Page 1 of 1
New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 8:59 am
by ori
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/03/16/poli ... index.html
"(CNN)Colorado could be part of voting history next general election day, joining 11 other states looking to ensure that their electoral college votes echo the will of the American majority to elect the next president.
Gov. Jared Polis signed a law Friday that would allot the state's electoral college votes to whichever candidate won the national popular vote. The Washington Post previously reported the law's signing.
The trend comes as Americans have shown greater support in recent years for a more democratic presidential election process, without the translational risks of the electoral college. But the daunting requirement of changing the Constitution, where the electoral college is formally codified, has posed a challenge to both public and political support for the issue.
The state's legislation would only take effect if enough other states sign on to secure the cumulative 270 electors needed to elect a president, and Colorado's votes raise the current total to 181 electors. Most states have winner-take-all laws in place dictating that their electors go towards whichever candidate takes the state's popular majority, while Maine and Nebraska opt to proportionally split their electors based on the vote.
The eleven other states that have signed on -- California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Vermont and Washington state -- as well as the District of Columbia and now Colorado, make up the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact. New Mexico, which has five electoral votes, sent a bill to the governor's desk to elect the president by popular vote and may soon join the group as well.
And the electoral college had been contentious not long ago. In 2016, President Donald Trump won the presidential vote with 306 electoral votes to Hillary Clinton's 232 votes. But Clinton won the popular vote, garnering 48.5% of the vote to Trump's 46.4%."
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 9:00 am
by ori
What do you think of these laws? I think no good will come of them.
Seems like a power grab by people who want control.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 9:06 am
by Arandur
Perhaps not. Still, at least it’s constitutional, and keeps the real power with the states, who can readjust these laws as they see fit. For all it’s flaws, this approach is a neater resolution to the EC controversy than I had expected to see, if it actually ends up resolving the controversy.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 9:19 am
by setyourselffree
Until I see a true swing state going this route then I will worry about it. All of these states are all democrat strong holds.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 9:58 am
by onandagus
Unenforceable. It's not common but not unheard of for electors to not vote along party lines or even for a candidate who is not on the ballot. Electors have broke ranks in the past and presumable will in the future. That being said the law will likely have it's intended effect with most electors towing the line.
However to prevent or punish an elector voting their conscience would likely take a constitutional amendment.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 11:42 am
by mes5464
ori wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 9:00 am
What do you think of these laws? I think no good will come of them.
Seems like a power grab by people who want control.
We are doomed.
I mean that seriously, I am not being sarcastic. It is just another way to steal/manipulate the vote.
A democracy is a proven failure and that is what this is trying to do.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 11:53 am
by gkearney
A better approach is what Maine and Nebraska do. Apportions your electoral votes by congressional district with the winner of the whole state getting the two senatorial electors. In the last election in Maine this resulted in Trump getting one electoral vote and Clinton getting three. There are two congressional districts in Maine the first voted for Trump and the Second voted for Clinton. Clinton then won the state overall and got the remaining two senatorial, or state wide electors.
If all the states were do do this it would be much more even system that would require presidential candidate to go out and campaign in much smaller geographic regions. IT would also solve the problem of a few big urban areas decided how all the electors in a given state are to vote or in republican states where all the counties get to decide how the urban electors will vote.
This still rewards winning a given state as the winner gets those two statewide electors.
The other reform that can be made is to place the names of the electors on the ballots. You would then be voting for electors which is what you're doing anyway. When you go in to vote you would get to vote for three electors, one from you district and the two statewide electors. So you could split you presidential electors vote vote.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 3:55 pm
by David13
The electoral college is provided for in the Constitution.
The states cannot amend the Constitution by passing a law.
Those laws could and should be declared null and void by the Supreme Court after about 2 minutes deliberation.
dc
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 4:03 pm
by JK4Woods
ori wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 8:59 am
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/03/16/poli ... index.html
"(CNN)Colorado could be part of voting history next general election day, joining 11 other states looking to ensure that their electoral college votes echo the will of the American majority to elect the next president.
Gov. Jared Polis signed a law Friday that would allot the state's electoral college votes to whichever candidate won the national popular vote. The Washington Post previously reported the law's signing.
The trend comes as Americans have shown greater support in recent years for a more democratic presidential election process, without the translational risks of the electoral college. But the daunting requirement of changing the Constitution, where the electoral college is formally codified, has posed a challenge to both public and political support for the issue.
The state's legislation would only take effect if enough other states sign on to secure the cumulative 270 electors needed to elect a president, and Colorado's votes raise the current total to 181 electors. Most states have winner-take-all laws in place dictating that their electors go towards whichever candidate takes the state's popular majority, while Maine and Nebraska opt to proportionally split their electors based on the vote.
The eleven other states that have signed on -- California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Vermont and Washington state -- as well as the District of Columbia and now Colorado, make up the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact. New Mexico, which has five electoral votes, sent a bill to the governor's desk to elect the president by popular vote and may soon join the group as well.
And the electoral college had been contentious not long ago. In 2016, President Donald Trump won the presidential vote with 306 electoral votes to Hillary Clinton's 232 votes. But Clinton won the popular vote, garnering 48.5% of the vote to Trump's 46.4%."
