Why "Every Member is a Missionary" will never work!

[JohnnyL]

Our ward is starting a member missionary program!

[righteousrepublic]

All other Christ-like commandments fit under the umbrella of the 2 greatest commandments “...which hang all the law and the prophets.”

Johnny,
Again, it’s not all-or-nothing. Many missionaries have helped many people live better lives. But they also are following orders to preach some evil mixed with the good - like financial corruption in how tithing has been distorted, and cult-like teachings as in prioritizing lds church leaders over Christ’s teachings.

I wish that
1) the missionary program followed Christ’s teachings by prioritizing EFFECTIVE humanitarian work...&
2) the church would embrace and prioritize Christ’s teachings which so many desperately need: guidance to navigate the “narrow way” which few find.

As it is, church leaders have shown they care more about members following them and the lds church, than following Christ. Elder Ballard in speaking to those who consider leaving the lds-church “ship” said, "Where will you go? What will you do?" As if the only Christ-like option is the lds church - like all other Christian churches are nothing. As if it’s the lds church or nothing - ignoring that it’s possible to (& many do) follow Christ & not go to the lds church. If they genuinely cared about members following CHRIST, they would urge that focus, above all. But the lds church “ship” is above all. False god anyone?

Matt 4:4
4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Doctrine and Covenants 98:11
11 And I give unto you a commandment, that ye shall forsake all evil and cleave unto all good, that ye shall live by every word which proceedeth forth out of the mouth of God.


Okay, now that the church is out of the way and some members that don't want to do or accept what its leaders do or say, that leaves us to God. According to the above verses what is required of his children? What does God tell us to do? Are there any covenants to be made with Him? Is tithing required? Is charity required and what does it entail? Are we supposed to feed the poor or just sit back and expect churches to do it. Again, if we are to live by every word out of the mouth of God, what is he telling us to do?

[Thinker]

RighteousRepublic,
“God is love.” And love is essentially the greatest commandment. So, what is love? I believe it is appreciating what is (reality in all its glory & horror) while striving for what’s best - through trial & error (active faith).

After saving up, I went on a trip to a poor country & hoped to help in the most effective way possible. I prayed for guidance & happened upon someone who worked in an orphanage where we left supplies. Later, a teacher in a remote area complained of how many students’ parents didn’t have money for even basic school supplies. So, I went with her & we bought a bunch for her to take for them.

Another time, we were playing outside with a bunch of kids in a poor area & it was hot so I got some cookies and water bottles. Looking back, fruit juice would have been a more fun treat - for the same cost. Trial and error - live & learn.

The point is, there is no one single answer of best to love. We each need to pray and go out and do what we can to help - and then reflect on how it went so we can learn to love better and better.

[eddie]

th9JX7A4YT.jpg (14.4 KiB) Viewed 191 times

[brianj]

It has never caught on and never will
I keep my religious beliefs to myself, they are essentially a very personal matter, why would I invite 2 strangers into my home who I've only known for a very short time and let them loose on friends I've known for 20 years plus? It's a no brainer!!, you'll get the odd one which will work but the basic premise will never work!
Why is the church so obsessed with trying to convert the whole world and everyone who has ever lived in it? there are other more important matters to consider and deal with!

Scriptures make it clear that if you do not fulfill your obligation to preach the gospel in an effort to perfect the saints and proclaim the gospel to those who don't have it, then you will bear the burden of the sins they would not have committed if you shared the gospel and they accepted. You may think it's unreasonable to share the gospel with friends but I think it's intolerable to allow myself to be stained by the blood and sins of this generation.

[Thinker]

It has never caught on and never will
I keep my religious beliefs to myself, they are essentially a very personal matter, why would I invite 2 strangers into my home who I've only known for a very short time and let them loose on friends I've known for 20 years plus? It's a no brainer!!, you'll get the odd one which will work but the basic premise will never work!
Why is the church so obsessed with trying to convert the whole world and everyone who has ever lived in it? there are other more important matters to consider and deal with!

