LDS Freedom Forum

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 4:05 pm This info was supposedly gleaned from an exmormon (so could be biased that way) talking to a friend who works in the Church Office Building. Anyway I found it interesting. Enjoy:

"1.I hadn’t heard that Mormon Channel has to change their name. It’s not to the lengthy full name. The Mormon Channel and the Mormon Messages are the single largest outreach to non-members and those wanting to know more. The outlet would get close to 50mill hits a month. Thanks to Rusty’s name change, the very large dept has been all but let go and the web traffic has shriveled. That bee in his bonnet apparently more important than new members

2.Probably not a huge surprise that money is the motivating factor between a ton of what they do. The killing of pageants and the emphasis on tithing is a greedy call for more. They are giving less and less to the wards and going after things like Girls Camps, They want spending at a super low level (don’t get me going on temple building). Despite being among the wealthiest religions on the Earth, the men at the top are concerned because the church is going to grow so rapidly that they need resources to keep it up. Ah huh.

3.Rusty has predicted internally that the second coming is 18-20 years away. One of those 2a revelations? Considering the very angels of heaven “do not know the day of his return”, that is pretty amazing. This led to his Sunday GC talk.

4.Stakes and wards are being shut down quite often. They are losing members rapidly and yet announcing temples like crazy. Most of them will never be built.

5.That 4million guess of active members is pretty close if you include children and count some people a couple times. As for full tithe payers and temple recommend holders: think less. He thought the shorter session might help.

6.Since my biscuit about the church at the moment is child abuse, I specifically asked. They are not going to budge. They are doubling down efforts and part of their desire for more money is to silent victims. They plan to fight to win. And are promising quick excommunications to get rid of the waste. Great attitude toward victims and their advocates, don’t you think? Victims cost them money. Instead of preventing victims; shut them up, pay them pennies on the dollar, make them silent with non-disclosures. And discredit them. Again - victims?

7.This was just fun to hear. Guess Bednar is pretty much a pompous donkey. But even he has had to admit things are not in a good place. Uchtdorf is the most socially liberal and willing to press for change. I guess he’s pushed the brethren to pray about some decisions and it’s usually 13/14 against 1or 2. This would be why he was banished."

Aprhys wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:17 am If my ward attendance is any judge then I might agree with this "insiders" concerns. I use what I call the "partition gauge." We used to always have to open the partition and set up chairs. 12 years ago we often had to go into the gym. Today? Plenty of seating for everyone. The partition is only now opened for farewells/homecomings.

tdj wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 5:13 pm

Aprhys wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:17 am If my ward attendance is any judge then I might agree with this "insiders" concerns. I use what I call the "partition gauge." We used to always have to open the partition and set up chairs. 12 years ago we often had to go into the gym. Today? Plenty of seating for everyone. The partition is only now opened for farewells/homecomings.

Interesting, because my stake is growing by leaps and bounds. We're constantly having to readjust our ward boundary's and at one point a few years ago, had to make an entirely new ward, and it STILL was filled up.

LukeAir2008 wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 6:35 pm I don’t know who this supposed ‘insider’ is but I do know that it was General Authority and Church Historian Elder Marlin K Jensen who in 2012 let slip that the Church was going through the biggest period of apostasy since Kirtland and it was attributed to the ability to be able to Google search mormonism etc.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-morm ... CM20120131

endlessismyname wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 8:47 pm

LukeAir2008 wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 6:35 pm I don’t know who this supposed ‘insider’ is but I do know that it was General Authority and Church Historian Elder Marlin K Jensen who in 2012 let slip that the Church was going through the biggest period of apostasy since Kirtland and it was attributed to the ability to be able to Google search mormonism etc.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-morm ... CM20120131

And what happened after that period of apostasy? Explosive growth. Sometimes when the tree prunes itself, it leaves room for strong growth.

