Where do you Draw the Line?

[Fiannan]

One option not listed is nanotechnology. I think this offers the best chance of life extension since micro-computers could be injected into the bloodstream and artificially extend the life of all the cells of the body. I would have no problem with this at all.

People getting healthy arms, legs, etc. cut off and replaced with superior replacements? Sounds weird but someday it will be as common as getting breast enlargements.

Connecting the brain to a computer framework? Now that is getting into the horrors of The Book of Revelations.

[Durzan]

So far, nothing about technology or its advances today seems to be particularly concerning. The uses are what concerns me. I will draw the line where the Lord tells me to draw the line.

[FattyArBeltBuckle]

One option not listed is nanotechnology. I think this offers the best chance of life extension since micro-computers could be injected into the bloodstream and artificially extend the life of all the cells of the body

Connecting the brain to a computer framework? Now that is getting into the horrors of The Book of Revelations.

What if any sort of "improvement" whether nano-bots or robotic limbs, initiated the link to a framework? Like the movie "Transcendence", the protagonist was able to heal and help with nano-technology, however each person he "helped" was also linked to him and each other, and were easily controlled by the protagonist.

[Yahtzee]

I wanted to vote converting to Amish, but the reality is I pray for the Savior's return.
I worry about the side effects of all the electronics already. I don't think we're supposed to live like this.
We're so obsessed with extending life as long as we can that we don't deal with the reality of death any more. Why think about God and where you're headed if you never have to meet him? If loved ones never die, what's to motivate you to understand what life's about and what happens after death?
I'm not even advocating we all become luddites, I just think we're losing some of our humanity with this. I think it's important to examine that with all of this and ask more questions. It seems too often that tech is the new God.

[RocknRoll]

It won’t be long, probably only a few more years, and we will have robots being sold as sex partners. Will this be considered full on adultery? Committing adultery in the heart? Or just a form of masturbation? It won’t be sex with an actual human being after all. I’m afraid we will know sooner than we’d like.

[harakim]

One option not listed is nanotechnology. I think this offers the best chance of life extension since micro-computers could be injected into the bloodstream and artificially extend the life of all the cells of the body. I would have no problem with this at all.

People getting healthy arms, legs, etc. cut off and replaced with superior replacements? Sounds weird but someday it will be as common as getting breast enlargements.

Connecting the brain to a computer framework? Now that is getting into the horrors of The Book of Revelations.

It's humorous that you can see being injected with micro-computers as different than being connected to a computer framework. They're all connected. Even if you think you are safe, they always put a backdoor in. They literally put back doors into hardware so you cannot escape it with any amount of anti-virus or whatever you think will protect you.

[Michelle]

https://www.wired.com/story/anthony-lev ... -religion/
INSIDE THE FIRST CHURCH OF ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE

The new religion of artificial intelligence is called Way of the Future.

The documents state that WOTF’s activities will focus on “the realization, acceptance, and worship of a Godhead based on Artificial Intelligence (AI) developed through computer hardware and software.”

The religion will seek to build working relationships with AI industry leaders and create a membership through community outreach, initially targeting AI professionals and “laypersons who are interested in the worship of a Godhead based on AI.”

“What is going to be created will effectively be a god,” Levandowski tells me in his modest mid-century home on the outskirts of Berkeley, California. “It’s not a god in the sense that it makes lightning or causes hurricanes. But if there is something a billion times smarter than the smartest human, what else are you going to call it?”

“The idea needs to spread before the technology,” he insists. “The church is how we spread the word, the gospel. If you believe [in it], start a conversation with someone else and help them understand the same things.”

“Humans are in charge of the planet because we are smarter than other animals and are able to build tools and apply rules,” he tells me. “In the future, if something is much, much smarter, there’s going to be a transition as to who is actually in charge. What we want is the peaceful, serene transition of control of the planet from humans to whatever. And to ensure that the ‘whatever’ knows who helped it get along.”

With the internet as its nervous system, the world’s connected cell phones and sensors as its sense organs, and data centers as its brain, the ‘whatever’ will hear everything, see everything, and be everywhere at all times. The only rational word to describe that ‘whatever’, thinks Levandowski, is ‘god’—and the only way to influence a deity is through prayer and worship.

Enter Way of the Future. The church’s role is to smooth the inevitable ascension of our machine deity, both technologically and culturally. In its bylaws, WOTF states that it will undertake programs of research, including the study of how machines perceive their environment and exhibit cognitive functions such as learning and problem solving.

Levandowski does not expect the church itself to solve all the problems of machine intelligence—often called “strong AI”—so much as facilitate funding of the right research. “If you had a child you knew was going to be gifted, how would you want to raise it?” he asks. “We’re in the process of raising a god. So let’s make sure we think through the right way to do that. It’s a tremendous opportunity.”