Scriptures make it clear that if you do not fulfill your obligation to preach the gospel in an effort to perfect the saints and proclaim the gospel to those who don't have it, then you will bear the burden of the sins they would not have committed if you shared the gospel and they accepted. You may think it's unreasonable to share the gospel with friends but I think it's intolerable to allow myself to be stained by the blood and sins of this generation.

What is “gospel”? Is it Mormonism - including an amazing sense of community and high standards, but also financial corruption and cult mentality? Or is it TRUTH - which nobody gets handed them by somebody else but is learned line upon line?

[righteousrepublic]

It has never caught on and never will
I keep my religious beliefs to myself, they are essentially a very personal matter, why would I invite 2 strangers into my home who I've only known for a very short time and let them loose on friends I've known for 20 years plus? It's a no brainer!!, you'll get the odd one which will work but the basic premise will never work!
Why is the church so obsessed with trying to convert the whole world and everyone who has ever lived in it? there are other more important matters to consider and deal with!

Scriptures make it clear that if you do not fulfill your obligation to preach the gospel in an effort to perfect the saints and proclaim the gospel to those who don't have it, then you will bear the burden of the sins they would not have committed if you shared the gospel and they accepted. You may think it's unreasonable to share the gospel with friends but I think it's intolerable to allow myself to be stained by the blood and sins of this generation.

What is “gospel”? Is it Mormonism - including an amazing sense of community and high standards, but also financial corruption and cult mentality? Or is it TRUTH - which nobody gets handed them by somebody else but is learned line upon line?

Was Christ a cult member? Also, we know that when Jesus was talking to Peter, he wasn't referring to Peter as being a "rock". He was telling Peter that his gospel is the rock upon which his church would be built. So, what is his church? Who did Peter, James and John visit, the head disciples of Christ? What did Jesus teach in his day that our church does not teach today? Why do they keep telling us to read scripture, all of them, but especially the Book of Mormon. Does the New Testament teach the words of Christ and his gospel? And all this is called a cult? Sad.

[JohnnyL]

RighteousRepublic,
“God is love.” And love is essentially the greatest commandment. So, what is love? I believe it is appreciating what is (reality in all its glory & horror) while striving for what’s best - through trial & error (active faith).

After saving up, I went on a trip to a poor country & hoped to help in the most effective way possible. I prayed for guidance & happened upon someone who worked in an orphanage where we left supplies. Later, a teacher in a remote area complained of how many students’ parents didn’t have money for even basic school supplies. So, I went with her & we bought a bunch for her to take for them.

Another time, we were playing outside with a bunch of kids in a poor area & it was hot so I got some cookies and water bottles. Looking back, fruit juice would have been a more fun treat - for the same cost. Trial and error - live & learn.

The point is, there is no one single answer of best to love. We each need to pray and go out and do what we can to help - and then reflect on how it went so we can learn to love better and better.

I don't know, love isn't needed; the NT says you just need to believe.

[JohnnyL]

It has never caught on and never will
I keep my religious beliefs to myself, they are essentially a very personal matter, why would I invite 2 strangers into my home who I've only known for a very short time and let them loose on friends I've known for 20 years plus? It's a no brainer!!, you'll get the odd one which will work but the basic premise will never work!
Why is the church so obsessed with trying to convert the whole world and everyone who has ever lived in it? there are other more important matters to consider and deal with!

Scriptures make it clear that if you do not fulfill your obligation to preach the gospel in an effort to perfect the saints and proclaim the gospel to those who don't have it, then you will bear the burden of the sins they would not have committed if you shared the gospel and they accepted. You may think it's unreasonable to share the gospel with friends but I think it's intolerable to allow myself to be stained by the blood and sins of this generation.

What is “gospel”? Is it Mormonism - including an amazing sense of community and high standards, but also financial corruption and cult mentality? Or is it TRUTH - which nobody gets handed them by somebody else but is learned line upon line?

