LDS bedroom nightmares

[ajax]

We should never intentionally self-stimulate ourselves.

This is why I never wash my genitals with soap. Might as well avoid the temptation altogether.

[Sarah]

I don't think more education to do this or don't do that is the answer because it's different for everyone. I do think older children, teenagers and young adults should be taught that sex is GOOD. Not that it's good with exceptions. That it is good and that's why Satan is trying to ruin it. That it is good to enjoy it and explore your own body and your spouse's together.

We talk so much about women submitting to their husbands during sex, but we only think of thephysical submission. In my experience, sex took on a whole new level of enjoyment when I trusted my husband enough to submit not just my body but my soul and my heart to him. To be completely vulnerable and in a position (figuratively speaking...) that he could humiliate me, destroy me, hurt me, or break me, but trusting that he wouldn't. This took many years and only happened because of his love and patience toward me and my willingness to take any steps of testing the waters with him until I could fully submit to him. Once I discovered this key, I discovered why men love sex so much, where before I was like most other women wondering what the big deal was. Now in our marriage its not uncommon for the tables to be turned turned where he's too tired and I'm trying to convince him to come play.

Our marriage is closer because of it and I'm not sure if there is a correlation or not, but it seems to me that I am a much more patient and loving wife and mother and simply have more love to give when I am reaching my potential sexually. It's not just about the physical feel goods...different kinds of orgasms release different kinds of energy, and I really think it's related to that.

I think it's intersting how you are equating submission to trust. You submit to what your husband does to you because you trust him that he will give you what you need. I can see how this is a good way to look at it, but for me I actually had to look at it in a different way of looking at submission, and that was that my husband should submit to my requests when it came to sex, and trust that this would be good for the both of us. This helped me realize that this was not about me submitting to his wants, but him submitting to mine, and him finding satisfaction in that. I even wonder if there is something that represents this dynamic in the phrase "the sun to rule the day and moon to rule the night."

[BruceRGilbert]

But first we do need to teach our daughters (and sons) that it is OK to explore and get acquainted with their "equipment". Everything within healthy limits, but not off limit.

I don't agree with this idea. We need to teach our children that they can get aquainted with their celestial body parts with their marriage partner. Sexual intimacy is only appropriate, meaningful, and sanctified when shared between husband and wife. We should never intentionally self-stimulate ourselves. Yes, it is easier than relying on another to do it, but it turns the act into a selfish thing. Celestial law is about unselfishly sharing and exchanging different types of love gifts with others. Not self gratification.

Self-exploration is a natural occurrence with small children and the "guidance" during this stage of development is key to helping the child develop healthy attitudes about their "special places." Shaming and "judgmental" disciplining are not in order for these times. Your approach as a parent to these issues, sets the climate for attitudes that the child will develop toward them. Guidance is the key. It is akin to teaching the child not to suck their thumb. The approach that my wife and I employed was that of keeping your "special place" special.

Further, Sarah mentions, "We should never intentionally self-stimulate ourselves. Yes, it is easier than relying on another to do it, but it turns the act into a selfish thing." I don't believe that there is any impropriety in hand on hand guidance, coaching and educating of one's spouse in what works and what doesn't. A man, in particular, has to learn how to touch. It has to do with getting adequate feedback and learning how to be tender and gentle - not "strong" or "forceful."

[Sarah]

We should never intentionally self-stimulate ourselves.

This is why I never wash my genitals with soap. Might as well avoid the temptation altogether.

Ha ha. Maybe you should take shorter showers.

[Davka]

I don't think more education to do this or don't do that is the answer because it's different for everyone. I do think older children, teenagers and young adults should be taught that sex is GOOD. Not that it's good with exceptions. That it is good and that's why Satan is trying to ruin it. That it is good to enjoy it and explore your own body and your spouse's together.

We talk so much about women submitting to their husbands during sex, but we only think of thephysical submission. In my experience, sex took on a whole new level of enjoyment when I trusted my husband enough to submit not just my body but my soul and my heart to him. To be completely vulnerable and in a position (figuratively speaking...) that he could humiliate me, destroy me, hurt me, or break me, but trusting that he wouldn't. This took many years and only happened because of his love and patience toward me and my willingness to take any steps of testing the waters with him until I could fully submit to him. Once I discovered this key, I discovered why men love sex so much, where before I was like most other women wondering what the big deal was. Now in our marriage its not uncommon for the tables to be turned turned where he's too tired and I'm trying to convince him to come play.

