LDS Freedom Forum

https://www.infowars.com/survey-finds-t ... al-topics/

Excerpts:

Have you ever wondered why most church services in America seem to be filled with lots of fluff and very little substance?
As America’s moral foundations literally collapse right in front of our eyes, a large percentage of our pastors are afraid to speak out about controversial topics because they might offend someone. And it doesn’t take a genius to figure out why they are so afraid. Most U.S. churches are shrinking, and more than 100 die every week. In a day and age where pastors are judged by attendance numbers and budget levels, scaring people away is bad for business.
With all that in mind, the results from a recent Barna survey shouldn’t be surprising at all…

We wanted to know if pastors felt limited or pressured when it comes to speaking about controversial topics. Half of Christian pastors says they frequently (11%) or occasionally (39%) feel limited in their ability to speak out on moral and social issues because people will take offense. The other half of pastors say they only rarely (30%) or never (20%) feel limited in this way. When asked to identify the source of the concerns, pastors are much more likely to say that they feel limited by those inside the church than those outside. In other words, the reactions of those in the pews are most on the minds of today’s pastors.

Of course not all is lost. There are some pastors out there that are doing a fantastic job, and all over the world God is raising up a Remnant. But overall, the institutional church in America is failing to influence the culture because pastors are deathly afraid of scaring their customers away.
All that it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.
And right now a whole lot of good men are doing precisely that.

2 Responses to my efforts to promote freedom in Church activities:

"That said, in terms of my recent calling (Area 70), my focus on what to teach stake presidents and others in leadership centers on prophetic priorities that are taught to me by members of the 1st Presidency, Quorum of the 12 and Presidency of the Seventy. In my opinion, it would be inappropriate for me to disregard the training I receive from the Brethren and launch off into other areas not addressed by file leaders in training I attend--even if I feel passionately about the topic. If it is not a focus of the Brethren it is not my focus."

"Confirming our telephone conversation I think the Church is cautious about openly participating in freedom promotion activities partly because of concern about government retribution that might unduly hinder its primary religious mission and partly because so many members have been indoctrinated to favor federal dominance and federal welfare and regulation that there is concern that a strong constitutional position might split the Church."

lundbaek wrote: ↑April 12th, 2019, 8:50 pm 2 Responses to my efforts to promote freedom in Church activities:

"That said, in terms of my recent calling (Area 70), my focus on what to teach stake presidents and others in leadership centers on prophetic priorities that are taught to me by members of the 1st Presidency, Quorum of the 12 and Presidency of the Seventy. In my opinion, it would be inappropriate for me to disregard the training I receive from the Brethren and launch off into other areas not addressed by file leaders in training I attend--even if I feel passionately about the topic. If it is not a focus of the Brethren it is not my focus."

"Confirming our telephone conversation I think the Church is cautious about openly participating in freedom promotion activities partly because of concern about government retribution that might unduly hinder its primary religious mission and partly because so many members have been indoctrinated to favor federal dominance and federal welfare and regulation that there is concern that a strong constitutional position might split the Church."

I would also say that some of the G.A.'s are now farther left in their personal beliefs, and will not defend the original constitution as it is written, and the intent behind it. I never hear that immigration laws should be obeyed. Instead they trot out a G.A. to express compassion on this issue, but will not say anything negative about breaking the laws. Also, I have posted about one of the Apostles, who as I have said, should re read the second amendment, 'cause his comments on guns and militias which he made at B.Y.U. conflict with it to a fairly large degree.

Compare sermons given by our leaders in the 1970s and 1980s and today. Compare articles from the Ensign then and today.

It is like the difference between graduate school and kindergarten.

Fiannan wrote: ↑April 13th, 2019, 4:14 am Compare sermons given by our leaders in the 1970s and 1980s and today. Compare articles from the Ensign then and today.

It is like the difference between graduate school and kindergarten.

Better yet, compare sermons givin in the beginnings of the church and throught the 1800's and it is another world compared to our church today...

I believe this is one of the reasons why the church shifted to home centered teaching. There are aspects of the gospel that our children can no longer be taught in church including the proclamation on the family.