I--and probably lots of people here--get lots of truth on Sunday.
Active listening, a sincere heart, the words of the prophets etc. speaking God's truth--it's plentiful. And if then there's always home study.

[Thinker]

What did Jesus teach in his day that our church does not teach today?

2 main ways our church has gone contrary to Christ’s teachings:
1) How money is used to control, abuse and other financial dishonesty, and corruption as in witholding tithes from those in need.
2) How the church is put up for members to prioritize above Christ and God - ignoring Luke 17:20-21 which explains that the kingdom of God is not an external church or dooms day event, but the experience (realm/kingdom) of God is within us each.

Many members suffer from mental illness, IMO, significantly because they are misdirected on how to enter the kingdom of God within. We’ve been told to focus on the church’s teaching rather than meditation and other more godly soul searching.

• “But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.”- Matthew 23:13

Our church prioritizes our church above Christ and God, and prioritizes mormon rules over Christ’s greatest commandments. Christ’s commandments ought to come first because they are “...which hang all the law and the prophets.” Tithing belongs to God - and how do we give to God? Inasmuch ye have done it unto the least of these, ye have done it undo God. Yet, Oaks admitted not a penny of tithes go to those in need - who knows how sacred tithes are spent since they’re kept hidden and secret.

• “Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
  This is the first and great commandment.
  And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
  On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.” -Matthew 23:37-40

Even if you designated fast offerings - the church leaders now say it’s their money and they can use it as they want...

[righteousrepublic]

What did Jesus teach in his day that our church does not teach today?

2 main ways our church has gone contrary to Christ’s teachings:
1) How money is used to control, abuse and other financial dishonesty, and corruption as in witholding tithes from those in need. Not true, the church gives food and other sustenance to victims of all sorts of calamities, called the humanitarian fund.
2) How the church is put up for members to prioritize above Christ and God - ignoring Luke 17:20-21 which explains that the kingdom of God is not an external church or dooms day event, but the experience (realm/kingdom) of God is within us each. Not true, I have explained this many times. Joseph Smith corrected the wording in that verse to say...21 Neither shall they say, Lo, here! or, Lo, there! For, behold, the kingdom of God has already come unto you.

Many members suffer from mental illness, IMO, significantly because they are misdirected on how to enter the kingdom of God within. We’ve been told to focus on the church’s teaching rather than meditation and other more godly soul searching.

• “But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.”- Matthew 23:13

Our church prioritizes our church above Christ and God, and prioritizes mormon rules over Christ’s greatest commandments. Christ’s commandments ought to come first because they are “...which hang all the law and the prophets.” Tithing belongs to God - and how do we give to God? Inasmuch ye have done it unto the least of these, ye have done it undo God. Yet, Oaks admitted not a penny of tithes go to those in need - who knows how sacred tithes are spent since they’re kept hidden and secret.

• “Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
  This is the first and great commandment.
  And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
  On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.” -Matthew 23:37-40

Even if you designated fast offerings - the church leaders now say it’s their money and they can use it as they want...

[img][g]

13 ¶ But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men...The scribes and Pharisees didn't live what they preach and made a bad name for the right way of conducting oneself, the Lord's way.

for ye neither go in yourselves...go in where, inside the body? Nay, hypocrites not going and finding the path leading to salvation, the Lord's way.

neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in...in where, inside themselves? Nay, the actions of the scribes and Pharisees was not a good example for others to follow, therefore, those looking for the right way were hindered.

The kingdom of God is not within us, it is among us, all of us can enter in and grow in spiritual stature, the Lord's way.

As for fast offerings, I don't care where the money goes after it leaves my hand. If someone steals it for whatever purpose...I know that God knows I paid it, and this is all that matters. Same with tithing. If I were to worry about where all my money is going, I might as well not pay any of it. When we begrudge giving God his due, we gain no blessings and it is deemed as if we did not pay it anyway. God requires a willing mind and a charitable heart. Why else do we think he wants us to pay it? It's a test in obedience. He simply asks for one penny out of ten.