Our marriage is closer because of it and I'm not sure if there is a correlation or not, but it seems to me that I am a much more patient and loving wife and mother and simply have more love to give when I am reaching my potential sexually. It's not just about the physical feel goods...different kinds of orgasms release different kinds of energy, and I really think it's related to that.

I think it's intersting how you are equating submission to trust. You submit to what your husband does to you because you trust him that he will give you what you need. I can see how this is a good way to look at it, but for me I actually had to look at it in a different way of looking at submission, and that was that my husband should submit to my requests when it came to sex, and trust that this would be good for the both of us. This helped me realize that this was not about me submitting to his wants, but him submitting to mine, and him finding satisfaction in that. I even wonder if there is something that represents this dynamic in the phrase "the sun to rule the day and moon to rule the night."

This is a very interesting perspective and I can't say I disagree!

[lemuel]

We should never intentionally self-stimulate ourselves.

This is why I never wash my genitals with soap. Might as well avoid the temptation altogether.

I just head down to the car wash naked to get clean.

[Davka]

I don't think more education to do this or don't do that is the answer because it's different for everyone. I do think older children, teenagers and young adults should be taught that sex is GOOD. Not that it's good with exceptions. That it is good and that's why Satan is trying to ruin it. That it is good to enjoy it and explore your own body and your spouse's together.

We talk so much about women submitting to their husbands during sex, but we only think of thephysical submission. In my experience, sex took on a whole new level of enjoyment when I trusted my husband enough to submit not just my body but my soul and my heart to him. To be completely vulnerable and in a position (figuratively speaking...) that he could humiliate me, destroy me, hurt me, or break me, but trusting that he wouldn't. This took many years and only happened because of his love and patience toward me and my willingness to take any steps of testing the waters with him until I could fully submit to him. Once I discovered this key, I discovered why men love sex so much, where before I was like most other women wondering what the big deal was. Now in our marriage its not uncommon for the tables to be turned turned where he's too tired and I'm trying to convince him to come play.

Our marriage is closer because of it and I'm not sure if there is a correlation or not, but it seems to me that I am a much more patient and loving wife and mother and simply have more love to give when I am reaching my potential sexually. It's not just about the physical feel goods...different kinds of orgasms release different kinds of energy, and I really think it's related to that.

I think it's intersting how you are equating submission to trust. You submit to what your husband does to you because you trust him that he will give you what you need. I can see how this is a good way to look at it, but for me I actually had to look at it in a different way of looking at submission, and that was that my husband should submit to my requests when it came to sex, and trust that this would be good for the both of us. This helped me realize that this was not about me submitting to his wants, but him submitting to mine, and him finding satisfaction in that. I even wonder if there is something that represents this dynamic in the phrase "the sun to rule the day and moon to rule the night."

And something else just occurred to me...perhaps for me it is less a submission of my will, as a submission of my mask...again, that willingness to be so vulnerable is what allows me to take more control of what I want...and then, like you said, he is then submitting to me. So the submission goes both ways.

I like it!

[capctr]

Want to know what makes for a healthy sex life? For women to "get involved" and with enthusiasm. I hear mention of submission, and it calls to mind the image of someone who lays there, allowing the husband to take the lead. On the other hand, another woman states that she teaches her husband to submit to her. Sounds like a dominance issue, in my opinion. Both approaches should be reconsidered.
My wife and I are coming up on 23 years, and our sex life has been all over the map and usually depends on who is the most aroused and who is the most fatigued at any given time(although moments of hilarity ensue when the most aroused is also the most fatigued). I can categorically, and emphatically state that although my wife would seldom ever deny me sex, I would prefer once a month where we are both well rested, equally enthused, curious, playful(in other words, a grown up version of a child excited to adventure with their best friend who just so happens to be the opposite sex),etc...over every night where she participates just enough.
Men are often accused of being satisfied simply with cooperation, but when our spouses engage less often, yet bring their "A-game" when they do, it makes us feel as if we are doing something right, which in turn makes us want to work harder to get even more right. Submitting makes us feel guilty or ashamed for being a sexual burden. Dominance makes us feel controled, even if we don't voice it, which leads to resentment/anger.
Doing "it" the same way every time with little to no variation leads to an uninteresting sex life, leads to apathy, leads to...
Just my two bits.