My children have been taught false doctrine at church including being told that it doesn't matter what degree of glory you end up in because everyone is going to be happy regardless of where they end up.

markharr wrote: ↑April 13th, 2019, 8:15 am I believe this is one of the reasons why the church shifted to home centered teaching. There are aspects of the gospel that our children can no longer be taught in church including the proclamation on the family.

My children have been taught false doctrine at church including being told that it doesn't matter what degree of glory you end up in because everyone is going to be happy regardless of where they end up.

If anyone has an interest in going to the celestial world, they must:

Mosiah 18:9
9 Yea, and are willing to mourn with those that mourn; yea, and comfort those that stand in need of comfort, and to stand as witnesses of God at all times and in all things, and in all places that ye may be in, even until death, that ye may be redeemed of God, and be numbered with those of the first resurrection, that ye may have eternal life—

How many good church goers stand as a witness for Christ at all times and in all things, and in all places that they may be in, even until death? How many are afraid to open their mouth because of fear of offending someone?

How many actually believe what is required of them in order to receive eternal life? How many understand what D&C 76 50-70 says to the point of internalizing and living it?

If we are ashamed to open our mouth for Christ, why should he not be ashamed of us before his Father? Being Celestial material requires much.

I wonder if more members were willing to stand up for what is right, were more committed to the gospel, and were more aware of what is really going on, would we hear more counsel, encouragement, or condemnation from our leaders. I think so many have tuned out the teachings they don't want to hear that our Heavenly Father is being kind in not giving them counsel that will further condemn them when they don't hearken to it.

And I think a lot of it goes to members being indoctrinated so much by the government schools they believe as Gideon and the people of King Limhi:

22 And now let us pacify the king, and we fulfil the oath which we have made unto him; for it is better that we should be in bondage than that we should lose our lives; therefore, let us put a stop to the shedding of so much blood.

Such an approach to life doesn't require much thought or change. On the other hand, recognizing that we are responsible for our government, for our position on agency, for being self-reliant and able to sustain our families, for teaching our children true doctrine, etc., requires a whole lot of effort every day.

The vast majority of church members are not willing to make those efforts. At least that's what I see in my area.

I do what I can. I teach emergency preparedness/food storage and have a program insert each month for my ward. I have another get-together with preparedness-minded sisters once or twice a month where we teach each other skills. I have my blog that I write six days per week. I learn from all the research I do. I write it mainly for my children, but also out there for anyone else who wants to learn. I provide links to other resources in food and medicine (there are links to recipe booklets the church and individual stakes produced for using food storage, and there is a fabulous off-grid medicine book that's free).

There isn't a lot of interest. Learning takes effort. And as long as people believe that the government or the church will take care of them in a crisis, they aren't going to learn.

PrepSchoolDaily.blogspot.com

Who do you think would be invited to give a speech at BYU, Brigham Young or Harry Reid? Or better yet, Ezra Taft Benson or Mitt Romney?

A good example of a pastor who says it as it is is Pastor Steven Anderson of Faithful Word Baptist Church, Tempe, Arizona.

He's not very complimentary about Mormons, but that aside, he is not afraid to say what needs to be said irrespective of the offence it may cause.
I like him, and we could do with his type in our own ranks.

Robin Hood wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 8:33 am A good example of a pastor who says it as it is is Pastor Steven Anderson of Faithful Word Baptist Church, Tempe, Arizona.

He's not very complimentary about Mormons, but that aside, he is not afraid to say what needs to be said irrespective of the offence it may cause.
I like him, and we could do with his type in our own ranks.

Oh ya this guy let's it fly... I like the fellow... has nine kids besides ... puts us to shame

What does Pastor Steven Anderson have to say that is uncomplimentary about Latter-day Saints ?

Robin Hood wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 8:33 am A good example of a pastor who says it as it is is Pastor Steven Anderson of Faithful Word Baptist Church, Tempe, Arizona.

He's not very complimentary about Mormons, but that aside, he is not afraid to say what needs to be said irrespective of the offence it may cause.
I like him, and we could do with his type in our own ranks.

Apparently he has some major flaws, but yes, he does speak. One of the things he has said is that he is (perhaps now) barred from entering Great Britain.