“We’d like to make sure this is not seen as silly or scary. I want to remove the stigma about having an open conversation about AI, then iterate ideas and change people’s minds,” says Levandowski. “In Silicon Valley we use evangelism as a word for [promoting a business], but here it’s literally a church. If you believe in it, you should tell your friends, then get them to join and tell their friends.”

But WOTF differs in one key way to established churches, says Levandowski: “There are many ways people think of God, and thousands of flavors of Christianity, Judaism, Islam...but they’re always looking at something that’s not measurable or you can’t really see or control. This time it’s different. This time you will be able to talk to God, literally, and know that it’s listening.”

I ask if he worries that believers from more traditional faiths might find his project blasphemous. “There are probably going to be some people that will be upset,” he acknowledges. “It seems like everything I do, people get upset about, and I expect this to be no exception. This is a radical new idea that’s pretty scary, and evidence has shown that people who pursue radical ideas don’t always get received well. At some point, maybe there’s enough persecution that [WOTF] justifies having its own country.”

Others, like Bill Gates and Stephen Hawking, agree that superhuman AIs are coming, but that they are likely to be dangerous rather than benevolent. Elon Musk famously said, “With artificial intelligence we are summoning the demon,” and in 2015 he pledged $1 billion to the OpenAI Institute to develop safer AI.

Levandowski thinks that any attempts to delay or restrict an emerging super-intelligence would not only be doomed to failure, but also add to the risks. “Chaining it isn’t going to be the solution, as it will be stronger than any chains you could put on,” he says. “And if you’re worried a kid might be a little crazy and do bad things, you don’t lock them up. You expose them to playing with others, encourage them and try to fix it. It may not work out, but if you’re aggressive toward it, I don’t think it’s going to be friendly when the tables are turned.”

Levandowski says that like other religions, WOTF will eventually have a gospel (called The Manual), a liturgy, and probably a physical place of worship.

How much time, I wonder, do we have before the Transition kicks in and Way of the Future’s super-intelligent AI takes charge? “I personally think it will happen sooner than people expect,” says Levandowski, a glint in his eye. “Not next week or next year; everyone can relax. But it’s going to happen before we go to Mars.”

Whenever that does (or doesn’t) happen, the federal government has no problem with an organization aiming to build and worship a divine AI. Correspondence with the IRS show that it granted Levandowski’s church tax-exempt status in August.

[mtm411]

I think it's interesting that new technology always has great and bad things. Social media helps spread the gospel, keeps generations communicating-even over large geographic areas. The internet has introduced many to the gospel. Conversely, it spreads greed, ignorance, lust, causes contention.

I think it's important to stay close to the spirit and our modern prophet. I don't feel like we can shun technology without shunning some really amazing aspects of it. We are fools if we don't put limits on ourselves and children when it comes to technology though.

[Michelle]

Jesus Christ did not heal through "technology." He used the power of the priesthood.

[Yahtzee]

So thinking on the original question... where do you draw the line? Artificial hearts? What about dialysis machines. What about a portable dialysis/artificial kidney you could wear? Microchips that could keep minerals, hormones, etc. at healthy levels - heck, that could cure type 1 diabetes. Now what about an artificial womb?
I have no idea where my line is. I think artificial hearts are amazing! Pacemakers are amazing. What foreign objects are ok and what aren't?

[Fiannan]

We have cyborgs today, look at Darth, I mean Dick Cheney.

Of course this will increase. Ever read Global Trends 2030? Of course it will start with the rich but enhancement will become the issue rather than repair.

Nanotechnology could, I suppose, be abused, but injecting millions of micro-computers into ones body to repair and preserve cells could be a fantastic means to reverse aging. Of course that technology could also be used, in theory, to change a person's gender over time - for real, not just surgery and artificial hormones. One could also change their racial appearance.

As for computer-mind interface that is the future. Problem is, who can tell what the computer will do to alter the brain.

And having kids will be totally different than it is done today. The first stage will be giving women artificial hormones to ovulate a bunch of eggs that will then be fertilized by donor sperm. Then she and her wife will be able to select which ones, based on computer analysis, will have the fitness and intelligence they desire. The others will be disposed of. And yes, this is the future the powers-that-be are programming people to accept. Everything from the promotion of bisexuality to gender not being a fixed concept, plus the acceptance of abortion-on-demand throughout the 9 months of pregnancy to population curtailment. It is all part of a general strategy to redefine the family and divorce sex from reproduction, while curtailing the number of children to be born.

[Trucker]

I voted Amish. I think they're great.