[Arganoil]

Try different locations in the house, outdoors, in public.

[Davka]

Want to know what makes for a healthy sex life? For women to "get involved" and with enthusiasm. I hear mention of submission, and it calls to mind the image of someone who lays there, allowing the husband to take the lead. On the other hand, another woman states that she teaches her husband to submit to her. Sounds like a dominance issue, in my opinion. Both approaches should be reconsidered.
My wife and I are coming up on 23 years, and our sex life has been all over the map and usually depends on who is the most aroused and who is the most fatigued at any given time(although moments of hilarity ensue when the most aroused is also the most fatigued). I can categorically, and emphatically state that although my wife would seldom ever deny me sex, I would prefer once a month where we are both well rested, equally enthused, curious, playful(in other words, a grown up version of a child excited to adventure with their best friend who just so happens to be the opposite sex),etc...over every night where she participates just enough.
Men are often accused of being satisfied simply with cooperation, but when our spouses engage less often, yet bring their "A-game" when they do, it makes us feel as if we are doing something right, which in turn makes us want to work harder to get even more right. Submitting makes us feel guilty or ashamed for being a sexual burden. Dominance makes us feel controled, even if we don't voice it, which leads to resentment/anger.
Doing "it" the same way every time with little to no variation leads to an uninteresting sex life, leads to apathy, leads to...
Just my two bits.

I actually agree with you completely! When I mentioned submission, I was not talking about physical submission. I am naturally an inhibited person, so in order for me to fully participate I have to *submit* that self protective nature to him so that I can be open and unashamed...and, like you said, enthusiastic. It's hard for a woman to be enthusiastic when there's even the slightest bit of embarrassment or hesitation. In the early years of our marriage, I struggled to be as open as I needed to be to really get into the experience, because the trust wasn't there yet for me to be in such a vulnerable state, emotionally more than physically, I think. And it didn't have anything to do with "good girl syndrome." I just couldn't let my guard down.

At least in our relationship, if I'm having a great time, then he is too. For him, the most enjoyable kind of lovemaking is the kind that he knows I am enjoying equally. It's a win-win.

[Sarah]

Want to know what makes for a healthy sex life? For women to "get involved" and with enthusiasm. I hear mention of submission, and it calls to mind the image of someone who lays there, allowing the husband to take the lead. On the other hand, another woman states that she teaches her husband to submit to her. Sounds like a dominance issue, in my opinion. Both approaches should be reconsidered.
My wife and I are coming up on 23 years, and our sex life has been all over the map and usually depends on who is the most aroused and who is the most fatigued at any given time(although moments of hilarity ensue when the most aroused is also the most fatigued). I can categorically, and emphatically state that although my wife would seldom ever deny me sex, I would prefer once a month where we are both well rested, equally enthused, curious, playful(in other words, a grown up version of a child excited to adventure with their best friend who just so happens to be the opposite sex),etc...over every night where she participates just enough.
Men are often accused of being satisfied simply with cooperation, but when our spouses engage less often, yet bring their "A-game" when they do, it makes us feel as if we are doing something right, which in turn makes us want to work harder to get even more right. Submitting makes us feel guilty or ashamed for being a sexual burden. Dominance makes us feel controled, even if we don't voice it, which leads to resentment/anger.
Doing "it" the same way every time with little to no variation leads to an uninteresting sex life, leads to apathy, leads to...
Just my two bits.

It should be noted as well from my point, that when I suggest my husband submit to my wishes, I'm not suggesting the woman dominate him. I don't even think of the idea of submission being a part of sex. I think respect is the better word. Both husband and wife should respect each other, but the wife must realize that her needs need to come before his or hers will never be met. And the husband needs to be respectful and loving and patient enough to realize this and make it happen, even if the wife has given up on herself.

[Dlight]

I had a lot of shame growing up about my inability to control myself in these ways. I learned that level of self mastery as an adult, but I did it by creating a repulsive feeling towards sex in general, I convinced myself it was a nasty horrible thing because I couldn't control myself. Every time i slipped up I would condemn myself as a filthy pervert and lie in my bed in a heap of depression. I'm sure thats exactly how God wanted me to feel right?

