LDS Freedom Forum

lundbaek wrote: ↑April 18th, 2019, 3:08 pm Apparently the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints sees fit to accept the terms of the 501c3. I think it is important that those of us involved in the freedom battle understand why. I don't know why, although I have my personal opinion, in which I am confident mostly because of similar opinions of people who's opinions I take seriously. I urge others to consider why the Church goes along with the 501c3.

Sometimes an organization has to compromise in order to survive. We did it with polygamy and I am sure that before policies are sent forth, including in the Holy Handbook, both the reaction of the members, the public, and the powers-that-be are considered. We have no idea what threats are made to the Church by what many refer to as "the deep state."

JK4Woods wrote: ↑April 15th, 2019, 8:47 pm Heck.... I don’t know one Bishop who has the intestinal fortitude to preach hellfire and damnation even when they know it’s what the ward needs to hear.

.... probably because once it got back to the SP and Area 70, bye bye to that Bishop....
(Can’t rock the boat...)

My old Tongan Bishop did! And because of it, the ward was one of the best and closest wards I have been a part of.

Fiannan wrote: ↑April 14th, 2019, 8:27 am Who do you think would be invited to give a speech at BYU, Brigham Young or Harry Reid? Or better yet, Ezra Taft Benson or Mitt Romney?

Thats a pretty unfair competition there.

Want to hear a true preacher listen to a John Hagee sermon. It will motivate and encourage and teach you more in 1 sermon than months of sacrament meetings.

Even this Christian does better than us...

Often abortion is the evil solution to the consequences of a sexual sin. Whether a pregnancy results from fornication or adultery, where the mother is a guilty participant in the sin, or a pregnancy results from rape or incest, where the mother usually is the guiltless victim of another's sin, abortion is an ungodly solution. For the Sovereign Redeemer is able to bring about good where there was evil. A new creation resulting from a sexual sin is an extraordinary witness to this redemptive truth.

Sadly many Christians refuse to completely submit to the Lordship of the Creator and fail to appreciate the redemptive power of their God to save man from the full consequences of sin. The defective fetus is the victim of that original sin which resulted in the fall of all creation. A mother may be the victim of her own or another's sexual sin or the victim of corporate societal sin, e.g., unjust poverty. In all of these situations abortion has no redeeming character; for God never deals with sin or its consequences by countering it with sin but with righteousness. The unhealthy child should be loved and cared for more not less because of its weakness. The pregnant woman should be counseled to do what is right and given assistance in every possible way to support a godly decision to nurture in her body God's creation during its first nine months of life. Christians must always affirm, both by word and deed, the sovereignty of the Creator and recognize His power to righteously redeem mankind from the results of sin.....

http://www.biblearchaeology.org/post/20 ... ifice.aspx

lundbaek wrote: ↑April 18th, 2019, 3:08 pm Apparently the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints sees fit to accept the terms of the 501c3. I think it is important that those of us involved in the freedom battle understand why. I don't know why, although I have my personal opinion, in which I am confident mostly because of similar opinions of people who's opinions I take seriously. I urge others to consider why the Church goes along with the 501c3.

What I see is a real problem. The leaders of the church won't open their mouths and adamantly condemn sin with an unconstrained fashion and with boldness.

These verses demonstrate that the righteous are to open their mouths.

Psalm 56:11
11 In God have I put my trust: I will not be afraid what man can do unto me.

Doctrine and Covenants 122:9
9 Therefore, hold on thy way, and the priesthood shall remain with thee; for their bounds are set, they cannot pass. Thy days are known, and thy years shall not be numbered less; therefore, fear not what man can do, for God shall be with you forever and ever.

Doctrine and Covenants 30:11
11 And your whole labor shall be in Zion, with all your soul, from henceforth; yea, you shall ever open your mouth in my cause, not fearing what man can do, for I am with you. Amen.

Moroni 8:16
16 Wo be unto them that shall pervert the ways of the Lord after this manner, for they shall perish except they repent. Behold, I speak with boldness, having authority from God; and I fear not what man can do; for perfect love casteth out all fear.

Are church leaders demonstrating their fear of what man can do? Or did God instruct them to withhold wrath until later.

righteousrepublic wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 10:54 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 16th, 2019, 6:32 am I believe we are only a few years away from fully accepting gay-married couples as members in good standing. We will try to hold our ground on sealings, but........

Is this wishful thinking? Who told us that the Lord's church would condone this?

What's next, live, in the flesh gay sealings in our temples?

It's certainly not wishful thinking on my part. I abhor homosexuality, and I don't feel good about the coddling that's being given the youth in the church when they "come out." Who told us that the Lord's church would condone this.......prophecies in our scriptures. Abomination of desolation, Satan will take his seat in the temple, why have you polluted the Holy Church of God. The cleansing will begin in His house, because it will have become filthy. What is filthier than perverters of our God-given blessing of procreation?

