mohammed cast out idols in Mecca at the beginning of his ministry and this is why visual representation of him are forbidden in Islam less any Muslim start to worship Mohammed and not God. Idol worship, or anything even remotely similar to it, is a very serious sin in Islam.

Third, and I find this highly unlikely, the Muslim worshipers covered the painting themselves. Even if this was the case the reason for doing so would likely be number two above and not out of any disrespect for Jesus whom they hold in very high regard.

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