While sexual relations outside of marriage are inappropriate, bridling our passions seems to signify controlling them so that we may be filled with love. Unbridled selfishness, uncontrolled selfishness leads to a loss of charity for others. But bridle doesn't mean to completely repress all desire.

But to me it is shaky ground because allowing children or teaching it is ok for them to explore their bodies, giving into lust or pleasure, is part of a path that once you set down, it only gets easier and easier to continue further down that same path. So I dont think I will advocate for my children to go ahead and just have fun exploring their bodies.

It seems that the right way is to teach abstinence, waiting for marriage as the goal, but also respect and love, and a positive attitude about sex and self image. Teach that slip ups (when they do happen) are easily repented of but the goal should be for abstinence, but we should not beat ourselves up over mistakes. If a child does slip, or struggle with bridling a passion, we react with love and kindness, and total understanding. We explain why it's meant to be bridled and kept special, but to understand they are still loved and not condemned to hell.

[BruceRGilbert]

The "Elastic Rebound" phenomenon can be experienced by taking an ordinary, plastic credit card between your thumb and index finger and applying pressure until it assumes somewhat of a "pressure induced" U shaped configuration in your hand. The U shape can quickly be "flipped" to the opposite direction by applying pressure at the crest of the U with the other hand without changing the pressure originally applied between the thumb and index finger. This little "experiment" is analogous to what happens when great emphasis and "pressure" is applied in the avoidance of "dreadful" behaviors. It is real and it is evident in what happens when things are "over-emphasized" with "condemnation."

I had a discussion with a former member of the Church who was quite candid with me about his first experience with breaking the Word of Wisdom by tasting coffee. In essence, he wanted to know what was so bad about it. He had schemed with some other curious, childhood members in going into private quarters with some brew and discovering for themselves it's harmful effects. According to plan, they executed the perilous venture of tasting that "wondrous" concoction. They waited to experience its effects. When none became apparent - there was disappointment and a quandary was precipitated in questioning, "What is this all about?"

I do not advocate taking "tests" to determine why instructions are given to avoid certain things, but I do advocate not putting a "bind" on people by putting them in a "pinch" if they lack understanding and faith. I know that God knows why certain things are best left alone in view of our "long term" happiness, joy, and fulfillment.

I recall giving the "Law of Chastity" discussion on my mission wherein it was made known that our appetites and passions are given to us with reason, without which man (mankind) would be unwilling to take upon himself (itself,) the responsibilities of raising family. The "sex drive" is God given and God ordained. He, in essence, engineered it. Certainly, therefore, it is not it's use that is bad, but it's AB-USE.

Do you remember your first date? Well, you certainly remember your first kiss. It was a significant event in your life that left an indelible memory. Of course, it is the same with other events, as well. These things are "life altering" because of their nature - because of the plethora of feelings that they engender. Because of "significance," things have to be somewhat "self-regulated" and "self-controlled." You don't go around kissing everyone, etc. and you don't go around having children with everyone. It is contrary to God's plan of happiness for us.

I believe it is important to recognize "the lesser of evils," as it where. When one is "tempted" by fire, it is best to choose the "lesser of evils." The Savior stated the following:

Mark 9:
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

I don't advocate "self-mutilation," but I do believe that what is being taught, here, has to do with choosing a lesser "evil." It isn't a good thing to cut off your hand, or foot, or eye. Heavenly Father doesn't want you to "maim" yourself in this way, but He does want you (us) to avoid the fire that is not quenched.

Ether 12:
27 And if men come unto me I will show unto them their weakness. I give unto men weakness that they may be humble; and my grace is sufficient for all men that humble themselves before me; for if they humble themselves before me, and have faith in me, then will I make weak things become strong unto them.

In nakedness, it is not meet to hide from the Lord. He will take a weakness and make it a strength in His time frame. Guilt and shame are not from the same source.

[Primary Outcast]

When I got married my wife had no idea about how a vagina worked and neither did I. After a couple of months she developed vaginismus and over a few years intercourse decreased until now we never do it.
Based on our experiences with different doctors I don't think this problem is very prevalent in Utah or any more prevalent than other communities.