I believe there have already been sealings in the temple involving LGBTQ couples. Just recently, a man intending to transition to a woman, and who is engaged to a woman who fully supports the he-to-she transition, were planning their temple marriage. The trans person is already dressing as a woman, but holding off on hormones until after the wedding. Bishop found out the plan, and put the kibosh on the whole thing. The engaged couple is devastated, according to them. I'm left SMH at why they wanted a temple marriage in the first place, when they are intending to present themselves as two women as soon as possible. Mind-boggling.

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:03 pm I believe there have already been sealings in the temple involving LGBTQ couples. Just recently, a man intending to transition to a woman, and who is engaged to a woman who fully supports the he-to-she transition, were planning their temple marriage. The trans person is already dressing as a woman, but holding off on hormones until after the wedding. Bishop found out the plan, and put the kibosh on the whole thing. The engaged couple is devastated, according to them. I'm left SMH at why they wanted a temple marriage in the first place, when they are intending to present themselves as two women as soon as possible. Mind-boggling.

Good on that bishop. It’s good there is still some resistance of evil in the church.

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:03 pm

righteousrepublic wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 10:54 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 16th, 2019, 6:32 am I believe we are only a few years away from fully accepting gay-married couples as members in good standing. We will try to hold our ground on sealings, but........

Is this wishful thinking? Who told us that the Lord's church would condone this?

What's next, live, in the flesh gay sealings in our temples?

It's certainly not wishful thinking on my part. I abhor homosexuality, and I don't feel good about the coddling that's being given the youth in the church when they "come out." Who told us that the Lord's church would condone this.......prophecies in our scriptures. Abomination of desolation, Satan will take his seat in the temple, why have you polluted the Holy Church of God. The cleansing will begin in His house, because it will have become filthy. What is filthier than perverters of our God-given blessing of procreation?

I believe there have already been sealings in the temple involving LGBTQ couples. Just recently, a man intending to transition to a woman, and who is engaged to a woman who fully supports the he-to-she transition, were planning their temple marriage. The trans person is already dressing as a woman, but holding off on hormones until after the wedding. Bishop found out the plan, and put the kibosh on the whole thing. The engaged couple is devastated, according to them. I'm left SMH at why they wanted a temple marriage in the first place, when they are intending to present themselves as two women as soon as possible. Mind-boggling.

Where is the scripture stating this (in red)? I have been looking for it but haven't found it yet. I feel that the church will go through a serious cleansing as well from the top down, or the bottom to the top depending how one looks at it. I'm not convinced the 501c3 position is enough of a deterrent to keep the leaders from condemning sin with boldness. Christ surely wouldn't use an excuse such as this to keep from telling it like it is with regard to sinners.

righteousrepublic wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 8:14 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 3:03 pm

righteousrepublic wrote: ↑April 19th, 2019, 10:54 pm

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 16th, 2019, 6:32 am I believe we are only a few years away from fully accepting gay-married couples as members in good standing. We will try to hold our ground on sealings, but........

Is this wishful thinking? Who told us that the Lord's church would condone this?

What's next, live, in the flesh gay sealings in our temples?

It's certainly not wishful thinking on my part. I abhor homosexuality, and I don't feel good about the coddling that's being given the youth in the church when they "come out." Who told us that the Lord's church would condone this.......prophecies in our scriptures. Abomination of desolation, Satan will take his seat in the temple, why have you polluted the Holy Church of God. The cleansing will begin in His house, because it will have become filthy. What is filthier than perverters of our God-given blessing of procreation?

I believe there have already been sealings in the temple involving LGBTQ couples. Just recently, a man intending to transition to a woman, and who is engaged to a woman who fully supports the he-to-she transition, were planning their temple marriage. The trans person is already dressing as a woman, but holding off on hormones until after the wedding. Bishop found out the plan, and put the kibosh on the whole thing. The engaged couple is devastated, according to them. I'm left SMH at why they wanted a temple marriage in the first place, when they are intending to present themselves as two women as soon as possible. Mind-boggling.

Where is the scripture stating this (in red)? I have been looking for it but haven't found it yet. I feel that the church will go through a serious cleansing as well from the top down, or the bottom to the top depending how one looks at it. I'm not convinced the 501c3 position is enough of a deterrent to keep the leaders from condemning sin with boldness. Christ surely wouldn't use an excuse such as this to keep from telling it like it is with regard to sinners.

This thread from several years ago contains quite a few scriptures and quotes.

viewtopic.php?t=34934

Lizzy60 wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 8:40 pm This thread from several years ago contains quite a few scriptures and quotes.

viewtopic.php?t=34934

Thank you.

Okay, let's go through and see what the Lord is talking about.

D&C 112
24 Behold, vengeance cometh speedily upon the inhabitants of the earth, a day of wrath, a day of burning, a day of desolation, of weeping, of mourning, and of lamentation; and as a whirlwind it shall come upon all the face of the earth, saith the Lord.

25 And upon my house shall it (b)begin, and from my house shall it go forth, saith the Lord;

26 First among those among you, saith the Lord, who have professed to know my name and have not known me, and have blasphemed against me in the midst of my house, saith the Lord.