And, again, the church does give to the poor and needy. We just don't hear about everything. If we did, then the church might get accused of bragging or waving their own multicolored flag for all to see. So they don't win either way.

[Thinker]

RighteousRepublic,
It’s undeniable that you feel God within you, as we all do. Where else would you feel anything? This is a basic, essential teaching of Christ that is twisted, to the damning (holding back) of many. Why deny the obvious? A lie told a million times is easier to believe than a truth heard for the 1st time.

Blindly trusting in church leaders by giving excessive tithes when they admit they aren’t being used as commanded - is breaking several commandments - the 2 greatest - which are supposed to come before all others, the law of tithing and the commandment to not have other gods before god. The warning for those who are so careless about helping those in need - or careless by not ensuring tithing collectors do - is laid out by Christ...

[JohnnyL]

RighteousRepublic,

Blindly trusting in church leaders by giving excessive tithes when they admit they aren’t being used as commanded - is breaking several commandments - the 2 greatest - which are supposed to come before all others, the law of tithing and the commandment to not have other gods before god. The warning for those who are so careless about helping those in need - or careless by not ensuring tithing collectors do - is laid out by Christ...

Source/ quote, please.
(Just seems like someone's confirmation bias has led them to misunderstand the donation slip...)

[righteousrepublic]

RighteousRepublic,
It’s undeniable that you feel God within you, as we all do. Where else would you feel anything? This is a basic, essential teaching of Christ that is twisted, to the damning (holding back) of many. Why deny the obvious? A lie told a million times is easier to believe than a truth heard for the 1st time.

Blindly trusting in church leaders by giving excessive tithes when they admit they aren’t being used as commanded - is breaking several commandments - the 2 greatest - which are supposed to come before all others, the law of tithing and the commandment to not have other gods before god. The warning for those who are so careless about helping those in need - or careless by not ensuring tithing collectors do - is laid out by Christ...

Feeling God within us. which is actually the Holy Ghost, is not the same as having his kingdom within us, not unless one is so huge that they encompass part of the universe. I have felt the Holy Ghost many, many times. He is the bearer of truth and confirms the word of God within us. There is a difference. Are you calling Joseph Smith a liar? He is the one that corrected the verse to read correctly. Otherwise, what lie are you referring to?

How is the paying of tithes wrong? What about the woman that gave all she had to the Lord as tithing.

Look, years ago, I was one of the worst members around. I refused to pay tithing. I felt the money was mine. Long story short, I now pay 10% in tithes, fast offering and humanitarian funds...and I don't even miss it. The Lord has blessed my wife and I so much that we can't begin to show all the gratitude that God deserves, our hearts are filled with it. What does it profit to complain and judge others when it is God that reaps his due after all is said and done. Again, God requires a willing mind and a charitable heart.

We do not blindly trust church leaders, rather, we put our trust in God and he will reward us as he sees fit. He blesses obedience, not blind following and begrudging.

Do church members blindly trust God when he says we are to pay tithing? The law comes from him, not the church.

[Thinker]

RighteousRepublic,

Blindly trusting in church leaders by giving excessive tithes when they admit they aren’t being used as commanded - is breaking several commandments - the 2 greatest - which are supposed to come before all others, the law of tithing and the commandment to not have other gods before god. The warning for those who are so careless about helping those in need - or careless by not ensuring tithing collectors do - is laid out by Christ...

Source/ quote, please.
(Just seems like someone's confirmation bias has led them to misunderstand the donation slip...)

Dallin Oaks told members that tithing is not for charity - which breaks the law of tithing https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=KJV and the greatest commandments (quoted above). https://www.lds.org/general-conference/ ... g?lang=eng

Speaking of confirmation bias - how can you deny what is obviously financial dishonesty and withholding tithes from God by withholding tithes from those who for which tithes were intended? How can you choose the church’s teachings over Christ’s?

[Thinker]

RighteousRepublic,
Since we have prioritized more obeying Christ’s greatest commandments and given our tithes to those in need, we have been blessed like never before!