Why on earth would the voters of Colorado give up their right to determination by casting all their electoral votes for the
national candidate who is most popular.... if they do anything, it should only be for the national candidate who has become most popular in their own state.
Of course it cuts both ways.... It's be hilarious if/when Trump is leading the popular vote in the next general election and Colorado (bastions of liberal non-sense that they are) had to cast all their electoral votes for him.... That's be great..!!
Of course, they'd renege and not do that... only if a Dem in leading the popular vote will they allow this to happen...
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 4:29 pm
by gkearney
David13 wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 3:55 pm
The electoral college is provided for in the Constitution.
The states cannot amend the Constitution by passing a law.
Those laws could and should be declared null and void by the Supreme Court after about 2 minutes deliberation.
dc
I don’t know about this Colorado proposal but how states proportion their electors is not prescribed by the constitution as systems such as those employed in Maine and Nebraska are permitted.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 4:43 pm
by Serragon
gkearney wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 4:29 pm
David13 wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 3:55 pm
The electoral college is provided for in the Constitution.
The states cannot amend the Constitution by passing a law.
Those laws could and should be declared null and void by the Supreme Court after about 2 minutes deliberation.
dc
I don’t know about this Colorado proposal but how states proportion their electors is not prescribed by the constitution as systems such as those employed in Maine and Nebraska are permitted.
This is clearly unconstitutional as it is essentially the state changing people's votes. It is an attempt to eliminate the republic and create a democracy.
For Maine and Nebraska, votes are not being changed. The electors are simply being apportioned at a smaller political district than the state.
In this case, the actual vote of the people is possibly being changed. I don't see how this could stand under any sort of legal inspection as it clearly violates the civil rights of the voters in that state.
In addition, it makes your electoral votes dependent upon election officials and laws you have no say or control over. For example, the current proposal to allow felons currently in prison to vote. Colorado's electoral votes could be determined by another state allowing this practice when Colorado state law says it is illegal.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 5:47 pm
by gkearney
Serragon wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 4:43 pm
gkearney wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 4:29 pm
David13 wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 3:55 pm
The electoral college is provided for in the Constitution.
The states cannot amend the Constitution by passing a law.
Those laws could and should be declared null and void by the Supreme Court after about 2 minutes deliberation.
dc
I don’t know about this Colorado proposal but how states proportion their electors is not prescribed by the constitution as systems such as those employed in Maine and Nebraska are permitted.
This is clearly unconstitutional as it is essentially the state changing people's votes. It is an attempt to eliminate the republic and create a democracy.
For Maine and Nebraska, votes are not being changed. The electors are simply being apportioned at a smaller political district than the state.
In this case, the actual vote of the people is possibly being changed. I don't see how this could stand under any sort of legal inspection as it clearly violates the civil rights of the voters in that state.
In addition, it makes your electoral votes dependent upon election officials and laws you have no say or control over. For example, the current proposal to allow felons currently in prison to vote. Colorado's electoral votes could be determined by another state allowing this practice when Colorado state law says it is illegal.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 6:56 pm
by dezNatDefender
Serragon wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 4:43 pm
gkearney wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 4:29 pm
David13 wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 3:55 pm
The electoral college is provided for in the Constitution.
The states cannot amend the Constitution by passing a law.
Those laws could and should be declared null and void by the Supreme Court after about 2 minutes deliberation.
dc
I don’t know about this Colorado proposal but how states proportion their electors is not prescribed by the constitution as systems such as those employed in Maine and Nebraska are permitted.
This is clearly unconstitutional as it is essentially the state changing people's votes. It is an attempt to eliminate the republic and create a democracy.
Not really, the only thing unconstitutional about it is the compact nature of the bill.
Article 1 Section 10:
"No State shall, without the Consent of Congress... enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State."
Why they are doing it this way, I'm not sure-but making it contingent upon other states (or a majority of the electoral college states) agreeing to the same compact is clearly unconstitutional.
However, nothing in the Constitution prevents a state from saying we are awarding our electors based upon the national popular vote.
Re: New Colorado law will give state's electoral college votes to national popular vote winner
Posted: May 13th, 2019, 10:55 pm
by Arandur
dezNatDefender wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 6:56 pm
Serragon wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 4:43 pm
gkearney wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 4:29 pm
David13 wrote: ↑May 13th, 2019, 3:55 pm
The electoral college is provided for in the Constitution.
The states cannot amend the Constitution by passing a law.
Those laws could and should be declared null and void by the Supreme Court after about 2 minutes deliberation.
dc
I don’t know about this Colorado proposal but how states proportion their electors is not prescribed by the constitution as systems such as those employed in Maine and Nebraska are permitted.
This is clearly unconstitutional as it is essentially the state changing people's votes. It is an attempt to eliminate the republic and create a democracy.
Not really, the only thing unconstitutional about it is the compact nature of the bill.
Article 1 Section 10:
"No State shall, without the Consent of Congress... enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State."
Why they are doing it this way, I'm not sure-but making it contingent upon other states (or a majority of the electoral college states) agreeing to the same compact is clearly unconstitutional.
However, nothing in the Constitution prevents a state from saying we are awarding our electors based upon the national popular vote.
Ooh, that’s a no-no. I hadn’t noticed that they had this as a condition.