(b) 1 Pet. 4:17 (17–18)

17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

It certainly sounds like what Peter is saying is that the house of God is the membership of His church. It must be those that do not live up to their covenants, keep the Sabbath day holy, feast upon the word, stand as witness for Christ, be humble and contrite, don't repent often, be as little children to be taught by the Holy Spirit or, perhaps, many other aspects of the gospel that Christ is not happy with. So great judgments are coming to the disobedient. Peter calls them ungodly.

D&C 18:46
46 And after that you have received this, if you keep not my commandments you cannot be saved in the kingdom of my Father.

D&C 82:3
3 For of him unto whom much is given much is required; and he who sins against the greater light shall receive the greater condemnation.

James 4:17
17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

2 Ne. 9:25 (25–27)
25 Wherefore, he has given a law; and where there is no law given there is no punishment; and where there is no punishment there is no condemnation; and where there is no condemnation the mercies of the Holy One of Israel have claim upon them, because of the atonement; for they are delivered by the power of him.
26 For the atonement satisfieth the demands of his justice upon all those who have not the law given to them, that they are delivered from that awful monster, death and hell, and the devil, and the lake of fire and brimstone, which is endless torment; and they are restored to that God who gave them breath, which is the Holy One of Israel.
27 But wo unto him that has the law given, yea, that has all the commandments of God, like unto us, and that transgresseth them, and that wasteth the days of his probation, for awful is his state!

Now we have a good idea of what the cleansing could entail.

Has anyone noticed any changes in sacrament meeting talks in your stake?

Are people self-censoring themselves on topics or are the assigned topics by the bishoprics specific to not cause a stir. Are bishoprics assigning talks to only people they can 'trust'?

Will we see the open mic for fast and testimony meeting be changed in the future?

Our church has the members speak in sacrament meeting unlike a pastor which is very unique in Christendom. We as members also need to do our parts when assigned to give talks.

Our church has the members speak in sacrament meeting unlike a pastor which is very unique in Christendom. We as members also need to do our parts when assigned to give talks.
[/quote]

Sunain, what do you think are "our parts" when assigned to give talks in church? What do you suggest?

Are people self-censoring themselves on topics or are the assigned topics by the bishoprics specific to not cause a stir. Are bishoprics assigning talks to only people they can 'trust'?

I think we all know the answer to that.

Sunain wrote: ↑April 20th, 2019, 9:55 pmAre people self-censoring themselves on topics or are the assigned topics by the bishoprics specific to not cause a stir. Are bishoprics assigning talks to only people they can 'trust'?

Trusted to do what, keep their mouth shut about what they read in the BoM? Topics covering things coming from scripture that are not in the manuals? Trusted to not teach pure doctrine, but to teach watered down doctrine? Trusted to do just what?

I have, on occasion, broached unpopular commandments and topics in testimony meetings.

Watch and listen to: https://www.latterdayconservative.com/b ... ft-benson/ for a good example of muzzled topics

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W86JqGw8BnA may be easier to understand.

It occurs to me that only a small % of Church members paid any serious mind to the things a prophet said to us over 30 years ago and even well before he became the President of the Church. But at least we were warned by our prophets and apostles of the very things that trouble our society today. That the current Prophet and apostles do not echo much of what their predecessors said tells me that we have allowed murderous combinations to get above us and we are beyond the point of no return.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W86JqGw8BnA

lundbaek wrote: ↑April 21st, 2019, 8:51 am It occurs to me that only a small % of Church members paid any serious mind to the things a prophet said to us over 30 years ago and even well before he became the President of the Church. But at least we were warned by our prophets and apostles of the very things that trouble our society today. That the current Prophet and apostles do not echo much of what their predecessors said tells me that we have allowed murderous combinations to get above us and we are beyond the point of no return.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W86JqGw8BnA

The church ain't what it used to be. The President's ain't what they used to be.
dc

I am still confident that the Prophet is doing and saying what the Lord wants him to say and do. I have to admit to sometimes wondering what the Lord is going to have Church authorities do about the deterioration of the nation that He established to serve as the bastion of freedom for the rest of the world.

lundbaek wrote: ↑April 21st, 2019, 11:58 am I am still confident that the Prophet is doing and saying what the Lord wants him to say and do. I have to admit to sometimes wondering what the Lord is going to have Church authorities do about the deterioration of the nation that He established to serve as the bastion of freedom for the rest of the world.

This could be false info, but I heard many, many years ago that the time would come where there would be a complete separation of the righteous from the wicked.

The only other prophecy (if true at all) is the one where Elders of the church would help save the Constitution. However, for this to occur there would possibly be massive bloodshed due to the Right and Left having different views, one, for freedom, and two, wanting NWO. And in order for freedom to reign again there would still be bloodshed; the enemy to freedom would have to be annihilated. Moroni could once again fly his Title of Freedom!

Who knows, the two concepts given here might be one in the same thing?

LDS Prophets on Voting Principles over Party & Politics (Ezra Taft Benson)

We must pray with all our heart in asking God to intervene in protecting our nation. Please, please watch this.


Also: Joel Skousen - Awakening to Our Awful Situation - Foreword - Jack Monnett