And that could be based on statements he made there previously.
dc

David13 wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 12:15 pm

Robin Hood wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 8:33 am A good example of a pastor who says it as it is is Pastor Steven Anderson of Faithful Word Baptist Church, Tempe, Arizona.

He's not very complimentary about Mormons, but that aside, he is not afraid to say what needs to be said irrespective of the offence it may cause.
I like him, and we could do with his type in our own ranks.

Apparently he has some major flaws, but yes, he does speak. One of the things he has said is that he is (perhaps now) barred from entering Great Britain.

And that could be based on statements he made there previously.
dc

He's been banned from a number of countries including Canada, UK, other Europeans countries, and some African ones. He has also been beaten up by US border patrol.

Someone facing that kind of opposition usually speaks a great deal of truth.

Robin Hood wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 12:42 pm

David13 wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 12:15 pm

Robin Hood wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 8:33 am A good example of a pastor who says it as it is is Pastor Steven Anderson of Faithful Word Baptist Church, Tempe, Arizona.

He's not very complimentary about Mormons, but that aside, he is not afraid to say what needs to be said irrespective of the offence it may cause.
I like him, and we could do with his type in our own ranks.

Apparently he has some major flaws, but yes, he does speak. One of the things he has said is that he is (perhaps now) barred from entering Great Britain.

And that could be based on statements he made there previously.
dc

He's been banned from a number of countries including Canada, UK, other Europeans countries, and some African ones. He has also been beaten up by US border patrol.

Someone facing that kind of opposition usually speaks a great deal of truth.

In the 'documentary' I saw about him he says himself that homos should kill themselves. No, they should repent. They can and should repent and sin no more.

He says that since he is 'saved' he can never lose that salvation. We don't believe that. We don't believe that once you obtain salvation, you can sin all you want, and it doesn't matter.

I didn't watch the whole video. But I don't agree it's all truth.
dc

simpleton wrote: ↑April 13th, 2019, 7:07 am

Fiannan wrote: ↑April 13th, 2019, 4:14 am Compare sermons given by our leaders in the 1970s and 1980s and today. Compare articles from the Ensign then and today.

It is like the difference between graduate school and kindergarten.

Better yet, compare sermons givin in the beginnings of the church and throught the 1800's and it is another world compared to our church today...

Seems to me someone is successfully deceiving the great many of the church even the leaders.

D&C 52:14 And again, I will give unto you a pattern in all things, that ye may not be deceived; for Satan is abroad in the land, and he goeth forth deceiving the nations—

It feels like we as a church are trying to placate (for lack of a better term) Babyon until the savior returns and sets things right. I dont think the savior wants us to placate Babylon. I think he wants us to do everything we can to fight it and if we have sufficient faith while doing what we can, he will take care of the rest on his return. I don't even believe that it is possible to placate Babylon unless you are willing to just surrender and give it 100% control over every aspect of your life.

Unfortunately a lot of church members seem to think that every paid minister is intentionally working wickedness. Many are very good people who are trying to serve God as best they know how. And, as observed, even within the LDS church there is a lot of reluctance to say things that might offend someone. In the last general conference there were many references to the Proclamation on the Family, marriage between a man and woman, and children being entitled to a mother and father. It seems that the leaders came as close as they could to saying gay "marriage" is wrong as they could without explicitly stating it, leaving me to wonder why they were not explicit.

My conclusion is that a lot of church members would take extreme offense at being told what really is right. And I really wish they would be explicit at the potential expense of losing people who have been seduced by worldly wickedness.

brianj wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 10:11 pm Unfortunately a lot of church members seem to think that every paid minister is intentionally working wickedness. Many are very good people who are trying to serve God as best they know how. And, as observed, even within the LDS church there is a lot of reluctance to say things that might offend someone. In the last general conference there were many references to the Proclamation on the Family, marriage between a man and woman, and children being entitled to a mother and father. It seems that the leaders came as close as they could to saying gay "marriage" is wrong as they could without explicitly stating it, leaving me to wonder why they were not explicit.

My conclusion is that a lot of church members would take extreme offense at being told what really is right. And I really wish they would be explicit at the potential expense of losing people who have been seduced by worldly wickedness.