[djinwa]

It won’t be long, probably only a few more years, and we will have robots being sold as sex partners. Will this be considered full on adultery? Committing adultery in the heart? Or just a form of masturbation? It won’t be sex with an actual human being after all. I’m afraid we will know sooner than we’d like.

This will have major impact on society.

Women were able to free themselves from the hassle of men by entering the workplace and making their own money, or by getting welfare from the government.

Now men will be able to be free from women by using artificial ones to satisfy themselves.

You would think feminists would be thrilled that men, being generally abusive, will leave women alone. But they're screaming that somehow sexbots are demeaning to women. I.E., they fear the loss of power women will experience when men can meet sexual needs elsewhere.

Like men lost power when they no longer had monopoly control over money.

[harakim]

I voted Amish. I think they're great.

It's not all sunshine and roses.

[creator]

With the constant advances in AI, and many seeing correlations to the Beast, where do you draw the line with adopting new technologies?

IMO, the mark of the beast is related to secret combinations: i.e. "that no man might buy or sell", unless he accepted the secret signs or handshakes and entered into this wicked combination.

[buffalo_girl]

When I observe the direction of human technologies, I remember the lesson of the Tower of Babel. Ziggurat construction combined with fired bitumen coated and mortared bricks made it entirely possible to build such a tower 10,000 ft high.

Just because a thing can be done does not necessary warrant that it should be done.

http://www.israel-a-history-of.com/tower-of-babel.html

The beauty of the tower was surely breathtaking. In fact, so impressive was the Tower of Babel that God Himself commented, "now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do".

A close friend had 'knee replacement' done using her own stem cells last year. Her recovery time has been slower than the 'usual' procedure of replacement with metal components, but her knee is her own God given tissue.

Another friend had hip replacement using chromium-cobalt laden metal components. She nearly died from toxicity. Her previously 'healthy' bone tissue reacted to the heavy metal exposure by dying back so far replacement surgery was impossible without constructing a metal framework on which to attach another 'hip joint'. https://www.regenexx.com/blog/hip-repla ... lications/

I believe we are entitled to advanced knowledge through proven righteousness and partnership with our Creator. When scientific advances are meant to subvert, subject, control, and exploit the Creation, we are agents of lucifer.

[capctr]

The biggest theoretical temptation for me? Respirocytes, gained through a small transfusion of artificial bloodcells that are capable of holding an exponentially larger amount of oxygen than standard red blood cells, enabling people with poor oxygen levels to substantially improve, while greatly increasing things like the length of an atheletes performance, speed, recovery time, etc... I could care less about sports events, but as a free diving fanatic, I'd be hard pressed to resist the temptation of being able to hold my breath for four hours rather than four minutesLOL!
Neurolink would possibly be quite tempting as well, as it would make gaming far more immersive. I am not much of a gamer, but ironically Tron is the one game I have fun playing in multiplayer mode, so a game about being sucked into a computer, would suck you into a computer to play it. What could possibly go wrong(I say, as I get ready to go tell my kids to turn off those darn devices)?

[buffalo_girl]

[Michelle]

I think part of the problem with just adopting technologies one by one, is that we often don't know when a technology has become a part of our lives, without our consent. This is definitely a line I don't want to cross.

I have highlighted some of my bigger concerns from the article below including mutant animals, horizontal gene transfer, and edible vaccines. I recommend reading the whole article at the link below.

https://articles.mercola.com/sites/arti ... ckens.aspx

In order to create the transgenic chickens, scientists used the gene-editing technology known as CRISPR, or Clustered Regularly Interspaced Short Palindromic Repeat. Unlike genetically engineered (GE) foods, which may have genes from other species inserted, gene editing involves altering an organism's DNA.

Further, foods produced via gene-editing are not subject to regulation by the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) or other regulatory agencies — although an advisory board recommended gene-edited foods could not be labeled organic.5

In fact, in March 2018, the USDA released a statement noting that it would not regulate CRISPR-edited crops, stating, "With this approach, USDA seeks to allow innovation when there is no risk present."6

Gene-editing technologies are relatively new, but they're moving ahead at a feverish pace. With the innovation, however, have come a few setbacks that should, at least, raise a few red flags.

Researchers have used CRISPR-Cas9 and other gene-editing technologies to create cows that can tolerate warmer temperatures (so they can be raised in the tropics), goats with longer cashmere wool and rabbits and pigs with bigger, leaner muscles.

Serious side effects resulted, however, including enlarged tongues in the rabbits.8,9 Among pigs that were altered by deleting the myostatin (MSTN) gene, which limits muscle growth, the larger muscles came along with an extra vertebrate in 20 percent of the gene-edited animals.