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 9:06 pm There has been no explosive growth, either before or after 2012. In fact, the percentage of increase has dropped every year except one since 2012, with 2018 at just over 1%. Here is a chart. If you can point out anything I may have missed, that you would define as explosive, let me know, please.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chu ... ip_numbers

endlessismyname wrote: ↑April 21st, 2019, 7:14 am

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 9:06 pm There has been no explosive growth, either before or after 2012. In fact, the percentage of increase has dropped every year except one since 2012, with 2018 at just over 1%. Here is a chart. If you can point out anything I may have missed, that you would define as explosive, let me know, please.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chu ... ip_numbers

There were many years of apostasy during the Kirtland years. Perhaps we're seeing many years of apostasy right now. My overall point is that people tend to mistake a trend for a destiny. And as others have pointed out, the church is still growing as we speak.

Last year's "growth" was 1.2%. That includes babies born to current members. It's easy to see that members are having fewer children, and fewer people are converting. It would be my guess that the members in Africa make up a good part of this one percent increase, as they are still having children, and missionary work is progressing there, as evidenced by 4 temples.

Fiannan wrote: ↑April 21st, 2019, 7:57 am

Last year's "growth" was 1.2%. That includes babies born to current members. It's easy to see that members are having fewer children, and fewer people are converting. It would be my guess that the members in Africa make up a good part of this one percent increase, as they are still having children, and missionary work is progressing there, as evidenced by 4 temples.

The activity rates are really small in Africa and if a family converts with 12 kids, and in ten years only one or two kids remains a member, that is not so good.

endlessismyname wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:57 pm

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 4:05 pm This info was supposedly gleaned from an exmormon (so could be biased that way) talking to a friend who works in the Church Office Building. Anyway I found it interesting. Enjoy:

"1.I hadn’t heard that Mormon Channel has to change their name. It’s not to the lengthy full name. The Mormon Channel and the Mormon Messages are the single largest outreach to non-members and those wanting to know more. The outlet would get close to 50mill hits a month. Thanks to Rusty’s name change, the very large dept has been all but let go and the web traffic has shriveled. That bee in his bonnet apparently more important than new members

2.Probably not a huge surprise that money is the motivating factor between a ton of what they do. The killing of pageants and the emphasis on tithing is a greedy call for more. They are giving less and less to the wards and going after things like Girls Camps, They want spending at a super low level (don’t get me going on temple building). Despite being among the wealthiest religions on the Earth, the men at the top are concerned because the church is going to grow so rapidly that they need resources to keep it up. Ah huh.

3.Rusty has predicted internally that the second coming is 18-20 years away. One of those 2a revelations? Considering the very angels of heaven “do not know the day of his return”, that is pretty amazing. This led to his Sunday GC talk.

4.Stakes and wards are being shut down quite often. They are losing members rapidly and yet announcing temples like crazy. Most of them will never be built.

5.That 4million guess of active members is pretty close if you include children and count some people a couple times. As for full tithe payers and temple recommend holders: think less. He thought the shorter session might help.

6.Since my biscuit about the church at the moment is child abuse, I specifically asked. They are not going to budge. They are doubling down efforts and part of their desire for more money is to silent victims. They plan to fight to win. And are promising quick excommunications to get rid of the waste. Great attitude toward victims and their advocates, don’t you think? Victims cost them money. Instead of preventing victims; shut them up, pay them pennies on the dollar, make them silent with non-disclosures. And discredit them. Again - victims?

7.This was just fun to hear. Guess Bednar is pretty much a pompous donkey. But even he has had to admit things are not in a good place. Uchtdorf is the most socially liberal and willing to press for change. I guess he’s pushed the brethren to pray about some decisions and it’s usually 13/14 against 1or 2. This would be why he was banished."

Does the AMD in your username stand for anti- Mormon drivel? Because that's what this is. Who in the church office building would have access to all this information. No one, that's who.