Also keeping in mind we are no longer an American church but a world wide one. In many countries the church would be have extreme legal problems and potentially lose its ability to operate if they stated gay marriage is wicked. That's now hate speech in Canada.

markharr wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 9:41 pm It feels like we as a church are trying to placate (for lack of a better term) Babyon until the savior returns and sets things right. I dont think the savior wants us to placate Babylon. I think he wants us to do everything we can to fight it and if we have sufficient faith while doing what we can, he will take care of the rest on his return. I don't even believe that it is possible to placate Babylon unless you are willing to just surrender and give it 100% control over every aspect of your life.

Actually according to the scriptures, He wants us to actually get out of Babylon period. Physically get out. Not fight it.

simpleton wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 10:42 pm

markharr wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 9:41 pm It feels like we as a church are trying to placate (for lack of a better term) Babyon until the savior returns and sets things right. I dont think the savior wants us to placate Babylon. I think he wants us to do everything we can to fight it and if we have sufficient faith while doing what we can, he will take care of the rest on his return. I don't even believe that it is possible to placate Babylon unless you are willing to just surrender and give it 100% control over every aspect of your life.

Actually according to the scriptures, He wants us to actually get out of Babylon period. Physically get out. Not fight it.

How do you do that when it feels like spiritual Babylon encompasses the entire earth including a large portion of this church. Where is the refuge?

markharr wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 10:50 pm

simpleton wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 10:42 pm

markharr wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 9:41 pm It feels like we as a church are trying to placate (for lack of a better term) Babyon until the savior returns and sets things right. I dont think the savior wants us to placate Babylon. I think he wants us to do everything we can to fight it and if we have sufficient faith while doing what we can, he will take care of the rest on his return. I don't even believe that it is possible to placate Babylon unless you are willing to just surrender and give it 100% control over every aspect of your life.

Actually according to the scriptures, He wants us to actually get out of Babylon period. Physically get out. Not fight it.

How do you do that when it feels like spiritual Babylon encompasses the entire earth including a large portion of this church. Where is the refuge?

Isaiah 33:
14The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?

15He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;



"Take away the Book of Mormon and the revelations, and where is our religion? We have none; for without Zion, and a place of deliverance, we must fall; because the time is near when the sun will be darkened, and the moon turn to blood, and the stars fall from the heaven, and the earth reel to and fro. Then, if this is the case, and if we are not sanctified and gathered to the places God has appointed, with all our former professions and our great love for the Bible, we must fall; we cannot stand; we cannot be saved; for God will gather out his saints from the Gentiles, and then comes desolation and destruction, and none can escape except the pure in heart who are gathered."


"He [President Brigham Young] conversed freely on the situation of the Saints in the mountains, and said that he dreaded the time when the Saints would become popular with the world; for he had seen in sorrow, in a dream, or in dreams, this people clothed in the fashions of Babylon and drinking in the spirit of Babylon until one could hardly tell a Saint from a black-leg. And he felt like shouting, "To your tents, Oh Israel!" because it was the only thing that could keep the people pure."



"In every dispensation of the gospel, the Lord has insisted on segregating his covenant people from the rest of the world: if they were not ready to "come out of her, [O] my people" (Revelation 18:4 - And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues) willingly, he saw to it that the world was more than willing to persecute and expel them. Two ways were placed before Adam, to see which one he would follow. Cain followed the one; Abel, and after him, Seth, the other. But soon Seth's posterity drifted over to the camp of Cain. Things being very bad, Enoch, the super-missionary, was sent out and was able "in [the] process of time" (Moses 7:21) to draw many after him into his city of Zion, which was then totally segregated from the rest of the world, pending the world's destruction. After the Flood, things went bad again, so that the call to Abraham was lech lecha - get out of here! And he kept moving all his days, forming his own society as he went, initiating all his followers into a special covenant with God. The law of Moses insists before all else that the Chosen People preserve their aloofness from the world by constant purification and instruction: the people must be qadosh, "sanctified," both words having the basic meaning of "cut off," "separated." God has always given his people the same choice of either living up to the covenants made with him or being in Satan's power; there is no middle ground (Moses 4:4). True, we spend this time of probation in a no-man's land between the two camps of salvation and damnation, but at every moment of the day and night we must be moving toward the one or the other. Progressive testing takes place along the way in either direction; the same tests in every dispensation and generation mark the progress of the people of God"
--Hugh Nibley, Approaching Zion....