"This phenomenon has never been reported in other MSTN-mutant animals," the researchers said,10 and therein lies the problem. While scientists have made great strides in mapping out genomes of entire organisms, much remains unknown about the purpose of individual genes and how they interact with one another.

As such, making tweaks to genes, even those intended to be precise, often lead to surprising and unintended consequences.

In the U.S., the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) considers most genetically edited (GE) foods to be "substantially equivalent" to non-GE foods and, as such, categorizes them as "generally recognized as safe," with no need for premarket approval.11 Yet, there is much we don't know about the fate of GE foods, and GE food-derived DNA, once they enter our bodies.

Research published in Food and Chemical Toxicology revealed, however, that DNA from food not only can survive harsh processing and digestive conditions, but "DNA fragments up to a few hundred base pairs can survive and reach blood and tissues of human and animal consumers."12

"There is limited evidence of food-born DNA integrating into the genome of the consumer and of horizontal transfer of GM crop DNA into gut-bacteria," the researchers added.

Vertical gene transfer, or vertical inheritance (i.e., natural reproduction), is the transmission of genes from the parent generation to offspring via sexual or asexual reproduction, such as breeding a male and female from one species.

By contrast, horizontal gene transfer involves injecting a gene from one species into a completely different species, which yields unexpected and often unpredictable results. Mae-Wan Ho, director of the Institute of Science in Society, stated:13

"It is now clear that horizontal transfer of GM DNA does happen, and very often. Evidence dating from the early 1990s indicates that ingested DNA in food and feed can indeed survive the digestive tract, and pass through the intestinal wall to enter the bloodstream. The digestive tract is a hot spot for horizontal gene transfer to and between bacteria and other microorganisms.

Recent evidence obtained with direct detection methods indicates that horizontal transfer of GM DNA is routinely underestimated, largely because the overwhelming majority of bacteria in the environment and particularly in the gut cannot be cultured.

… Higher organisms including human beings are even more susceptible to horizontal gene transfer than bacteria, because unlike bacteria, which require sequence homology (similarity) for incorporation into the genome, higher organisms do not."

The Food and Chemical Toxicology study also found that micro-ribonucleic acid (micro-RNA) from GE foods may enter the body and affect gene expression in different organs.

According to Ho, "One type of nucleic acids, the microRNAs (miRNAs), are specifically involved in gene silencing via a vastly complex and flexible process that changes according to the environmental context. Consequently, GMOs based on miRNAs have many potentially adverse off-target effects, which are radically unpredictable and uncontrollable."14

While GMO foods and gene-edited foods are not technically the same, similar concerns exist for both technologies. Jaydee Hanson, an analyst at advocacy group the Center for Food Safety, told National Geographic that gene editing is essentially "the new kind of genetic engineering, whether you call it transgenic [GMO] or not."15

The experiments were geared toward producing an "edible" malaria vaccine, with the ultimate goal being that children drinking the milk would become vaccinated in the process.

[thestock]

God uses technology. Can't wait to learn what the Savior's got during the Millenium.

[Michelle]

God uses technology. Can't wait to learn what the Savior's got during the Millenium.

Funny how He refused to use it during His mortal ministry.

[thestock]

God uses technology. Can't wait to learn what the Savior's got during the Millenium.

Funny how He refused to use it during His mortal ministry.

What makes you so sure?

[Michelle]

God uses technology. Can't wait to learn what the Savior's got during the Millenium.

Funny how He refused to use it during His mortal ministry.

What makes you so sure?

I guess because the scripture say he spit in the mud and put it on the blind man's eye's and he was healed, not that he pulled out his laser and did LASIK.

[thestock]

God uses technology. Can't wait to learn what the Savior's got during the Millenium.

Funny how He refused to use it during His mortal ministry.

What makes you so sure?

I guess because the scripture say he spit in the mud and put it on the blind man's eye's and he was healed, not that he pulled out his laser and did LASIK.

If I went back to Christ's time and turned my back to the crowd and used a lighter and kneeled down to start some kindling on fire.....it would be written that I miraculously made fire.

The Liahona is a "object of curious worksmanship" that appeared out of nowhere to help Lehi's family.

The Urim and Thummin has properties to allow translation of ancient records into one's own language.

Christ and God have mastered time and space travel....even though they must obey physical laws of the Universe.

You will always lose if you cannot reconcile religion to science. They are both one in the same if judged properly.

[Michelle]

At least people are starting to think more seriously about his issue.
What do you think?

Artificial Intelligence: An Evangelical Statement of Principles
https://erlc.com/resource-library/state ... principles

Why faith groups are asking tough questions about robots and artificial intelligence.
https://www.deseretnews.com/article/900 ... moore.html