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 21st, 2019, 7:33 pm

endlessismyname wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:57 pm

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 4:05 pm This info was supposedly gleaned from an exmormon (so could be biased that way) talking to a friend who works in the Church Office Building. Anyway I found it interesting. Enjoy:

"1.I hadn’t heard that Mormon Channel has to change their name. It’s not to the lengthy full name. The Mormon Channel and the Mormon Messages are the single largest outreach to non-members and those wanting to know more. The outlet would get close to 50mill hits a month. Thanks to Rusty’s name change, the very large dept has been all but let go and the web traffic has shriveled. That bee in his bonnet apparently more important than new members

2.Probably not a huge surprise that money is the motivating factor between a ton of what they do. The killing of pageants and the emphasis on tithing is a greedy call for more. They are giving less and less to the wards and going after things like Girls Camps, They want spending at a super low level (don’t get me going on temple building). Despite being among the wealthiest religions on the Earth, the men at the top are concerned because the church is going to grow so rapidly that they need resources to keep it up. Ah huh.

3.Rusty has predicted internally that the second coming is 18-20 years away. One of those 2a revelations? Considering the very angels of heaven “do not know the day of his return”, that is pretty amazing. This led to his Sunday GC talk.

4.Stakes and wards are being shut down quite often. They are losing members rapidly and yet announcing temples like crazy. Most of them will never be built.

5.That 4million guess of active members is pretty close if you include children and count some people a couple times. As for full tithe payers and temple recommend holders: think less. He thought the shorter session might help.

6.Since my biscuit about the church at the moment is child abuse, I specifically asked. They are not going to budge. They are doubling down efforts and part of their desire for more money is to silent victims. They plan to fight to win. And are promising quick excommunications to get rid of the waste. Great attitude toward victims and their advocates, don’t you think? Victims cost them money. Instead of preventing victims; shut them up, pay them pennies on the dollar, make them silent with non-disclosures. And discredit them. Again - victims?

7.This was just fun to hear. Guess Bednar is pretty much a pompous donkey. But even he has had to admit things are not in a good place. Uchtdorf is the most socially liberal and willing to press for change. I guess he’s pushed the brethren to pray about some decisions and it’s usually 13/14 against 1or 2. This would be why he was banished."

Does the AMD in your username stand for anti- Mormon drivel? Because that's what this is. Who in the church office building would have access to all this information. No one, that's who.

In my original post I pointed out it would have a bias based on who was supposedly receiving this info. Instead of actually discussing the actual points of the post I do find it interesting that almost everyone has focused on the bias instead. Interesting indeed.

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 4:05 pm In my original post I pointed out it would have a bias based on who was supposedly receiving this info. Instead of actually discussing the actual points of the post I do find it interesting that almost everyone has focused on the bias instead. Interesting indeed.

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 21st, 2019, 7:33 pm

endlessismyname wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:57 pm

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 4:05 pm This info was supposedly gleaned from an exmormon (so could be biased that way) talking to a friend who works in the Church Office Building. Anyway I found it interesting. Enjoy:

"1.I hadn’t heard that Mormon Channel has to change their name. It’s not to the lengthy full name. The Mormon Channel and the Mormon Messages are the single largest outreach to non-members and those wanting to know more. The outlet would get close to 50mill hits a month. Thanks to Rusty’s name change, the very large dept has been all but let go and the web traffic has shriveled. That bee in his bonnet apparently more important than new members

2.Probably not a huge surprise that money is the motivating factor between a ton of what they do. The killing of pageants and the emphasis on tithing is a greedy call for more. They are giving less and less to the wards and going after things like Girls Camps, They want spending at a super low level (don’t get me going on temple building). Despite being among the wealthiest religions on the Earth, the men at the top are concerned because the church is going to grow so rapidly that they need resources to keep it up. Ah huh.

3.Rusty has predicted internally that the second coming is 18-20 years away. One of those 2a revelations? Considering the very angels of heaven “do not know the day of his return”, that is pretty amazing. This led to his Sunday GC talk.