We are right now, eating and drinking in the spirit of Babylon. But not only that, we are also partaking of the spirit of Sodom and Gomorrah. We are literally doing what Brigham Young foresaw in his dream. You cannot tell a latter day saint from any other typical gentile, infact we go out of our way to fit into the fashions of Babylon. So as he also said " to your tents oh Isreal", maybe thats what we should literally do, go and completely abandon this society and live in tents amongst the Indians. Pick some tribe out in the sticks that has not been infiltrated by the white man, Mexico or south America....

But hey, I like the "good life" of all the conveniences of this modern society so I dont see me going anywhere. But no question, we are not in Zion at all.

simpleton wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 11:36 pm We are right now, eating and drinking in the spirit of Babylon. But not only that, we are also partaking of the spirit of Sodom and Gomorrah. We are literally doing what Brigham Young foresaw in his dream. You cannot tell a latter day saint from any other typical gentile, infact we go out of our way to fit into the fashions of Babylon. So as he also said " to your tents oh Isreal", maybe thats what we should literally do, go and completely abandon this society and live in tents amongst the Indians. Pick some tribe out in the sticks that has not been infiltrated by the white man, Mexico or south America....

But hey, I like the "good life" of all the conveniences of this modern society so I dont see me going anywhere. But no question, we are not in Zion at all.

I hear lots of people saying this, and nobody leading the way.

David13 wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 3:21 pm

Robin Hood wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 12:42 pm

David13 wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 12:15 pm

Robin Hood wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 8:33 am A good example of a pastor who says it as it is is Pastor Steven Anderson of Faithful Word Baptist Church, Tempe, Arizona.

He's not very complimentary about Mormons, but that aside, he is not afraid to say what needs to be said irrespective of the offence it may cause.
I like him, and we could do with his type in our own ranks.

Apparently he has some major flaws, but yes, he does speak. One of the things he has said is that he is (perhaps now) barred from entering Great Britain.

And that could be based on statements he made there previously.
dc

He's been banned from a number of countries including Canada, UK, other Europeans countries, and some African ones. He has also been beaten up by US border patrol.

Someone facing that kind of opposition usually speaks a great deal of truth.

In the 'documentary' I saw about him he says himself that homos should kill themselves. No, they should repent. They can and should repent and sin no more.

He says that since he is 'saved' he can never lose that salvation. We don't believe that. We don't believe that once you obtain salvation, you can sin all you want, and it doesn't matter.

I didn't watch the whole video. But I don't agree it's all truth.
dc

Of course. His theology is going to be off in some regards because he is a Independent Fundamental Baptist.

With regards to homosexuals, he believes the Biblical teaching regarding reprobates. The NT clearly indicates that reprobates are unable, or perhaps more accurately, totally unwilling, to repent; and that they glory in their sin. It is this to which he is referring.
Under the OT homosexuals were put to death. This was because God wanted no filthiness in Israel. Pastor Anderson is referring to this in his suicide comment.

Robin Hood wrote: ↑April 15th, 2019, 7:10 am
Of course. His theology is going to be off in some regards because he is a Independent Fundamental Baptist.

With regards to homosexuals, he believes the Biblical teaching regarding reprobates. The NT clearly indicates that reprobates are unable, or perhaps more accurately, totally unwilling, to repent; and that they glory in their sin. It is this to which he is referring.
Under the OT homosexuals were put to death. This was because God wanted no filthiness in Israel. Pastor Anderson is referring to this in his suicide comment.

I watch religious videos from non LDS people sometimes. It's tempting because a lot of what they say is truth and they are more blunt in their condemnation of sin than most Latter Day Saint speakers.

I was watching this guy a lot until I saw a video where he called my religion a cult. Then I decided to pray for him that his eyes would be opened to the truth.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5EtLm ... dyrEotfENg