4.Stakes and wards are being shut down quite often. They are losing members rapidly and yet announcing temples like crazy. Most of them will never be built.

5.That 4million guess of active members is pretty close if you include children and count some people a couple times. As for full tithe payers and temple recommend holders: think less. He thought the shorter session might help.

6.Since my biscuit about the church at the moment is child abuse, I specifically asked. They are not going to budge. They are doubling down efforts and part of their desire for more money is to silent victims. They plan to fight to win. And are promising quick excommunications to get rid of the waste. Great attitude toward victims and their advocates, don’t you think? Victims cost them money. Instead of preventing victims; shut them up, pay them pennies on the dollar, make them silent with non-disclosures. And discredit them. Again - victims?

7.This was just fun to hear. Guess Bednar is pretty much a pompous donkey. But even he has had to admit things are not in a good place. Uchtdorf is the most socially liberal and willing to press for change. I guess he’s pushed the brethren to pray about some decisions and it’s usually 13/14 against 1or 2. This would be why he was banished."

Does the AMD in your username stand for anti- Mormon drivel? Because that's what this is. Who in the church office building would have access to all this information. No one, that's who.

In my original post I pointed out it would have a bias based on who was supposedly receiving this info. Instead of actually discussing the actual points of the post I do find it interesting that almost everyone has focused on the bias instead. Interesting indeed.

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 21st, 2019, 7:33 pm

endlessismyname wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:57 pm

LucianAMD wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 4:05 pm This info was supposedly gleaned from an exmormon (so could be biased that way) talking to a friend who works in the Church Office Building. Anyway I found it interesting. Enjoy:

"1.I hadn’t heard that Mormon Channel has to change their name. It’s not to the lengthy full name. The Mormon Channel and the Mormon Messages are the single largest outreach to non-members and those wanting to know more. The outlet would get close to 50mill hits a month. Thanks to Rusty’s name change, the very large dept has been all but let go and the web traffic has shriveled. That bee in his bonnet apparently more important than new members

2.Probably not a huge surprise that money is the motivating factor between a ton of what they do. The killing of pageants and the emphasis on tithing is a greedy call for more. They are giving less and less to the wards and going after things like Girls Camps, They want spending at a super low level (don’t get me going on temple building). Despite being among the wealthiest religions on the Earth, the men at the top are concerned because the church is going to grow so rapidly that they need resources to keep it up. Ah huh.

3.Rusty has predicted internally that the second coming is 18-20 years away. One of those 2a revelations? Considering the very angels of heaven “do not know the day of his return”, that is pretty amazing. This led to his Sunday GC talk.

4.Stakes and wards are being shut down quite often. They are losing members rapidly and yet announcing temples like crazy. Most of them will never be built.

5.That 4million guess of active members is pretty close if you include children and count some people a couple times. As for full tithe payers and temple recommend holders: think less. He thought the shorter session might help.

6.Since my biscuit about the church at the moment is child abuse, I specifically asked. They are not going to budge. They are doubling down efforts and part of their desire for more money is to silent victims. They plan to fight to win. And are promising quick excommunications to get rid of the waste. Great attitude toward victims and their advocates, don’t you think? Victims cost them money. Instead of preventing victims; shut them up, pay them pennies on the dollar, make them silent with non-disclosures. And discredit them. Again - victims?

7.This was just fun to hear. Guess Bednar is pretty much a pompous donkey. But even he has had to admit things are not in a good place. Uchtdorf is the most socially liberal and willing to press for change. I guess he’s pushed the brethren to pray about some decisions and it’s usually 13/14 against 1or 2. This would be why he was banished."

Does the AMD in your username stand for anti- Mormon drivel? Because that's what this is. Who in the church office building would have access to all this information. No one, that's who.

In my original post I pointed out it would have a bias based on who was supposedly receiving this info. Instead of actually discussing the actual points of the post I do find it interesting that almost everyone has focused on the bias instead. Interesting indeed.